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Chainsaw rope very hard to pull
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Jerr...@spamblocked.com
Feb 22, 2015, 5:00:49 AM2/22/15
to
I picked up a Stihl "Farm Boss" chainsaw at a garage sale, for a real
good price. It's old but real clean and came with an extra *new* chain
and a case, and more. The new chain is worth what I paid for the whole
thing. The guy said it's not been used for about 10 years. I checked
the gas tank and it was dry, and I knew it was not gummed up. But when
I pulled the rope, it would not budge. The guy told me I could remove
the spark plug, so I did. I sprayed some WD40 in the cylinder and was
able to pull the rope and turn the engine. I then poured a small amount
of motor oil in it, and a little more WD40, and I could easily pull the
rope (with spark plug still removed). I pulled it about 20 times, added
a little more oil, and pulled it another 10 or 15 times, abnd it pulled
real easily, and I could see the piston go up and down.
I put the spark plug back in the engine, and although I could pull the
rope, it pulled very hard, but I could hear the compression, so I bought
it.
After getting it home, I took the spark plug out again, and sprayed some
PB Blaster in the cyl. and added some very light oil, like sewing
machine oil, and let it sit for a day, so the oil can get down around
the piston rings. I then pulled the rope about 25 times and it pulled
real easily (plug removed). I then replaced the plug, and it still
pulls very hard.
I know the piston and the rope are working properly. The air cleaner is
very clean. So, why does it pull so hard when the spark plug is in the
engine? Yes, I know it should pull harder when the plug is in the
engine, but not this hard. I pretty much have to use every muscle I
have to pull that rope. But without the spark plug, I could probably
pull it with one finger. This dont make much sense to me....
[No, it's not oil locked, most of the oil came out of the plug hole when
the plug was removed, and I have pulled it at least 10 times with the
plug installed, which wore me out.
I have not tried to add gas and run it yet. I want to find out why it
pulls so hard before I try to run it. I probably could not pull it fast
enough to start it anyhow.
Any ideas ????
Thanks
good price. It's old but real clean and came with an extra *new* chain
and a case, and more. The new chain is worth what I paid for the whole
thing. The guy said it's not been used for about 10 years. I checked
the gas tank and it was dry, and I knew it was not gummed up. But when
I pulled the rope, it would not budge. The guy told me I could remove
the spark plug, so I did. I sprayed some WD40 in the cylinder and was
able to pull the rope and turn the engine. I then poured a small amount
of motor oil in it, and a little more WD40, and I could easily pull the
rope (with spark plug still removed). I pulled it about 20 times, added
a little more oil, and pulled it another 10 or 15 times, abnd it pulled
real easily, and I could see the piston go up and down.
I put the spark plug back in the engine, and although I could pull the
rope, it pulled very hard, but I could hear the compression, so I bought
it.
After getting it home, I took the spark plug out again, and sprayed some
PB Blaster in the cyl. and added some very light oil, like sewing
machine oil, and let it sit for a day, so the oil can get down around
the piston rings. I then pulled the rope about 25 times and it pulled
real easily (plug removed). I then replaced the plug, and it still
pulls very hard.
I know the piston and the rope are working properly. The air cleaner is
very clean. So, why does it pull so hard when the spark plug is in the
engine? Yes, I know it should pull harder when the plug is in the
engine, but not this hard. I pretty much have to use every muscle I
have to pull that rope. But without the spark plug, I could probably
pull it with one finger. This dont make much sense to me....
[No, it's not oil locked, most of the oil came out of the plug hole when
the plug was removed, and I have pulled it at least 10 times with the
plug installed, which wore me out.
I have not tried to add gas and run it yet. I want to find out why it
pulls so hard before I try to run it. I probably could not pull it fast
enough to start it anyhow.
Any ideas ????
Thanks
bob_villa
Feb 22, 2015, 8:58:03 AM2/22/15
to
On Sunday, February 22, 2015 at 4:00:49 AM UTC-6, Jerr...@spamblocked.com wrote:
> Any ideas ????
>
> Thanks
Plugged exhaust port...remove the muffler and clean the accumulated carbon. Stihl is a nice unit!
> Any ideas ????
>
> Thanks
Plugged exhaust port...remove the muffler and clean the accumulated carbon. Stihl is a nice unit!
CRNG
Feb 22, 2015, 9:11:54 AM2/22/15
to
On Sun, 22 Feb 2015 03:55:44 -0600, Jerr...@spamblocked.com wrote in
<hk7jealqji408uds8...@4ax.com>
>I have not tried to add gas and run it yet. I want to find out why it
>pulls so hard before I try to run it. I probably could not pull it fast
>enough to start it anyhow.
>
>Any ideas ????
>
>Thanks
Stuck or defective compression release valve?
http://www.woodweb.com/knowledge_base/Chainsaw_Compression_Release.html
--
Web based forums are like subscribing to 10 different newspapers
and having to visit 10 different news stands to pickup each one.
Email list-server groups and USENET are like having all of those
newspapers delivered to your door every morning.
<hk7jealqji408uds8...@4ax.com>
>I have not tried to add gas and run it yet. I want to find out why it
>pulls so hard before I try to run it. I probably could not pull it fast
>enough to start it anyhow.
>
>Any ideas ????
>
>Thanks
http://www.woodweb.com/knowledge_base/Chainsaw_Compression_Release.html
--
Web based forums are like subscribing to 10 different newspapers
and having to visit 10 different news stands to pickup each one.
Email list-server groups and USENET are like having all of those
newspapers delivered to your door every morning.
David L. Martel
Feb 22, 2015, 9:49:39 AM2/22/15
to
Agree with Bob. Since it's old and been sitting replace the exhaust
gasket while you are cleaning the muffler screen. Also buy a can of starter
fluid.
Dave M.
gasket while you are cleaning the muffler screen. Also buy a can of starter
fluid.
Dave M.
Ralph Mowery
Feb 22, 2015, 9:59:06 AM2/22/15
to
<Jerr...@spamblocked.com> wrote in message
news:hk7jealqji408uds8...@4ax.com...
>I picked up a Stihl "Farm Boss" chainsaw at a garage sale, for a real
> good price. It's old but real clean and came with an extra *new* chain
> and a case, and more. The new chain is worth what I paid for the whole
> thing. The guy said it's not been used for about 10 years. I checked
> the gas tank and it was dry, and I knew it was not gummed up. But when
> I pulled the rope, it would not budge. The guy told me I could remove
> the spark plug, so I did. I sprayed some WD40 in the cylinder and was
> able to pull the rope and turn the engine. I then poured a small amount
> of motor oil in it, and a little more WD40, and I could easily pull the
> rope (with spark plug still removed). I pulled it about 20 times, added
> a little more oil, and pulled it another 10 or 15 times, abnd it pulled
> real easily, and I could see the piston go up and down.
>
> I put the spark plug back in the engine, and although I could pull the
> rope, it pulled very hard, but I could hear the compression, so I bought
Maybe dirtdobber filled up the muffler/ehaust system.
> good price. It's old but real clean and came with an extra *new* chain
> and a case, and more. The new chain is worth what I paid for the whole
> thing. The guy said it's not been used for about 10 years. I checked
> the gas tank and it was dry, and I knew it was not gummed up. But when
> I pulled the rope, it would not budge. The guy told me I could remove
> the spark plug, so I did. I sprayed some WD40 in the cylinder and was
> able to pull the rope and turn the engine. I then poured a small amount
> of motor oil in it, and a little more WD40, and I could easily pull the
> rope (with spark plug still removed). I pulled it about 20 times, added
> a little more oil, and pulled it another 10 or 15 times, abnd it pulled
> real easily, and I could see the piston go up and down.
>
> I put the spark plug back in the engine, and although I could pull the
> rope, it pulled very hard, but I could hear the compression, so I bought
Tony Hwang
Feb 22, 2015, 10:05:58 AM2/22/15
to
Intake or exhaust passage is plugged up or reed(valve) jammed.
Since compression is felt, exhaust side?(remove muffler and look)
Instead of plug did you try with paper ball plugged into plug hole?
It should pop if compression cycle works.
Col. Edmund Burke
Feb 22, 2015, 10:21:45 AM2/22/15
to
Phil Kangas
Feb 22, 2015, 12:51:39 PM2/22/15
to
"CRNG" <
> wrote in message
> On Sun, 22 Feb 2015 03:55:44 -0600,
wrote in
> <>
>
>>I have not tried to add gas and run it yet. I
>>want to find out why it
>>pulls so hard before I try to run it. I
>>probably could not pull it fast
>>enough to start it anyhow.
