How I spent my New Year's Eve
RichL
http://www.soundclick.com/bands/page_songInfo.cfm?bandID=787260&songID=8550207
One guitar, one voice, very little processing. Just to do something a
little bit different.
The song is Elvis Costello's "Alison". I blended Costello's version
with Linda Ronstadt's and added a couple of quirks of my own. Comments
welcome.
Just for fun: bonus question: guess the guitar and amp.
Guitar choices: Fender Tele, Strat, Gibson SG, Gibson Les Paul Double
Cut, my custom Hamburguitar (Fralin P-92 pups), Gretsch Tennessean (w.
TV Jones Classic pups), Ric 450.
Amp choices: Marshall JCM 800 2204, Fender Twin, Vox AC30, Epi VJ,
Fender Blues Jr.
Arlowe
No offense Rich, but that is not your sort of song.
I have heard you do some great stuff, but this is just wrong for you.
Listen to the original, there's a lot of anger & sadness in that song.
Alison is a great song because of the feeling Costello put into it.
If you try to play it straight like you just did, it doesn't work.
I have heard alot of bands try to cover that song and none of them made
it work...not even Ronstadt.
IMO of course....
:)
Greendistantstar
I disagree; Ronstadt's version worked just fine.
GDS
"Let's roll!"
choowie
"RichL" <rple...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:3bydnf8q2MdzC6DW...@supernews.com...
> ...recording this:
>
> http://www.soundclick.com/bands/page_songInfo.cfm?bandID=787260&songID=8550207
>
> One guitar, one voice, very little processing. Just to do something a
> little bit different.
Tx. Nice.
Question: You record voice & guitar at the same time?
--
Choowie
Arlowe
Your opinion....
Linda is like custard, she covers everything, but all she adds is soft,
vanilla flavour.
For instance....Poor pitiful me.
Warren Zevon's is rough as a Tequila hangover, linda's version wouldn't
melt sugar...
I won't even get into her cover of Willin'...
She did look hot tho...in those shorts & roller skates...
hubba, hubba :)
RichL
Thanks.
No, I didn't. I can't drive and talk on a cell phone at the same time
either ;-)
Squier
Whether Rondstat's cover is good or not is up in the air.
She sang it like a chick song - that's the way chicks love that song.
Zevon sang it from a guy's perspective. Same song - different approaches.
But here's the REAL thing about her cover and Zevon's original -
it's Waddy Watchell (sp?). He played with Zevon and Rondstat's recorded cover.
Waddy Watchel seems to be a little known guitarist but he has a knack
for playing exactly what the song needs and doing an amazing job on everything
he plays. The tones he is getting is to me amazingly good.
Listen to the guitar on both versions and Waddy is getting his Les Paul
to sound like a Les Paul. In fact it was Rondstat's cover of Poor Poor Pitiful Me
that was one of the first (before it became a genre) modern country or
modern country rock - and the reason was Waddy's country grinding Les Paul sound.
It was one of the first times a les paul was used on a country type recording
and was a hit. It was done way before Hank Williams Jr started to deliver
a more rocked out country and pre-dates most any other song which is
now considered modern country rock.
Anyways, take away Waddy Watchel and the song just isn't the same
in either Zevon's or Rondstat's versions.
One of the best CD's or albums's I have ever heard is an album called
"Exictable Boy" by Warren Zevon and yep... Waddy Watchel is doing the guitar
tracks.
Anyways, Waddy is one of my own personal guitar heroes.
I learned about him from my Dad and he made it a point that if
I was ever lost for what good electric tones are - listen to Waddy. (and he had
a few others to mention as well).
If you want to hear some great tones and great playing - have a listen
to any of the songs with him playing on Exitable Boy album or like I said,
really listen to the guitar on Rondstat's Poor Poor Pitiful Me.
Another thing is that a lot of bands cover that song - but there are clips
when Rondstat did the cover live touring with Waddy as the guitar player
and he plays both lead and
rhythm (not the acoustic part/intro) but all electric rhythm/leads.
He grabs those little riffs between chords and most bands need 2 guitarists
to pull that off (you'll hear is you listen to the song).
+1 for Waddy Watchel
RichL
Different strokes, etc. I *like* Ronstadt's version (although given the
lyrics it does sound odd from a female perspective). I actually heard
and learned that version before I had ever heard Costello's -- I'm
thinking that wires your brain to accept it.
Squier
hey - first off - no matter what anyone says - you post up your stuff.
that alone gets my respect. A lot of people that will chime in with
comments never seem to post up anything. So kudos to you for putting it up
for us to listen.
