"Worst or most overrated guitarist
Ed
lov...@ripco.com (Nelson Seggley) wrote:
> Worst guitarist ever? I guess you mean the worst guitarist of the most
>acclaim. How about the guitarist for Blind Melon. Oh, man, I hate that band.
>=_Nelson_=
>"And I look like a man...and I feel like an ant." -SG
What about that guy from Silverchair? They oughtta be called Baby
Chair. I guess he might get better when he gets older......nah, it
don't matter, they probably won't even put out another album!
That guy from Green Day sucks pretty bad. I think he's trying too
hard to be like the singer/guitarist from The Clash. People are
trying to compare them to Ramones, Sex Pistols, etc., but check out
the Clash, you'll see.
Those two guys from Pearl Jam really suck. I'd have to say they're
really overrated. I have to say, I loved Ten, but after that,
everything went downhill. I think they're too stoned to play the
guitar anymore. Either that or they're too rich.
Kenny Ray Shepherd is overrated. I mean, he's a great player, but if
he wasn't so young, and his dad hadn't gotten him a record deal, and
if he didn't sound exactly like Stevie Ray Vaughan, he'd be nowhere.
There are thousands of guitarists with more talent than this guy, only
they don't have the connections.
By the way, check out the alt.guitar amp newsgroups. Everyone's
infatuated with the SRV sound. Everyone wants a '59 Bassman, '54
Strat, and an original TS-808. It's the new formula rock for the
'90s. Get the rig, learn your I-IV-V 12 bar progressions and
turnarounds, get that pentatonic scale down, and you're set!
(By the way, I play a Strat and a Fender Bassman (a '74, nothing so
vintage) but I don't try to get that "Texas Blues Sound" like
everybody and his brother)
Peter Bradt
I agree that Kenny Wayne Shepherd is way overrated but the most overrated
guitarists of all have to be Jimmy Page (very sloppy and after LZ1 it just
got worse) and SRV. I *like* Stevie but there were/are Blues players who
blow him away. I saw the tribute thing on PBS (regrettably with *all* the
pledge breaks) and B.B. King, Bonnie Raitt and Buddy Guy all reminded me
of why. They are *originals,* much more than SRV ever was. T-Bone Walker
was a major influence on King, Guitar Slim on Buddy Guy, so even *they*
are heavily influenced.
What Stevie had, *at times* was feeling. But as much as anything SRV was
the right guy at the right place in the right time. He helped the Blues
get larger for everyone as did Clapton before him so we owe him the debt
of gratitude. Note it took milquetoast pop songs, not blues, to make
Bonnie Raitt famous. I don't buy her records any more because they don't
have any blues on them. Robert Cray has great pipes and is a great player
but I'm not fond of his tone. But SRV was not *even* the best.
B.B. King made a friend of mine, a great player and musician, cry. He'd
never seen BB before. B is a religious experience. SRV was not...
Page...ugh, you can have him. Yardbirds was his last really good work...pete
Clancy
>I agree that Kenny Wayne Shepherd is way overrated but the most overrated
>guitarists of all have to be Jimmy Page (very sloppy and after LZ1 it just
>got worse) and SRV. I *like* Stevie but there were/are Blues players who
>blow him away. I saw the tribute thing on PBS (regrettably with *all* the
>pledge breaks) and B.B. King, Bonnie Raitt and Buddy Guy all reminded me
>of why. They are *originals,* much more than SRV ever was. T-Bone Walker
>was a major influence on King, Guitar Slim on Buddy Guy, so even *they*
>are heavily influenced.
naaaaaaaaah, Vaughn really was great. Bonnie Raitt is just an ok
slide player. I don't see any connection between Eddie Jones and
Guy, at all.
>
>What Stevie had, *at times* was feeling. But as much as anything SRV was
>the right guy at the right place in the right time. He helped the Blues
Wrong. In the '80's, even zztop quit their traditional style and
got into synthesizers. The Rolling Stone review of Vaughn's first album
practically started with a disclaimer. It was something like "We know
what you're thinking, but suspend judgement for a minute..." The
reason being that there had been so many, so many 'boogie shuffle'
bands who were terribly terribly out of fashion.
No, the cards were clearly stacked against him in terms of mass appeal
and he beat that, just by playing so well.
Billy Marsh
Peter Bradt wrote:
>
> I agree that Kenny Wayne Shepherd is way overrated but the most overrated
> guitarists of all have to be Jimmy Page (very sloppy and after LZ1 it just
> got worse) and SRV. I *like* Stevie but there were/are Blues players who
> blow him away. I saw the tribute thing on PBS (regrettably with *all* the
> pledge breaks) and B.B. King, Bonnie Raitt and Buddy Guy all reminded me
> of why. They are *originals,* much more than SRV ever was. T-Bone Walker
> was a major influence on King, Guitar Slim on Buddy Guy, so even *they*
> are heavily influenced.
>
> the right guy at the right place in the right time. He helped the Blues
> of gratitude. Note it took milquetoast pop songs, not blues, to make
> Bonnie Raitt famous. I don't buy her records any more because they don't
> have any blues on them. Robert Cray has great pipes and is a great player
> but I'm not fond of his tone. But SRV was not *even* the best.
>
> B.B. King made a friend of mine, a great player and musician, cry. He'd
> never seen BB before. B is a religious experience. SRV was not...
>
> Page...ugh, you can have him. Yardbirds was his last really good work...pete
Page and Vaughn overrated!!Pleassssseeeeee!!!Page is one of the best
EVER!Sure,he's a little sloppy at times,but the guy was a virtual guitar
orchestra.The combination of tones and tunings he used was awesome.One
of the top guitar composers ever.
As far as SRV not being original...I can recognise his tone
anywhere.Yeah,he was heavily Hendrix and King(Albert)influenced,but he
definitely had his own thing going.The guy played COMPLETELY from the
heart.That always does it for me.
Agree with you on Kenny Wayne....far overrated,and a lame SRV rip-off.
Billy
marh...@ix.netcom.com
just...@castles.com (Peter Bradt) wrote:
>I agree that Kenny Wayne Shepherd is way overrated but the most overrated
>guitarists of all have to be Jimmy Page (very sloppy and after LZ1 it just
>got worse) and SRV. I *like* Stevie but there were/are Blues players who
>blow him away. I saw the tribute thing on PBS (regrettably with *all* the
>pledge breaks) and B.B. King, Bonnie Raitt and Buddy Guy all reminded me
>of why. They are *originals,* much more than SRV ever was. T-Bone Walker
>was a major influence on King, Guitar Slim on Buddy Guy, so even *they*
>are heavily influenced.
marhumba wrote:
And who influenced T-Bone? He did'nt start it all, so does that make
him un-original? I think not.
>What Stevie had, *at times* was feeling.
marhumba wrote:
Feeling is 99.9% of blues. Just about anyone can learn to shred, but
feeling can't be taught.
>But as much as anything SRV was
>the right guy at the right place in the right time. He helped the Blues
>get larger for everyone as did Clapton before him so we owe him the debt
>of gratitude. Note it took milquetoast pop songs, not blues, to make
>Bonnie Raitt famous. I don't buy her records any more because they don't
>have any blues on them. Robert Cray has great pipes and is a great player
>but I'm not fond of his tone. But SRV was not *even* the best.
marhumba wrote:
*sigh*. I'd hoped that the "best guitarist" thread would have
illustrated that there is simply no such thing as "the best". And
blues has always been "large" for many people, just not the masses.
>B.B. King made a friend of mine, a great player and musician, cry. He'd
>never seen BB before. B is a religious experience. SRV was not...
marhumba wrote:
You don't have to be a great player or a musician to be touched by BB.
I doubt it was BB's *technique* that touched your friend. Once
again,"feeling". I had the good fortune to meet him backstage some
twenty years ago when he was touring with Freedy King. The sweetest
man you could ever want to meet. How a guy can tear at your heart with
3 or 4 notes is beyond me, but hey, I'll take it! Maybe SRV was'nt a
"religious" experience for you, but many of us were shattered by this
mans death. I never got a chance to see him play, and that in itself
is enough to make me cry.
>Page...ugh, you can have him. Yardbirds was his last really good work...pete
marhumba wrote:
Agreed. Saw him a few years back on an MTV special. He was playing so
bad I could'nt help but feel sorry for him.
Just my 1.73 cents (had to pay the governor)
marhumba
Eggy Bhuna Massala
The worst axe dude ever has to be Jyngway bloody Malmstein. All speed and no
feeling. I could play better with both thumbs up my arse. Hell, I do play
better with both thumbs up my arse.
Shalom and peace, Eggy
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Eggy Bhuna Massala ( { }
WND Shorts Inc. } }{
mailto:eggy...@purbeck.demon.co.uk ((((O)))))
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"That which does not kill me makes my stools stronger" The Good Curry Guide
==============================================================================
Ton Schuwer
If you go to a live performance of Malmsteen or listen to his latest
albums you're absolutely right.