>>
>>Any ideas ????
>>
>>Thanks
>
> Stuck or defective compression release valve?
> http://www.woodweb.com/knowledge_base/Chainsaw_Compression_Release.html
It may not even _have_ a compression
>
>>I have not tried to add gas and run it yet. I
>>want to find out why it
>>pulls so hard before I try to run it. I
>>probably could not pull it fast
>>enough to start it anyhow.
>>
>>Any ideas ????
>>
>>Thanks
>
> Stuck or defective compression release valve?
> http://www.woodweb.com/knowledge_base/Chainsaw_Compression_Release.html
release!
Ed Pawlowski
Feb 22, 2015, 3:54:12 PM2/22/15
to
does not.
Harry K
Mar 3, 2015, 12:11:16 PM3/3/15
to
Harry K
cl...@snyder.on.ca
Mar 3, 2015, 7:53:23 PM3/3/15
to
On Tue, 3 Mar 2015 09:11:11 -0800 (PST), Harry K <tur...@q.com>
wrote:
Pull the plug and then try the rope. If it is still stiff, you have a
problem. My Remington snaps like crazy when I pull the cord - very
high compression. Don't ever try to start it on a ladder or in a
tree!!
wrote:
problem. My Remington snaps like crazy when I pull the cord - very
high compression. Don't ever try to start it on a ladder or in a
tree!!
thekma...@gmail.com
Mar 3, 2015, 8:33:53 PM3/3/15
to
7:53 PMcl...@snyder.on.ca wrote
- show quoted text -
swimming pool, trailing smoke from the saw? LOLOL
- show quoted text -
Pull the plug and then try the rope. If it is still stiff, you have a
problem. My Remington snaps like crazy when I pull the cord - very
high compression. Don't ever try to start it on a ladder or in a
tree!! "
Heh-heh-hehhh! Can you just see him flying off the ladder into a neighbor's
problem. My Remington snaps like crazy when I pull the cord - very
high compression. Don't ever try to start it on a ladder or in a
tree!! "
swimming pool, trailing smoke from the saw? LOLOL
Stormin Mormon
Mar 4, 2015, 7:33:57 PM3/4/15
to
On 3/3/2015 8:33 PM, thekma...@gmail.com wrote:
> Heh-heh-hehhh! Can you just see him flying off the ladder into a neighbor's
> swimming pool, trailing smoke from the saw? LOLOL
>
That would be a Clark Griswold and National
> Heh-heh-hehhh! Can you just see him flying off the ladder into a neighbor's
> swimming pool, trailing smoke from the saw? LOLOL
>
Lampoon moment. But, yes, it would be comical.
-
.
Christopher A. Young
learn more about Jesus
. www.lds.org
.
.
Harry Boling
Jun 26, 2017, 8:14:06 PM6/26/17
to
replying to Jerry.Tan, Harry Boling wrote:
See if it has a spring-assist starter. If not, see if you can get one for
that unit. Put one on my Poulan 3314 and it made a tremendous difference in
start-ability.
--
for full context, visit https://www.homeownershub.com/maintenance/chainsaw-rope-very-hard-to-pull-824350-.htm
See if it has a spring-assist starter. If not, see if you can get one for
that unit. Put one on my Poulan 3314 and it made a tremendous difference in
start-ability.
--
for full context, visit https://www.homeownershub.com/maintenance/chainsaw-rope-very-hard-to-pull-824350-.htm
rdw8932
Feb 10, 2018, 9:44:09 AM2/10/18
to
replying to Jerry.Tan, rdw8932 wrote:
> I have not tried to add gas and run it yet. I want to find out why it pulls so
hard before I try to run it.
Bad move. The gas/oil mix lubricates the bearings as well as the rings. You
> I have not tried to add gas and run it yet. I want to find out why it pulls so
hard before I try to run it.
are turning the engine on dry bearings. Very bad. I have a similar situation
on a Stihl 026 (hard, jerky pull and won't start). But you have given me an
idea: I did leave gas in the saw for three months so possibly the gas
varnished in the passages and lubrication is not getting to the bearings and
rings. The increased friction on top of the compression would make the
starter harder to pull and jerky. So even though I drained the tank and put
in fresh fuel it may not be getting through, thus no start. Tomorrow I will
remove the spark plug and pull the starter rope and see if I can smell gas
fumes at the spark plug hole. If no fumes I may have to rebuild the
carburetor. I know this thread is three years old but this particular problem
seems to be very common so I am posting for those just now encountering it.
trader_4
Feb 10, 2018, 2:42:00 PM2/10/18
to
On Saturday, February 10, 2018 at 9:44:09 AM UTC-5, rdw8932 wrote:
> replying to Jerry.Tan, rdw8932 wrote:
> > I have not tried to add gas and run it yet. I want to find out why it pulls so
> hard before I try to run it.
> Bad move. The gas/oil mix lubricates the bearings as well as the rings. You
> are turning the engine on dry bearings. Very bad. I have a similar situation
> on a Stihl 026 (hard, jerky pull and won't start).
It isn't similar, the OP said that his pulls OK with the spark plug
> replying to Jerry.Tan, rdw8932 wrote:
> > I have not tried to add gas and run it yet. I want to find out why it pulls so
> hard before I try to run it.
> Bad move. The gas/oil mix lubricates the bearings as well as the rings. You
> are turning the engine on dry bearings. Very bad. I have a similar situation
> on a Stihl 026 (hard, jerky pull and won't start).
removed. If it was dry bearings, he would have trouble pulling it
without the plug. Someone years ago suggested looking for a blocked
exhaust port, that sounds like a possibility, eg rusted muffler that's
plugged or similar. Maybe even insects made a home.
Will
Feb 11, 2018, 12:14:08 PM2/11/18
to
replying to trader_4, Will wrote:
I'm having this same problem, I took apart the starter assembly on my MS291,
and it hasn't run for over a year and, its really hard to pull the starter
like im fighting the compression. Its a brand new saw aswell.
I'm having this same problem, I took apart the starter assembly on my MS291,
and it hasn't run for over a year and, its really hard to pull the starter
like im fighting the compression. Its a brand new saw aswell.
BurfordTJustice
Feb 11, 2018, 12:21:46 PM2/11/18
to
LOL
"trader_4" <tra...@optonline.net> wrote in message
news:b71da472-df29-4101...@googlegroups.com...
: : It isn't similar,
If it was
. Someone years ago
"trader_4" <tra...@optonline.net> wrote in message
news:b71da472-df29-4101...@googlegroups.com...
: : It isn't similar,
If it was
. Someone years ago
, that sounds like a possibility,
Dove Tail
Feb 11, 2018, 2:50:22 PM2/11/18
to
Will wrote:
> replying to trader_4, Will wrote:
> I'm having this same problem, I took apart the starter assembly on my
> MS291, and it hasn't run for over a year and, its really hard to pull
> the starter like im fighting the compression. Its a brand new saw
> aswell.
MS291 is a GREAT saw. What happens if you remove the spark plug?
> replying to trader_4, Will wrote:
> I'm having this same problem, I took apart the starter assembly on my
> MS291, and it hasn't run for over a year and, its really hard to pull
> the starter like im fighting the compression. Its a brand new saw
> aswell.
--
"In matters of conscience, the law of the majority has no place."
"Truth Sounds Like Hate To Those Who Hate The Truth"
Uncle Monster
Feb 11, 2018, 5:38:26 PM2/11/18
to
On Sunday, February 11, 2018 at 1:50:22 PM UTC-6, Dove Tail wrote:
> Will wrote:
>
> > replying to trader_4, Will wrote:
> > I'm having this same problem, I took apart the starter assembly on my
> > MS291, and it hasn't run for over a year and, its really hard to pull
> > the starter like im fighting the compression. Its a brand new saw
> > aswell.
>
> MS291 is a GREAT saw. What happens if you remove the spark plug?
>
> --
>
So says Dove Anus The North Korean troll. ^_^
> Will wrote:
>
> > replying to trader_4, Will wrote:
> > I'm having this same problem, I took apart the starter assembly on my
> > MS291, and it hasn't run for over a year and, its really hard to pull
> > the starter like im fighting the compression. Its a brand new saw
> > aswell.