Ok - that being said - your take on the song is more of a mellow
approach to it. And that's fine with me. It's a cover not a fax
copy of the original. I liked it because it has your signature way
of playing and approaching a song. I would have done that song
differently but its cool to hear someone approach it in a different
way than what I would do or what the original attempts to do.
I always like your guitar work (well.. mostly) and
you have a voice that I instantly recognize. I think your
vocals are getting better and better each time I hear them
as you seem less and less hesitant. You just sing now and
let it out. cool.
Here's the thing - I can definitely hear the Fender long scale guitar
and single coils.
It's either a Tele or a Strat. (The Tele would have to be the
in-between position but maybe the neck if it's a chimier type neck).
For the Strat it sounds like an in-between position.
For the amp I'll guess the Twin but it might be the Vox AC30.
Ahh.. I'm probably way off about the amp but it's too chimey clean
The song itself sounds like you. I like your guitar work but to me
the vocals were just a bit too mellow. But like I said, as I have
listened to the tracks you put up - you have your own style and way
to playing. I can listen to a few measures and know it's you.
Not too many people can say that since most are trying to sound
like someone else. You do things your own way and always sound
and play like you. I admire that. I'm still finding my way when
it comes to my own sounds and style. So I'm not quite there yet.
- Thanks for sharing.
(ps.) the recording seems to saturate a lot (like the recording levels
kept going way over the 0 limit on the VU meters).
to be the Marshall cranked up. heh.
dvaoa
> ...recording this:
>
> http://www.soundclick.com/bands/page_songInfo.cfm?bandID=787260&songI...
>
> One guitar, one voice, very little processing. Just to do something a
> little bit different.
>
> The song is Elvis Costello's "Alison". I blended Costello's version
> with Linda Ronstadt's and added a couple of quirks of my own. Comments
> welcome.
>
> Just for fun: bonus question: guess the guitar and amp.
> Guitar choices: Fender Tele, Strat, Gibson SG, Gibson Les Paul Double
> Cut, my custom Hamburguitar (Fralin P-92 pups), Gretsch Tennessean (w.
> TV Jones Classic pups), Ric 450.
> Amp choices: Marshall JCM 800 2204, Fender Twin, Vox AC30, Epi VJ,
> Fender Blues Jr.
Right on...loved it. I've ragged your vocals in the past (even though
I can't sing my way out of a paper bag), but you've got the right
amount of fragility and tenderness working here, in a way that works
for you, not how it should be relative to the other versions. I tried
to not think of the original while listening, and I really liked
yours, Rich. I'd get rid rid of the lip smacking sounds at the end of
your runs, though ;-)
I'm willing to bet that's the VJ, but I'm not sure about the guitar;
not the Ric and not the Tele...I'm gonna say either the Tennessean or
the Hamburgler.
-d
choowie
Ah. You're like me then. :o)
My brain is too limited. Sometime I even forgot to breath when I play the
guitar so I have to stop playing a few seconds :-D
--
Choowie
Claude V. Lucas
RichL
> "RichL" <rple...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:LZKdna-w4vkjiKPW...@supernews.com...
>> choowie <choowie_...@free.fr> wrote:
>>> "RichL" <rple...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>>> news:3bydnf8q2MdzC6DW...@supernews.com...
>>>> ...recording this:
>>>>
>>>>
>>
http://www.soundclick.com/bands/page_songInfo.cfm?bandID=787260&songID=8550207
>>>>
>>>> One guitar, one voice, very little processing. Just to do
>>>> something a little bit different.
>>> <snip>
>>>
>>> Tx. Nice.
>>>
>>> Question: You record voice & guitar at the same time?
>>
>> Thanks.
>> No, I didn't. I can't drive and talk on a cell phone at the same
>> time either ;-)
>>
>
> Ah. You're like me then. :o)
> My brain is too limited. Sometime I even forgot to breath when I play
> the guitar so I have to stop playing a few seconds :-D
I can do it if I'm playing chords...sometimes. I can do it occasionally
if I'm playing arpeggios or something where the timing of the guitar
fits that of the melody. Beyond that, it's really hit-or-miss.
RichL
Thanks! I just keep working at it and hope for the best :-)
> Here's the thing - I can definitely hear the Fender long scale guitar
> and single coils.
> It's either a Tele or a Strat. (The Tele would have to be the
> in-between position but maybe the neck if it's a chimier type neck).
> For the Strat it sounds like an in-between position.
> For the amp I'll guess the Twin but it might be the Vox AC30.
>
> Ahh.. I'm probably way off about the amp but it's too chimey clean
Hmmm.....interesting!
I was hoping I could debunk a couple of preconceptions with this. Looks
like I might be on the right track ;-)
Here's the thing. The guitar is my custom guitar with the P92s. It's a
three-pickup guitar, wired so I can get the pickups in any combination,
and either connected in series or parallel. I can make the sound go
from Fender to Gibson to in-between zones with a flick of a couple of
switches.
