What is wrong with PS2?
Harry
(because of the really dissappointing screenshots) , raw power being not
that important afterall (because PS2 is dwarfed by X-Box) and anti aliassing
(which PS2 clearly lacks and it shows) while just a year ago PS2 would be so
much better than DC because of the performance gap!
Let's face it: the PS2 game screenshot's of today look worse than a year ago
when the game was only 15% complete! Did it become worse overtime? Did they
decide to scrap the smooth anti aliassing and decided to go for the raw
edges??? Just compare GT2000's first released screenshots to the screenshots
released recently! Next to the state-of-the-art PS2 the "old" and "slow" DC
currently looks just as good.
And why do all the DC screenshot's I have seen so far look stunning? To be
honest, every Soul Calibur screenshot kicks TTT ass. These are also
screenshots, why don't they get ugly because of interlacing???
So please don't call me a troll, I consider myself a general game console
fan which is a bit disappointed with PS2 so far...(let's face it, it does
not exactly live up to the hype now, does it?).
The Fuzz
> And why do all the DC screenshot's I have seen so far look stunning? To be
> honest, every Soul Calibur screenshot kicks TTT ass. These are also
> screenshots, why don't they get ugly because of interlacing???
do 30fps at this res. The early PS2 screenshots were taken using a dev.
kit (probably) which does not require interlacing, while the later
screenshots (those that came out after the PS2's release) were mostly
taken by people playing the game on their TV's -- hence the 'jaggies'
> So please don't call me a troll, I consider myself a general game console
> fan which is a bit disappointed with PS2 so far...(let's face it, it does
> not exactly live up to the hype now, does it?).
Not at all. Frankly, what *could* live up to that hype? (please don't
say X-Box, it doesn't even exist yet).
--
-The Fuzz-
www.ozemail.com.au/~randrgrant
check my site to mail me
(sorry 'bout the anti-spam hassle)
TheHut
>And why do all the DC screenshot's I have seen so far look stunning? To be
>honest, every Soul Calibur screenshot kicks TTT ass.
Those programmers have really tamed Segas little baby haven`t they, but they
would after nearly 2 years, so DOA2 and SC make it`s japanese launch games
look ridiculous.
And thats what going to happen to the PS2, in 2 years we are going to look
back and laugh. And remember than the team who have done DOA2 say that they
have maxed out the DC, whereas they got it running on the PS2 incredibly
quickly and had time to enhance effects and stuff, and it`s a first gen
game, that should give you a clue as to how far ahead the hardware is, the
programmers will catch it up. So the PS2`s second gen games are going to
kill Soul Calibur and the like.
>So please don't call me a troll,
Compared to some anti-PS2 rants we get here it was a pretty intelligent
post, thankfully.
I consider myself a general game console
>fan which is a bit disappointed with PS2 so far...(let's face it, it does
>not exactly live up to the hype now, does it?).
>
What could?
You can be sure that the X-box won`t (PC ports ahoy). Just remember that
what games are at the launch are pretty irrelevant. The N64 had world class
games but was ignored by most developers and the PS1 had godawful crap at
jap launch yet quickly got must haves.
Our new black plastic friend will go the same way, a way to apply full
screen anti-aliasing has been found, the DC can NEVER do this as i doesn`t
have the floating point power.
And EVERY 3rd party developer is churning out games, trust us, the quality
will rise quickly as the PS2`s many tricks and features are uncovered by
wily programmers.
Ross Anderson
with the Dreamcast, N64 Saturn, SNES etc etc....
....no world-wide release dammit!
--
Ross Anderson
ross.a...@risingpad.com
Harry <harr...@HOTMAIL.COM> wrote in message
news:953945285.1253....@news.demon.nl...
> It's just funny to see that every Sony fan is now talking about
interlacing
> (because of the really dissappointing screenshots) , raw power being not
> that important afterall (because PS2 is dwarfed by X-Box) and anti
aliassing
> (which PS2 clearly lacks and it shows) while just a year ago PS2 would be
so
> much better than DC because of the performance gap!
>
> Let's face it: the PS2 game screenshot's of today look worse than a year
ago
> when the game was only 15% complete! Did it become worse overtime? Did
they
> decide to scrap the smooth anti aliassing and decided to go for the raw
> edges??? Just compare GT2000's first released screenshots to the
screenshots
> released recently! Next to the state-of-the-art PS2 the "old" and "slow"
DC
> currently looks just as good.
>
> And why do all the DC screenshot's I have seen so far look stunning? To be
> honest, every Soul Calibur screenshot kicks TTT ass. These are also
> screenshots, why don't they get ugly because of interlacing???
>
> So please don't call me a troll, I consider myself a general game console
CoolColJ
I guess you like to play the game with the pause button on ....... :P
--
-----------------------------------------------------------------
CCJ
BLITZ_Force
My HomePage -----> http://www.geocities.com/coolcolj
Updated - 3/3/2000
joey
better than rr5 and is playable on-line in Japan.
TheHut <we...@sdf.com> wrote in message
news:PKVC4.6036$f67.1...@news3.cableinet.net...
>
> >And why do all the DC screenshot's I have seen so far look stunning? To
be
> >honest, every Soul Calibur screenshot kicks TTT ass.
>
they
> would after nearly 2 years, so DOA2 and SC make it`s japanese launch games
> look ridiculous.