>
> MS291 is a GREAT saw. What happens if you remove the spark plug?
>
> --
>
[8~{} Uncle Observant Monster
Tekkie®
Feb 12, 2018, 2:34:38 PM2/12/18
to
Will posted for all of us...
Ever hear of a warranty?
--
Tekkie
--
Tekkie
Sirgerlad
Jul 3, 2019, 11:44:06 PM7/3/19
to
replying to Tony Hwang, Sirgerlad wrote:
So, what do you use to clean the carbon buildup on the top of the piston
So, what do you use to clean the carbon buildup on the top of the piston
Sirgerlad
Jul 3, 2019, 11:44:06 PM7/3/19
to
replying to bob_villa, Sirgerlad wrote:
So what do you clean carbon buildup on the top of the ? Yes
So what do you clean carbon buildup on the top of the ? Yes
Wade Garrett
Jul 4, 2019, 8:34:52 AM7/4/19
to
On 7/3/19 11:44 PM, Sirgerlad wrote:
> replying to Tony Hwang, Sirgerlad wrote:
> So, what do you use to clean the carbon buildup on the top of the piston
>
Wooden popsicle stick or similar. Nothing metal!
> replying to Tony Hwang, Sirgerlad wrote:
> So, what do you use to clean the carbon buildup on the top of the piston
>
--
Ever notice the shortage of "armed law-abiding citizen” victim tragedy
stories in the news?
Vic Smith
Jul 4, 2019, 11:41:59 AM7/4/19
to
On Thu, 4 Jul 2019 08:34:48 -0400, Wade Garrett <wa...@cooler.net> wrote:
>On 7/3/19 11:44 PM, Sirgerlad wrote:
>> replying to Tony Hwang, Sirgerlad wrote:
>> So, what do you use to clean the carbon buildup on the top of the piston
>>
>Wooden popsicle stick or similar. Nothing metal!
Copper tools work fine.
>On 7/3/19 11:44 PM, Sirgerlad wrote:
>> replying to Tony Hwang, Sirgerlad wrote:
>> So, what do you use to clean the carbon buildup on the top of the piston
>>
>Wooden popsicle stick or similar. Nothing metal!
Oren
Jul 4, 2019, 12:35:44 PM7/4/19
to
On Thu, 04 Jul 2019 10:41:53 -0500, Vic Smith
<thismaila...@comcast.net> wrote:
>>> So, what do you use to clean the carbon buildup on the top of the piston
>>>
>>Wooden popsicle stick or similar. Nothing metal!
>
>Copper tools work fine.
This guy used Lacquer Thinner:
<thismaila...@comcast.net> wrote:
>>> So, what do you use to clean the carbon buildup on the top of the piston
>>>
>>Wooden popsicle stick or similar. Nothing metal!
>
>Copper tools work fine.
<https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1r70nZ8zwvE>
Wade Garrett
Jul 4, 2019, 4:14:22 PM7/4/19
to
particular alloys. Go with popsicle sticks....they're safer and you get
to eat the popsicles first ;-)
--
I miss the country I grew up in.
%
Jul 4, 2019, 4:26:45 PM7/4/19
to
week...@gmail.com
Nov 14, 2019, 9:47:56 PM11/14/19
to
I know this is an old thread, but I just came across it when searching for a solution for a saw with a hard pull start. I found an ms 291 at a pawn shop that’s very clean looks almost new. The muffler is shiny and the guide bar which appears to be the one it came with barely has any scratches. I know doesn’t mean the saw is new but it’s just too clean to have had much use. They had it marked for $240. So I took it outside but I only got about one full pull and then I couldn’t pull it very far. I gave it all I had and again I got a very hard pull but all the way out and sort of a low load resonant sound which made me think it’s probably a simple fix, I just don’t know that much about saws. Or I would have removed the plug and tried again. Instead I was thinking mechanical issue like the pull start itself or flywheel. So after I got them to knock the price down to $200 I put it on layaway so I’d have a chance to figure it out. And after reading few a few things here I’m pretty sure I was just fighting the compression. Especially since the store manager said it was running fine when it came in but had been sitting on their shelf for the last 90 days. So when I go back I plan on bringing a can of wd40 and maybe some pb blaster removing the plug and spray some in the hole and I’m thinking that should do the trick. Would you have any other suggestions at this point?
Side note. Just two weeks earlier I found an ms290 at a different pawnshop. This one looked rough there was oil and debris caked to just about everything and when I took it out to start it I couldn’t get to start but it turned over once and I could tell it wanted to. So for $110 I took it straight to an Ace shop. They opened it up and said yeah this thing has never been cleaned the vacuumed the air filter took the plug out and said the carburetor was pristine though I’m not sure if he actually replaced the plug or just put the old one back in but he fired it right up and charged me $5. And it runs great, I’m still working on cleaning it up and learning more about how it works and what does what. But when I saw that MS291 and it looked like it had barely been used, even at twice what I had just paid for basically the same saw I knew $240 was a good price and since it had just hit the sales floor that day it wouldn’t be there long. But $200 is an even better price so At the end of the day I should come out with an MS290 + MS291 for about $310. And if I’m not mistaken I could probably sell either one of them for close to that number
Side note. Just two weeks earlier I found an ms290 at a different pawnshop. This one looked rough there was oil and debris caked to just about everything and when I took it out to start it I couldn’t get to start but it turned over once and I could tell it wanted to. So for $110 I took it straight to an Ace shop. They opened it up and said yeah this thing has never been cleaned the vacuumed the air filter took the plug out and said the carburetor was pristine though I’m not sure if he actually replaced the plug or just put the old one back in but he fired it right up and charged me $5. And it runs great, I’m still working on cleaning it up and learning more about how it works and what does what. But when I saw that MS291 and it looked like it had barely been used, even at twice what I had just paid for basically the same saw I knew $240 was a good price and since it had just hit the sales floor that day it wouldn’t be there long. But $200 is an even better price so At the end of the day I should come out with an MS290 + MS291 for about $310. And if I’m not mistaken I could probably sell either one of them for close to that number
Fred C Wiesinger
Jan 1, 2020, 12:14:07 PM1/1/20
to
replying to bob_villa, Fred C Wiesinger wrote:
I have Jerry Tans problem. And with the muffler removed I still have the hard
jerky pull. If I ever do get it started, then it starts nicely on warm start.
To be sure it's not flooded, I pull 6 to 8 times with plug out. Fred in
Bellville, TX
I have Jerry Tans problem. And with the muffler removed I still have the hard
jerky pull. If I ever do get it started, then it starts nicely on warm start.
To be sure it's not flooded, I pull 6 to 8 times with plug out. Fred in
Bellville, TX
Jon
Mar 10, 2020, 11:44:05 PM3/10/20
to
replying to Tekkie®, Jon wrote:
Found this thread when Googling a solution for the exact same issue. Pulls
freely with spark plug removed, but if I cap that it is extremely hard to
pull. I took off the muffler, there was no clog. I took off the carb, fuel
line and filter, and the fuel line definitely had a clog as did the filter in
the fuel tank wasnt allowing anything to pass. So, I took it out, cut the
fuel line, took off the carb and took it apart, blowing out everything with
air, put back together, could draw thru the fuel line again, put it back on...
and nothing. still cant pull the cord. I just got a new carb, line, and
filter delivered today to see if maybe I just didnt clear it all the away from
carb and line etc. However, I really dont think this is the issue, Ive
checked the piston and it isnt scarred up. Im hoping the previous owner didnt
use a bad mix and the rings are moved/shot. Anyone get their saw running from
any of these suggestions?
Found this thread when Googling a solution for the exact same issue. Pulls
freely with spark plug removed, but if I cap that it is extremely hard to
pull. I took off the muffler, there was no clog. I took off the carb, fuel
line and filter, and the fuel line definitely had a clog as did the filter in
the fuel tank wasnt allowing anything to pass. So, I took it out, cut the
fuel line, took off the carb and took it apart, blowing out everything with
air, put back together, could draw thru the fuel line again, put it back on...
and nothing. still cant pull the cord. I just got a new carb, line, and
filter delivered today to see if maybe I just didnt clear it all the away from
carb and line etc. However, I really dont think this is the issue, Ive
checked the piston and it isnt scarred up. Im hoping the previous owner didnt
use a bad mix and the rings are moved/shot. Anyone get their saw running from
any of these suggestions?
