Pedal buffers / true bypass
The Interceptor
concluded that true bypass was a bit of a marketing gimmick. However, while
my Voodoo Lab Sparkle Drive (true bypass) was out of action recently, I put
my Digitech Bad Monkey in its place. I noticed that my signal was a little
hot and was starting to distort earlier that I expected (I like my clean
tone to be very clean, at least until I hit it with the compressor or
overdrive/distortion pedals). I figured that since I am running 7 pedals -
all Boss or Digitech - I might have too many buffers.
Anyway, when the Sparkle Drive was repaired, I put it back into service and
removed the Bad Monkey. And what do you know - clean signal with no more
early distortion.
I think the issue is that 7 buffered pedals is probably too much, but 6 is
ok. Interesting.
Brett
Master Betty
"The Interceptor" <this...@willnotwork.com> wrote in message
news:fPmdnRf4IIbqd4HW...@westnet.com.au...
You hit the nail on the head.
http://www.gibson.com/en-us/Lifestyle/Features/Gibson%20Tone%20Tips_%20True%20Bypass/
This is the reason I keep my pedals down to 2 or 3 (true bypass). After
reading this I'm going to get some shorter cables too. '
Jim
boardjunkie
wrote:
A buffer (if properly designed) does not provide gain. Yer barking up
the wrong tree.....
Tony Done
"The Interceptor" <this...@willnotwork.com> wrote in message
news:fPmdnRf4IIbqd4HW...@westnet.com.au...
If you want to build a true bypass box for your pedal chain, see my reply in
the "Out of the closet" thread.
Tony D
Jim
If the pedal is properly designed, you could run 50 buffer type pedals
with no change in output. But that assumes that they actually have
unity output regardless of input level. And that they won't distort if
you hit them with a hotter level. And that they have good S/N ratio if
you use a low output pickup. And...
Every buffer type pedal inserts some distortion. It's possible to use
low noise OpAmps to keep the distortion inaudible for a dozen pedals or
so. But I'm not sure that all makers do this. Especially the low
dollar units.
I've got the parts to build a true bypass switching unit with several
loops. Some of my pedals REALLY change tone, especially my vintage
Maestro Boomerang Wah, which is an active volume control in the other
switch position. There is NO bypass on that one. You get wah or volume.
Derek
to all true bypass, and put the only buffered pedal (TU-2) right
before it hits the amp to strengthen the signal.
Has worked pretty well.
Rufus
...I'll bet I play through about 60 ft of cable...25-30 feet of guitar
cable, 24 feet of Pedal Snake, and probably about 6 feet of pedal
interconnect. All but my Snake are Planet Waves...and the only thing
that seems to be affected is that I loose some high end on my
TTE...which I can EQ back up to my satisfaction. And I use passive
pickups...hot passive pickups, but passive.
So...I'm thinking it all depends on more than cables and pedals (9
pedals on my stereo rig, 5 on my little one), but the combination and
order of it all. For one, I try not to buy pedals that don't give me
control over input/output levels...and then I set up my chain to match
everything and get the best signal I can. For another, I watch how I
chain true bypass pedals with respect to non-TBP ones, and which ones
are going to be on the most. And balance all that.
But shorter cables? Jury's out...it how ya use it all.
--
- Rufus
Master Betty
"Rufus" <n...@home.com> wrote in message
news:xKmdnaaMTvfP_oDW...@mchsi.com...
Well.....there's that too.
TTE?
TTE Telecommunications Terminal Equipment
TTE Transthoracic Echocardiography
TTE Transthoracic Echocardiogram
TTE Trustee
TTE TCL-Thomson Electronics
TTE To the Extreme (band)
TTE The Tourism Expert (travel guide)
Tte Travelling Ticket Examiner
TTE Technical Training Equipment
TTE Time to Eat
TTE Ternate, Indonesia - Babullah (Airport Code)
TTE Train Ticket Examiner
TTE Tools & Test Equipment
TTE Table Top Exercise
TTE Time Turns Elastic (Phish song)
TTE Temporary Teacher Eligibility
TTE Technical Test and Evaluation
TTE Tower Top Equipment
TTE Temporary Teacher Endorsement
TTE Tracking The Eye (hurricane tracking software; GenCode Systems,
Inc.)
