Blues amp advice
Julian Treadwell
I'm an amateur blues/blues-rock player (strat, tele and LP clones) and
wish to buy my first tube amp. I am trying to decide between a Fender
Blues Junior, a Laney VC15 a Vox AC15, and a Vox 15R. 've tried them
all out in the stores but they never sound quite the same when you get
them home. My idols include Buddy Guy, Clapton, Peter Green, Ry Cooder
and Hendrix. I only want something for practising, jam sessions and
maybe the odd small gig.
Any comments on the comparative reliability, sound quality or whatever
of these models would be appreciated.
Thanks,
Julian
Mr Soul
> of these models would be appreciated.
a clone. That amp rocks and would make a good blues amp.
Mr Soul
Monster Zero
"Julian Treadwell" <julian.t...@jcu.edu.au> wrote in message
news:g2akiq$jph$1...@aioe.org...
Don't be afraid to buy used either. Peavey "Classic" series amps are great
blues amps and a lot of folks swear by them. Also the Crate "Palomino or
Vintage Club" series are very inexpensive and get great reviews. I've owned
a Peavey Classic 30 and a Crate VC5115 and though I liked the Peavey better,
both are very formidable blues amps. You should also look at the Epiphone
Valve Jr. amps. Only 5 watts but suitable for small gigs and practice where
you don't have a real loud drummer.
My 2 cents..
Random Excess
Said it before and I'll say it again: Most underrated amp is the
Traynor YCV20. Two footswitchable channels with foot switchable gain
makes it almost a three-channel amp, very versatile indeed. Best
preamp distortion I've ever heard.
http://www.traynoramps.com/products.asp?id=251&cat=63&type=3
That said, lotta folks seem to like the Blues Junior and the Peavey
Classics/Delta Blues, both of which are cheaper than the Traynor.
BTW, I prefer the sound of the Pro Jr. to the Blues Jr.
Tejas Pedro
Jim
> "Julian Treadwell" <julian.t...@jcu.edu.au> wrote in message
> news:g2akiq$jph$1...@aioe.org...
>
>>Hi all,
>>
>>I'm an amateur blues/blues-rock player (strat, tele and LP clones) and
>>wish to buy my first tube amp. I am trying to decide between a Fender
>>Blues Junior, a Laney VC15 a Vox AC15, and a Vox 15R. 've tried them all
>>out in the stores but they never sound quite the same when you get them
>>home. My idols include Buddy Guy, Clapton, Peter Green, Ry Cooder and
>>Hendrix. I only want something for practising, jam sessions and maybe the
>>odd small gig.
>>
>>Any comments on the comparative reliability, sound quality or whatever of
>>these models would be appreciated.
>>
>>Thanks,
>>
>>Julian
>
>
> Don't be afraid to buy used either. Peavey "Classic" series amps are great
> blues amps and a lot of folks swear by them. Also the Crate "Palomino or
> Vintage Club" series are very inexpensive and get great reviews.
I'll chime in with a BIG second on the Crate Vintage Club 30W VC3112. (Note:
there is also a 50W version, but the 30W sounds better to me, smoother chime on
the power tubes.) One warning... Crate build quality is reputedly spotty. I
saw some complaints about intermittent issues that sound very much like cold
solders or board mounted components coming loose. When I bought mine, I had the
seller play at high volume for 20 minutes while I dinked around with all of the
controls, trying to find a problem. None found, still works like a charm. And
sounds VERY good. I even like the eminence built speaker.
The power amp essentially is the Vox AC30 circuit. It even has an exposed paper
wound output transformer. It's got an oddball effects loop using a TRS with
send on the ring. But when you plug in a regular cable, it feed the AC30
circuit power amp directly. It sounds really nice with a Vox Amplug AC30
feeding the power stage: http://www.voxamps.co.uk/amplug/
I've owned
> a Peavey Classic 30 and a Crate VC5115 and though I liked the Peavey better,
> both are very formidable blues amps.
Aha, that's the 50 watt version! Have you played the VC3112?
> You should also look at the Epiphone
> Valve Jr. amps. Only 5 watts but suitable for small gigs and practice where
> you don't have a real loud drummer.
Valve Juniors are good amps that become great if you modify them. With an
efficient 4x12, they could keep up with some live needs, but NOT clean.