> And thats what going to happen to the PS2, in 2 years we are going to look
> back and laugh. And remember than the team who have done DOA2 say that
they
> have maxed out the DC, whereas they got it running on the PS2 incredibly
> quickly and had time to enhance effects and stuff, and it`s a first gen
> game, that should give you a clue as to how far ahead the hardware is, the
> programmers will catch it up. So the PS2`s second gen games are going to
> kill Soul Calibur and the like.
>
> post, thankfully.
>
> >fan which is a bit disappointed with PS2 so far...(let's face it, it does
> >not exactly live up to the hype now, does it?).
> >
S.DiIorio
alrady flow at a smooth 60fps... as far as the PSX2 games lookign like
crap..yeh even I am not overly impressed right now..a little disappointed so
far..I sitl lpaly it for kicks..but we have to wait to see ahat they have
comign up...Dreamcast games are lookign great now..but they had tiem to work
with it..PSX2 is still very new.... You can buy more then one system and
enjoy them.
There will always be better systems jsut around the corner
CoolColJ <cool...@optushome.com.au> wrote in message
news:cX1D4.133$l_3...@news1.belrs1.nsw.optushome.com.au...
> > And why do all the DC screenshot's I have seen so far look stunning? To
be
> > honest, every Soul Calibur screenshot kicks TTT ass. These are also
> > screenshots, why don't they get ugly because of interlacing???
> >
> > So please don't call me a troll, I consider myself a general game
TheHut
joey wrote in message <_afD4.12340$OV.17...@typhoon.austin.rr.com>...
>Tokyo extreme racing was out in japan within 2 months of launch, it looks
>better than rr5 and is playable on-line in Japan.
!?
No way does it look better, and the gameplay sucks. Even gran tourismo is a
better buy than that.
joey
rr series is boring in my opinion. The first one was all-right, but the
controls are strange and adolecent to me.
TheHut <jo...@REMOVETHISBITkrik81.freeserve.co.uk> wrote in message
news:jvnD4.7587$f67.2...@news3.cableinet.net...
joey
then the ps was announced with it's use of polygons? At that point the
saturn was "upgraded" to compete and eclipse the ps. The result was a
console that was a nightmare to program for. The same thing happened with
the ps2, and now the ps2 owners are saying things like, wait until the
emotion engine is harnessed, wait until the 2nd or 3rd gen. games. The ps2's
design is flawed, developers are having a hard time implementing
anti-aliasing in the games? Bad design.
And all the while the dreamcast has games that look better or equal to the
ps2 games. Factor this in with the hype and downright misleading specs and
you have the answer to the question "what is wrong with the ps2.
Ross Anderson <ross.a...@risingpad.com> wrote in message
news:8bi20s$fns$1...@uranium.btinternet.com...
> I know exactly what's wrong with the PS2. It's the same thing that was
wrong
> with the Dreamcast, N64 Saturn, SNES etc etc....
>
> ....no world-wide release dammit!
>
> --
> Ross Anderson
> ross.a...@risingpad.com
Greg Nolle
who the hell said this? The deal with the saturn is completely different
because that was the same console. The PSX and PS2 are completely different
consoles. The only developers that are moaning about the design of the PS2
are the ones that can't program properly. All the others see the benefits of
the way it is designed.
Greg.
--
Please read the Official FAQ at:
http://www.obsidian.wizkids.co.uk/newsgroups/ps2faq.txt
joey wrote in message ...
>Actually, my theory is this. Remember how the saturn was ready to go and
>then the ps was announced with it's use of polygons? At that point the
>saturn was "upgraded" to compete and eclipse the ps. The result was a
>console that was a nightmare to program for. The same thing happened with
>the ps2, and now the ps2 owners are saying things like, wait until the
>emotion engine is harnessed, wait until the 2nd or 3rd gen. games. The
ps2's
>design is flawed, developers are having a hard time implementing
>anti-aliasing in the games? Bad design.
> And all the while the dreamcast has games that look better or equal to the
>ps2 games. Factor this in with the hype and downright misleading specs and
>you have the answer to the question "what is wrong with the ps2.
<snip>
Greg Nolle
Greg.
--
Please read the Official FAQ at:
http://www.obsidian.wizkids.co.uk/newsgroups/ps2faq.txt
Greg Nolle wrote in message
<954105444.22853.0...@news.demon.co.uk>...
Jun
>
> Actually, my theory is this. Remember how the saturn was ready to go and
> then the ps was announced with it's use of polygons? At that point the
> saturn was "upgraded" to compete and eclipse the ps. The result was a
> console that was a nightmare to program for. The same thing happened with
> the ps2, and now the ps2 owners are saying things like, wait until the
> emotion engine is harnessed, wait until the 2nd or 3rd gen. games. The ps2's
> design is flawed, developers are having a hard time implementing
> anti-aliasing in the games? Bad design.
> And all the while the dreamcast has games that look better or equal to the
> ps2 games.
Sorry, but you're wrong. The Saturn and the PS2 are not very similar at
all. The Saturn utilized dual Hitachi SH2 chip configuration and
programmers had to utilize both to get anything done. The PS2 has a CPU
and two assisting VUs - the VUs do not have to be used at all they're
just a way to free up computing power in the main CPU. Each has its own
specialized task; VU1 is for simple geometry and the VU0 is for more
complex procedures like game physics. Developers have said that there
is no "secret chip" in the Saturn - it was quoted in an article that it,
Saturn's "secret chip", was an inside joke to them. However, they also
stated that the PS2 does have that "secret chip" two of them in fact.
