OT. Christmas in Solitary??

[Dean Hoffman]

Fauci is already claiming it's too soon to tell if people
should have get togethers. He just as well quit talking. Normal, average
people aren't going to listen.
<https://reason.com/2021/10/03/anthony-fauci-christmas-too-soon-too-tell-covid/>
Has Santa had his shots? How many should he get given his age?

[angelica...@yahoo.com]

I'm going to spend Christmas just as I have for the last 20-odd years:
at home with my husband. Weather permitting, we'll start with coffee
in the hot tub.

Cindy Hamilton

[Buck Fiden]

On 10/3/21 9:30 PM, Dean Hoffman wrote:
> Fauci is already claiming it's too soon to tell if people
> should have get togethers. He just as well quit talking. Normal, average
> people aren't going to listen.
> <https://reason.com/2021/10/03/anthony-fauci-christmas-too-soon-too-tell-covid/>
>

Obviously the depop myocarditis clot-shots are not working.

[Bod]

"At my hospital, over 95% of COVID-19 patients share one thing in
common: They’re unvaccinated"

"As an emergency medicine and critical care doctor at the University of
Washington School of Medicine in Seattle, I’ve lost count of the number
of COVID-19 surges since the U.S. pandemic began in Seattle in February
2020. But this one feels different. The patients are younger. They have
fewer preexisting medical conditions. And at my hospital, over 95% of
these hospitalized patients share one common feature: They’re
unvaccinated".

https://theconversation.com/at-my-hospital-over-95-of-covid-19-patients-share-one-thing-in-common-theyre-unvaccinated-166708

Sorry, but you're just an ignorant dopey idiot.

[Dean Hoffman]

Fauci must never look outside or turn on a tv. American football stadiums are full, both college
and pro. People are naturally going to nearby bars and restaurants before or after the game. They will
go back home to spread what ever disease they might have. Americans will *all* be dead or have survived
by Christmas.
I went bumming from Nebraska to southeast Georgia a few weeks ago. It's about 1,400 miles give or take.
Not many travelers had masks. People acted like it was pre pandemic days. It was east to spot employees
of a business. They had the masks.

[trader_4]

Fauci said it was too early to say what advice they will be giving for Christmas.
Unfortunately, you can't fix stupid and there are lots of stupid people who won't
listen. Many of them are sick, in the hospital or dead. We'd have many more if
the rest of us were doing the same, living in Covid denial, refusing to get vaccinated,
etc.

[hub...@ccanoemail.ca]

Once bit - twice shy ?
Here in Ontario, the relaxing of restrictions & precautions and
covid fatigue and complacency - ~ this-time-last-year - led to the
big 3rd wave in Dec. and Jan. < pre vaccine >.
The health authorities do have some reason to be concerned -
in looking at the graphs - which seem to show a significant
September upturn < 4th wave > ; and at the hospitalizations
in the hot spots ...
A couple weeks ago we heard from relatives in Tennessee who had
had unvaccinated family get very sick - but survive. Their hospitals
were being severely tested and military assistance requested.
At that time, the covid daily deaths in Tennessee <pop. 7 m. >
were greater than all of Canada < pop. 38 m. > .

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/?utm_campaign=homeAdUOA?Si

John T.

[micky]

In alt.home.repair, on Mon, 4 Oct 2021 02:41:24 -0700 (PDT),

Doesn't that take an awful lot of coffee?
>
>Cindy Hamilton

[angelica...@yahoo.com]

Heh.

Filling the hot tub with coffee was not specified.

"Coffee in the hot tub" might mean 1 teaspoon of brewed coffee added
to 500 gallons of warm, brominated water.

Cindy Hamilton

[micky]

In alt.home.repair, on Mon, 4 Oct 2021 05:41:26 -0700 (PDT), Dean

Yes, I know what you mean. I've been to hamfests in New Jersey, Pa. and
Baltimore and it's the same way. 5% or fewer have on masks. Yesterday,
more than 100 people there, me and 3.5 other masks (One guy had one
hanging from his ears.)