TTE Thai Town Express (Los Angeles, California restaurant)
TTE Tucker Tek Estimator (Software as a Service)
TTE Twin Tower Engineering, Inc. (air dryer manufacturer; Broomfield,
CO)
TTE Teardown, Test & Evaluation
TTE Total Time of Examination
I'm guessing you don't mean "Time to eat"
:-)
Jim
TheChris
437bcd...@u25g2000prh.googlegroups.com:
I agree.. It's not trickery...
Let me get this straight... You have your tuner LAST in the chain? I
always assumed I wanted to hit my tuner with the cleanest signal..
I guess for me, I'd be kicking distortion on and off.. or would I??
Jim
EQ'ing lost frequencies always means increasing the noise floor in that
band. You can NEVER recover what is lost. You can only boost what is left.
WB
> I have read some of the buffers vs true bypass business, and had largely
> concluded that true bypass was a bit of a marketing gimmick.
Purest maintain that anything between the 2 jacks have
a penalty of altering the tone by adding impedance to the signal
path.
YMMV.
Rufus
Tube Tape Echo...Fulltone. Next best thing to an EP-4 Echoplex.
--
- Rufus
Stephen Cowell
"Master Betty" <ne...@mind.com> wrote
> TTE Total Time of Examination
>
>
> I'm guessing you don't mean "Time to eat"
Is not everyone lusting over the Fulltone TTE?
Is not everyone counting the spare change looking
for the 1080$ list for a new TTE, with bag?
Does not everyone have TTE in their eBay search?
It is the Tube Tape Echo, and it rocks, severely...
I have a mere Echoplex EP-3, and the lust continues...
__
Steve
.
btw converted the EP-3 to true bypass... using the DPDT
on the front panel! Screw SOS... who needs it?
Stephen Cowell
"boardjunkie" <board...@techie.com> wrote
> A buffer (if properly designed) does not provide gain. Yer barking up
> the wrong tree.....
Ah, but seven in a row... bad luck! And hisssssss....
__
Steve
.
Rufus
> Rufus wrote:
>> Master Betty wrote:
>>> "The Interceptor" <this...@willnotwork.com> wrote in message
>>> news:fPmdnRf4IIbqd4HW...@westnet.com.au...
>>
>> cable, 24 feet of Pedal Snake, and probably about 6 feet of pedal
>> interconnect. All but my Snake are Planet Waves...and the only thing
>> that seems to be affected is that I loose some high end on my
>> TTE...which I can EQ back up to my satisfaction.
>
> EQ'ing lost frequencies always means increasing the noise floor in that
> band. You can NEVER recover what is lost. You can only boost what is
> left.
>
That's what you'd think, but that's now how my devices are working
(together). The TTE (Tube Tape Echo) is a tube preamp of/on it's own,
and for some reason adding length to the control cable affects it's tone
- not sure why, but it does and states so in the manual. That's all
that's running through the 24 feet of Pedal Snake for my TTE - the
on/off and SOS foot switches.
But it doesn't bother the TTE so much that I can't correct it by
cranking in a bit of treble at my amp heads (one head effects chain
includes a sub-octave, so it's really a moot issue for that channel) -
again, order of effects is key - the TTE splits my signal to two heads
and thus acts as a pre-amp to both of them. I don't have to crank it's
gain, and therefore I don't gain any noise...which isn't there anyway,
because the cable I'm adding is a control and not a signal cable.
--
- Rufus
Rufus
That's what I've found out...I use a Boss FS-6 with my TTE and can make
it do SOS, but the loop is WAY too long to be useful. And the manual
doesn't really say anything about how to use it. Running two amps in
stereo though a TTE is what REALLY rocks...holy key-rappp!
...BTW - I own one of the 10 special edition TTEs covered in black tolex
instead of white. In fact, I think I got the LAST one...
