Basically, I'm thinking of levelling my lvl 70 combat swords rogue
soon, which is in heroic/Kara level gear, including some not-brilliant
weapons, Vindicator's Brand and Malchazeen (yes, I know, it's a
dagger... was the best available at the time - I've not really played
that character for 2 years)
Obviously, as soon as I step into Northrend I'll see some nice big
upgrades available to me... BUT, I put Mongoose on both my current
weapons, since they were the best I was likely to see for a long time.
Given Mongoose still costs the earth even now, I'll just run
unenchanted until I get some decent lvl 80 weapons (and then likely
getting Berserker, from what I read that's the best now?), so my
question is: how much higher base dps does a Northrend weapon need to
have to make up for the dps loss in losing my Mongoose enchant?
I'm well aware it's variable based off my other gear but heck, if
someone can just say "20 dps", "30 dps" as a guesstimate for when it's
time to upgrade to a better levelling weapon, that's enough for me,
sure beats the zero clue I currently have ;-)
--
EU-Draenor:
Sagart (80 Undead Priest)
Tairbh (80 Tauren Druid)
Buinne (78 Troll Shaman)
Eilnich (70 Blood Elf Warlock)
Ruire (70 Blood Elf Paladin)
Been reading your threads here for two/three years.
What I have put together is:
Aliase female hume rogue lvl 80 PVE solo
http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Zul%27jin&n=Aliase
Subtlety engineer/enchanter
19/23/29
Certainly I think Aliase is equipted for PVE and I think you are discussing PVP. I can't
figure why to put mongoose on both daggers. So my off hands (Zebby the Huntress included)
are a real best guess. I did not wait until 80 with any character to enchant the best. I
wanted to have fun at each level and not suck while leveling. imho.
This isn't rocket surgery.
** no fate **
dracman
Tomb Raider: Shotgun City
http://www.smokeypoint.com/tomb.htm
my game machines:
http://www.smokeypoint.com/My_PC.htm
Zebby female NE Huntress lvl 80 / Aja nightstalker cat lvl 79 (bite,prowl)
PVE solo
http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Zul%27jin&n=Zebby
Marksmanship Alchemy/Herbs
23/43/5
Aisleyne Female Blood Elf rogue lvl 60 PVE solo
http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Zul%27jin&n=Aisleyne
Subtlety mining/jewelcrafter
10/17/24
Horde Aliance go between:
http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Zul%27jin&n=barraefeli
WoW ingame pictures in a smoke free environment:
http://www.smokeypoint.com/wow/website/fishingDiplomat.html
http://www.smokeypoint.com/if_airport/telaar.html
http://www.smokeypoint.com/if_airport/IF_airport.htm
http://www.smokeypoint.org/wow/worldofwarcraft1.html
-----------------------------------------
http://thottbot.com/?c=hunter
http://thottbot.com/?c=rogue
-----------------------------------------
................................................................
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17 main 12 dps offhand - with a lot of variables
and understanding I know next to nothing beyond writing things down
and slavishly misquoting them back out of context months later.
Mongoose benefits from its other effects and overlaying on proc
which say a 80g +20agility enchant won't give, burst over sustained.
Since 80g is fairly cheap it could be at least considered as part of any replacement.
20 agi = 20 ap = 1.43 dps of course my notes are probably wrong :-)
>Certainly I think Aliase is equipted for PVE and I think you are discussing PVP. I can't
>figure why to put mongoose on both daggers. So my off hands (Zebby the Huntress included)
>are a real best guess. I did not wait until 80 with any character to enchant the best. I
>wanted to have fun at each level and not suck while leveling. imho.
Pvp? No, why would I be talking about that? I'm talking about when to
replace my current enchanted weapons, while levelling. Thought I made
that clear enough... my one and only question is: at what point does
the higher dps on an unenchanted weapon beat my old weapons +
mongoose. And while you may want to waste money enchanting a new
weapon with a 300-400g enchant every couple of hours as you repeatedly
upgrade it during levelling, I don't - I'd kinda like to have enough
gold to buy cold weather flying when I get high enough :-P
>17 main 12 dps offhand - with a lot of variables
> and understanding I know next to nothing beyond writing things down
> and slavishly misquoting them back out of context months later.
>
>Mongoose benefits from its other effects and overlaying on proc
>which say a 80g +20agility enchant won't give, burst over sustained.
>Since 80g is fairly cheap it could be at least considered as part of any replacement.
