While my guitar Gently Weeps - effect used

[SeraBelum]

What guitar effect was used by Clapton on the Beatles "While My
Guitar Gently Weeps"? I thought it was some kind of studio thing,
but it sounds like it is being used live on the George Harrison
tribute DVD.

Thanks!

(Posted in the effects group a while back and got no response)



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[Restless Fingers Syndrome]

On 3/11/2012 8:04 PM, SeraBelum wrote:
> What guitar effect was used by Clapton on the Beatles "While My
> Guitar Gently Weeps"?
>

Sounds like (fender) tremolo to me

[Inyo]

"SeraBelum" <cera...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:jjji2...@news4.newsguy.com...

> What guitar effect was used by Clapton on the Beatles "While My
> Guitar Gently Weeps"? I thought it was some kind of studio thing,
> but it sounds like it is being used live on the George Harrison
> tribute DVD.

Can't help identifying the specific effects that affected Clapton's
creation...but, I do recollect reading an interview with EC, who stated that
after he'd completed his guitar parts--plus solo, of course--he made the
remark (something to the effect) that "guess what, guys, that just isn't
"Beatley" enough," or something like some such thing. I'm paraphrasing, most
obviously, here.

So, a recording technician then took it upon himself to run EC's guitar
parts through some special audio effects maneuver to achieve a more
"Beatley" sound.

Bottom line--my recollection of the interview is that the distinctive
Clapton guitar sound eventually placed on The White Album evolved after the
original tape recording. If you heard the identical sound live on the
Harrison tribute, perhaps it's due to the "miracles of modern technology,"
or something akin to same, allowing Clapton to somehow recreate the original
sound sans post-recording magic.

http://inyo.coffeecup.com/site/guitar/inyoguitar16.html
My solo, acoustic, instrumental 6-string version of Harrison's "While My
Guitar Gently Weeps."

[RichL]

"SeraBelum" <cera...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:jjji2...@news4.newsguy.com...

> What guitar effect was used by Clapton on the Beatles "While My
> Guitar Gently Weeps"? I thought it was some kind of studio thing,
> but it sounds like it is being used live on the George Harrison
> tribute DVD.
>
> Thanks!

Leslie rotating speaker.

http://oldies.about.com/od/thebeatlessongs/a/whilemyguitargentlyweeps.htm

"The next day, Harrison's friend Eric Clapton, also his neighbor in the
county of Esher, gave George a lift to Abbey Road studios. Unhappy with the
band infighting and his own attempts at a guitar solo for "Weeps," George
insisted on the way in that Eric come into the studio and lay down a track.
Clapton originally refused, correctly noting that "nobody (famous) ever
plays on the Beatle's records!" but George insisted. The invitation had its
intended effects: the band were completely professional and Eric's solo
sounded great. But listening to the playback, the ex-Yardbird decided the
result "wasn't Beatle-y enough," so the solo was run through the Leslie
rotating speaker of the Hammond B-3 organ cabinet, an effect the lads had
been using at least as far back as "Tomorrow Never Knows." That same day,
the remaining vocal and instrumental tracks were laid down."

[LULU]

On Mar 11, 6:04 pm, SeraBelum <cerabe...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> What guitar effect was used by Clapton on the Beatles "While My
> Guitar Gently Weeps"?   I thought it was some kind of studio thing,
> but it sounds like it is being used live on the George Harrison
> tribute DVD.
>
> Thanks!
>
> (Posted in the effects group a while back and got no response)
>
> --
> --------------------------------- --- -- -
> Posted with NewsLeecher v4.0 Beta 7

> Web @http://www.newsleecher.com/?usenet

> ------------------- ----- ---- -- -

==============================

Clapton's solo is played on a 1957 Les Paul through a Leslie speaker
cabinet from a Hammond B-3. There were several variations of "While
My Guitar Gently Weeps" recorded by the Beatles. One alternate take
has a "backwards" solo laid down by George. I think that it can be
found on one of the "Anthology" albums? Another version has Paul on
piano and there's a cello in the arrangement.

Good Luck,
Lulu : )

Here's my favorite cover version -
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=puSkP3uym5k

==============================

[Nil]

On 11 Mar 2012, SeraBelum <cera...@hotmail.com> wrote in alt.guitar:

> What guitar effect was used by Clapton on the Beatles "While My
> Guitar Gently Weeps"? I thought it was some kind of studio thing,
> but it sounds like it is being used live on the George Harrison
> tribute DVD.

