Happy holidays Kieth Adams.
Jay
Happy holidays Kieth, I hope your talking trash with Elvis and
pestering John Lennon about this cheap guitars and bothering Johnny
cash until he smacks you bothering Garcia because he "Should work on
his chords not so many effects"
Happy holidays Kieth Adams.
Fred
> Yep, he was so mean and often I hated him.
>
>
WeReo_ScoTTy
news:4b37ff58$0$5347$bbae...@news.suddenlink.net...
> Jay wrote:
>> Yep, he was so mean and often I hated him.
>>
> he's dead. get over it.
people despised him, and I did a bit in the beginning, but we got over it.
He died way too soon.
RIP Keith and Happy Holidays wherever you are, buddy.
Lord of all fevers and plagues
He might just say he'd cut your throat
Yet now he's gone he's really missed
Despite him acting like a scrote
He threatened Meat Plow on the group
With violence his usual plan
No one knew how low he'd stoop
Meat Plow just turned tail and ran
White Spirit pissed him off one day
Keith's answer was to get his gun
Said that he'd blow Spirit away
For Keefy that's what passed as fun
But Keef disliked Repair Guy most
For correcting all the crap he spoke
He'd contradict his every post
So Keefy said he'd make him choke
Now he's gone but not forgotten
Through Google's archives one may hunt
So that when poor Keef is lying rotten
You can read the words of a hateful cunt
WeReo_ScoTTy
message news:hh95u8$68q$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
BACONATER
"WeReo_ScoTTy" <scotta...@ixpres.com.no_spamm84037uj> wrote:
Well then PiGGy....u will LOVE this one:
*I Gate�d The PIG*
To the tune of: I Started a Joke by The Bee Gees
I gate�d The PIG
Which started the whole world laffing
But PEDOshine was too STUPID to see
IT was really AWL about ME, oh yes
I started to laff, which started the whole net laughing,
Oh, if I�d only seen that the PiGGy has fleas
I looked at the screen, wiping the tears from my eyes,
And I fell out of bed, Laffin� my ass off from things that I�d said.
Til the pig finally died, which started the whole world living,
Oh, if I�d only seen what a grand day that�d be
--
Shit Shat FaTTy Ass, give The PIG a Bone, this BIG FAT SLOB goes rolling home
PEDOTARD PIG FACE SHITSHINE the SMELLY GREASY CIRCUS PIG
& WORTHLESS DELUSIONAL LYING PATHETIC PATHOLOGICAL PERVERT�d
RABID FAT STUPID ReTARD�d PEDOPHILE WADDLING WARTHOG says WHAT???
Master Betty
"Lord of all fevers and plagues" <plague...@hotmail.com> wrote in
message news:hh95u8$68q$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
This whole thread is absurd on at least 3 levels.
1st: Obvious.
2nd: KA canonized?
3rd: Drum roll please......Rock and Roll Heaven?
I never understand which Heaven they are talking about. If it's Christian
then he's a rotting corpse until judgment day. Even in their "Jesus
sanitized" world. <ugh>
Spiny Norman
You needed a sock to post that? You're a class act, WS.
iL_weReo
wrote:
>
> - Show quoted text -
Yo man the dude's dead. Like the other dude said, get over it.
WartRemover
<dd4d1b5f-3498-4458...@r14g2000vbc.googlegroups.com>,
iL_weReo <calja...@yahoo.com> wrote:
...say PiGGy as the UGLY RETARD sticks up for ITs ASS SUCKER SOCK
--
oWo
|---|
Master Betty
"Spender" <Spe...@Mars.org> wrote in message
news:u3hgj5lrn76g5s6q9...@news.easynews.com...
> On Sun, 27 Dec 2009 21:43:20 -0600, "Master Betty" <em...@address.com>
> wrote:
>
>>I never understand which Heaven they are talking about. If it's Christian
>>then he's a rotting corpse until judgment day. Even in their "Jesus
>>sanitized" world. <ugh>
>
> Baptist Church type at that.
>
I'm going by the
http://www.cedcc.psu.edu/khanjan/europe_images/025_sistine%20chapel.jpg
> The majority take clues such as the parable of Lazurus and the Rich man
> seriously. Bodies die (or sleep as the NT puts it), spirits go home to the
> creator.
Are you telling me there is no judgment day? Isn't that the basis of
Christianity? What happen to the return of the messiah? Damn Baptist!
Greendistantstar
>> then he's a rotting corpse until judgment day. Even in their "Jesus
>> sanitized" world. <ugh>
>
> Baptist Church type at that.
Seventh Day Adventists, Jehovah's Witnesses and Christadelphians also believe the dead 'sleep' until
Judgement Day ie there is no 'soul' to ascend into heaven. 'Spirit' is not synonymous with 'soul'
if you're talking Biblical translation from Hebrew or Aramaic. The 'soul' concept they believe to be
a Platonic, not a Christian concept. The Westboro Baptist Church people are nothing more than
spiteful loons.
> The majority take clues such as the parable of Lazurus and the Rich man
> seriously. Bodies die (or sleep as the NT puts it), spirits go home to the
> creator.
Ask 'the majority' of Christians what becomes of them when they die, and they'll tell you that it's
straight to personal judgement before God, and then heaven or hell, with purgatory a possibility if
you're RC. They forget about all the dead rising at Judgement Day, presumeably as they don't see
themselves as part of that resurrected group...rising from the grave is *so* George A Romero ;>
It takes a somewhat prehistoric world view to subscribe to any of it. We are all made of star-stuff,
and even stars have life-cycles. To presume that we humans, made of the same constituents, can
somehow acquire an immortality denied to our molecular, atomic and sub-atomic antecedents is
scientifically naive and laughably anthropomorphic.
As to how God reconsitutes different people when so much matter is shared between the living and the
dead is never discussed. How will God resurrect a cannibal whose only constituents were created from
the consituents of others? Who has 'first dibs' on their 'own' matter?
We live, we die. It's quite simple; it only gets complicated when absurdities are introduced.
GDS
"Let's roll!"
White Spirit
> You needed a sock to post that? You're a class act, WS.
Why would you accuse me of reposting his eulogy? I have better things
to do with my time such as informing people about the destruction of
Britain.
