Plastic bobbin Fender pickups
Tony Done
Does anyone know which, if any Fender pickups have alnico slugs and plastic
bobbins - as opposed to fibre endplates.
Does any have any of these pickups that they would sell?
Thanks,
Tony D
Mark Bedingfield
Anything out of a MIM, I don't think any of the Fender MIM guitars (RI's
and deluxes) have fibre bobbins and also Squier Standards (or better).
Highway Ones I think are also plastic bobbin.
Mark
Squier
I'm fairly sure the Highway 1 series had (and still has) alnico's but
bobbins were/are plastic. At least the Highway 1's up to 2007.
RichL
Does that mean I can shove those silly slugs to the positions where they
*belong* without endangering the pickups?
Mark Bedingfield
Tony thinks so ;-) I think that vintage staggers are perfectly fine tho.
Mark
RichL
Maybe it's just the string set I use (10-52), but that unwound G just
pops out at me. If I could safely push just that one slug down on each
pickup, I'd be a happy camper.
Mark Bedingfield
> X-No-Archive: yes
> bobbins. Check the back of the bobbin for the imprinted number,
> 016730. That seems to be Fender's part number for their plastic
> bobbins. I've seen pickups from the '80's onward imprinted with that
> number. You'll have to check out the rest of the specs to identify
> the particular Fender pickup that you have. The magnet slug varies in
> width on many of the older models. Some slugs are so narrow that the
> bobbin has slight waves or ripples caused by the loose fit.
I'm pretty sure custom shop and RI are fibre bobbins. Its only base
production models that are plastic. My CS Fat 50's are fibre bobbin.
Mark
Tony Done
"RichL" <rple...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:aLOdnZQ2yYf_1kjX...@supernews.com...
<g> Mark and I choose to disagree on the (lack of) merit of vintage stagger
pickups. That is the *one* thing that has prevented buying any kind of
mid-priced to expensive strat of any kind - the risk that it has fibre
endplate pickups that cannot be adjusted.
The pole pieces on the plastic bobbins I have used are held in with potting
wax. I move them with a bit of brass rod mounted in the drill press, with
the pickup held over a gap in the drill vise jaws, but it can be done with a
small hammer and a piece of soft rod - a piece of satay stick will do.
The stagger I use with a plain third string is 123123, where 1 = 0 (flush
with pickup cover) and 3 = about +1.5 mm. This is with Ernie Ball 10-46,
which are wrapped with nickel-plated iron. For a wound third I use 123412,
and for phosphor bronze acoustic strings 123402, 0 = no slug, just a dummy.
I plan on trying a conversion of one of these pickups to iron pole, using
5mm grub screws for the pole pieces, an brass base plate and ceramic
magnets, like a mini P90. I have already done this with a single humbucker
coil, and the result was warmer than I expected. My Lollar Chicago has a
flat 6.6K ohm coil, iron screw poles, an iron base plate and strong ceramic
magnets. It is warmer and hotter than you would expect from the coil
resistance. It is also very noisy without a shielding cover.
Tony D
Tony Done
"Tony Done" <tony...@bigpond.com> wrote in message
news:9PaBm.47377$ze1....@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
Thanks for the replies, I'm surprised how many have plastic bobbins. I'm not
trying to identify pickups so much as strats that are potential purchases -
ie with plastic bobbins. For me, any possible tonal advantage of the
traditional fibre endplate is greatly outweighed by the advantage of being
able to adjust the pole pieces in a plastic bobbin.
Tony D
Mr. Green
> Mark Bedingfield <atari...@nomorespamplease.optusnet.com.au> wrote:
> > RichL wrote:
> >> Squier <squ...@strats.net> wrote:
> >>>> Fender pickups with plastic bobbins were mentioned in the Fender
> >>>> p/u thread. Does anyone know which, if any Fender pickups have
> >>>> alnico slugs and plastic bobbins - as opposed to fibre endplates.
