Human Skulls
Shannon Larratt / BME
I know I'm risking some serious flaming, especially since I've posted this to
a couple of groups, but I do think this is appropriate.
I've just started up a business selling (real) human skulls, but specializing
in oddities, deformities, and violent deaths. (Why get a skull if it's not
interesting, right? Everyone can get a skull, but how many have one with a
bullet hole in it!)
Anyway, I've started putting up a page about it at:
http://bme.freeq.com/skulls/
On a side note, anyone that wants to steal any of my photos to use on their
own page, go right ahead as long as it's non-commercial use. I'd like a
credit/link, but you don't have to give me one.
Enjoy,
Shannon
=======================================================
Shannon Larratt, b...@freeq.com
BME: Body Modification Ezine: http://BME.FreeQ.com/
UNUSUAL REAL HUMAN SKULLS: http://BME.FreeQ.com/skulls/
jennifer stolarz
Shannon Larratt / BME wrote in message
<6njje9$m9g$4...@news2.tor.accglobal.net>...
>I know I'm risking some serious flaming, especially since I've posted this
to
>a couple of groups, but I do think this is appropriate.
>
>I've just started up a business selling (real) human skulls, but
specializing
>in oddities, deformities, and violent deaths. (Why get a skull if it's not
>interesting, right? Everyone can get a skull, but how many have one with a
>bullet hole in it!)
>
Gross Gross Gross, aren't those the kind of things Michael Jackson buys ?
Elizabeth
jennifer stolarz wrote:
>
> Shannon Larratt / BME wrote in message
> <6njje9$m9g$4...@news2.tor.accglobal.net>...
> >I've just started up a business selling (real) human skulls, but
> specializing
> >in oddities, deformities, and violent deaths.
> Gross Gross Gross,
I second that. To all his own, but I find deformed, real skulls too
creepy. I did visit the site out of that sick curiousity we all have of
thing that gross us out. There's no picture of it, but there are the
skulls of FETUSES available! Yes, as in unborn babies! The others
didn't seem TOO bad, but the thought of that REALLY freaked me out....
-Elizabeth
ThornsKiss
b...@freeq.com (Shannon Larratt / BME) wrote:
>I've just started up a business selling (real) human skulls, but specializing
>
>interesting, right? Everyone can get a skull, but how many have one with a
>bullet hole in it!)
I thought there was a federal law against the sale of human parts.
If not, where in the bloody hell can I get a shrunken head? Without
shrinking one myself, that is.
@>}--}----
Shannon Larratt / BME
In article <199807040051...@ladder03.news.aol.com>, thorn...@aol.com (ThornsKiss) wrote:
>b...@freeq.com (Shannon Larratt / BME) wrote:
>>I've just started up a business selling (real) human skulls, but specializing
>>
>>in oddities, deformities, and violent deaths. (Why get a skull if it's not
>>interesting, right? Everyone can get a skull, but how many have one with a
>>bullet hole in it!)
>
> I thought there was a federal law against the sale of human parts.
Not that I know of. When you're dealing with animal parts you have to have
paperwork to prove that they're not poached I think. Humans on the other hand
don't generally get poached! I think there may be laws against "wet parts" but
not against skulls and bones.
> If not, where in the bloody hell can I get a shrunken head? Without
>shrinking one myself, that is.
Go to altavista and search for "shrunken head for sale" and you'll find a few
on the market. I don't personally deal in them, but when you find them they're
generally $5000 or more. They're very rare...
Shannon Larratt / BME
In article <359DBB...@ix.netcom.com>, cdrp...@ix.netcom.com wrote:
>jennifer stolarz wrote:
>>
>> Shannon Larratt / BME wrote in message
>> <6njje9$m9g$4...@news2.tor.accglobal.net>...
>
>> specializing
>> >in oddities, deformities, and violent deaths.
>
>
>I second that. To all his own, but I find deformed, real skulls too
>creepy. I did visit the site out of that sick curiousity we all have of
>thing that gross us out. There's no picture of it, but there are the
>skulls of FETUSES available! Yes, as in unborn babies! The others
>didn't seem TOO bad, but the thought of that REALLY freaked me out....
I can get the whole fetus skeleton too -- that's REALLY creepy, because rather
than being articulated like a normal skeleton, dried tissues hold it together.
Very, very, very weird and scary looking!
FairyMange
>I can get the whole fetus skeleton too -- that's REALLY creepy, because
>rather
>than being articulated like a normal skeleton, dried tissues hold it
>together.
>Very, very, very weird and scary looking!
>
> Shannon
Maybe Im being airheaded, or un-educated or what-have-you, but *where* do you
get Skulls? Human skulls?? I had no idea there was a market for skulls, much
less fetal skeletons. I've heard of people who *donate* their body for things
like that, but any other method of obtaining them seems as if it would be
illegal...
~Amberella
Nikki
Hmmmm...and where, preytell, do you GET these human skulls, Shannon dear?
Shannon Larratt / BME
In article <199807040628...@ladder03.news.aol.com>, fairy...@aol.com (FairyMange) wrote:
>>I can get the whole fetus skeleton too -- that's REALLY creepy, because
>>rather
>>than being articulated like a normal skeleton, dried tissues hold it
>>together.
>>Very, very, very weird and scary looking!