Twibil
>
>
>
> >He threatened Meat Plow on the group
> >With violence his usual plan
> >No one knew how low he'd stoop
> >Meat Plow just turned tail and ran
>
He's confused.
He meant to say you *wrote* "Where Did You Run To".
"Nothing from something, was a real great thing
Trying to be someone maybe even trying to be something
Looking through the world with those big black eyes
Where did you run to, baby?
Where did you hide?"
- Mazzy Star
And he's (?) wrong about that, too.
Nil
> Where did I run to?
Your fingers ran from one key to another as you slapped him into place
once again.
Monster Zero
"Jay" <jayma...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:8507210d-96d1-4762...@j24g2000yqa.googlegroups.com...
Keith was a tortured soul with many demons and he insulted me a few times
but he also stepped up and helped me with guitar setups and lyrics and gave
me some great knowledge of which I've applied many times over now. If Keefy
hurt anyone's feewings by typed word over the internet then maybe those
people are too thin skinned?
POGO PUNY
Spender <Spe...@Mars.org> wrote:
> On Mon, 28 Dec 2009 00:02:57 -0600, "Master Betty" <ne...@mind.com> wrote:
>
> >Are you telling me there is no judgment day? Isn't that the basis of
> >Christianity? What happen to the return of the messiah? Damn Baptist!
>
> I didn't say there isn't a judgment day. I said that bodies stay in the
> ground (until the resurrection) while spirits go to the creator. As
> another example, consider what Christ said to the repentant thief on the
> cross. "Verily I say unto thee, today shalt thou be with me in paradise."
> That day he would be in paradise; not after the resurrection.
>
> Granted it is a really strained and contradictory mythology. Death vs
> sleep, soul vs spirit, Sheol vs Hades vs Gehenna, etc. Spirits being
> indestructible vs annihilationism.
>
> But Catholics especially believe in an immediately continued spiritual
> existence after the body dies. Why would they bother praying to saints if
> the saints were unconscious and rotting in the ground?
u & PEDOSHINE need to try that out and see if u's can report back???
Master Betty
"Spender" <Spe...@Mars.org> wrote in message
>>Christianity? What happen to the return of the messiah? Damn Baptist!
>
> ground (until the resurrection) while spirits go to the creator. As
> another example, consider what Christ said to the repentant thief on the
> cross. "Verily I say unto thee, today shalt thou be with me in paradise."
> That day he would be in paradise; not after the resurrection.
>
> Granted it is a really strained and contradictory mythology. Death vs
> sleep, soul vs spirit, Sheol vs Hades vs Gehenna, etc. Spirits being
> indestructible vs annihilationism.
>
> But Catholics especially believe in an immediately continued spiritual
> existence after the body dies. Why would they bother praying to saints if
> the saints were unconscious and rotting in the ground?
>
Just another contradiction to me.
Lord Valve
As long as the warped sumbitch stays dead, I can't really see any reason to
mention his name.
Lord Valve
iL_weReo
> On Mon, 28 Dec 2009 16:32:57 -0500, POGO PUNY <n...@bacon.org> wrote:
>
> >u & PEDOSHINE need to try that out and see if u's can report back???
>
Hey, the link works! I didn't know TeRRy made it to the DOJ. He's
nationwide! He's bigtime!
iL_weReo
I remember watching your videos.
iL_weReo
It's not nice to make fun of the dead.
Lord Valve
Piss off, creep.
jtees4
No question the guy could be a pain in the butt and/or an sob every
now and again....but once he became a friend he really became a
friend. I considered him an internet friend, even though I may not
have originally. When I started my website he was quick to join in and
offer me help. If he was an idiot to someone, it is kind of ridiculous
to bring him up in this way, makes them look small.
****
http://www.soundclick.com/bands/default.cfm?bandID=789610
http://www.reviewmymusicnow.com
White Spirit
> I remember watching your videos.
They don't make pretty viewing.
The Repair Guy
>Keith was a tortured soul with many demons and he
>insulted me a few times but he also stepped up and
>helped me with guitar setups and lyrics and gave me
>some great knowledge of which I've applied many
>times over now. If Keefy hurt anyone's feewings by
>typed word over the internet then maybe those
>people are too thin skinned?
"I was just sitting here and wondering how many
lined up heads a single 300 Winchester Magnum
round could splatter?" -K. Adams, tortured soul
The Repair Guy
repairguy1993 dot netfirms dot com
White Spirit
> "I was just sitting here and wondering how many
> lined up heads a single 300 Winchester Magnum
> round could splatter?" -K. Adams, tortured soul
Since everyone started saying nice things about him after he died, do
you think I'd get similar honours if I carked it?
Monster Zero
Greendistantstar
>
> (You forgot the 'slit your fucking throat' threats he made against some
> here).
The following poem by Keith now seems curiously apropos....
Dead Mans Guitar
7-30-07
Keith Adams
It's been held by drunkards
And knows how winos are
Strummed at the Square Garden
Seen waterfronts and bars
Carrying the voices
Of criminals and stars
Now I've got my hands upon
This old dead mans guitar
A dead man guides your fingers
And forms words on your tongue
Singing bout what used to be (chorus)
And things that aint yet done
Yeah you're looking lilly white
But feeling black as tar
Since you started playing on
An old dead mans guitar
Passed on by an uncle
Who stole it from a friend
He'd shot a second cousin
To own it once again
Taken from a limousine
Straight to a freight train car
Late at night they moan and cry
Wondering where you are
Putting thoughts inside your head
And songs you cant recall
Words a long lost poet said
In some music hall
Pick until your fingers bled
New dreams take you far
Since you started playing on
An old dead mans guitar
GDS
"Let's roll!"
Master Betty
"Andy" <no@invalid> wrote in message
news:ha8o07-fgn.ln1@unique_and_different_just_like_everyone_else.westnet.com.au...
>
> (You forgot the 'slit your fucking throat' threats he made against some
> here).
>
LOL...he was like the group's alcoholic dad on a permanent bender.
RS
Ah, he shall be missed.
Seriously, that's creepy. There's one thing having respect for the
dead, but it's wise to show respect for the living as well. Many here
disliked Adams for obvious reasons. It's silly to post some Christmas
wish and expect that it doesn't turn bad.