Cgray1521
Mar 18, 2020, 8:44:07 AM3/18/20
to
replying to Jon, Cgray1521 wrote:
I’m trying to get my grandparents yard boss running but having the same
issue. Hard to pull at first, feels like because of compression, then releases
and spins over. I’ve torn everything down twice. This last time I noticed
the gap on the spark plug was closed. So I looked at the piston and it has a
slight surface rust mark that matches the shape of the bottom of the side
electrode on the spark plug.
So I feel the piston is just slightly hitting the spark plug. Thought maybe
someone over tighten the spark plugs so I bought a new one. But the new does
the same thing. If I install the spark plug by hand as thought as I can it
will run fine. But if I put a wrench on it and tighten it literally a hair
more it locks up. DONT GET IT!
I’m trying to get my grandparents yard boss running but having the same
issue. Hard to pull at first, feels like because of compression, then releases
and spins over. I’ve torn everything down twice. This last time I noticed
the gap on the spark plug was closed. So I looked at the piston and it has a
slight surface rust mark that matches the shape of the bottom of the side
electrode on the spark plug.
So I feel the piston is just slightly hitting the spark plug. Thought maybe
someone over tighten the spark plugs so I bought a new one. But the new does
the same thing. If I install the spark plug by hand as thought as I can it
will run fine. But if I put a wrench on it and tighten it literally a hair
more it locks up. DONT GET IT!
Ralph Mowery
Mar 18, 2020, 9:34:35 AM3/18/20
to
In article <15fd6696f9545207$1$38335$4206...@news.newsgroupdirect.com>,
caedfaa9ed1216d60ef...@example.com says...
and see. If not , find one that is slightly shorter where it goes into
the head. Sometimes all things the same number by different companies
will be slightly different. If it has a crush washer, maybe the washer
is over flattened.
caedfaa9ed1216d60ef...@example.com says...
>
> replying to Jon, Cgray1521 wrote:
> I�m trying to get my grandparents yard boss running but having the same
> replying to Jon, Cgray1521 wrote:
> issue. Hard to pull at first, feels like because of compression, then releases
> and spins over. I�ve torn everything down twice. This last time I noticed
> the gap on the spark plug was closed. So I looked at the piston and it has a
> slight surface rust mark that matches the shape of the bottom of the side
> electrode on the spark plug.
> So I feel the piston is just slightly hitting the spark plug. Thought maybe
> someone over tighten the spark plugs so I bought a new one. But the new does
> the same thing. If I install the spark plug by hand as thought as I can it
> will run fine. But if I put a wrench on it and tighten it literally a hair
> more it locks up. DONT GET IT!
>
>
>
Maybe someone put the wrong spark plug in the chain saw. I would look
> slight surface rust mark that matches the shape of the bottom of the side
> electrode on the spark plug.
> So I feel the piston is just slightly hitting the spark plug. Thought maybe
> someone over tighten the spark plugs so I bought a new one. But the new does
> the same thing. If I install the spark plug by hand as thought as I can it
> will run fine. But if I put a wrench on it and tighten it literally a hair
> more it locks up. DONT GET IT!
>
>
>
and see. If not , find one that is slightly shorter where it goes into
the head. Sometimes all things the same number by different companies
will be slightly different. If it has a crush washer, maybe the washer
is over flattened.
Wade Garrett
Mar 18, 2020, 11:36:19 AM3/18/20
to
On 3/18/20 8:44 AM, Cgray1521 wrote:
> replying to Jon, Cgray1521 wrote:
> I’m trying to get my grandparents yard boss running but having the same
> issue. Hard to pull at first, feels like because of compression, then
> releases
> and spins over. I’ve torn everything down twice. This last time I noticed
> the gap on the spark plug was closed. So I looked at the piston and it
> has a
> slight surface rust mark that matches the shape of the bottom of the side
> electrode on the spark plug. So I feel the piston is just slightly
> hitting the spark plug. Thought maybe
> someone over tighten the spark plugs so I bought a new one. But the new
> does
> the same thing. If I install the spark plug by hand as thought as I can it
> will run fine. But if I put a wrench on it and tighten it literally a hair
> more it locks up. DONT GET IT!
>
The reach of the park plug is too long and extends too far into the
> replying to Jon, Cgray1521 wrote:
> I’m trying to get my grandparents yard boss running but having the same
> issue. Hard to pull at first, feels like because of compression, then
> releases
> and spins over. I’ve torn everything down twice. This last time I noticed
> the gap on the spark plug was closed. So I looked at the piston and it
> has a
> slight surface rust mark that matches the shape of the bottom of the side
> electrode on the spark plug. So I feel the piston is just slightly
> hitting the spark plug. Thought maybe
> someone over tighten the spark plugs so I bought a new one. But the new
> does
> the same thing. If I install the spark plug by hand as thought as I can it
> will run fine. But if I put a wrench on it and tighten it literally a hair
> more it locks up. DONT GET IT!
>
cylinder- and certainly not the correct one the manufacturer specified
for that engine.
RTFM ;-)
--
Before beginning, plan carefully.
- Marcus Tullius Cicero
Clare Snyder
Mar 18, 2020, 11:20:57 PM3/18/20
to
On Wed, 18 Mar 2020 11:36:14 -0400, Wade Garrett <wa...@cooler.net>
wrote:
Likely an extended tip plug where it is not spec'd. What model saw
and what plug are you buying??
wrote:
and what plug are you buying??
Ed Pawlowski
Mar 18, 2020, 11:44:48 PM3/18/20
to
Clare Snyder
Mar 19, 2020, 10:28:27 PM3/19/20
to
mulesan...@gmail.com
Jun 7, 2020, 4:10:37 AM6/7/20
to
On Sunday, February 22, 2015 at 4:00:49 AM UTC-6, Jerr...@spamblocked.com wrote:
> I picked up a Stihl "Farm Boss" chainsaw at a garage sale, for a real
> good price. It's old but real clean and came with an extra *new* chain
> and a case, and more. The new chain is worth what I paid for the whole
> thing. The guy said it's not been used for about 10 years. I checked
> the gas tank and it was dry, and I knew it was not gummed up. But when
> I pulled the rope, it would not budge. The guy told me I could remove
> the spark plug, so I did. I sprayed some WD40 in the cylinder and was
> able to pull the rope and turn the engine. I then poured a small amount
> of motor oil in it, and a little more WD40, and I could easily pull the
> rope (with spark plug still removed). I pulled it about 20 times, added
> a little more oil, and pulled it another 10 or 15 times, abnd it pulled
> real easily, and I could see the piston go up and down.
>
> I put the spark plug back in the engine, and although I could pull the
> rope, it pulled very hard, but I could hear the compression, so I bought
> it.
>
> After getting it home, I took the spark plug out again, and sprayed some
> PB Blaster in the cyl. and added some very light oil, like sewing
> machine oil, and let it sit for a day, so the oil can get down around
> the piston rings. I then pulled the rope about 25 times and it pulled
> real easily (plug removed). I then replaced the plug, and it still
> pulls very hard.
>
> I know the piston and the rope are working properly. The air cleaner is
> very clean. So, why does it pull so hard when the spark plug is in the
> engine? Yes, I know it should pull harder when the plug is in the
> engine, but not this hard. I pretty much have to use every muscle I
> have to pull that rope. But without the spark plug, I could probably
> pull it with one finger. This dont make much sense to me....
> [No, it's not oil locked, most of the oil came out of the plug hole when
> the plug was removed, and I have pulled it at least 10 times with the
> plug installed, which wore me out.
> enough to start it anyhow.
>
> Any ideas ????
>
> Thanks
> I picked up a Stihl "Farm Boss" chainsaw at a garage sale, for a real
> good price. It's old but real clean and came with an extra *new* chain
> and a case, and more. The new chain is worth what I paid for the whole
> thing. The guy said it's not been used for about 10 years. I checked
> the gas tank and it was dry, and I knew it was not gummed up. But when
> I pulled the rope, it would not budge. The guy told me I could remove
> the spark plug, so I did. I sprayed some WD40 in the cylinder and was
> able to pull the rope and turn the engine. I then poured a small amount
> of motor oil in it, and a little more WD40, and I could easily pull the
> rope (with spark plug still removed). I pulled it about 20 times, added
> a little more oil, and pulled it another 10 or 15 times, abnd it pulled
> real easily, and I could see the piston go up and down.