It's a vibrato effect, created by someone manually varying the speed of
the tape machine to create a warbling sound. It's related to ADT
("Automatic Double Tracking"), the granddaddy of the familiar chorus
and flanging effects. Some say The Beatles invented it; certainly they
pioneered it.

The effect was added after during the mixing process. If you compare
the mono and stereo versions of the track, you'll notice different
amounts of the effect. Also, you can find the isolated guitar track on
youtube and elsewhere, and it sounds to me like someone applied a
modern digital flange or leslie-like effect to it, something different
than the original sound,

Coincidentally, I recorded my own copycat version of the song a couple
of months ago. I wasn't quite able to duplicate the effect, so I mostly
backed off on that aspect. Now that you reminded me of it, I might pick
up the ball again. Here's what I have for now, but it may change when I
get around to it:

http://rednoise.devio.us/temp/WMGGW4.mp3

[Flasherly]

On Mar 11, 9:04 pm, SeraBelum <cerabe...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> What guitar effect was used by Clapton on the Beatles "While My
> Guitar Gently Weeps"? I thought it was some kind of studio thing,
> but it sounds like it is being used live on the George Harrison
> tribute DVD.
>
> Thanks!

Could lay pedals for added presence, reverb -- not sure how though a
wah would sound with mid-effects active boost. Also got a 125-watt
Fender Stereo Ultimate Chorus I haven't used in a dog's age. Turn it
up loud enough and maybe images of Carl Perkins giving sacrament to
Harrison will appear on the wall with Prince to side bearing witness.

[Desk Rabbit]

Correction, Esher is a town in the county of Sussex.

[iarwain]

> It's a vibrato effect, created by someone manually varying the speed of
> the tape machine to create a warbling sound.

This is the story I've always heard, that a recording engineer was
manually manipulating the tape head to create a wobble effect.
I've never heard the Leslie explanation before.

[Nil]

Maybe there's a little Leslie in there, too, but the predominent effect
is a pitch wobble. A Leslie produces a phasey-doppler effect, but no
pitch variation.

[Lost in The Wasteland]

On Sunday, March 11, 2012 8:04:20 PM UTC-5, SeraBelum wrote:
>
> WMGGW
>


I caught Frampton in Austin right after GH
died, playing in a small movie theater, ~1000 people,
and he did this song as an final encore.

There wasn't a dry eye in the house afterwards.

[LULU]

On Mar 12, 9:51 am, Nil <redno...@REMOVETHIScomcast.net> wrote:

=====================================

There's a lot of different stuff going on from version to version of
"While My Guitar Gently Weeps." Later versions of WMGGW are supposed
to be the first attempts of the Beatles using an 8-track machine to
record. ADT is used in the mix down. Maybe manual "flanging" was
used as well? Here's a stripped version of what Clapton played on the
tune. I guess that it's authentic. It's interesting anyway.

Enjoy,
Lulu : )

Clapton's Guitar - "While My Guitar Gently Weeps" -
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xzDyycsXmN0&feature=related

======================================

[Angus]

In article <jjjn1v$h6o$1...@dont-email.me>, in...@altavista.com says...

>
> "SeraBelum" <cera...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:jjji2...@news4.newsguy.com...
>
> > What guitar effect was used by Clapton on the Beatles "While My
> > Guitar Gently Weeps"? I thought it was some kind of studio thing,
> > but it sounds like it is being used live on the George Harrison
> > tribute DVD.
>
> Can't help identifying the specific effects that affected Clapton's
> creation...but, I do recollect reading an interview with EC, who stated that
> after he'd completed his guitar parts--plus solo, of course--he made the
> remark (something to the effect) that "guess what, guys, that just isn't
> "Beatley" enough," or something like some such thing. I'm paraphrasing, most
> obviously, here.
>
> So, a recording technician then took it upon himself to run EC's guitar
> parts through some special audio effects maneuver to achieve a more
> "Beatley" sound.
>

I have a very similar recollection of that interview. If I'm not
mistaken he said something about his relationship with Patti Harrison at
the same time along the lines of, in the sixties you didn't go off with
one of the Beatles wives, it just wasn't done.

[RichL]

"Nil" <redn...@REMOVETHIScomcast.net> wrote in message
news:XnsA01482D8...@127.0.0.1...