BTW, his guitar and electronics advice was almost invariably bad, and
he did admit that was intentional on at least one occasion..."to keep
people on their toes". What, by getting electrocuted?
RS
I was devastated the first couple times that you died, but I started
getting used to it.
jtees4
wrote:
>LOL
Excellent! Double LOL.
Stephen Cowell
"jtees4" <jte...@hotmail.com> wrote
>Meat Plow <me...@petitmorte.net> wrote:
>> <R...@saynotospam.com>wrote:
>>>White Spirit wrote:
>>>>On 29/12/2009 01:15, The Repair Guy wrote:
>>>>> "I was just sitting here and wondering how many
>>>>> lined up heads a single 300 Winchester Magnum
>>>>> round could splatter?" -K. Adams, tortured soul
>>>>
>>>>Since everyone started saying nice things about him after he died, do
>>>>you think I'd get similar honours if I carked it?
>>>
>>>I was devastated the first couple times that you died, but I started
>>>getting used to it.
>>
>>LOL
>
> Excellent! Double LOL.
Indeed... methinxt this precipitated the latest exodus.
A capital riposte.
__
Steve
.
RichL
Someone left?
:-)
The Repair Guy
>The Repair Guy wrote:
>> "Monster Zero" wrote:
>>
>>>Keith was a tortured soul with many demons and
>>>he insulted me a few times but he also stepped
>>>up and helped me with guitar setups and lyrics
>>>and gave me some great knowledge of which
>>>I've applied many times over now. If Keefy hurt
>>>anyone's feewings by typed word over the
>>>internet then maybe those people are too thin
>>>skinned?
>>
>> "I was just sitting here and wondering how many
>> lined up heads a single 300 Winchester Magnum
>> round could splatter?" -K. Adams, tortured soul
>
>And really really really good guitar 'builder'. Honest.
"twisted neck wont make frets buzz. The strings
follow the twist right around and they dont change
their height in relation to the fingerboard." -K. Adams
>(You forgot the 'slit your fucking throat' threats he
>made against some here).
I didn't want to seem vindictive and re-post every
psychotic, perverse. mean-spirited thing he wrote :-)
The Repair Guy
>"The Repair Guy" <repair...@yahoo.com> wrote...
>>>Keith was a tortured soul with many demons and
>>>he insulted me a few times but he also stepped
>>>up and helped me with guitar setups and lyrics
>>>and gave me some great knowledge of which
>>>I've applied many times over now. If Keefy hurt
>>>anyone's feewings by typed word over the
>>>internet then maybe those people are too thin
>>>skinned?
>>
>> "I was just sitting here and wondering how many
>> lined up heads a single 300 Winchester Magnum
>> round could splatter?" -K. Adams, tortured soul
>
>And?
How do you differentiate between "tortured soul
with many demons" and "psychotic pinhead"?
Twibil
>
>
> "twisted neck wont make frets buzz. The strings
> follow the twist right around and they dont change
> their height in relation to the fingerboard." -K. Adams
Right up there with his "Leo Fender couldn't even tune a guitar"
posts.
It isn't terribly unusual to meet Usenet posters who just make stuff
up as they go along, but it's a mite uncommon to have them issue
psychotic threats when they get caught at it.
~Pete
Arlowe
Adams only rated 4.8 on the IINS (international internet nutter scale)
You have to rate at least 5.4 or higher to fit in the psycotic pinhead
catagory. The best you can make at 4.8 is Cranky Moronic Arsehole.
VampX
> Right up there with his "Leo Fender couldn't even tune a guitar"
> posts.
>
> It isn't terribly unusual to meet Usenet posters who just make stuff
> up as they go along, but it's a mite uncommon to have them issue
> psychotic threats when they get caught at it.
Hmm...
Well, I see him as having been angry because looking a little deeper, I
think he knew about his situation for a long while. He never burdened
anyone here with it either so think of that when next taking a shot at
him. I guess if I were in his shoes, I would have been pretty pissed at
that too. I may not have reacted the way he did on some occasions as we
all have different ways of dealing with things - or not.
I also think he used this group as a sounding board. I tweaked when I
mentioned something about a Gibson Silverburst '83 Custom LP and he
said that if he had one he would give it to me. I mean, who in their
right mind would just give away classic axes like that? Not many.
Keith is gone now, guys. Let it go. IMO, it's not too cool to be
hacking in on those who have passed on.
Just my thoughts. Take them or leave them.
--
VeronicaX
-------------------------------
Greendistantstar
Well said, and best to you for 2010, sister.
GDS
"Let's roll!"
iL_weReo
>
> - Show quoted text -
No.
RichL
+1.
The Repair Guy
>The Repair Guy used his keyboard to write :
>>>> "I was just sitting here and wondering how many
>>>> lined up heads a single 300 Winchester Magnum
>>>> round could splatter?" -K. Adams, tortured soul
>>>
>>> And?
>>
>> How do you differentiate between "tortured soul
>> with many demons" and "psychotic pinhead"?
>
>Adams only rated 4.8 on the IINS (international
>internet nutter scale)
>You have to rate at least 5.4 or higher to fit in the
>psycotic pinhead catagory. The best you can
>make at 4.8 is Cranky Moronic Arsehole.
Ha! You need to get your IINS meter calibrated.
KA was at least a 6.1.
The Repair Guy
>> It isn't terribly unusual to meet Usenet posters who
>> just make stuff up as they go along, but it's a mite
>> uncommon to have them issue psychotic threats
>> when they get caught at it.
>
>Hmm...
>Well, I see him as having been angry because
>looking a little deeper,
<snork>
Hello, Vanessa. I realize you'll probably A) never
see this, or B) delete it after a sentence or two, but...
>I think he knew about his situation for a long while.
>He never burdened anyone here with it either so
>think of that when next taking a shot at him.
Everyone has "situations", but everyone doesn't
give malicious advice, make death threats, use
gratuitous profanity, insults, etc., etc. He never
hesitated to take a shot at anyone (except you,
apparently), and the fact that he's dead doesn't
change how he acted in life.
>I guess if I were in his shoes, I would have been
>pretty pissed at that too. I may not have reacted
>the way he did on some occasions as we all
>have different ways of dealing with things - or not.
Sure, people get pissed off at stuff. I do, too.
