Floyd Rose VS. Trans Trem
lee sangbong
Which is the wider pitch changes?
Which is the more stable tune?
Which is the greater resonance and sustain?
And... I wonder the guitars else Steinberger can got Trans Trem?
Looking the body Steinberger, endline is cutted to expose Trans bridge. Are
there some reason?
from IDn...@hitel.net
TubeStore
Which is the wider pitch changes?
Which is the more stable tune?
Which is the greater resonance and sustain?
Transtrem, the othet can not hold pitch change, transtrem stays in tune, and
has better sustain.
No comparision ! ! !
Chuck Stroud
lee sangbong wrote in message <01bd763f$a71d3b90$3d6f2e93@pc16>...
>Which is the better bridge system?
TransTrem
>
>Which is the wider pitch changes?
TransTrem.....Floyd does not change pitch.
>Which is the more stable tune?
TransTrem
>Which is the greater resonance and sustain?
TransTrem
>
>And... I wonder the guitars else Steinberger can got Trans Trem?
Anybody with a router COULD install a TransTrem in any guitar...of course
you'll have to chop off the headstock. It's easier to just buy a
Steinberger...you'll get a better guitar as well.
>Looking the body Steinberger, endline is cutted to expose Trans bridge. Are
>there some reason?
So you can get to the tuners and the tension adjustment.
mike jones
Floyd's can be raised, lowered and raised a whole fifth and more depending
on the type, and if installed and set up properly, will stay in tune with
even the most punishing whammy work. Alot of people don't like them because
they either don't understand how they work, or think that they are too much
trouble ot fool with. Personally, I think the little extra bit of work
would be worth it for the superior trem, and alot of people agree with me
(the list is too long to name, but for a few: vai, satch, dimebag, hammet,
skolnick, it goes on and on). In fact, the only guitarist I've ever seen
with a steinberger is the guitarist for david bowie (I think), and he does
do some wild whammy work.
The whammy doesn't do a whole lot for sustain, it's really more of a pickup,
wood, string, amp kinda thing, but when doing whammy work, you can do a long
ass harmonic squeel or dive with a floyd and not have it die halfway through
like with a standard fulcrum.
As far as modifiacation goes, it is a real pain to put in a floyd, but
probably less or the same as a trans. Your better off buying a new or used
guitar suited for the particular trem you want either way.
Hope this sways you over to good old floyd's side!
F.J>
lee sangbong <ek...@plaza.snu.ac.kr> wrote in message
news:01bd763f$a71d3b90$3d6f2e93@pc16...
> Which is the better bridge system?
>
>
Are
> there some reason?
>
>
>
>
>
X-Factor
<chuc...@NOSPAMgreenwood.net> ' shared this nugget of wisdom :
>>Which is the wider pitch changes?
>
>TransTrem.....Floyd does not change pitch.
Mayeb it doesn't if you don't move the bar at all, but all
tremolo/vibrato/whammy bars change pitch when used. It's their
function.
Chuck Stroud
mike jones wrote in message <7gktm8$dgd$1...@ash.prod.itd.earthlink.net>...
>sorry to disagree here, but it's the floyd all the way.
>Floyd's can be raised, lowered and raised a whole fifth and more depending
>on the type, and if installed and set up properly, will stay in tune with
>even the most punishing whammy work.
I have to disagree. The Floyd does not transpose, the TransTrem does (hence
the name). Strike a chord with a Floyd then dump the trem...notice what
happens? The chord is out of tune...it's not transposed.
Alot of people don't like them because
>they either don't understand how they work, or think that they are too much
>trouble ot fool with.
Obviously you have never had a TransTrem :)
Set aside a few days to get it right.
Personally, I think the little extra bit of work
>would be worth it for the superior trem,
The TransTrem is light years ahead of a Floyd. Most people just don't
understand it, therefore they avoid it. Plus most people are afraid of
double ball strings. I think if the TransTrem were more readily available,
it would take over. Steinbergers are great guitars, but granted they are not
for everybody. I wish I had a TransTrem on my Jackson, that would rock! It
would work fine with a locking nut.
and alot of people agree with me
>(the list is too long to name, but for a few: vai, satch, dimebag, hammet,
>skolnick, it goes on and on). In fact, the only guitarist I've ever seen
>with a steinberger is the guitarist for david bowie (I think), and he does
>do some wild whammy work.