I have two of the version two amps. One is heavily modified, one is stock. I
haven't played version 3, but for pennies Epiphone could add a bright cap over
the volume control, and a few pennies more put it on a switch. That one small
change does a lot towards getting the amp to where it needs to be (for my ears,
at least).
>
> My 2 cents..
>
>
MG
<julian.t...@jcu.edu.au> wrote:
Pignose G40V - same tubes as a 59 Bassman but with added gain control
for lower volume breakup.
MG
UK
MIND THE GAPS in my email before replying!
The Glove Slaps U
sessions and >maybe the odd small gig". Will be great. mvm
Angus Manwaring
>Hi all,
>I'm an amateur blues/blues-rock player (strat, tele and LP clones) and
>wish to buy my first tube amp. I am trying to decide between a Fender
>Blues Junior, a Laney VC15 a Vox AC15, and a Vox 15R. 've tried them
>all out in the stores but they never sound quite the same when you get
>them home. My idols include Buddy Guy, Clapton, Peter Green, Ry Cooder
>and Hendrix. I only want something for practising, jam sessions and
>maybe the odd small gig.
You might want to try using a Treble booster with the Vox AC15, there are
some nice germanium ones, but they are quite expensive.
I've recently been doing a similar thing, and have similar tastes to you,
although I'm not trying to get a Fender or a Hendrix tone, much as I love
his playing.
I tried a LP through a Marshall Vintage Modern 2266C 50 watt combo and was
sold on the sound. Bought it in fact. It can sound good at fairly low
volumes too and (presumably) the KT66 valves don't hurt the early EC
emulation either.
Another amp I was impressed with was the Orange Tiny Terror, switchable
between 7 and 15 watt and very nice sounding to these ears.
Best of luck, let us know how you go.
All the best,
Angus Manwaring. (for e-mail remove ANTISPEM)
I need your memories for the Amiga Games Database: A collection of Amiga
Game reviews by Amiga players http://www.angusm.demon.co.uk/AGDB/AGDB.html
Phil Wilson
Korg, the Chines built ones in various flavors, the new Heritage with EF86
preamp option. None of them have a rep as a blues amp as far as I know.
Without knowing what you want to spend it's a tough call, but the Blues Jr
gets a lot of praise.
--
Phil Wilson
"Julian Treadwell" <julian.t...@jcu.edu.au> wrote in message
news:g2akiq$jph$1...@aioe.org...
tle4
"Mr Soul" <pc...@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:ccd83e03-be47-437f...@59g2000hsb.googlegroups.com...
I like the Tweed Deluxe also. If I build another amp, it would be a Tweed
Deluxe clone. Just enough power to gig and be able to crank it some. They
are very touch responsive amps also. Play it lightly and it gets clean....
Beat on the strings and it breaks up all with the same settings...
Rick N. Backer
did courageously avow:
Agreed there. Victoria Amps comes to mind.
--
Ken Wilson
http://www.myspace.com/bcislander
Rick N. Backer
<tejas...@sbcglobal.net> did courageously avow:
The Traynor is reasonable in its price range but even though I'm a
Canuck there's nothing that really works other than American made
tweed. And there are definitely some nice, reasonably priced clones
to be had.
Rick N. Backer
<pdjw...@whatever.net> did courageously avow:
>"Vox AC15" is a bit vague. There are the originals, the 90's model made by
>Korg, the Chines built ones in various flavors, the new Heritage with EF86
>preamp option. None of them have a rep as a blues amp as far as I know.
>Without knowing what you want to spend it's a tough call, but the Blues Jr
>gets a lot of praise.
If price is not a barrier, might I suggest a Mesa Lone Star Special.
This is a very nice work horse.
Surgical Glove Snaps Wrist
RS
<julian.t...@jcu.edu.au> wrote:
When you say they "never sound the same when you get them home," that
may be due in part to how loud they are cranked. That, IMO, is crucial
to getting good blues sound. Make the whole amp work hard. That's how
a lot of the guys got their sound--little pawnshop amps cranked up.
You've got some good suggestions in this thread. To narrow it down, if
you want it to sound good at home and at small gigs:
1: Look for an all-tube amp.