>
>20 agi = 20 ap = 1.43 dps of course my notes are probably wrong :-)
That sounds great as a general rule of thumb, thanks! As for the 20agi
enchant, I may consider it but my rogue is on alliance and I have very
very little money on that side, so rather not waste any on weapons
that'll be upgraded again in no time - perhaps if I get a good blue
but I'm expecting to be using greens for a bit since my old weapons
really are poor enough that even a green will beat them ;-)
Just as an aside, Alliance have the quest
[http://www.wowhead.com/?quest=12019] in Borean Tundra (I presume Horde
have something similar) that will provide you with at least one nice
blue weapon that might be worth the cost to enchant :-)
For questing you are already up with Borean/Howling weapon quest rewards
like http://www.wowhead.com/?quest=12019, so you can just go for
the highest vendor gold a lot.
You could maybe get onto the kaluak early
http://www.wowhead.com/?item=44051
from vendor , one of 2 http://www.wowhead.com/?npc=32763
The daily run from Coldera, kaluak-borean, kaluak-dragonblight,
wyrmrest temple, steelgrill depot,
break the blockade , kaluak-howling bull/calf can get the rep and cash ball rolling.
you need to do the pirates east of kaluak to unlock the daily
A few days in venture bay/blue sky pvp along the way may be useful early
http://www.wowhead.com/?item=37836#currency-for
You can just squeeze it in at 72, you have the weaponry to carry it off, or wait a while.
>
>"Catriona R" <catrion...@totalise.co.uk> wrote in message
>news:7ldac6F...@mid.individual.net...
>>
>> On Wed, 4 Nov 2009 15:10:43 +0930, "i|||| | | || ||| || |||| 2.0" <i|
>> || ||| ||||| |||||| 2.0> wrote:
>>
>>>17 main 12 dps offhand - with a lot of variables
>>> and understanding I know next to nothing beyond writing things down
>>> and slavishly misquoting them back out of context months later.
>>>
>>>Mongoose benefits from its other effects and overlaying on proc
>>>which say a 80g +20agility enchant won't give, burst over sustained.
>>>Since 80g is fairly cheap it could be at least considered as part of any replacement.
>>>
>>>20 agi = 20 ap = 1.43 dps of course my notes are probably wrong :-)
>>
>> That sounds great as a general rule of thumb, thanks! As for the 20agi
>> enchant, I may consider it but my rogue is on alliance and I have very
>> very little money on that side, so rather not waste any on weapons
>> that'll be upgraded again in no time - perhaps if I get a good blue
>> but I'm expecting to be using greens for a bit since my old weapons
>> really are poor enough that even a green will beat them ;-)
>
> For questing you are already up with Borean/Howling weapon quest rewards
>like http://www.wowhead.com/?quest=12019, so you can just go for
>the highest vendor gold a lot.
Ah yeah, I'd kinda assumed the starting weapons would be a bit higher
dps than that, oh well, good to know I guess!
> You could maybe get onto the kaluak early
> http://www.wowhead.com/?item=44051
>from vendor , one of 2 http://www.wowhead.com/?npc=32763
Shame it's a dagger when I really prefer sword spec but yeah, that'll
be nice as an offhand at least - I'm well used to the Kalu'ak farm,
all 3 of my high levels have done it so far (2 casters that can use
maces, one feral druid who dinged 78 about 2 days after the patch
which allowed use of polearms so I'd prepared for it ;-))
>A few days in venture bay/blue sky pvp along the way may be useful early
>
>http://www.wowhead.com/?item=37836#currency-for
>
>You can just squeeze it in at 72, you have the weaponry to carry it off, or wait a while.
Hmm some not bad rewards there, only trouble is this rogue is a total
non-pvper, I'm semi-rp'ing him as a pacifist who wants to work towards
peace between Alliance and Horde, and as such, he won't ever do quests
which involve killing Horde, be it players or NPCs, so I have to pass
on ones like that. Think he'll make an exception for Wrath Gate, under
the logic that any Forsaken who get caught up are going to be traitors
anyway and not real members of the Horde ;-)
Yes lol I can see the waste of re applying mongoose if i changed weapons
with an intent to break the 0-80 leveling record. The three characters I do
have in game have been leveling for the past 3 years. Lets see, I played the
beta and then six months later after WoW went active - started playing with
two of the three (Zebby and Aliase). about four months ago I reached level
80 with Aliase and then Zebby followed but I am still working on getting pet
to lvl 80. I wanted to play Horde side to experience the other half of the
game (gheesh the horde are really left out of the story line with their
quests). So I really do put all the enchants to good use without to much
gold waste. I have to farm my favorite items a lot to be able to afford the
good stuff for my characters.
Mostly I was saying to you that "why wait" until you get primo weapons at
lvl 80 to enchant when your character needs then now ! imho. Unless you know
how to build a character that doesn't need the enchants to win big time -
then again why bother at level 80 when you can kick ash without enchants. I
know there exists an "uber template" for each character at each level - but
that seems so boring. Yes I had your question in mind mongoose for the
burst, or static + enchant. I use the burst trinkets also. That is so much
fun when everything procs during a monster fight !
