Bass sound on Uprising

[Steve M. Mann]

Hey folks,

Our project is considering covering the Muse song, "Uprising".
Obviously, the bass is KEY to the overall sound of this particular song.
I'm of the opinion that in the studio, this was some sort of bass synth,
but I'm pretty sure Christopher Wolstenholme plays it on a bass guitar
live.

Any thoughts as to what the fuzz effect is? Boss Bass Fuzz? Big Muff?
Something else? Any overall tips on recreating this tone either directly
on the bass or in post production?

Thanks for any thoughts or comments!
--
Steve
..............................
P R O J E C T - 4 3
http://www.project-43.com/
http://fb.com/project43rocks
http://itunes.com/project-43
http://youtube.com/project43rocks
..............................

[rakman]

On Jan 7, 5:28 pm, "Steve M. Mann" <rockermannLOS...@steve-mann.com>
wrote:

Yeah. There seem to be 2 sounds,
the bass guitar with most of the tops rolled off,
plus a distorted sound one octave up.

IMO the distorted sound sounds like a software synth through
a guitar distortion/amp plugin, like Amplitube.
This can be either audio-to-midi to make the bass notes trigger
a software synth, or playing the two separately then using quantize
to lock the audio and midi in tight sync.

Alternatively it could also be a bass guitar plus a
guitar through an octaver/distortion/amp, both playing
the same part.

Live the bass plus distorted synth thing could be
achieved with an audio-to-midi trigger like this
one, which only does single (monophonic) notes:

http://www.dv247.com/computer-hardware/sonuus-b2m-bass-to-midi-converter--72304

IMO the best way to get the distorted synth sound is with
a laptop running Logic or Ableton.

[RichL]

"Steve M. Mann" <rockerma...@steve-mann.com> wrote in message
news:Po2dnWVOW8wnHZXS...@giganews.com...

> Hey folks,
>
> Our project is considering covering the Muse song, "Uprising".

Arrrr! Say it ain't so!!! :-)

> Obviously, the bass is KEY to the overall sound of this particular song.
> I'm of the opinion that in the studio, this was some sort of bass synth,
> but I'm pretty sure Christopher Wolstenholme plays it on a bass guitar
> live.
>
> Any thoughts as to what the fuzz effect is? Boss Bass Fuzz? Big Muff?
> Something else? Any overall tips on recreating this tone either directly
> on the bass or in post production?

I think it's a synth playing essentially a square wave PLUS a bass guitar on
top. The synth seems to be running an octave below the bass, holding notes
steady while the bass plays a disco-esque octave sequence (with no effects).
The rhythm pattern isn't disco-esque, however.

This video shows a Fender-like Jazz bass at 0:18

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w8KQmps-Sog&ob=av2n

[Oci-One Kanubi]

On Jan 7, 12:28 pm, "Steve M. Mann" <rockermannLOS...@steve-mann.com>
wrote:

> Hey folks,
>
> Our project is considering covering the Muse song, "Uprising".
> Obviously, the bass is KEY to the overall sound of this particular song.
> I'm of the opinion that in the studio, this was some sort of bass synth,
> but I'm pretty sure Christopher Wolstenholme plays it on a bass guitar
> live.
>
> Any thoughts as to what the fuzz effect is? Boss Bass Fuzz? Big Muff?
> Something else? Any overall tips on recreating this tone either directly
> on the bass or in post production?
>
> Thanks for any thoughts or comments!
> --
> Steve

Good song. I've heard it once or twice but never really paid much
attention. Maybe I'll suggest it to my band (I mean, "project"). We
all know a boatload of Classic Rock tunes, but I keep pushing to mix
in about 30% contemporary rock, 10% classic soul, and 10% Nashville
pop (so far 've been successful at keeping the Classic Rock down to
50% of our playlist).

If we were to learn it I would play the rhythmic bass part dry, and
ask the keyboard player to hold that sustained distorted bass note
with his left hand on one keyboard while he plays the actual keyboard
parts with his right hand on another keyboard(s).

-Richard, His Bassic Travesty

[eadg]

"Steve M. Mann" <rockerma...@steve-mann.com> wrote in
message news:Po2dnWVOW8wnHZXS...@giganews.com...

> Hey folks,
>
> Our project is considering covering the Muse song,
> "Uprising".

...reminds me of the BBC Radiophonic workshop's Dr Who theme.

> Obviously, the bass is KEY to the overall sound of this
> particular song. I'm of the opinion that in the studio,
> this was some sort of bass synth, but I'm pretty sure
> Christopher Wolstenholme plays it on a bass guitar live.

