Debate: Are 100w amps obsolete?
Mark Delsing
This has come up pretty often in all of these newsgroups, but I'd like
to open the subject to debate:
Are 100w amps obsolete?
Lately, I tend to think that they are. Big Marshall stacks and 100w
Twins were invented for an age virtually devoid of quality PA
equipment and for musicians playing enourmous venues. I know that
there is something afforded by having all this power (e.g, headroom),
but I've never been in a situation where it was necessary. Maybe I'm
just getting old (at the ripe age of 26), but who really needs all
that power?
My band, Butterman, plays regularly in clubs all over Chicago. My old
amp (a 60w Acoustic head) and my current amp (Boogie Mark IV 35w-85w)
have never needed to be turned up past 3 or 4 for any show I have ever
done. Virtually every soundman I've worked with has had nothing but
scorn for players with big Marshall stacks and 400w bass rigs. Guys
with these amps either end up killing everybody in the club or turning
down to a point where, of course, the amp sounds like crap. My bass
player goes direct (no cabinet, just a preamp) and I just have a 1x12
EV cab (though I may upgrade to 2x12 or 4x10), and soundmen love us,
and we get complimented on our tone all the time.
What do people think? Does anybody really need a 120w Boogie Triple
Rectifier?
Mark Delsing mdel...@enteract.com
EnterAct, L.L.C. http://www.enteract.com
773-248-8511
"Be it a highwayman who confronts a traveler with the
ultimatum: 'Your money or your life,' or a politician
who confronts a country with the ultimatum: 'Your
children's education or your life,' the meaning of
that ultimatum is : 'Your mind or your life'--and
neither is possible to man without the other."
Mark Swanson
Christopher Brown wrote:
>
> Mark Delsing <mdel...@enteract.com> wrote in article
> <333d7316...@news.enteract.com>...
> > This has come up pretty often in all of these newsgroups, but I'd like
> > to open the subject to debate:
> >
> > Are 100w amps obsolete?
> >
> > Lately, I tend to think that they are. Big Marshall stacks and 100w
>
> Yeah, I know what you mean. I went from a Carvin Tube 100 power amp (50W a
> side) to a Mesa-Boogie Simulclass 2:90 to compliment my Triaxis preamp but
> its 90W a side is harder to harness. At three on the preamp I'm pounding
> everybody.
>
> The key to good sounding groups is keeping stage volume down a bit. I love
> my 6L6 (or 5881) tubes but wow, I play me preamp at "3".
I agree. After playing thru a Marshall 100 watt JMP, I now use a Marshall Artist
3203 (30 watts) thru a 4x12 cab. If it is not loud enough on it's own (rare), I
simply mic it. The other guitar player in my band has one full Marshall stack
and is crying for another. It seems to be an "appearance" thing for him. Any
venue large enough to require 100 watt guitar amps will certainly have an
adequate PA. Sheesh.
mark
Pete
> Mark Delsing <mdel...@enteract.com> wrote in article
> <333d7316...@news.enteract.com>...
> > This has come up pretty often in all of these newsgroups, but I'd like
> > to open the subject to debate:
> >
> > Are 100w amps obsolete?
I think so. I've used a 15 watt Fender Pro Junior for club gigs and yes,
I've been told to turn down. By someone using a Bassman knockoff. I'm not a
bass player so I can't address that end of it because i'm not familiar with
the equipment any more.
I have an old Supro Thunderbolt that only really has the juice when its
cranked and it's really too loud for many club gigs. I often use my two Pro
Juniors in stereo and its usually enough. On a stage where the amos are all
miked, why not use something smaller, keep the stage volume down and be
kinder to your ears?...pete
Christopher Brown
Mark Delsing <mdel...@enteract.com> wrote in article
<333d7316...@news.enteract.com>...
> This has come up pretty often in all of these newsgroups, but I'd like
> to open the subject to debate:
>
> Are 100w amps obsolete?
>
Liam Casey
> Are 100w amps obsolete?
>
> Lately, I tend to think that they are. Big Marshall stacks and 100w
> equipment and for musicians playing enourmous venues. I know that
> there is something afforded by having all this power (e.g, headroom),
> but I've never been in a situation where it was necessary. Maybe I'm
> just getting old (at the ripe age of 26), but who really needs all
> that power?
> My band, Butterman, plays regularly in clubs all over Chicago. My old
> amp (a 60w Acoustic head) and my current amp (Boogie Mark IV 35w-85w)
> have never needed to be turned up past 3 or 4 for any show I have ever
> done. Virtually every soundman I've worked with has had nothing but
> scorn for players with big Marshall stacks and 400w bass rigs. Guys
> with these amps either end up killing everybody in the club or turning
> down to a point where, of course, the amp sounds like crap. My bass
> player goes direct (no cabinet, just a preamp) and I just have a 1x12
> EV cab (though I may upgrade to 2x12 or 4x10), and soundmen love us,
> and we get complimented on our tone all the time.
> What do people think? Does anybody really need a 120w Boogie Triple
> Rectifier?
>
as hell would be better on my back. But I have yet to find a bass amp that
will sound decent without a substantial amount of power. All of the
smaller amps never seem to get the nice "feel it more then hear it" lows.
Also, I wouldn't want to rely on the sound systems of alot of clubs.
Liam Casey
cas...@golden.net
Fly on! free bird!
Christopher Brown wrote:
>
> Mark Delsing <mdel...@enteract.com> wrote in article
> <333d7316...@news.enteract.com>...
> > This has come up pretty often in all of these newsgroups, but I'd like
> > to open the subject to debate:
> >
> >
> > Lately, I tend to think that they are. Big Marshall stacks and 100w
>
> Yeah, I know what you mean. I went from a Carvin Tube 100 power amp (50W a
> side) to a Mesa-Boogie Simulclass 2:90 to compliment my Triaxis preamp but
> its 90W a side is harder to harness. At three on the preamp I'm pounding
> everybody.
>
> The key to good sounding groups is keeping stage volume down a bit. I love
> my 6L6 (or 5881) tubes but wow, I play me preamp at "3".
Mebbe since the trend is toward smaller amps, but in all honesty, sure,
a BF Deluxe gives a nice, creamy overdrive, but it certainly does not
sound like a 100watt marshall's crunch, and note clarity, and on that
note, the 50watt marshalls (we are talking the old 4-prongers, not the
new marshalls) sound totally different.... just so happens, I am cursed
with the love of the sound of the old 100watt superleads.. sorry, but
that is the tone I am after, and nothing else comes close... sooo what I
am saying is that, sure the trends may be toward smaller amps, and you
can get 'pretty close" tones with soem of these, but you can't get the
real thing... Same as a twin... sure a Super can sound close, as well as
some other tube amps, but then again, they dont sound EXACTLY like a BF
twin... now, in the day of large pa's and attenuators like the THD
hotplate, you can get that sound at lower STAGE volumes.. so, no, large
amps are NOT dead... jsut reserved for us who are truly alternative
these days and play rock and roll, not artsy stuff that is CALLED
alternative (which, how can something that is on the top40 be called
alternative is way beyond me, but lets not start that arguement)
Matt
mdel...@enteract.com (Mark Delsing) wrote:
>This has come up pretty often in all of these newsgroups, but I'd like
>to open the subject to debate:Are 100w amps obsolete?
>Lately, I tend to think that they are. Big Marshall stacks and 100w
>Twins were invented for an age virtually devoid of quality PA
>equipment and for musicians playing enourmous venues...(snip)...
>Virtually every soundman I've worked with has had nothing but
>scorn for players with big Marshall stacks and 400w bass rigs. Guys
>with these amps either end up killing everybody in the club or turning
>down to a point where, of course, the amp sounds like crap...(SNIP)
Here's like about 100 cents worth...I guess I'm one of those
crank-it-up guys who used to make the sound guys mad...my
listening/playing pleasure at their expense you know, but roadies are
prone to whining about this and that...aren't they?
I would agree that the 100 watts are an endangered species, in that
they do seem to be having a hard time finding habitat in which they
can live and work without the neighbours and techies
complaining...they're also a pain in the back to move around, if
you've got 'em in hd roadcases!
Lately, for me, and I know it's true for others in struggling indie
bands, the gigs seem to be happening in smaller and smaller venues,
with smaller & smaller PA boxes, and roadies. I don't believe this is
so much an indication of a downturn in my own career, but rather in
the whole live scene itself. There just don't seem to be many clubs
with the big ol' stages that there used to be, and it's hard to
justify using a amp that's bigger/louder than the front of house
stuff! Especially with that guy whining at you. I also note that a
lot of clubs with nice house systems seem to have passed on buying
nice monitors to go with the FOH. I've seen monitors that look like
they should be on the rear shelf of a Hyundai.
However, I'll never forget the first time I "tenned" my Super Lead 100
and fed it an open G chord...sounded like God and All His Angels
descending from Harmonic Heaven. Earshplittenloudenboomen, of course,
but, for recording, and sheer self-gratification....that TONE! I'll
never part with my 100 watt Marshalls, but I've gotta admit, for live
gigs, I've used my 50 watters far more.
The last bunch of years my favourite club amp has become the Fender
Super Reverb, down in the 40-50 watt range. Not too big, just tens
(albeit a lot of them), and great with a fuzzbox. The Marshalls sit
in their cases, likely waiting for that day when I'll jam with Jimi...
I guess my response, with respect to live gigs, would be, Yes, 100
watts are fast becoming obsolete, but their sound is never going to be
duplicated by any small amp or fuzzbox.
The last guy I saw trying to use one in a club had the cab facing the
wall, and all kinds of plexiglass baffles and stuff...a true keeper of
the flame, I guess.
Matt
*loco...@adan.kingston.net
(please remove the * to e-mail me)
John Templeton
Mark Delsing wrote:
>
> This has come up pretty often in all of these newsgroups, but I'd like
> to open the subject to debate:
>
> Are 100w amps obsolete?