Okay, so PS2's graphics are look barely better than DC games - but
you're comparison is unfair. So PS2 games are of the quality of DC's
2nd generation of games - Well, doesn't that mean that the games will be
significantly better in the next generation? Look at the differences
between VFT3b and SC (1st compared to 2nd gen-respectively.) Don't tell
me you don't see a difference. Why do you insist that the "2nd gen is
better than 1st gen" only true for the DC? Look at the first Saturn
titles (Saturn, as you said, was difficult to program), Virtual Fighter
was better on the 32x! However, then second gen Sega Rally came along,
Alpha was weak compared to the PSX version, but Alpha 2 was far
superior. Fighter's Mega Mix was awesome too - a later generation
game. NES - Mario Bros vs Mario Bros 3. SNES - Mario World vs DKC.
PSX - Ridge Racer vs Gran Turismo(2). N64 - M64 vs Zelda64.
> Factor this in with the hype and downright misleading specs and
> you have the answer to the question "what is wrong with the ps2.
The only ones who are dissappointed are the ones who were dumb enough to
believe the hype. If you've been following consoles for a while then
you should know that hype comes with every new release. Also, now that
the internet is in many many more homes than it was back in the
NES/SNES/GEN/PSX/SAT days it is easier to magnify hype. DC sure didn't
live up to the hype when it first launched in Japan. Most consoles
don't. I suppose you are buying Microsoft's x-box hype too aren't you.
What's wrong with PS2? DC trolls who have nothing better to do than to
blow all the PS2's flaws out of proportion. That's what's wrong with
the PS2.
CoolColJ
all that much - looks very flat like a PC game, stretched textures over
polygons.
I'm sick of that look. PS2 is supposed to allow a different look with the
beziers etc, that's why the PS2 is designed the way it is, tetxuring a game
to kingdom come gives a flat look. we need more polygons and lighting! The
polygons should be the texture - not the shortcut everyone currently does
with texture bitmaps.
I need to go down to my console store and check an import PS2 running :)
-----------------------------------------------------------------
CCJ
BLITZ_Force
My HomePage -----> http://www.geocities.com/coolcolj
Updated - 3/3/2000
S.DiIorio <dii...@home.com> wrote in message
news:edfD4.19792$S4.1...@news1.rdc1.nj.home.com...
> Actually Dreamcast can do more then 30 fps in VGA mode..A coupe lgames
> alrady flow at a smooth 60fps... as far as the PSX2 games lookign like
> crap..yeh even I am not overly impressed right now..a little disappointed
so
> far..I sitl lpaly it for kicks..but we have to wait to see ahat they have
> comign up...Dreamcast games are lookign great now..but they had tiem to
work
> with it..PSX2 is still very new.... You can buy more then one system and
> enjoy them.
>
> There will always be better systems jsut around the corner
>
>
> CoolColJ <cool...@optushome.com.au> wrote in message
> news:cX1D4.133$l_3...@news1.belrs1.nsw.optushome.com.au...
> > ummmm
> >
> >
> > I guess you like to play the game with the pause button on ....... :P
> >
> > --
> > -----------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > CCJ
> >
> > BLITZ_Force
> >
> > My HomePage -----> http://www.geocities.com/coolcolj
> >
> > Updated - 3/3/2000
> >
> >
> > > not exactly live up to the hype now, does it?).
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
joey
a sign, developers bitching about the design is a sign, only 4m texture
memory is one of the stumbling blocks. And yes, i do realize that the ps and
ps2 a diff. consoles. Your point?
Greg Nolle <gr...@nolle.co.uk> wrote in message
news:954105444.22853.0...@news.demon.co.uk...
> Jeez! You're talking out of you arse again. The PS2s hardware isn't
flawed,
> who the hell said this? The deal with the saturn is completely different
> because that was the same console. The PSX and PS2 are completely
different
> consoles. The only developers that are moaning about the design of the PS2
> are the ones that can't program properly. All the others see the benefits
of
> the way it is designed.
>
> Greg.
>
> --
> Please read the Official FAQ at:
> http://www.obsidian.wizkids.co.uk/newsgroups/ps2faq.txt
>
> joey wrote in message ...
> >then the ps was announced with it's use of polygons? At that point the
> >saturn was "upgraded" to compete and eclipse the ps. The result was a
> >console that was a nightmare to program for. The same thing happened with
> >the ps2, and now the ps2 owners are saying things like, wait until the
> >emotion engine is harnessed, wait until the 2nd or 3rd gen. games. The
> ps2's
> >design is flawed, developers are having a hard time implementing
> >anti-aliasing in the games? Bad design.
> > And all the while the dreamcast has games that look better or equal to
the
and
> >you have the answer to the question "what is wrong with the ps2.
>
>
joey
"photo-realistic graphics" and that it would be a leap over the Dreamcast.
They have failed.news:954105626.22948.0...@news.demon.co.uk...
> Oh, and what's so misleading about the specs?
>
>
> --
> Please read the Official FAQ at:
> http://www.obsidian.wizkids.co.uk/newsgroups/ps2faq.txt
>
joey
Jun <NOamoxi...@homeSPAM.com> wrote in message
news:38DE8301...@homeSPAM.com...
> joey wrote:
> >
> > Actually, my theory is this. Remember how the saturn was ready to go and
> > then the ps was announced with it's use of polygons? At that point the
> > saturn was "upgraded" to compete and eclipse the ps. The result was a
> > console that was a nightmare to program for. The same thing happened
with
> > the ps2, and now the ps2 owners are saying things like, wait until the
> > emotion engine is harnessed, wait until the 2nd or 3rd gen. games. The
ps2's
> > design is flawed, developers are having a hard time implementing
> > anti-aliasing in the games? Bad design.