2: Think low wattage. Maybe 15 or 20 watts. (Or less for home)
Another thing that you may want to pay attention to: Single tone
control vs Treble+Bass(+mid). The old, simple designs with a single
tone control usually have very rich mids that will overdrive nicely on
solo playing. More complex controls (Treble+Bass+Middle) typically
have less midrange, and will sound cleaner for chords.
jh
> On Fri, 6 Jun 2008 05:00:24 -0700 (PDT), Mr Soul <pc...@comcast.net>
> did courageously avow:
>
>>> Any comments on the comparative reliability, sound quality or whatever
>>> of these models would be appreciated.
>> Try a Fender Tweed Deluxe - not the re-issue (it's too expensive) but
>> a clone. That amp rocks and would make a good blues amp.
>>
>> Mr Soul
>
> Agreed there. Victoria Amps comes to mind.
>
Hi,
I totally agree with the sonic qualities of the little Vickies.
Especially when it gets stage use in the "break up zone" from 3-5 on the
volume pot. Pure dynamic heaven. Especially with a high sensitivity
speakr like an ALnico Blue (which mine has) and a 5751 or 12AY7 in the
input stage.
I would not consider the amp to be a good bedroom or kitchen amp. Mine
gets absolutely *NO* use at home. IMHO it doesn't even see its sweet
spot there and is too mid peaky. An amp with TMB control is much better
for home use.
But - the amp would be my lonely island amp, if i were only allowed to
take one with me....
just my 2 cts
regards
Jochen
Rick N. Backer
did courageously avow:
I have their Champ clone with the 12" speaker upgrade. Works fine
around the house. 8-)
Rick N. Backer
courageously avow:
How about a single switch that does double duty as on/off and volume
control. And that's it. Just plug in and crank it. You'll know soon
enough if it came ready to play. 8-)
TD Madden
look at a Mission Amps Aurora...or if you're handy with a soldering
iron, at his 5E3 kits.
Grip
"Rick N. Backer" <ken.w...@NsOhSaPw.cAaM> wrote in message
news:ssem449rt4h41op4a...@4ax.com...
Hey Ken,
I have had a Maverick since they came out, 4X el 84 35W...the
1X12.....I too have looked many times at the Lone Star Special....it almost
seems description wise like a much updated replacement for the Mav.....dunno
if you are familiar with mine, but how close might I be to my take on this?
I have not been able to find a LSS in stock anywhere to try one. Thanks
boardjunkie
> I'll chime in with a BIG second on the Crate Vintage Club 30W VC3112. (Note:
> there is also a 50W version, but the 30W sounds better to me, smoother chime on
> the power tubes.) One warning... Crate build quality is reputedly spotty. I
> saw some complaints about intermittent issues that sound very much like cold
> solders or board mounted components coming loose. When I bought mine, I had the
> seller play at high volume for 20 minutes while I dinked around with all of the
> controls, trying to find a problem. None found, still works like a charm. And
> sounds VERY good. I even like the eminence built speaker.
>
I'll second the recommendation for the VC3112. I took one in on trade
a couple days ago because I needed a small-ish 1-12 amp to tote around
to jams and such instead of hauling around half stacks. It was just OK
the way it was, but I was planning on having my way with it anyhow. I
finished up on the mods today and got to play through it for a couple
minutes before I had to get out the door. Man does that little sucker
*sing* now. It will be a fun amp to play fer sher. And I'm gonna
really dig the look on ppl's faces when it smokes most every
comparable amp out there. And the sleeper factor will be good for
entertainment when the snickers start from the "hotshots" who think
just because its a Crate that its a POS.
It was surprisingly easy to do the mods on....about 1-1/2 hrs start to
finish. Only thing that worries me is those little 84s being right on
top of the speaker....they'll get rattled to death in no time flat.
SLM expected this and fused the B+ line. The reverb sucks but I don't
need it anyway. I guess that could be changed in the future if I see a
need for it.
Anyone interested in what I did to it feel free to ask. I'll be able
to go through it component by component since its fresh in my mind.
For starters.....the dirt channel uses 3 stages now instead of 4. The
first stage was shared for both channels and that wasn't really the
way to go.
JP
I'd be interested in what you did and why you did i and what the
result was...you can id components or not, I am after the basic
thinking and modding process you went through..
Jim
Second request for your mods.