>
beautiful old amps many of us crave, you'll see that they were low
powered. As the power race developed speaker makers went to really poor
speakers, very inefficient and made to be beaten. You have to have a lot
of power to get those things on point. The old speaker designs are part
of our lust for old amps. Very efficient, light, responsive. And guess
what?, you can get great tone with lower powered amps. I spent an hour
one Sat. talking to Ted Weber at his machine shop, discussing his ideas
on this subject and he was right on. His vintage speaker line are all
low power relatively speaking. I think we've all forgotten what 20 watts
rms of tube power sounds like when properly designed. I just finished
putting one of Weber's speakers in a Deluxe Reverb. At first the sound
was good but I could over kill the speaker. I went back and made some
minor adjustments to the tone stack (more of a 50's bassman style) and
it now is a killer. I'd put it into any situation for playing because
now that the whole amp is balanced it has a sound that cuts through
anything. So to wrap up this long (sorry) post, I say let's go back to
the future. Focus on tone not wattage.
Regards,
John Templeton
Jeff Sutton
Hey,
Yeah, I think that 100w amps come from a different time and place; there
used to be a need to make a guitar heard all the way to the back of a
2,500 seat theater. Think of the Beatles playing Dodger Stadium; they
used 100w amps as the only source of guitar amplification - - only the
vocals went through the PA!
I've been playing 20w amps for years, and really think that they are
appropriate more of the time than larger amps. I don't say this from
ignorance; at one time I owned an awesome BF Twin Reverb with stock
"Fender" JBL's, a great sounding BF Super Reverb, and a little BF
Princeton Reverb upgraded with a 12" speaker. When it came time to gig,
the Twin was for outdoor gigs, the Super for clubs, and the Princeton
was used for bar gigs and practice. As we played mostly in bars, the
Princeton was the most used over time.
Still have the Princeton and Super, but I sold the Twin long ago . . .
too damn heavy and too damn loud for my needs. I started playing with a
blues band about a year ago, and they just about laughed me out of the
room when I showed up for the first practice with my Princeton. The
other guitar guy had a 4x10 Blues DeVille, and it was just plain loud.
No one else could hear over the DeVille, so the drummer played harder
and the bass guy was turned way up. Even brought my Super to a few
practices, but the louder we played the less we could hear each other.
We now play through 20w amps, and get a great sound. I retired my
trusty old Princeton for a Tone King Imperial, and the other guitar guy
now uses a BF Deluxe Reverb. We have lot's of tone, play at a volume
where we can all hear each other, and don't have problems with sound
guys at gigs. We both look forward to gigs that enable us to bring our
big amps, but most of the time our "little" amps do just fine.
later,
Jeff
Jeannie
*loco...@adan.kingston.net (Matt) wrote:
>mdel...@enteract.com (Mark Delsing) wrote:
>>This has come up pretty often in all of these newsgroups, but I'd like
>>to open the subject to debate:Are 100w amps obsolete?
A year ago I went to see a friends new power trio play a the local
headbanging emporium. To my suprise he had 2 100 watt Marshalls
perched atop full stacks. The band was great but louder than the end
of the world. During a set break I asked him if this sonic assault
was necessary.
Wandering on stage to his rig he said "look behind it but don't tell a
soul." The Marshalls were on standby, the cabinets were empty and
behind them was and old super miked! It turns out the roar was all
house pa and my friend rightly judged that the fake ID beer swillers
were more impressed by the looks of this dinosaur setup than they
would have been by a puny little 50 watt super reverb.
Matthew Ivaliotes
Mark Delsing wrote:
> Are 100w amps obsolete?
One more 'yes' vote here. I have seen many a club band that would have
been great if they weren't Too Damn Loud. I'm not going to pay good
money to go to a show that's going to damage my hearing. No way.
Some bands seem to think that they're getting paid to play for
themselves, so they pop in the ear plugs, crank up the stacks to get
'their tone,' and blast away. They completely ignore the fact that most
of their paying customers are lined up along the back wall, and no one
is less than 50 feet away from the stage (except for that one deaf chick
who happens the be the guitarist's girlfriend).
Others have touched on the fact that some sound men are just as bad.
I've seen bands with relatively modest setups that were cranked up to
deafening levels by the (possibly deaf) PA operator. The day will come
when club owners will wise up and have a PA master volume knob tucked
away somewhere behind the bar where it can't get bumped, but in easy
reach when the PA-afflicted get oppressive.
And I still can't get over the fact that half the time, when I go see a
live band at the local COFFEE HOUSE, I have to sit along the back wall
because the idiots are playing acoustic guitars (with Markley pickups)
and singing vocals through the 200-watt PA system that they brought with
them. The place is maybe 10 feet by 30 feet.
One bass player I saw had a 300-watt amp turned up to about 6 in that
place. I asked him if his goal was to use the entire place as a speaker
through sympathetic vibrations, and he acted like I was calling him
cool. The pinhead.
I guess I'm lucky. The guitar tones which have always grabbed me the
most have been ones that I've heard from amps like the 22-watt Fender
Deluxe Reverbs, 15-watt Matchless Lightnings, and 20/10-watt
(selectable) Mesa/Boogie Subway Blues, as well as a variety of nice
preamps and direct/distortion boxes. I just can't enjoy a tone that is
physically painful. Call me crazy.
Matt I.
Chris
On Sat, 29 Mar 1997 19:24:48 -0800, Mark Swanson
>> >
>> > Lately, I tend to think that they are. Big Marshall stacks and 100w
>>
>> its 90W a side is harder to harness. At three on the preamp I'm pounding
>> everybody.
>>
>> The key to good sounding groups is keeping stage volume down a bit. I love
>> my 6L6 (or 5881) tubes but wow, I play me preamp at "3".
>
>3203 (30 watts) thru a 4x12 cab. If it is not loud enough on it's own (rare), I
>simply mic it. The other guitar player in my band has one full Marshall stack
>and is crying for another. It seems to be an "appearance" thing for him. Any
>venue large enough to require 100 watt guitar amps will certainly have an
>adequate PA. Sheesh.
It seems that a lot of people still buy high powered stuff that's way
more than they need, though. Our other guitarist plays this Crate
120w 1/2 stack and he never gets to turn it up past 2 or 3. I just
bought a mesa DC-3 and I can't even crank that (Through a 4x12) up
half way. We don't play large stadiums, so it seems like anything
more than 30 watts or so is total overkill...
Chris
____________________
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Randall Aiken
Matthew Ivaliotes wrote:
>
> Mark Delsing wrote:
>
> > Are 100w amps obsolete?
> I've seen bands with relatively modest setups that were cranked up to
> deafening levels by the (possibly deaf) PA operator. The day will come
> when club owners will wise up and have a PA master volume knob tucked
> away somewhere behind the bar where it can't get bumped, but in easy
> reach when the PA-afflicted get oppressive.
I've always thought so too, until a gig last night at a new, fairly
large club. My band has a rather decent PA, tri-amped, couple thousand
watts or so into some serious dual 18 bottoms on each side, along with
dual mid and high cabinets, each with more than enough power amp behind
them to blow the drivers...it'll curl your hair. The club owner
actually kept telling us to turn it up. At the end of the night he told
us we'd better have more PA the next time we play there. Go figure.
RA
Matthew Ivaliotes
Randall Aiken wrote:
> I've always thought so too, until a gig last night at a new, fairly
> large club. My band has a rather decent PA, tri-amped, couple thousand
> watts or so into some serious dual 18 bottoms on each side, along with
> dual mid and high cabinets, each with more than enough power amp behind
> them to blow the drivers...it'll curl your hair. The club owner
> actually kept telling us to turn it up. At the end of the night he told
> us we'd better have more PA the next time we play there. Go figure.
Yeesh. Maybe he's deaf, and/or knows his clients are deaf from previous
bands. That's just too much. But hey, at least you got to use your
stuff, I guess.
Matt I.
John Kelley Brown
Over the years I've noticed that the more professional a guitar player
is, the less he/she luggs around. By professional I mean those who
truly make a living at playing guitar. The best guitar players I know
started out with big stacks, went down to a head and a 2x12, then down
to a Super Reverb or Deluxe, their effects a spartan 2 or 3 pedals.
Gigging guitar players want just enough amp to pull off the gig and not
one watt more, that's where the tonal sweet spot is! Jerry Donahue
brought this down to just a D.I. box,(I have one, I hate the way it
sounds).
However, if you have not plugged into an original 100 watt Marshall
Plexi Superlead and cranked it to around 6 or 7, in a large room, then
you don't know what you are missing! Unfortunately there is no way to
get that sound at a lower volume, not even if you Power Soak it, Power
Break it, Hot Plate it, forget it.
I've compromised, I now own an old '68 Plexi Marshall 50 watt, I play
it through an old Fender 2x12 cab outfitted with Celestion 30s. I love
it! I use a Hot Plate to bring the volume to just a little louder than
a Vox AC30, but lower that that the Hot Plate makes the amp sound
horrible. I'm not a professional or I probably would be playing through
a Deluxe Reverb, but I'm really not crazy about the sound of 6V6 or 6L6
amps.
There is always going to be a place for certain 100 watt amps but for
the most part they will not hit their sweet spot at most venues, and
it's the sweet spot where you want your amp to be working. The best
guitar players use this to their advantage.
JKB
Matthew Amster-Burton
On Sun, 30 Mar 1997, Matthew Ivaliotes wrote:
> I guess I'm lucky. The guitar tones which have always grabbed me the
> most have been ones that I've heard from amps like the 22-watt Fender
> Deluxe Reverbs, 15-watt Matchless Lightnings, and 20/10-watt
> (selectable) Mesa/Boogie Subway Blues, as well as a variety of nice
> preamps and direct/distortion boxes. I just can't enjoy a tone that is
> physically painful. Call me crazy.