In this case, it's neck and middle pickups in parallel -- like a Strat.
But it's also a 24 3/4-inch-scale guitar! So you were on the right
track in a sense, but it's my contention that scale length doesn't have
anyway near as much a role in "defining" a guitar's sound as does
pickups and circuitry. The P92s, played one pickup at a time, are
indeed much more "ballsy" and "growly" than the corresponding Fender
pickups, although they're closer to those than they are to buckers. But
when you put them in combination, the combination seems to take over to
define the sound.
And the amp? It's the Marshall JCM 800 2204!
Here's the thing. I wanted to record it on my Twin, but when I went to
practice the part, I noticed I was getting a rattle somewhere in the
amp, something that came through on the recording microphone. And my
AC30's on the fritz. I suppose I could have come close with the Blues
Jr., but I wound up plugging into the Marshall and dialing, fiddling
with EQ and with gain/master. I hit on the sound and said "that's it!".
Low gain, high master volume, bass up all the way, just a bit of
presence and treble. Gotta remember those settings for future use!
>
> The song itself sounds like you. I like your guitar work but to me
> the vocals were just a bit too mellow. But like I said, as I have
> listened to the tracks you put up - you have your own style and way
> to playing. I can listen to a few measures and know it's you.
> Not too many people can say that since most are trying to sound
> like someone else. You do things your own way and always sound
> and play like you. I admire that. I'm still finding my way when
> it comes to my own sounds and style. So I'm not quite there yet.
Part of it is recognizing my limitations, I think. I tried to come up
with an arrangement that wouldn't sound "forced", like I was trying to
be someone else. That has its down-sides, obviously.
>
> - Thanks for sharing.
> (ps.) the recording seems to saturate a lot (like the recording levels
> kept going way over the 0 limit on the VU meters).
Actually, the meters didn't peg at all. I think in retrospect I put too
much compression on the final result. I'm used to dealing with a mix
where there are lots of spikes from drum hits etc. I think I need to
back it off quite a bit where there's only guitar and vocals. As it
turns out it's much "hotter" than my other recordings when I listen
side-by-side. I'll fix!
RichL
You're right about the guitar--it's the custom guitar, set to mimic
Strat neck + middle pickups.
My version of the VJ distorts way too early with that guitar to be of
any use in getting that sparkling semi-clean sound. It's the Marshall
amp, believe it or not -- see my response to Squier for details.
RichL
Waddy's great, I gotta say he's one of my influences.
FWIW, I'm 99% sure he used a Strat on "Alison" (and on a bunch of the
other "Living In The USA" tracks. Give a listen to the guitar in the
"Alison" ending. To me, it screams "Strat".
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nAHktlvoZEE
Jim
I'm not a fan of Costello really, but that's a very good attempt at a
difficult number I'd say. Well played. I gotta tell you though, I just
listened to your "Behind Blue Eyes" and "You Can Close Your Eyes" and they
are bloody brilliant mate!
J
RichL
Thanks!
Mark Bedingfield
guitar sounded like a Strat running bridge and middle, but it could be a
Tele running neck and bridge too. Depends how bright the guitar is.
Amp was quite bright and not as much warmth as I'd expect from the Twin,
so I'll go Blues Jr as I'm not familiar with the Vox so much.
And.... I'm wrong. But close with the guitar ;-)
Nice tune tho, VERY nice Fendery tones there and I like the tune too.
Some great playing there really well done Rich.
Mark
RichL
Thanks, Mark. Yeah, I surprised myself being able to get that Marshall
amp into Fender territory.
Squier
But to me the upsides outweigh the down when doing your own thing
and not having pressure to sound like anyone else (like doing various
covers sometimes on cover gigs).
> >
> > - Thanks for sharing.
> > (ps.) the recording seems to saturate a lot (like the recording levels
> > kept going way over the 0 limit on the VU meters).
>
> Actually, the meters didn't peg at all. I think in retrospect I put too
> much compression on the final result. I'm used to dealing with a mix
> where there are lots of spikes from drum hits etc. I think I need to
> back it off quite a bit where there's only guitar and vocals. As it
> turns out it's much "hotter" than my other recordings when I listen
> side-by-side. I'll fix!
>
>
thanks for the info Rich - my ears are more tuned for what amps
sound like at full band volume. To me there can be a dichotomy to
amps and other parts of the rig - they can sound very different at
quieter home/studio volumes than cranked up (well ok you can crank
them up at home too) but I mean turned up for full rockin' band volume.
Anyways, I have a feeling that if you were to want to keep those tones
at full band volume then you'd need to use the Twin as the Marshall would
start to do its Marshall thing more and more as you turned it up.