I even had my oil changed and none of the three of them had on masks
even though their google listing says they wear them. That was on the
next big shopping street, 2 miles from the shopping street near me.
Here, everyone wears masks, all the clerks and all the customers. FWIW,
they're almost all black but I haven't been to other black n'hoods to
see if that is the difference.

But I digress. It's still bad. It's been 1500 deaths** in the US per
day, and I think I hear 4000 or maybe more, maybe n000 over the weekend.

**A rate higher than the previous 18 months.


It reminds me of sex which seems to have no consequences until a few
months later. Oh, pregnant! baby! I didn't plan on that.

I've wondered about the football games. Has anyone tried to get data
about those who were there?

[micky]

In alt.home.repair, on Mon, 4 Oct 2021 07:30:56 -0700 (PDT),

"angelica...@yahoo.com" <angelica...@yahoo.com> wrote:

>On Monday, October 4, 2021 at 10:08:17 AM UTC-4, micky wrote:
>> In alt.home.repair, on Mon, 4 Oct 2021 02:41:24 -0700 (PDT),
>> "angelica...@yahoo.com" <angelica...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>> >On Sunday, October 3, 2021 at 9:30:54 PM UTC-4, dean...@gmail.com wrote:
>> >> Fauci is already claiming it's too soon to tell if people
>> >> should have get togethers. He just as well quit talking. Normal, average
>> >> people aren't going to listen.
>> >> <https://reason.com/2021/10/03/anthony-fauci-christmas-too-soon-too-tell-covid/>
>> >> Has Santa had his shots? How many should he get given his age?
>> >
>> >I'm going to spend Christmas just as I have for the last 20-odd years:
>> >at home with my husband. Weather permitting, we'll start with coffee
>> >in the hot tub.
>> Doesn't that take an awful lot of coffee?
>
>Heh.
>
>Filling the hot tub with coffee was not specified.
>
>"Coffee in the hot tub" might mean 1 teaspoon of brewed coffee added
>to 500 gallons of warm, brominated water.
>
>Cindy Hamilton

I feel better now.

[Maskless Sociopath]

You took the clot-shots and you're still worried?

Do the clot-shots not work?  LOL

[Maskless Sociopath]

I had the Fauci-19 virus and it really wasn't that bad...nothing like what the snowflakes have been whimpering about.

And once you recover from the Fauci-19, you've got natural immunity that is 10x better than the clot-shot.

[Bob F]

Wrong again, and again, ......

Unless you get vaccinated AFTER you recover from covid.

"If you've had COVID-19 before, does your natural immunity work better
than a vaccine?

The data is clear: Natural immunity is not better. The COVID-19 vaccines
create more effective and longer-lasting immunity than natural immunity
from infection.

More than a third of COVID-19 infections result in zero protective
antibodies
Natural immunity fades faster than vaccine immunity
Natural immunity alone is less than half as effective than natural
immunity plus vaccination

Natural immunity can be spotty. Some people can react vigorously and get
a great antibody response. Other people don't get such a great
response," says infectious diseases expert Mark Rupp, MD. "Clearly,
vaccine-induced immunity is more standardized and can be longer-lasting."
A third of infections don't get any protective antibodies

Some people who get COVID-19 receive no protection from reinfection –
their natural immunity is nonexistent. A recent study found that 36% of
COVID-19 cases didn't result in development of SARS-CoV-2 antibodies.
The people had different levels of illness – most had moderate disease,
but some were asymptomatic and some experienced severe COVID-19. "

https://www.nebraskamed.com/COVID/covid-19-studies-natural-immunity-versus-vaccination

[Buck Fiden]