>
> >>>> Does any have any of these pickups that they would sell?
>
> >>>> Thanks,
>
> >>>> Tony D
>
> >>> I'm fairly sure the Highway 1 series had (and still has) alnico's
> >>> but bobbins were/are plastic. At least the Highway 1's up to 2007.
>
> >> Does that mean I can shove those silly slugs to the positions where
> >> they *belong* without endangering the pickups?
>
> > Tony thinks so ;-) I think that vintage staggers are perfectly fine
> > tho.
>
> Maybe it's just the string set I use (10-52), but that unwound G just
> pops out at me. If I could safely push just that one slug down on each
>
> - Show quoted text -
My jap strat has plastic bobbins. Magnets move easily. IMO sounds much
better with a modern stagger with a lower G string pole. Better to
take the pick guard off and do it. Not a good idea to expect the
pickup screws to support it while you push the pole in. You may strip
the thread out of the bobbin.
Green
Green
Tony
Same here. Gs were wound when the staggered design originated, and it has always
fascinated me that anyone could be satisfied with the imbalance it creates with any modern
string set. I've considered demagnetizing just the G magnets with an old degausser (so
they would still look vintage), but I decided not to risk taking it too far.
Tony
White Spirit
When I got my '50s Reissue (MIM), the pickups had cloth wire and alnico
slugs.
I have a set of Texas Specials I'm selling if you're interested in those.
White Spirit
> Same here. Gs were wound when the staggered design originated, and it has always
> fascinated me that anyone could be satisfied with the imbalance it creates with any modern
> string set.
You don't notice when using lots of distortion.
Mark Bedingfield
I found this;
Fender uses that bobbin with a number of their pickups, such as the
American Series, the Classic Series, and the Tex-Mex. Texas Specials,
like most of the Custom Shop pups, have vintage black fiber bobbins. And
of course the CS69 is gray rather than black.
Here;
http://www.fender.com/community/forums/viewtopic.php?t=2796&sid=55d332daedd044ef19e4e3f57444a27b
Which pretty much backs up what I thought. Am series, MIM (and possibly
MIJ) classic series and Tex-mex pups are plastic bobbin. Texas Specials
will have a fibre bobbin. SO I'd say the pups in your MIM weren't
original, WS. I'm pretty sure that original MIM classics are alnico,
plastic bobbin and PVC coated wire. So I'm not sure what you would have
had in there.
In summary look for AM series, MIM classics, Squier Standard (or better
- duncan designed) and Tex-mex's. That kind of thing.
Mark
White Spirit
> Which pretty much backs up what I thought. Am series, MIM (and possibly
> MIJ) classic series and Tex-mex pups are plastic bobbin. Texas Specials
> will have a fibre bobbin. SO I'd say the pups in your MIM weren't
> original, WS. I'm pretty sure that original MIM classics are alnico,
> plastic bobbin and PVC coated wire. So I'm not sure what you would have
> had in there.
If I'd known, I'd have tried to find out and sell them. Instead, I just
left the neck and bridge pickups with the luthier. I still have the
middle one. I got the guitar second hand from Ebay for a bargain price
in mint condition.
rct
> Same here. Gs were wound when the staggered design originated, and it has always
> fascinated me that anyone could be satisfied with the imbalance it creates with any modern
> string set.
Because they were usually standing in front of an amp that's probably
a little loud. The...subtleties are lost. Usually.
> I've considered demagnetizing just the G magnets with an old degausser (so
> they would still look vintage), but I decided not to risk taking it too far.
Dude. It's a Pickup. Relax. Yer the only one that can hear that
difference.
rct
Mr. Green
Nope, I can hear it too. I've lowered my G pole and I'm never going
back ;-)
It really struck me after I made a few strat pickups. I made the first
couple with level poles and could definitely tell the difference
between those and the old vintage stagger. This got me listening.
Thought about it and came up with a more logical modern stagger which,
funnily enough, matches the magnet stagger used by Chris Kinman.