Indeed. I saw a couple of bands in a Berkeley bar recently; the first
had two guitarists playing through Mesa half-stacks, and they were loud
enough to melt metal (though the tone was pretty good). The second band
had one guitarist playing through an Ampeg Jet, unmiked, and the tone was
magnificent. I got the CD, and the guitar sounds even better. Little
amps are nice things most of the time.
Greg Siegel
Mark Delsing wrote:
>
> This has come up pretty often in all of these newsgroups, but I'd like
> to open the subject to debate:
>
> Are 100w amps obsolete?
Yes. I have a Mesa Boogie Trem-O-Verb that I can't even take out and
use on a gig. The damn thing is too loud -- even with pulling out two
of the power tubes and one of the rectifiers.
I am now of the feeling that 35 watts is more than enough even to play
high powered blues in Texas. Hell, everyone in our group uses low power
rigs and still all we need to use the PA for is vocals. \
Go figure.
Greg
Clarke P. Robertson
> >
> I would love to be able to tame my equipment down to a little amp, sure
> as hell would be better on my back. But I have yet to find a bass amp that
> will sound decent without a substantial amount of power. All of the
> smaller amps never seem to get the nice "feel it more then hear it" lows.
> Also, I wouldn't want to rely on the sound systems of alot of clubs.
>
> Liam Casey
> cas...@golden.net
I think that people on this thread are referring to guitar rather than
bass. Lead and rhythm guitar takes considerably less wattage than
bass. There are, however, some bass amps out now which are compact and
light but really powerful too. Check out Hartke and SWR. Just my 2
cents worth.
Carl Fiadino
The more 100 watt heads the better. When I perform "live" in
my room, I like to have a couple of 100 watt heads ready to go.
Carl
Guitar Al
> This has come up pretty often in all of these newsgroups, but I'd like
> to open the subject to debate:
>
> Are 100w amps obsolete?
Hmmm,
Just not very practical. A couple years ago I downsized to a 50watt JCM
900 1X12 combo, that has power cut switch to 25 watts. Its all I need.
The other guitar player in my band has an old plexi head and 4X12 cab.
Looks cool, and he lugs the damn thing around all over the place (fool).
But, I consistently get a better sound at practice and at gigs, while he
can't get past 1-2 and it really sounds like crap. He even turns the amp
to the wall and himself, but still too loud. I have a 1X12 extension cab
to give a little better throw when needed but otherwise its just fine.
This all reminds me of when I saw Rush when I was 16 or so. I was so
disappointed when Lifeson just had this one sad little combo (mesa-boogie
I think) sitting at the very back of the stage lost in equipment (even
then I was an equipment freak, so I always walked around the stage before
show to see if I could spot the equipment). But, when he started playing
the sound was huge AND good, blew me away.
Al
>
> Lately, I tend to think that they are. Big Marshall stacks and 100w
> Twins were invented for an age virtually devoid of quality PA
> equipment and for musicians playing enourmous venues. I know that
> there is something afforded by having all this power (e.g, headroom),
> but I've never been in a situation where it was necessary. Maybe I'm
> just getting old (at the ripe age of 26), but who really needs all
> that power?
> My band, Butterman, plays regularly in clubs all over Chicago. My old
> amp (a 60w Acoustic head) and my current amp (Boogie Mark IV 35w-85w)
> have never needed to be turned up past 3 or 4 for any show I have ever
> done. Virtually every soundman I've worked with has had nothing but
> scorn for players with big Marshall stacks and 400w bass rigs. Guys
> with these amps either end up killing everybody in the club or turning
> down to a point where, of course, the amp sounds like crap. My bass
> player goes direct (no cabinet, just a preamp) and I just have a 1x12
> EV cab (though I may upgrade to 2x12 or 4x10), and soundmen love us,
> and we get complimented on our tone all the time.
> What do people think? Does anybody really need a 120w Boogie Triple
> Rectifier?
>
Ed
The other guitarist in my old band had a nice assortment of amps that he
used to rotate through for practice and gigging, ranging from a BF
Deluxe Reverb, an Ampeg Jet, and a early-70's Marshall 100-watt full
stack (Super Lead?). IMO, the best tone he had was with either his
Strats or PRS Custom through the BF Deluxe Reverb. The stack sounded
really nice(non-master volume) but loud enough at about 4 for what we
needed as a cover band, whereas he could remember tenning it back at his
gigs in the 70's (whistful shake of the head...) I play a rack system
(begone, godless sinner!!!)consisting of a Mesa Quad tube preamp into a
Mesa 295 tube power amp at the Class A power setting (30 watts per
channel) into an Ampeg stereo 2-12 cab. With careful adjustment of the
EQ, my Korg A3 doesn't sound too brittle for effects, and the rig is
loud enough for what I like to do. For the size places we played, I
prefer the lower wattage amps for the tone and also the fact that the
crowd stays and parties longer if you don't totally kill them with
excessive sound levels (might also get rebooked because the crowd stays
longer and spends more $$$-always a good thing for the bar AND band)
Having played in the band as guitarist and bassist, I think that the
bass requires more wattage, roughly twice as much as guitar to be
effective. Of course, larger venues might require miking to fill, but I
think tone is more important than sheer volume(although trying to ride
100 watts of pissed-off Marshall is an E-ticket ride all the way and I
wouldn't want to do that EVERY night...)
Best wishes, Ed
Fly on! free bird!
EXACTLY... the TRENDY SOUND is that of smaller amps, but none of us can
dispute the fact that a BF Deluxe cannot ever sound like a 100watt
marshall, nor can a 50watt marshall... the point is, yea, the current
trend is to use saller amps (even richie blackmore is using smaller
amps,) but the tone is definitely different, not better by any means,
but not worse either, jsut different... I guess I am just unlucky enough
to enjoy the sound of a 100 watt super lead more than anything else....
Matthew Ivaliotes
Fly on! free bird! wrote:
> EXACTLY... the TRENDY SOUND is that of smaller amps, but none of us can
> dispute the fact that a BF Deluxe cannot ever sound like a 100watt
> marshall, nor can a 50watt marshall... the point is, yea, the current
> trend is to use saller amps (even richie blackmore is using smaller
> amps,) but the tone is definitely different, not better by any means,
> but not worse either, jsut different... I guess I am just unlucky enough
> to enjoy the sound of a 100 watt super lead more than anything else....
Trendy is not appropriate to describe it. Yes, it is becoming more
popular, but it's not because small amps are becoming 'cool.' There are
pracitcal reasons behind the change, the biggest reasons being the lack
of practical applications for the stacks and the ease and reduced
weight/expense/hassle of using a smaller amp.
I agree that each amp has a unique sound, and that if you want that
amp's sound, you pretty much have to have that amp or settle for an
approximation. But small amps are simply far more practical.
Matt I.
MANNIX
Mark Delsing wrote:
>
> This has come up pretty often in all of these newsgroups, but I'd like
> to open the subject to debate:
>
> Are 100w amps obsolete?
>
Mark I'm afraid you are correct.......
I am a dynasour of years gone past...my basement has 18 Marshall
cabinets (all green back 20's and 30's) and 6 Plexi 100 watters and 2
JTM-45's collecting inches of dust.Some of my 100 Watters are the
aluminum ones that use KT66 valves. I left music scene because it sucks
and no-one likes quality anymore.Good soundmen know how to work with 100
watt amps...Most of the knob turners found today want to feel like there
in a studio environment.The good sounding plexi 100 watters on 10 are
not that loud and brutal..It is the later amps that are brighter and
shrill that hurt your ears...A SVT bass amp is punchy and deep and is a
pleasure to listen to...
C.M.
Tremolux
I think it's a question of personal preference and particular application.
I have a Twin that gets used maybe once a year, and then only at outdoor
gigs. It's just too loud for anything else I play. I use smaller amps
99% of the time, either a Deluxe Reverb or a 61 2x10 Super, and they are
plenty for a club.
With all that said, my friend Jay Graydon prefers 100 Watters because he
says they record better. Go figure.
Lester Long
In <333E7D...@worldchat.com> John Templeton <jte...@worldchat.com>
writes:
>Mark Delsing wrote:
>>
>> This has come up pretty often in all of these newsgroups, but I'd
like
>> to open the subject to debate:
>>
>> Are 100w amps obsolete?
>>
I happen to have a Marshall 100w with a 4x12 cab. I also happen to
live in a one bedroom apt in NYC. I agree with the point that modern
systems can allow a 10w speaker to sound good, and actually very loud
for us home users.
However, on those rare ocassions when I am able (or perhaps forced, by
a neighbor who listened to excessively loud rap music) to crank it,
there is little to compare to the tone of my setup. In addition, one
does not really need to crank it for it to sound good, and I believe I
have never had the volume above 5 on all the knobs but maybe 3 times.
James P. H. Fuller
Matt (*loco...@adan.kingston.net) wrote:
: Lately, for me, and I know it's true for others in struggling indie
: bands, the gigs seem to be happening in smaller and smaller venues,
: with smaller & smaller PA boxes, and roadies.
The roadies are getting smaller?
Pete
> Trendy is not appropriate to describe it. Yes, it is becoming more
> popular, but it's not because small amps are becoming 'cool.' There are
> pracitcal reasons behind the change, the biggest reasons being the lack
> of practical applications for the stacks and the ease and reduced
> weight/expense/hassle of using a smaller amp.
>
> I agree that each amp has a unique sound, and that if you want that
> amp's sound, you pretty much have to have that amp or settle for an
> approximation. But small amps are simply far more practical.