On 10/4/21 11:54 AM, Bob F wrote:
> On 10/4/2021 8:33 AM, Maskless Sociopath wrote:
>> On 10/4/2021 7:53 AM, Bod wrote:
>>> On 04/10/2021 12:12, Buck Fiden wrote:
>>>> On 10/3/21 9:30 PM, Dean Hoffman wrote:
>>>>>      Fauci is already claiming it's too soon to tell if people
>>>>> should have get togethers.  He just as well quit talking. Normal, average
>>>>> people aren't going to listen.
>>>>> <https://reason.com/2021/10/03/anthony-fauci-christmas-too-soon-too-tell-covid/>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Obviously the depop myocarditis clot-shots are not working.
>>>>
>>> "At my hospital, over 95% of COVID-19 patients share one thing in common: They’re unvaccinated"
>>>
>>> "As an emergency medicine and critical care doctor at the University of Washington School of Medicine in Seattle, I’ve lost count of the number of COVID-19 surges since the U.S. pandemic
>>> began in Seattle in February 2020. But this one feels different. The patients are younger. They have fewer preexisting medical conditions. And at my hospital, over 95% of these
>>> hospitalized patients share one common feature: They’re unvaccinated".
>>>
>>> https://theconversation.com/at-my-hospital-over-95-of-covid-19-patients-share-one-thing-in-common-theyre-unvaccinated-166708
>>>
>>> Sorry, but you're just an ignorant dopey idiot.
>>>
>>>
>>
>> I had the Fauci-19 virus and it really wasn't that bad...nothing like what the snowflakes have been whimpering about.
>>
>> And once you recover from the Fauci-19, you've got natural immunity that is 10x better than the clot-shot.
>>
>
> Wrong again, and again, ......
>
> Unless you get vaccinated AFTER you recover from covid.

Oh Bobby, you are wrong again!

“For those of us who’ve had the disease and survived, we’re more at risk in being around only vaccinated people. So these people are hysterical about the unvaccinated, it’s actually the
opposite of the truth,” Senator Rand Paul MD told host Laura Ingraham.

https://www.infowars.com/posts/video-rand-paul-warns-health-authoritarians-are-hysterical-about-the-unvaccinated/

I'm grateful we have a an honest medical doctor/politician.

[gfre...@aol.com]

On Mon, 4 Oct 2021 02:41:24 -0700 (PDT), "angelica...@yahoo.com"
<angelica...@yahoo.com> wrote:

I may be up the road from you on Christmas this year, freezing my ass
off in Traverse City.

[angelica...@yahoo.com]

Do you think you might bring us a white Christmas? That would be nice.
We don't get them all that often anymore.

Cindy Hamilton

[Sam E]

On 10/4/21 6:53 AM, Bod wrote:

[snip]

> "At my hospital, over 95% of COVID-19 patients share one thing in
> common: They’re unvaccinated"

Sometimes I wonder if one of the effects of CoViD will be an increase in
the average intelligence of people (considering death of those
unvaccinated).


[snip]

--
82 days until the winter celebration (Saturday, December 25, 2021
12:00:00 AM for 1 day).

"Skeptics don't no it all -- but they no what they should."

[Bob F]

On 10/4/2021 11:28 AM, Sam E wrote:
> On 10/4/21 6:53 AM, Bod wrote:
>
> [snip]
>
>> "At my hospital, over 95% of COVID-19 patients share one thing in
>> common: They’re unvaccinated"
>
> Sometimes I wonder if one of the effects of CoViD will be an increase in
> the average intelligence of people (considering death of those
> unvaccinated).

LOL! Good one.

[trader_4]

He may say that, IDK what he's basing it on, but there are studies that show
the opposite, eg the recent large study in Israel that showed 14 times better
protection for those that had Covid compared to the Pfizer vaccine.

>
> Some people who get COVID-19 receive no protection from reinfection –
> their natural immunity is nonexistent. A recent study found that 36% of
> COVID-19 cases didn't result in development of SARS-CoV-2 antibodies.
> The people had different levels of illness – most had moderate disease,
> but some were asymptomatic and some experienced severe COVID-19. "
>
> https://www.nebraskamed.com/COVID/covid-19-studies-natural-immunity-versus-vaccination

If it's that spotty, not as effective, how do you explain the Israeli study?