Sounds so much more balanced.
IMO the difference is an obvious one once you have made a direct
comparison. As WH said though, if you use a lot of distortion it goes
away.
Green
rct
> > Dude. It's a Pickup. Relax. Yer the only one that can hear that
> > difference.
> Nope, I can hear it too. I've lowered my G pole and I'm never going
> back ;-)
Yes, you the guitar player you, yes indeedly. People have been
pushing the G down for as long as I have been playing, which is a
pretty long time now!
> IMO the difference is an obvious one once you have made a direct
> comparison. As WH said though, if you use a lot of distortion it goes
> away.
That woulda been something like:
> > Because they were usually standing in front of an amp that's probably
> > a little loud. The...subtleties are lost. Usually.
rct
Mr. Green
I acknowledge your "Usually" :-)
Last time I tried out an electric guitar in a music store it was one
of those Epiphone, P90 equipped, Gold Tops. The salesman plugged it
into a Marshall hybred amp. I said, give me the cleanest sound you can
get out of the amp. I could tell, by the expression on his face, this
was obviously a rare request ;-)
Green
boardjunkie
Just for the record Tony, you can take the cheaper ceramic p-ups and
remove the steel slugs from the plastic bobbin and replace them with
alnico rod magnets.
http://store.guitarfetish.com/vistsewhwobl.html
Cheap set of 3 there. Up to you to find the magnets.
boardjunkie
MIMs and squiers are ceramic bar magnet types, but a plastic bobbin.
White Spirit
> MIMs and squiers are ceramic bar magnet types, but a plastic bobbin.
The reissue MIMs aren't and early Squiers had alnico magnets. My '84
Squier has alnico IV pole-pieces.
Wrong_Note_Rod
>
> <g> Mark and I choose to disagree on the (lack of) merit of vintage stagger
> pickups. That is the *one* thing that has prevented buying any kind of
> mid-priced to expensive strat of any kind - the risk that it has fibre
> endplate pickups that cannot be adjusted.
none of that has ever bothered me whatsoever. I think once when i was
playing in a rockabilly band, I had ONE strat where either the G or the B
was a little loud so I pushed down the pole. Other than that, its been a
complete non-issue with every other guitar, in every form of music I've
ever played.
Different strokes for folks and all that
boardjunkie
I'm talking about current issue stuff. Whats a "reissue" MIM?
White Spirit
> I'm talking about current issue stuff. Whats a "reissue" MIM?
They make '50s, (early) '60s and '70s reissues.
rct
> none of that has ever bothered me whatsoever. I think once when i was
> playing in a rockabilly band, I had ONE strat where either the G or the B
> was a little loud so I pushed down the pole. Other than that, its been a
> complete non-issue with every other guitar, in every form of music I've
> ever played.
I've pushed them down here and there, always have, all kindsa guitars,
for a very long time now. Problem is that a few unpotted pickups got
wrecked because a rusted iron pole was pushed down and it caught on
and broke a wind or 300. Ever since then it's been like, Rocket
Surgery or something. I guess yer supposed to send yer pickups to a
pro feshunal Pole Pusher Downer to do it. Just push them down.
Unless Leo wound it, I don't care what it is, just push it down.
> Different strokes for folks and all that
Perhaps it is our Tin Ears maybe?
rct
Tony Done
"rct" <Ron.Th...@faa.gov> wrote in message
news:81881eeb-922c-4337...@e18g2000vbe.googlegroups.com...
I've wrecked (broken coil wire) a couple of fibre endplate pickups trying to
move the poles. I wouldn't try it again on another of that type. There is
also the problem that the endplates are held together by the alnico slugs,
so moving the plugs might loosen or even move the endplate.
Tony D
Mark Bedingfield
Squier standards (and better) are Alnico. Its only the cheap SE100's,
Bullets and Affinities that have ceramics.