"Doppler effect" IS pitch variation!

The thing with the Leslie is that the amount of Doppler is proportional to
the rotation speed, so you get more pitch variation as you speed it up. So
maybe you're right; the WMGGW guitar has a lot of wobble toward the end but
the speed remains constant.

[Flasherly]

On Mar 12, 4:28 pm, Angus <angus@_ANTISPEM_angusm.demon.co.uk> wrote:
> In article <jjjn1v$h6...@dont-email.me>, i...@altavista.com says...
>
>
>
>
>
> > "SeraBelum" <cerabe...@hotmail.com> wrote in message

Harrison broke a lot of new ground there. Sweet guy basically, so
she's says, though as his life broadens into trancing out on a pillow
while waiting for elevated astral projection. . .probably as much
implicit if not an understated agreement, tacitly then she accompany
Eric to the Wonderful Party. . . .Sweet Lord, what if she'd showed
with Ginger or Ringo.

[Nil]

On 12 Mar 2012, "RichL" <rple...@yahoo.com> wrote in alt.guitar:

> "Doppler effect" IS pitch variation!
>
> The thing with the Leslie is that the amount of Doppler is
> proportional to the rotation speed, so you get more pitch
> variation as you speed it up. So maybe you're right; the WMGGW
> guitar has a lot of wobble toward the end but the speed remains
> constant.

You're right, of course. What I was trying to say was that the wobble
has a wider range than I think a Leslie is capable of. And I found this
exerpt in my "Recording The Beatles" book:

"When it came time to mix, the tracks with George's organ and Clapton's
guitar were heavily treated with "wobbly" ADT to create a chorusing
effect. "Eric played [the solo]. and I thought it was really good,"
said George Harrison. "Then we listened to it back, and he said, 'Ah,
there's a problem, though; it's not Beatley enough' -- so we put it
through the ADT to wobble it up a bit." Chris Thomas recalls being the
person in charge of the Levell oscillator during the mix session." I
actually hated the sound," he admits. "I thought it was stupid because
it was really gimmicky. But that's what they wanted to do, because
apparently Eric said that he didn't want it to sound like him. So I was
just sitting there wobbling the thing -- the wanted it really extreme,
so that's what I did. That whiny, out-of-tune keyboard sound was a
flanged organ."

[jimmy]

Well, that didn't sound like a guitar god. Not everything he did was
golden.

[jimmy]

On Tue, 13 Mar 2012 09:52:49 -0300, jimmy <bigto...@hotmail.com>
wrote:

not that anyone here said he's a guitar god. It's just me saying.

[Nil]

On 13 Mar 2012, jimmy <bigto...@hotmail.com> wrote in alt.guitar:

>> Clapton's Guitar - "While My Guitar Gently Weeps" -
>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xzDyycsXmN0
>

> Well, that didn't sound like a guitar god. Not everything he did
> was golden.

It does to me. I think it's one of those rare, nearly perfect solos.
Melodic, singable, builds in intensity, not too little and not too
much. A gem.

[RichL]

"Nil" <redn...@REMOVETHIScomcast.net> wrote in message

news:XnsA015556...@127.0.0.1...

Funny, I always assumed it's a Leslie. I guess I was misled because,
although I've never played through a real Leslie speaker, I've got the Boss
RT-20 Rotary Ensemble pedal which, as it turns out, does a pretty passable
emulation of the WMGGW effect. So I thought a Leslie would do the same
thing, although in retrospect I realize that the pedal has much more control
over the nature of the effect than a real Leslie would. Ah well, live and
learn!

[Nil]

On 13 Mar 2012, "RichL" <rple...@yahoo.com> wrote in alt.guitar:

> Funny, I always assumed it's a Leslie. I guess I was misled
> because, although I've never played through a real Leslie speaker,
> I've got the Boss RT-20 Rotary Ensemble pedal which, as it turns
> out, does a pretty passable emulation of the WMGGW effect. So I
> thought a Leslie would do the same thing, although in retrospect I
> realize that the pedal has much more control over the nature of
> the effect than a real Leslie would. Ah well, live and learn!