>
>
>get Skulls? Human skulls?? I had no idea there was a market for skulls, much
>less fetal skeletons. I've heard of people who *donate* their body for things
>like that, but any other method of obtaining them seems as if it would be
>illegal...
They come in from Asia. In some cultures there's no taboo as far as buying and
selling of body parts once the soul has left -- it's just an empty vessel I
guess. Also, a lot of them are from "old stock". I'm sure that a number do
come from illicit sources like graverobbers, but it's surprisingly legal...
Shannon Larratt / BME
In article <01bda71b$557f3ec0$0f5087d1@whodaman>, "Nikki" <pl...@accessv.com> wrote:
>Hmmmm...and where, preytell, do you GET these human skulls, Shannon dear?
All you need is good night vision and a shovel. ;-)
ThornsKiss
>and
>selling of body parts once the soul has left -- it's just an empty vessel I
>guess. Also, a lot of them are from "old stock". I'm sure that a number do
>come from illicit sources like graverobbers, but it's surprisingly legal...
>
> Shannon
Oh! So Cambodia finaly found a market for the left-overs and side effects of
Pol Pot's tender rule. I forget how many people the Khimer Rouge massacred but
it was certainly quite a lot. A National Geographic article showed whole
warehouses full of bones and skulls.
That would certainly provide an endless seeming supply. However, it would
seem to me that using the bone of people murdered by a tyrant's army would be
the same as getting them from Dachau or Auschwitz. Or at least that was the
first thought that went through my mind.
@>}--}----
Medora
Perhaps it's just me, but buying and selling human skulls seems rather
perverse. I mean how can you put a price on the cradle of human thought?
All the skulls you sell come from real people with real lives, real
loves, real concerns, real pain, real deaths. To you a skull with a
bullet hole in it, or raveged by a terrible disease might seem "neat"
but to the peson who was murdered it was no joke. You have the skull of
a 10 year old child for sale, how do you think that poor inocent's
mother would feel to see his skull as a paperweight, or is her skull for
sale too? Your trade is barbaric and exploititive, to be quite frank you
sicken me. Nazis liked to use the skulls of their victems as
decorations, to make lampshades of their skin. My great aunts and great
grandparents were killed in the holocaust. Their remains were never
recovered, perhaps you have them on display?
-Medora.(who feels sick now)
Shannon Larratt / BME wrote:
>
> I know I'm risking some serious flaming, especially since I've posted this to
> a couple of groups, but I do think this is appropriate.
>
> I've just started up a business selling (real) human skulls, but specializing
> in oddities, deformities, and violent deaths. (Why get a skull if it's not
> interesting, right? Everyone can get a skull, but how many have one with a
> bullet hole in it!)
>
> Anyway, I've started putting up a page about it at:
> http://bme.freeq.com/skulls/
>
> On a side note, anyone that wants to steal any of my photos to use on their
> own page, go right ahead as long as it's non-commercial use. I'd like a
> credit/link, but you don't have to give me one.
>
> Enjoy,
>
sus...@stones.com
> >I second that. To all his own, but I find deformed, real skulls too
> >creepy. I did visit the site out of that sick curiousity we all have of
> >thing that gross us out. There's no picture of it, but there are the
> >skulls of FETUSES available! Yes, as in unborn babies! The others
> >didn't seem TOO bad, but the thought of that REALLY freaked me out....
>
> I can get the whole fetus skeleton too -- that's REALLY creepy, because rather
> than being articulated like a normal skeleton, dried tissues hold it together.
> Very, very, very weird and scary looking!
>
> Shannon
and how much does this stuff cost?
-susan
-----== Posted via Deja News, The Leader in Internet Discussion ==-----
http://www.dejanews.com/rg_mkgrp.xp Create Your Own Free Member Forum
Jenn
You're definately not the only one who finds it inhumane...almost all
cultures feel that ancestors must be revered, and while not all cultures
place the same amount of value on their dead, they put them in the ground
for a reason, and I'm sure that no one would want somebody to profit off the
sale of their mother, sister, grandmother, etc...
Jenn
auda...@teleport.com
free recipes: http://www.geocities.com/NapaValley/9559/
>Dear zeus, I hope this was a joke. ::frowning:: Somehow I still can't
>swallow the fetus skeletons. Am I the only one who finds this inhumane?
>I have to ask.. what kind of people order fetal skeletons? Better yet..
>who spends over $500 on a skull anyways? ::shakes her head:: I believe
>that's a sure sign that you have more money than you know what to do
>with.
>
>KeLLi G.Q.
>http://listen.to/Kelli
>~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~
>"Long Night?"
>"They’re all long. Every night is an eternity within itself.
>When it seems the sun will surely rise and bring the morning with it,
>the darkness begins again. Hours pass, and yet time does not.
>So yes. Yes sir. Long night. Every night."
>~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~
>
>
Imbryn
My lovely little email-pal Medora said:
>Perhaps it's just me, but buying and selling human skulls seems rather
>perverse. I mean how can you put a price on the cradle of human thought?