The bass on the Muse track is not how I like my bass to
sound - it sounds keys orientated to me.

--
SR

[Jay S]

"Steve M. Mann" wrote in message
news:Po2dnWVOW8wnHZXS...@giganews.com...

Hey folks,

Our project is considering covering the Muse song, "Uprising".
Obviously, the bass is KEY to the overall sound of this particular song.
I'm of the opinion that in the studio, this was some sort of bass synth,
but I'm pretty sure Christopher Wolstenholme plays it on a bass guitar
live.

Any thoughts as to what the fuzz effect is? Boss Bass Fuzz? Big Muff?
Something else? Any overall tips on recreating this tone either directly
on the bass or in post production?

Thanks for any thoughts or comments!
--
Steve

--------------
One of the bands I play guitar in does that song.
The bassist in my band uses an octaver, and some sort of distorted synth
effect.
To tell you the truth I've never paid much attention to his gear!

Jay S

[Steve M. Mann]

On 1/7/2012 11:28 AM, Steve M. Mann wrote:

> Hey folks,
>
> Our project is considering covering the Muse song, "Uprising".
> Obviously, the bass is KEY to the overall sound of this particular song.
> I'm of the opinion that in the studio, this was some sort of bass synth,
> but I'm pretty sure Christopher Wolstenholme plays it on a bass guitar
> live.
>
> Any thoughts as to what the fuzz effect is? Boss Bass Fuzz? Big Muff?
> Something else? Any overall tips on recreating this tone either directly
> on the bass or in post production?
>
> Thanks for any thoughts or comments!

Wow! Thanks to everyone for all the great advice. It's much appreciated.

Seems we have lots of things to try. The dual tracks (bass and key
synth) sound most promising. Using a octaver sounds interesting too...
we'll play around with our options and see what we can figure out.

We'll be sure to post back with any final results. :)

[Derek Tearne]

JimmyM <m...@nnn.com> wrote:

> He uses one of his Jazz basses into a Boss OC-2, a Crowther Prunes and
> Custard harmonic intermodulator (weird name for "fuzz box with a
> bizarre but cool modulation to it")

I know Paul Crowther, the inventor of the Prunes, quite well. The
other, more conventional, overdrive/distortion pedal is called the
Hotcake. One of the versions of that is called the 'bluesberry'.

He followed this pudding theme when he named the Prunes and Custard.

Seeing as there really is no easy way to describe what the prunes does,
this name is as good as any. The full name is the Prunes and Custard -
harmonic generator intermodulator. The Datsuns play a song called
Harmonic Generator in honour of the prunes, so it is probably the only
effects pedal with a song named after it.

You can get sounds from a warm distortion to full on space battle synth
like sounds from one of these. It is definitely my favourite effects
pedal.

One of the things it does that is pretty unique is generate harmonics
and then distort them, which means it can take something with a very
pure tone (like a theremin or musical saw) and effect them in an
interesting way. It also tends to allow the fundamental to remain,
which is useful for a bass effect.

I'll have to listen to thie muse track now.

--- Derek

--
Derek Tearne - de...@url.co.nz
Vitamin S: improvisation from New Zealand http://www.vitamin-s.co.nz/
d'Groove: 12 piece party/covers band http://www.dGroove.co.nz/

[rakman]

On Jan 8, 9:13 pm, de...@url.co.nz (Derek Tearne) wrote:

> The Datsuns play a song called
> Harmonic Generator in honour of the prunes, so it is probably the only
> effects pedal with a song named after it.

Songs named after effects pedals...? :)

Echoplex by Nine Inch Nails.

Mudhoney had an EP called Superfuzz Bigmuff,
but no mention of pedals in the actual song titles.

[Mark Bluemel]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=12si7A9UyGw

[Desk Rabbit]

On 08/01/2012 05:55, Jay S wrote:
>
>
> "Steve M. Mann" wrote in message
> news:Po2dnWVOW8wnHZXS...@giganews.com...
>
> Hey folks,
>
> Our project is considering covering the Muse song, "Uprising".
> Obviously, the bass is KEY to the overall sound of this particular song.
> I'm of the opinion that in the studio, this was some sort of bass synth,
> but I'm pretty sure Christopher Wolstenholme plays it on a bass guitar
> live.
>
> Any thoughts as to what the fuzz effect is? Boss Bass Fuzz? Big Muff?
> Something else? Any overall tips on recreating this tone either directly
> on the bass or in post production?
>
> Thanks for any thoughts or comments!