If you listen to the "classic" instrumental songs on the first album
than you will hear that he really can play with feeling.
It's just his attitude nowadays that makes him sound like he does now.
Ton
rat...@conval.edu
[B
CM>>I agree that Kenny Wayne Shepherd is way overrated but the most overrated
CM>>guitarists of all have to be Jimmy Page (very sloppy and after LZ1 it just
CM>>got worse) and SRV. I *like* Stevie but there were/are Blues players who
CM>>blow him away. I saw the tribute thing on PBS (regrettably with *all* the
CM>>pledge breaks) and B.B. King, Bonnie Raitt and Buddy Guy all reminded me
CM>>of why. They are *originals,* much more than SRV ever was. T-Bone Walker
CM>>was a major influence on King, Guitar Slim on Buddy Guy, so even *they*
CM>>are heavily influenced.
SRV brought blues to a new level. He also re-defined the
standards for what a blues rocker has to be. On top of that he broke
through a buisness stacked against him at the time, through word of
mouth. He never sent out demos. Yes, he was in the right place at the
right time, but he only got there becuase people were passing the word,
and the word made it's way to Mick Jagger. If Stevie hadn't brought the
blues to a new level back in the clubs I doubt he wouldn't have gotten
signed... there are 1000's of blues guitarists around the country who
re-hash every cliche 100 times during there gig. SRV threw out those
cliches, and instead brought something fresh to the blues, like BB,
Buddy Guy, T-Bone, Freddie King, and others did. That's why I consider
SRV one of the greats. Also, people always talk about SRV "ripping off"
ASLbert King, Buddy Guy, etc. Listen to the source, and listen to SRV,
and while some of the source is there, there was a ton of other stuff
that isn't accounted for, it can't really be traced back. But to each
his own.
goldtop®
Billy Marsh <fen...@cyberstate.infi.net> was seen scribbling this:
>Page and Vaughn overrated!!Pleassssseeeeee!!!Page is one of the best
>EVER!Sure,he's a little sloppy at times,but the guy was a virtual guitar
>orchestra.The combination of tones and tunings he used was awesome.One
>of the top guitar composers ever.
Hmmm. I don't care for JP, but he has made his mark, no doubt. Sloppy
can be different things. Johnny Winter was kinda sloppy. I wished I
was half that sloppy.
>As far as SRV not being original...I can recognise his tone
>anywhere.
Bingo. It was Stevie's *tone* that was so muscular and unmistakeable.
His repertoire of licks were the standard blues fare, but sounded
great with that tone.
>Agree with you on Kenny Wayne....far overrated,and a lame SRV rip-off.
Am I the only one who feels that the term "rip-off" is just plain out
of place in a discussion of blues guitarists?
goldtop
Wayne
I THINK JIMMY PAGE WAS BETTER THAN YOU THINK !
Ed
marh...@ix.netcom.com wrote:
>just...@castles.com (Peter Bradt) wrote:
>>I agree that Kenny Wayne Shepherd is way overrated but the most overrated
>>guitarists of all have to be Jimmy Page (very sloppy and after LZ1 it just
>>got worse)
Sure, Jimmy Page had sloppy moments, but look at the songs he wrote.
He rocked the world, literally. Do you think any of today's modern
guitarists could have written anything as lyrical as "The Rain Song"?
I think not.
and SRV. I *like* Stevie but there were/are Blues players who
>>blow him away. I saw the tribute thing on PBS (regrettably with *all* the
>>pledge breaks) and B.B. King, Bonnie Raitt and Buddy Guy all reminded me
>>of why. They are *originals,* much more than SRV ever was.
I'm not a big fan of SRV, though I acknowledge his guitar prowess. He
copied a lot of Albert King's stuff.
T-Bone Walker
>>was a major influence on King, Guitar Slim on Buddy Guy, so even *they*
>>are heavily influenced.
I realize everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but this is the
most uneducated opinion I have heard yet. Page has probably inspired
more guitarists than most of the blues "greats"
Chris Stecker
Billy Marsh wrote:
>
> Peter Bradt wrote:
> >
> > I agree that Kenny Wayne Shepherd is way overrated but the most overrated
> > guitarists of all have to be Jimmy Page (very sloppy and after LZ1 it just
> > blow him away. I saw the tribute thing on PBS (regrettably with *all* the
> > pledge breaks) and B.B. King, Bonnie Raitt and Buddy Guy all reminded me
> > was a major influence on King, Guitar Slim on Buddy Guy, so even *they*
> > are heavily influenced.
> >
> > the right guy at the right place in the right time. He helped the Blues
> > get larger for everyone as did Clapton before him so we owe him the debt
> > of gratitude. Note it took milquetoast pop songs, not blues, to make
> > Bonnie Raitt famous. I don't buy her records any more because they don't
> > have any blues on them. Robert Cray has great pipes and is a great player
> > but I'm not fond of his tone. But SRV was not *even* the best.
> >
> > never seen BB before. B is a religious experience. SRV was not...
> >
>
> EVER!Sure,he's a little sloppy at times,but the guy was a virtual guitar
> orchestra.The combination of tones and tunings he used was awesome.One
> of the top guitar composers ever.
> definitely had his own thing going.The guy played COMPLETELY from the
> heart.That always does it for me.
>
guitarist that can come close to stevie!
CW
"Worst and most overrated guitarist". Hmmmmmmmm. I could never bash
anyone who has recorded *anything* with any instrument, let alone the
guitar. All of the guitarists mentioned in this thread are all great
axemen. Some may say that one is better than the other but the bottom
line is how much heart, soul and style they inject into their music.
rat...@conval.edu
FE>Page and Vaughn overrated!!Pleassssseeeeee!!!Page is one of the best
FE>EVER!Sure,he's a little sloppy at times,but the guy was a virtual guitar
FE>orchestra.The combination of tones and tunings he used was awesome.One
FE>of the top guitar composers ever.
FE>As far as SRV not being original...I can recognise his tone
FE>anywhere.Yeah,he was heavily Hendrix and King(Albert)influenced,but he
FE>definitely had his own thing going.The guy played COMPLETELY from the
FE>heart.That always does it for me.
FE>Agree with you on Kenny Wayne....far overrated,and a lame SRV rip-off.
I like the part where you said Page was a guitar orchestra. You
are so right. Not many people can do that. People always rate guitar
players by there leads, and ignore there other talents. Page was an
awesome composer. I could care less for his leads, personally. His
orchestration is what I respect most..
rat...@conval.edu
JU>I agree that Kenny Wayne Shepherd is way overrated but the most overrated
JU>guitarists of all have to be Jimmy Page (very sloppy and after LZ1 it just
JU>got worse) and SRV. I *like* Stevie but there were/are Blues players who
JU>blow him away. I saw the tribute thing on PBS (regrettably with *all* the
JU>pledge breaks) and B.B. King, Bonnie Raitt and Buddy Guy all reminded me
JU>of why. They are *originals,* much more than SRV ever was. T-Bone Walker
JU>was a major influence on King, Guitar Slim on Buddy Guy, so even *they*
JU>are heavily influenced.
How can you judge someone on just there Leads? Leads are a part
of it, but there is a lot more to guitar than just leads... check out
Achilles Last Stand.. while there isn't a wicked cool lead break.. there
is lots of other cool stuff in there. Crazy guitar harmonies and such. I
agree that he was sloppy. But usually the parts he orchestrated we
fine....
Real Garry
I'd have to put a vote in for George Thorogood.
Garry/Las Vegas
goldtop®
Matt Lipschutz <mal...@psu.edu> was seen scribbling this:
>Page may not have been a great performer, (he was very sloppy), but he
>was one, in my opinion, of the greatest rock composers ever.
>Being a good player is more than just being able to perform.
Yes, you must be able to to do more than just perform.
But you have to be able to perform in the first place.
Page wasn't a great performer, but a great composer.
And a highly overrated lead player.
Don't bother flaming me. I responded to this from alt.guitar.amps,
where it was improperly crossposted. I changed the header to
alt.guitar, where it belongs, and I don't read alt.guitar.
goldtop®
Paolo Ciccone
I know it will cause a lot of flame but... Jimi Hendrix, while
defitely good, is, in my opinion, highly overrated.
Paolo
--
The opinions expressed here are exclusively my own
Charles Winters
Chris Stecker wrote:
>
> Billy Marsh wrote:
> >
> > Peter Bradt wrote:
> > >
> > >
> > > What Stevie had, *at times* was feeling. But as much as anything SRV was
> > > the right guy at the right place in the right time. He helped the Blues
> > > get larger for everyone as did Clapton before him so we owe him the debt
> > > of gratitude. Note it took milquetoast pop songs, not blues, to make
> > > Bonnie Raitt famous. I don't buy her records any more because they don't
> > > have any blues on them. Robert Cray has great pipes and is a great player
> > > but I'm not fond of his tone. But SRV was not *even* the best.