From here (click on specifications);
http://www.squierguitars.com/products/search.php?partno=0321602509
- 3 Alnico Magnet Single-Coil Pickups
MIM Deluxes and RI's are also Alnico. This is one reason I think Squiers
are better buys then MIM Standards.
Mark
RichL
Right, at least if it's tube distortion, you get a lot of compression
with it that levels out the relative volumes from the different strings.
I play a lot of clean/semi-crunchy and in that regime there's a big
difference.
Mark Bedingfield
I played one of those a while back. I went in thinking this is going to
be a lovely guitar. it wasn't. I was so disappointed, if ever I was
going to get an LP that's what I'd probably get. Neck felt like chunky
yuck. I think I may have reverse Rufus syndrome. I.e. can't find a good LP.
BTW Clean is good. That's where you hear all the nuances of your pups.
Its also one (the main) reason I bought the Traynor amp, you can dirty
up clean you can't clean up dirty.
Mark
White Spirit
> MIM Deluxes and RI's are also Alnico. This is one reason I think Squiers
> are better buys then MIM Standards.
I don't like modern Squiers. Mexican standards don't differ from most
of the '80s standard Strats with 7.25" radius necks, C profile and the
correct number of frets, so they're much more vintage style. They also
have better wood than a lot of new Squiers.
Here's my Mexican standard:
http://s656.photobucket.com/albums/uu283/wulfgar1976/Mexican%20Strat/
Mark Bedingfield
Nice Strat, dude. Modern Standards are 9.5" rad. In fact the specs of
the VM's are near identical to the MIM's. Same profile, rad, string
spacing etc. They are shit hot players too, well at least the one's I've
tried. There's also the Signature, Standard and Classic vibe series too
and all have Alnico pups as well as being cheaper than a MIM. Don't get
me wrong, I can see myself ending up with a MIM Std, but if I were going
to gig with an unmodified guitar, it'd be a Squier over a MIM any day of
the week.
http://www.squierguitars.com/products/search.php?partno=0301200505
If I was going to mod (like I wouldn't, eh ;-) ) I'd happily get a
modern Squier Bullet and redo the electronics. Last few I've played have
been sweet little axes. Resonate like nobodies business and only cost
$160au (about 80 pounds). I've gigged with both of my Squiers too. No
wukka's ;-)
I'm still hankering for a Shell Pink bullet.
Mark
Squier
I agree with you 100%. Besides the fact I need clean for a lot of
the covers we do I have found that the best for me is to have an amp
with a nice clean base tone. From there I can pedal it up but I can
always kick off the gain/effects and get back to clean.
it just seems that amps that can get nice cleans like your 6L6 Traynor and
many Fenders.. etc are able to be really versatile because that nice cleans
makes for a great platform for most anything else you want to layer on it
be it overdrive or gain or effects or whatever.
My friend has Marshall JTM45 and it's a great amp but it's really not as
versatile as nice clean 6L6 powered amp. (imho). But it does rock out.
Nothing against other amps - it's just that I find a nice clean platform
to start from or always have available when I kick off pedals is the
way to go for versatility.
If I was only playing in some tribute band or maybe covering a narrow
genre of songs then sure a great one trick pony amp that nailed those
specific sounds would be fine. But for all around playing nothing beats
an amp with nice clean tones to start from or go back to.
(ps. the Prosonic I have just doesn't do some mean gain and crunch it has
the second blackface clean channel which immediately gives me the Fender cleans)
I actually use that channel a lot. I wouldn't like that amp without the
really nice clean channel it has.
And btw - we went to club and the band has the guitarist with Traynor YCV40
(black tolex) and he had a fairly simple pedal board and that band really
rocked out. He had great tones all night long. He was playing with an
Epi Les Paul and he really rocked it and sounded great. 4 piece band.
That amp had more than enough balls to play unmic'd in the club. I think
about 250 people there - 2 level place. (club downstairs with full bar on
street level first floor). So anyways I can attest that your Traynor is
definitely gig worthy and ready to go anywhere.