But I don't insult/threaten people I've never seen
(or even people I _have_ seen) because of it.
>I also think he used this group as a sounding
>board.
I think he used it the same way an old drunk uses
a neighborhood tavern - to show up and act like
a know-it-all, insult/threaten a few people, then
stagger back home. Except in a newsgroup
there's no risk of someone knocking you on
your ass - as even Keith pointed out.
>I tweaked when I mentioned something about a
>Gibson Silverburst '83 Custom LP and he said that
>if he had one he would give it to me. I mean, who in
>their right mind would just give away classic axes
>like that? Not many.
Talk is cheap, as KA (ironically) pointed out
several times.
>Keith is gone now, guys. Let it go. IMO, it's not too
>cool to be hacking in on those who have passed
>on. Just my thoughts. Take them or leave them.
I think you're wrong; you think I'm wrong. But I think
you're cherry-picking examples. He made piles
of posts that were nothing but swearing, threats,
misinformation, etc., but you remember one where
he offered to give you something he didn't have...
VampX
> VampX <vero...@vampx.dot.net> wrote:
>
>>> It isn't terribly unusual to meet Usenet posters who
>>> just make stuff up as they go along, but it's a mite
>>> uncommon to have them issue psychotic threats
>>> when they get caught at it.
>>
>> Hmm...
>> Well, I see him as having been angry because
>> looking a little deeper,
>
> <snork>
> Hello, Vanessa. I realize you'll probably A) never
> see this, or B) delete it after a sentence or two, but...
I don't think I'm that arrogant. Granted there are some that just don't
see the light of my eyes and they have truly earned their status.
>
>> I think he knew about his situation for a long while.
>> He never burdened anyone here with it either so
>> think of that when next taking a shot at him.
>
> Everyone has "situations", but everyone doesn't
> give malicious advice, make death threats, use
> gratuitous profanity, insults, etc., etc. He never
> hesitated to take a shot at anyone (except you,
> apparently), and the fact that he's dead doesn't
> change how he acted in life.
We all deal with things differently. Your expectations are clearly from
your own frame of reference. I'm just asking you look outside of that
and realise not everyone has your experiences. You're right, death
doesn't change deeds that are done, but it can serve to change us -
help make us more forgiving or understanding. Or is this just a chick
thing?
>
>> I guess if I were in his shoes, I would have been
>> pretty pissed at that too. I may not have reacted
>> the way he did on some occasions as we all
>> have different ways of dealing with things - or not.
>
> Sure, people get pissed off at stuff. I do, too.
> But I don't insult/threaten people I've never seen
> (or even people I _have_ seen) because of it.
Believe it or not I can understand/empathise where he was coming from.
I don't suspect life was all that peachy keen for him and seeing
through all that "stuff" I saw a fragile and hurt person. That's just
my feeling.
>
>> I also think he used this group as a sounding
>> board.
>
> I think he used it the same way an old drunk uses
> a neighborhood tavern - to show up and act like
> a know-it-all, insult/threaten a few people, then
> stagger back home. Except in a newsgroup
> there's no risk of someone knocking you on
> your ass - as even Keith pointed out.
Even old drunks need love and understanding. Admittedly it's a tough
gig but you know what you're in for. I'm sure you're a big enough boy
not to be knocked on your arse that easily.
>
>> I tweaked when I mentioned something about a
>> Gibson Silverburst '83 Custom LP and he said that
>> if he had one he would give it to me. I mean, who in
>> their right mind would just give away classic axes
>> like that? Not many.
>
> Talk is cheap, as KA (ironically) pointed out
> several times.
Maybe, but talk is communication and we all speak volumes without
saying much. It's all about the finer detail. When we start to see that
we truly embrace understanding. Perhaps the world could be a better
place someday as a result.
>
>> Keith is gone now, guys. Let it go. IMO, it's not too
>> cool to be hacking in on those who have passed
>> on. Just my thoughts. Take them or leave them.
>
> I think you're wrong; you think I'm wrong. But I think
> you're cherry-picking examples. He made piles
> of posts that were nothing but swearing, threats,
> misinformation, etc., but you remember one where
> he offered to give you something he didn't have..
You have a right to state your thoughts and opinions. After all this is
what we do most here. However, you seem to miss my point. It's not
about material possession; it's about the thoughtfulness and intent
behind it. Frankly I couldn't give a rats arse about the guitar itself.
I _do_ appreciate people who reach beyond their circumstance and
despite him his experiences in life, he reached beyond that. Think of
his partner who posted his passing in here. Think of how special she
was to him and how special he was to her and just how much she loved
and adored him to spend her life with him. Think of how she may have
been the best thing in his life and having that cut short. How would
_you_ feel about that?
No need to answer... just think about it.
I hope this year and many more onward bring you much joy and happiness.
I truly hope you live a long and happy life.
--
VeronicaX
-------------------------------
The Repair Guy
--snip squabbling about Keith--
>I hope this year and many more onward bring you
>much joy and happiness. I truly hope you live a
>long and happy life.
Thanks. Long may you run, etc. :-)
I really didn't think you'd read my post, much less
reply. You're a more charitable person than I am,
I guess, WRT Keith. I give people the benefit of
the doubt until they say or do something I consider
acceptable - like making death threats.
Anyway, I could've just as well kept my mouth shut -
just blowing off steam. It reminded me of Nixon's
funeral, in a way. Despised by boatloads of
Americans until his funeral... after which he turned
into some kind of hero, or something.
The Repair Guy
>I give people the benefit of the doubt until they say
>or do something I consider acceptable -
UNacceptable. Duh...
RichL
>
> --snip squabbling about Keith--
>> I hope this year and many more onward bring you
>> much joy and happiness. I truly hope you live a
>> long and happy life.
>
> Thanks. Long may you run, etc. :-)
> I really didn't think you'd read my post, much less
> reply. You're a more charitable person than I am,
> I guess, WRT Keith. I give people the benefit of
> the doubt until they say or do something I consider
> acceptable - like making death threats.
I guess for me, I don't hold grudges, I tend to give people second
(third, fourth, etc.) chances. I had my moments with Keith, both good
and bad.
> Anyway, I could've just as well kept my mouth shut -
> just blowing off steam. It reminded me of Nixon's
> funeral, in a way
Hey, I have my limits. Nixon was always in my killfile.