Short list of Steinberger players:
Eddie Van Halen
Allen Holdsworth
Brad Gillis
Vito Bratta
Reeves Gabrels
Buck Dharma
>The whammy doesn't do a whole lot for sustain, it's really more of a
pickup,
>wood, string, amp kinda thing, but when doing whammy work, you can do a
long
>ass harmonic squeel or dive with a floyd and not have it die halfway
through
>like with a standard fulcrum.
TransTrem is not a fulcrum. It's a monospring with adjustable tension.
Again, superior design.
>As far as modifiacation goes, it is a real pain to put in a floyd, but
>probably less or the same as a trans.
Probaby more so for a Trans. You would have to have it calibrated as
well...it has to be done exactly right to do it's thing.
Your better off buying a new or used
>guitar suited for the particular trem you want either way.
>Hope this sways you over to good old floyd's side!
I don't think it's a matter of either/or, a TransTrem is available only on
Steinbergers (unless you have money falling out of your butt to give to Ed
Roman), Floyds are available on everything I can think of.
One last argument:
Time it takes to change strings and tune up with a Floyd: 15 minutes.
Time it takes to change strings and tune up with a TransTrem: 1 minute.
That's right. I can do it in 1 minute. No wrenches, no locking nuts, no
locking saddles, no string cutting, no string winding, no trem blocking
needed.
>F.J>
>lee sangbong <ek...@plaza.snu.ac.kr> wrote in message
>news:01bd763f$a71d3b90$3d6f2e93@pc16...
>> Which is the better bridge system?
>>
>> Which is the wider pitch changes?
Chuck Stroud
>
>TransTrem
>
>>
>>Which is the wider pitch changes?
>
>TransTrem.....Floyd does not change pitch.
Sorry, my answer was kind of misleading. I was assuming that the poster was
meaning which trem holds pitch when moving the bar. That's what the
TransTrem does that the Floyd does not. Beauty of the TransTrem is that you
can move it down 3 steps (or up)....and hold it there...and the chords will
still be in tune. TAH-DAAH....transposing!
As far as which one actually produces a lower pitch drop, they are about the
same. The only difference is that the TransTrem does not feel like it's
going to break!
Hey, I might sound biased, but my main guitar has a Floyd. I like it for
what it does, it's a great trem. It's just that the TransTrem is simply a
better trem. The PRS trem is also better than a Floyd overall, but it's not
better for dive bombing. It's better in sustain, staying in tune, ease of
setting up, and ease of changing strings, but if you want to dive bomb get a
Floyd.
mike jones
Chuck Stroud <chuckstr@NOSPAM!greenwood.net> wrote in message
news:92577477...@news.remarQ.com...
>
> mike jones wrote in message <7gktm8$dgd$1...@ash.prod.itd.earthlink.net>...
> >sorry to disagree here, but it's the floyd all the way.
> >Floyd's can be raised, lowered and raised a whole fifth and more
depending
> >on the type, and if installed and set up properly, will stay in tune with
> >even the most punishing whammy work.
>
> I have to disagree. The Floyd does not transpose, the TransTrem does
(hence
> the name). Strike a chord with a Floyd then dump the trem...notice what
> happens? The chord is out of tune...it's not transposed.
I was mainly talking about the ability to stay in tune after you return it
to the standard position. I don't know alot of people worried about
transposing a whole chord up anyway (in fact, I don't know someone with teh
ability to hold it in exactly one spot while playing for that matter, but I
guess it would be cool for some slide sounding kinda stuff).
>
> Alot of people don't like them because
> >they either don't understand how they work, or think that they are too
much
> >trouble ot fool with.
>
> Obviously you have never had a TransTrem :)
> Set aside a few days to get it right.
I was talking about the floyd there
> Personally, I think the little extra bit of work
> >would be worth it for the superior trem,
>
> The TransTrem is light years ahead of a Floyd. Most people just don't
> understand it, therefore they avoid it. Plus most people are afraid of
> double ball strings. I think if the TransTrem were more readily available,
> it would take over. Steinbergers are great guitars, but granted they are
not
> for everybody. I wish I had a TransTrem on my Jackson, that would rock! It
> would work fine with a locking nut.
True that. I don't know why, I just wouldn't feel right about having a
guitar without a headstock. It just seems unnatural to me.