Matt, I've used my two Pro Juniors with a reverb pedal and a TS-9 (yes, a
sinful reissue and it sounds just fine) for club gigs and been told to turn
down. I've messed around with 'em enough to know where the sweet spot is in
each amp. 30 watts into two 10s. In the clubs I've played it was. I've been
known to use an MXR Dyna-Comp on occasion too. Just to squeeze the sound a
bit...pete
Rob Dobson
In article <333EC0...@hie.com>, Matthew Ivaliotes <matthew....@hie.com> says:
>
>Mark Delsing wrote:
>
>> Are 100w amps obsolete?
>
>been great if they weren't Too Damn Loud.
BOTH MY MUSICMAN AND MY MARSHALL ARE 100 WATTS AND I DON'T THINK
THEY'RE TOO LOUD!!!
STEVIE ROB
Mel Waldorf
On Sun, 30 Mar 1997, Greg Siegel wrote:
> Mark Delsing wrote:
> >
> > This has come up pretty often in all of these newsgroups, but I'd like
> > to open the subject to debate:
> >
> > Are 100w amps obsolete?
>
> Yes. I have a Mesa Boogie Trem-O-Verb that I can't even take out and
> use on a gig. The damn thing is too loud -- even with pulling out two
> of the power tubes and one of the rectifiers.
>
> I am now of the feeling that 35 watts is more than enough even to play
> high powered blues in Texas. Hell, everyone in our group uses low power
> rigs and still all we need to use the PA for is vocals. \
>
Here's one vote in favor of 100W (OK, 85W) amps. I play in an instrument
surf music band, and big Fender amps are crucial - I use a '63 dual
Showman and our other guitar player uses a '67 Twin Reverb. I think the
big difference is that we want to sound clean at any volume. Even when
we play decent sized rooms (250-300 cap.) I never turn my amp up over
half.
I think you'd find similar sentiments among some country and steel players.
Mel
BENSONGREER
I keep seeing the BF Deluxe Reverb come up in this discussion. I'm
in the market for an amp in that power size. Is the BF a reissue or due
you have to buy vintage? I've also been looking at the Mesa Blue Angel.
I like the switchable tubes.
Any comments on this or other recommendations would be
appreciated.(need to stay in the $1k range)
thanx
Bill Spencer
> > done. Virtually every soundman I've worked with has had nothing but
> > scorn for players with big Marshall stacks and 400w bass rigs.
I've seen a few that complain that my 15W amp is drowning out the vocals
as well. Maybe I should bring along a 100 watter for those ;-).
Bill
Rob Dobson
In article <333F32...@hie.com>, Matthew Ivaliotes <matthew....@hie.com> says:
>Trendy is not appropriate to describe it. Yes, it is becoming more
>popular, but it's not because small amps are becoming 'cool.' There are
>pracitcal reasons behind the change, the biggest reasons being the lack
>of practical applications for the stacks and the ease and reduced
>weight/expense/hassle of using a smaller amp.
It's the damn attitudes, you see. Why, when I was a boy, guitarists
wanted/needed the biggest and loudest amp that would fit in '63 VW bus.
We also wanted/needed drugs, alcohol, gratuitous sex, no sleep,
junk food and as much partying as possible.
Nowadays, musicians want/need practical gear, a healthy lifestyle and
a financial planner.
What the Hell happened?!
Stevie Rob
Greg Siegel
>
> >>This has come up pretty often in all of these newsgroups, but I'd like
> >>to open the subject to debate:Are 100w amps obsolete?
>
> headbanging emporium. To my suprise he had 2 100 watt Marshalls
> perched atop full stacks. The band was great but louder than the end
> of the world. During a set break I asked him if this sonic assault
> was necessary.
>
> Wandering on stage to his rig he said "look behind it but don't tell a
> soul." The Marshalls were on standby, the cabinets were empty and
> behind them was and old super miked! It turns out the roar was all
> house pa and my friend rightly judged that the fake ID beer swillers
> were more impressed by the looks of this dinosaur setup than they
> would have been by a puny little 50 watt super reverb.
I offer a standing ovation to this more than sensible artist -- although
those 'dummy' cabs take up the same amount of room as a real one. We
used to do some benefits with some heavy metal guys in Virginia who used
a bunch of Randall 'dummy' cabs. Look great and when the show is over,
you have a big box of air to store all of the cables.
Greg
--
Please remove the "_NoSpam" from the eMail address to send return eMail.
Dan Stanley
VW stopped making a decent microbus, that's what happened. Plus, I BECAME
a financial planner, and can now afford a Bentley.
Country Stevie Dan Fish
Daniel Foley
: I agree that each amp has a unique sound, and that if you want that
: amp's sound, you pretty much have to have that amp or settle for an
: approximation. But small amps are simply far more practical.
: Matt I.
Umm, some of us stompbox junkies want as much clean power as possible
to work with and that just isn't possible with a little blues machine amp.
There's more to this world than just that edge of distortion fender tone or
balls out marshall stack option. Don't forget those who swear by 100 watt
heads into one or 2 12"s and an acceptance of master volumes, flaws and all.
Mark Heustis
Yes, 100 watters are rarely needed these days.
I do remember the stack days and wear two hearing aids to constantly remind me.
Now my "The Twin" rarely leaves the house and I use a 15 watt Ampeg JetII to
play out.
Mark
Michael V. Baker
Pete wrote:
>
> In article <333F32...@hie.com>, matthew....@hie.com wrote:
>
> > Trendy is not appropriate to describe it. Yes, it is becoming more
> > popular, but it's not because small amps are becoming 'cool.' There are
> > pracitcal reasons behind the change, the biggest reasons being the lack
> > of practical applications for the stacks and the ease and reduced
> > weight/expense/hassle of using a smaller amp.
> >
> > amp's sound, you pretty much have to have that amp or settle for an
> > approximation. But small amps are simply far more practical.
>
> sinful reissue and it sounds just fine) for club gigs and been told to turn
> down. I've messed around with 'em enough to know where the sweet spot is in
> each amp. 30 watts into two 10s. In the clubs I've played it was. I've been
> known to use an MXR Dyna-Comp on occasion too. Just to squeeze the sound a
> bit...pete
God, I hope not since I just picked up a skookum vintage Hiwatt 100...
oh well, I can always yank the two outside EL34's and convert it to
a fifty... and Variac the voltage to 85... but first I have to
exterminate all the rodents in our warehouse complex with it. It's
guaranteed to gibble a gopher on 4... try that with yer Pro Junior!;)
--
Usenet: Half Fact... Half Friction
mailto:di...@agt.net
http://www.agt.net/public/digit/digit.htm
Greg Siegel
Roadie(s)?!? I've done more than my share of dues paying and have yet
to be able to afford to pay someone to haul my equipment -- I hope that
doesn't speak to how well (or badly) I play. Point is, if ya gotta
carry it yourself it damn well better be small (even if you want it to
sound like a wall of Marshalls).
Even more practical than that, My requirement is that everything fit in
my truck -- the PA and my rig; keeping in mind that *I* have to carry it
back to the truck, load it, and unload it when I get home. How much of
that do you want to do at 3:00 am when you have kids that will get up
early the next day (or even work if during the week).
All that said, smaller is better.
more that my $0.02,
Greg
Dallas Pryor
and the lights were right you could see the marshall cabs had holes
where the speakers went.
Actually my old Mesa Mk IIc (60w) and current Fender HR Deville (60w
4x10) are way loud. It's frustrating having these great amps and playing
with the volume set on 2. I think it might be better to spend less on the
amp and go out to find that great 60's Paul or Strat.
Fly on! free bird!
James P. H. Fuller wrote:
>
> Matt (*loco...@adan.kingston.net) wrote:
>
> : Lately, for me, and I know it's true for others in struggling indie
> : bands, the gigs seem to be happening in smaller and smaller venues,
> : with smaller & smaller PA boxes, and roadies.
>
> The roadies are getting smaller?
hmmm the ones I have seen have been getting bigger, at least around the
waist, ever since people started using smaller eqip..... now mebbe their
MINDS are getting smaller...
Fly on! free bird!
Bean wrote:
>
> > I keep seeing the BF Deluxe Reverb come up in this discussion. I'm
> > in the market for an amp in that power size. Is the BF a reissue or due
> > you have to buy vintage?
>
> determined to blow the whole $1000. I own a DR and a 30 watt Crate
Funny, 2 years ago, you could buy an original BF deluxe for under $300,
and even today, if you spend more than $500, you are paying too much
Fly on! free bird!
of course you woulndt think they are too loud... by the looks of how you
are typing, you are already half deaf ;)
Bean
> I keep seeing the BF Deluxe Reverb come up in this discussion. I'm
> in the market for an amp in that power size. Is the BF a reissue or due
> you have to buy vintage?
That's a sweet amp--don't limit yourself to blackface unless you're
determined to blow the whole $1000. I own a DR and a 30 watt Crate Vintage
30. I was taken in by the Blue Angel advertising, but unimpressed by the
tone when I actually got around to playing one. My Crate, while seriously
unroadworthy, does the class A EL84 thing better than the Boogie, and my DR
blows it right out of the water. You could theoretically buy both for
under $1000.
AlanN
On 31 Mar 1997 20:29:55 GMT, r.do...@sk.sympatico.ca (Rob Dobson)
wrote:
*In article <333F32...@hie.com>, Matthew Ivaliotes
<matthew....@hie.com> says:
*>Trendy is not appropriate to describe it. Yes, it is becoming more
*>popular, but it's not because small amps are becoming 'cool.' There
are
*>pracitcal reasons behind the change, the biggest reasons being the
lack
*>of practical applications for the stacks and the ease and reduced
*>weight/expense/hassle of using a smaller amp.
*
*It's the damn attitudes, you see. Why, when I was a boy, guitarists
*wanted/needed the biggest and loudest amp that would fit in '63 VW
bus.
*We also wanted/needed drugs, alcohol, gratuitous sex, no sleep,
*junk food and as much partying as possible.
*
Hey! This is no lie!! I had a '72 Marshall SuperLead MKII ( that I
was too young and stupid to KNOW WHAT I HAD back then! ) and a
Marshall 8x10"! I drove a 71 bug..