All I've done was pull out the preamp tubes and put in some NOS 12AY7. It
sounds a lot better.
boardjunkie
> Second request for your mods.
>
> All I've done was pull out the preamp tubes and put in some NOS 12AY7. It
> sounds a lot better.
>
Alright kids....now follow along.....
http://www.schematicheaven.com/newamps/crate_vc3112_preamp.pdf
Start by removing the jumper in line with pin 7 of V1 and add a 68k
grid stopper. Remove C2 (.047u) and replace with .022u. Remove C41.
Thats it for the clean side.
Replace R67 (1M) with 68k, Jumper the end that connects to C41 to the
input jack tip (high side of R1). So far we've seperated the 2
channels, but driving both input stages simultaneously through their
own grid stoppers.
Next remove R59 (1M). It won't be needed since the dirty channel's
input stage is referenced to R1 so the grid won't want to float.
Remove C1 (.0022) and replace R11 (220k) with 100k at least half watt,
1 watt preferred. The cathode components for stage 1 are already where
they should be, but I'd recommend replacing the .68 tantalum with a
mylar or similar...I don't trust the tants as they have a tendency to
short.
Leave C10 alone (.01u).
Remove R6 (1M) and replace with 1000p/.001u cap. Low V is fine. I'm
not picky about type here 'cause its just shunting highs to gnd....no
need for spendy gourmet types.
R68 (470k) and C55(470p) are where they should be...leave 'em. Good
idea to replace the 470p with a better type tho since its in the
signal path.
Now normally I'll use a 1M pot bypassed with a good quality .001u cap
for the "gain" control, but I didn't have any miniature pcb mt 1 megs
on hand (just ordered more) so for now I left the 250k in there (but
forgot to bypass it so it loses highs when rolled down). It sounds ok
that way, season to taste. I'll change this one to 1M eventually.
Remove R15 and C12. Remove C11(470p) and replace with .01u. Remove
R16, replace with wire jumper. Remove R66(47k) and replace with 470p.
Remoce C13(.022) and replace with 470k/470p in parallel. Leave
R69(470k).
Now for stage 2s cathode circuit. remove R14(4.7k) and replace with
2.7k. Also in parallel with that 2.7k install a .68 cap and 1k
resistor in series so that the cap goes to gnd. I did this on the
solder side of the pcb.
Thats it for the pre circuitry...unless I've forgotten something ;)
The stage 3 cathode components I left as is. An unbypassed 820 here
will do and thats what I'll normally use, but I didn't see it making a
big difference. I left the 250k "level" control....but I'll use a 1M
here too.
Now all thats left is to get the voltages in the front end a little
higher. The run about 240-250 as they had it. This circuit wants to
see closer to 300 to operate as intended.
Find R22(4.7k 2w) and replace with 1k 2w.
Ref supply/output/PI section:
http://www.schematicheaven.com/newamps/crate_vc3112_preamp.pdf
Find R32 and R31(both 4.7k 2w) and replace them both with 1k 2w. That
should get you close enough for rock 'n' roll to 300v....mine measured
around 292v at the high side of the first stage plate load resistor.
Thats about it....yer done.
I *highly* recommend using .001 bypass caps on your gtr's vol pots.
This pre circuit is very touch sensitive and with just a bridge
humbucker there's a good range of tones and responses across the range
of the vol knob. Same with a neck single....it really cleans up nice
with the vol rolled down with "vintage" output singles.
Lastly....I'd recommend using an EQ pedal in the loop. Even with the
highs rolled full down and the mids about halfway, there's still some
brightness that some may not like. With an EQ in the loop you can cut
the extreme high end down to get rid of unwanted fizz while bumping up
some mids for a more meaty tone.
If anyone actually performs this mod, lemme know what you think of it.
If it proves popular (it already is in my area as I've put this pre in
a lot of JCM800s, Laneys, plexi RIs, etc and they all love it) I may
concider offering a kit with all needed parts and instructions. Not a
bad idea....I need to make notes for each model amp this goes into in
the future.
<enters Craig Fergusen mode> Take THAT Torres!
persist
<julian.t...@jcu.edu.au> wrote:
Clark Amplification makes the very nice Beaufort Tweed Deluxe (5E3
circuit).
Good luck.