> and alot of people agree with me
> >(the list is too long to name, but for a few: vai, satch, dimebag,
hammet,
> >skolnick, it goes on and on). In fact, the only guitarist I've ever seen
> >with a steinberger is the guitarist for david bowie (I think), and he
does
> >do some wild whammy work.
>
> Short list of Steinberger players:
> Eddie Van Halen
> Allen Holdsworth
> Brad Gillis
> Vito Bratta
> Reeves Gabrels
> Buck Dharma
Hey, I've heard of Eddie Van Halen and Allen Holdsworth!
>
>
>
>
> >The whammy doesn't do a whole lot for sustain, it's really more of a
> pickup,
> >wood, string, amp kinda thing, but when doing whammy work, you can do a
> long
> >ass harmonic squeel or dive with a floyd and not have it die halfway
> through
> >like with a standard fulcrum.
>
> TransTrem is not a fulcrum. It's a monospring with adjustable tension.
> Again, superior design.
I didn't say it was a fulcrum. I was just reffering to how fulcrums do
that, but floyd's won't. Floyd's also have adjustable tension (of course
you knew that). Again, it's that extra little bit of work I was talking
about.
> >As far as modifiacation goes, it is a real pain to put in a floyd, but
> >probably less or the same as a trans.
>
> Probaby more so for a Trans. You would have to have it calibrated as
> well...it has to be done exactly right to do it's thing.
Just give me a new ibanez and I'll be happy!
>
> Your better off buying a new or used
> >guitar suited for the particular trem you want either way.
> >Hope this sways you over to good old floyd's side!
>
> I don't think it's a matter of either/or, a TransTrem is available only on
> Steinbergers (unless you have money falling out of your butt to give to Ed
> Roman), Floyds are available on everything I can think of.
YEah, but would you want to put a floyd or a tran on a piece of crap? Hell
no, the trem would cost more than the whole guitar!
> One last argument:
>
> Time it takes to change strings and tune up with a Floyd: 15 minutes.
>
> Time it takes to change strings and tune up with a TransTrem: 1 minute.
> That's right. I can do it in 1 minute. No wrenches, no locking nuts, no
> locking saddles, no string cutting, no string winding, no trem blocking
> needed.
Well, you got me there. You could always put them on one at a time. That
would at least eliminate the trem block.
Here's a comparison. cost of floyd: $200 + $100-$200 for routing and such
depending on the guitar. Trans: whatever the hell a steinberger cost. I'm
not sure of the exact figure, but it's a hell of a lot. Probably enough to
buy 2 high quality ibanez's or jacksons.
I guess in the end it's your choice.
Rock on man
>
> >F.J>
> >lee sangbong <ek...@plaza.snu.ac.kr> wrote in message
> >news:01bd763f$a71d3b90$3d6f2e93@pc16...
> >> Which is the better bridge system?
> >>
> >> Which is the wider pitch changes?
Chuck Stroud
>>
>> I have to disagree. The Floyd does not transpose, the TransTrem does
>(hence
>> the name). Strike a chord with a Floyd then dump the trem...notice what
>> happens? The chord is out of tune...it's not transposed.
>
>I was mainly talking about the ability to stay in tune after you return it
>to the standard position.
I think the Steinberger has the egde there too, mainly because of the double
ball end strings.
I don't know alot of people worried about
>transposing a whole chord up anyway (in fact, I don't know someone with teh
>ability to hold it in exactly one spot while playing for that matter, but I
>guess it would be cool for some slide sounding kinda stuff).
You can actually transpose both up and down 3 steps. You don't have to hold
it, the trem bar has notches in it...you just move it where you want it and
push the bar down on the notch. It becomes a fixed bridge transposed to
whatever key you want. It's actually cool to transpose up because you can
get some really cool high notes that nobody else can get with a standard
tuning or standard trem. It kinda leaves the audience guessing. It also is
fun to when they ask you how you get a 7 string sound out of a 6 string (by
transposing down)!
>
>True that. I don't know why, I just wouldn't feel right about having a
>guitar without a headstock. It just seems unnatural to me.
When you feel how balanced it is and how natural it feels, you'll wonder why
you never tried it before......kinda like...well....I won't go there!