[Dean Hoffman]

New Zealand is having a few problems also.
<https://hotair.com/jazz-shaw/2021/10/04/new-zealand-okay-it-turns-out-we-cant-eliminate-the-virus-n420115>
Maybe a future generation will be able to see more clearly if the lockdowns were worth the price.

[notX]

[snip]

>> Natural immunity can be spotty. Some people can react vigorously and get
>> a great antibody response. Other people don't get such a great
>> response," says infectious diseases expert Mark Rupp, MD. "Clearly,
>> vaccine-induced immunity is more standardized and can be longer-lasting."
>> A third of infections don't get any protective antibodies
>
> He may say that, IDK what he's basing it on, but there are studies that show
> the opposite, eg the recent large study in Israel that showed 14 times better
> protection for those that had Covid compared to the Pfizer vaccine.

Whichever is better, BOTH would be even better.

[rbowman]

I saw a wooly bear on the trail yesterday. It was completely black.
What's a caterpillar know?

[Peeler]

On Mon, 4 Oct 2021 20:53:47 -0600, lowbrowwoman, the endlessly driveling,
troll-feeding, senile idiot, blabbered again:

> I saw a wooly bear on the trail yesterday. It was completely black.

Thrilling account, again! Did you talk to it?

[angelica...@yahoo.com]

That's an encouraging sign, but around here the temperature of the
water in the Great Lakes usually has the final say.

Cindy Hamilton

[trader_4]

Right, there have been studies that showed getting vaccinated some months
after recovering from Covid provided much better protection that either natural
immunity or the vaccines alone.

[Dean Hoffman]

I don't remember how far away your neighbors are. The CDC recommends you just wave to them from a distance
on Thanksgiving.
<https://hotair.com/jazz-shaw/2021/10/05/cdc-recommends-virtual-thanksgiving-this-year-n420269>

[angelica...@yahoo.com]

We're vanishingly unlikely to see them outside the house. One set of neighbors, we'd
be more likely to give the finger than wave. The others, big shrubs block the view.

Cindy Hamilton

[gfre...@aol.com]

On Tue, 5 Oct 2021 02:51:25 -0700 (PDT), "angelica...@yahoo.com"

Lake Michigan was 69 an august at the kid's place in August (TC). That
is right in the groove. It is 62 now. I am sure it will be in the low
30s by mid 1q22.

[micky]

In alt.home.repair, on Tue, 5 Oct 2021 06:53:43 -0700 (PDT), trader_4

I've gotten some blood test for the study I'm in, 3 times, and each time
it shows antibodies from the vaccination, but none from infection.
Which means there are two kinds.

And clearly it's better to have both.

AIUI, the vaccine antibodies are better.

[Buck Fiden]

It's criminal that the democrats who stole the election are ignoring the Constitution and the Nuremberg Code.

From The Nuremberg Code:

1. The voluntary consent of the human subject is absolutely essential. This means that the person involved should have legal capacity to give consent; should be so situated as to be able to
exercise free power of choice, without the intervention of any element of force, fraud, deceit, duress, overreaching, or other ulterior form of constraint or coercion; and should have
sufficient knowledge and comprehension of the elements of the subject matter involved as to enable him to make an understanding and enlightened decision.

https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/nejm199711133372006

What kind of monsters don't support basic human rights? Makes me believe that the United States government is totally corrupt for not stopping this inhumane practice.

[angelica...@yahoo.com]

What kind of idiot are you? Everybody who gets the vaccine does it by choice.
Sure, the choice may be the loss of their job or getting the vaccine, but it's
still a choice.

They're not rounding up people at gunpoint and jabbing their arms.