> > >
> > > B.B. King made a friend of mine, a great player and musician, cry. He'd
> > > never seen BB before. B is a religious experience. SRV was not...
> > >
> > > Page...ugh, you can have him. Yardbirds was his last really good work...pete
> >
> >
Bentley
Paolo Ciccone (pcic...@borland.com) said something like:
:
: I know it will cause a lot of flame but... Jimi Hendrix, while
: defitely good, is, in my opinion, highly overrated.
Question: How old are you?
In 1996, yeah, Hendrix' stuff is played by everyone... which is kind of
the point, dude, in 1966 we'd never heard anything like it. I still wonder
if he'd lived to the 30 if we'd all be playing with our feet now :)
I admire the balls it took to write that, btw.
[.tab newsgroup trimmed]
Anonymous X. Incognito
I'm afraid the winner of that title would have to be. ....... .. . .
Me!
Daddy-0
Anonymous X. Incognito wrote:
>
> I'm afraid the winner of that title would have to be. ....... .. . .
>
> Me!
I like this guy!
Carl Mercier
Paolo Ciccone <pcic...@borland.com> wrote:
>
>I know it will cause a lot of flame but... Jimi Hendrix, while
>defitely good, is, in my opinion, highly overrated.
I'd say he wasn't really that good... all his stuff is easy to play as hell!
Kirk Hammett can kick his ass 100 times and he's really not the best guitarist
on earth... I'd go for people like Vai, Satch, Johnson, Pettrucci... those
guys... not fucken Hendrix!
rat...@conval.edu
CM>Paolo Ciccone <pcic...@borland.com> wrote:
CM>>
CM>>I know it will cause a lot of flame but... Jimi Hendrix, while
CM>>defitely good, is, in my opinion, highly overrated.
CM>I'd say he wasn't really that good... all his stuff is easy to play as hell!
CM>Kirk Hammett can kick his ass 100 times and he's really not the best guitari
CM>on earth... I'd go for people like Vai, Satch, Johnson, Pettrucci... those
CM>guys... not fucken Hendrix!
Just becuase something is easy to play doesn't mean it isn't
good.... And if it wasn't for Hendrix, Hammet, Via, Satch, Johnson, and
Pettrucci... not to mention 100's of others... would sound very
different. It's like saying Stevie Ray Vaughan blew Albert King away.
Just becuase Albert's style is simpler, doesn't mean SRV could have
blown him away.
Jimmy Pena
In article <rupg24vol...@joyeux.inria.fr>,
mart...@joyeux.inria.fr (Laurent Martelli) wrote:
LM> Sloppy? Yes his is. (Anyone who is not sure of that can listen
LM> to the solo of Heartbreaker) But what's wrong with sloppyness
I can't believe you. The entire POINT of _Heartbreaker_ is that
there is no TIME SIGNATURE during the beginning of the solo, it is FREE
TIME, so the only thing that applies would be the KEY. The term "sloppy"
or even "technical" does not apply, because during free time there is no
standard by which to judge whether a guitar player is playing the music
at the proper TIME. I'm suprised that _Heartbreaker_ is touted as the
biggest example of his sloppiness, while ignoring the fact that it is not
standard music.
Please note followups.
Better yet, create a group called alt.guitar.advocacy. Then all
of you who hate (and love) Page can beat your heads against the wall,
rather than in a TAB newsgroup. I like him, but I wouldn't post about him
in here.
Jimmy Pena - ji...@walrus.com
bul...@acadiacom.net
cm...@prolognet.qc.ca (Carl Mercier) wrote:
>>I'd say he wasn't really that good... all his stuff is easy to play as hell!
>Kirk Hammett can kick his ass 100 times and he's really not the best guitarist
>on earth... I'd go for people like Vai, Satch, Johnson, Pettrucci... those
>guys... not fucken Hendrix!
OK, boy genius, YOU change the world of guitar permanently. Either
that or play the solo from Voodoo Chile/Slight Return, note for note.
Anyone ever notice that the asswipes who dump on Hendrix are always
fans of these metal noodler finger-tapper big hair guitarists?
mrw...@grove.ufl.edu
you are crazy. jim croce was is and shall ever be the greatest guitarist
of all time. one day he will play his acoustic guitar in heaven with neil
diamond on vocals jimi hendrix on harp and jim morrison will be their
maNAGER. surrealistic painter salvador dali will design album covers and
the title of their band will be "the chili dog solution." they will fly
around on mystical llamas visiting Taco bells and doing covers from the
great movie "willy wonka and the chocalate factory" cheese will be the
message they bring to the nations. save yourself from destruction! young
children. eat more provolone. before you pass this off as the ramblings
of a lunatic remember that all true visionaries of the future are
ridiculed.
OHSHHHHHHH
as far as Hendix goes.......he was great......you have to account for what
was out there at the time also.......he experimented with a lot of
things.....that's what truely made him great IMHO
Scott
gur...@ibm.net
How about the most underated guitarist? Listen to the riffs Ian Bairson
makes on all the Allan Parsons Project albums. This guy is great:
I would sit at his feet. It's much easier to emulate Hendrix, Beck or Page
thatn it is to play this guys stuff. This is music to the max.
cl...@mdh1.moorhead.msus.edu
Most underrated guitarist?
Was, is, and (sadly) probably always will be Richard Thompson.
Jeff Havens
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Don't know what drug you on, but it sounds interesting. Please deliver 10
pounds of it to my doorstep at *once*.
Bob Pickwoad
Daddy-O
cl...@mdh1.moorhead.msus.edu wrote:
>
> Most underrated guitarist?
>
> Was, is, and (sadly) probably always will be Richard Thompson.
Hear, hear!
Larry Bles
I don't know if he was the greatest, but if you've ever tried to play
Time In A Bottle, you sure do gain some appreciation for him.
Young J. Putt
In article <32335ab...@news.contact.net>,
cm...@prolognet.qc.ca (Carl Mercier) wrote:
>Paolo Ciccone <pcic...@borland.com> wrote:
>
>>
>>I know it will cause a lot of flame but... Jimi Hendrix, while
>>defitely good, is, in my opinion, highly overrated.
>
>I'd say he wasn't really that good... all his stuff is easy to play as hell!
>Kirk Hammett can kick his ass 100 times and he's really not the best guitarist
>on earth... I'd go for people like Vai, Satch, Johnson, Pettrucci... those
>guys... not fucken Hendrix!
I've been reading this and similar threads for some time now, and have been reluctant to
respond because I think the whole idea of a "best" musician is comical. However, I can remain
silent no more.
IMHO . . .
Music is not an athletic event. Why on earth does it matter if a piece is hard to play? The
purpose of music, or any art for that matter, is to ellict an emotion in someone who is
listening to (or observing) it. The question that needs to answered to "evaluate" a guitarist is
not "How fast can he play" or "How much theory does she know?" It is "How does his playing make
me feel?" I must admit that watching a player tear off a run of 32nd notes at breakneck speeds
is exciting, but only for about 2 minutes if he not saying something with those notes.
If you don't appreciate artists like Hendrix and Page, it is because you simply don't get it.
That's not meant to be insulting or condescending. There's a lot of music out there that I don't
"get" yet, but I'm trying. My advice to everyone is to stop analyzing and measuring musicians
and start listening to and enjoying them. If the only enjoyment you get from music is the "Gee
Whiz" reaction to a dificult passage, then you are truly missing out.
Michael Wajda
bul...@acadiacom.net wrote:
>
> cm...@prolognet.qc.ca (Carl Mercier) wrote:
>
> >>I'd say he wasn't really that good... all his stuff is easy to play as hell!
> >Kirk Hammett can kick his ass 100 times and he's really not the best guitarist
> >on earth... I'd go for people like Vai, Satch, Johnson, Pettrucci... those
> >guys... not fucken Hendrix!
>
> that or play the solo from Voodoo Chile/Slight Return, note for note.
>
> Anyone ever notice that the asswipes who dump on Hendrix are always
> fans of these metal noodler finger-tapper big hair guitarists?
RIGHT ON D00D!!!!
bul...@acadiacom.net
cl...@mdh1.moorhead.msus.edu wrote:
>Most underrated guitarist?
>Was, is, and (sadly) probably always will be Richard Thompson.
I agree wholeheartedly. He just keeps putting out albums of brilliant
stuff and people keep ignoring him. I saw him play in New Orleans
last year with Danny Thompson on bass and Dave Mattacks on drums, plus
a mandolinist/rhythm guitarist whose name I didn't catch. He
absolutely burned on both electric and acoustic. I keep telling my
guitar head friends that Richard Thompson is a better player than Eric
Johnson or Joe Satriani and they always give me this pitying look.