I got the 8x10" in the back seat of the VW!
Alan
************************************************
alann(removethis)@intrlink.com
( sig done like this to cut out the junk mail I get! )
ham radio : km...@w4ca.va.usa.noam
I frequently visit SBS-6 and Galaxy K-4!
***************************************************
pl...@his.com
In <5hp6s3$q...@mongol.sasknet.sk.ca>, r.do...@sk.sympatico.ca (Rob Dobson) writes:
>In article <333F32...@hie.com>, Matthew Ivaliotes <matthew....@hie.com> says:
>>Trendy is not appropriate to describe it. Yes, it is becoming more
>
>
>a financial planner.
>
>What the Hell happened?!
>
>Stevie Rob
Jimi, Janis, Jim, Brian, Keith and countless others who followed their path died
or went insane.
Greg Jones
that I've seen for guitar has 50 watts at a minimum.
Michael Cullen
mdel...@enteract.com (Mark Delsing), far, far away from here, appears to have
written:
>This has come up pretty often in all of these newsgroups, but I'd like
>to open the subject to debate:
>
>Are 100w amps obsolete?
Yep. I've got a 30 watt Marshall and it's *plenty* loud enough. Further
benefit - stops me from getting harassed by my wife (the Audiologist :-)
cheers,
Stevie Mic
Cross Purposes Studios (Web & Graphic Design)
http://netserv.net.au/tiger/
Robert Fries
"Fly on! free bird!" <gior...@bellatlantic.net> wrote:
>Bean wrote:
>>
>> > I keep seeing the BF Deluxe Reverb come up in this discussion. I'm
>> > in the market for an amp in that power size. Is the BF a reissue or due
>> > you have to buy vintage?
>>
>> That's a sweet amp--don't limit yourself to blackface unless you're
>> determined to blow the whole $1000. I own a DR and a 30 watt Crate
>Funny, 2 years ago, you could buy an original BF deluxe for under $300,
>and even today, if you spend more than $500, you are paying too much
Maybe 5-6 years ago, $300-$400, but nowadays, I'd sure like to run across some
nice, original, BF Deluxe Reverb's for $500; I'd buy all I could find.
RF
*****************
Robert Fries
415-988-9475
rfr...@netcom.com
*****************
Michael V. Baker
Randy Smith of Mesa Engineering says it is OK to pull out either the
outside or inside pair of output tubes and run it 50W. This way you
always have a spare pair of output tubes, and you don't get hassled by
the SPCA for blowing up small mammals! Further easy mods include making
your own extension cord with a junction box containing a fan or light
dimmer control (aka: Variac.) Nowadays, a guy has to pay $2000 just to
get an amp that has these 2 simple "mods" built in. Just set the Variac
where a 100W light bulb glows "brown"... 80-85V. Where have we heard
that before? You can always convert it back to break any iron clad lease
in a minute;D
Starfire (JCA)
Why the hell would they be obsolete. No guitar item becomes obsolete they
become better and better. 100w acoustic amp by trace elliot is louder than
I can stand at volume level 2. You don't need more than 45 watts unless
you're a pro and even then you use a pa system.
Bean
> Why don't manufacturers make low wattage power amps? Every power amp
> that I've seen for guitar has 50 watts at a minimum.
I think 100 watter sales are perpetuated inexperienced buyers who shop
through mail order catalogs. Wow, look! I can get a 100 watt Marshall for
less than $100 bucks more than the fifty watt head! And that's twice as
good, right?!
Bean
> Funny, 2 years ago, you could buy an original BF deluxe for under $300,
> and even today, if you spend more than $500, you are paying too much
A thing is worth whatever someone is willing to shell out for it. In San
Francisco, where I live, DRs are more popular than Supers, more popular
than Twins. Vintage retailers like Univibe and Black Market sell several
silverface deluxes a week for up to $795! I found my SFDR for $400 after a
month of scouring want ads and was thrilled to get it. Your milage may
vary.
Bean
> Here's one vote in favor of 100W (OK, 85W) amps. I play in an instrument
> surf music band, and big Fender amps are crucial
This is the most compelling argument yet in the defense of high powered
amps. This thread presumes output tube overdrive as the ultimate goal--a
goal that not everyone shares. I used to play in a big funk combo and
nothing less than my monster VT-22 could crank out the volume to get those
clean single note skanks to an audible level. My chiropractor also loved
it!
John
Matt
r.do...@sk.sympatico.ca (Rob Dobson) wrote:
>BOTH MY MUSICMAN AND MY MARSHALL ARE 100 WATTS AND I DON'T THINK
>THEY'RE TOO LOUD!!!
>STEVIE ROB
WHAT WAS THAT, STEVIE ROB??? WHAT DID YOU SAY???? HUH? PARDON ME???
:) Matt
*loco...@adan.kingston.net
(please remove the * to e-mail me)
Thomas C. Clancy
I think you need one but not several 100watt heads for
a medium sized club. Not a small bar. It's better not to
have to rely on a PA to get the sound across, the soundman
can generally screw up the sound. They generally do.
For lead guitar, it's important to get that sound across. That's
the whole point of it. It also makes a huge difference
how hight the ceiling is. Some of theses places with high
ceiling can really take a lot more volume.
Barry Houtchen
I am amazed at the number of responses on this thread and
also by the (apparent) near consensus that 100W amps are
indeed obsolete. Maybe there is some hope for our eardrums
after all.
My roadie is getting pretty fat because he spends all his
time on the internet. He isn't getting any younger either.
Score one for smaller amps.
Which is all related to latest amp project:
I am thinking about taking my 50W Bassman head out of its
box and building an open backed combo cabinet for it. I have
seen such a conversion in an ad in Vintage guitar Magazine.
I have plywood, Tolex, and fierce determination. Anybody
have a comment on speakers, etc for such a project? I
figured 1x12 or 2x10 would match the head width and not be
too heavy.
mho,
Barry
who hears Stevie (SN 00001) spinning in his grave at the
prospect of playing through a single SF deluxe :)
e-mail b-hou...@ti.com
Reply to b-hou...@ti.com
.|
[|:-)~ SRV
.|
michael buening
Several interesting insights. I have an amp which is 100watt (or 50watt
if you through a switch) with a 4x12" cabinet that I bought when I was
in high school. The only PA available at the places we played was the
one we brought with us. At 1500watts it was sufficient for anyplace we
were likely to play but nothing fantastic. And when I first started we
only had an 8 channel mixing board. So only the lead guitar got mic'ed
and the bass and the two other guitars were on their own (fighting each
other, the drums, the keyboard, the lead singer and four backup singers
and the mic'ed lead guitarist who could fly a neat solo but couldn't find
the rhythym if it hit him in the face...he got better with age though).
So back to the subject at hand. I bought a 100watt amp mostly because it
was cool to be able to be that loud in rehearsal (everyone else had as
much or more) but it turned out to be rather necessary. And in an
outdoor situation it was almost hopeless. I could rarely, if ever,
hear myself since I wasn't going through the monitors (at least my
vocals were) and with 4 teenaged guitarists in one band we all had
them up way way way too loud.
So 11 years later I'm no longer in any bands (and would actually like
to sell my amplifier and speaker cabinet...another post perhaps :) and
spend any guitar time I have with an acoustic in the living room and I
look back and wonder if I *needed* a 100watt amp. Given the fact that
in the different various places we played I never put the volume
control more than 4 (out of 10) seems to indicate that I did not need
that much power as long as I was content with the severe overdrive
sound I was using (hey...we were playing Judas Priest). However if I
wanted the nice clean and mellow, but still loud, sound then yes I
needed everybit of that 100watts.
If we had had a better PA setup (and we did get a 14 channel board
while I was still with them...but who's got money for another microphone)
then a simple "practice" combo amp would have done fine. As long as
you have the tubes in there I don't think you need 100watts worth
of them. I had to compete, not complement, a 1500watt PA system
and the rest of the band and in that case I needed a larger amp.
Cheers!
--
Mike Buening
Dept. of Chemistry and Biochemistry
University of Notre Dame
mbue...@argon.helios.nd.edu http://www.nd.edu/~mbuening
Mark Delsing
On 30 Mar 1997 04:43:06 GMT, "Liam Casey" <cas...@golden.net> wrote:
> I would love to be able to tame my equipment down to a little amp, sure
>as hell would be better on my back. But I have yet to find a bass amp that
>will sound decent without a substantial amount of power. All of the
>smaller amps never seem to get the nice "feel it more then hear it" lows.
>Also, I wouldn't want to rely on the sound systems of alot of clubs.
>
>Liam Casey
>cas...@golden.net
I admit that bass amps are a little outside the discussion here, as
they require a higher minimum wattage, but I think the theory applies
the same. You're going to relying on the PA of any club, regardless of
whether you're going direct or not. Unless, of course, you don't mike
the bass at all, in which case you'll pobably end up killing one half
of the room and be unheard by the other. I don't want to put you down;
to each his own, but every band I've seen with a bassist with an
enormous rig (not counting serious concert venues) usually ends up
shattering my earplugs AND sounding none too good.
I thik the key here is this: I've played quite a few shows at this
point, and I'm finding it ridiculous that the standard situation in
even the smallest venues is the band having mounds of equipment and
wearing earplugs, and the audience either running away or wearing
earplugs. IF EVERYBODY'S WEARING EARPLUGS, MAYBE IT'S TIME TO TURN
DOWN! There are always those who love the deafening roar (and this
includes dance clubs, not just bands), but I'm getting real sick of
wearing earplugs all the time; it's pointless.
To be honest, a lot of times it's the soundguy's fault as well. One
place we play has these subwoofers (once owned by Black Sabbath!)