> > And all the while the dreamcast has games that look better or equal to
the
> > ps2 games.
>
> all. The Saturn utilized dual Hitachi SH2 chip configuration and
> programmers had to utilize both to get anything done. The PS2 has a CPU
> and two assisting VUs - the VUs do not have to be used at all they're
> just a way to free up computing power in the main CPU. Each has its own
> specialized task; VU1 is for simple geometry and the VU0 is for more
> complex procedures like game physics. Developers have said that there
> is no "secret chip" in the Saturn - it was quoted in an article that it,
> Saturn's "secret chip", was an inside joke to them. However, they also
> stated that the PS2 does have that "secret chip" two of them in fact.
> Okay, so PS2's graphics are look barely better than DC games - but
> you're comparison is unfair. So PS2 games are of the quality of DC's
> 2nd generation of games - Well, doesn't that mean that the games will be
> significantly better in the next generation? Look at the differences
> between VFT3b and SC (1st compared to 2nd gen-respectively.) Don't tell
> me you don't see a difference. Why do you insist that the "2nd gen is
> better than 1st gen" only true for the DC? Look at the first Saturn
> titles (Saturn, as you said, was difficult to program), Virtual Fighter
> was better on the 32x! However, then second gen Sega Rally came along,
> Alpha was weak compared to the PSX version, but Alpha 2 was far
> superior. Fighter's Mega Mix was awesome too - a later generation
> game. NES - Mario Bros vs Mario Bros 3. SNES - Mario World vs DKC.
> PSX - Ridge Racer vs Gran Turismo(2). N64 - M64 vs Zelda64.
>
> > you have the answer to the question "what is wrong with the ps2.
>
joey
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
Brent Green
after launch. It was available AT launch. If the game was truly developed
in 9 months, 2 extra might have been pretty helpful.
Brent
"joey" <mo...@ev1.net> wrote in message
news:_afD4.12340$OV.17...@typhoon.austin.rr.com...
> Tokyo extreme racing was out in japan within 2 months of launch, it looks
> better than rr5 and is playable on-line in Japan.
> TheHut <we...@sdf.com> wrote in message
> news:PKVC4.6036$f67.1...@news3.cableinet.net...
> >
> > >And why do all the DC screenshot's I have seen so far look stunning? To
> be
> > >honest, every Soul Calibur screenshot kicks TTT ass.
> >
> > Those programmers have really tamed Segas little baby haven`t they, but
> they
> > would after nearly 2 years, so DOA2 and SC make it`s japanese launch
games
> > look ridiculous.
> > And thats what going to happen to the PS2, in 2 years we are going to
look
> > back and laugh. And remember than the team who have done DOA2 say that
> they
> > have maxed out the DC, whereas they got it running on the PS2 incredibly
> > quickly and had time to enhance effects and stuff, and it`s a first gen
> > game, that should give you a clue as to how far ahead the hardware is,
the
> > programmers will catch it up. So the PS2`s second gen games are going
to
> > kill Soul Calibur and the like.
> >
> > >So please don't call me a troll,
> > Compared to some anti-PS2 rants we get here it was a pretty intelligent
> > post, thankfully.
> >
> > I consider myself a general game console
> > >fan which is a bit disappointed with PS2 so far...(let's face it, it
does
> > >not exactly live up to the hype now, does it?).
> > >
Carl221
>do 30fps at this res.
You are incompetent.
ManyDC games do run at 60hz / 640x480.
I have a PS2 and a DC and at the moment the PS2 games have more jaggies. But
still RR5 does look great ! In a year the PS2 GFXwill be better than DC but by
that time we already have the Dolphin out and the X-Box coming.
So it seems PS2 will never be the best when it comes to GFX.
Ross Anderson
If not, my OE must be buggered! I hope not, 'cos I've just switched to W2K.
--
Ross Anderson
ross.a...@risingpad.com
"Greg Nolle" <gr...@nolle.co.uk> wrote in message
news:954105444.22853.0...@news.demon.co.uk...
> Jeez! You're talking out of you arse again. The PS2s hardware isn't
flawed,
> who the hell said this? The deal with the saturn is completely different
> because that was the same console. The PSX and PS2 are completely
different
> consoles. The only developers that are moaning about the design of the PS2
> are the ones that can't program properly. All the others see the benefits
of
> the way it is designed.
>
> Greg.
>
> --
> Please read the Official FAQ at:
> http://www.obsidian.wizkids.co.uk/newsgroups/ps2faq.txt
>
> joey wrote in message ...
> >Actually, my theory is this. Remember how the saturn was ready to go and
> >then the ps was announced with it's use of polygons? At that point the
> >saturn was "upgraded" to compete and eclipse the ps. The result was a
> >console that was a nightmare to program for. The same thing happened with
> >the ps2, and now the ps2 owners are saying things like, wait until the
> >emotion engine is harnessed, wait until the 2nd or 3rd gen. games. The
> ps2's
> >design is flawed, developers are having a hard time implementing
> >anti-aliasing in the games? Bad design.
> > And all the while the dreamcast has games that look better or equal to
the
> >ps2 games. Factor this in with the hype and downright misleading specs
and
> >you have the answer to the question "what is wrong with the ps2.
