Modern Elizabethan Fashion
john mchale
others to choose her daily apparel and main wardrobe. Growing up, she was
deprived of clothes shopping trips...including to the bespoke tailors for a
selection of fabrics. Her clothes were laid out for her daily by her nanny.
Thus to Elizabeth. What-to-wear was automatic, with no choices presented to
her.
Rarely she would protest, only to be admonished by "Crawfie" that the
colours she wore must stand apart in the admiring crowds who congregated at
her every public appearance.
The Princess's teen years came during WW II and just thereafter, when the
government had a tight rein on clothes purchases, which were controlled and
rationed by coupons, These restrictions began when she was fifteen and went
on until after her twenty-fifth birthday which may partially explain her
sensible approach to clothing.
It wasn't until 1952, when she was twenty-six, that she had her first true
party dress, designed by Norman Hartnell. Before then, her wardrobe,
including ball gowns and evening dresses, were fashioned from the material
of her Mother's cast-off clothing.
Elizabeth didn't even indulge herself after she became Queen. She permitted
Bobo Mc Donald, who was then her dresser, to make the final decisions on her
apparel. Bobo had to approve or Elizabeth would shun the fashions presented
to her. As Bobo had no flair for fashion, her selections disappointed
designers and press alike.
The young Queen , for a time, imitated her Mother's style until she saw for
herself, the pastel colours and frothy fabrics weren't right for her.
Her shoes have been deemed all clump and no glamour....she stands on her
feet for hours at a time and insists on comfort.
People are always curious about HM's handbags. She is seldom seen without
one, even "at home." What is its function? It's purely a "security blanket"
sort of item....She needs it for clutching when she's slightly thrown off
guard, to busy her hands during long periods and awkward times.
Her handbags are of top-quality calf for day wear and silver textile for
evening occasions. Thy ALL must have a loop for her to hold on to. She
sticks to this simple style through decades of fashion changes , making her
classic bags the object of recognition and levity.
They contain a lipstick, a small gold compact, her spectacles [bens], a
handkerchief and occasionally, her favourite gold-plated camera. Nothing
more...and never money.
Her gloves are standard as well....specifically designed to protect her
hands from endless hand-shakes. Her hand-shake is loose of necessity....her
hand would become mangled if she tightened her grip day after day, over the
years.
She finds dress- fittings to be the most boring times of her life and may
munch on a Mars bar whilst chatting away. She sees her dressmakers far more
often than anyone else on earth. She often takes two or three of her best
behaved Corgis to fittings to alleviated the monotony. The Queen insists on
strict protocol during these endless sessions, informal though they may
basically be.
Elizabeth takes an American size 14 dress, her weight fluctuates between 120
and 130 pounds. Her designers must hope to make her appear taller than her
actual height of five foot , four inches.
One of HM's favourite dress-up occasions is Royal Ascot....and no
wonder....it always dazzles!
Loreen
>others to choose her daily apparel and main wardrobe. Growing up, she was
>deprived of clothes shopping trips...including to the bespoke tailors for a
>selection of fabrics. Her clothes were laid out for her daily by her nanny.
>Thus to Elizabeth. What-to-wear was automatic, with no choices presented to
>her.
Safety at the risk of boredom. Some of the royal women and marry-ins (like
Sarah Ferguson could have used some of that help) Geez, she wore some awful
stuff! Some of those Ascot outfits!
>Rarely she would protest, only to be admonished by "Crawfie" that the
>colours she wore must stand apart in the admiring crowds who congregated at
>her every public appearance.
Think what a "Crawfie" could have done for Zara Phillips for example. "No
dear, your Grandmother is the Queen; you may not get your tongue pierced."
>The Princess's teen years came during WW II and just thereafter, when the
>government had a tight rein on clothes purchases, which were controlled and
>rationed by coupons,
I thought I read somewhere that many people had to donate their ration coupons
for silk (?) so her wedding dress could be made.
These restrictions began when she was fifteen and went
>on until after her twenty-fifth birthday which may partially explain her
>sensible approach to clothing.
>It wasn't until 1952, when she was twenty-six, that she had her first true
>party dress, designed by Norman Hartnell. Before then, her wardrobe,
>including ball gowns and evening dresses, were fashioned from the material
>of her Mother's cast-off clothing.
An admirable example for recycling and reusing.
>Elizabeth didn't even indulge herself after she became Queen. She permitted
>Bobo Mc Donald, who was then her dresser, to make the final decisions on her
>apparel. Bobo had to approve or Elizabeth would shun the fashions presented
>to her. As Bobo had no flair for fashion, her selections disappointed
>designers and press alike.