>All the skulls you sell come from real people with real lives, real
>loves, real concerns, real pain, real deaths. To you a skull with a
>bullet hole in it, or raveged by a terrible disease might seem "neat"
>but to the peson who was murdered it was no joke. You have the skull of
>a 10 year old child for sale, how do you think that poor inocent's
>mother would feel to see his skull as a paperweight, or is her skull for
>sale too? Your trade is barbaric and exploititive, to be quite frank you
>sicken me. Nazis liked to use the skulls of their victems as
>decorations, to make lampshades of their skin. My great aunts and great
>grandparents were killed in the holocaust. Their remains were never
>recovered, perhaps you have them on display?
> -Medora.(who feels sick now)
Oh my dear Medora! You miss the point! These are but the lifeless husks of
the person that they were! They may be the cradle of human thought, but think
about the pointlessness of burial or of cremation. They have the nerve to
(respectfully they think) stick a person, into the ground, and then cover them
with dirt, with the worms! Thats rather rude, I think! And the burning of
bodies?! I only like the idea because of pyromania! I think its pretty mean,
too. Truely, there are no respectful ways to get rid of a corpse. And also,
you realise that it is very expensive! That is for good reason, because still,
the body is worth quite a bit to the family, but even if the Mum of some little
baby in Asia has the body buried close, or if the whole skeleton is across the
Earth(or across the universe, for that matter), the child will be just as close
to their Mothers heart. That is what matters in the moral aspect of it. And
besides (I assume here, Shannon, please correct me if I am wrong) but I think
that the process would probably include the consent of some relative or mother
or someone who has the rights to the corpse. As for your grandparents, I think
that she couldn't of gotten hold of them, considering that she gets her bones
from Asia, she probably doesnt have them. Sorry to have to disagree with you
here, but I think that it is a good idea, if a touch barbaric.
Luv and Bloodlust,
C@$H B.
who thinks that the philosophic aspect of this should not even be debated(it
explains itself!)
"He said "I'm your lover,I'm your friend, I'm pure." and he hit me again."
-Courtney Love, From Jennifer's Body
The Fallen Belltower-Under construction
http://www.angelfire.com/ca2/ohdidyouwantthis
Alex & Synnove Hoover
Miss Evil wrote in message <359E40...@earthlink.net>...
>in california, you can keep a dead body in your home, as long as it is
>displayed nicely.. i.e. not some nasty spooky way.. but in a dignified
>way..
>
>had a friend who's parents kept the bones of a great granddad in a
>drawer..
>
>Becca
>--
>look.. now i'm a number... # 14480943
>http://www.geocities.com/SoHo/Square/5361/gothswap.htm
>home for all of your goth swapping needs.
In NY, you can't even attend to your own dead.
If you are a member of a religion that is not supported by local
undertakers, you have to pay one to stand around during the service and to
be present during transportation.
Talk about sick.
L8r,
alX
Zevaluz
>On Sat, 04 Jul 1998 16:58:32 GMT, b...@freeq.com (Shannon Larratt / BME) wrote:
>
>There you are, caught in your Judeo-Christian prejudices. Not every culture
>puts a value on the body.
Revering your ancestors isn't Judeo-Christian. It's Egyptian, it's a
very large part of Voodoo, there sure aren't many religions that
*don't* have respect for the dead as a part of it.
So if you want to slag on Christians, find another point. A majority
of the cultures that revere their dead do so because they believe that
either the dead will move into a different world and want them to have
stuff/all their bones intact - or believe that their ancestors never
leave them and would want their bones revered and not just sold off.
Christianity believes generally that the body is a vessel and though
they do bury them, etc - it's not seen as still being necessarily the
whole person. I'd say out of the many cultures that show respect for
their dead - Christianity is the least elaborate.
>In some cultures, it's the soul that has value, and
>once the soul has left the body, it's just an empty vessel. So I can say with
>certainty that it's not a big deal to these people.
Sure, that's true. I'm not Christian, but I sure as hell won't piss
off my ancestors by selling off their bones! They help us out too
much, why would I want to upset them?
Buying someone elses bones surely won't kill you. But to put someone
down for not wanting to, not believing it's ethical and then drawing
Christianity into it... Why? Just let them believe what they want to
believe without slinging any mud.
Zev. (who loves Necromance on Melrose...)
Alex & Synnove Hoover
Zevaluz wrote in message <359ffd85...@news.supernews.com>...
>>On Sat, 04 Jul 1998 16:58:32 GMT, b...@freeq.com (Shannon Larratt / BME)
wrote:
>>
>>There you are, caught in your Judeo-Christian prejudices. Not every
culture
>>puts a value on the body.
>
>Revering your ancestors isn't Judeo-Christian. It's Egyptian, it's a
>very large part of Voodoo, there sure aren't many religions that
>*don't* have respect for the dead as a part of it.
1) Don't forget Shinto.
2) She didn't say revering ancestors is Judeo-Christian. She said that
using the corpse as a part of that reverence was a Judeo-Christian
prejudice.
3) You're right in saying it isn't *exculsively* a J-C idea.
L8r,
alX
Elizabeth
KeLLi G.Q. wrote:
>
> Shannon Larratt / BME wrote:
>
> >
> > << Shannon>>
I knew someone who tried to dig up a grave, but he lost interest at the
3 feet point. Sicko....
>
> Dear zeus, I hope this was a joke. ::frowning:: Somehow I still can't
> swallow the fetus skeletons. Am I the only one who finds this inhumane?