>
>> and alot of people agree with me
>> >(the list is too long to name, but for a few: vai, satch, dimebag,
>hammet,
>> >skolnick, it goes on and on). In fact, the only guitarist I've ever
seen
>> >with a steinberger is the guitarist for david bowie (I think), and he
>does
>> >do some wild whammy work.
>>
>> Short list of Steinberger players:
>> Eddie Van Halen
>> Allen Holdsworth
>> Brad Gillis
>> Vito Bratta
>> Reeves Gabrels
>> Buck Dharma
>
>Hey, I've heard of Eddie Van Halen and Allen Holdsworth!
Reeves Gabrels is with Tin Machine (David Bowie's band), Bratta with White
Lion, Buck Dharma with Blue Oyster Cult. Add Joe Perry, Nuno Bettencourt,
Paul Stanley, and Mike Rutherford to that list. I have also been told by
many sources that Stevie Ray Vaughan played Steinbergers at one point,
although I have never seen a picture of him with one.
>
>YEah, but would you want to put a floyd or a tran on a piece of crap? Hell
>no, the trem would cost more than the whole guitar!
Well....I've seen lots of crappy guitars with Floyds! The BC Rich imports
from the 80's come to mind....Jackson imports from the 80's...Washburn
imports from the 80's....hell any import from the 80's.
>> One last argument:
>>
>> Time it takes to change strings and tune up with a Floyd: 15 minutes.
>>
>> Time it takes to change strings and tune up with a TransTrem: 1 minute.
>> That's right. I can do it in 1 minute. No wrenches, no locking nuts, no
>> locking saddles, no string cutting, no string winding, no trem blocking
>> needed.
>
>Well, you got me there. You could always put them on one at a time. That
>would at least eliminate the trem block.
>Here's a comparison. cost of floyd: $200 + $100-$200 for routing and such
>depending on the guitar. Trans: whatever the hell a steinberger cost. I'm
>not sure of the exact figure, but it's a hell of a lot. Probably enough to
>buy 2 high quality ibanez's or jacksons.
You could ruin a guitar trying to put a TransTrem in it. It really has to be
designed for one.
mike jones
>
>
> >>
> >> I have to disagree. The Floyd does not transpose, the TransTrem does
> >(hence
> >> the name). Strike a chord with a Floyd then dump the trem...notice what
> >> happens? The chord is out of tune...it's not transposed.
> >
> >I was mainly talking about the ability to stay in tune after you return
it
> >to the standard position.
>
double
> ball end strings.
>
> >transposing a whole chord up anyway (in fact, I don't know someone with
teh
> >ability to hold it in exactly one spot while playing for that matter, but
I
> >guess it would be cool for some slide sounding kinda stuff).
>
hold
> it, the trem bar has notches in it...you just move it where you want it
and
> push the bar down on the notch. It becomes a fixed bridge transposed to
> whatever key you want. It's actually cool to transpose up because you can
> get some really cool high notes that nobody else can get with a standard
> tuning or standard trem. It kinda leaves the audience guessing. It also is
> fun to when they ask you how you get a 7 string sound out of a 6 string
(by
> transposing down)!
Well, I can definately see your point there.
>
>
> >
> >True that. I don't know why, I just wouldn't feel right about having a
> >guitar without a headstock. It just seems unnatural to me.
>
> When you feel how balanced it is and how natural it feels, you'll wonder
why
> you never tried it before......kinda like...well....I won't go there!
it would be like riding a bike without handlebars to me!
> >
> >> and alot of people agree with me
> >> >(the list is too long to name, but for a few: vai, satch, dimebag,
> >hammet,
> >> >skolnick, it goes on and on). In fact, the only guitarist I've ever
> seen
> >> >with a steinberger is the guitarist for david bowie (I think), and he
> >does
> >> >do some wild whammy work.
> >>
> >> Short list of Steinberger players:
> >> Eddie Van Halen
> >> Allen Holdsworth
> >> Brad Gillis
> >> Vito Bratta
> >> Reeves Gabrels
> >> Buck Dharma
> >
> >Hey, I've heard of Eddie Van Halen and Allen Holdsworth!
>
> Reeves Gabrels is with Tin Machine (David Bowie's band), Bratta with White
> Lion, Buck Dharma with Blue Oyster Cult. Add Joe Perry, Nuno Bettencourt,
> Paul Stanley, and Mike Rutherford to that list. I have also been told by
> many sources that Stevie Ray Vaughan played Steinbergers at one point,
> although I have never seen a picture of him with one.