Jeremy Michael Crosbie
In article <323CA6...@ix.netcom.com>,
Besides the point of Hendrix-dumpers being fans of "metal noodler" guitarists,
let's put this in perspective:
Satch started playing guitar because of Jimi Hendrix (it is even said that Satch
started playing the day Hendrix died). If Satch ahd not the heard Hendrix, we
can probably assume we would not have a Joe Satriani.
it is also well known that Kirk Hammett was taught by Joe Satriani. Do you see
what I am getting at?
Hendrix influenced many musicians and non-musicians alike. If not for Hendrix we
would not have some of the greatest (and worst) guitar players we have now. It
is kind of like going back a million years and stepping on a small insect. That
bug could have been the basis for all civilization known today. So don't step on
Hendrix.
"The next sentence will be false. . .
The previous sentence was true."
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Paolo Ciccone
jcro...@rigel.oac.uci.edu (Jeremy Michael Crosbie) writes:
> Besides the point of Hendrix-dumpers being fans of "metal noodler" guitarists,
> let's put this in perspective:
>
> Satch started playing guitar because of Jimi Hendrix (it is even said that Satch
> started playing the day Hendrix died). If Satch ahd not the heard Hendrix, we
> can probably assume we would not have a Joe Satriani.
>
> it is also well known that Kirk Hammett was taught by Joe Satriani. Do you see
> what I am getting at?
>
> Hendrix influenced many musicians and non-musicians alike. If not for Hendrix we
> would not have some of the greatest (and worst) guitar players we have now.
I agree and disagree at the same time. Hendrix had the merit to
clearly show what an electric guitar could do when pushed to the
limit. He showed us how to break some barriers but I believe he was
just the right man at the right moment. He surely was good but in his
absence probably someone else would create that tone. Musically and
technically he was acceptable, he himself admitted to be extremely
limited by his lack of theory knowledge. Don't get me wrong, I like
Hendrix and I think that he had a great influence to other musicians
but that's it. Being influenced doens't mean that you're a replica of
a given musician. And what about Jimi himself ? He was sure influenced by
other guitarists. Are they the greatest guitarist in the whole world ?
The musical talent of people like Blackmore or Vai or Satriani is so
big that they would be probably a little different without Hendrix, or
they would have developed a certain vocabulary in a different time but
they show a musical range that is much wider that Hendrix's. There no
need to trash him nor to overrate his influence or ability. He his an
important milestone in music history but other musicians have given a
much bigger contribution to the evolution of music.
Jeffrey Potoff
Paolo Ciccone wrote:
>
>
> The musical talent of people like Blackmore or Vai or Satriani is so
> big that they would be probably a little different without Hendrix, or
> they would have developed a certain vocabulary in a different time but
> they show a musical range that is much wider that Hendrix's. There no
> need to trash him nor to overrate his influence or ability. He his an
> important milestone in music history but other musicians have given a
> much bigger contribution to the evolution of music.
>
They show a musical range much greater than Hendirx ?! Are
you out of your mind ? Go find the Electric Ladyland album,
listen to it, and then come back and tell us about his
'musical range'. Satriani and Vai are both fine guitarists, but
can they play blues ? No ! I've seen them make attempts and
they are pathetic at best. Can they play jazz ? Maybe, but
I haven't heard them do so. Country ? Nope. Bluegrass ? Nope.
R+B ? I don't think so. Satriani and Vai are both very typical
metal/shred guitarists who are good at what they do, but that's
about it.
Jeff
funky stuff
by majority of popular music magazines, prince/O(+> is held as the most
underrated guitarist of his generation. email 4 more info.
may u live 2 see the dawn,
funky stuff
Adam Cook
>>
>> OK, boy genius, YOU change the world of guitar permanently. Either
>> that or play the solo from Voodoo Chile/Slight Return, note for note.
>>
It would certainly be easier than Eric Johnson's Cliffs of Dover, or
Vai's For the Love of God. Just have to nail down all the feedback and
stuff.
>> Anyone ever notice that the asswipes who dump on Hendrix are always
>> fans of these metal noodler finger-tapper big hair guitarists?
The guitarists I listen to finger tap and (some) have long hair, does
that make them bad? I love hendrix too, but his hair was much bigger
than Vai's or Satch's is these days :) He had some serious fro action
going on. As you can see, image has nothing to do with a person's
playing. Hey, if the 60's never existed, and you saw a guy looking
like hendrix walking down the street, wouldn't you laugh?
Adam Cook
Jeffrey Potoff <jpo...@latoso.cheme.cornell.edu> wrote:
>>
>They show a musical range much greater than Hendirx ?! Are
>you out of your mind ? Go find the Electric Ladyland album,
>listen to it, and then come back and tell us about his
>'musical range'. Satriani and Vai are both fine guitarists, but
>can they play blues ? No ! I've seen them make attempts and
>they are pathetic at best.
You mean Satch's latest? That's good as any blues I've heard (I've
heard enough to compare, so don't ask). People knock on metal players
for being repetitive <cough>Yngwie<cough> but blues players have been
playing the same thing for decades, and everybody calls it soulful and
wonderful. I'm not knocking blues, it's fine, I just don't like it.
>Can they play jazz ? Maybe, but
>I haven't heard them do so. Country ? Nope. Bluegrass ? Nope.
>R+B ? I don't think so. Satriani and Vai are both very typical
>metal/shred guitarists who are good at what they do, but that's
>about it.
>Jeff
What's your point? I don't know any guitarists who have recorded all
of those different styles throughout their career. Steve Morse has
come close though.
Pete Wiley
Definately Brian May----
Marcos Fajardo Orellana
Adam Cook wrote:
>
> Jeffrey Potoff <jpo...@latoso.cheme.cornell.edu> wrote:
>
> ...
>
> >Can they play jazz ? Maybe, but
> >I haven't heard them do so. Country ? Nope. Bluegrass ? Nope.
> >R+B ? I don't think so. Satriani and Vai are both very typical
> >metal/shred guitarists who are good at what they do, but that's
> >about it.
>
> >Jeff
>
> What's your point? I don't know any guitarists who have recorded all
> of those different styles throughout their career. Steve Morse has
> come close though.
And what about Eric Johnson? i think he has touched all those styles
and then some - he has even attempted some Flamenco
Gerd Weyhing
Yeah, didn't he play guitar on Kate Bush's _The Dreaming_ ???
Great Guy, really. Especially on _Pulling Out The Pin_.
His Guitar sounds as if it was recorded in a helicopter !!!
Gerd
=:-#
Paolo Ciccone
I didn't get the post from Jeffrey so I continue from here.
ac...@tiac.net (Adam Cook) writes:
> Jeffrey Potoff <jpo...@latoso.cheme.cornell.edu> wrote:
>
> >>
> >They show a musical range much greater than Hendirx ?! Are
> >you out of your mind ? Go find the Electric Ladyland album,
> >listen to it, and then come back and tell us about his
> >'musical range'.
No, I'm not out of my mind and I've already listened to Hendrix many
times. On the other hand Jeffrey doesn't seem to have listened to
the people that he criticizes.
> Satriani and Vai are both fine guitarists, but
> >can they play blues ? No ! I've seen them make attempts and
> >they are pathetic at best.
This is degenerating, as usual. And that's exactly what I think is
unacceptable. You can criticize anybody *except* Hendrix. When we
close our eyes and ears and elect a person to the status of semi-god,
this is the end of the music. The relevance of playing the blues is,
in my opinion, nothing. That's exactly what I meant with musical
range. If you consider a musician good only if she/he plays the blues
that's very restrictive. I don't like jazz but I have a great respect
for jazz musicians and I would never judge their musicianship because
they are tied to a music style. When I was talking about musical range
I had in mind the production of Vai or Blackmore or Frip. Listen, if
you want, to the diversity of songs like "For the love of God" ,
"Liberty", "Sisters", "The animal", "The boy from Seattle" (rings a
bell ?) and "Bad Horsie". For Blackmore is the same, compare the hard
rock of "Highway star" to the blues in "Lazy", "Mitzy Dupree",
"Mistreated", "Catch the Rainbow" and the incredible structure of the
solo in "The Gates of Babilon". Those are people that learned from
Jimi but went a lot further.
We should avoid competition about musicians, I didn't say "Hendrix was
mediocre, Vai is better". I just said that, in my opinion, Hendrix is
overrated. And indeed he is because he is considered more that he
was. That doesn't take away any merit he has, we all know that he has
been an incredible influence in music but other people have done much
more and still don't have the same recognition. What about Buddy Guy
for example. He surely can play the blues and Jimi was influenced by
him. Let's erect a temple in his honor and listen to his music
whatever it is.