I don't know if inhumane is the word (I'm SURE they weren't killed FOR
their skeletons), but I know what you mean. Somehow, it seems really
perverse. And not perverse in that cool, interesting way. I literally
felt sick when I read that part. But again, to each his own. *shiver*
-Elizabeth
Elizabeth
Imbryn wrote:
>
> My lovely little email-pal Medora said:
> >Perhaps it's just me, but buying and selling human skulls seems rather
> >perverse. I mean how can you put a price on the cradle of human thought?
*clap clap clap* I agree. I mean, if someone wills they're bones ahead
of time to be sold, fine. But aside from that, I think it's just not
our place to use them for profit or because we want to make our home
look creepy. The skull is a significant thing after death, even if only
in a poetic way, and I don't think it is right to put a price tag on it.
> >All the skulls you sell come from real people with real lives, real
> >loves, real concerns, real pain, real deaths. To you a skull with a
> >bullet hole in it, or raveged by a terrible disease might seem "neat"
> >but to the peson who was murdered it was no joke.
Yeah, I hardly find murder a "neat" thing, and selling/buying a skull
with a bullet hole in it rather glorifies violence, it seems.
> >sicken me. Nazis liked to use the skulls of their victems as
> >decorations, to make lampshades of their skin.
This was one of the first things that came to my mind as well.
> Oh my dear Medora! You miss the point! These are but the lifeless husks of
> the person that they were!
You forget that most philosophies regard the body as a temple of some
sort. Once the soul is gone, the body no longer serves a purpose, but
it should still be respected for the magnificent thing that it was.
That is why there is usually discarded with some sort of ceremony, it
once housed something heavenly.
They may be the cradle of human thought, but think
> about the pointlessness of burial or of cremation. They have the nerve to
> (respectfully they think) stick a person, into the ground, and then cover them
> with dirt, with the worms! Thats rather rude, I think!
For the record, the point of burial is returning the body to the earth
from which it came. Even if you don't believe that we were created from
the earth by God, we came somehow indirectly from it, and so are like a
part of it. That's why we so often say "Mother Earth," and why the
Earth has been thought of as a Goddess. It's a cycle. We come from the
earth, return to the earth, and nurish it so that it can bear further
life. Nearly every tradition of discarding the body is somehow
connected to this cycle. The only one I can think of that is not is
cremation.
> the body is worth quite a bit to the family, but even if the Mum of some little
> baby in Asia has the body buried close, or if the whole skeleton is across the
> Earth(or across the universe, for that matter), the child will be just as close
> to their Mothers heart.
Yes, but that doesn't mean it's alright to profit from a person's death
by potentially disrespecting it. I sure as hell wouldn't want my skull
(or a family members skull) being tossed hand to hand by some person who
thinks it's damn cool that I got his in the head by a bullet. *knock on
wood* That's MY violent death he thinks is damn cool, and I certainly
won't be looking back and saying, "Hey, check out the hole in my skull!
How cool is that!?"
That is what matters in the moral aspect of it. And
> besides (I assume here, Shannon, please correct me if I am wrong) but I think
> that the process would probably include the consent of some relative or mother
> or someone who has the rights to the corpse.
It might, but you never know, do you? I know that there have been all
kinds of mix ups in places where people are cremated. They'll find
fillings in the ashes of a baby who never even had teeth yet, much less
a cavity. They'll find fillings missing in the ashes of people who DID
have them. How easy, and how profitable would it be for people who know
what they're doing to keep a skull or two in one of these places where
there are all kinds of mix ups anyway? You just don't know.
As for your grandparents, I think
> that she couldn't of gotten hold of them, considering that she gets her bones
> from Asia, she probably doesnt have them.
That wasn't her point.
Okay, just had to bitch about that. :) If it's legal, I can't do
anything to keep the trade from going on (short of voting against it if
the oportunity ever would come up). If it's your thing, fine. But I
just wanted to show why I and others feel this way.
-Elizabeth
Kaleah
Ok, a bit unrelated, but this does remind me . . .
Last year I did a really nifty art project - we made clay whistles. :)
At first, I was gonna make a goblet with either a dragon or a feerie
sitting in it/coming out of it, but then decided to do otherwise (with
urgings from a friend). He kept saying "That looks like a skull! Make
a skull out of it!" And so I did. :) And it turned out pretty good
too. I made the whistle end of it into a candle sticking out off the
top of the skull (which does not have a jawbone hehe). I dripped red
wax on it to give it that genuine candle look (and feel and smell and
taste, etc. >:)) and it dripped down parts of the sides too. It is
about halfsize though, and the color (which when I had painted it before
the glaze had been near perfect to bone - had to bring one into class
- dog chews soup bones and drags home deer every now and then - but
after the glaze dried it turned almost splochy red and greenish hues
but still looks nifty - almost moldy). :) Hmm .. enough said of that!
:)
Kaleah
not *quite* sure why she posted that . . . hehe :)
--
***
Please respond to sev...@widomaker.com for a quicker reply. :)
William Iserman
Shannon Larratt / BME wrote:
>
> >>rather
> >>than being articulated like a normal skeleton, dried tissues hold it
> >>together.
> >>Very, very, very weird and scary looking!
> >
> >
> >get Skulls? Human skulls?? I had no idea there was a market for skulls, much
> >less fetal skeletons. I've heard of people who *donate* their body for things
> >like that, but any other method of obtaining them seems as if it would be
> >illegal...