BUILT into the stage, each one about three feet on a side. The
soundguy cranks the PA and the stage monitors to match. It's
impressive for about three minutes, and then you just want to go
downstairs to the bar. All this in a room not much bigger than the
average garage!
Mark Delsing mdel...@enteract.com
EnterAct, L.L.C. http://www.enteract.com
773-248-8511
"Be it a highwayman who confronts a traveler with the
ultimatum: 'Your money or your life,' or a politician
who confronts a country with the ultimatum: 'Your
children's education or your life,' the meaning of
that ultimatum is : 'Your mind or your life'--and
neither is possible to man without the other."
Mark Delsing
On Mon, 31 Mar 1997 12:07:54 -0500, Mel Waldorf <sho...@cs.mcgill.ca>
wrote:
>Here's one vote in favor of 100W (OK, 85W) amps. I play in an instrument
>surf music band, and big Fender amps are crucial - I use a '63 dual
>Showman and our other guitar player uses a '67 Twin Reverb. I think the
>big difference is that we want to sound clean at any volume. Even when
>we play decent sized rooms (250-300 cap.) I never turn my amp up over
>half.
>
>I think you'd find similar sentiments among some country and steel players.
>
>Mel
>
Here I agree with you. I did try to mention clean power (headroom) in
my original post. Still, you admit to not turning the amp full up,
which is important to note. I guess any "complaint" in my initial post
was directed to certain type of guitarist of which you do not seem to
be. Surf on, baby!
Mark Delsing
On Sun, 30 Mar 1997 18:14:31 -0500, Carl Fiadino <fia...@bccom.com>
wrote:
>The more 100 watt heads the better. When I perform "live" in
>my room, I like to have a couple of 100 watt heads ready to go.
>
>Carl
Are these heads blonde or brunette? ;)
Central Scrutinizer
I think that you have to first examine the application. What's the
amp to be used for?
Are you using it primarily as a practice amp?
Are you using it as a rehearsal amp?
Are you playing small clubs?
Are you playing large clubs?
Are you playing hockey-rink sized halls which seat 20,000 people?
Personally, I think that 100 watts is way too much power for all but
that last application.
For practice, why do you need anything more than 10 or 20 watts?
Rehearsals w/o a PA system, you're going to need between 20 to 35
watts in order to put the drummer in his place. <G>
Small clubs? Stick a mic in front of it, and run it through the
zillion watt PA.
If you're playing large collesium sized places, it's so big that I
think you can get away with playing a 100 watt monster wide open.
- Of course that's just my opinion. I could be deaf.
The Central Scrutinizer
To reply, remove the pluses
Bill Bolton
On 31 Mar 1997 17:40:01 GMT, xmheu...@earthlink.net (Mark Heustis)
wrote:
>Yes, 100 watters are rarely needed these days.
Since so much of the music industry is driven by fads, it would be
very short sighted, IMO, to think that big amps will be out of favour
for good.
The current tube amp fad amongst electric guitarists for lower power
BF Fender amps could just as easily swap back to Fender Twin Reverbs
and Marshal Stacks within a few years.
Cheers,
Bill
Bill Bolton billb...@onaustralia.com.au
Sydney, Australia
nei...@pacbell.net
Carl Fiadino wrote:
>
> Greg Siegel wrote:
> >
> > Mark Delsing wrote:
> > >
> > > This has come up pretty often in all of these newsgroups, but I'd like
> > > to open the subject to debate:
> > >
> > > Are 100w amps obsolete?
> >
> > use on a gig. The damn thing is too loud -- even with pulling out two
> > of the power tubes and one of the rectifiers.
> >
> > I am now of the feeling that 35 watts is more than enough even to play
> > high powered blues in Texas. Hell, everyone in our group uses low power
> > rigs and still all we need to use the PA for is vocals. \
> >
> > Go figure.
> >
> > Greg
>
> The more 100 watt heads the better. When I perform "live" in
> my room, I like to have a couple of 100 watt heads ready to go.
>
Matthew Ivaliotes
Bill Bolton wrote:
> The current tube amp fad amongst electric guitarists for lower power
> BF Fender amps could just as easily swap back to Fender Twin Reverbs
> and Marshal Stacks within a few years.
Fads generally lack purpose. In my case at least, the abandonment of
high wattage was a purely pracical decision. Nothing faddish about it
for many, many players.
Matt I.
Michael V. Baker
I THINK HE SAID "THE SAUSAGE IS IN THE LIBRARY!"
Fly on! free bird!
I personally want the best of both worlds... I want the sound of a
100Watt superlead, BUT wnat the soudnman ot add some reverb for me, and
occasional ddl whenever it is needed to cop the song....
arc4786
Having no experience with playing at Massive Volume Levels (I own a
cruddy Peavey practice amp) let me relate to you my experience as
an
audience member watching a band whose guitarist had an acute case of
"Volumitis." He had a 100W Marshall something-or-other on top of a 4x12
and he sounded like shit. He had it "11'd" in a little club about the size
of a McDonald's dining area. Oh, he was heard, all right, but the rest of
his band wasn't. he drowned out everything including conversation at the
bar.
when the next band came on, the guitarist used a small 1x12 combo. Not
only did he have the most heavenly sound on the planet that i've heard
yet, but we could hear the rest of the band. The rest of the band wasn't
that bad either ;)
--
"All this and more can be yours, including an ELECTRIC-COOLED PONY
HARNESS!! With fuel injection, fuel injection..."
-Mark Volman (of Flo & Eddie)
Mark Delsing
On 31 Mar 1997 22:35:11 GMT, ost...@bu.edu (Daniel Foley) wrote:
> Umm, some of us stompbox junkies want as much clean power as possible
>to work with and that just isn't possible with a little blues machine amp.
>
>There's more to this world than just that edge of distortion fender tone or
>balls out marshall stack option. Don't forget those who swear by 100 watt
>heads into one or 2 12"s and an acceptance of master volumes, flaws and all.
>
Well, you're talking about using a 100w amp at less than full power,
making use of its headroom. That's great, but not quite what I was
getting at. More power to you! Wear earplugs!
Chuck Jurich
In article <guitaral-300...@207.69.245.174>,
guit...@mindspring.com (Guitar Al) wrote:
> This all reminds me of when I saw Rush when I was 16 or so. I was so
> disappointed when Lifeson just had this one sad little combo (mesa-boogie
> I think) sitting at the very back of the stage lost in equipment (even
> then I was an equipment freak, so I always walked around the stage before
> show to see if I could spot the equipment). But, when he started playing
> the sound was huge AND good, blew me away.
> Al
Great dialogue concerning 100w amps... I am a bass player who has seen
more guitar amps than bass amps in my life because of the different bands
I've played in! Very interesting topic and it involves ALL the
instruments.
I have a friend who is currently shopping for an amp (for three months
now!) and is having great difficulty finding what she wants. Her
demands: tube, two channel (or more...), great "big-rock" distortion, and
it's got to have substantial "low end". Her negotiable demands: small (a
tour is being planned) and price (under $1000 but can go a little over).
The "big rock" distortion and incredible "low end" are, obviously, quite
subjective and I absolutely respect her preferences when she states them.
She has liked the sound of a Fender Bassman and a Fender Band Master best
(using a Big Muff), but the amps aren't two channel, quite large, and
pretty loud (100w and 60w...pre-CBS for the Band Master). We've tried a
whole lot of amps and while I prefer little Mesa Boogies, she doesn't
think one will work for her because they don't have "the sound". She
nearly bought a 100w Bedrock head before I desperately begged, "Don't!
Please! Don't buy a 100w head!"
The problem comes from the physics of "low end". The cabnets have to be
big and more power is necessary to drive them. I can't convince her that
she'll have massive problems with such a loud amp, especially because she
won't be able to get that great big-rock distortion and/or the low end
with these huge amps at sane volumes.
I mean, her bass player uses a 100w amp!
Suggestions? Perhaps a 50w head (switchable to 25) through a 2x10 bass cabnet?
chuck
Mark Delsing
On 1 Apr 1997 14:57:14 -0600, cmi...@hpcf.cc.utexas.edu (Thomas C.
Clancy) wrote:
>I think you need one but not several 100watt heads for
>a medium sized club. Not a small bar. It's better not to
>have to rely on a PA to get the sound across, the soundman
>can generally screw up the sound. They generally do.
>For lead guitar, it's important to get that sound across. That's
>the whole point of it. It also makes a huge difference
>how hight the ceiling is. Some of theses places with high
>ceiling can really take a lot more volume.
Sorry to disagree (as you'd suspect I might), but I don't think the
point is seeing how much volume the venue can "take." Ears can "take"
a lot of volume, but that doesn't mean that they're going to work
properly afterward.
And, soundguys may sometimes mess up sound, but, more often, they're
there to fit your sound to the limits of the venue (if not the limits
of the PA). I don't know, are soundmen usually happy when you tell
them not to mike your amp? Most places I've played won't even allow
you to face your amp directly at the audience. As I've said in other
posts, this way the people right in front of your amp go deaf, and
everybody else may or may not hear you at all. And being in the
monitors is most important of all, if you're not miked, that doesn't
happen, and then you'll find yourself turning up louder!
C'mon, you think even a 120w guitar amp is going to do better at
getting you heard than the average 600-1500w PA?
I guess my main point in all this isn;t that 100w amps don't sound
good, they're just not necessary. Too many great guitarists
(Townshend, Eric Johson, Beck) have suffered permanent hearing damage,
not to mention people in the audience. I just have found that I'm
getting real sick of listening to crappy bands in living-room sized
venues blast away, forcing me to wear earplugs. I mean, does this make
sense?
Brian P. Mann
On 31 Mar 1997 17:58:33 GMT, r.do...@sk.sympatico.ca (Rob Dobson)
wrote:
>In article <333EC0...@hie.com>, Matthew Ivaliotes <matthew....@hie.com> says:
>>
>>Mark Delsing wrote:
>>
>>> Are 100w amps obsolete?