> >Can they play jazz ? Maybe, but
> >I haven't heard them do so.
Well, listen with more care. There's a lot of Jazz influence in Vai's
songs. It's not immediate but many progressions come from Jazz scales
more than from tipical rock pentatonics. They are just so well
integrated that they sound more interesting inside a rock context but
there's a big Jazz influence. The new project of Blackmore is about
Reinnasance music. Not the mixture proposed by Yngwie but music
written in the style of that era (Blackmore can play the cello).
> Country ? Nope. Bluegrass ? Nope.
> >R+B ? I don't think so.
You can't be serious asking this, how many musicians you know that
play so many styles. And what's the point ?
> Satriani and Vai are both very typical
> >metal/shred guitarists who are good at what they do, but that's
> >about it.
That shows how little, if any, time you spent listening to those
people. Please give us some examples (song titles please) of tipical
metal/shred played by those guys. I guess that Paganini and
Tchaicowsky (sp?) could be defined as "shred" musicians by you.
Take care,
Brian John Wright
k Kim Thayil. I don't get it.
-Brian
Chowderhead
I agree with Paolo, to appreciate Hendrix you need to be aware of the times
and he was the most innovative at the time. Noone had done his stuff
before, at least not like Jimi! A lot of people can play his stuff. There
are a lot of good guitar players in the world , people who can play scales,
know the theory, etc.Personally I like SRVs renditions of a lot of his
stuff. Hendrix influenced a hell of a lot of musicians and help set the
course to heavy rock. He did more than out -of - tune whammy bar stuff too.
One of my favorites is the instrumental from the woodstock album ( anyone
else remember? ) Its the one he goes into after the Star Spangled Banner.
I dont know too many of these newer players to make a fair comparison but I
guess there are some that inspire young players today and thats cool! I saw
Joe Satriana on MTV Unplugged who had to go on before SRV. What a thing to
do to somebody! After Stevie played it was like Joe WHO? Oh, did he play
tonight too? But I should listen to some more of his stuff to make a
judgement. Its just that after that night I wasn't interested anymore.
People like what they like, its subjective. Its like arguing what is the
worlds greatest vegetable? Some people like Page some Vai some Winter some
SRV blah blah blah. I just listen to stuff that does something for me.
Paolo Ciccone wrote in article ..
> I agree and disagree at the same time. Hendrix had the merit to
> clearly show what an electric guitar could do when pushed to the
> limit. He showed us how to break some barriers but I believe he was
> just the right man at the right moment. He surely was good but in his
> absence probably someone else would create that tone. Musically and
> technically he was acceptable, he himself admitted to be extremely
> limited by his lack of theory knowledge. Don't get me wrong, I like
> Hendrix and I think that he had a great influence to other musicians
> but that's it. Being influenced doens't mean that you're a replica of
> a given musician. And what about Jimi himself ? He was sure influenced by
> other guitarists. Are they the greatest guitarist in the whole world ?
>
> The musical talent of people like Blackmore or Vai or Satriani is so
> big that they would be probably a little different without Hendrix, or
> they would have developed a certain vocabulary in a different time but
> they show a musical range that is much wider that Hendrix's. There no
> need to trash him nor to overrate his influence or ability. He his an
> important milestone in music history but other musicians have given a
> much bigger contribution to the evolution of music.
>
>
> Paolo
Brandon
Words very well spoken...
Paolo Ciccone <pcic...@borland.com> wrote in article
<wkafupo...@genghis.borland.com.borland.com>...
> jcro...@rigel.oac.uci.edu (Jeremy Michael Crosbie) writes:
>
> > Besides the point of Hendrix-dumpers being fans of "metal noodler"
guitarists,
> > let's put this in perspective:
> >
> > Satch started playing guitar because of Jimi Hendrix (it is even said
that Satch
> > started playing the day Hendrix died). If Satch ahd not the heard
Hendrix, we
> > can probably assume we would not have a Joe Satriani.
> >
> > it is also well known that Kirk Hammett was taught by Joe Satriani. Do
you see
> > what I am getting at?
> >
> > Hendrix influenced many musicians and non-musicians alike. If not for
Hendrix we
> > would not have some of the greatest (and worst) guitar players we have
now.
>
> I agree and disagree at the same time. Hendrix had the merit to
> clearly show what an electric guitar could do when pushed to the
> limit. He showed us how to break some barriers but I believe he was
> just the right man at the right moment. He surely was good but in his
> absence probably someone else would create that tone. Musically and
> technically he was acceptable, he himself admitted to be extremely
> limited by his lack of theory knowledge. Don't get me wrong, I like
> Hendrix and I think that he had a great influence to other musicians
> but that's it. Being influenced doens't mean that you're a replica of
> a given musician. And what about Jimi himself ? He was sure influenced by
> other guitarists. Are they the greatest guitarist in the whole world ?
>
> The musical talent of people like Blackmore or Vai or Satriani is so
> big that they would be probably a little different without Hendrix, or
> they would have developed a certain vocabulary in a different time but
> they show a musical range that is much wider that Hendrix's. There no
> need to trash him nor to overrate his influence or ability. He his an
> important milestone in music history but other musicians have given a
> much bigger contribution to the evolution of music.
>
>
> Paolo
>
>
Adam Cook
Marcos Fajardo Orellana <mfaj...@freenet.hut.fi> wrote:
>Adam Cook wrote:
>>
>> Jeffrey Potoff <jpo...@latoso.cheme.cornell.edu> wrote:
>>
>> >Can they play jazz ? Maybe, but
>> >I haven't heard them do so. Country ? Nope. Bluegrass ? Nope.
>> >R+B ? I don't think so. Satriani and Vai are both very typical
>> >metal/shred guitarists who are good at what they do, but that's
>> >about it.
>>
>> >Jeff
>>
>> What's your point? I don't know any guitarists who have recorded all
>> of those different styles throughout their career. Steve Morse has
>> come close though.
>And what about Eric Johnson? i think he has touched all those styles
>and then some - he has even attempted some Flamenco
Bluegrass? R&B? Straight ahead jazz? I don't think so. Eric has
elements of all of these styles in his music, but like I said, no
guitarist has ever mastered every style. So there's no point in
shooting down a player for not being versitile in each one.
Elliot Iver
Paolo Ciccone wrote:
>
The relevance of playing the blues is,
in my opinion, nothing. That's exactly what I meant with musical
> range. If you consider a musician good only if she/he plays the blues
> that's very restrictive. I don't like jazz but I have a great respect
> for jazz musicians and I would never judge their musicianship because
> they are tied to a music style. When I was talking about musical range
>
Here's a guy who thinks that blues, the basis of all jazz and rock is irrelevant,
yet thinks PRODUCTION is evidence of musical range. Amazing!
Elliot
Paolo Ciccone
Elliot Iver <kki...@students.wisc.edu> writes:
That's not what I meant. Read again, I said "the relevance of
*playing* the blues..", not "the relevance of blues". Avoid prejudice
and you'll get the meaning of what I said. My answer was related to the
question "Can they play the blues ?". Every baby knows that blues is
the foundation of rock but that are a lot of good musicians that play
good rock but they don't feel the blues. The same is valid the other
way around, there are amazing blues players that don't feel the rock'n
roll. When I said "musical range" I referred to the different
"musical terrotories" explored by the musicians nominated. And that's
interesting because all of them, together with other people like May,
Frip, Santana etc., found new ways of playing rock guitar. Now, I
believe those people deserve at least the same consideration of
Hendrix if not more. Just look what was the music at the time of
Jimi and look what it is now. I think the difference is pretty obvious
but if one prefers to limit him/herself it's not my problem.
Take care,
Patrick M. McMillin
Paolo Ciccone (pcic...@borland.com) wrote:
: I know it will cause a lot of flame but... Jimi Hendrix, while
: defitely good, is, in my opinion, highly overrated.
Can you even fathom this kind of lunacy ? This is precisely
why alt.guitar is one of the most hated groups on the net...
Pmc
bul...@acadiacom.net
ac...@tiac.net (Adam Cook) wrote:
>>Can they play jazz ? Maybe, but
>>I haven't heard them do so. Country ? Nope. Bluegrass ? Nope.
>>R+B ? I don't think so. Satriani and Vai are both very typical
>>metal/shred guitarists who are good at what they do, but that's
>>about it.
>>Jeff
>What's your point? I don't know any guitarists who have recorded all
>of those different styles throughout their career. Steve Morse has
>come close though.
Try Steve Howe and Jerry Garcia.
Adam Cook
bul...@acadiacom.net wrote:
>Try Steve Howe and Jerry Garcia.
Funny, I've never heard them play neoclassical shred...
GTRXMAN
Mike Campbell of Tom Petty's Heartbreakers. Name another guitarist with
so many hit melodies that can be instantly recgonized by
anyone............