>
> I put the spark plug back in the engine, and although I could pull the
> rope, it pulled very hard, but I could hear the compression, so I bought
> it.
>
> After getting it home, I took the spark plug out again, and sprayed some
> PB Blaster in the cyl. and added some very light oil, like sewing
> machine oil, and let it sit for a day, so the oil can get down around
> the piston rings. I then pulled the rope about 25 times and it pulled
> real easily (plug removed). I then replaced the plug, and it still
> pulls very hard.
>
> I know the piston and the rope are working properly. The air cleaner is
> very clean. So, why does it pull so hard when the spark plug is in the
> engine? Yes, I know it should pull harder when the plug is in the
> engine, but not this hard. I pretty much have to use every muscle I
> have to pull that rope. But without the spark plug, I could probably
> pull it with one finger. This dont make much sense to me....
> [No, it's not oil locked, most of the oil came out of the plug hole when
> the plug was removed, and I have pulled it at least 10 times with the
> plug installed, which wore me out.
>
> I have not tried to add gas and run it yet. I want to find out why it
> pulls so hard before I try to run it. I probably could not pull it fast
> I have not tried to add gas and run it yet. I want to find out why it
> enough to start it anyhow.
>
> Any ideas ????
>
> Thanks
mulesan...@gmail.com
Jun 7, 2020, 4:11:10 AM6/7/20
to
Ed Pawlowski
Jun 7, 2020, 9:40:49 AM6/7/20
to
now.
trader_4
Jun 7, 2020, 9:52:37 AM6/7/20
to
with a new carb, fuel line, filter, etc. None of that has anything to do
with being unable to pull the cord.
Fred McKenzie
Jun 7, 2020, 12:50:22 PM6/7/20
to
In article <y76DG.245160$2U3.1...@fx04.iad>,
Ed-
I wonder if mulesan...@gmail.com is a more recent address for
Jerr...@spamblocked.com? He still needs to fix it.
Fred
I wonder if mulesan...@gmail.com is a more recent address for
Jerr...@spamblocked.com? He still needs to fix it.
Fred
Bob F
Jun 7, 2020, 4:06:15 PM6/7/20
to
Clare Snyder
Jun 7, 2020, 6:51:09 PM6/7/20
to
On Sun, 7 Jun 2020 01:10:33 -0700 (PDT), mulesan...@gmail.com
wrote:
Sounds like my high compression Remington. When you pull the rope it
either starts or tears the rope out of your hand. REALLY a "snappy"
unit but it screams like a banshee when you get it started. I WILL NOT
start it while on a ladder - pretty much need to "drop" it to start
it.
wrote:
either starts or tears the rope out of your hand. REALLY a "snappy"
unit but it screams like a banshee when you get it started. I WILL NOT
start it while on a ladder - pretty much need to "drop" it to start
it.
Phil Kangas
Jun 7, 2020, 10:30:05 PM6/7/20
to
"Clare Snyder" <cl...@snyder.on.ca> wrote in message
news:1lrqdf5meul29gk6n...@4ax.com...
open
a relief valve to lower the compression to ease starting. As
soon
as it fires this valve closes to run as normal. pdk
johnst...@gmail.com
Jun 21, 2020, 1:36:03 PM6/21/20
to
Did anyone ever find a solution?
I have older 025c, which is rarely used (but I run it dry when I do use it).
I can barely pull the starter cord. If I remove the spark plug, can pull with one finger. Removing the muffler does not help. Removing the chain/bar did not help.
No obvious scars on the piston/rings.
I put a some oil on the piston/rings, no difference.
I'm at a loss.
Ralph Mowery
Jun 21, 2020, 1:50:42 PM6/21/20
to
In article <1a3b6493-6ead-4b4f...@googlegroups.com>,
johnst...@gmail.com says...
lubercate the internal parts. I do use the unleaded gas and most of the
time add the Sta-bil to it just to be sure.
I do run my 4 cycle engines dry as the oil is in the crank case and the
gas can get into it over a long period of time. I hae a tiller that is
arund 10 years old and only use it for about a week in the spring. It
sits for 11 months and will start on the 1st or 2nd pull. Same with a 5
kw generator.
johnst...@gmail.com says...
>
> I know this thread is old.
> Did anyone ever find a solution?
> I have older 025c, which is rarely used (but I run it dry when I do use it).
> I can barely pull the starter cord. If I remove the spark plug, can pull with one finger. Removing the muffler does not help. Removing the chain/bar did not help.
> No obvious scars on the piston/rings.
> I put a some oil on the piston/rings, no difference.
> I'm at a loss.
>
>
I never run a 2 cycle engine empty. The gas has the oil in it to
> I know this thread is old.
> Did anyone ever find a solution?
> I have older 025c, which is rarely used (but I run it dry when I do use it).
> I can barely pull the starter cord. If I remove the spark plug, can pull with one finger. Removing the muffler does not help. Removing the chain/bar did not help.
> No obvious scars on the piston/rings.
> I put a some oil on the piston/rings, no difference.
> I'm at a loss.
>
>
lubercate the internal parts. I do use the unleaded gas and most of the
time add the Sta-bil to it just to be sure.
I do run my 4 cycle engines dry as the oil is in the crank case and the
gas can get into it over a long period of time. I hae a tiller that is
arund 10 years old and only use it for about a week in the spring. It
sits for 11 months and will start on the 1st or 2nd pull. Same with a 5
kw generator.
Jim Joyce
Jun 21, 2020, 2:03:59 PM6/21/20
to
On Sun, 21 Jun 2020 10:35:59 -0700 (PDT), johnst...@gmail.com wrote:
>On Wednesday, March 18, 2020 at 8:44:07 AM UTC-4, Cgray1521 wrote:
>> replying to Jon, Cgray1521 wrote:
>> I’m trying to get my grandparents yard boss running but having the same
>> issue. Hard to pull at first, feels like because of compression, then releases
>> and spins over. I’ve torn everything down twice. This last time I noticed
>> the gap on the spark plug was closed. So I looked at the piston and it has a
>> slight surface rust mark that matches the shape of the bottom of the side
>> electrode on the spark plug.
>> So I feel the piston is just slightly hitting the spark plug. Thought maybe
>> someone over tighten the spark plugs so I bought a new one. But the new does
>> the same thing. If I install the spark plug by hand as thought as I can it
>> will run fine. But if I put a wrench on it and tighten it literally a hair
>> more it locks up. DONT GET IT!
If the spark plug is hitting the top of the piston, the most likely culprit
>On Wednesday, March 18, 2020 at 8:44:07 AM UTC-4, Cgray1521 wrote:
>> replying to Jon, Cgray1521 wrote:
>> I’m trying to get my grandparents yard boss running but having the same
>> issue. Hard to pull at first, feels like because of compression, then releases
>> and spins over. I’ve torn everything down twice. This last time I noticed
>> the gap on the spark plug was closed. So I looked at the piston and it has a
>> slight surface rust mark that matches the shape of the bottom of the side
>> electrode on the spark plug.
>> So I feel the piston is just slightly hitting the spark plug. Thought maybe
>> someone over tighten the spark plugs so I bought a new one. But the new does
>> the same thing. If I install the spark plug by hand as thought as I can it
>> will run fine. But if I put a wrench on it and tighten it literally a hair
>> more it locks up. DONT GET IT!
is the wrong spark plug is installed. A "hot" plug will usually have a
longer nose, which could then make contact with the top of the piston if
the engine isn't designed for it. The solution then is simple: swap the hot
plug for a colder plug. Every spark plug carries a heat range, so look for
a plug that's colder than what you have. Preferably, look for the actual
plug recommended for that engine.
Some info about plug heat ranges:
https://www.ngkntk.in/hot-spark-plugs-vs-cold-spark-plugs/
>>
>> --
>> for full context, visit https://www.homeownershub.com/maintenance/chainsaw-rope-very-hard-to-pull-824350-.htm
>
>
>I know this thread is old.
>Did anyone ever find a solution?
>I have older 025c, which is rarely used (but I run it dry when I do use it).
>I can barely pull the starter cord. If I remove the spark plug, can pull with one finger. Removing the muffler does not help. Removing the chain/bar did not help.
>No obvious scars on the piston/rings.
>I put a some oil on the piston/rings, no difference.