I wonder if by the time she was Queen it just became much easier to simply
delegate anything fashion-related to dressers and the like whom she trusted?
>The young Queen , for a time, imitated her Mother's style until she saw for
>herself, the pastel colours and frothy fabrics weren't right for her.
>Her shoes have been deemed all clump and no glamour....she stands on her
>feet for hours at a time and insists on comfort.
LOL...couldn't you just see her in Birkenstock Arizonas?!
>People are always curious about HM's handbags. She is seldom seen without
>one, even "at home." What is its function? It's purely a "security blanket"
>sort of item....She needs it for clutching when she's slightly thrown off
>guard, to busy her hands during long periods and awkward times.
Well, compared to my own purse... the Queen obviously doesn't need house or car
keys; she doesn't need a wallet for cash or credit cards or ID cards; she
doesn't need a Palm Pilot; I'm sure she doesn't carry a Stila six pan LOL...
>Her handbags are of top-quality calf for day wear and silver textile for
>evening occasions. They ALL must have a loop for her to hold on to. She
>sticks to this simple style through decades of fashion changes , making her
>classic bags the object of recognition and levity.
And they are THE thing this season! Dillards had a whole table covered with
the classic QEII black handbag.
>She finds dress- fittings to be the most boring times of her life and may
>munch on a Mars bar whilst chatting away. She sees her dressmakers far more
>often than anyone else on earth. She often takes two or three of her best
>behaved Corgis to fittings to alleviated the monotony. The Queen insists on
>strict protocol during these endless sessions, informal though they may
>basically be.
In Elizabeth R, the documentary from the early 90s, she seemed remarkably
easygoing with the portrait painter where she sat for a solid hour at a time.
IIRC, she was laughing and remarking on the people outside looking up at the
window, and she was musing on what they were saying, "look...is it her? it
can't be her!"
>Elizabeth takes an American size 14 dress, her weight fluctuates between 120
>and 130 pounds. Her designers must hope to make her appear taller than her
>actual height of five foot , four inches.
Just looking at her, with a height of 64 inches, I would have to guess her
weight more at 150 to 160, but I don't think there is anyway to know for
certain. Although there was that report a while back of someone finding
medical records of some of the royals along the side of a road! Whatever
happened with that? Anyone know?
>^..^<
john mchale
"Loreen" <owned...@aol.comnospam> wrote in message
news:20011128083416...@mb-fo.aol.com...
> >For all of her life, Elizabeth has relied on the suggestions and taste of
> >others to choose her daily apparel and main wardrobe. Growing up, she was
> >deprived of clothes shopping trips...including to the bespoke tailors for
a
> >selection of fabrics. Her clothes were laid out for her daily by her
nanny.
> >Thus to Elizabeth. What-to-wear was automatic, with no choices presented
to
> >her.
>
> Safety at the risk of boredom. Some of the royal women and marry-ins
(like
> Sarah Ferguson could have used some of that help) Geez, she wore some
awful
> stuff! Some of those Ascot outfits!
Sarah needed some guidance...OR perhaps she ignored whatever advice she
received. Her skirts were Often too short. I think the best she has EVER
looked was shortly after the Wyatt pix came to light...her hair was styled
to come just to the top of her shoulders, her dress was feminine ...Then,
inexplicitly, she returned to her former unsuitable choices.
>
> >Rarely she would protest, only to be admonished by "Crawfie" that the
> >colours she wore must stand apart in the admiring crowds who congregated
at
> >her every public appearance.
>
> Think what a "Crawfie" could have done for Zara Phillips for example. "No
> dear, your Grandmother is the Queen; you may not get your tongue pierced."
Crawfie was a Diamond and they didn't see it until they had lost her. She
would have at least discouraged Zara from sticking out her tongue at
photographers in order to show off her "daring."
>
> >The Princess's teen years came during WW II and just thereafter, when the
> >government had a tight rein on clothes purchases, which were controlled
and
> >rationed by coupons,
>
> I thought I read somewhere that many people had to donate their ration
coupons
> for silk (?) so her wedding dress could be made.
From Crawfie's book, "The Little Princesses" -
"For the fist time an old-fashioned convention was broken. Lilibet was
allowed to keep presents that were sent her. At other royal weddings,
presents were only accepted from persons the family knew. "
She goes on to say: " A lot of people sent their clothing coupons to help
with her trousseau, but these were always returned by registered post, with
a letter of thanks from the Princess. It was not legal to give clothing
coupons away."
Yes, her dress was of ivory silk garlanded with the white roses of York in
raised pearls, entwined with ears of corn embroidered in crystal and
interspersed with embroidered star flowers and oranage blossom, tulle on
satin and satin on tulle.