Tony Done
"Squier" <squ...@strats.net> wrote in message
news:151020091225237475%squ...@strats.net...
Me too. In my case it is the H&K Statesman and carefully chosen pickups. The
gain channel is also very good, but that is just a bonus.
Tony D
Mark Bedingfield
<snip>
>
> And btw - we went to club and the band has the guitarist with Traynor YCV40
> (black tolex) and he had a fairly simple pedal board and that band really
> rocked out. He had great tones all night long. He was playing with an
> Epi Les Paul and he really rocked it and sounded great. 4 piece band.
> That amp had more than enough balls to play unmic'd in the club. I think
> about 250 people there - 2 level place. (club downstairs with full bar on
> street level first floor). So anyways I can attest that your Traynor is
> definitely gig worthy and ready to go anywhere.
So can I ;-) I do find it hard to believe that there aren't a lot of
users on a.g. Such a simple, yet functional amp that sounds good too.
What's not to like?
I suppose the metal heads and the Marshall heads wouldn't be in it, eh
Squier?
Mark
PS as an OT Tele question, what would you recommend for a set of Tele
pups? Bridge SC and Neck Humbucker, not fussed if the HB is stacked or
PAF sized but looking for a good level balance with solid bottom end on
the bridge. Nice bluesy neck sort of thing too.
Mark Bedingfield
Being a Lap steel guy, do you go for clinical clean, Tony? Just asking
as the Traynor is clean, yet warm too. The "warm" sound would have to be
distortion of some kind, I'd imagine. Most likely due to the fact its a
valve amp.
Having trouble trying to explaining this, but the Epi VJH is warm too,
but dirtier. I'm not sure I'd call it warmer tho, tho I guess you could.
Also the chime from and amp, in relation to Strats, seems to be easier
to get with valve amps. Dunno why. Not really something you can quntify
in any case, I guess.
Mark
Tony Done
"Mark Bedingfield" <atar...@nomorespampleaseoptusnet.com.au> wrote in
message news:4ad7bf25$0$5420$afc3...@news.optusnet.com.au...
I don't think it is clinical lack the pedal steel guys who use a huge amount
of headroom in their amps, but it certainly lets a lot of the natural high
transients through. I can easily hear differences in pickups, and my hearing
isn't that good in the high range
Just asking
> as the Traynor is clean, yet warm too. The "warm" sound would have to be
> distortion of some kind, I'd imagine. Most likely due to the fact its a
> valve amp.
The warm might just be the frequencies it is favouring, ie its internal
EQing, my Blues Deluxe is warm like that.
>
> Having trouble trying to explaining this, but the Epi VJH is warm too, but
> dirtier. I'm not sure I'd call it warmer tho, tho I guess you could.
I know what you mean, again re my BD and my Epi VJ.
>
> Also the chime from and amp, in relation to Strats, seems to be easier to
> get with valve amps. Dunno why. Not really something you can quntify in
> any case, I guess.
The chimiest clean I have tried was a Mesa express 5-25, but too noisy for
my tastes. The H&K is pretty good like that, especially with the LP Special,
after the strat, it sounds as if the reverb is on. I don't know if it is
tubes or not, the Sansamp "British" pedal has the same quality, but they may
have a built-in reverb circuit for all I know.
Tony D
Squier
GFS Power Rock neovin noiseless set for Tele.
or you can get separates (GFS neovin Power Rock bridge and
neovin Hard Rock neck). But you get a better deal just getting
the Power Rock tele set.
They look like regular Tele pups but sound much more modern
when you overdrive them or give them gain. They don't get overly
thin or honky. The Power rock bridge really sounds more like
a humbucker as you overdrive it but it has nice warm cleans when you back off.
I usually put in Dimarzio Area T set but these GFS pups I think are
much better especially doing a wide variety of sounds and doing covers.