Cindy Hamilton

[trader_4]

On Tuesday, October 5, 2021 at 2:47:11 PM UTC-4, dean...@gmail.com wrote:

According to the news the other day, CDC pulled their holiday recommendation page
down, replaced it with nothing, something coming, instead. This is another classic
tempest in a tea pot thing. It started with Fauci being asked about Christmas and him
simply saying it's too soon to tell, we'll have to wait and see. What would the correct
answer, the better answer have been? People criticize him every day for any changes
in recommendations in a pandemic that is changing and it does seem early to be
giving out recommendations for Xmas. It's a no win situation, whatever he or CDC
say a lot of people complain.

[micky]

In alt.home.repair, on Wed, 6 Oct 2021 06:45:54 -0700 (PDT), trader_4

It's the same problem Eisenhower had. Reporters would ask him, Where
are you going to attack next? And Ike would say, We have to see what
the Germans do. And the reporters would ask, Where will our troops be
at Christmas, and Ike would say, It's too early to say.

Then there would be editorials in all the anti-war papers saying that
army didn't know what it was doing. The Navy said that too.

[gfre...@aol.com]

Denying your livelihood is putting a gun to your head.
What other job discrimination would you tolerate?
Not hiring someone with HIV?
Not hiring the handicapped?
Not hiring <pick a religious group>?

[gfre...@aol.com]

On Wed, 06 Oct 2021 12:55:42 -0400, micky <NONONO...@fmguy.com>
wrote:

You can't compare the US in WWII to today.

Bradley Manning and Julian Assange would have been hanged in 1944.
OTOH CBS would leak the Enigma breach and the Manhattan project
details today and get away with it.

[Ed Pawlowski]

Did you go to first grade? Most of is could not go unless we were
vaccinated. People saw the need and understood. Now we have Alex Jones
and Tucker Carlson.

[gfre...@aol.com]

There has been an antivax movement for decades. It isn't the 50s
anymore.
I suppose if you are a minority, you are happy it isn't the 50s tho.

[Tiro del Coágulo]

Were those traditional vaccines or were they experimental myocarditis clot-shots?

[angelica...@yahoo.com]

I wouldn't hire someone with HIV to work in a brothel in Nevada.
I wouldn't hire the handicapped to be a firefighter.
I wouldn't hire a Baptist to be a Catholic priest.

The health care workers can either get the vaccine or find another job.

Cindy Hamilton

[Buck Fiden]

On 10/7/21 5:33 AM, angelica...@yahoo.com wrote:
> The health care workers can either get the vaccine or find another job.
>
> Cindy Hamilton

Latest studies show COVID vaccine immunity declines after 7 months, natural immunity lasts over a year

Vaccine manufacturers are now suggesting a whole new vaccine could be needed by next year to combat future strains of the coronavirus. However, as One America’s Pearson Sharp explains, new
research shows natural immunity offers far greater protection than any of the vaccines.


https://www.oann.com/latest-studies-show-covid-vaccine-immunity-declines-after-7-months-natural-immunity-lasts-over-a-year/


But the best thing about my natural immunity is that I don't have to wear a face diaper.

[Tiro del Coágulo]

On 10/7/2021 5:33 AM, angelica...@yahoo.com wrote:
> The health care workers can either get the vaccine or find another job.
>
> Cindy Hamilton

Should the single mom pay off her +$50K student debt before she retrains for another career?

[angelica...@yahoo.com]

Seems like the vaccine is a better choice for your hypothetical single mom.


Cindy Hamilton

[Bob F]

I would have serious thoughts about working with unvaccinated people. It
is a significant unnecessary risk. I am SURE I am not in the minority,
since 70+% have already had at least 1 shot.

Should I ( and 70% of workers) have to work with unvaccinated people
holding a gun to my head?

[Bob F]

And all her co-workers will thank her.