>
> selling of body parts once the soul has left -- it's just an empty vessel I
> guess. Also, a lot of them are from "old stock". I'm sure that a number do
> come from illicit sources like graverobbers, but it's surprisingly legal...
>
> Shannon
Gee, and here I thought you had a summer job at the Mutter Museium in
Phila. and were bringing your work home with you.
WRI
Elizabeth
Shannon Larratt / BME wrote:
>
> paperwork to prove that they're not poached I think. Humans on the other hand
> don't generally get poached!
ROTFL Oh.... Hehe.... Did anyone else get really amusing images in
their head with the consideration of human poaching?
-Elizabeth
Who has a sick sense of humor sometimes....
Cygnet
On Sun, 05 Jul 1998 22:34:20 GMT, zev...@amphigory.com (Zevaluz)
wrote:
>Sure, that's true. I'm not Christian, but I sure as hell won't piss
>off my ancestors by selling off their bones! They help us out too
>much, why would I want to upset them?
My mother suggested a while ago that I carve her bones after she's
gone. Can't think of a better way to remember, IMO... there's quite a
strong cultural signifiance in it, as well as the obvious familial
ties...
~scott
Shannon Larratt / BME
In article <199807052134...@ladder01.news.aol.com>, imb...@aol.com (Imbryn) wrote:
>too. Truely, there are no respectful ways to get rid of a corpse. And also,
I'd love to be the centrepiece of someone's collection. I like the idea of
being on display after I'm dead...
>to their Mothers heart. That is what matters in the moral aspect of it. And
>besides (I assume here, Shannon, please correct me if I am wrong) but I think
>that the process would probably include the consent of some relative or mother
>or someone who has the rights to the corpse.
To the best of my knowledge, all of these skulls were either given by the
families or by the people themselves (via pre-death consent) to medical
and other collections, and they've now entered the public market.
Shannon
Shannon Larratt / BME
In article <35A045...@ix.netcom.com>, cdrp...@ix.netcom.com wrote:
>Yeah, I hardly find murder a "neat" thing, and selling/buying a skull
>with a bullet hole in it rather glorifies violence, it seems.
These skulls are undeniably "interesting". Whether you think that's they're in
good taste or not is a different issue. Skulls have historically been used for
display purposes in almost every culture... Mostly in tribal cultures, but
also in the West.
>life. Nearly every tradition of discarding the body is somehow
>connected to this cycle. The only one I can think of that is not is
>cremation.
In cremation you are converted to ashes/earth...
>wood* That's MY violent death he thinks is damn cool, and I certainly
>won't be looking back and saying, "Hey, check out the hole in my skull!
>How cool is that!?"
I bet that your perspective will change a great deal when you're dead! The
unbearable flames will be more of a concern! ;-)
>It might, but you never know, do you? I know that there have been all
>kinds of mix ups in places where people are cremated. They'll find
>fillings in the ashes of a baby who never even had teeth yet, much less
>a cavity. They'll find fillings missing in the ashes of people who DID
>have them. How easy, and how profitable would it be for people who know
>what they're doing to keep a skull or two in one of these places where
>there are all kinds of mix ups anyway? You just don't know.
And in some countries, life in cheap. You can buy people for $40 and do with
them whatever you want... Including killing them and selling their skull. (Of
course I'm NOT in support of this!!!)
Shannon Larratt / BME
In article <6np1gp$732$1...@news.monmouth.com>, "Alex & Synnove Hoover" <sa...@monmouth.com> wrote:
>>>There you are, caught in your Judeo-Christian prejudices. Not every
>culture
>>>puts a value on the body.
>>
>>Revering your ancestors isn't Judeo-Christian. It's Egyptian, it's a
>>very large part of Voodoo, there sure aren't many religions that
>>*don't* have respect for the dead as a part of it.
>
>using the corpse as a part of that reverence was a Judeo-Christian
>prejudice.
Yup. The majority of things that Christians do and think are certainly not "by
the Book"...
Shannon
PS. Even though my name is Shannon, I am a "he"... named after Shannon's
Theorum, an information theorum that makes computing possible. (Claude Shannon
of Bell Labs). Can you tell computers run in the family?
Shannon Larratt / BME
In article <35A03D...@ix.netcom.com>, cdrp...@ix.netcom.com wrote:
>> Dear zeus, I hope this was a joke. ::frowning:: Somehow I still can't
>> swallow the fetus skeletons. Am I the only one who finds this inhumane?
>
>I don't know if inhumane is the word (I'm SURE they weren't killed FOR
>their skeletons), but I know what you mean. Somehow, it seems really
>perverse. And not perverse in that cool, interesting way. I literally
>felt sick when I read that part. But again, to each his own. *shiver*
The fetus skeletons are medical remains of course. They are VERY VERY creepy.
They literally look like little alien soldiers, and are held together with the
dried tissues... absolutely terrifying, and not something I'd recommend to
most people, even serious collectors.
Shannon
ThanisWolf
>>life. Nearly every tradition of discarding the body is somehow
>>connected to this cycle. The only one I can think of that is not is
>>cremation.
>
>In cremation you are converted to ashes/earth...
Not to mention...ashes make a wonderful fertilizer. Why do you think that
plant life flourishes so well after a forest fire?
~Lord Thannis~
"All the advantages of Christianity and alcohol;
none of their defects."