>
> These restrictions began when she was fifteen and went
> >on until after her twenty-fifth birthday which may partially explain her
> >sensible approach to clothing.
> >It wasn't until 1952, when she was twenty-six, that she had her first
true
> >party dress, designed by Norman Hartnell. Before then, her wardrobe,
> >including ball gowns and evening dresses, were fashioned from the
material
> >of her Mother's cast-off clothing.
>
> An admirable example for recycling and reusing.
She was STILL restricted to food rationing coupons whilst expecting Prince
Charlie. She was rationed to seven pints of milk a week!
>
> >Elizabeth didn't even indulge herself after she became Queen. She
permitted
> >Bobo Mc Donald, who was then her dresser, to make the final decisions on
her
> >apparel. Bobo had to approve or Elizabeth would shun the fashions
presented
> >to her. As Bobo had no flair for fashion, her selections disappointed
> >designers and press alike.
>
> I wonder if by the time she was Queen it just became much easier to simply
> delegate anything fashion-related to dressers and the like whom she
trusted?
That sounds right...she had so many duties and engagements to occupy her
time that she was relieved to have Bobo take charge.
>
> >The young Queen , for a time, imitated her Mother's style until she saw
for
> >herself, the pastel colours and frothy fabrics weren't right for her.
> >Her shoes have been deemed all clump and no glamour....she stands on her
> >feet for hours at a time and insists on comfort.
>
> LOL...couldn't you just see her in Birkenstock Arizonas?!
A delightful gift idea! For summer picnics at Balmoral!
>
> >People are always curious about HM's handbags. She is seldom seen without
> >one, even "at home." What is its function? It's purely a "security
blanket"
> >sort of item....She needs it for clutching when she's slightly thrown off
> >guard, to busy her hands during long periods and awkward times.
>
> Well, compared to my own purse... the Queen obviously doesn't need house
or car
> keys; she doesn't need a wallet for cash or credit cards or ID cards; she
> doesn't need a Palm Pilot; I'm sure she doesn't carry a Stila six pan
LOL...
Not even a stethascope! LOL Her keys would fill several saddle bags , no
doubt!
>
> >Her handbags are of top-quality calf for day wear and silver textile for
> >evening occasions. They ALL must have a loop for her to hold on to. She
> >sticks to this simple style through decades of fashion changes , making
her
> >classic bags the object of recognition and levity.
>
> And they are THE thing this season! Dillards had a whole table covered
with
> the classic QEII black handbag.
Always smart! Macy's and Nordstrom's as well.
>
> >She finds dress- fittings to be the most boring times of her life and may
> >munch on a Mars bar whilst chatting away. She sees her dressmakers far
more
> >often than anyone else on earth. She often takes two or three of her best
> >behaved Corgis to fittings to alleviated the monotony. The Queen insists
on
> >strict protocol during these endless sessions, informal though they may
> >basically be.
>
> In Elizabeth R, the documentary from the early 90s, she seemed remarkably
> easygoing with the portrait painter where she sat for a solid hour at a
time.
> IIRC, she was laughing and remarking on the people outside looking up at
the
> window, and she was musing on what they were saying, "look...is it her? it
> can't be her!"
I saw that and thought she was very candid as well!
>
> >Elizabeth takes an American size 14 dress, her weight fluctuates between
120
> >and 130 pounds. Her designers must hope to make her appear taller than
her
> >actual height of five foot , four inches.
>
> Just looking at her, with a height of 64 inches, I would have to guess her
> weight more at 150 to 160, but I don't think there is anyway to know for
> certain. Although there was that report a while back of someone finding
> medical records of some of the royals along the side of a road! Whatever
> happened with that? Anyone know?
>
>
> >^..^<
I think she has gaine a bit of weight in the past year or so.
The medical records were sent out to be discarded........how they wound up
where they did , I think, it still unexplained.
Loreen
>
>A delightful gift idea! For summer picnics at Balmoral!
>>
I would sure send them if I thought there was any chance she would actually
*wear* them!
>> Well, compared to my own purse... the Queen obviously doesn't need house
>or car
>> keys; she doesn't need a wallet for cash or credit cards or ID cards; she
>> doesn't need a Palm Pilot; I'm sure she doesn't carry a Stila six pan
>LOL...
>Not even a stethoscope!
If you will indulge me? I must say I get more compliments on my stethoscope!
When I practiced in the southwest, I had a patient who hand beaded the top with
a traditional native medicine design. The picture could never do it justice.
http://www.members.aol.com/ownedbycats/stethoscope.jpg
>^..^<
john mchale
"Loreen" <owned...@aol.comnospam> wrote in message
It's a work of art! Jolly colours as well Likely to cheer a patient right
up. The stylized "L" is quite chic as well.