[gfre...@aol.com]

On Thu, 7 Oct 2021 02:33:06 -0700 (PDT), "angelica...@yahoo.com"

Being a free market person I tend to agree as long as the government
takes it's finger off the scale and lets the employer make the
decision.
You certainly wouldn't want the OEO or DoL(ADA) demanding that the
whore house hire a person with AIDS, the fire department hire the
handicapped or the Baptists hire a Catholic priest.
Employers should be able to make the decision about the vaccinations
too, without the heavy hand of Government slapping them around.
I saw today IBM will be require vaccinations but when you dig down on
the story, it wasn't their decision. They don't want to lose their
government contracts.

We still haven't said what happens to those people Trader talks about
who have medical conditions that preclude the shot or people with
religious objections. Is that an ADA situation? How about the 1st
amendment?
If we are willing to say fuck them, we can all throw our masks away.

[gfre...@aol.com]

From my experience with nurses in the 70s when they had the mass
exodus, they transition into barmaid pretty seamlessly. They were
making the same money too, working better hours. I knew a few that
were very happy with the career move. They did keep their license up,
just to keep their options open.
Some moved back into nursing when the supply/demand curve swung the
other way and the money got better. Some never went back.

[gfre...@aol.com]

If you were vaccinated and you actually believe, why would it bother
you other than maybe having to do their work when they die?

I got my shot, I believe and I don't care about those who didn't,
either way.
0.3% of them might die.
Shit happens.

If you actually drill down on that CDC morbidity data I posted, old
fat blacks and hispanics are going to tilt that stat so much that a
working age white guy may be more likely to get killed in his car.
Particularly if he likes to stop off for a beer after work.

[micky]

In alt.home.repair, on Thu, 7 Oct 2021 08:13:00 -0700, Bob F

aND IT WILL work even if she changes jobs. 3 good reasons.

[Bob F]

And she can go find a better job where everyone is vaccinated to relieve
stress.

[micky]

In alt.home.repair, on Thu, 7 Oct 2021 02:33:06 -0700 (PDT),

I think that's okay if you stay 6 feet apart.

>I wouldn't hire the handicapped to be a firefighter.
>I wouldn't hire a Baptist to be a Catholic priest.
>
>The health care workers can either get the vaccine or find another job.

Other than that, I fully agree with you.

>Cindy Hamilton

I had my oil changed two weeks ago. Their google listing said they wore
masks, got temperature checks, and disinfected surfaces, but none of the
three were wearing masks. I just sent a letter of complaint. Who wants
to bet: Will they reply?

Will they be nice about it?

I said to change the google listing. He'll probably say they will wear
masks from now on, so I'll have to stop by to check??

Apparently surfaces are not much of an issue, or did they just stop
talkign about that to concentrate on bigger issues? Last I heard you
could still touch a surface then your eyes or nose and get infected.

[angelica...@yahoo.com]

On Sunday, October 10, 2021 at 1:09:10 PM UTC-4, micky wrote:

> I had my oil changed two weeks ago. Their google listing said they wore
> masks, got temperature checks, and disinfected surfaces, but none of the
> three were wearing masks.

Probably outdated information in their google listing, whatever that is.

> I just sent a letter of complaint. Who wants
> to bet: Will they reply?
>
> Will they be nice about it?
>
> I said to change the google listing. He'll probably say they will wear
> masks from now on, so I'll have to stop by to check??
>
> Apparently surfaces are not much of an issue, or did they just stop
> talkign about that to concentrate on bigger issues? Last I heard you
> could still touch a surface then your eyes or nose and get infected.

Stop picking your nose.

Cindy Hamilton

[Let’s go, Brandon.]

Assuming she's not disabled or killed by the Myocarditus clot-shot.

https://populist.press/big-win-for-the-unvaccinated/

[Let’s go, Brandon.]

On 10/10/21 12:37 AM, Bob F wrote:

I'd find a company that respects the Constitution and the Nuremberg Code.

I'm retired but my former employer, an awesome employer, is offering employees a $1500 cash incentive to take the "jab" but they won't mandate it.

Like the abortionists keep chanting, "My body, my choice."