>>
>>One more 'yes' vote here. I have seen many a club band that would have
>>been great if they weren't Too Damn Loud.
>
>BOTH MY MUSICMAN AND MY MARSHALL ARE 100 WATTS AND I DON'T THINK
>THEY'RE TOO LOUD!!!
>
>STEVIE ROB
WHAT'D YOU SAY?!? I'M PRACTICING!!!
Dave Taylor
In article <5hrpb4$7...@crack.usaor.net>, Praetorian+@usaor.+net+ says...
Some additional qualifiers:
Do you want a fatter bottom with more overhead and less distortion?
Then use a Twin or Marshall 100 watter.
Do you use a pedal for distortion?
Then use a 100 watt amp or a 45 watt amp.
Do you want your amp to give you output stage distortion at lower levels?
Then use something under 50 watts.
Do you haul and setup your on rig at gigs where everything is mic'd and fed
through the monitors?
Then use a Princeton Reverb.
Do you set up your own rig at gigs, but have a particular desire to be hurt
or injured?
Then use a 100 watt Marshall full stack.
----------------------------------------
Dave Taylor dbta...@mindspring.com
The Fins http://www.dws.org/fins
----------------------------------------
PLEASE NOTE: To discourage SPAMMERS, the above return address is bogus.
To reply by e-mail, please edit the return address by replacing the word
"nospam" with the word "mindspring".
Gracias.
Paul Cassone
Bruce Barone, a very talented bass player I knew, sold me his Bruce amp
in the early 70's. He found out he had hearing loss from being in too
many loud bands and gave up bass playing for unamplified cello. He
warned me when he sold me the amp that by the time I was 40 I would
probably need to roll the Bruce amp around after me as I walked, plugged
into a mike so I could hear people talk, because of the hearing loss I
would most surely have.
He wasn't far off the mark.
Paul
Matthew Ivaliotes
Fly on! free bird! wrote:
ing can really take a lot more volume.
>
> 100Watt superlead, BUT wnat the soudnman ot add some reverb for me, and
> occasional ddl whenever it is needed to cop the song....
No problem. Just book all your gigs in an arena.
See, there's an answer for everyone. :)
Matt I.
Lord Valve
In <334143...@agt.net> "Michael V. Baker" <di...@agt.net> writes:
>
>Randy Smith of Mesa Engineering says it is OK to pull out either the
>outside or inside pair of output tubes and run it 50W. This way you
>always have a spare pair of output tubes, and you don't get hassled by
>the SPCA for blowing up small mammals! Further easy mods include
making
>your own extension cord with a junction box containing a fan or light
>dimmer control (aka: Variac.)
LV: This is ABSOLUTELY TOTALLY BOGUS INFO. You CANNOT feed a device
which contains a transformer the chopped output of a motor-speed
controller or (EGAD!) a light dimmer. Anyone who attempts this
deserves exactly what he gets! Have a fire extinguisher handy.
Nowadays, a guy has to pay $2000 just to
>get an amp that has these 2 simple "mods" built in.
LV: NO amplifier built contains a Variac. Period. A Variac is not a
'mod,' it's a piece of test equipment. Leave it on the testbench where
it belongs.
Just set the Variac
>where a 100W light bulb glows "brown"... 80-85V. Where have we heard
>that before? You can always convert it back to break any iron clad
lease
>in a minute;D
LV: If you run your amp at 80-85 volts, you can look for plenty of
problems.
John Kelley Brown
Hey, it's all one big conspiracy by the lumber companys to sell alot of
particle board to make the 4x12 cabs. Kidding...maybe.
As far as small amps go, one of my favorites is the old Sears Silvertone
that had a grey cover and the head fit into the back of a 2x12 openback
cab, great tone! Does anyone here know how many watt these are and the
power tubes used?
JKB
Brian Rost
My response is quite simple. Playing music at a level where earplugs are
needed to protect your hearing is crazy. Except for playing in VERY large
rooms, or outdoors, 100 watt amps are overkill. Even in those cases if there
is good PA support, a 100 watt amp may not be needed.
--
Brian Rost
3Com Corp.
508-264-1550
br...@synnet.com
*********************************************************************
Monkey Island: a dance band for the new millenium
*********************************************************************
Tom
though.
Greg Jones
In article <5hou09$n...@mongol.sasknet.sk.ca>, r.do...@sk.sympatico.ca (Rob Dobson) writes:
|> In article <333EC0...@hie.com>, Matthew Ivaliotes <matthew....@hie.com> says:
|> >
|> >Mark Delsing wrote:
|> >
|> >> Are 100w amps obsolete?
|> >
|> >One more 'yes' vote here. I have seen many a club band that would have
|> >been great if they weren't Too Damn Loud.
|>
|> BOTH MY MUSICMAN AND MY MARSHALL ARE 100 WATTS AND I DON'T THINK
|> THEY'RE TOO LOUD!!!
|>
|> STEVIE ROB
Michael V. Baker
http://www.cybtrans.com/guitar/g125.htm ...How Ed's rig works
http://www.mesaboogie.com/US/Products/hb.shtml ...built in Variac?
http://www.soundsmith.com/say.htm ...OK, there can be some drawbacks
... but boy does it sound great!!!
Michael V. Baker
Lord Valve wrote:
> LV: This is ABSOLUTELY TOTALLY BOGUS INFO. You CANNOT feed a device
> which contains a transformer the chopped output of a motor-speed
> controller or (EGAD!) a light dimmer. Anyone who attempts this
> deserves exactly what he gets! Have a fire extinguisher handy.
>
OOPS! You're right... a fan/light dimmer will not work, but real Variacs
that don't alter the power wave do, or so several people on the net
say. Some say it makes the tubes last longer. I know first hand that it
makes the sound much better - more crunch. OTOH, several people
on the very same net also say that an amp should be run at EXACTLY
120V (even though it's only 116V here.) Thank God EVH didn't listen
to them and listened to Jose Arendondo instead.
Paul Cassone
Chuck,
You might have her try a Super Reverb with a Hughes and Kettner Tubeman
plus or other such pre amp. The Pre-amp will allow channel switching,
and the 4 10's will give the bass response she craves.
Let me know how she likes it.
Paul
Greg Siegel
Bean wrote:
>
> > I think you need one but not several 100watt heads for
> > a medium sized club. Not a small bar.
>
> in stereo.
>
And play what? The electric tuba?
Greg
Dennis Hall
br...@fogerty.synnet.com (Brian Rost) wrote:
>My response is quite simple. Playing music at a level where earplugs are
>needed to protect your hearing is crazy. Except for playing in VERY large
>rooms, or outdoors, 100 watt amps are overkill. Even in those cases if there
>is good PA support, a 100 watt amp may not be needed.
Well, that's a good opinion... I have a Marshall Full stack with a
JCM-900 100w head and a VS100 Valvesate head and both are great
and extremely loud at volue level 2.
But as far as I'm concerned, it's better to have the volume resources
there, than to have not enough.
Michael V. Baker
Why does it still work then?
Bean
Michael Cullen
billb...@onaustralia.com.au (Bill Bolton), far, far away from here, appears
to have written:
>On 31 Mar 1997 17:40:01 GMT, xmheu...@earthlink.net (Mark Heustis)
>wrote:
>
>>Yes, 100 watters are rarely needed these days.
>
>Since so much of the music industry is driven by fads, it would be
>very short sighted, IMO, to think that big amps will be out of favour
>for good.
This premise is spot on if you think that the shift is a fad. I honestly think
it's more of a paradigm shift than just a fad. I think it's guitarists waking
up to the fact that recently (last 5+ years?) most places that they play will
have a "reasonable" PA and so there's no need to go deaf from your amp
or get a hernia lugging stuff. *However*, this would hardly be the first time
in my life that I'd been wrong :-)
>The current tube amp fad amongst electric guitarists for lower power
>BF Fender amps could just as easily swap back to Fender Twin Reverbs
>and Marshal Stacks within a few years.
It's possible, (maybe even probable), but I think that when it does happen it
won't be a major shift. One advantage the small amp brigade has nowadays is
the common availability of reasonably good sounding smaller amps. Another is
increased awareness of volume-induced hearing problems (PT, et al).
cheers,
Stevie Mic
Cross Purposes Studios (Web & Graphic Design)
http://netserv.net.au/tiger/
Mark Delsing
On Wed, 02 Apr 1997 19:05:42 GMT, dh...@rgv.net (Dennis Hall) wrote:
>But as far as I'm concerned, it's better to have the volume resources
>there, than to have not enough.
Well, I have yet to be in a situation where I didn't have enough
power, except for the time I was in a pal's basement trying to compete
with a guy with a louder amp! :p
Andrew McWhirter
That would be to keep the coffee warm, I guess.....
Mark Delsing
On Tue, 01 Apr 1997 20:31:41 -0700, edug...@unm.edu (Chuck Jurich)
wrote:
>I have a friend who is currently shopping for an amp (for three months
>now!) and is having great difficulty finding what she wants. Her
>demands: tube, two channel (or more...), great "big-rock" distortion, and
>it's got to have substantial "low end". Her negotiable demands: small (a
>tour is being planned) and price (under $1000 but can go a little over).
>The problem comes from the physics of "low end". The cabnets have to be
>big and more power is necessary to drive them. I can't convince her that
>she'll have massive problems with such a loud amp, especially because she
>won't be able to get that great big-rock distortion and/or the low end
>with these huge amps at sane volumes.
>
>I mean, her bass player uses a 100w amp!
>
>Suggestions? Perhaps a 50w head (switchable to 25) through a 2x10 bass cabnet?
