OT? Humongous traverse drapery rod won't close
tiog...@yahoo.com
Mom's problems) 125" traverse drape rod will not close without pulling
so hard, I actually pulled the d&*m thing out of the wall this spring.
What happens is that once the drawcord, with the little plastic hooks
holding the drape pins/drapes, reaches one of the rod supports, it
"clogs up."
I levelled everything when I hung this rod--and levelled again,
horizontally and vertically. What else could be the problem? If this
isn't a place to get this information, could you guys suggest where I
could find out?
Noozer
silicone spray to help lube it up.
<tiog...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1104058934.2...@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
Colbyt
I install these things for a living. What brand do you have? How many
supports on the 125"? What type of drapery pins did you use? Does it
traverse smoothly with no draperies on the rod? And did you install the
pulley that came with the rod?
Colbyt
tiog...@yahoo.com
>
> I install these things for a living. What brand do you have? How
many
> supports on the 125"? What type of drapery pins did you use? Does it
> traverse smoothly with no draperies on the rod? And did you install
the
> pulley that came with the rod?
Wow, I struck gold! Mom's ranting about "Finding someone who knows
what they're doing." You don't live in North/Central/Eastern PA, huh?
I used the entire package of materials that came in the Kirsch box.
Traverse rods' supports *used to be* angular in shape, sort of like the
letter "L." (No, *exactly* like the letter "L.") Now they're like the
letter "J."
Although I'm not certain of it, I feel the change of shape has some
affect on this problem I described, or at least the width of opening of
the rod seems to have an affect. The width on the old-style "L" shaped
rod was narrower. Not a great deal, but still narrower. It seemed to
hold up the weight of the plastic pin-holders with the attached drapes.
Seems the pin-holders "pull" to an angle within the rod--maybe, like,
a 80-degree angle--and that that's responsible for the sticking at the
right-hand drape support.
I use small (2") pins. I have to use these sharp kind rather than the
type that join two pleats together, because these are fabric lined
formal drapes. I don't think the pin size or style is involved in the
issue because the left 75" drape closes with no problem. It's the
right that gets clogged up at the support (which is placed at, I
suppose, 42-42", or whatever a third of 125" is. There are only two
supports, one right, one left.
No, I didn't install the pulley that came with the rod. The rod *does*
open and close smoothly with no drapes on the rod.
Man, I would be Ex-TREME-ly grateful to get more feedback from you.
Colbyt
<tiog...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1104103719....@c13g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
No KY and the trip charge would break you. :)
As long as you did not buy a 66-120" rod and try to stretch it for 5" your
problem can be solved. A note to you and all who follow this thread the more
"wasted capacity" you have on a rod the smaller your potential problems.
For a 125" window a rod for 86-150" should have been used.
Okay. You bought a good rod. You may have a couple of installation issues
and a few basic things you need to be aware of. I will ramble these off in
no particular order but all are important.
The pulley must be installed on modern rods because it prevents kinking of
the cord which can cause jambs and it maintains the lock on the underlap
master carrier (MC). You install the pulley and take the slack out of the
cord by pulling on the knotted string at the back of the Overlap MC on the
same side as the pulley is installed (usually right).
Did you lock the sting on the underlap carrier (the one on the left)? After
centering the overlap and underlap master carriers in the center of the rod
using only the string (meaning you fully open and close it twice by pulling
the string) you lock the center position on the underlap master carrier ( I
can post a pic if you have lost the directions). If you have hand forced it
to the center position by moving the MC's you may have kinked the cord.
Your regular traverse rod (decorative rods are different) should have been
installed so that the top of the drapery is 1/2" above or even with the top
of the rod (1/2" +- on this is acceptable).
You have used the right pins. Your drapes should be hung on the rod
starting from the center of the rod. Two pins go in each MC and then one
pin per plastic carrier. DO NOT skip any carriers. The extras except for
one should be removed to allow maximum opening (there is a little gate on
the back to allow removal). Leaving extras in the middle of the drapes is a
very common cause of jams.
The fabric should be folded forward and finger pressed half way between each
pleat to train it as to the way it should fold. (not your problem but an
important step).