VampX
> UNacceptable. Duh...
Yeah I figured that.
:)
--
VeronicaX
-------------------------------
VampX
> It reminded me of Nixon's
> funeral, in a way. Despised by boatloads of
> Americans until his funeral... after which he turned
> into some kind of hero, or something.
Yeah well men (or women) in power who abuse that privilege get no
favours from me that's for sure. If you're trusted to do the important
job then do it without compromise.
--
VeronicaX
-------------------------------
dvaoa
The ability to forgive is a pretty transcendent capacity, especially
when our instincts tell us to fight fire with fire. The problem with
the latter is, there's no end to that cycle. No one wins.
-d
Arlowe
Nobody "knows"anybody in the land of the internuts. We are all just
floating around on pathways of flowing electrons...In here I am
charming, handsome & rich.
But in the Real meatspace...I'm just charming and handsome...
:P
BTW> If I had a Gibson, silverburst '83 custom Les Paul? I'd give it to
ya :)
VampX
> Nobody "knows"anybody in the land of the internuts. We are all just
> floating around on pathways of flowing electrons...In here I am
> charming, handsome & rich.
> But in the Real meatspace...I'm just charming and handsome...
>
> :P
>
> BTW> If I had a Gibson, silverburst '83 custom Les Paul? I'd give it to ya :)
Silly boy!
--
VeronicaX
-------------------------------
The Repair Guy
>The ability to forgive is a pretty transcendent capacity,
>especially when our instincts tell us to fight fire with fire.
I can see forgiving a specific incident, mistake,
misjudgment, etc. I've got kids, and have been
married 20+ years. But "forgiving" an attitude
or worldview? I don't know.
>The problem with the latter is, there's no end to that
>cycle. No one wins.
That's the origin of/reason for an eye for an eye, IIRC.
It stops with the second eye. And it never GETS to
the second eye unless someone decides they want
the FIRST eye.
Les Cargill
> dvaoa<dv...@altavista.com> wrote:
>
>> The ability to forgive is a pretty transcendent capacity,
>> especially when our instincts tell us to fight fire with fire.
>
> I can see forgiving a specific incident, mistake,
> misjudgment, etc. I've got kids, and have been
> married 20+ years. But "forgiving" an attitude
> or worldview? I don't know.
>
>> The problem with the latter is, there's no end to that
>> cycle. No one wins.
>
> That's the origin of/reason for an eye for an eye, IIRC.
> It stops with the second eye.
Only if somebody has the power to make it stop there.
> And it never GETS to
> the second eye unless someone decides they want
> the FIRST eye.
>
> The Repair Guy
> repairguy1993 dot netfirms dot com
--
Les Cargill
dvaoa
It's a pretty meaty topic.
Forgiveness isn't about rewarding the transgressor. It's about
keeping the forgiver out of the dead-end of soul-rot, so it's kinda
selfish, in a way. It's about saving oneself instead of exhonorating
the villain.
I don't see life as inherently "fair", so I don't expect it to be. I
can choose not allow myself to be dragged to down to a certain level.
Where does real strength lie? Answering a punch with a knife or a
gun, or walking away? I get it that self-defense is a natural
reaction mechanism, and I'm not arguing that. But self-defense can
also mean a lot of different things.
I often use the analogy of a shot glass vs. a beer stein. The
capacity of one far exceeds that of the other...some people are only
capable of so much. How am I going to change that? Why should it be
my burden to change that?
-d
Geetar Dave
>
> BTW> If I had a Gibson, silverburst '83 custom Les Paul? I'd give it to
> ya :)
I do have one. Actually, it's an '82. But I'm still not giving it to
anyone.
As for Keith, his verbal attacks were like being barked at by a
chihuahua. I mostly ignored him, but I'm just relieved that he isn't
crapping in my flower beds and humping my shrubs any more.
-dave-----:::
www.myspace.com/geetardave
Mark Bedingfield
Our brains are just big blobs of flowing electrons too ;-) Not all of us
are wired the same and we all have our own idiosyncrasies and problems.
Its how we deal with them that counts. I'm also convinced that enough
trauma and there is a point of no return. Keith had been there I think.
Keith helped me and even sent some gear just cause he was a nice guy and
if you looked past his aggressive nature, a front really, he was good
value and funny too. I enjoyed the banter with him, even when he did get
narky because it wasn't personal. At least it wasn't with me. I miss
him, he was a real character and a great addition to a.g imho. Its all a
bit more vanilla now.
Mark
dvaoa
> On Sat, 2 Jan 2010 13:01:02 -0800 (PST), dvaoa
> <dv...@altavista.com>wrote:
>
>
>
> >On Jan 2, 2:41?pm, The Repair Guy <repairguy1...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >> dvaoa <dv...@altavista.com> wrote:
> >> >The ability to forgive is a pretty transcendent capacity,
> >> >especially when our instincts tell us to fight fire with fire.
>
> >> I can see forgiving a specific incident, mistake,
> >> married 20+ years. ?But "forgiving" an attitude
> >> or worldview? I don't know.
>
> >> >The problem with the latter is, there's no end to that
> >> >cycle. No one wins.
>
> >> That's the origin of/reason for an eye for an eye, IIRC.
> >> It stops with the second eye. And it never GETS to
> >> the second eye unless someone decides they want
> >> the FIRST eye.
>
> >> The Repair Guy
> >> repairguy1993 dot netfirms dot com
>
> >It's a pretty meaty topic.
>
Cheers ;-)
The Repair Guy
>> That's the origin of/reason for an eye for an eye,
>> IIRC. It stops with the second eye.
>
>Only if somebody has the power to make it stop there.
True, but the same can be said for any rule/law/
convention.
Arlowe
I guess my point is ones internet persona isn't really indicative of
ones real persona.
You see so many of these
http://tinyurl.com/yzuvqvh
on the internet. but turn out to be
http://tinyurl.com/ygsdlt4
in meatspace.
Lost in Space
> Yep, he was so mean and often I hated him.
>
He's dead .. in case you wonder why he been so quiet.
Les Cargill
>>> dvaoa<dv...@altavista.com> wrote:
>>>> The ability to forgive is a pretty transcendent capacity,
>>>> especially when our instincts tell us to fight fire with fire.