>
>chuck
I bet you could find a Fender Prosonic for about $1000. Great Fender
clean sound, creamy distortion (a little too fuzzy for my taste,
perhaps), all pumped through two 10's. Or maybe a 50w Marshall with
EV's or JBL's. I have a 1x12 cab (EV-loaded) that puts out tons of
bass. Plug her into a low-watt amp without telling her and do a blind
test. I'll bet you can find what you need in a small package.
All I think anybody needs is a good amp (an amp they're happy with)
and a good cabinet with GOOD SPEAKERS. Crappy speakers will ruin any
amp. Anyway, a head and a 2x12 cab isn't that much to lug around.
R.G. Keen
On Wed, 02 Apr 1997 18:27:46 -0700, "Michael V. Baker" <di...@agt.net>
wrote:
>OOPS! You're right... a fan/light dimmer will not work, but real Variacs
>that don't alter the power wave do, or so several people on the net
>say.
I've seen several people on the net say the most interesting things,
things that would violate several natural laws if true. Real variacs
WILL change the tone of an amp. They will also put the tubes and
transformers in the amp at risk. Lower voltages risk cathode stripping
by limiting cathode emission and preventing a fully developed space
charge, and higher voltages risk overcurrent in the tubes and
transformers and burning out the filaments.
>Some say it makes the tubes last longer.
That would be the contingent that uses a variac turned down. Modest
reductions of filament voltage - like 5% - do lengthen life on preamp
tubes, at least that is the sentiment in the tube hifi camp, and was
practice in major industrial tube users decades ago. Some of these
preamp tubes last decades anyways, though.
>I know first hand that it
>makes the sound much better - more crunch. OTOH, several people
>on the very same net also say that an amp should be run at EXACTLY
>120V (even though it's only 116V here.) Thank God EVH didn't listen
>to them and listened to Jose Arendondo instead.
The variac approach might make some sense if you could variac down the
B+ by itself, or B+ and bias voltage, and leave the filaments alone.
A separate filament transformer would let you do this. I hate to think
about the weight of all that iron, though.
Also, you'd have to mod your amp to do this, and everyone knows that
if you mod your amp, you're damned to musical hell for all eternity
:-)
shredgod
Matthew Ivaliotes wrote:
>
> Fly on! free bird! wrote:
>
> > dispute the fact that a BF Deluxe cannot ever sound like a 100watt
> > marshall, nor can a 50watt marshall... the point is, yea, the current
> > trend is to use saller amps (even richie blackmore is using smaller
> > amps,) but the tone is definitely different, not better by any means,
> > but not worse either, jsut different... I guess I am just unlucky enough
> > to enjoy the sound of a 100 watt super lead more than anything else....
>
> Trendy is not appropriate to describe it. Yes, it is becoming more
> popular, but it's not because small amps are becoming 'cool.' There are
> pracitcal reasons behind the change, the biggest reasons being the lack
> of practical applications for the stacks and the ease and reduced
> weight/expense/hassle of using a smaller amp.
>
> I agree that each amp has a unique sound, and that if you want that
> amp's sound, you pretty much have to have that amp or settle for an
> approximation. But small amps are simply far more practical.
>
> Matt I.
Small amps suck for preforming.
Shred
Fly on! free bird!
Michael V. Baker wrote:
>
> Lord Valve wrote:
> > LV: This is ABSOLUTELY TOTALLY BOGUS INFO. You CANNOT feed a device
> > which contains a transformer the chopped output of a motor-speed
> > controller or (EGAD!) a light dimmer. Anyone who attempts this
> > deserves exactly what he gets! Have a fire extinguisher handy.
> >
>
> that don't alter the power wave do, or so several people on the net
> makes the sound much better - more crunch. OTOH, several people
> on the very same net also say that an amp should be run at EXACTLY
> 120V (even though it's only 116V here.) Thank God EVH didn't listen
> to them and listened to Jose Arendondo instead.
>
> Usenet: Half Fact... Half Friction
> mailto:di...@agt.net
> http://www.agt.net/public/digit/digit.htm
mebbe some of us dont want the mega-crunch of starving the tubes, and
want the high end clarity and defintion cutting through the crunch,
that unfortunately the 50watt marshalls etc dont have... -- they are too
'cloudy' sounding for me
Milan Plechata
Ok. I know I'm gonna get flamed or misinterpreted for this. Anyway,
here goes.. IF SHE WANTS A 100watt head, LET HER GET ONE! A thousand
dollars is a lot to spend on something a 'friend' thinks you should
buy. Let her get whatever she wants. (BTW- I do think 100watts is a
little too big, but that's not my point.)
edug...@unm.edu (Chuck Jurich) wrote:
>In article <guitaral-300...@207.69.245.174>,
>guit...@mindspring.com (Guitar Al) wrote:
>> This all reminds me of when I saw Rush when I was 16 or so. I was so
>> disappointed when Lifeson just had this one sad little combo (mesa-boogie
>> I think) sitting at the very back of the stage lost in equipment (even
>> then I was an equipment freak, so I always walked around the stage before
>> show to see if I could spot the equipment). But, when he started playing
>> the sound was huge AND good, blew me away.
>> Al
>Great dialogue concerning 100w amps... I am a bass player who has seen
>more guitar amps than bass amps in my life because of the different bands
>I've played in! Very interesting topic and it involves ALL the
>instruments.
>I have a friend who is currently shopping for an amp (for three months
>now!) and is having great difficulty finding what she wants. Her
>demands: tube, two channel (or more...), great "big-rock" distortion, and
>it's got to have substantial "low end". Her negotiable demands: small (a
>tour is being planned) and price (under $1000 but can go a little over).
>The "big rock" distortion and incredible "low end" are, obviously, quite
>subjective and I absolutely respect her preferences when she states them.
>She has liked the sound of a Fender Bassman and a Fender Band Master best
>(using a Big Muff), but the amps aren't two channel, quite large, and
>pretty loud (100w and 60w...pre-CBS for the Band Master). We've tried a
>whole lot of amps and while I prefer little Mesa Boogies, she doesn't
>think one will work for her because they don't have "the sound". She
>nearly bought a 100w Bedrock head before I desperately begged, "Don't!
>Please! Don't buy a 100w head!"
>The problem comes from the physics of "low end". The cabnets have to be
>big and more power is necessary to drive them. I can't convince her that
>she'll have massive problems with such a loud amp, especially because she
>won't be able to get that great big-rock distortion and/or the low end
>with these huge amps at sane volumes.
>I mean, her bass player uses a 100w amp!
>Suggestions? Perhaps a 50w head (switchable to 25) through a 2x10 bass cabnet?
>chuck
To reply, remove the !.
shredgod
Rob Dobson wrote:
>
> In article <333EC0...@hie.com>, Matthew Ivaliotes <matthew....@hie.com> says:
> >
> >Mark Delsing wrote:
> >
> >> Are 100w amps obsolete?
> >
> >One more 'yes' vote here. I have seen many a club band that would have
> >been great if they weren't Too Damn Loud.
>
> BOTH MY MUSICMAN AND MY MARSHALL ARE 100 WATTS AND I DON'T THINK
> THEY'RE TOO LOUD!!!
>
> STEVIE ROB
YEAH STEVE!!! IF IT'S TOO LOUD YOU'RE TOO OLD!!!
Shred
shredgod
pl...@his.com wrote:
>
> In <5hp6s3$q...@mongol.sasknet.sk.ca>, r.do...@sk.sympatico.ca (Rob Dobson) writes:
> >In article <333F32...@hie.com>, Matthew Ivaliotes <matthew....@hie.com> says:
> >>Trendy is not appropriate to describe it. Yes, it is becoming more
> >>popular, but it's not because small amps are becoming 'cool.' There are
> >>pracitcal reasons behind the change, the biggest reasons being the lack
> >>of practical applications for the stacks and the ease and reduced
> >>weight/expense/hassle of using a smaller amp.
> >
> >wanted/needed the biggest and loudest amp that would fit in '63 VW bus.
> >We also wanted/needed drugs, alcohol, gratuitous sex, no sleep,
> >junk food and as much partying as possible.
> >
> >Nowadays, musicians want/need practical gear, a healthy lifestyle and
> >a financial planner.
> >
> >What the Hell happened?!
> >
> >Stevie Rob
>
> Jimi, Janis, Jim, Brian, Keith and countless others who followed their path died
> or went insane.
>
> Pat
> pl...@his.com
Jimi din't go insane. Died in his own puke, coz they carried him to the
hospital face up and let him suffocate. Anyone who used 100 watt-ers
usually get to play big stadiums, get bick bucks, and fuck a billion
women.
Shred
shredgod
>
> EXACTLY... the TRENDY SOUND is that of smaller amps, but none of us can
> dispute the fact that a BF Deluxe cannot ever sound like a 100watt
> marshall, nor can a 50watt marshall... the point is, yea, the current
> trend is to use saller amps (even richie blackmore is using smaller
> amps,) but the tone is definitely different, not better by any means,
> but not worse either, jsut different... I guess I am just unlucky enough
> to enjoy the sound of a 100 watt super lead more than anything else....
How right you are dude! Small amps can never really match to big amps
power. Oh, and the super lead plexi really kicks fuckin' ass! I gotta
get the original issue AND the reissue. Keep the 100 watt faith,
brother!
Shred
"I can slay as much with a 20 watt amp, but that's not what this is
about!"
-DIMEBAG DARELL
Jeffrey Sutton
In <334363...@mnl.sequel.net> shredgod <valm...@mnl.sequel.net>
writes:
>
snip!
>
>Small amps suck for preforming.
>
>Shred
Really? I can't get a decent tone with a big amp in a small bar - -
and not drive the crowd away. Give me a 20 watter and watch 'em dance!
Jeff
Matthew Ivaliotes
shredgod wrote:
>
> Small amps suck for preforming.
Since you stated that as fact, please support it with, say, evidence.
Some of the best amps I've ever heard were small amps. And I could
still hear *after* the show, too.
Have fun going deaf.
Matt I.