~ Mustapha Mond on the virtues of soma, Brave New World
Jenn
Well Shannon, I must say that I think your business is absolutely disgusting
and horrible, but I also must say that I sort of admire you for taking all
this flak and not going ballistic at people...I hope you have success,
though I also hope you'll never have a huge business with this skull/fetus
skeleton thing of yours...
Jenn
Ah, but it depends on the ashes...hardwood ashes are great mulches or
compost additives, however, ashes from barbeque charcoal are very toxic to
plants...I wonder which end of the scale we humans are, and I wonder what
we're doing to our beautiful lakes when we throw ourselves (or rather, our
ashes into them)...actually, ya know, something odd...a few weeks ago the
local news station aired a story about how lots of people were having their
ashes dumped in the streams in the local Japanese Gardens (a truly beautiful
place), and how it was clogging filter systems and causing plants to be in
bad shape and causing some unwanted things (I believe algae was one of them)
to flourish...
Jenn
auda...@teleport.com
free recipes: http://www.geocities.com/NapaValley/9559/
> Not to mention...ashes make a wonderful fertilizer. Why do you think
Shannon Larratt / BME
In article <XGXn1.5669$r73.4...@news.teleport.com>, "Jenn" <auda...@teleport.com> wrote:
>Well Shannon, I must say that I think your business is absolutely disgusting
>and horrible, but I also must say that I sort of admire you for taking all
>this flak and not going ballistic at people...I hope you have success,
>though I also hope you'll never have a huge business with this skull/fetus
>skeleton thing of yours...
Thanks, I think... Either way, I'm having fun with it. If I can carve out a
living doing fun and unusual things (I have lots of other goofy projects too),
then I'm happy. I don't want to be locked into a traditional job, ever.
Elizabeth
Shannon Larratt / BME wrote:
> trade. But it isn't in those contexts. Why is it that Westerners always judge
> everything in Western terms and are unable to truly open their eyes?
>
Um, I'm a Taoist (philosophically and spiritually [not religiously]),
which is a very eastern (chinese, mainly) philosophy, yet I still fail
to see the sale of of skulls as ethical. Of course, ethics are
relative, but I'm not EVEN going into that one.... Anyway, my point is
that we DO see what you mean by different cultures not valuing a dead
body, we just don't agree with it. It is actually very offensive to a
lot of people, as you have already seen.
-Elizabeth
tee...@spamtrap.com
Medora <rey...@erols.com> wrote:
: Perhaps it's just me, but buying and selling human skulls seems rather
: perverse. I mean how can you put a price on the cradle of human thought?
The cradle of human thought?
These particular cradles are empty, of no more use to their original
owners.
Personally, I'd rather think that my skull would become a real kewl
decoration at someone's halloween party, than that it would sit in the
ground forgotten.
Zevaluz
>On Mon, 06 Jul 1998 03:19:04 GMT, b...@freeq.com (Shannon Larratt / BME) wrote:
>
>Yup. The majority of things that Christians do and think are certainly not "by
>the Book"...
I think it's rather odd then in that same book that most of the people
who were seen as 'worthy of respect' were respectfully entombed before
their final burial.
Zevaluz
>On Fri, 03 Jul 1998 21:46:58 GMT, b...@freeq.com (Shannon Larratt / BME) wrote:
>
>I've just started up a business selling (real) human skulls, but specializing
>in oddities, deformities, and violent deaths. (Why get a skull if it's not
>bullet hole in it!)
While I'm thinking about this thread.....
This seems to be an interesting ethical picture of a subculture that
is often seen as intensely strange because of their liking for things
that relate to death or pain.
Why do the people who dislike this, dislike this? Where is the line
drawn between the skull of someone we loved and the skull of someone
we didn't know?
Storytime: When I went to California with my husband a couple of
years ago, we went to all of his own haunts, including Black Market on
Melrose. Now, all of you LA and Hollywood CA oldtimers remember when
Ragnorak (sp) and Necromance were in there.... when he'd come back to
Melrose with me, Necromance had their own store.
The store had all kinds of bones and skulls - including jewelry
embellished with deer-knucklebones (which I did purchase, they're
gorgeous and very subtle), etc. It was a beautiful store, and she had
a *lot* of lovely things, including preserved things in jars and a
child size coffin used as a display case.
What's the difference between her store and Shannon's online
enterprise? Elegance. Her store was decorated with (and had the mood
of) macabre elegance, done in earth tones and blacks. Nancy herself
was a very nice and friendly person who loved what she did. Had
always been fascinated by it. To me, her store felt almost like more
of a shrine - respectfully done - than a store. On a slightly tangent
note, we were there when she got a phone call from the Dali Lama's
representative - it seemed he'd heard about her store and wanted to
bless it. She somewhat respectfully declined.
Nancy was a very nice, fun, friendly person, and her store was very
elegant. It's very different to me (and perhaps others) to see
someone with just a webpage that's very plain selling expensive and
deformed skulls. It's partly due to the nature of the net and partly
a reflection that Shannon has other interests and can't pour hours and
hours into an elegant webpage (if that's indeed what he wants to do in
the first place).