I don't like the GFS "Lil Punchers" for tele but the neovin Power rocker set
are nice only because when you play clean they sound like fat warm Tele sounds
and then they start to morph into really nice humbucker type sounds
as you gain them up. good stuff (imho)
The only thing you might want to change is if you want
a more glassy strat type neck sound then get the vintage tele neovins
with the power rock bridge - but personally i like the power rock set.
ok. all I can say really. tone is so subjective but that set
really gets me from clean to mean and does it better than any
other traditional looking tele set and it really is noiseless
(very little hum even when gained up)
White Spirit
> Nice Strat, dude. Modern Standards are 9.5" rad. In fact the specs of
> the VM's are near identical to the MIM's. Same profile, rad, string
> spacing etc. They are shit hot players too, well at least the one's I've
> tried. There's also the Signature, Standard and Classic vibe series too
> and all have Alnico pups as well as being cheaper than a MIM. Don't get
> me wrong, I can see myself ending up with a MIM Std, but if I were going
> to gig with an unmodified guitar, it'd be a Squier over a MIM any day of
> the week.
There's something about the feel of the Mexican Standards that makes
them feel right where modern Squiers don't, apart from the Classic
Vibes, but the quality of the wood wasn't sufficiently high on the CV to
interest me. One thing I don't like about modern Squiers in particular
is the quality of the rosewood used and the satin finish leaves
something to be desired compared to the Mexican Standards.
> http://www.squierguitars.com/products/search.php?partno=0301200505
I note that it's made from 'Indian red cedar'. I wonder how it sounds?
> If I was going to mod (like I wouldn't, eh ;-) ) I'd happily get a
> modern Squier Bullet and redo the electronics. Last few I've played have
> been sweet little axes. Resonate like nobodies business and only cost
> $160au (about 80 pounds). I've gigged with both of my Squiers too. No
> wukka's ;-)
> I'm still hankering for a Shell Pink bullet.
I'd love to get this, although I have a white version of the same:
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=290359341248&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT
I really don't have any more room for guitars, though.
Mark Bedingfield
I've heard you say that before, mate ;-) That's a sweet looking E series
too. Are the necks the same as the S9? The Squier VM's are better than
the CV's IMHO. They feel better and resonate well too. The biggest
problem I've seen with the CV's so far is setup tho. Actions too high,
truss rods not set right that sort of thing. Quality of the hardware and
pups is good in both cases tho. The ones that get my attention are the
Duosonic and Telecaster. I'd still love a jagmaster too. Sigh. Here we
go again ;-)
Mark
Mark Bedingfield
Never heard of that pedal, off too google.....
I'd bet you'd like the Traynor, Tony. Quiet, clean and able to be
cranked too. I've never really had it loud enough to distort on the
clean channel, as its freaking loud. lots of headroom too.
Mark
Mark Bedingfield
I have a GFS 50's Tele bridge pup;
http://store.guitarfetish.com/re19tealbobr.html
My Fat 50's in the MIM 50's has more bottom end than these tho. Not a
bad pup tho, but completely outdone by the Shadow 59 PAF I put in the
neck. I suppose what I want is a Tele pup that is high output, Alnico,
lots of (bight tight) bottom end but still with some traditional tone to
it. If you know what I mean?
I had the Alnico Tele pup in the neck;
http://store.guitarfetish.com/altenepiclch.html
But found it was lacking in sweetness and volume too. So I tried the
PAF, which I'm happy with as it contrasts my EMG Tele nicely.
Mark
Tony Done
It is one of the "Character" series, their Marshall emulator. I did a review
of it a few months ago. The others are Fender ("Tweed"?), Vox ("Liverpool")
and Mesa ("California"). A couple of things to notice if you get to try one
1) the knobs cover a huge range, so it is easy to jump past the sweet spot
and 2) I think it works better direct to the power amp, ie into the FX
return, bypassing the preamp.
Another not-too-expensive one I'm wondering about is the Blackstar Dual HT.
The Gain channel cranked sounds pretty good on the Youtube demos.
Tony D