I used to be in a band with a Hammond B2 player with a Leslie, and it
was a lot of fun to play my guitar through it. So much nicer than
through any simulator box I've ever tried; it's a whole 'nother league.
To actually hear and feel the air moving in all directions - very
sensual. It's hard to get the same thing from a recording. The main
thing about it is the fluttering effect it's more of a tonal thing than
a pitch thing - you don't really get a pronounced vibrato out of it.

Several years ago a friend was throwing out an old 70's vintage
electronic organ. He let me take it, and it sat in my basement for a
couple of years while I thought about renovating it. I eventually
decided that it wasn't worth the effort and I trashed it. But not
before removing the rotating speaker assembly. Unlike a real Leslie,
which rotates horizontally, this one is a speaker on a whirling arm
that rotates perpendicular to the floor. I was thinking that I could
build a cabinet for it and have a small "Leslie" for recording
purposes. That's as far as it's gotten so far.

[LULU]

On Mar 13, 9:57 am, Nil <redno...@REMOVETHIScomcast.net> wrote:

> Several years ago a friend was throwing out an old 70's vintage
> electronic organ. He let me take it, and it sat in my basement for a
> couple of years while I thought about renovating it. I eventually
> decided that it wasn't worth the effort and I trashed it. But not
> before removing the rotating speaker assembly. Unlike a real Leslie,
> which rotates horizontally, this one is a speaker on a whirling arm
> that rotates perpendicular to the floor. I was thinking that I could
> build a cabinet for it and have a small "Leslie" for recording
> purposes. That's as far as it's gotten so far.

=============================

Fender Vibratones have a "vertical" rotating mechanism similar to the
one you describe. I still run across a Vibratone occasionally. There
doesn't seem to be much call for them these days. The VT cable
assemblies are getting very hard to locate. I always preferred the
sound of a Leslie to that of a VT. I haven't seen a VT model 950 with
the "psychedelic" speaker cover fabric in a very long time.

Lulu : )

This might interest you or someone else . . . enjoy . . .
http://www.nmia.com/~vrbass/vibratone/

==============================

[Nil]

On 13 Mar 2012, LULU <lulupa...@yahoo.com> wrote in alt.guitar:

> Fender Vibratones have a "vertical" rotating mechanism similar to
> the one you describe. I still run across a Vibratone
> occasionally. There doesn't seem to be much call for them these
> days. The VT cable assemblies are getting very hard to locate. I
> always preferred the sound of a Leslie to that of a VT. I haven't
> seen a VT model 950 with the "psychedelic" speaker cover fabric in
> a very long time.
>
> Lulu : )
>
> This might interest you or someone else . . . enjoy . . .
> http://www.nmia.com/~vrbass/vibratone/

That's an interesting page, thanks! After looking through that, I'm
starting to think about making something out of my little rotating
speaker. Mine wouldn't be able to handle much wattage, but for
recording it might work well. I also salvaged the tube amplifier from
the organ. Now all I have to do is build or find a suitable box. Too
bad I have no woodworking tools.

[Lawrence Logic]

"LULU" wrote in message
news:09f6dd5e-282f-452a...@p12g2000yqe.googlegroups.com...

>
> Clapton's Guitar - "While My Guitar Gently Weeps" -
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xzDyycsXmN0&feature=related
>

Thank you so much for posting that link. It lead me to discovering MOGG
files. I've downloaded a few since reading your post, and it's like not
just knowing the ingredients to a cake but knowing how and when they were
included in the recipe.

--
Lawrence
"I'm gonna go find me some butterfly poon." - Randy Marsh - 20 October 2010

[jtees4]

On Tue, 13 Mar 2012 09:52:49 -0300, jimmy <bigto...@hotmail.com>
wrote:

No God...No. But a great solo, of course you have to listen to it in
the context of the recorded song to realise how great it was.

[Rockinghorse Winner]

* It may have been the liquor talking, but

This is prolly old news to some, but the opening piano riff was done by Paul
McCartney. Not sure if the bass or drums were done by Paul and Ringo on that
particular track.

Terry
--
"There are two means of refuge from the miseries of life: music and cats."
-Albert Schweitzer

badass linux - gentoo 3.2.1

[Nil]

On 16 Mar 2012, Rockinghorse Winner
<rwinner@remove_this.hmamail.com> wrote in alt.guitar:

> This is prolly old news to some, but the opening piano riff was
> done by Paul McCartney. Not sure if the bass or drums were done by
> Paul and Ringo on that particular track.

Ringo and only Ringo.