--
Regards,
persist
Rick N. Backer
courageously avow:
Very heavy on the 'much' with the updated part. Essentially you are
on the right track, allowing for the new bells and whistles. It does
have a pretty price tag though.
Julian Treadwell
The 'Victoria' and 'Clark Beaufort' amps are waaaaay out of my price
range. So is the Mesa. Solo parent, inflated Aussie prices, endless
bills, snivel snivel snivel...
I accept that the AC15 is not a recognised blues amp and it is crossed
off my list.
I did try and reject both the Epi Valve Junior and the Orange Tiny
Terror, the Epi because the sound seemed rather harsh and I couldn't get
warm-and-mellow from it at all, and the Tiny Terror because it's only a
head and for similar money I can buy a Laney combo which to my ears
sounded better (of course it probably depends much on the speaker you
plugged the TT into).
That leaves the Laney VC15, the Laney (not Vox, typo sorry) LC15R and
the Fender Blues Junior, to which I now have to add the Crate Vintage
and the Peavey Vintage series, although there doesn't seem to be a local
dealer for either brand here.
I'm leaning towards the LC15R I think, but will try and find a Peavey
and a Crate to compare if I can.
Thanks again to all, I learned much. :)
Cheers,
Julian
jh
> Thanks to all who replied.
>
> The 'Victoria' and 'Clark Beaufort' amps are waaaaay out of my price
> range. So is the Mesa. Solo parent, inflated Aussie prices, endless
> bills, snivel snivel snivel...
>
> I accept that the AC15 is not a recognised blues amp and it is crossed
> off my list.
>
> I did try and reject both the Epi Valve Junior and the Orange Tiny
> Terror, the Epi because the sound seemed rather harsh and I couldn't get
> warm-and-mellow from it at all, and the Tiny Terror because it's only a
> head and for similar money I can buy a Laney combo which to my ears
> sounded better (of course it probably depends much on the speaker you
> plugged the TT into).
>
> That leaves the Laney VC15, the Laney (not Vox, typo sorry) LC15R and
> the Fender Blues Junior, to which I now have to add the Crate Vintage
> and the Peavey Vintage series, although there doesn't seem to be a local
> dealer for either brand here.
>
> I'm leaning towards the LC15R I think, but will try and find a Peavey
> and a Crate to compare if I can.
>
> Thanks again to all, I learned much. :)
>
> Cheers,
>
> Julian
>
Hi Julian,
IMHO you'd better not forget th AC15. It's bigger brethren is a
formidable "blues amp". I think the AC15 has been buried in the
responses about the other "blues amps". Check it out. I have not played
the "new" incarnation of the AC15, but I'd decide to take a 90s Korg vs
Blues Junior in a fraction of a second. At least the older AC15 was an
amp that IMHO excels for home use AND for club level jams.
regards
Jochen
H
cclaw...@gmail.com
Add another BIG vote for the Crate VC3112. Simply one of the best
sounding production amps of its kind out there. Build quality was
notoriously spotty -but if you can find one that runs well, it's a
keeper. Jim's right. I talked to a guy who repped for Crate back in
the day -they had gone over to a 'robotic' production line on the CB
and had a lot of trouble with bad solder joints. Techs seemed
uniformly to loathe them. I think that was as much because of people
stuff as tech stuff though. They sound gorgeous. The stock (16 ohm)
Eminence is a hell of a nice speaker too. They like volume a lot. It
isn't the most responsive or expressive amp at low volume -but once
you get it to 5 or so it just sings. I kinda wish I'd kept mine -but I
did get tired of lugging it. The amp ain't light. Lots of blues guys
I've played with have had one - and many of these were guys who
could've played whatever they chose, so it's a pretty ringing
endorsement. Expect to pay around $300 for one in decent shape. The
only amp of similar power that I like better is a Deluxe Reverb.
Chuck
cclaw...@gmail.com
I agree. If you like the way the AC15 sounds, don't let opinions sway
you. I'd forgotten about the Laneys. Those are schweet amps -but they
seem to be getting pricier all the time.
Chuck
jh
I've had an LC15R in for repair a few years ago. OT bad. I was *not*
impressed by the overall construction.
Don't know how it would have sounded, the owner did not want to have it
repaired.
Small nifty package tho.
Jochen