The other poster that suggested silicone spray was also giving good advice.
If all the above are in order sometimes just a little lubrication is all
that is needed.
All brackets and center supports must be set to maintain the same
measurement from the front of the rod to the wall. A bow or bend will cause
jams.
I think that is all the basics. Try all of those before you consider the
following.
In a very small % of cases the cord may have been twisted by the factory and
require a rework before it moves smoothly (not your issue if it is real
smooth with no load).
In a small % of cases the inner rod has a damaged end that catches the
carriers when they encounter it. A visual inspection will reveal that the
inner rod is not tightly seated to the outer rod where it ends. This creates
a rough edge that catches the carriers. Sometimes this can be repaired and
sometimes a new rod is required. I'll post more if this is your problem.
My email works with the obvious removed but for now let's keep this in the
group for the benefit of others.
Colbyt
tiog...@yahoo.com
> As long as you did not buy a 66-120" rod and try to stretch it for 5"
your
> problem can be solved. A note to you and all who follow this thread
the more
> "wasted capacity" you have on a rod the smaller your potential
problems.
> For a 125" window a rod for 86-150" should have been used.
Bought the only 125" rod left in town, it seems. Thanks for the
heads-up on "wasted capacity." I'm going to pass this info on to
others, even if their drapes aren't jamming.
> The pulley must be installed on modern rods because it prevents
kinking of
> the cord which can cause jambs and it maintains the lock on the
underlap
> master carrier (MC). You install the pulley and take the slack out
of the
> cord by pulling on the knotted string at the back of the Overlap MC
on the
> same side as the pulley is installed (usually right).
I *think* I know what you mean by this. I install the pulley, then tug
on the knotted string...at the pulley end? I am a bit confused by the
phrase "at the back of" the Overlap MC.
> Did you lock the sting on the underlap carrier (the one on the left)?
After
> centering the overlap and underlap master carriers in the center of
the rod
> using only the string (meaning you fully open and close it twice by
pulling
> the string) you lock the center position on the underlap master
carrier ( I
> can post a pic if you have lost the directions). If you have hand
forced it
> to the center position by moving the MC's you may have kinked the
cord.
No, I haven't forced it to the center position by hand, but if it's
possible to post binaries here, or even a cave-dweller (!)
black-and-white diagram using the keyboard, I'd appreciate it. For
some reason, the mechanics of drapes are more complicated than I ever
thought.
> Your regular traverse rod (decorative rods are different) should
have been
> installed so that the top of the drapery is 1/2" above or even with
the top
> of the rod (1/2" +- on this is acceptable).
Is that all? I'm not sure if it was from Kirsch, but some instruction
I got, somewhere, said a full 4" of the drape should go above the pins.
Maybe THIS is the problem.
> You have used the right pins. Your drapes should be hung on the rod
> starting from the center of the rod. Two pins go in each MC and then
one
> pin per plastic carrier. DO NOT skip any carriers. The extras except
for
> one should be removed to allow maximum opening (there is a little
gate on
> the back to allow removal). Leaving extras in the middle of the
drapes is a
> very common cause of jams.
Ah, Mom will love you for this. She's all bent out of shape--like her
rod!--because the drapes droop at the MC overlap and underlap. 2
PINS!!
> The fabric should be folded forward and finger pressed half way
between each
> pleat to train it as to the way it should fold. (not your problem but
an
> important step).
>
[SNIP]
> In a small % of cases the inner rod has a damaged end that catches
the
> carriers when they encounter it. A visual inspection will reveal that
the
> inner rod is not tightly seated to the outer rod where it ends. This
creates
> a rough edge that catches the carriers. Sometimes this can be
repaired and
> sometimes a new rod is required. I'll post more if this is your
problem.
This is what I meant when I said I noticed a difference between the old
"L" rods and the new "J" rods. The "L" rods seemed to provide for a
tighter and smoother transition from outer to inner. I'll check this
out.
> My email works with the obvious removed but for now let's keep this
in the
> group for the benefit of others.