I though the combat swords rogue was a PVP build. No ? Guess I read you
question into your entire post.
** no fate **
dracman
http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Zul%27jin&n=Aliase
http://www.smokeypoint.com/figureprints/figureprints.html
According to all the rogues I know, anything Combat spec related is pretty
much the worst choice for PvP. Combat is the leveling spec, not PvP.
That's certainly how I saw it, I've always been combat swords since
it's usually regarded as the best solo PVE spec - dunno if it still is
but it was when I was last playing anyway and I'm sure it's still fun
for me to play.
>>> that'll be upgraded again in no time - perhaps if I get a good blue
>>> but I'm expecting to be using greens for a bit since my old weapons
>>> really are poor enough that even a green will beat them ;-)
>>
>> For questing you are already up with Borean/Howling weapon quest rewards
>>like http://www.wowhead.com/?quest=12019, so you can just go for
>>the highest vendor gold a lot.
>
> Ah yeah, I'd kinda assumed the starting weapons would be a bit higher
> dps than that, oh well, good to know I guess!
Well, at 72-73 just solo and 3-man questing you get something a 70 would sweat
blood for in instances. They are pretty good, but you are just better :-)
Basically a hardened 70 is going to be equal to a solo levelling 74 - or so.
At least the effort and gold you put in on the old weapons will still be paying off
for a while.
>> You could maybe get onto the kaluak early
>> http://www.wowhead.com/?item=44051
>>from vendor , one of 2 http://www.wowhead.com/?npc=32763
>
> Shame it's a dagger when I really prefer sword spec but yeah, that'll
> be nice as an offhand at least - I'm well used to the Kalu'ak farm,
> all 3 of my high levels have done it so far (2 casters that can use
> maces, one feral druid who dinged 78 about 2 days after the patch
> which allowed use of polearms so I'd prepared for it ;-))
There are other 1H swords along the way , but I don't think they were better
I tended to ignore/vendor them and go for the 2H Polearm early
http://www.wowwiki.com/Ahlurglgr because it is dead easy to get.
I just figured the 3-man quest would give an indication of relative level.
Then there are instances.
>
>"Catriona R" <catrion...@totalise.co.uk> wrote in message
>news:7ldm1pF...@mid.individual.net...
>
>>>> that'll be upgraded again in no time - perhaps if I get a good blue
>>>> but I'm expecting to be using greens for a bit since my old weapons
>>>> really are poor enough that even a green will beat them ;-)
>>>
>>> For questing you are already up with Borean/Howling weapon quest rewards
>>>like http://www.wowhead.com/?quest=12019, so you can just go for
>>>the highest vendor gold a lot.
>>
>> Ah yeah, I'd kinda assumed the starting weapons would be a bit higher
>> dps than that, oh well, good to know I guess!
>
>Well, at 72-73 just solo and 3-man questing you get something a 70 would sweat
>blood for in instances. They are pretty good, but you are just better :-)
> Basically a hardened 70 is going to be equal to a solo levelling 74 - or so.
> At least the effort and gold you put in on the old weapons will still be paying off
>for a while.
Makes sense, all my other characters had much the same deal gearwise,
just I'd thought my weapons were really poor, since in TBC is seemed
melee dps weapons scaled hugely during the time. Good to know tbh,
it's nice not replacing absolutly everything instantly ;-)
Sorry for confusion, I stand corrected.
** no fate **
dracman
................................................................
Sorry for confusion, I stand corrected.
** no fate **
dracman
>Hmm some not bad rewards there, only trouble is this rogue is a total
>non-pvper, I'm semi-rp'ing him as a pacifist who wants to work towards
>peace between Alliance and Horde, and as such, he won't ever do quests
>which involve killing Horde, be it players or NPCs, so I have to pass
>on ones like that. Think he'll make an exception for Wrath Gate, under
>the logic that any Forsaken who get caught up are going to be traitors
>anyway and not real members of the Horde ;-)
Actually, there are quests (marked PvP) that involve *no* killing of
Horde, player or NPC. There's at least one to smoke out 20 mobs, even
if you aggro them smoking them makes them drop combat. My Rogue could
do those easily without aggroing the guards on the path to them. It
would be *much* slower than doing it with the ones that involve
fighting the NPCs (the only time I "fought" a Horde player was when I
was trying to check out the rewards, one time, but then again all
three toons that I took through there were too high-level for the
rewards by the time I started doing them), but it would still be
doable ;-)
--
ald
reply via email to ald_007_1999 at yahoo dot com
For the smoking are Venture Company horde anyway?
http://www.wowhead.com/?quest=12323
The gather parts quest , return broken shredders , and bandage injured
in blue-sky also doesn't demand combat.
http://www.wowwiki.com/Quest:Life_or_Death
A 73 being bounced by half a dozen flying 80s out for a rumble
doesn't actually qualify as 'killing' does it? :-)
'Hey, love and peace man, live and let live, I'm just here for the xp and cash
I never even so much as scratched any horde..honest...' (dead)
or more likely
'Just one more of those shredders, this is going well. Why is my health bar on
half?...'(dead)
Still quicker than slogging through instances with PUGs :-)
That is my absolute favorite quest in Venture Bay!
