pantone cvc vs. pantone cv?
Troy 92850
coated palette in Illustrator, the colors are CVC, but I have gotten files from
other people that have Pantone CV colors assigned in the artwork. They look
close on the screen but print differently....any help would be appreciated.
thanks
troy
Warren Tryk
***
If I'm not mistaken...
CV = For Uncoated Stock (used to be U)
CVC = For Coated Stock (used to be C)
-Warren
Warren Tryk Design
Tumwater, Washington, USA
"The woman who knew that I had dyslexia. I never interviewed her."
G. (Dubya) Bush, Orange, Calif., Sept. 15, 2000
PrePressGuy
CVC, CVU, CV are just different programs names for the same ink if its a spot
color.
When designers do a spot color logo in AI, and then import it into Quark or PM,
and then use the same Pantone color in Quark or PM, the program will want to
print 2 seps, 1 for the CVC, and 1 for the CV (for example).
They need to go into the Show Swatches>Options, and just makes sure the name of
the color in AI is the same as in Quark or PM.
All colors on 1 plate.
So many designers overlook or dont know this.
Its the first thing I do when I get a document with AI spot colors, is to make
sure they all print on the same plate.
I dont do Windoze...
Just Do It..., Buy a G4!
LT
All very true. A few other points.
CVC = Computer video coated, and CVU = computer video uncoated.
For some odd reason, pantone has elected to create separate color
swatches for the coated and uncoated versions of the same ink mix
similar to the "Hard Copy" Pantone matching system swatch packet.
They say that if you use the cvc vs the cvu, the screen display you
see will be slightly different, and is supposed to simulate, on your
screen, that color as printed on coated or uncoated stock . I can't
see any difference on any of our monitors!
For the reasons that the other posters have already pointed out, this
causes lots of problems with mixed versions of the same color causing
extra unwanted separations. We use only the coated version in our
work flow, no matter what stock it will be printed on. This give us
some standardization on work created in house. However we can not
control what comes in from customers, and we deal with this problem
quite often.
I wish the page layout apps, PM QXP ID, would allow you to select
which colors you want to print on each plate. This way, if you had one
of those mixed color definitions, you could force it to print on the
same plate.
Warren Tryk
>For some odd reason, pantone has elected to create separate color
>swatches for the coated and uncoated versions of the same ink mix
>similar to the "Hard Copy" Pantone matching system swatch packet.
>
>They say that if you use the cvc vs the cvu, the screen display you
>see will be slightly different, and is supposed to simulate, on your
>screen, that color as printed on coated or uncoated stock . I can't
>see any difference on any of our monitors!
Take a look in the Pantone printed swatch book at the coated and uncoated
versions of 199 & 273 for example. You'll see a huge difference in the
perceived "look" of the ink film on paper even though the ink formulas are the
same. There is indeed a difference that SHOULD show on the monitor if a
designer is to make any valid choices based on the ultimate paper stock spec'ed
for the job. And of course, a laminate proof will mask this difference, too.
Been there... done that.
LT
> Take a look in the Pantone printed swatch book at the coated and uncoated
> versions of 199 & 273 for example. You'll see a huge difference in the
> perceived "look" of the ink film on paper even though the ink formulas are the
> same. There is indeed a difference that SHOULD show on the monitor if a
> designer is to make any valid choices based on the ultimate paper stock spec'ed
> for the job. And of course, a laminate proof will mask this difference, too.
>
> Been there... done that.
>
> -Warren
>
> Warren Tryk Design
> Tumwater, Washington, USA
>
> "The woman who knew that I had dyslexia. I never interviewed her."
> G. (Dubya) Bush, Orange, Calif., Sept. 15, 2000
Warren,
I don't know what exactly you are saying.
We mix pantones everyday using the formulas provided by the "Pantone
Color Formula Guide"
PMS199 is 12 parts Rubine, and 4 parts Yellow. Produces a deep red
PMS273 is 8 parts Rubine and 8 parts Reflex. Produces very dark violet
Two very different pigment ink mixes.
If you order one of these colors from us, that's what you will get. No
matter what you see on your screen.
Now how they display on the screen, or are produced by CMYK is quite a
different story.
My point is that the computer display characteristics of the same PMS
color in U (uncoated) and the C (coated) are so close you would be
hard pressed to notice a difference. Now I'll admit I have not gone
through the trouble of putting all 1000+ pms colors on my monitor with
the U and C versions side by side to see if there is any difference.