>I'm at a loss.
physical interference between the plug and the top of the piston, then I
would assume it's a high compression issue. So what would cause that? Well,
for example, something being lodged in the combustion chamber that doesn't
belong there, such as extensive carbon build-up or even a foreign object
that might have come through the intake port. Can you remove the cylinder
head and take a look?
johnst...@gmail.com
Jun 21, 2020, 2:17:31 PM6/21/20
to
On Sunday, June 21, 2020 at 1:50:42 PM UTC-4, Ralph Mowery wrote:
> In article <1a3b6493-6ead-4b4f...@googlegroups.com>,
> johnst...@gmail.com says...
> >
> > I know this thread is old.
> > Did anyone ever find a solution?
> > I have older 025c, which is rarely used (but I run it dry when I do use it).
> > I can barely pull the starter cord. If I remove the spark plug, can pull with one finger. Removing the muffler does not help. Removing the chain/bar did not help.
> > No obvious scars on the piston/rings.
> > I put some oil on the piston/rings, no difference.
> In article <1a3b6493-6ead-4b4f...@googlegroups.com>,
> johnst...@gmail.com says...
> >
> > I know this thread is old.
> > Did anyone ever find a solution?
> > I have older 025c, which is rarely used (but I run it dry when I do use it).
> > I can barely pull the starter cord. If I remove the spark plug, can pull with one finger. Removing the muffler does not help. Removing the chain/bar did not help.
> > No obvious scars on the piston/rings.
> > I'm at a loss.
> >
> >
>
> I never run a 2 cycle engine empty. The gas has the oil in it to
> lubercate the internal parts. I do use the unleaded gas and most of the
> time add the Sta-bil to it just to be sure.
>
> I do run my 4 cycle engines dry as the oil is in the crank case and the
> gas can get into it over a long period of time. I hae a tiller that is
> arund 10 years old and only use it for about a week in the spring. It
> sits for 11 months and will start on the 1st or 2nd pull. Same with a 5
> kw generator.
Understood about using Sta-bil, etc.
> >
> >
>
> I never run a 2 cycle engine empty. The gas has the oil in it to
> lubercate the internal parts. I do use the unleaded gas and most of the
> time add the Sta-bil to it just to be sure.
>
> I do run my 4 cycle engines dry as the oil is in the crank case and the
> gas can get into it over a long period of time. I hae a tiller that is
> arund 10 years old and only use it for about a week in the spring. It
> sits for 11 months and will start on the 1st or 2nd pull. Same with a 5
> kw generator.
In my case, I can go years between uses. I'm not sure Sta-bil ideal for that long a period of inactivity.
That would not explain why I can easily pull cord, with plug removed.
It worked fine when I last used it, couple yrs ago.
Ralph Mowery
Jun 21, 2020, 3:06:55 PM6/21/20
to
In article <1c2f69be-a5a4-49b7...@googlegroups.com>,
johnst...@gmail.com says...
have any valves that open and close ? Maybe even some reed types ?
They may be stuck or broken.
I doubt the Sta-bil would be good for years. In that case it probably
is ok to let the engine run dry and just take the hit on no lubercation.
I bolught one of the roughly $ 100 700 watt generators from HF that is 2
cycle. I seldom use it, but do start it up every couple of months and
run it for a while. Then put in a fresh batch of the alcohol free
gas/oil and Sta-bil. I think some of the oil has some properties of the
Sta-bil. Let that run for a short period of time. Found it hard to
start even when new,so give it a shot of starting fluid and it cranks
right up.
johnst...@gmail.com says...
>
> Understood about using Sta-bil, etc.
> In my case, I can go years between uses. I'm not sure Sta-bil ideal for that long a period of inactivity.
> That would not explain why I can easily pull cord, with plug removed.
> It worked fine when I last used it, couple yrs ago.
>
>
I have not looked into the insides of the small engines. Does that one
> Understood about using Sta-bil, etc.
> In my case, I can go years between uses. I'm not sure Sta-bil ideal for that long a period of inactivity.
> That would not explain why I can easily pull cord, with plug removed.
> It worked fine when I last used it, couple yrs ago.
>
>
have any valves that open and close ? Maybe even some reed types ?
They may be stuck or broken.
I doubt the Sta-bil would be good for years. In that case it probably
is ok to let the engine run dry and just take the hit on no lubercation.
I bolught one of the roughly $ 100 700 watt generators from HF that is 2
cycle. I seldom use it, but do start it up every couple of months and
run it for a while. Then put in a fresh batch of the alcohol free
gas/oil and Sta-bil. I think some of the oil has some properties of the
Sta-bil. Let that run for a short period of time. Found it hard to
start even when new,so give it a shot of starting fluid and it cranks
right up.
Clare Snyder
Jun 21, 2020, 3:46:04 PM6/21/20
to
On Sun, 21 Jun 2020 13:03:56 -0500, Jim Joyce <no...@none.invalid>
wrote:
>On Sun, 21 Jun 2020 10:35:59 -0700 (PDT), johnst...@gmail.com wrote:
>
>>On Wednesday, March 18, 2020 at 8:44:07 AM UTC-4, Cgray1521 wrote:
>>> replying to Jon, Cgray1521 wrote:
>>> I’m trying to get my grandparents yard boss running but having the same
>>> issue. Hard to pull at first, feels like because of compression, then releases
>>> and spins over. I’ve torn everything down twice. This last time I noticed
>>> the gap on the spark plug was closed. So I looked at the piston and it has a
>>> slight surface rust mark that matches the shape of the bottom of the side
>>> electrode on the spark plug.
>>> So I feel the piston is just slightly hitting the spark plug. Thought maybe
>>> someone over tighten the spark plugs so I bought a new one. But the new does
>>> the same thing. If I install the spark plug by hand as thought as I can it
>>> will run fine. But if I put a wrench on it and tighten it literally a hair
>>> more it locks up. DONT GET IT!
>
>If the spark plug is hitting the top of the piston, the most likely culprit
>is the wrong spark plug is installed. A "hot" plug will usually have a
>longer nose, which could then make contact with the top of the piston if
>the engine isn't designed for it. The solution then is simple: swap the hot
>plug for a colder plug. Every spark plug carries a heat range, so look for
>a plug that's colder than what you have. Preferably, look for the actual
>plug recommended for that engine.
>
Actually, a hotter plug virtually NEVER has a longer "nose". The
insulator is just longer and slimmer back into the body. Extended tip
plugs are designed to run COLDER under higher speeds and hotter at
low speeds and loads by virtue of getting the tip "out there" into the
active flow.They are not only "extended tip" but "extended range"
plugs. (I've been a mechanic since 1969 and taught the trade as well)
wrote:
>On Sun, 21 Jun 2020 10:35:59 -0700 (PDT), johnst...@gmail.com wrote:
>
>>On Wednesday, March 18, 2020 at 8:44:07 AM UTC-4, Cgray1521 wrote:
>>> replying to Jon, Cgray1521 wrote:
>>> I’m trying to get my grandparents yard boss running but having the same
>>> issue. Hard to pull at first, feels like because of compression, then releases
>>> and spins over. I’ve torn everything down twice. This last time I noticed
>>> the gap on the spark plug was closed. So I looked at the piston and it has a
>>> slight surface rust mark that matches the shape of the bottom of the side
>>> electrode on the spark plug.
>>> So I feel the piston is just slightly hitting the spark plug. Thought maybe
>>> someone over tighten the spark plugs so I bought a new one. But the new does
>>> the same thing. If I install the spark plug by hand as thought as I can it
>>> will run fine. But if I put a wrench on it and tighten it literally a hair
>>> more it locks up. DONT GET IT!
>
>If the spark plug is hitting the top of the piston, the most likely culprit
>is the wrong spark plug is installed. A "hot" plug will usually have a
>longer nose, which could then make contact with the top of the piston if
>the engine isn't designed for it. The solution then is simple: swap the hot
>plug for a colder plug. Every spark plug carries a heat range, so look for
>a plug that's colder than what you have. Preferably, look for the actual
>plug recommended for that engine.
>
insulator is just longer and slimmer back into the body. Extended tip
plugs are designed to run COLDER under higher speeds and hotter at
low speeds and loads by virtue of getting the tip "out there" into the
active flow.They are not only "extended tip" but "extended range"
plugs. (I've been a mechanic since 1969 and taught the trade as well)
Clare Snyder
Jun 21, 2020, 3:50:13 PM6/21/20
to
On Sun, 21 Jun 2020 11:17:26 -0700 (PDT), johnst...@gmail.com
wrote:
Maybe you are just getting old and feeble??