SRV? No way man, I've never seen him play anything except a strat, and a
doubleneck (live that is).
>
> >
> >YEah, but would you want to put a floyd or a tran on a piece of crap?
Hell
> >no, the trem would cost more than the whole guitar!
>
> Well....I've seen lots of crappy guitars with Floyds! The BC Rich imports
> from the 80's come to mind....Jackson imports from the 80's...Washburn
> imports from the 80's....hell any import from the 80's.
Yeah, but by today's standards, most guitars with an expensive floyd (not
that lo pro deal) will most likely be a quality instrument. I'm partial to
edge's myself.
>
>
> >> One last argument:
> >>
> >> Time it takes to change strings and tune up with a Floyd: 15 minutes.
> >>
> >> Time it takes to change strings and tune up with a TransTrem: 1 minute.
> >> That's right. I can do it in 1 minute. No wrenches, no locking nuts, no
> >> locking saddles, no string cutting, no string winding, no trem blocking
> >> needed.
> >
> >Well, you got me there. You could always put them on one at a time.
That
> >would at least eliminate the trem block.
> >Here's a comparison. cost of floyd: $200 + $100-$200 for routing and
such
> >depending on the guitar. Trans: whatever the hell a steinberger cost.
I'm
> >not sure of the exact figure, but it's a hell of a lot. Probably enough
to
> >buy 2 high quality ibanez's or jacksons.
>
>
> You could ruin a guitar trying to put a TransTrem in it. It really has to
be
> designed for one.
>
I believe it man. I guess it really just comes down to the funds!
Chuck Stroud
>
>SRV? No way man, I've never seen him play anything except a strat, and a
>doubleneck (live that is).
Like I say, I've never seen it with my own eyes but various sources have
stated that SRV played Steinbergers. I'd love to see it myself! Like you
say, he plays mostly Strats, the only other guitars I have seen him with are
Robin and Hamiltone guitars. His Hamiltone actually had active EMG's in it,
which is kinda odd for Stevie. Maybe that's why he didn't play it much.
TubeStore
Mayeb it doesn't if you don't move the bar at all, but all
tremolo/vibrato/whammy bars change pitch when used. It's their
function
******************
It can not hold a pitch change and all the strings are in different pitch, the
tRanstrem keeps all the strings in tune.
The floyd is junk compared to the transtrem
TubeStore
Floyd's can be raised, lowered and raised a whole fifth and more depending
on the type, and if installed and set up properly, will stay in tune with
they either don't understand how they work
**************************
Wrong !
It will not keep all the strings in tune when changing pitch, try iy, raise the
tremlo and play a chord. I understand the way they work, they dont. A Floyd or
any other tremlo out there will not hold pitch 2 or 3 steps up or down. Does
yours ?
Michael Kornum
floyds(especially ibanez edges) are setup correct, it will keep 100% in
tune.
michael
TubeStore <tube...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:19990504100813...@ng-fx1.aol.com...
Chuck Stroud
Michael Kornum wrote in message <2kEX2.252$443...@news.get2net.dk>...
>how stupid can ya get, a floyd isn't made for transposing chords. When
>floyds(especially ibanez edges) are setup correct, it will keep 100% in
>tune.
>
>michael
Not with chords it won't. Try it, strike a chord, dump your Floyd and hold
it....BAM...it's not in tune.
Mark Zedaker
<chuckstr@NOSPAM!greenwood.net> wrote:
He's not talking about an 'in use Floyd', he's talking about the
tuning stability of the FR bridge. If you leave a Floyd Rose-equipped
guitar sitting around for awhile, the next time you pick it up, it'll be
in tune, where it wouldn't be with a 'lesser' trem system.
If you dump the bridge, when you RELEASE it, it will come back to
tune. That's all.
--
Mark Zedaker 'Users amaze accursed skill.'
ch...@home.com
ddasd
>
>mike jones wrote in message <7gktm8$dgd$1...@ash.prod.itd.earthlink.net>...
>>Floyd's can be raised, lowered and raised a whole fifth and more depending
>>on the type, and if installed and set up properly, will stay in tune with
>>even the most punishing whammy work.
>
>the name). Strike a chord with a Floyd then dump the trem...notice what
>happens? The chord is out of tune...it's not transposed.