Didn't think you could.
EP
doo...@airmail.net
On Wed, 18 Sep 1996 01:47:16 GMT, ac...@tiac.net (Adam Cook) wrote:
>
>>Can they play jazz ? Maybe, but
>>I haven't heard them do so. Country ? Nope. Bluegrass ? Nope.
>>R+B ? I don't think so.
>
>What's your point? I don't know any guitarists who have recorded all
>of those different styles throughout their career.
>
>
Jerry Garcia has, at one time or another, played in all those styles
on record.
EdBong
Rick Brown
How about Lindsay Buckingham? I was listening to a solo cd of his recently,
and was pretty inpressed with some of his playing.
In article <52fjn3$q...@newsbf02.news.aol.com>, cfish...@aol.com (CFisher000)
wrote:
>>by majority of popular music magazines, prince/O(+> is held as the most
>>underrated guitarist of his generation. email 4 more info.
>
>Using Prince (or whatever the symbol is) and guitarist in the sentence is
>already overrating prince. He is a good songwriter but a sorry guitarist.
>
jnf
CFisher000 wrote:
>
> I think Robin Trower is very underrated. Anyone that had never heard him
> should listen to 'Bridge of Sighs ( released 1974) or the Long Misty Days
> (1976).
>
> Others: Johnny Winter, Robben Ford, Elvin Bishop, Gary Moore.
I couldn't agree more. I have seen Robin Trower 5 times, and he is
absolutely mesmerizing. People have given Trower shit for sounding too
much like Hendrix. To those people, I say Fuck-Off (Capitalized).
Hendrix being the man whop changed forever, would only naturally
generate a whole school of guitar. Robin is a master of playing a simple
chord or chord progression and using his effects to change and twist the
sound to the max.
To any guitarist in a grunge band, I would like to see you perform to
1/2 the level of abaility or FEEL that Robin Trower has. At over 50, he
still tours and without a doubt a master of his chosen instrument!
Check out the link:http://www.inforamp.net/~suth/trower/
--
John Francis | j...@axionet.com
Specialist in sound files, answering machine messages, voice overs,
impersonations
"Next time we have sex Lumati style!" Coreleillmurzon to Ivanova....Acts
of Sacricrice.
http://www.clinet.fi/~jjazz/music/Frank_Marino/
--
Daddy-O
Rick Brown wrote:
>
> How about Lindsay Buckingham? I was listening to a solo cd of his recently,
> and was pretty inpressed with some of his playing.
>
from a blues/rock base like almost everybody else. No matter what you
think of Fleetwood Mac, Buckingham's always been an original writer &
player.
Daddy-O
Carlos Grau
Elliot Iver <kki...@students.wisc.edu> wrote:
>Paolo Ciccone wrote:
>>
> The relevance of playing the blues is,
> in my opinion, nothing. That's exactly what I meant with musical
>> range. If you consider a musician good only if she/he plays the blues
>> that's very restrictive. I don't like jazz but I have a great respect
>> for jazz musicians and I would never judge their musicianship because
>> they are tied to a music style. When I was talking about musical range
>> I had in mind the production of .....
>>
>
>
>
>
>
> Here's a guy who thinks that blues, the basis of all jazz and rock is irrelevant,
>yet thinks PRODUCTION is evidence of musical range. Amazing!
>
>
>
>Elliot
I happen to agree. In my mind, Satriani is all technique and no sense
of music. In other words, just empty playing. But then there's no
accounting for taste.
Carlos Grau
"Chowderhead" <tba...@gate.net> wrote:
>I agree with Paolo, to appreciate Hendrix you need to be aware of the times
>and he was the most innovative at the time. Noone had done his stuff
>before, at least not like Jimi! A lot of people can play his stuff. There
>are a lot of good guitar players in the world , people who can play scales,
>know the theory, etc.Personally I like SRVs renditions of a lot of his
>stuff. Hendrix influenced a hell of a lot of musicians and help set the
>course to heavy rock. He did more than out -of - tune whammy bar stuff too.
>One of my favorites is the instrumental from the woodstock album ( anyone
>else remember? ) Its the one he goes into after the Star Spangled Banner.
>
>I dont know too many of these newer players to make a fair comparison but I
>guess there are some that inspire young players today and thats cool! I saw
>Joe Satriana on MTV Unplugged who had to go on before SRV. What a thing to
>do to somebody! After Stevie played it was like Joe WHO? Oh, did he play
>tonight too? But I should listen to some more of his stuff to make a
>judgement. Its just that after that night I wasn't interested anymore.
>
>People like what they like, its subjective. Its like arguing what is the
>worlds greatest vegetable? Some people like Page some Vai some Winter some
>SRV blah blah blah. I just listen to stuff that does something for me.
>
>Paolo Ciccone wrote in article ..
>> I agree and disagree at the same time. Hendrix had the merit to
>> clearly show what an electric guitar could do when pushed to the
>> limit. He showed us how to break some barriers but I believe he was
>> just the right man at the right moment. He surely was good but in his
>> absence probably someone else would create that tone. Musically and
>> technically he was acceptable, he himself admitted to be extremely
>> limited by his lack of theory knowledge. Don't get me wrong, I like
>> Hendrix and I think that he had a great influence to other musicians
>> but that's it. Being influenced doens't mean that you're a replica of
>> a given musician. And what about Jimi himself ? He was sure influenced by
>> other guitarists. Are they the greatest guitarist in the whole world ?
>>
>> The musical talent of people like Blackmore or Vai or Satriani is so
>> big that they would be probably a little different without Hendrix, or
>> they would have developed a certain vocabulary in a different time but
>> they show a musical range that is much wider that Hendrix's. There no
>> need to trash him nor to overrate his influence or ability. He his an
>> important milestone in music history but other musicians have given a
>> much bigger contribution to the evolution of music.
>>
>>
>> Paolo
>
SRV was the last great guitar player alive. Ok, Beck is still alive,
but does he PLAY?
Joe Satriani is not qualified to carry SRV guitar case.
Carlos Grau
Paolo Ciccone <pcic...@borland.com> wrote:
>Elliot Iver <kki...@students.wisc.edu> writes:
>
>
>> Paolo Ciccone wrote:
>> >
>> The relevance of playing the blues is,
>> in my opinion, nothing. That's exactly what I meant with musical
>> > range. If you consider a musician good only if she/he plays the blues
>> > that's very restrictive. I don't like jazz but I have a great respect
>> > for jazz musicians and I would never judge their musicianship because
>> > they are tied to a music style. When I was talking about musical range
>> > I had in mind the production of .....
>> >
>>
>> Here's a guy who thinks that blues, the basis of all jazz and rock is irrelevant,
>> yet thinks PRODUCTION is evidence of musical range. Amazing!
>
>That's not what I meant. Read again, I said "the relevance of
>*playing* the blues..", not "the relevance of blues". Avoid prejudice
>and you'll get the meaning of what I said. My answer was related to the
>question "Can they play the blues ?". Every baby knows that blues is
>the foundation of rock but that are a lot of good musicians that play
>good rock but they don't feel the blues. The same is valid the other
>way around, there are amazing blues players that don't feel the rock'n
>roll. When I said "musical range" I referred to the different
>"musical terrotories" explored by the musicians nominated. And that's
>interesting because all of them, together with other people like May,
>Frip, Santana etc., found new ways of playing rock guitar. Now, I
>believe those people deserve at least the same consideration of
>Hendrix if not more. Just look what was the music at the time of
>Jimi and look what it is now. I think the difference is pretty obvious
>but if one prefers to limit him/herself it's not my problem.
>
>Take care,
>
>
> Paolo
>
>--
>The opinions expressed here are exclusively my own
>
Well if you ask me, comparing Vai or Satriani to Hendrix is like
comparing Leroy Nieman to Picasso. But you're entitled to your
opinion. Maybe the problem is you just weren't here when Hendrix was.
He was a god.
Carlos Grau
ac...@tiac.net (Adam Cook) wrote:
and hopefully never will.
I like that neoclassical shred. another word for playing scales as
fast as humanly possible.
Ken Axe
I was hoping someone would say that!!
CFisher000
>Well, listen with more care. There's a lot of Jazz influence in Vai's
>songs. It's not immediate but many progressions come from Jazz scales
>more than from tipical rock pentatonics. They are just so well
>integrated that they sound more interesting inside a rock context but
>there's a big Jazz influence.
Just because Vai doesn't draws from scales other than pentatonic doesn't
mean he's a jazz player or jazz influenced. Jazz is an entirely different
art form than what Vai is doing. Jazz players draw a lot of ideas from
pentatonic and just like in rock music a good jazz player can also play
some great blues (Listen to Charlie Parker play Parker's mood for
example). Hey, Star Spangle Banner doesn't use pentatonic, it must be jazz
influenced.