Now, I didn't nose around Necromance's invoices to see where she got
her skulls - but she does willingly tell people that she gets them
from medical establishments in the US where there's deeded to science
and some of the animal bones from scientific supply companies. I did
not hear her mention that they were gotten from outside the US and she
mentioned what a pain it was keeping all the invoices, it seems that
periodically she's inspected and asked where she got her merchandise
and has to have the invoices to prove they were gotten in a legal and
forthright manner.
I'm personally uncomfortable with the sale of human skulls - but the
solution's easy. I just don't purchase one.
(But if any of you ever want a beautiful store to look around in, look
up Necromance on Melrose in CA)
Zev. (who finds hers and others reactions to this very fascinating!)
Lyn
Jenn wrote:
>
> Ah, but it depends on the ashes...hardwood ashes are great mulches or
> compost additives, however, ashes from barbeque charcoal are very toxic to
> plants...I wonder which end of the scale we humans are, and I wonder what
> we're doing to our beautiful lakes when we throw ourselves (or rather, our
> ashes into them)...actually, ya know, something odd...a few weeks ago the
> local news station aired a story about how lots of people were having their
> ashes dumped in the streams in the local Japanese Gardens (a truly beautiful
> place), and how it was clogging filter systems and causing plants to be in
> bad shape and causing some unwanted things (I believe algae was one of them)
> to flourish...
Also, the process of cremation produces air pollution. I think the way
our society handles the dead is all wrong--pumping the body all full of
preservatives, then sealing it up in a water-proof box, where it will
stay for centuries. Gives me claustrophobia just thinking about it. I
think we should just be put as-is into pine boxes so we can actually
return to earth.
On a different note, how about those people who get their pts
freeze-dried?
Lyn
Shannon Larratt / BME
In article <35a0cb64...@news.supernews.com>, zev...@amphigory.com wrote:
>Nancy was a very nice, fun, friendly person, and her store was very
>elegant. It's very different to me (and perhaps others) to see
>someone with just a webpage that's very plain selling expensive and
>deformed skulls. It's partly due to the nature of the net and partly
>a reflection that Shannon has other interests and can't pour hours and
>hours into an elegant webpage (if that's indeed what he wants to do in
>the first place).
In my defense, this is the first "edition" of the web page that I've put up.
It will of course improve in time, and you're right that the majority of my
time/efforts go into my primary project, BME...
>Now, I didn't nose around Necromance's invoices to see where she got
>her skulls - but she does willingly tell people that she gets them
>from medical establishments in the US where there's deeded to science
>and some of the animal bones from scientific supply companies. I did
>not hear her mention that they were gotten from outside the US and she
>mentioned what a pain it was keeping all the invoices, it seems that
>periodically she's inspected and asked where she got her merchandise
>and has to have the invoices to prove they were gotten in a legal and
>forthright manner.
A vast majority of medical human skulls come in from Asia, even when bought
from an American source. I buy mine from the US, but I make no illusions as to
their true source. All skulls are grey marked when it comes to "deeded to
science".
H Harris III
I think selling human bones is great. As long as she's not hurting
anyone there's no harm done. As "creepy" as this may sound some of us
take great joy out of "strange" things like others see pleasure in
reading.
Marjorie Peck
It's legal to sell human remains?? Not just like a black market thing? Wow. Kinda gives me that sick
feeling I got when someone told me about Snuff Films. I gotta say, to each his own but if I met someone
who kept a human skull on their desk, I'd run like f*cking hell. Talk about your serial killer wannabes.
Like people who own those censorered from TV police videos. Maybe they're not bad people, sure, but I'd
worry that those violent tendencies would need an outlet sooner or later, and telling myself that I
shouldn't be judgmental won't help when I'm in a shallow grave in someone's backyard.
Marjorie, doesn't need X-files to be paranoid
Marjorie Peck
Jenn wrote:
> Well Shannon, I must say that I think your business is absolutely disgusting
> and horrible, but I also must say that I sort of admire you for taking all
> this flak and not going ballistic at people...I hope you have success,
> though I also hope you'll never have a huge business with this skull/fetus
> skeleton thing of yours...
I gotta agree. Very cool. Very......well spoken.
Marjorie
cool...@usa.net
In article <35A0FCAC...@oblix.com>, Marjorie Peck <marj...@oblix.com> wrote:
>
>
>It's legal to sell human remains?? Not just like a black market thing? Wow.
There's a store on Melrose, in CA that sells human bones. Some for as low as
$15, and they're absilutely legal. The store's called Necromance and it has an
online store also. Just type in Necromance in any major search engine, and you
should find it...
-Bijan
^Å^******************** † ^v^ † ********************^Å^
Bijan Kazem
bi...@dial.pipex.com
Do NOT reply to cool...@usa.net
"I must die, Die, DIE......my hair black!"
Visit the IRC chatlines:
Channel: #gothic, Server: irc.ichat.com, Port: 6667
^Å^*************************************************^Å^
Mary-Suzanne
cool...@usa.net wrote:
>
> In article <35A0FCAC...@oblix.com>, Marjorie Peck <marj...@oblix.com> wrote:
> >
> >It's legal to sell human remains?? Not just like a black market thing? Wow.
>
> There's a store on Melrose, in CA that sells human bones. Some for as low as
> $15, and they're absilutely legal. The store's called Necromance and it has an
> online store also. Just type in Necromance in any major search engine, and you
> should find it...