I think at lower volumes with most tube amps you can get away with some sort
of clean (or sorta clean) but as you turn them up and the power tubes
start to do their thing the real character of the amp comes out.
So you did a great job of dialing in the JCM800 (yeah I know a guy
that plays with an older non-master JCM800.. I think it's JCM800 1982)
and there is no way you can get those sounds at cranked up volumes.
So that's why I went for the Twin instead of realizing you are at home
recording at much lower volumes.
Ok here's the thing - those Twins were probably played cranked up
and you know they can get thunder loud - and since it's a combo the
chassis takes a beating with the 2x12 thumping away in the same cab.
Lots of stuff works loose. (it's pretty common in big power combos).
Anyways, just pull the chassis (undo the wire retainer.. unplug
reverb.. etc) and get a screwdriver (phillips/regular)
and stubby needle nose pliers and start tightening down anything on the
chassis including tube socket mounts.. tranny mounts.. whatever else can
be tightened. Most everything usually will take at least a small turn
to re-tighten various items that have worked loose during the many years
it's been used. Anyways, tighten down everything.
Then get yourself a 3/8" or 5/16" (I forget right now) deep dish socket
or box wrench or whatever (I think pliers tend to round off nuts too much)
and tighten down the speakers while the chassis is out. Don't muscle it
but give each speaker bolt/nut a little turn to re-torque it down tight again.
Don't tighten down the reverb tank (it's supposed to float a little)
but make sure those hold down screws aren't
so loose that the tank is flapping away loose in there.
Last thing to do (imho) is to ditch any of those preamp tube metal retainers
around the tubes. leave them off. they can become another source of
rattling as the combo vibrates. Obviously at full band volume you might
not hear any of these rattles but at home they can become audible and
annoying. Anyways the Twin rattles are common if that amp has never had
a re-tightening of screws/bolts etc.. since it's been new.
In some rare cases after pulling the chassis you might also find a loose
piece of plastic in there from someone previous that broke off a 6L6 power tube
plastic center mount and they snap off and then roll around inside the chassis.
Squier
yeah... probably is a Strat there.
you can see some videos from him touring with Ronstadt
and he plays a strat in at least one of the live songs
(I think it's "that'll be the day")
http://waddywachtelinfo.com/LindaRonstadt3.html
but he definitely was playing a LP with Zevon and Ronstadt
for Poor Poor Pitiful Me (which I happen to like both Zevon's and Ronstadt versions
mostly because of Waddy's playing on both)
ok. thanks for that link to refresh my Alison memories of that song
and how it was covered.
I played in a band with chick singer
and we did lots of Ronstadt covers.
I think I have a recording we did with her of PPPMe.. hmmm..
We never did Ronstadt version of Alison though.
I'll post it up if I can find it on one of the cd's in the drawer here.
RichL
Sure, no question, I couldn't get the Marshall up much louder than it
was without that tone moving into real Marshall territory. I was just
surprised that it did the Fender substitute thing in a pinch. Gain was
on 2, master about 7. I could inch the master up probably a little more
if I had to, but if I moved the gain up any higher it'd start to
"crunch".
OK, thanks for the info. I'm not sure how comfortable I am doing all
this stuff myself. FWIW, a good tech went all over this thing before I
bought it, most of the tubes were replaced, etc. He may have missed
some tightening but the rattle is new.
jtees4
wrote:
Gretsch and VJ
Nice playing.
****
http://www.soundclick.com/bands/default.cfm?bandID=789610
http://www.reviewmymusicnow.com
jtees4
OK OK I'm not even close. I read the thread.
RichL
> On Fri, 1 Jan 2010 01:33:30 -0500, "RichL" <rple...@yahoo.com>
> wrote:
>
>> ...recording this:
>>
>>
http://www.soundclick.com/bands/page_songInfo.cfm?bandID=787260&songID=8550207
>>
>> One guitar, one voice, very little processing. Just to do something
>> a little bit different.
>>
>> The song is Elvis Costello's "Alison". I blended Costello's version
>> with Linda Ronstadt's and added a couple of quirks of my own.
>> Comments welcome.
>>
>> Just for fun: bonus question: guess the guitar and amp.
>> Guitar choices: Fender Tele, Strat, Gibson SG, Gibson Les Paul Double
>> Cut, my custom Hamburguitar (Fralin P-92 pups), Gretsch Tennessean
>> (w. TV Jones Classic pups), Ric 450.
>> Amp choices: Marshall JCM 800 2204, Fender Twin, Vox AC30, Epi VJ,
>> Fender Blues Jr.
>>
>
> Gretsch and VJ
> Nice playing.
Nope.
Thanks!