Loreen
>stethoscope!
>> When I practiced in the southwest, I had a patient who hand beaded the top
>with
>> a traditional native medicine design. The picture could never do it
>justice.
>>
>> http://www.members.aol.com/ownedbycats/stethoscope.jpg
>> >^..^<
>
>It's a work of art! Jolly colours as well Likely to cheer a patient right
>up. The stylized "L" is quite chic as well.
>
It's also the perfect distraction for babies and little children. The "L" is
just a useful coincidence as it stands for Littmann, the stethoscope maker
rather than Loreen, it's owner.
>^..^<
john mchale
"Loreen" <owned...@aol.comnospam> wrote in message
Loreen
>> >stethoscope!
>> >> When I practiced in the southwest, I had a patient who hand beaded the
>top
>> >with
>> >> a traditional native medicine design. The picture could never do it
>> >justice.
>> >>
>> >> http://www.members.aol.com/ownedbycats/stethoscope.jpg
>> >> >^..^<
>> >
>> >It's a work of art! Jolly colours as well Likely to cheer a patient right
>> >up. The stylized "L" is quite chic as well.
>> >
>>
>> It's also the perfect distraction for babies and little children. The "L"
>is
>> just a useful coincidence as it stands for Littmann, the stethoscope maker
>> rather than Loreen, it's owner.
>> >^..^<
>Isn't it spiffin' to talk of royalty , cabbages and Kings in peace!??!!?
>
Ah, just one of the many benefits of filters and kill files!
>^..^<
john mchale
"Loreen" <owned...@aol.comnospam> wrote in message
I am fond of the simply 'ignore' method yet I keep an open mind about those
devices no one seems to have!
loki
> Elizabeth takes an American size 14 dress, her weight fluctuates between
120
> and 130 pounds. Her designers must hope to make her appear taller than her
> actual height of five foot , four inches.
This cannot be right. If she weighs between 120 and 130 she most assuredly
does not wear an American size 14 and never did! That weight on that height
would be a size 6 to 8.
So, either she is heavier or wears a smaller size.
Loki
john mchale
"loki" <lo...@mindspring.com> wrote in message
news:9u4090$c3c$1...@nntp9.atl.mindspring.net...
fitting....although, she looks heavier to me as well. Loreen said much the
same thing as you.
Even books contain mistakes so you may well be right. In the early nineties,
I think she may have worn a size 12 American. She has gained since then....
>
Martha Tassi
Hi, Loki! Glad you're back.
-Martha
=========
Susan Cohen
loki wrote:
I was a size 10 last year at 5' 10", 135 pounds,
became a size 12 when I got up to145 pounds
Now, of course, I'm still pretty much the same weight,
but am buying bigger dresses just to be comfortable :-)
SusanC
loki
news:KkiN7.32331$Sx.92...@news1.elcjn1.sdca.home.com...
Well, I'll likely pop in and out for a while. I've got a lot going on...
Thanks though!
Loki
JEANSUE
"proportions." Like all of us getting to a "certain age," dimensions shift
(generally downward). The one piece of my anatomy that has me most flummoxed is
my rib cage. I am the same weight now as I have been since about 12. Yet my rib
cage is more open and items left from the 1960s (like a Norwegian costume)
don't fit there. I've spoken with other women my age and all of who had
children seem to have this same problem. It makes sense; every organ gets moved
about to make room for baby and the ribs probably expand a tad, never to return
(without the help of Scarlett's corset and Mammy's forearms).
The Queen had four pregnancies and I would find it difficult to believe she
could button the front (or zip the back) of any size 6 or 8. And we know she is
not vain enough to try just to say she can, either.
jeansue
Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons for you are crunchy and taste good with
catsup.
john mchale
"JEANSUE" <jea...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20011129093811...@mb-mc.aol.com...
Great post and most applicable! Yes, indeed....like many over 50s, HM has
widened a bit....parts DO shift as you suggest. She tends to be buxom and a
wee bit toward the barrel chestiness of some of her forbearers. She would
likely qualify for a larger size on the "top" shall we say? Great legs!
Always encased in suitable tights. I saw her run at the York honeymoon
send -off [made a dash for Wills]....very fit, and quite a bit
slimmer...that's been, what? circa 15 years ago.
Mammy, Scarlett and the bedpost ! Such a visual experience!