You newsreader is broken. Comment lost.

[Oci-One Kanubi]

On Jan 7, 8:30 pm, "eadg" <don'...@it.com> wrote:
> "Steve M. Mann" <rockermannLOS...@steve-mann.com> wrote in
> messagenews:Po2dnWVOW8wnHZXS...@giganews.com...

>
> > Hey folks,
>
> > Our project is considering covering the Muse song,
> > "Uprising".
>
> ...reminds me of the BBC Radiophonic workshop's Dr Who theme.
>
> > Obviously, the bass is KEY to the overall sound of this
> > particular song. I'm of the opinion that in the studio,
> > this was some sort of bass synth, but I'm pretty sure
> > Christopher Wolstenholme plays it on a bass guitar live.
>
> The bass on the Muse track is not how I like my bass to
> sound - it sounds keys orientated to me.
>
> --
> SR

How can a bass sound "keys oriented"? Do you mean it sounds like a
keyboard bass?

To me it just sounds like a keyboar holding that long sustained
distorted bass note, and a bass guitar sending a dry signal (with the
EQ favoring the mid-tones) for the actual bass line.

-Kanubi

[Oci-One Kanubi]

> You newsreader is broken. Comment lost.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

His comment was probably lost because it appears below a double-
hyphen.

The double-hyphen is interpreted by many newsreaders to signify the
beginning of a sig, and the sig is stripped off when quoting the
original in the reply.

-Richard, His Bassic Travesty

[Derek Tearne]

We went through all this before, and established where the problem lay.

Seeing as this is exactly the same situation for a different poster (and
I think there are three regulars who are currently experiencing this),
wouldn't it be helpful to explain the problem, instead of just saying
"Your newsreader is broken"?

Jay, the version of Microsoft Windows Live Mail that you are using is
broken. You have probably recently upgraded from a version that worked
(WLM2009)

Your solutions are to restore the older version or use a different
newsreader, or whatever fours...@blueyonder.co.uk did to solve it.

[RichL]

"Oci-One Kanubi" <rho...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:1f1d7184-61dd-4e1c...@t13g2000yqg.googlegroups.com...

That's what I said. I still believe it.

[Derek Tearne]

What even after Jimmy Miller has already given chapter and verse? And
given that information it's pretty easy to google and find the answers.

Firstly:

http://www.bassplayer.com/article/Too-Much-Is-Never-Enough-Muses-Chris-W
olstenholme-Reinvents-Art-Rock-Bass-For-The-21st-Century/4688
About uprising:
"... we made a conscious decision that the rhythm section had to be
real, so we wanted to come up with a bass sound that almost sounded like
a synth, but wasn't."

Then check this out.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UofS3bfyFeU

Obsessive compulsive fanboi buys all the same gear as Christopher
Wolstenholme, and shows how it works (I am kind of in awe, and deeply
disturbed by this at the same time...).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EcbbtewVog0
He plays the tunes with the effects... You want 2:33 in for uprising.

[RichL]

"Derek Tearne" <de...@url.co.nz> wrote in message
news:1kdnoy9.1x4novi1jjbtwnN%de...@url.co.nz...

> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EcbbtewVog0
> He plays the tunes with the effects... You want 2:33 in for uprising.

OK. Fair enough, but I'm still puzzled. The heavily distorted part seems to
my ears to be coming from a single sustained note, with another part doing
the octaves on top fairly cleanly. Either my ears are fooling me or there's
a lot more to all those fancy doo-dads than I can imagine.

[rakman]

On Jan 10, 12:26 am, de...@url.co.nz (Derek Tearne) wrote:
> RichL <rpleav...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > "Oci-One Kanubi" <rhop...@earthlink.net> wrote in message

> Vitamin S: improvisation from New Zealandhttp://www.vitamin-s.co.nz/

> d'Groove: 12 piece party/covers bandhttp://www.dGroove.co.nz/

Good stuff.

Dude in the video is in the right neighborhood
but he's got too much resonant filter on it and
it's by no means an EXACT replica. The distortion
should be post the synth-like filter IMO.
But to me the bottom end doesn't sound distorted at
all, no distortion below 200Hz or so, to my ears.
Could be Waves RBass or CLA Bass adding those
subs though.

[Derek Tearne]

I can't quite be bothered to go back and check everything, but what they
were describing was a split signal chain with an octaver going through a
prunes and the other chain going through some other distortion. It also
looks on the video like he's not damping the low note much, if at all.