I have a little remington that is that way - as I've stated here
before. Will almost tear your arm off if your hand is strong enough to
not let go of the rope but once it starts it is a little BEAST!!!
Compared to it the larger Partner saw is a breeze to start but the
little fellow will give the big one a REAL run for the money - -
wrote:
I have a little remington that is that way - as I've stated here
before. Will almost tear your arm off if your hand is strong enough to
not let go of the rope but once it starts it is a little BEAST!!!
Compared to it the larger Partner saw is a breeze to start but the
little fellow will give the big one a REAL run for the money - -
Clare Snyder
Jun 21, 2020, 3:56:35 PM6/21/20
to
On Sun, 21 Jun 2020 15:06:44 -0400, Ralph Mowery
<rmower...@earthlink.net> wrote:
>In article <1c2f69be-a5a4-49b7...@googlegroups.com>,
>johnst...@gmail.com says...
>>
>> Understood about using Sta-bil, etc.
>> In my case, I can go years between uses. I'm not sure Sta-bil ideal for that long a period of inactivity.
>> That would not explain why I can easily pull cord, with plug removed.
>> It worked fine when I last used it, couple yrs ago.
>>
>>
>
>I have not looked into the insides of the small engines. Does that one
>have any valves that open and close ? Maybe even some reed types ?
>They may be stuck or broken.
>
>I doubt the Sta-bil would be good for years. In that case it probably
>is ok to let the engine run dry and just take the hit on no lubercation.
Since the saw has a SEALED tank the fuel in the tank won't oxidize or
<rmower...@earthlink.net> wrote:
>In article <1c2f69be-a5a4-49b7...@googlegroups.com>,
>johnst...@gmail.com says...
>>
>> Understood about using Sta-bil, etc.
>> In my case, I can go years between uses. I'm not sure Sta-bil ideal for that long a period of inactivity.
>> That would not explain why I can easily pull cord, with plug removed.
>> It worked fine when I last used it, couple yrs ago.
>>
>>
>
>I have not looked into the insides of the small engines. Does that one
>have any valves that open and close ? Maybe even some reed types ?
>They may be stuck or broken.
>
>I doubt the Sta-bil would be good for years. In that case it probably
>is ok to let the engine run dry and just take the hit on no lubercation.
go rancid like it will in a lawnmower. I use SeaFoam in my saw gas and
the last time I used the Remington it had sat for over 2 years with a
FULL tank of Shell premium with 40:1 "smokeless" (yeah, right!!) semi
synthetic two stroke oil and it started on about the 5th pull. Just
remember to shake the saw a few times to make sure the oil has not
stratified in the fuel. The Partner took a whiff of starting fluid to
get it to kick, but then it ran fine. Haven't used either one for
about 5 years - maybe I should crank them up and see if they still run
in case a windstorm takes down more branches -- - - -
Jim Joyce
Jun 21, 2020, 3:58:07 PM6/21/20
to
On Sun, 21 Jun 2020 15:46:01 -0400, Clare Snyder <cl...@snyder.on.ca>
Yeah, I could have it wrong. I thought I knew about it from some limited
experience back in the 80's but it probably faded since then. I was also
relying a bit on this little table from the link I included.
Difference between Hot Plugs and Cold Plugs
Hot Plugs
Have a long Insulator nose.
A great surface area exposed to the hot combustion gases.
Heat transfer to the engine head is slower.
Its firing end heats up quickly.
Cold plugs
Have a short Insulator nose.
A less surface area exposed to the hot combustion gases.
Heat transfer to the engine head is quicker.
Its firing end does not heat up quickly.
experience back in the 80's but it probably faded since then. I was also
relying a bit on this little table from the link I included.
Difference between Hot Plugs and Cold Plugs
Hot Plugs
Have a long Insulator nose.
A great surface area exposed to the hot combustion gases.
Heat transfer to the engine head is slower.
Its firing end heats up quickly.
Cold plugs
Have a short Insulator nose.
A less surface area exposed to the hot combustion gases.
Heat transfer to the engine head is quicker.
Its firing end does not heat up quickly.
Clare Snyder
Jun 21, 2020, 9:28:22 PM6/21/20
to
On Sun, 21 Jun 2020 14:58:05 -0500, Jim Joyce <no...@none.invalid>
I missed the bit about locking with the last 1/2 turn.
He has the wrong thread reach plug. I am betting he has a 1/2" reach
plug and it requies a 3/8" reach. In Champion that would be an L seies
where he needs a J - in NGK it would be an H uffix instead of an N
that it should have.
He has the wrong thread reach plug. I am betting he has a 1/2" reach
plug and it requies a 3/8" reach. In Champion that would be an L seies
where he needs a J - in NGK it would be an H uffix instead of an N
that it should have.
Jim Joyce
Jun 21, 2020, 9:58:54 PM6/21/20
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On Sun, 21 Jun 2020 21:28:19 -0400, Clare Snyder <cl...@snyder.on.ca>
That 1/8" difference should be all it takes to keep the plug from hitting
the piston.
the piston.
johnst...@gmail.com
Jun 21, 2020, 10:13:58 PM6/21/20
to
I'm definitely older, but hopefully not that feeble :)
I forgot to mention, I'm the original owner, and the spark plug is original.
Original spark plug could be factor in running the engine, but I'm not getting that far.
Bob F
Jun 22, 2020, 12:27:55 AM6/22/20
to
byr2...@gmail.com
Jul 16, 2020, 7:19:56 PM7/16/20
to
I have a 25 year old Husqvarna that I have used heavily over those years. Last year it got extremely hard to pull. So I put it aside until June of this year.
I decided that on top of everything else I probably had a galled cylinder/piston situation. It turned out that piston and cylinder looked great.
BUT . . . what I did discover is that from where the carb attaches to the cylinder there is a port that runs inside the wall of the cylinder to its base, apparently to bring lubrication to the crankcase and ventilate the crankcase on the down stroke. I could see that lack of ventilation would make the saw extremely hard to pull.
SO . . . I first blew air through the port. No problem. No blockage. Then I examined the gasket and mating surface on the crankcase fully expecting to find a passage through the gasket and mating surface into the base. THERE WASN’T ANY!
WHAT I DISCOVERED is that all venting of that port through the cylinder relies on an extremely thin gap/channel between the gasket and cylinder base. It looked to me like that gap is no more than .020” wide.
NO MATTER. It was absolutely packed tight with carbon. So, I picked it clean with a dental pick. AND GUESS WHAT?
THE REASSEMBLED MOTOR PULLS EASY AND RUNS LIKE THE DAY I BOUGHT IT.
Now I am having the same issue with a month old Stihl MS171. Have loved that saw up to this point. Took off the carb earlier this week and you guessed it there is a similar port going from where the carb mounts down into the cylinder wall. I am guessing its for crankcase ventilation again. I haven’t had time to complete the investigation but obviously suspect it is the cause of the near identical symptoms.
I decided that on top of everything else I probably had a galled cylinder/piston situation. It turned out that piston and cylinder looked great.
BUT . . . what I did discover is that from where the carb attaches to the cylinder there is a port that runs inside the wall of the cylinder to its base, apparently to bring lubrication to the crankcase and ventilate the crankcase on the down stroke. I could see that lack of ventilation would make the saw extremely hard to pull.
SO . . . I first blew air through the port. No problem. No blockage. Then I examined the gasket and mating surface on the crankcase fully expecting to find a passage through the gasket and mating surface into the base. THERE WASN’T ANY!
WHAT I DISCOVERED is that all venting of that port through the cylinder relies on an extremely thin gap/channel between the gasket and cylinder base. It looked to me like that gap is no more than .020” wide.
NO MATTER. It was absolutely packed tight with carbon. So, I picked it clean with a dental pick. AND GUESS WHAT?
THE REASSEMBLED MOTOR PULLS EASY AND RUNS LIKE THE DAY I BOUGHT IT.
Now I am having the same issue with a month old Stihl MS171. Have loved that saw up to this point. Took off the carb earlier this week and you guessed it there is a similar port going from where the carb mounts down into the cylinder wall. I am guessing its for crankcase ventilation again. I haven’t had time to complete the investigation but obviously suspect it is the cause of the near identical symptoms.
Buddy
Apr 8, 2021, 3:01:05 PM4/8/21
to
I’ve had my ms290 for 14 years no problem and this just started. Pulls easy with plug out but you have to fight to pull it. with plug in. Was able to start it then could not restart.