You bet! I can't thank you enough, ColbyT. I mean this kind of
professional information is what makes the Internet worth putting up
with all the crap. (Hey, if you're in Northern KY, maybe I'll get you
to give a paid lecture to Mom, who'll be in the Dayton area in a week!
I think she'd prefer this to a trip to Las Vegas, seriously.)
Colbyt
<tiog...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1104146129.3...@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
<edited for clarity>
> I *think* I know what you mean by this. I install the pulley, then tug
> on the knotted string...at the pulley end? I am a bit confused by the
> phrase "at the back of" the Overlap MC.
>
We can't post pics in this group. But you have motivated me to go ahead and
resurrect some content that I previously published on the web. Browse to
this page and you should find one picture worth 10K words. I am planning to
rewrite the content before I post it but I went ahead and uploaded some of
the pics and an index page.
http://www.lexkyweb.com/windows/
>
> > Your regular traverse rod (decorative rods are different) should
> have been
> > installed so that the top of the drapery is 1/2" above or even with
> the top
> > of the rod (1/2" +- on this is acceptable).
>
> Is that all? I'm not sure if it was from Kirsch, but some instruction
> I got, somewhere, said a full 4" of the drape should go above the pins.
> Maybe THIS is the problem.
I can assure you that if you have 2" or more of drape over the top of the
rod that IS your problem. When you do that it tends to pull the carriers
out of vertical alignment and they always snag where the rods overlap. Since
you have to hang the darn thing again take the time to do it right. Use
toggles, center the draw, use the pully and remove all the extras except the
last one.
If you know the exact finished length of the draperies the rod should be set
that distance from the floor, the top of the pin should be 2" from the top
of the drape and this will yield 1/2" off the floor and 1/2" over the top of
the rod.
Colbyt
tiog...@yahoo.com
> We can't post pics in this group. But you have motivated me to go
ahead and
> resurrect some content that I previously published on the web.
Browse to
> this page and you should find one picture worth 10K words. I am
planning to
> rewrite the content before I post it but I went ahead and uploaded
some of
> the pics and an index page.
>
> http://www.lexkyweb.com/windows/
Excellent site. I'm surprised, since this post has been crossposted to
alt.home.interior.decorating, there haven't been more responses. I
think your site is the only one on the World Wide Web addressing this
subject.
> I can assure you that if you have 2" or more of drape over the top of
the
> rod that IS your problem. When you do that it tends to pull the
carriers
> out of vertical alignment and they always snag where the rods
overlap. Since
> you have to hang the darn thing again take the time to do it right.
Use
> toggles, center the draw, use the pully and remove all the extras
except the
> last one.
Okay, ColbyT, don't get angry. I have every intention of doing it
right or else I wouldn't have posted! Your explanation here is the one
that makes the most sense, since I've observed--'cause I've studied the
problem so often--this is EXACTLY what happens.
When I encountered this problem back in the spring, I posted to
alt.home.repair and elsewhere, and I got emailed a .pdf file that said
the reason the clearance above the rod should be at least 4" is so that
people standing outside the window don't see the colored gathered upper
hem of the drape and just see the white lining. Not only that, but the
stiff drapery "tape" lining the gathers is 4" wide. I just assumed
you'd insert the pins at the bottom of the gathers.
But when I rehang the rod and drapes, I'm going to follow your
directions.
> If you know the exact finished length of the draperies the rod should
be set
> that distance from the floor, the top of the pin should be 2" from
the top
> of the drape and this will yield 1/2" off the floor and 1/2" over the
top of
> the rod.
One final question. This particular window is 1) a bay window, with 2)
a baseboard heater running the length of the window directly underneath
it. (The window is approximately 2 1/2" from the floor.) Would you
use the baseboard heater as the "distance from the floor" variable
here? Might sound like a stupid question, but I want to have all bases
covered this time (it's the third time I'll be doing the job).
Thanks again for EXCELLENT, professional help!
Colbyt
<tiog...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1104232211.3...@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
> Okay, ColbyT, don't get angry.
That wasn't an anger tone. It was an empathy tone.