Most octavers will only effect the lowest note if there are more than
one playing at once - so if you're not damping the low note you'll get
the affected low note through the signal chain with the octaver, but low
and high through the other channel.

I'll try some experiments later but that's kind of how I'd expect what I
can see the guy playing to sound, especially with a prunes in there
fattening the sound and giving a softish decay.

[Derek Tearne]

rakman <rakma...@hotmail.com> wrote:


> Good stuff.
>
> Dude in the video is in the right neighborhood
> but he's got too much resonant filter on it and
> it's by no means an EXACT replica.

He's using a Prunes and Custard. While this is my absolute favourite
pedal, and Paul is a genius, part of the charm of the Prunes is that you
can never quite get it to do the same thing twice in row.

> The distortion
> should be post the synth-like filter IMO.

The distortion *is* the synth-like filter.

> But to me the bottom end doesn't sound distorted at
> all, no distortion below 200Hz or so, to my ears.

The Prunes is designed to retain more of the fundamental than other
effects pedals do. Most pedals take the waveform and clip it in some
way to get the overdriven sound. Which is OK when you're doing trebly
signals, but they tend to make bass notes indistinct.

The Prunes creates harmonics and distorts *those*, theoretically
retaining a much more clear fundamental note.

--- Derek

--
Derek Tearne - de...@url.co.nz

Vitamin S: improvisation from New Zealand http://www.vitamin-s.co.nz/

[RichL]

"Derek Tearne" <de...@url.co.nz> wrote in message

news:1kdnsf7.aamf911ibr10kN%de...@url.co.nz...

> RichL <rple...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>> "Derek Tearne" <de...@url.co.nz> wrote in message
>> news:1kdnoy9.1x4novi1jjbtwnN%de...@url.co.nz...
>>
>> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EcbbtewVog0
>> > He plays the tunes with the effects... You want 2:33 in for uprising.
>>
>> OK. Fair enough, but I'm still puzzled. The heavily distorted part seems
>> to
>> my ears to be coming from a single sustained note, with another part
>> doing
>> the octaves on top fairly cleanly. Either my ears are fooling me or
>> there's
>> a lot more to all those fancy doo-dads than I can imagine.
>
> I can't quite be bothered to go back and check everything, but what they
> were describing was a split signal chain with an octaver going through a
> prunes and the other chain going through some other distortion. It also
> looks on the video like he's not damping the low note much, if at all.
>
> Most octavers will only effect the lowest note if there are more than
> one playing at once - so if you're not damping the low note you'll get
> the affected low note through the signal chain with the octaver, but low
> and high through the other channel.

That makes sense, if that's how high-quality octavers work. The only thing
I have that comes close is Boss's OC-3 pedal, which seems to simply get
confused if the input is polytonic.

[Derek Tearne]

RichL <rple...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> "Derek Tearne" <de...@url.co.nz> wrote in message

> news:1kdnsf7.aamf911ibr10kN%de...@url.co.nz...

> > Most octavers will only effect the lowest note if there are more than
> > one playing at once - so if you're not damping the low note you'll get
> > the affected low note through the signal chain with the octaver, but low
> > and high through the other channel.
>
> That makes sense, if that's how high-quality octavers work. The only thing
> I have that comes close is Boss's OC-3 pedal, which seems to simply get
> confused if the input is polytonic.

That's how my EBS octaver works, and everyone seems to think that is one
of the better ones.

I haven't yet found one that really works well enough.

So I made myself an 8 string bass instead.

[Jay S]

"Derek Tearne" wrote in message
news:1kdnelb.1urt2ovn7pw7hN%de...@url.co.nz...

no recent upgrades here. as a matter of fact, I never upgrade this computer.
oh well...how does one know my comment is lost if someone is commenting that
my comment is lost....ahhhhh! my head exploded!

Jay S

[Derek Tearne]

JimmyM <m...@nnn.com> wrote:

> LOL! I had an 8 string and went with an EHX Micro Pog instead ;) The
> best tracking octave pedals I've used are the EHX Pog and Micro Pog,
> and the Eventide Pitchfactor.

The Pog looks really interesting, but here one costs about the same as I
spent on the 8 string conversion. And instrument building is fun.

> You can even play chords on them. The
> only problem is they're digital and sound like it.

I love my 8 string, I can play chords, and play single strings with a
bit of care.

We play a version of Beyonce's 'single ladies', which has an irritating
screachy guitar sound on the record. It amuses me to play that on the
bass.

> Dude, I so wish I could justify snagging a P&C. It rocks! I just
> have nothing I could use it on. I show up making the bass sound like
> that and I will get my ass kicked!