>
There's also one in Berkeley/Oakland CA called The Bone Room...
I once made a bet that a friend would drop at least $200 there within 15
minutes of walking in the door. I won: he implulse-bought a human
skull... *sigh* easy money...
- safi/msk
-------------------------------------------------------------------
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All of the material on these pages is ANSI C++ compliant."
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Elizabeth
fla...@pobox.alaska.net wrote:
> >> paperwork to prove that they're not poached I think. Humans on the other hand
> >> don't generally get poached!
>
> >ROTFL Oh.... Hehe.... Did anyone else get really amusing images in
> >their head with the consideration of human poaching?
>
> bones, bugs take forever, but boiling in water and bleach works really
> well, at least for smaller projects!
*confused look* I wasn't talking about removing flesh, I was talking
about poaching (as in ILLEGAL HUNTING) humans. The image I had was some
guy in a safari hat hunting people down. It had nothing to do with
flesh removal.
-Elizabeth
fla...@pobox.alaska.net
Elizabeth <cdrp...@ix.netcom.com> wrote:
>Shannon Larratt / BME wrote:
>>
>> Not that I know of. When you're dealing with animal parts you have to have
>> paperwork to prove that they're not poached I think. Humans on the other hand
>> don't generally get poached!
>ROTFL Oh.... Hehe.... Did anyone else get really amusing images in
>their head with the consideration of human poaching?
And you thought they got the flesh off the bones how? Acids damage the
bones, bugs take forever, but boiling in water and bleach works really
well, at least for smaller projects!
Magda Bathory
who had this deceased iguana....
Shannon Larratt / BME
In article <Mneo1.6$SA.3...@binary.alaska.net>, fla...@pobox.alaska.net wrote:
>>ROTFL Oh.... Hehe.... Did anyone else get really amusing images in
>>their head with the consideration of human poaching?
>
>And you thought they got the flesh off the bones how? Acids damage the
>bones, bugs take forever, but boiling in water and bleach works really
>well, at least for smaller projects!
I just scrape it off with a knife.
elsworth
Marjorie Peck wrote in message <35A0FCAC...@oblix.com>...
>
>
>It's legal to sell human remains?? Not just like a black market thing? Wow.
>feeling I got when someone told me about Snuff Films. I gotta say, to each his
own but if I met someone
>who kept a human skull on their desk, I'd run like f*cking hell. Talk about
your serial killer wannabes.
Things like human skulls are a valuable resource for artists. The colour range
and texture of a human skull can't be reproduced in plaster (I have several
copies of skulls for working).
There's also nothing like a human skull to make you ponder the deeper meaning of
life. Many artists use the human skull in their work for this very purpose.
Isn't this whole thread somewhat OT for this group?
ObGoth statement: I painted my dresser black and grey, and it now looks
fabulous. Has anyone else given ratty old furniture new life by playing with
colour paints?
elsworth
Ian Sturrock
<cdrp...@ix.netcom.com> writes
>*confused look* I wasn't talking about removing flesh, I was talking
>about poaching (as in ILLEGAL HUNTING) humans. The image I had was some
>guy in a safari hat hunting people down. It had nothing to do with
>flesh removal.
'Course it does. If you were a People Poacher, you would need some way
to dispose of all the body parts. Eating the flesh, and selling the
bones through a shop like The Bone Room or Shannon's site, is almost
certainly the most practical way to get rid of the stuff.
For that you would need to devise a satisfactory method of flesh
removal. Scraping is probably best as it avoids damaging the meat,
although just boiling the corpse up & gnawing the bones clean would be
pretty effective. The internal organs could either be sold for
transplants, or grated finely for a 'Human Haggis' type dish, or
rendered in human fat to make pet food.
--
"Are we just going to lay around in our coffins and let the living outnumber
the dead on this newsgroup? Fight back. Our way of life is being destroyed
by happy campers! Come-on everyone. Eat their brains because it tastes like
candy! More brains! More brains!" -ren
Shannon Larratt / BME
interested.
Ismene
scrawled:
>
>ObGoth statement: I painted my dresser black and grey, and it now looks
>fabulous. Has anyone else given ratty old furniture new life by playing with
>colour paints?
Actually, I've only done this with new furniture, since plain
wood isn't very appealing to me. My computer stand is painted with a
green marbleizing kit, and I've been (not) working on painting scenes
on the sides of some bookcases for quite some time now.
Ismene
GothFaeri
>Has anyone else given ratty old furniture new life by playing with
>>colour paints?
yup. my dad pays me to faux finish all his planting pots. :} and im getting all
revved up to attack the furniture we'll be buying this summer for my *new apt!*
(psst.. this is what the fortunes are for.. shh!) i am a master at getting
cheap furniture and making it RAWK. and ive wanted to do a big section on this
in the GawthKrafte decor section for a long time. i had a huge web planned just
about gothy faux finishing, but i killed it all when i thought about all the
other faux finishing pages, and how difficult it is to get my ideas across
through a web page. since then, people have been mostly talkign to me in
private email, where i've been giving up my secrets! ;} *bounce*
faux finishing princess, (and stencil-mistress?)
*~^.poppy..}|{..pumpkin.^~* #14577324
"Like a deceased Italian mama damned to make pasta for the demons in hell,
the minister's wife pulled strands of death spaghetti from a wheezy old
organ."
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