When bored or flying through the area my characters do just that one.
It always makes me laugh. Watch what those guys say as they run out.
I have so many Venture Coins now... :-D
--
Hypanthia, Night Elf, Shadow Priest, Enchantress/Herbalist.
Cowpattee, Tauren, Druid, Enchantress/Herbalist.
True but they still defeat my RP stance of not wanting to be involved
in alliance-horde fighting. I wouldn't be able to justify doing any of
those simply because they're all about the war between the side and my
character is totally against that war and will play no part in it -
he's more interested in doing things to help mend the breach.
Yeah, that's the one I'm actually looking forward to trying with my
Pally who hit 73 today ;-)
I'm not even sure the smoked-out ones *are* Horde, and you're *not*
fighting them, or doing anything that is involved in alliance-horde
fighting. You're simply sending them away from where they are. If you
hurt them in any way, you're doing something wrong ;-)
But to each their own, I'm just saying, ... ;-)
> I'm not even sure the smoked-out ones *are* Horde, and you're *not*
> fighting them, or doing anything that is involved in alliance-horde
> fighting. You're simply sending them away from where they are. If you
> hurt them in any way, you're doing something wrong ;-)
>
> But to each their own, I'm just saying, ... ;-)
Belief in a virtuous anger is very hard to work through, best avoided if possible.
I suppose they just want to avoid putting any horde in the position to be able
to attack. Not that it stops them. With some out looking for trouble if they can't
find easy kills in PVP they move on to soft target and tricks. I suppose some alliance do
as well.
Even with the best of intentions on both sides things can go wrong in RL and ingame
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5jLEAJmAwjE
This was a contact in 1999, the Australians were moving up to the border
with a small force, infantry and light vehicles, not provocative.
Using the latest Indonesian maps and GPS, they were exactly right to their knowledge.
Unfortunately the UN was formalising the old 1946 border line a few hundred metres back.
If the officer on the radio looks worried , there were about 75,000 Indonesian
troops just in the area and 5,000 Australian/UN .
Communications nets would have already been sparking up from his handset all the way to
the UN
with naval and field artillery starting to track towards his position.
It takes real guts on both sides to walk up and talk, and at the end there were some
smiles, only a couple
of casulaties. It was a simple mistake, more of a misunderstanding really.
Now these small incidents can spiral out of control, what would the aftermath of
911 have been if 240 million Indonesians were already locked in war with a Western power?
Or perhaps with another focus there wouldn't have been a 911.
True but why even bother? There's just no need to be involved in a war
like that for my character; he wants to stay *right* out of all that
and it's not like he's a class where the rewards aren't easily
replaceable (like the tanking idol that my druid still wears from
there). I found it hard enough to justify doing the quests to destroy
the plague cauldrons that the Forsaken have in Howling Fjord, ended up
allowing myself to do that by the logic that it's debatable whether
all the Forsaken are that loyal to the Horde, and the presence of the
cauldrons will cause more friction between the sides than destroying
them would. Was a touch tricky getting into the ones around Halgrind
without killing any of the mobs though, thank goodness for
stealth+sap.
True, taking a quick glance at the rewards last night I only saw one
that looked like even a minor upgrade for the Pally (and *still* no
Relic, shouldn't she have come across one by now, at almost 74?).
Still, the smugglers are definitely *not* Horde, unless the Horde have
allied themselves with Venture Company ;-)
Since you are going to be encountering similar dps weapons
and if it is convenient , and if you run a dps log/meter,
you may like to compare one or two before vendor/DE and compare DPS
with one mongoose, 2 and none.
It would give you better real numbers than my rough guess that
would prove useful once you get to the lvl 80 weapons.
Mongoose procs and dual procs and the extra stats they give
don't give just dps.
Feedback to be stored on google could help others as well hint :-)
Great idea, I'll give that one a try instead of just vendoring my
weapons from quest rewards then. I think the greens are relatively
similar dps at the moment, around mid-80s, so should be fairly
comparable.
--
EU-Draenor:
Sagart (80 Undead Priest)
Tairbh (80 Tauren Druid)
Buinne (78 Troll Shaman)
Balgair (71 Human Rogue)