But the ones I have seen... no noticeable difference.
Use the hard copy PMS swatch samples to be sure of PMS colors.. that
is the color you will got from a quality printer.
LT
Warren Tryk
>I don't know what exactly you are saying.
>
>We mix pantones everyday using the formulas provided by the "Pantone
>Color Formula Guide"
>
>PMS199 is 12 parts Rubine, and 4 parts Yellow. Produces a deep red
>PMS273 is 8 parts Rubine and 8 parts Reflex. Produces very dark violet
>Two very different pigment ink mixes.
>
>If you order one of these colors from us, that's what you will get. No
>matter what you see on your screen.
>
>Now how they display on the screen, or are produced by CMYK is quite a
>different story.
>
>My point is that the computer display characteristics of the same PMS
>color in U (uncoated) and the C (coated) are so close you would be
>hard pressed to notice a difference. Now I'll admit I have not gone
>through the trouble of putting all 1000+ pms colors on my monitor with
>the U and C versions side by side to see if there is any difference.
>But the ones I have seen... no noticeable difference.
>
>Use the hard copy PMS swatch samples to be sure of PMS colors.. that
>is the color you will got from a quality printer.
>
>LT
***
[excerpt from my post follows ...]
Take a look in the Pantone printed swatch book at the coated and uncoated
versions of 199 & 273 for example. You'll see a huge difference in the
perceived "look" of the ink film on paper even though the ink formulas are the
same. There is indeed a difference that SHOULD show on the monitor if a
designer is to make any valid choices based on the ultimate paper stock spec'ed
for the job.
***
Your comments are of course, correct. I guess what my point was, that _IF_ the
difference doesn't show up on screen, which it DOES NOT in any of the apps that
I use (Illustrator, InDesign, etc.), then the designer is basically without a
clue as to how it will actually print on a given paper. This is based upon the
assumption that many, if not most, younger "designers" don't have the
experience of actually having to look at PRINTED Pantone swatch books to comp
their layouts and simply trust what they see on screen. As you obviously
understand, there is a difference between the RGB of the screen and the actual
CMYK of ink film on a given paper.
My perspective comes from 35+ years experience in basically every aspect of the
graphics/printing business from technical illustrator traineee to print shop
manager (Old Fart, here for sure!)
Sorry for the rant. I'm cranky today.
LT
>
> My perspective comes from 35+ years experience in basically every aspect of the
> graphics/printing business from technical illustrator traineee to print shop
> manager (Old Fart, here for sure!)
>
> Sorry for the rant. I'm cranky today.
>
> -Warren
>
> Warren Tryk Design
> Tumwater, Washington, USA
>
> "The woman who knew that I had dyslexia. I never interviewed her."
> G. (Dubya) Bush, Orange, Calif., Sept. 15, 2000
OKAY, I didn't read your post correctly.. thought you were saying that
you trusted what you see on the screen, and could see differences
between the CVC and CVU swatches as displayed on the screen. We are
on the same page here.
If you are working on a job that is "Color Critical" then you best use
the printed swatch book for color selections. Trust what you see on
your screen and you are headed for disaster.
Given that you CAN NOT see much difference between CVC and CVU as
displayed on your RGB screen, and color accuracy of colors in general
as seen on the screen is suspect, then standardizing your work flow
with one of the options (CVC or CVU) still makes a lot of sense to me.
You just know going in that WYS is not WYG and you use the printed
swatch book to select colors.
BTW, you probably know this from your many years in the industry, but
for the benefit of other readers (Suppose there are any?)
those printed swatch books are only accurate for 12-18 months, after
which the colors will begin to fade a bit. This doesn't mean through
them away, but know up front that the older the swatch book is the
more inaccurate it is.
Have a great day Warren.
The Jazz Hustler
I don't know if anyone can help, but I'm a little confused about Pantones in
Illustrator 8. What I do is create or manipulate an image in Photoshop 5.0,
convert it to a monotone color (pantone) then save it as an eps file.
I then expect that I can place that file into Illustrator and continue to
create a work in one or two colors. When I do place the pantone image in
Illustrator however, it converts the image to CMYK - or at least this is
ehat it says when I select the image and choose 'Selection Info'. Why do it
do this, or is it still a spot/pantone image that Illustrator can't quite
recognise?
All help will be gratefully received.
Peace,
The Jazz Hustler