>>>
>>> I can see forgiving a specific incident, mistake,
>>> married 20+ years. ?But "forgiving" an attitude
>>> or worldview? I don't know.
>>>
>>>> The problem with the latter is, there's no end to that
>>>> cycle. No one wins.
>>>
>>> That's the origin of/reason for an eye for an eye, IIRC.
>>> It stops with the second eye. And it never GETS to
>>> the second eye unless someone decides they want
>>> the FIRST eye.
>>>
>>> The Repair Guy
>>> repairguy1993 dot netfirms dot com
>>
>> It's a pretty meaty topic.
>
http://www.mcpeepants.com/pics/meatwad5.gif
--
Les Cargilll
Jon
> Jay wrote:
>> Yep, he was so mean and often I hated him.
>>
>>
Yes, good riddance.
The Repair Guy
>> That's the origin of/reason for an eye for an eye,
>> IIRC. It stops with the second eye. And it never
>> GETS to the second eye unless someone
>> decides they want the FIRST eye.
>
>It's a pretty meaty topic.
It's not black & white, that's for sure, and when
you're dealing with man's animal nature, it's hard
to stay all cerebral when situations move beyond
the academic.
>Forgiveness isn't about rewarding the transgressor.
>It's about keeping the forgiver out of the dead-end
>of soul-rot, so it's kinda selfish, in a way. It's about
>saving oneself instead of exhonorating the villain.
That's one view. Why do (some) transgressors ask
for forgiveness, then? Seems like it means a lot to
some to _get_ forgiveness.
>I don't see life as inherently "fair", so I don't expect
>it to be.
I see "fair" or "equitable" as ideals, like honesty or
perfect tuning. You aim for ideals; you don't just throw
in the towel when you see they're not being achieved.
>I can choose not allow myself to be dragged to
>down to a certain level.
That was revealing :-) Defending oneself is "being
dragged down to a certain level"? I'd never thought
of it that way.
>Where does real strength lie? Answering a punch
>with a knife or a gun, or walking away?
Ideally, the first punch would never have been thrown.
After that it depends on the situation and the people
involved.
Your scenario presupposes two people of similar
size & strength. What if the first punch was thrown
by a 6' 4" linebacker at a 100lb 80-year-old woman?
What if it was the fourth or fifth time the guy had hit her?
What if ___
You get the picture. She should just sit there in her
wheelchair & take it? Maybe throw a punch back?
I use this example because conflicts aren't always
between equal powers.
>I get it that self-defense is a natural reaction
>mechanism, and I'm not arguing that.
The most natural thing, for most people I know, is to
be left alone. There are people who look for conflict,
but I think they're a minority. When forced into fight/
flight, response depends on numerous things. I don't
see how anyone can say there is one "acceptable"
response.
>But self-defense can also mean a lot of different
>things. I often use the analogy of a shot glass vs.
>a beer stein. The capacity of one far exceeds that
>of the other... some people are only capable of so
>much. How am I going to change that? Why should
>it be my burden to change that?
You lost me with the analogy. The capacities
represent each party's strength? Their morality?
Their size? What?
Anyway, I don't think you can change people. You
can give them information, but what they do with it
is up to them.
The Repair Guy
>http://www.mcpeepants.com/pics/meatwad5.gif
"mcpeepants.com"?? You must have an interesting
bookmarks file :-)
The Repair Guy
>I guess my point is ones internet persona isn't really
>indicative of ones real persona.
I don't know how many times I've heard this, but it's
always used to defend someone being a butthead.
VampX
> Why do (some) transgressors ask
> for forgiveness, then?
What's more important is the sudden uptake of the use of the word
transgression and its variables. Tiger Woods has had a profound effect
on modern society.
:)
--
VeronicaX
-------------------------------
Arlowe
Yes...I was defending you.
:P
RichL
> On 2010-01-03 16:01:59 +1100, The Repair Guy
> <repair...@yahoo.com> said:
>
>> Why do (some) transgressors ask
>> for forgiveness, then?
>
> What's more important is the sudden uptake of the use of the word
> transgression and its variables. Tiger Woods has had a profound effect
> on modern society.
Somehow I think that using "wanna transgress?" as a pickup line in a bar
is kind of a dud.
Arlowe
> Tiger Woods has had a profound effect on
> modern society.
> :)
Only surpassed by the effect Elin Wood's use of a 5 iron had on Tiggers
skull & mandible. :)
Stephen Cowell
>
>>http://www.mcpeepants.com/pics/meatwad5.gif
>
> "mcpeepants.com"?? You must have an interesting
> bookmarks file :-)
I want candy!
He's still not as funny as Mooninites... or the
angle alien dudes. Fave episode... the evil guy
convention. "MondayTuesdayWednesdayThursday...".
__
Steve
.
VampX
> Only surpassed by the effect Elin Wood's use of a 5 iron had on Tiggers
> skull & mandible. :)
Ahh yes, hell hath no fury like a woman scorn.
--
VeronicaX
-------------------------------
Arlowe
> On 2010-01-03 18:07:53 +1100, Arlowe <bare....@gmail.com> said:
>
>> Only surpassed by the effect Elin Wood's use of a 5 iron had on Tiggers
>> skull & mandible. :)
>
> Ahh yes, hell hath no fury like a woman scorn.
No...smells more like justice :D
Arlowe
you are fucking scary at times...
VampX
> No...smells more like justice :D
Goes hand in hand doesn't it?
--
VeronicaX
-------------------------------
Arlowe
> On 2010-01-03 19:35:40 +1100, Arlowe <bare....@gmail.com> said:
>
>> No...smells more like justice :D
>
> Goes hand in hand doesn't it?
well, no...fury can happen just for leaving the toilet seat up.
At least in my house...
VampX
> well, no...fury can happen just for leaving the toilet seat up.
>
> At least in my house...
You're wife rocks!
--
VeronicaX
-------------------------------
mercutio
wrote:
>On 2010-01-03 18:07:53 +1100, Arlowe <bare....@gmail.com> said:
>
>> Only surpassed by the effect Elin Wood's use of a 5 iron had on Tiggers
>> skull & mandible. :)
>
>Ahh yes, hell hath no fury like a woman scorn.