> <snip>
>
>
jes
Sony. If you said Sega GT, that would be a whole different story.news:GluD4.14753$w81.1...@typhoon.austin.rr.com...
> Wrong. I think it looks better, and the gameplay issue goes to txr too.
The
> rr series is boring in my opinion. The first one was all-right, but the
> controls are strange and adolecent to me.
> TheHut <jo...@REMOVETHISBITkrik81.freeserve.co.uk> wrote in message
> news:jvnD4.7587$f67.2...@news3.cableinet.net...
> >
> > joey wrote in message <_afD4.12340$OV.17...@typhoon.austin.rr.com>...
looks
> > >better than rr5 and is playable on-line in Japan.
> >
TheHut
possible in a tech demo or cut scene(seen DOA2`s?) in the furture, not a
game though. And not even 10 x-box`s linked up to a super cray mainframe
could produce actual photo-realistic graphics, that a decade away at least.
The graphics are certainly a leap over the DC`s when programmed properly,
RRV craps all over any DC racer. And you have to compare the PS2`s current
games to the DC`s jap launch games (NOT the US launch) to see how much
better they are.
Compare the awesome(yet still first generation) DOA2 to Virtua Fighter 3tb
for a fair comparison.
It`s no point mentioning the poor PS2 titles because any system can have
crap graphics if you program it that way, even the x-box will have some
stinkers at launch.
joey wrote in message ...
>Specs are what they are. Sony maintaned that they would produce
>"photo-realistic graphics" and that it would be a leap over the Dreamcast.
>They have failed.
>Greg Nolle <gr...@nolle.co.uk> wrote in message
>news:954105626.22948.0...@news.demon.co.uk...
>> Oh, and what's so misleading about the specs?
>>
>> Greg.
>>
>> --
>> Please read the Official FAQ at:
>> http://www.obsidian.wizkids.co.uk/newsgroups/ps2faq.txt
>>
>> Greg Nolle wrote in message
>> <954105444.22853.0...@news.demon.co.uk>...
TheHut
I can`t believe the way the DC fanboys seem to think that the PS2`s first
gen games are using 100% of it`s power and will never get better.
Freakin` madness.
Jun wrote in message <38DE8301...@homeSPAM.com>...
>Sorry, but you're wrong. The Saturn and the PS2 are not very similar at
>all. The Saturn utilized dual Hitachi SH2 chip configuration and
>programmers had to utilize both to get anything done. The PS2 has a CPU
>and two assisting VUs - the VUs do not have to be used at all they're
>just a way to free up computing power in the main CPU. Each has its own
>specialized task; VU1 is for simple geometry and the VU0 is for more
>complex procedures like game physics. Developers have said that there
>is no "secret chip" in the Saturn - it was quoted in an article that it,
>Saturn's "secret chip", was an inside joke to them. However, they also
>stated that the PS2 does have that "secret chip" two of them in fact.
>Okay, so PS2's graphics are look barely better than DC games - but
>you're comparison is unfair. So PS2 games are of the quality of DC's
>2nd generation of games - Well, doesn't that mean that the games will be
>significantly better in the next generation? Look at the differences
>between VFT3b and SC (1st compared to 2nd gen-respectively.) Don't tell
>me you don't see a difference. Why do you insist that the "2nd gen is
>better than 1st gen" only true for the DC? Look at the first Saturn
>titles (Saturn, as you said, was difficult to program), Virtual Fighter
>was better on the 32x! However, then second gen Sega Rally came along,
>Alpha was weak compared to the PSX version, but Alpha 2 was far
>superior. Fighter's Mega Mix was awesome too - a later generation
>game. NES - Mario Bros vs Mario Bros 3. SNES - Mario World vs DKC.
>PSX - Ridge Racer vs Gran Turismo(2). N64 - M64 vs Zelda64.
>
>> Factor this in with the hype and downright misleading specs and
>> you have the answer to the question "what is wrong with the ps2.
>
Greg Nolle
to be the way you post in this group (anti-Sony).
Greg.
--
Please read the Official FAQ at:
http://www.obsidian.wizkids.co.uk/newsgroups/ps2faq.txt
jes wrote in message <8bng7...@enews2.newsguy.com>...
>You have to be kidding right? Or are you just saying this for your hate of
>Sony. If you said Sega GT, that would be a whole different story.
<snip>
Greg Nolle
Greg.
--
Please read the Official FAQ at:
http://www.obsidian.wizkids.co.uk/newsgroups/ps2faq.txt
TheHut wrote in message ...
>No they never, they said Toy Story quality graphics, which is proabably
>possible in a tech demo or cut scene(seen DOA2`s?) in the furture, not a
>game though. And not even 10 x-box`s linked up to a super cray mainframe
>could produce actual photo-realistic graphics, that a decade away at least.
>
>The graphics are certainly a leap over the DC`s when programmed properly,
>RRV craps all over any DC racer. And you have to compare the PS2`s current
>games to the DC`s jap launch games (NOT the US launch) to see how much
>better they are.
>Compare the awesome(yet still first generation) DOA2 to Virtua Fighter 3tb
>for a fair comparison.
>It`s no point mentioning the poor PS2 titles because any system can have
>crap graphics if you program it that way, even the x-box will have some
>stinkers at launch.
>
>joey wrote in message ...
>>Specs are what they are. Sony maintaned that they would produce
>>"photo-realistic graphics" and that it would be a leap over the Dreamcast.
>>They have failed.