--
- Rufus
Master Betty
"Stephen Cowell" <stephenleeN...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:hfkcpe$3s3$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
>
> "Master Betty" <ne...@mind.com> wrote
>> TTE Total Time of Examination
>>
>>
>> I'm guessing you don't mean "Time to eat"
>
> Is not everyone lusting over the Fulltone TTE?
> Is not everyone counting the spare change looking
> for the 1080$ list for a new TTE, with bag?
>
Ouch....That's something I'll just have to live w/o.
Jim
Jim
My concern would be capacitance.
eric weasel
I no longer lust, for the time being, having scored a new Heritage H157
Classic for over half off the regular price!
eric
TheChris
news:84OdnatHXum7KIDW...@mchsi.com:
Damn, I just went out and bought a 'Thai Town Express' pedal on your
recommendation! :)
Rufus
>>
>
> Damn, I just went out and bought a 'Thai Town Express' pedal on your
> recommendation! :)
...no claims for what's lost in translation. Hope you got it cheap.
--
- Rufus
TheChris
TheChris
underwood
I'm using more than 15 pedals in a chain and all are true bypass
except for a high quality buffer in front of the chain and a buffered
boss RC-2 as last pedal in the chain.
I've compared it with the signal direct to the amp and I have no
difference in sound.
Derek
>I agree.. It's not trickery...
>Let me get this straight... You have your tuner LAST in the chain? I
>always assumed I wanted to hit my tuner with the cleanest signal..
>I guess for me, I'd be kicking distortion on and off.. or would I??
Yes, that is right. I experimented with various configurations until
I settled on that.
Even with true bypass pedals, once you go thru the all cabling,
connectors, and a number of pedals, your signal is going to decay or
weaken some.
The idea is to strengthen it some before it hits the amp. Got the
idea after reading an interview with Pete Cornish.
I never have any effects on when I tune anyway, so no biggie. It is
the only buffered pedal on my board, and it seemed a wasted to buy a
buffer just to accomplish this.
Master Betty
"Derek" <de...@ycoaoffice.com> wrote in message
news:828a9aaa-e1af-4a58...@a21g2000yqc.googlegroups.com...
Thanks for the suggestion. I think I'm going to try it.
Jim
Jim
> The Chris wrote:
>
>> I agree.. It's not trickery...
>
>> Let me get this straight... You have your tuner LAST in the chain? I
>> always assumed I wanted to hit my tuner with the cleanest signal..
>
>> I guess for me, I'd be kicking distortion on and off.. or would I??
>
> Yes, that is right. I experimented with various configurations until
> I settled on that.
>
> Even with true bypass pedals, once you go thru the all cabling,
> connectors, and a number of pedals, your signal is going to decay or
> weaken some.
An active guitar solves all of these issues. If you have passive, a
buffer type pedal first in line should solve the problem. Assumes
decent cables with good solders and that they haven't been kinked or
stepped on too much.
>
> The idea is to strengthen it some before it hits the amp. Got the
> idea after reading an interview with Pete Cornish.
>
> I never have any effects on when I tune anyway, so no biggie. It is
> the only buffered pedal on my board, and it seemed a wasted to buy a
> buffer just to accomplish this.
If you go to your tuner first, and it's a buffer type, you've got the
problem solved. When you hit bypass on the other pedals, you've got
that low impedance signal going to the amp.
It doesn't hurt to hit jacks AND switches with some Caig DeoxIt D5 once
a year or so.
WB
>
> My concern would be capacitance.
Capacitance is included in impedance clause ;-} .
Rufus
> Rufus <n...@home.com> wrote in
> news:utydnduhLJXcf4DW...@mchsi.com:
>
>> TheChris wrote:
>>> Rufus <n...@home.com> wrote in
>>>
>>>> Tube Tape Echo...Fulltone. Next best thing to an EP-4 Echoplex.
>>>>
>>> Damn, I just went out and bought a 'Thai Town Express' pedal on your
>>> recommendation! :)
>>
>> ...no claims for what's lost in translation. Hope you got it cheap.
>>
>
> It was my attempt at humor :)
Yeah...I got that...back atcha!
--
- Rufus