>> Satriani and Vai are both very typical
>> >metal/shred guitarists who are good at what they do, but that's
>> >about it.
>That shows how little, if any, time you spent listening to those
>people. Please give us some examples (song titles please) of tipical
>metal/shred played by those guys. I guess that Paganini and
>Tchaicowsky (sp?) could be defined as "shred" musicians by you.
Shred musicians typically just use a lot of boring and predictable
sequences. There's really not much inventiveness and they hide their lack
of musicianship with a lot of distortion and pedals. Just listen and see
how exciting some of these guys sound unplugged .There playing isn't very
melodic, creative or musical. Hell, my computer can make sequences.
Hendrix was a great blues player. Red House is one of the all time
greatest blues cuts I've heard and it influenced a lot players. Hendrix
could had made a good career just being a good blues player but his
interest ran deeper. His rendetion of the Star Spangle Banner really
reflected the mood and the attitude of his time. Machine Gun, Vodoo Chile,
Electric Ladyland, Little Wing really took the rock guitar to a new
standard. Yes Buddy Guy is a great blues player but he only plays the
blues. Also, Richie Blackmore playing Lazy--is not blues.
Jack Pfister
> Others: Johnny Winter, Robben Ford, Elvin Bishop, Gary Moore.
'Aint nobody plays slide guitar better or faster than Johnny Winter. Has
an odd style, using the plectrum and all, but he certainly got some
speed out of that Firebird he played in the '70s.
Carlos Grau
cfish...@aol.com (CFisher000) wrote:
I agree with everything you write, but there's not much point in
trying to convert the shredders/scale players. There's just no
accounting for taste.
Krishnendu Dutt-Mazumdar
Jack Pfister (pfi...@pfizer.com) wrote:
: > Others: Johnny Winter, Robben Ford, Elvin Bishop, Gary Moore.
:
:
: 'Aint nobody plays slide guitar better or faster than Johnny Winter. Has
: an odd style, using the plectrum and all, but he certainly got some
: speed out of that Firebird he played in the '70s.
--
==============================================================================
ka...@WPI.EDU
Simba D-M
Muddied, Watered, Rolled & Stoned
==============================================================================
GTRXMAN
My vote goes for Mike Campbell, lead guitar of Tom Petty's Heartbreakers.
Can anyone else name a guitarist whose work is so well known, yet who is
still basically unknown?
Ed
Daddy-O
Hear, hear. One of the tastiest guitarists in the universe, and always
makes *sure* his parts fit the song precisely. Great choice.
Daddy-O
cit...@epix.net
GTRXMAN (gtr...@aol.com) wrote:
: My vote goes for Mike Campbell, lead guitar of Tom Petty's Heartbreakers.
: Can anyone else name a guitarist whose work is so well known, yet who is
: still basically unknown?
One guitarist that stands out in my mind is Roger Steen from The Tubes. I
know Roger irl and I remember him playing the Parker Fly prototypes long
before the public ever saw them. His playing, in my opinion, ranks up
there with the best. Some of the things I've heard him do live have been
totally mind-blowing.
Tom Farrington
Have to agree 100% with this and add that very few guitarists play (CAN
play?!?) with MC's restraint and taste. His ability to create
immediately recognizable, signature riffs and fills that fit perfectly
into the song is uncanny. His work on "The Waiting" knocks me out every
time I hear it!
Best,
Tom
P.S. Plus he uses cool guitars!
GTRXMAN wrote:
>
> My vote goes for Mike Campbell, lead guitar of Tom Petty's Heartbreakers.
> Can anyone else name a guitarist whose work is so well known, yet who is
> still basically unknown?
>
> Ed
chud
Frank Zappa (most of the general public don't even know he PLAYED
guitar). Johnny Ramone (Ramones). Joe Strummer (The Clash). Steve Jones
(Sex Pistols). Stephen Egerton (ALL/Descendents). Dr. Frank (Mr. T
Experience). Most of these guys ain't flashy soloists but are either 1.
extrememly influental to a lot of people or 2. great songwriters.
--
chud
http://www.kiva.net/~coppingz
Stuff and Junk Magazine:
It's really a lot of rubbish, innit?
morningstar
Decent songwriter. Adequate guitar player. The greatest? I'm assuming
you're joking. If not, I'll take 10 pounds of the drug your on delivered
to MY doorstep as well. Steve
John Sheehy
morningstar <morni...@mc.net> writes:
If there were a clue as to what you were responding to, or who the
player you had in mind was, we might be able to comment, but you seem to
have started your own thread without a parent post, and didn't include
any of the text you were responding to.
<>>< ><<> ><<> <>>< ><<> <>>< <>>< ><<>
John P Sheehy <jsh...@ix.netcom.com>
><<> <>>< <>>< ><<> <>>< ><<> ><<> <>><
Dugg Taeler
Gavin Cooper
Sorry, but it has to be said that the most over-rated guitarist of all
time was Hendrix.
Now Dimebag, there's a brilliant guitarist.
Ed
Gavin Cooper <gj...@ukc.ac.uk> wrote:
I'm not even gonna bother flaming this dumb fuck, I'll leave it to
the rest of you to show him his ignorance.
check out my homepage and guitar links at www.cajunnet.com/~epguidry
Mark Garvin
>Sorry, but it has to be said that the most over-rated guitarist of all
>time was Hendrix.
>Now Dimebag, there's a brilliant guitarist.
Evidently you've never heard of Slim Whitman. He taught Dimebag
everything he knows! Even the legendary Boxcar Willy has acknowledged
Slim as the best guitarist in the universe as we know it.
MG
Thomas C. Clancy
>>Sorry, but it has to be said that the most over-rated guitarist of all
>>time was Hendrix.
>>Now Dimebag, there's a brilliant guitarist.
>
>Evidently you've never heard of Slim Whitman. He taught Dimebag
>everything he knows! Even the legendary Boxcar Willy has acknowledged
>Slim as the best guitarist in the universe as we know it.
You never know. Jerry Reed and Roy Clark are most famous with the
general public as comedy actors. Glen Campbell was a studio
guitarist before he became the rhinestone cowboy.
Whitman might be a pretty good bluegrass player? Supposedly,
he actually was one of the greats at that yodeling style he did,
even though it seems like a joke.
Analyst
On Fri, 01 Nov 1996 17:38:43 GMT, epgu...@cajunnet.com (Ed) babbled:
>Gavin Cooper <gj...@ukc.ac.uk> wrote:
>
>>Sorry, but it has to be said that the most over-rated guitarist of all
>>time was Hendrix.
>>Now Dimebag, there's a brilliant guitarist.
>the rest of you to show him his ignorance.
Yeah....bonehead...you should learn to play some Hendrix and realize
how he phrased chords and progressed the melody of the song using
notes and blending leads with his chord progressions....
hmm...that doesn't sound as clear as I'd like to express it, but
learn something like castles in the sand....especially the verses...
and you'll see what I mean.
austin_player
On Fri, 01 Nov 1996 11:50:54 +0000, Gavin Cooper <gj...@ukc.ac.uk>
wrote:
>Sorry, but it has to be said that the most over-rated guitarist of all
>time was Hendrix.
>Now Dimebag, there's a brilliant guitarist.
say what you dont know what you are talking about in a recent
interview who was it that DB looked up to and who is the "father" of
the rock / metal guitar?? use your head almost every lead solo or for
that matter power chord was thought out or started my jimi, also who
was the first player to use the now standard wah wah or cry baby pedal
jimi think before you speak!!!!!
simon_marx
> jimi, also who was the first player to use the now standard wah wah
or cry >baby pedal
Sorry, but Eric "Slowhand" Clapton was fiest with the wah wah pedal,
using it on Cream's "Tale of Brave Ulysees" so - cuss !
Simon
JohnDoe
Simon Marx wrote:
>Simon
Sorry 'bout your sorry- I saw them both in those days, Jimi was playing
with wah on his first (headline) tour, Cream didn't, and they came out about
the same time. Jimi's use of it was more creative/ experimental than
Clapton's, too.
John Darsey
jda...@garlic.com
__________________
Eschew Obfuscation
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Carl Fiadino
with it first.
We'll have to check with Ceasar Diez, noted bullshit artist, about
things he has no knowledge of!!! Carl
Aardvark
In article <56o3ne$r...@bcs3.bccom.com>, Carl Fiadino <fia...@bccom.com>
says:
I'm bettin that if it was recorded and electric ZAPPA did it first
Robb Scott
> Simon Marx wrote:
>
> >> jimi, also who was the first player to use the now standard wah wah
> >or cry >baby pedal
>
>
> >Sorry, but Eric "Slowhand" Clapton was fiest with the wah wah pedal,
> >using it on Cream's "Tale of Brave Ulysees" so - cuss !