>>Greg Nolle <gr...@nolle.co.uk> wrote in message
>>news:954105626.22948.0...@news.demon.co.uk...
>>> Oh, and what's so misleading about the specs?
>>>
>>> Greg.
>>>
>>> --
>>> Please read the Official FAQ at:
>>> http://www.obsidian.wizkids.co.uk/newsgroups/ps2faq.txt
>>>
>>> Greg Nolle wrote in message
>>> <954105444.22853.0...@news.demon.co.uk>...
>>> >Jeez! You're talking out of you arse again. The PS2s hardware isn't
>>flawed,
>>> >who the hell said this? The deal with the saturn is completely
different
>>> >because that was the same console. The PSX and PS2 are completely
>>different
>>> >consoles. The only developers that are moaning about the design of the
>>PS2
>>> >are the ones that can't program properly. All the others see the
>benefits
>>> of
>>> >the way it is designed.
>>> >
>>> >Greg.
>>> >
>>> >--
>>> >Please read the Official FAQ at:
>>> >http://www.obsidian.wizkids.co.uk/newsgroups/ps2faq.txt
>>> >
>>> >joey wrote in message ...
>>> >>Actually, my theory is this. Remember how the saturn was ready to go
>and
>>> >>then the ps was announced with it's use of polygons? At that point the
>>> >>saturn was "upgraded" to compete and eclipse the ps. The result was a
>>> >>console that was a nightmare to program for. The same thing happened
>>with
>>> >>the ps2, and now the ps2 owners are saying things like, wait until the
>>> >>emotion engine is harnessed, wait until the 2nd or 3rd gen. games. The
>>> >ps2's
>>> >>design is flawed, developers are having a hard time implementing
>>> >>anti-aliasing in the games? Bad design.
>>> >> And all the while the dreamcast has games that look better or equal
to
>>> the
>>> >>ps2 games. Factor this in with the hype and downright misleading specs
>>and
>>> >>you have the answer to the question "what is wrong with the ps2.
>>> ><snip>
>>> >
>>> >
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>
Greg Nolle
is
>a sign,
Not really, AA isn't essential at such an early point. We've managed without
it in the past. Just be patient and you'll get games using it.
>developers bitching about the design is a sign,
As I said, only crap developers bitch about the design and that's a sign of
their intelligence not a sign of the PS2s quality.
>only 4m texture
>memory is one of the stumbling blocks.
Hardly considering you can stream textures straight of the CD/DVD.
>And yes, i do realize that the ps and
>ps2 a diff. consoles. Your point?
No point.
Greg.
---
Please read the Official FAQ at:
http://www.obsidian.wizkids.co.uk/newsgroups/ps2faq.txt
<snip>
Greg Nolle
Greg.
--
Please read the Official FAQ at:
http://www.obsidian.wizkids.co.uk/newsgroups/ps2faq.txt
Ross Anderson wrote in message <8bnct0$jng$3...@neptunium.btinternet.com>...
>Is that a reply to my post?
>
>If not, my OE must be buggered! I hope not, 'cos I've just switched to W2K.
>
>--
>Ross Anderson
>ross.a...@risingpad.com
<snip>
TheHut
Greg Nolle wrote in message
>Hate for Sony is my guess. Don't take this the wrong way Joey but that
tends
>to be the way you post in this group (anti-Sony).
>
>Greg.
>
Yeah Joey, less pointless anti-sony rants man.
Considering that if it wasn`t for Sony console games would still be
considered kids toys and the games industry would be 10 times smaller i
think they deserve some respect.
Of course Sega do as well, their megadrive(genesis) made my teens a whole
lot more enjoyable, and you can only give credit for having the very first
internet capable console, so lets just direct all your hatred at those who
deserve it the most.
Thats Microsoft, who would happily kill all Sega and Sony employees if they
knew they were going to get away with it,(well, probably) and may even cause
the end of the company they supposedly helped. The gits just probably
helped Sega with the DC so they could steal ideas. Though maybe crippling
it with WindowsCE(which thankfully no game uses) is hardly help at all. Why
didn`t they just give them the tech to make Dreamcast2? No, they want to be
the bigshots themselves and don`t care who they step on, i hate bullies.
simon hutchinson
> And why do all the DC screenshot's I have seen so far look stunning? To be
> screenshots, why don't they get ugly because of interlacing???
>
> fan which is a bit disappointed with PS2 so far...(let's face it, it does
====
hmmmm.........if you were a general video games fan, you would never bash a
system after it has only been out 2 weeks
the dreamcast had vf3tb, pen pen, godzilla and a few other shit games......
the ps1 had ridge racer, motor toon, tohshinden and some pachinko games...
the reason the shots look so poor is cos they are usually photographed from
a video.......and not from a hi res screen grabber.......also since the
dreamcast outputs vga at 640x480 it is easier to grab a hi res picture that
will look good when viewed on a pc.......
just give the machine time......after all the dreamcast has had well over a
year to prove itself.......(since the japanese release)
--
--
From Simon Hutchinson
I Dont Put My Email On Newsgroup Posts!
<smhATeidosnetDOTcoDOTuk>
simon hutchinson
====
> Tokyo extreme racing was out in japan within 2 months of launch, it looks
> better than rr5 and is playable on-line in Japan.
is it.......really?
nope
there are no online multiplayer games yet for the dreamcast
joey
and a waste of my money.
jes <j...@yifan.net> wrote in message news:8bng7...@enews2.newsguy.com...