RoseofYork
That occurred to me as well. I'm not all that tall. I am a size 8 when
I weigh 120 pounds. The only thing I can think of is that maybe HM
carries the weight in her middle.
yaffaDina1
Can we please move on, and drop this subject. The more I read the more convinced I am that I am
becoming more like the Queen than I care for.
Thank you in advance:
Annie
Holly W.
According to the notes on the dress collection of hers I saw at
Kensington Palace when I was in the UK, the Queen is 5'3" and wore a
British size 8-10, which I think translates into an American size 6-8.
No mention of what she weighs... Maybe now she wears a 10 American,
but don't forget she's been a Weight Watcher follower for years, and
she's pretty active still.
JEANSUE
or will you? >>
I'm not going anywhere on a lead, ma'am. I'm running wild like the rest of your
dogs do, off to get a hedgehog, I am.
loki
> << Shall I get your lead,
> or will you? >>
>
> I'm not going anywhere on a lead, ma'am. I'm running wild like the rest of
your
> dogs do, off to get a hedgehog, I am.
Cool. Can we sing the hedgehog song then?
Loki
john mchale
"yaffaDina1" <yaffa...@netscape.net> wrote in message
news:3C068CD7...@netscape.net...
>
loki
>
> No 'edgeogs ere me dear. Too many brocks. ;-) (Badgers)
> Badgers eat hedgehogs - shame because hedgehogs are good friends to
> gardeners, eating slugs and snails. Do you have hedgehogs in America?
No, we don't. At least not in Missouri. I do have a family of friendly
raccoons who like to raid my garden for edibles though - tomatoes, etc.
<sigh>
Loki
Susan Cohen
Sacha wrote:
> On 29 Nov 2001 14:38:11 GMT, jea...@aol.com (JEANSUE) wrote:
>
> >I would find it hard to believe QEII is a 6 or 8, in part because of
> >"proportions." Like all of us getting to a "certain age," dimensions shift
> >(generally downward). The one piece of my anatomy that has me most flummoxed is
> >my rib cage. I am the same weight now as I have been since about 12. Yet my rib
> >cage is more open and items left from the 1960s (like a Norwegian costume)
> >don't fit there. I've spoken with other women my age and all of who had
> >children seem to have this same problem. It makes sense; every organ gets moved
> >about to make room for baby and the ribs probably expand a tad, never to return
> >(without the help of Scarlett's corset and Mammy's forearms).
> >
>
> You're right. It does make sense, Jeansue. Dog breeders deliberately
> let bitches have one litter sometimes because they then have 'spring
> of rib' which makes them show better. ;-)) Shall I get your lead,
> or will you? ;->
> --
> Sacha
And here someone had told me that it was the *pelvis* that is ruined
if a dog is not mated with the correct breed!!
(Of course, that may not be wrong, either)
SusanC
>
> S. Devon
> www.garden.demon.co.uk
>
> (remove spam-trap)
yaffaDina1
Oh, I forgot about that bit.
You're welcome, child.
yD
the Fleming
That's interesting - I found that my rib cage expanded when my first
marriage broke up and I moved from a semi-detached house's ground floor flat
(with spare room on the 2nd floor) to a 2nd floor flat -- by myself, and
against a deadline 'before Christmas'... Since I was working full-time, I'd
chase home (to the 'old' house), pack boxes like mad (mostly from the garret
room, which held stacks and stacks of *my*, rather than *our* stuff), carry
them down 2 floors and stack them in my car, drive a bootful to the new
place, carry every box up 2 floors by stairs (no lift), take off old
wallpaper, put up new, paint etc. until midnight, when I'd fall into bed
exhausted but slept solidly every night, until 7 when the whole routine of
getting ready for work - chase home etc. would start all over again. After
about a month of this, which constituted the best fitness training I could
ever recommend anyone ;o) , I was incredibly fit -- my leaps in Scottish
dancing were high and effortless, I ran up the stairs without getting out of
breath, I was sleeping like a baby every night. And what surprised me most
was that, although my weight was fairly steady, suddenly some of my more
snugly-fitting blouses became too tight to wear... And in the 6 years or so
that followed before I had a child, that never changed back again.
It was with considerable chagrin that I saw all that physical fitness
disappear when I was involved in a car accident, and 2 months of recovery
reduced me to worse-than-before... <sigh> There seems to have to be a dark
cloud to many silver linings...!
the Fleming
JEANSUE
was that, although my weight was fairly steady, suddenly some of my more
snugly-fitting blouses became too tight to wear... And in the 6 years or so
that followed before I had a child, that never changed back again. >>
Maybe it is less pregnancy and more lifting (which comes after the pregnancy).
I've just always been perplexed by it. Since my childless friends haven't
noticed the same phenomenon, I reached a less-than-scientific decision.