>
There's soemthing you can do with the floyd that you can't with the transtrem
that comes from what you seem to view as a flaw. You can't do the 2 string
harmonic dives and get that cool effect when they're both dropping in tune.
All you get witht he transtrem is a sliding down the neck sound.
..and I would have to say it's the floyd all the way as well. The TransTrem
had it's chance. It came out a few years later, sure, but it was still during
the peak of the whammy 80's metal. Only a few people picked up the
transtrem..well, basically, nobody endorsed it when you compare it to the
number of Floyd users (and floyd type). All hardcore whammy users tried it
out, I tried it when it was first released. Neat trick...but it's mostly a
useless feature. What do I need transpose for? And it was a nightmare to
setup the cams for each string to change pitch properly. Change string
brands/alloys and you're in for the same deal all over again. Change string
types on a Floyd and you're looking at tension adjustments on the springs.
(there may be other adjustments like action, but that would go for the
Transtrem too.)
ddasd
>skolnick, it goes on and on). In fact, the only guitarist I've ever seen
>with a steinberger is the guitarist for david bowie (I think), and he does
>do some wild whammy work.
Reeves Gabriel is the name, I think. lots of wild shit. about 1/2 is
musical. ahhaah.
ljstarin
after a while, they were supposed to keep the thing in tune playing chords,
at any pitch, even with the strings breaking off one by one. My friend has
one on a VOX coffin shaped guitar. Does anyone remember this monstrousity?
TubeStore wrote in message <19990504100452...@ng-fx1.aol.com>...
asdf
>Washburn made this big clumsy vibrato once, you could find them real cheap
>after a while, they were supposed to keep the thing in tune playing chords,
>at any pitch, even with the strings breaking off one by one. My friend has
>one on a VOX coffin shaped guitar. Does anyone remember this monstrousity?
Yes. That would be the WonderBar. All surface mounted so there's no
routing..that's what made it so big and clunky and ugly.
iplaym...@gmail.com
> There's soemthing you can do with the floyd that you can't with the transtrem
> that comes from what you seem to view as a flaw. You can't do the 2 string
> harmonic dives and get that cool effect when they're both dropping in tune.
> All you get witht he transtrem is a sliding down the neck sound.
>
I have a Floyd on my Aria Pro Urchin (main guitar) and a Shift 2001 on my Washburn Striker ST 500 (backup guitar). Now I am in the studio all the time, and rarely change strings. When you have all the lights, mics and video cameras on and a string breaks it is the double locking Floyd Rose that allows me just to feed some down quickly from the headstock supply relock-1 Bridge, tune, relock-2 Neck, and go. So that is what will go into my custom dream guitar I designed many years ago and have redesigned for a crowdfunding venture.
If you are changing to new strings all the time, then a single locking Floyd is best (half the locks to breakdown). I have never played on a TransTrem. I am glad it has such strong fans who support it. However, if it cannot be reasonable bought or mass-produced, then I will stick with promoting Floyd in the new guitar.
Thanks all for the group discussion!
jtees4
wrote:
*************
Some of my music:
http://www.soundclick.com/bands/default.cfm?bandID=789610
The_Chris
>
> Thanks for that Chuck. It was the answer I was looking for. Harmonic dives are part of my play style. I am developing a custom guitar, and while researching bridges, I came across TransTrem and I wondered if it could be put into the new guitar design (cause I want everything to be the very best!) However while the Floyd is readily available, the TransTrem is not.
>
> I have a Floyd on my Aria Pro Urchin (main guitar) and a Shift 2001 on my Washburn Striker ST 500 (backup guitar). Now I am in the studio all the time, and rarely change strings. When you have all the lights, mics and video cameras on and a string breaks it is the double locking Floyd Rose that allows me just to feed some down quickly from the headstock supply relock-1 Bridge, tune, relock-2 Neck, and go. So that is what will go into my custom dream guitar I designed many years ago and have redesigned for a crowdfunding venture.
>
> If you are changing to new strings all the time, then a single locking Floyd is best (half the locks to breakdown). I have never played on a TransTrem. I am glad it has such strong fans who support it. However, if it cannot be reasonable bought or mass-produced, then I will stick with promoting Floyd in the new guitar.
>
> Thanks all for the group discussion!
actually miss that guitar!!!