> You have to be kidding right? Or are you just saying this for your hate of
> Sony. If you said Sega GT, that would be a whole different story.
> > Wrong. I think it looks better, and the gameplay issue goes to txr too.
> The
> > rr series is boring in my opinion. The first one was all-right, but the
> > controls are strange and adolecent to me.
> > TheHut <jo...@REMOVETHISBITkrik81.freeserve.co.uk> wrote in message
> > news:jvnD4.7587$f67.2...@news3.cableinet.net...
> > >
> > > joey wrote in message
<_afD4.12340$OV.17...@typhoon.austin.rr.com>...
> looks
> > > >better than rr5 and is playable on-line in Japan.
> > >
joey
overreacting out of your love for sony <g>news:954170309.26797.0...@news.demon.co.uk...
> Hate for Sony is my guess. Don't take this the wrong way Joey but that
tends
> to be the way you post in this group (anti-Sony).
>
> Greg.
>
of
> >Sony. If you said Sega GT, that would be a whole different story.
>
>
joey
don't include me in on it.news:ypPD4.648$Ym1....@news3.cableinet.net...
> tends
> >to be the way you post in this group (anti-Sony).
> >
> >Greg.
> >
>
joey
direct from the sony hype machine.news:OCJD4.186$Ym1....@news3.cableinet.net...
> No they never, they said Toy Story quality graphics, which is proabably
> possible in a tech demo or cut scene(seen DOA2`s?) in the furture, not a
> game though. And not even 10 x-box`s linked up to a super cray mainframe
> could produce actual photo-realistic graphics, that a decade away at
least.
>
> The graphics are certainly a leap over the DC`s when programmed properly,
> RRV craps all over any DC racer. And you have to compare the PS2`s
current
> games to the DC`s jap launch games (NOT the US launch) to see how much
> better they are.
> Compare the awesome(yet still first generation) DOA2 to Virtua Fighter 3tb
> for a fair comparison.
> It`s no point mentioning the poor PS2 titles because any system can have
> crap graphics if you program it that way, even the x-box will have some
> stinkers at launch.
>
> >"photo-realistic graphics" and that it would be a leap over the
Dreamcast.
> >They have failed.
> >> Oh, and what's so misleading about the specs?
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> Please read the Official FAQ at:
> >> http://www.obsidian.wizkids.co.uk/newsgroups/ps2faq.txt
> >>
> >> >Jeez! You're talking out of you arse again. The PS2s hardware isn't
> >flawed,
> >> >who the hell said this? The deal with the saturn is completely
different
> >> >because that was the same console. The PSX and PS2 are completely
> >different
> >> >consoles. The only developers that are moaning about the design of the
> >PS2
> >> >are the ones that can't program properly. All the others see the
> benefits
> >> of
> >> >the way it is designed.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >--
> >> >Please read the Official FAQ at:
> >> >http://www.obsidian.wizkids.co.uk/newsgroups/ps2faq.txt
> >> >
joey
not deliver.news:954170373.26831.0...@news.demon.co.uk...
> Well said man!
>
> Greg.
>
> --
> Please read the Official FAQ at:
> http://www.obsidian.wizkids.co.uk/newsgroups/ps2faq.txt
>
joey
but it cuts the frame rate. Why is that? Could it be a flawed design? In my
opinion it is.news:954170532.26917.0...@news.demon.co.uk...
> joey wrote in message ...
> is
> >a sign,
>
> Not really, AA isn't essential at such an early point. We've managed
without
> it in the past. Just be patient and you'll get games using it.
>
> >developers bitching about the design is a sign,
>
> As I said, only crap developers bitch about the design and that's a sign
of
> their intelligence not a sign of the PS2s quality.
>
> >only 4m texture
> >memory is one of the stumbling blocks.
>
> Hardly considering you can stream textures straight of the CD/DVD.
>
> >And yes, i do realize that the ps and
> >ps2 a diff. consoles. Your point?
>
> No point.
>
> Greg.
>
> ---
>
>
joey
flat out lied. These threads should not even exist. If they delivered what
was said they were you would not be speaking of "fanboys" or "just you wait"
or "it's the develeprs fault". Now, i must get back to Shen Mue. <BFG>news:lHJD4.195$Ym1....@news3.cableinet.net...
> >> you have the answer to the question "what is wrong with the ps2.
> >
Jun
games to 2nd and 3rd gen DC games and there isn't much difference.
People have been saying "there's barely a difference" between PS2 and DC
graphics - Well, if japanese PS2 launch titles look that good, then
imagine how good they will look when they have more time to develop the
games -when they harness the hardware. Sega promised a leap too, did
you see that leap with VF3Tb? With Godzilla? With Pen Pen? I don't
think so. All companies make hype statements - if they didn't, no one
would talk about it, and if no one talked about it, then only a small
amount of people would know about it. Hype is a way to get more people
to buy. It's those who don't take it with a grain of salt that end up
dissappointed. You know, I wish you'd wake up from your anti-sony state
of mind - many already have. I just don't understand why you tell
everyone they shouldn't buy a PS2 - if you don't like it that's fine,
don't get one, but don't tell me or anyone else what to buy or what not
to like. We all have our own opinions, and yours obviously differs, I
respect that, can you respect mine? Think about it.