>
> >Simon
>
> Sorry 'bout your sorry- I saw them both in those days, Jimi was playing
> with wah on his first (headline) tour, Cream didn't, and they came out about
> the same time. Jimi's use of it was more creative/ experimental than
> Clapton's, too.
> John Darsey
> jda...@garlic.com
FWIW, Chet Atkins claims to have used a wah-like pedal of his own design,
back in the fifties. This is from a GP interview from a few years ago.
According to him it didn't have the pronounced resonance of the 60s units,
it was more of a glorified tone control.......rs
___________________________________________
"If you take cranberries and stew 'em like applesauce
it tastes more like prunes than rhubarb does".
........Groucho
"Honk!"
........Harpo
___________________________________________
hvacdude
In article <56r6jm$9...@wormer.fn.net>, jem...@feist.com says...
>>>Simon Marx wrote:
>>>
>>>>> jimi, also who was the first player to use the now standard wah wah
>>>>or cry >baby pedal
>>>
>>>
>>>>Sorry, but Eric "Slowhand" Clapton was fiest with the wah wah pedal,
>>>>using it on Cream's "Tale of Brave Ulysees" so - cuss !
>>>
>>>>Simon
>>>
>>>Sorry 'bout your sorry- I saw them both in those days, Jimi was
>playing
>>>with wah on his first (headline) tour, Cream didn't, and they came out
>about
>>>the same time. Jimi's use of it was more creative/ experimental than
>>>Clapton's, too.
>>>John Darsey
>>>jda...@garlic.com
>>>Eschew Obfuscation
>>>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>>>
>>Hendrix may have used it "live" first, but I think Clapton recorded
>>with it first.
>>We'll have to check with Ceasar Diez, noted bullshit artist, about
>>things he has no knowledge of!!! Carl
>>
>
>
>I'm bettin that if it was recorded and electric ZAPPA did it first
rat...@conval.edu
FI>>jda...@garlic.com
FI>>__________________
FI>>Eschew Obfuscation
FI>>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
FI>>
FI>Hendrix may have used it "live" first, but I think Clapton recorded
FI>with it first.
FI>We'll have to check with Ceasar Diez, noted bullshit artist, about
FI>things he has no knowledge of!!! Carl
You know, I bet that isn't a Wah pedal Clapton was using, but a
device built by Diaz called the wah wave. Yea, that's it. And Jimi
didn't use no fuzzface, it was actually a Diaz square wave.
;)
MJL
bar...@ix.netcom.com (hvacdude) wrote:
>In article <56r6jm$9...@wormer.fn.net>, jem...@feist.com says...
>>
>>In article <56o3ne$r...@bcs3.bccom.com>, Carl Fiadino <fia...@bccom.com>
>>says:
>>>
>>>jda...@garlic.com (JohnDoe) wrote:
>>>>Simon Marx wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>> jimi, also who was the first player to use the now standard wah wah
>>>>>or cry >baby pedal
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>Sorry, but Eric "Slowhand" Clapton was fiest with the wah wah pedal,
>>>>>using it on Cream's "Tale of Brave Ulysees" so - cuss !
>>>>
>>>>>Simon
>>>>
>>>>Sorry 'bout your sorry- I saw them both in those days, Jimi was
>>playing
>>>>with wah on his first (headline) tour, Cream didn't, and they came out
>>about
>>>>the same time. Jimi's use of it was more creative/ experimental than
>>>>Clapton's, too.
>>>>John Darsey
>>>>jda...@garlic.com
>>>>__________________
>>>>Eschew Obfuscation
>>>>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>>>>
>>>Hendrix may have used it "live" first, but I think Clapton recorded
>>>with it first.
>>>We'll have to check with Ceasar Diez, noted bullshit artist, about
>>>things he has no knowledge of!!! Carl
>>>
>>
>>
>>I'm bettin that if it was recorded and electric ZAPPA did it first
>fur sure,he even had a electric hero!
Your all wrong.... it was me !!!!!
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
Morgwn Quin McCarty
MJL wrote:
>
> bar...@ix.netcom.com (hvacdude) wrote:
>
> >In article <56r6jm$9...@wormer.fn.net>, jem...@feist.com says...
> >>
> >>In article <56o3ne$r...@bcs3.bccom.com>, Carl Fiadino <fia...@bccom.com>
> >>says:
> >>>
> >>>jda...@garlic.com (JohnDoe) wrote:
> >>>>Simon Marx wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>>> jimi, also who was the first player to use the now standard wah wah
> >>>>>or cry >baby pedal
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>Sorry, but Eric "Slowhand" Clapton was fiest with the wah wah pedal,
> >>>>>using it on Cream's "Tale of Brave Ulysees" so - cuss !
some of that stuff off "shout at the devil" - really, really bad.
PhreNeTiK
ja...@fascination.com (James Forest) wrote:
>In article <4mo4b5$g...@mark.ucdavis.edu>, ez04...@chip.ucdavis.edu (Andrew Hinton) says:
>>
>>
>> : > The most OVERRATED guitar player of ALL TIME is without a doubt:
>>: >
>>: > ERIC CLAPTON
>>: >
>>: > The call him slow hand, but its a nice way of saying the man has no
>>: > chops. Overrated to the max.
>>: > you need to eat some red meat and clear your mind. Clapton is not the
>>: most overrated guitarist around. Yngwie is. I first heard Mammarysteen
>>: I was impressed, for about the first 4 bars of Icarius Suite Opus 4,
>>: after about the 2nd or 3rd 64th note run, I was ready to puke. I would
>>: rather hear emotion, and when Clapton plays I feel every note. Speed has
>>: its place, but... its good if you can hear the notes.
>>:
>>: Yngwie has technical skill, but that isn't everything.
>>:
>>: Chiao
>>: Guido the Sicilian Land Shark
>
> I don't really question anything that you said, but wish to point out
> that at the time when he was making records, he was the cutting edge
> of Rock guitar, he invented many of the riff's that you would call
> boring, that every guitar player in the world now knows how to play.
> But at the time he was the only one that knew how to play them, it was
> quite new, it was different, and it was exciting. In 20 years you will
> be defending Malmsteen to some 20 year old kid that thinks he plays
> simple shit that is boring, but you will know that when Malmsteen played
> with Steeler in LA night clubs in 1981 he was quite new, very different
> and yes, original.
About the most common-sense thing I have read in this thread so
far.....Eric might not do anything for you, but you wouldn't be
listening to what you do now in quite the same way if he hadn't
existed....nough said...
Morrison Paul W
PhreNeTiK (rcar...@clt.mindspring.com) wrote:
: ja...@fascination.com (James Forest) wrote:
:
: >In article <4mo4b5$g...@mark.ucdavis.edu>, ez04...@chip.ucdavis.edu (Andrew Hinton) says:
: >>
: >>
: >> : > The most OVERRATED guitar player of ALL TIME is without a doubt:
: >>: >
: >>: > ERIC CLAPTON
: >>: >
: >>: > The call him slow hand, but its a nice way of saying the man has no
: >>: > chops. Overrated to the max.
Being a good guitarist is not about how many notes one plays or how
quickly one plays them. A good guitarist can feel where a note needs to
be and put one there. Clapton does that. In my opinion, one of the best
guitar albums ever written is his unplugged album. It's filled with
tasty, bueatiful lines...
And why are we talking about guitarists this is a Bass chat!
Paul
Gerald Robert Overmyer
jaco
PhreNeTiK
ja...@fascination.com (James Forest) wrote:
>In article <4mo4b5$g...@mark.ucdavis.edu>, ez04...@chip.ucdavis.edu (Andrew Hinton) says:
>>
>>
>> : > The most OVERRATED guitar player of ALL TIME is without a doubt:
>>: >
>>: > ERIC CLAPTON
>>: >
>>: > The call him slow hand, but its a nice way of saying the man has no
>>: > chops. Overrated to the max.
Valerie
In <Pine.SOL.3.93.961127...@icarus.cc.uic.edu> Gerald
Robert Overmyer <gov...@icarus.cc.uic.edu> writes:
>
>
>jaco
>
>
Break out the fire extinguisher! Here come the flames!!!
Dave
Valerie
>About the most common-sense thing I have read in this thread so
>far.....Eric might not do anything for you, but you wouldn't be
>listening to what you do now in quite the same way if he hadn't
>existed....nough said...
>
at least a good player. However, back in the 60's he was phenomenal
when compared to his peers. He was a trailblazer, and this should not
be taken out of context. But his talent does not stop there. Eric
Clapton is also a good musician. While he may lack the chops of a
Yngwie, he makes this up tenfold in his ability to write songs and
convey his thoughts musically. He's still around because he's still
coming up with fresh new ideas. Remember, chops is only one part of the
muscial experience.
Dave