[angelica...@yahoo.com]

If it weren't a communicable disease, you might have a point.

Cindy Hamilton

[Bob F]

Which almost never happens.

[Bob F]

And the Repubs.

"your body, my choice".

[trader_4]

On Wednesday, October 6, 2021 at 5:49:06 PM UTC-4, gfre...@aol.com wrote:

None of those are diseases that are easily communicable in the
workplace.

[trader_4]

+1

Trump has transformed the Republican Party from the party of Eisenhower and
Reagan into the party of Qanon, Proud Boys and ignoramuses. And even he can't
control the kraken that he has created, the Kraken is in control of him and the Republican
leaders and influencers.

[angelica...@yahoo.com]

On Wednesday, October 13, 2021 at 10:39:20 AM UTC-4, trader_4 wrote:

> Trump has transformed the Republican Party from the party of Eisenhower and
> Reagan into the party of Qanon, Proud Boys and ignoramuses. And even he can't
> control the kraken that he has created, the Kraken is in control of him and the Republican
> leaders and influencers.

Trump is the effect, not the cause.

Cindy Hamilton

[trader_4]

That's true, but from the 50s through the next five decades, it was
insignificant in size and scope. Starting around maybe 2000, with the
advent of the internet, the loons found it increasingly easy to connect
with each other and spread lies and BS. That's when it started to become
a public health problem, eg outbreaks of measles, because certain areas
and communities had low vaccination rates. Now it's gone exponential,
Qanon crazy. And up until the past year, there was no apparent political
connection. Today the Republican Party has adopted an anti-vax position,
while abandoning most of the principles that they stood for since the 50s,
one of those being truth. I hear Republicans harping about all that Biden
is responsible for and they actually have the unmitigated gall to list Covid
still being with us, on the rise, etc as one of his big failures. It's not Biden,
it's the Republicans that are working against the public health interest and
killing people. Hannity is a good example of that. He blames Biden for
where we are at with Covid, while
he spends hours most days spreading FUD about the vaccines, having on
anti-vax doctors and only anti-vax doctors, talking up ivermectin, discouraging
people from getting vaccinated. Then for about one minute a couple times
a day he says he's not telling people not to get vaccinated, he's not giving
advice, etc. He claims to be Catholic, maybe he thinks that little disclaimer
will save him from hell.

[trader_4]

+1

[trader_4]

That's a classic bad comparison. All those things are stupid,
make people less safe, endanger them. A Covid vaccine requirement
does the opposite.

> Employers should be able to make the decision about the vaccinations
> too, without the heavy hand of Government slapping them around.

Funny that over the past six months we haven't heard one objection here
from you about what DeSantis has been doing, which is exactly that.
He's been trying to order employers to do what he wants, eg trying to
ban cruise ships from requiring vaccines to go on a cruise. Or slapping
local towns and cities from making decisions about masks and vaccines.
Slapping those schools around too. A lot of slapping.

> I saw today IBM will be require vaccinations but when you dig down on
> the story, it wasn't their decision. They don't want to lose their
> government contracts.
>
> We still haven't said what happens to those people Trader talks about
> who have medical conditions that preclude the shot or people with
> religious objections. Is that an ADA situation? How about the 1st
> amendment?
> If we are willing to say fuck them, we can all throw our masks away.

I don't see how you got from point A to B there.

[trader_4]

You have heard of breakthrough infections, right? It's like saying that
because 70% of people working in an explosives factory follow the accepted
risk reduction procedures, it's OK to have some employees who say screw
it, I'm doing as I please.

> I got my shot, I believe and I don't care about those who didn't,
> either way.
> 0.3% of them might die.
> Shit happens.

No surprise that you don't care about the people around you, the
rest of humanity.

>
> If you actually drill down on that CDC morbidity data I posted, old
> fat blacks and hispanics are going to tilt that stat so much that a
> working age white guy may be more likely to get killed in his car.
> Particularly if he likes to stop off for a beer after work.