> When I encountered this problem back in the spring, I posted to
> alt.home.repair and elsewhere, and I got emailed a .pdf file that said
> the reason the clearance above the rod should be at least 4" is so that
> people standing outside the window don't see the colored gathered upper
> hem of the drape and just see the white lining. Not only that, but the
> stiff drapery "tape" lining the gathers is 4" wide. I just assumed
> you'd insert the pins at the bottom of the gathers.
I'm not sure what you received. Maybe you mis-read it or just made the wrong
assumption abou the pin placement In a perfect install the rod is mounted
high enough on the wall that the back side of the pleats and the pins do not
show from the outside (this is about 4"). You are at the mercy of whomever
measured the draperies. If using ready mades you have no choice as 84" is
the industry standard though some 90" one were sold in the past.You still
hook your 2" pins so that the top of them is 2" from the top of the drapery.
>
> One final question. This particular window is 1) a bay window, with 2)
> a baseboard heater running the length of the window directly underneath
> it. (The window is approximately 2 1/2" from the floor.) Would you
> use the baseboard heater as the "distance from the floor" variable
> here? Might sound like a stupid question, but I want to have all bases
> covered this time (it's the third time I'll be doing the job).
> Thanks again for EXCELLENT, professional help!
>
BB electric heat is a different situation. For safety you have to stay at
least 1" above the top of the heater. I think the actual safety warning on
the heater boxes specs a greater clearance. Based on personal observation I
believe 1" above is a safe distance. I was never able to get a contact
thermometer placed directly on the heater above 120 degrees on a high demand
day. I have never installed one closer than 1". I have been in homes where
it has been done with no consequences but I am not willing to take a chance
with someone's life or home. In your case it sounds like the top of the
heater may be above the bottom of the window. You may have to punt. Any
fabric can be treated to be flameproof. If you do that you will need to
find some stainless steel drapery hooks because the regular ones will
corrode over a short period of time.
Colbyt
tiog...@yahoo.com
> I'm not sure what you received. Maybe you mis-read it or just made
the wrong
> assumption abou the pin placement In a perfect install the rod is
mounted
> high enough on the wall that the back side of the pleats and the pins
do not
> show from the outside (this is about 4"). You are at the mercy of
whomever
> measured the draperies. If using ready mades you have no choice as
84" is
> the industry standard though some 90" one were sold in the past.You
still
> hook your 2" pins so that the top of them is 2" from the top of the
drapery.
The final piece of the puzzle! *Your* description of the 4"
clearance/installation makes sense; the file I got does not. (In
fact--not that this is necessarily bad, for those Chicago Tools folk
out there--which includes me--but the instructions were in pidgeon
English.)
> BB electric heat is a different situation. For safety you have to
stay at
> least 1" above the top of the heater. I think the actual safety
warning on
> the heater boxes specs a greater clearance. Based on personal
observation I
> believe 1" above is a safe distance. I was never able to get a
contact
> thermometer placed directly on the heater above 120 degrees on a high
demand
> day. I have never installed one closer than 1". I have been in homes
where
> it has been done with no consequences but I am not willing to take a
chance
> with someone's life or home. In your case it sounds like the top of
the
> heater may be above the bottom of the window. You may have to punt.
No, the baseboard's at the floor, but once again, you answered another
question. I'm going to have to get toggle bolts, spackle, patch paint,
and redo the entire job the way it should have been done the first
time.
You literally taught me everything I have to know, too bad Smilies
aren't allowed, 'cause I'd toast you a couple dozen cold ones. The
customers in your area are lucky (Mom says she'd call you in a
heartbeat if you were up here.) Happy New Year.
wendy7964
I have 3 sets of draperies using kirsch rods and the inner rod on all 3 sets
of draperies is hanging up when I try to close the drapes. Visual inspection
shows that the inner rod is where the slide carrier is catching. how can I
fix this?
--
for full context, visit https://www.homeownershub.com/maintenance/ot-humongous-traverse-drapery-rod-won-t-close-579047-.htm
Mmpotts
Did you figure a solution? We just bought 2 sets of Kirsch traverse rods and
having the same issue. Thanks!
--
for full context, visit https://www.homeownershub.com/maintenance/re-ot-humongous-traverse-drapery-rod-won-t-close-1190192-.htm