Justify, what's there to justify? You need a Prunes.

Actually, I don't use it much for general band stuff, although there are
a couple of tunes with bass synthy sounds where I use it if I can be
bothered to take it to a gig.

I do use it a lot for some of the less conventional musical projects I'm
involved in. You can make anything sound cool and amazing if you send
it through a prunes.

Oh, and to drift the thread to unconventional musical projects...

I'm building a musical elephant

http://musicalelephant.blogspot.com/

I'll probably play it through a Prunes...

[RichL]

"JimmyM" <m...@nnn.com> wrote in message
news:d0ing7hlkeo1jh7so...@4ax.com...

> I just told you guys how he does it. Take an OC-2, add some fuzz to
> the octave lower, some other modulation effect, instant faux synth.

Yeah, I read that, but what confused me was that what I'm hearing in the
lower register appears to be confined to single notes of brief duration
while the "cleaner" stuff was jumping up and down octaves. Derek's later
explanation set me straight.

[Derek Tearne]

JimmyM <m...@nnn.com> wrote:

> You're building a marimba? Holy cow! Tis truly a gift to be able to
> build...I'll be staying tuned for this one!

I think technically I'm building a Balafon, which is basically a
diatonic marimba.

I must confess I'm a bit confused by the differences between a xylophone
and a marimba.

I'm just building what I think will fit in the Elephant.

Tuning little blocks of wood is bizarre, but satisfying.

[Sam Wilson]

In article
<38447249-4724-42fb...@h12g2000yqg.googlegroups.com>,

In case anyone needs to know it's '-- ', i.e. hyphen-hyphen-space on a
line by itself that is the sig separator. That shouldn't matter[1] but
if anyone's trying to fake putting a sig in themselves it may do.

Sam

[1] Proper newsreading software knows this and a) will let you define a
sig to be included automatically, and b) will remove the sig from the
separator down when including text that is being replied to.

[Pt]

On Jan 11, 5:13 am, de...@url.co.nz (Derek Tearne) wrote:

> I must confess I'm a bit confused by the differences between a xylophone
> and a marimba.

I believe that a xylophone has metal keys and a marimba was wooden
keys.

Pt.

[Derek Tearne]

That's what I thought, until I started looking into this.

It seems to me that all Marimbas have wooden bars and resonators, but
Xylophones come with wood or metal bars and with or without resonators.

[Mark Bluemel]

Nope. "xylo" is from the greek word for wood. The one with metal bars is
a glokenspiel (unless it's a vibraphone).

A marimba is a specific type of xylophone.

There are articles on this subject in Wikipedia which seem fairly
accurate and sensible to me...

[Oci-One Kanubi]

On Jan 11, 11:50 am, Sam Wilson <Sam.Wil...@ed.ac.uk> wrote:
> In article
> <38447249-4724-42fb-8bbe-f396fae0d...@h12g2000yqg.googlegroups.com>,

Thanks for the more-precise explication!

-Kanubi

[Steve M. Mann]

On 1/7/2012 11:28 AM, Steve M. Mann wrote:

> Hey folks,
>
> Our project is considering covering the Muse song, "Uprising".

> Obviously, the bass is KEY to the overall sound of this particular song.
> I'm of the opinion that in the studio, this was some sort of bass synth,
> but I'm pretty sure Christopher Wolstenholme plays it on a bass guitar
> live.
>

> Any thoughts as to what the fuzz effect is? Boss Bass Fuzz? Big Muff?
> Something else? Any overall tips on recreating this tone either directly
> on the bass or in post production?
>
> Thanks for any thoughts or comments!

Well, thanks to ALL the feedback in here, I think we were able replicate
the sound fairly well. I'm still working on the mix a bit but I'll post
here shortly so you can all let us know how we did. :)

Until then, I'll give you a clue... we ended up using a blend of a bass
synth and a straight bass guitar.

Thanks again for all the input!

--
Steve
..............................
P R O J E C T - 4 3
http://www.project-43.com/
http://fb.com/project43rocks
http://itunes.com/project-43
http://youtube.com/project43rocks
..............................

[Desk Rabbit]

When you start using a proper newsreader you'll understand but while you
keep using that broken toy you'll remain ignorant of the fact.

It also doesn't quote comments properly making your posts look strange.

[Jay S]

"Desk Rabbit" wrote in message
news:jf12rq$lpm$1...@deskrabbit.motzarella.org...

---------------------------------------------------
I guess I'll remain ignorant, 'cause once again you replied to my post.

Jay S