Now it won’t start at all but still pulled and jerks very hard.
Pulled muffler off..ok..pulled flywheel off..ok..and by the way it does not have a compression release.
I realize you have to tug on these saws but this is something that still has me scratching my head? Any ideas would be great. I want to save this saw.
--
For full context, visit https://www.homeownershub.com/maintenance/chainsaw-rope-very-hard-to-pull-824350-.htm
Now it won’t start at all but still pulled and jerks very hard.
Pulled muffler off..ok..pulled flywheel off..ok..and by the way it does not have a compression release.
I realize you have to tug on these saws but this is something that still has me scratching my head? Any ideas would be great. I want to save this saw.
--
For full context, visit https://www.homeownershub.com/maintenance/chainsaw-rope-very-hard-to-pull-824350-.htm
Clare Snyder
Apr 8, 2021, 9:34:14 PM4/8/21
to
On Thu, 8 Apr 2021 19:01:00 +0000, Buddy
<8eee82466b3285f5...@example.com> wrote:
>I’ve had my ms290 for 14 years no problem and this just started. Pulls easy with plug out but you have to fight to pull it. with plug in. Was able to start it then could not restart.
>Now it won’t start at all but still pulled and jerks very hard.
>Pulled muffler off..ok..pulled flywheel off..ok..and by the way it does not have a compression release.
>I realize you have to tug on these saws but this is something that still has me scratching my head? Any ideas would be great. I want to save this saw.
Carbon build-up?
<8eee82466b3285f5...@example.com> wrote:
>I’ve had my ms290 for 14 years no problem and this just started. Pulls easy with plug out but you have to fight to pull it. with plug in. Was able to start it then could not restart.
>Now it won’t start at all but still pulled and jerks very hard.
>Pulled muffler off..ok..pulled flywheel off..ok..and by the way it does not have a compression release.
>I realize you have to tug on these saws but this is something that still has me scratching my head? Any ideas would be great. I want to save this saw.
Snag
Apr 8, 2021, 9:58:20 PM4/8/21
to
the saw to trim a couple of branches a couple of times a year . And it's
never been run wide open since the day it was new , and "if one ounce of
oil is good 2 must be better" . I'd bet that piston has enough carbon
buildup to jack the compression ratio pretty high .
--
Snag
In 1775, the British demanded we give them our guns.
We shot them.
Bob F
Apr 9, 2021, 11:44:07 PM4/9/21
to
On 4/8/2021 12:01 PM, Buddy wrote:
> I’ve had my ms290 for 14 years no problem and this just started. Pulls
> easy with plug out but you have to fight to pull it. with plug in. Was
> able to start it then could not restart.
> Now it won’t start at all but still pulled and jerks very hard.
> Pulled muffler off..ok..pulled flywheel off..ok..and by the way it does
> not have a compression release.
> I realize you have to tug on these saws but this is something that still
> has me scratching my head? Any ideas would be great. I want to save this
> saw.
>
Very likely the flywheel key. Timing is off and it fires at the wrong time.
> I’ve had my ms290 for 14 years no problem and this just started. Pulls
> easy with plug out but you have to fight to pull it. with plug in. Was
> able to start it then could not restart.
> Now it won’t start at all but still pulled and jerks very hard.
> Pulled muffler off..ok..pulled flywheel off..ok..and by the way it does
> not have a compression release.
> I realize you have to tug on these saws but this is something that still
> has me scratching my head? Any ideas would be great. I want to save this
> saw.
>
TerryH
Apr 24, 2021, 12:31:37 PM4/24/21
to
> If I install the spark plug by hand as thought as I can it will run fine. But if I put a wrench on it and tighten it literally a hair more it locks up. DONT GET IT!
Of all I have read here and on many other websites, the closest I have to an answer is "If I install the spark plug by hand as thought as I can it will run fine. But if I put a wrench on it and tighten it literally a hair more it locks up. ..." I am going to try to loosen my spark plug, LOL May let you know (If I can find this webpage again?) :-) I cud understand if wrong 1/2" reach plug that should be 3/8 reach and "barely" touching piston top w/ carbon? Or if "plug thread leakage designed as compression release port" LOL
TerryH
Apr 24, 2021, 12:31:38 PM4/24/21
to
Or suck paper ball into cylinder if reed valve stuck shut?
rdw8932
Apr 24, 2021, 3:31:06 PM4/24/21
to
026 update: on a tip from my local Stihl dealer I let the saw sit upside down overnight and the saw pulled slightly easier and started! Much smoke at first but running and starting fine ever since. Hope this helps.
wild bill
Sep 16, 2021, 11:01:27 PM9/16/21
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YOU ARE MISSING ONE OF THE PAWS THAT ENGAGES WHEN YOU PULL THE ROPE. I HAVE ONE WITH THE SAME PROBLEM. TAKE OFF THE GAS TANK & YOU WILL SEE YOU ARE MISSING ONE
rdw8932
Sep 16, 2021, 11:45:07 PM9/16/21
to
It is not a good idea to turn the motor over without gas/oil mix in the tank. The gas/oil lubricates the crank bearings. 10 years old without running? Those bearings are going to be bone dry! Suggestion: put oil/gas mix into tank. Let the saw sit upside down overnight and then try again (of course new spark plug!). Worked for me. Other possibilities: plugged muffler screen, varnished fuel pickup filter in gas tank, and/or varnish in carburetor lines.
TerryH
Sep 17, 2021, 12:01:16 AM9/17/21
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I fought a little 14" Craftsman/ on high compression issues w/ Plug in, and after much disbelief and distraction, (wasted time searching other potential issues) finally pulled flywheel to find KEY was NOT in the key slot ....was NOT ... was not.. was not, despite testing w/ kill switch off, etc. Carefully reassembly, and it started right up..
Thomas Gronek
Oct 15, 2021, 7:40:49 AM10/15/21
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TerryH
Oct 15, 2021, 1:01:19 PM10/15/21
to
Many/most (but not all) CS over 45cc have a COMPRESSION RELEASE BUTTON you push for easier cranking/ starting? Did you look for one? Also possible flywheel out of time from sheared key, but (more likely) someone removed and improperly assembled with key not properly matched. Flywheel often needs to be removed to access/ service the (oil pump/ oil pump drive gear). I just dealt w/ a vintage red Craftsman top handle w/ same issue, and despite feeling otherwise for too long, it was the flywheel key improper assembly
Kc409
Jan 3, 2022, 9:15:07 PM1/3/22
to
I believe he removed the carb and muffler and determined there was no clogging nor any carbon build up. With the plug removed, it was easy to crank and with the plug installed, it was difficult or almost impossible to spin. A stuck reed valve may be the culprit as it could be sealed, not allowing any fuel/air mixture to be drawn into the combustion chamber.
TerryH
Jan 4, 2022, 12:45:07 AM1/4/22
to
Had similar LONG story to this and many others here, on a small top handle vintage craftsman, finally pulled flywheel and found shaft/key installed with key 1/4" away from keyway in fly wheel; after reinstalling correctly, it fired/ ran first pull.... amazed, I was
BobG
Jan 17, 2022, 12:31:36 PM1/17/22
to
I had a similar problem on a lawn mower engine and my Stihl chainsaw. They were both very hard to crank with the pull rope. For me the issue in both cases was the timing. If it's off it can make it very hard to pull. I went through much of the same steps as you did trying to figure this out. On the Stihl in order to set the timing you have to set the gap on the ignition coil. Once I set the gap correctly it became much easier to pull and start. I can't believe that Stihl or others aren't telling people this is a possible cause for the hard pull. It's one of the first things I would check once it's determined that it's easy to pull with the spark plug removed.
0586f89b053462be...@example.com
Dec 22, 2022, 9:45:10 PM12/22/22
to
Wild Bill has a good point. I have a Stihl 193T and was difficult to pull. The starter assembly was missing one of the paws. i replaced the entire pull starter assembly with a new assembly, I was surprised the the pull took half the effort, .Problem solved!
TerryH
Dec 23, 2022, 12:15:09 AM12/23/22
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Guessing 50cc+, which is where MFR starts adding COMPRESSION RELEASE button to saws....but if you do not have that button, pull muffler, inspect piston/ cylinder and spark screen. LOO for CR Button and push it. Good saw= choke ON, pull x2, choke OFF= Pull x1 to start.
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