Although that may be true the complete quote is "Heaven has no rage
like love to hatred turned / Nor hell a fury like a woman scorned.".
However in this case the quoye is even more appropo
Jim
The Repair Guy
>>> I guess my point is ones internet persona isn't
>>> really indicative of ones real persona.
>>
>> I don't know how many times I've heard this, but it's
>> always used to defend someone being a butthead.
>
>Yes...I was defending you.
>:P
You'll meet worse :-)
dvaoa
> dvaoa <dv...@altavista.com> wrote:
> >> That's the origin of/reason for an eye for an eye,
> >> IIRC. It stops with the second eye. And it never
> >> GETS to the second eye unless someone
> >> decides they want the FIRST eye.
>
> >It's a pretty meaty topic.
>
> It's not black & white, that's for sure, and when
> you're dealing with man's animal nature, it's hard
> to stay all cerebral when situations move beyond
> the academic.
>
> >Forgiveness isn't about rewarding the transgressor.
> >It's about keeping the forgiver out of the dead-end
> >of soul-rot, so it's kinda selfish, in a way. It's about
> >saving oneself instead of exhonorating the villain.
>
> That's one view. Why do (some) transgressors ask
> for forgiveness, then? Seems like it means a lot to
> some to _get_ forgiveness.
I can't answer that because I don't see just one answer. Some may ask
for forgiveness because of genuine remorse. Everyone's had one or two
epiphanies in their time. I know I have...I've looked back at some of
the stuff I did when I was younger, and I cringe. My remorse is
genuine. Sometimes crossing the line has a transformative effect on
the transgressor, when called on it. Others are incorrigible, I
agree...every population has its hopeless outliers.
>
> >I don't see life as inherently "fair", so I don't expect
> >it to be.
>
> I see "fair" or "equitable" as ideals, like honesty or
> perfect tuning. You aim for ideals; you don't just throw
> in the towel when you see they're not being achieved.
I don't see it as throwing in the towel. I see it as there's only so
much you can do to align others to your (or society's) ideals.
There's a real danger in falling into Quixotic quests...not
interested. It's a no-win.
>
> >I can choose not allow myself to be dragged to
> >down to a certain level.
>
> That was revealing :-) Defending oneself is "being
> dragged down to a certain level"? I'd never thought
> of it that way.
You misunderstood. Or I wasn't clear. I'm fortunate that I haven't
had to physically defend myself in my 46 years. Maybe being 6'3" and
200 lbs helps as a deterrent ;-) But I have a couple times.
Sometimes there's no way out. But I also see that our animal nature
is all too eager to escalate situations when there's no real need to
other than ego, testosterone, the need to be "right", etc.
>
> >Where does real strength lie? Answering a punch
> >with a knife or a gun, or walking away?
>
> Ideally, the first punch would never have been thrown.
Don't take this the wrong way, but for me, "ideals" are fool's gold.
> After that it depends on the situation and the people
> involved.
> Your scenario presupposes two people of similar
> size & strength. What if the first punch was thrown
> by a 6' 4" linebacker at a 100lb 80-year-old woman?
> What if it was the fourth or fifth time the guy had hit her?
> What if ___
> You get the picture. She should just sit there in her
> wheelchair & take it? Maybe throw a punch back?
> I use this example because conflicts aren't always
> between equal powers.
That's a pretty b&w scenario. B&W's are easy to dissect. My question
was, what do you do or how do you react when you have more than one
option on the table? Sometimes you can bridge a divide without
reactive brute force, that's all. The tricky part is being able to
discern when and where.
>
> >I get it that self-defense is a natural reaction
> >mechanism, and I'm not arguing that.
>
> The most natural thing, for most people I know, is to
> be left alone.
As is the need for community. I don't see them as mutually
exclusive. It's complicated living in society/community...it's a
helluva lot easier living in isolation...but not nearly as fulfilling
or rewarding.
> There are people who look for conflict,
> but I think they're a minority. When forced into fight/
> flight, response depends on numerous things. I don't
> see how anyone can say there is one "acceptable"
> response.
Couldn't agree more.
>
> >But self-defense can also mean a lot of different
> >things. I often use the analogy of a shot glass vs.
> >a beer stein. The capacity of one far exceeds that
> >of the other... some people are only capable of so
> >much. How am I going to change that? Why should
> >it be my burden to change that?
>
> You lost me with the analogy. The capacities
> represent each party's strength? Their morality?
> Their size? What?
All of it, except for the physical size part. Add to that list
patience, empathy, apathy, curiosity, temper, hair trigger,
compassion, forgiveness, etc. We're complicated creatures.
> Anyway, I don't think you can change people. You
> can give them information, but what they do with it
> is up to them.
If, after you give them the information you deem appropriate, you are
able to walk away and not feel compelled to look back, then it's my
contention you're that much richer for it :-)
-d
jtees4
wrote:
>Yep, he was so mean and often I hated him.
>
>Happy holidays Kieth, I hope your talking trash with Elvis and
>pestering John Lennon about this cheap guitars and bothering Johnny
>cash until he smacks you bothering Garcia because he "Should work on
>his chords not so many effects"
>
>Happy holidays Kieth Adams.
One last note on Keith: At least he didn't fake his death like some
others around here and then come back later! He was a man of his word.
****
http://www.soundclick.com/bands/default.cfm?bandID=789610
http://www.reviewmymusicnow.com
The Repair Guy
--snip--
>> >I don't see life as inherently "fair", so I don't expect
>> >it to be. �
>>
>> I see "fair" or "equitable" as ideals, like honesty
>> or perfect tuning. You aim for ideals; you don't
>> just throw in the towel when you see they're not
>> being achieved.
>
>I don't see it as throwing in the towel. I see it as
>there's only so much you can do to align others
>to your (or society's) ideals. There's a real danger
>in falling into Quixotic quests... not interested.
>It's a no-win.
True. I suppose throwing in the towel and Quixotic
quests are opposite extremes. I find little ways to
make life around me more fair.
>> >I can choose not allow myself to be dragged
>> >down to a certain level. �
>>
>> That was revealing �:-) �Defending oneself is "being
>> dragged down to a certain level"? I'd never thought
>> of it that way.