Following that logic, we should just accept drunk driving and not do
the logical things to save those lives too.

[trader_4]

I totally disagree. Trump had a total disregard for the truth, spread one lie after another,
encouraged conspiracy theories, refused to condemn Qanon. Instead he welcomed Qanon,
Proud Boys, white supremacists, anyone was acceptable as long as they supported him.
He jumped on hydroxy when there was no clear evidence to show that it worked, he
dismissed Covid as really not that bad, he mocked masks, he held death rallies.
He destroyed the truth, he accused all the mainstream media of being the fake news and
put forth his lies as alternatives. Trump created the kraken.

[Scott Lurndal]

trader_4 <tra...@optonline.net> writes:
>On Wednesday, October 13, 2021 at 10:47:49 AM UTC-4, angelica...@yahoo.com wrote:
>> On Wednesday, October 13, 2021 at 10:39:20 AM UTC-4, trader_4 wrote:
>>
>> > Trump has transformed the Republican Party from the party of Eisenhower and
>> > Reagan into the party of Qanon, Proud Boys and ignoramuses. And even he can't
>> > control the kraken that he has created, the Kraken is in control of him and the Republican
>> > leaders and influencers.
>> Trump is the effect, not the cause.
>>
>> Cindy Hamilton
>
>I totally disagree. Trump had a total disregard for the truth, spread one lie after another,
>encouraged conspiracy theories, refused to condemn Qanon.

Many political historians place the blame squarely
on Newt Gingrich, which would make Trump just a followon effect.

https://www.encyclopedia.com/politics/encyclopedias-almanacs-transcripts-and-maps/devolution-and-federalism-historical-perspective
https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2018/11/newt-gingrich-says-youre-welcome/570832/

"But few figures in modern history have done more than
Gingrich to lay the groundwork for Trump\u2019s rise.
During his two decades in Congress, he pioneered a style
of partisan combat\u2014replete with name-calling, conspiracy
theories, and strategic obstructionism\u2014that poisoned America\u2019s political
culture and plunged Washington into permanent dysfunction"

[trader_4]

That's just complete BS. Newt lead a movement that was lawful, that respected
the Constitution, that had sound principles, eg less federal govt, less spending,
less taxes, strong defense, all sound Republican principles for years. He wasn't
playing footsie with Nazis, accepting Qanon that thinks Democrats drink kids
blood, wasn't lying about election results. It's like saying trying to blame your
lib crazies today eg AOC and Black Lies Matter, on Bill Clinton or Tip O'Neill.

[gfre...@aol.com]

On Wed, 13 Oct 2021 07:33:52 -0700 (PDT), trader_4

If you are vaccinated, why do you care? Your case will be mild and
your natural immunity from it, aided by the vaccine makes you
stronger.
If you aren't vaccinated, you spun the wheel, you took your chance.
Maybe you will be in the 98.2% who has a mild case anyway.
Calm the fuck down. This isn't a pandemic anymore. It is endemic.
Lester Holt told me so.

[gfre...@aol.com]

On Wed, 13 Oct 2021 07:57:36 -0700 (PDT), trader_4

I remember Don Imus, Limbaugh and Jenny McCarthy telling us about
vaccine dangers in the early 90s. It is the same bunch and you are
right, the internet gives them more of a platform than a few national
talk radio shows. It still isn't new. Christian Scientists got
exemptions in the 60s after some church/state lawsuits.

I got mine and I don't care anymore. Unlike you flip floppers, I
think it works.

[gfre...@aol.com]

On Wed, 13 Oct 2021 08:12:16 -0700 (PDT), trader_4

Another person who doesn't think the vaccine works.

[gfre...@aol.com]

On Wed, 13 Oct 2021 08:23:12 -0700 (PDT), trader_4

Yup but you keep telling me it is a very small fraction of the people
who get sick enough to be in the hospital and most of them were on
death's door anyway.