>
>You misunderstood. Or I wasn't clear. I'm fortunate
>that I haven't had to physically defend myself in my
>46 years. Maybe being 6'3" and 200 lbs helps as a
>deterrent ;-) But I have a couple times. Sometimes
>there's no way out. But I also see that our animal
>nature is all too eager to escalate situations when
>there's no real need to other than ego, testosterone,
>the need to be "right", etc.
Varies with the person. Some people's self image
is invested in dominating, winning, etc. Mine isn't.
It would take _extreme_ provocation for my "animal
nature" to assert itself :-)
>> >Where does real strength lie? �Answering a
>> >punch with a knife or a gun, or walking away?
>>
>> Ideally, the first punch would never have been
>> thrown.
>
>Don't take this the wrong way, but for me, "ideals"
>are fool's gold.
The ideal itself, maybe. But working toward it?
>> After that it depends on the situation and the people
>> involved.
>> Your scenario presupposes two people of similar
>> size & strength. What if the first punch was thrown
>> by a 6' 4" linebacker at a 100lb 80-year-old woman?
>> What if it was the fourth or fifth time the guy had hit
>> her? What if ___ You get the picture.
>> She should just sit there in her wheelchair & take it?
>> Maybe throw a punch back?
>> I use this example because conflicts aren't always
>> between equal powers.
>
>That's a pretty b&w scenario. B&W's are easy to
>dissect.
I usually use obvious examples to sort of establish
boundaries and basic agreement. You work your
way in to "the norm" from there and see where
disagreement happens. If someone doesn't just
blow off the extreme example as too dumb, it works.
>My question was, what do you do or how do you
>react when you have more than one option on the
>table?
Maybe that's an ideal situation :-) Sometimes
things progress/escalate/degenerate to the point
where there's only one viable option. Or where it
_looks_ that way, which is effectively the same
thing.
>Sometimes you can bridge a divide without reactive
>brute force, that's all. The tricky part is being able to
>discern when and where.
Agreed. Your "I can choose not allow myself to be
dragged to down to a certain level" made me think
you were saying take the punch, walk away, turn the
other cheek, etc., regardless of the situation.
--snip--
>> >But self-defense can also mean a lot of different
>> >things. �I often use the analogy of a shot glass vs.
>> >a beer stein. �The capacity of one far exceeds
>> >that of the other... some people are only capable
>> >of so much. �How am I going to change that? �
>> >Why should it be my burden to change that?
>>
>> You lost me with the analogy. The capacities
>> represent each party's strength? Their morality?
>> Their size? What?
>
>All of it, except for the physical size part. Add to that
>list patience, empathy, apathy, curiosity, temper, hair
>trigger, compassion, forgiveness, etc. We're
>complicated creatures.
More than that - people don't have/not have these
traits. They're present in varying degrees/amounts,
and virtually all are situation-dependant.
>> Anyway, I don't think you can change people.
>> You can give them information, but what they
>> do with it is up to them.
>
>If, after you give them the information you deem
>appropriate, you are able to walk away and not
>feel compelled to look back, then it's my
>contention you're that much richer for it :-)
Hopefully _they're_ richer for it. You're the same
person whether they assimilate new information
or not :-P
Twibil
>
>
> Somehow I think that using "wanna transgress?" as a pickup line in a bar
> is kind of a dud.
Hey, don't knock it if you haven't tried it!
There are scarlet women out there who have both a sense of humor *and*
a strong sex drive!
VampX
> There are scarlet women out there who have both a sense of humor *and*
> a strong sex drive!
Yeah but I guarantee the use of the word Transgress will drive anyone away.
--
VeronicaX
-------------------------------
VampX
> Although that may be true the complete quote is "Heaven has no rage
> like love to hatred turned / Nor hell a fury like a woman scorned.".
> However in this case the quoye is even more appropo
See, now I would have accredited you for your linguistic knowledge had
it not been for the "quoye" thing.
--
VeronicaX
-------------------------------
VampX
> Arlowe <bare....@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>>> I guess my point is ones internet persona isn't
>>>> really indicative of ones real persona.
>>>
>>> I don't know how many times I've heard this, but it's
>>> always used to defend someone being a butthead.
>>
>> Yes...I was defending you.
>> :P
>
> You'll meet worse :-)
That's a comforting thought all the same.
--
VeronicaX
-------------------------------
Twibil
>
>
> > There are scarlet women out there who have both a sense of humor *and*
> > a strong sex drive!
>
> Yeah but I guarantee the use of the word Transgress will drive anyone away.
Gosh! You can speak with certainty for everyone else in the world?
How amazing! Why, most of the rest of us have enough trouble just
speaking for ourselves.
Which reminds me of a story.
A little man was waiting in line at the Pearly Gates to be interviewed
by Saint Peter.
Peter asked the man three in front of him, "Who are you, and how many
souls have you saved?"
The man replied, "Why I'm Pope John-Paul! I'm surprised you didn't
know me! I was head of the Catholic Church on Earth, and I cannonized
several saints and was venerated by millions!"
And Peter said, "Allright, go stand over there by the side while I
think about this." John-Paul looked surprised, but he went.
Then Peter asked the next man, "Who are you and how many souls have
you saved?"
And the man replied, "Peter, I'm Billy Graham! I had radio and TV
gospel shows that reached out to people all around the world and led
them to Jesus! People could call me on the phone and get my blessings
right there on the air so long as they weren't calling collect!"
And Peter said, "Go stand over there with the Pope while I think about
this." Billy went, but he kept looking over his shoulder as if he was
sure there'd been some mistake.
Then Peter asked the next guy, "Who are you and how many souls have
you saved?"
And the man said, "Peter, I'm Oral Roberts! Hallelujah! I raised so
many millions in the name of God that I built a Christian University
and named it after myself! I healed from the pulpit, claimed to speak
in God's name, and I retired very, very rich."
And Peter shuddered a bit and said, "Go stand over there with the Pope
and the Reverend Graham while I think about this.", and Oral went:
muttering something under his breath that sounded a lot like
"ingrate".
Finally Peter came to the little man and asked him, "Who are you, and
how many souls have *you* saved?"
The little man timorously replied, "Er, my name is Bill Smith, sir.
And I know of only one soul that I may have saved, but I'm not even
certain about that."
And Saint Peter smiled, stepped aside, and said, "Come on in, Bill!"