Jun
they promised after less that a month on the market? Did they promise
"photo realistic" or "toy story" graphics **at launch**? Sega promised
online gaming - just cause it wasn't there at launch meant that they
would never fulfill that promise? I think Chu Chu (very far from
launch) proves that they came through. Not all things happen right away
- these things take time. Think about it.
joey wrote:
>
> You are missing the point alltogether. Sony hyped photo-realistic, they did
> not deliver.
> Greg Nolle <gr...@nolle.co.uk> wrote in message
> news:954170373.26831.0...@news.demon.co.uk...
> > Well said man!
> >
> > Greg.
> >
> > --
> > Please read the Official FAQ at:
> > http://www.obsidian.wizkids.co.uk/newsgroups/ps2faq.txt
> >
> > TheHut wrote in message ...
> > >No they never, they said Toy Story quality graphics, which is proabably
> > >possible in a tech demo or cut scene(seen DOA2`s?) in the furture, not a
> > >game though. And not even 10 x-box`s linked up to a super cray
> mainframe
> > >could produce actual photo-realistic graphics, that a decade away at
> least.
> > >
> > >The graphics are certainly a leap over the DC`s when programmed properly,
> > >RRV craps all over any DC racer. And you have to compare the PS2`s
> current
> > >games to the DC`s jap launch games (NOT the US launch) to see how much
> > >better they are.
> > >Compare the awesome(yet still first generation) DOA2 to Virtua Fighter
> 3tb
> > >for a fair comparison.
> > >It`s no point mentioning the poor PS2 titles because any system can have
> > >crap graphics if you program it that way, even the x-box will have some
> > >stinkers at launch.
> > >
> > >joey wrote in message ...
> > >>Specs are what they are. Sony maintaned that they would produce
> > >>"photo-realistic graphics" and that it would be a leap over the
> Dreamcast.
> > >>They have failed.
> > >>Greg Nolle <gr...@nolle.co.uk> wrote in message
> > >>news:954105626.22948.0...@news.demon.co.uk...
> > >>> Oh, and what's so misleading about the specs?
> > >>>
> > >>> Greg.
> > >>>
> > >>> --
> > >>> Please read the Official FAQ at:
> > >>> http://www.obsidian.wizkids.co.uk/newsgroups/ps2faq.txt
> > >>>
> > >>> Greg Nolle wrote in message
> > >>> <954105444.22853.0...@news.demon.co.uk>...
> > >>> >Jeez! You're talking out of you arse again. The PS2s hardware isn't
> > >>flawed,
> > >>> >who the hell said this? The deal with the saturn is completely
> > different
> > >>> >because that was the same console. The PSX and PS2 are completely
> > >>different
> > >>> >consoles. The only developers that are moaning about the design of
> the
> > >>PS2
> > >>> >are the ones that can't program properly. All the others see the
> > >benefits
> > >>> of
> > >>> >the way it is designed.
> > >>> >
> > >>> >Greg.
> > >>> >
> > >>> >--
> > >>> >Please read the Official FAQ at:
> > >>> >http://www.obsidian.wizkids.co.uk/newsgroups/ps2faq.txt
> > >>> >
> > >>> >joey wrote in message ...
> > >>> >>Actually, my theory is this. Remember how the saturn was ready to go
> > >and
> > >>> >>then the ps was announced with it's use of polygons? At that point
> the
> > >>> >>saturn was "upgraded" to compete and eclipse the ps. The result was
> a
> > >>> >>console that was a nightmare to program for. The same thing happened
> > >>with
> > >>> >>the ps2, and now the ps2 owners are saying things like, wait until
> the
> > >>> >>emotion engine is harnessed, wait until the 2nd or 3rd gen. games.
> The
> > >>> >ps2's
> > >>> >>design is flawed, developers are having a hard time implementing
> > >>> >>anti-aliasing in the games? Bad design.
> > >>> >> And all the while the dreamcast has games that look better or equal
> > to
> > >>> the
> > >>> >>ps2 games. Factor this in with the hype and downright misleading
> specs
> > >>and
> > >>> >>you have the answer to the question "what is wrong with the ps2.
> > >>> ><snip>
> > >>> >
> > >>> >
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
TheHut
joey wrote in message ...
>direct from the sony hype machine.
NO frigging chance. I distinctly remember the phrase Toy Story standard
graphics being mentioned. And i`ve even got a quote here from George Lucas
about how he was interested in doing an "A Bugs Life" type movie in real, or
near-real time.
Even the most insane sony PR person wouldn`t say photo-realistic as it is
utterly impossible even if you linked up all the computers in the world.
Simply because the software to make such realistic renderings hasn`t been
written yet.
Even if it had you could link up 10 of the latest SGI machines and still no
way would you be able to process that kind of realism in real time.
Can`t you even try and visualise the kind of processing needed to render
textures, colours, lighting and near-infinite polygon meshes 25 times a
sec(for a slow game). Sony would never say such a thing, a foolish website
might make the mistake, but you are trying yet again to make Sony out to be
stupid. And once again you fail.
jes
> No i am not kidding. The first one was allright. The others were redundant
> and a waste of my money.
> jes <j...@yifan.net> wrote in message
news:8bng7...@enews2.newsguy.com...
of
> > Sony. If you said Sega GT, that would be a whole different story.
> > news:GluD4.14753$w81.1...@typhoon.austin.rr.com...
> > > Wrong. I think it looks better, and the gameplay issue goes to txr
too.
> > The
> > > rr series is boring in my opinion. The first one was all-right, but
the
> > > controls are strange and adolecent to me.
jes
like the real world?news:c9XD4.15247$w81.1...@typhoon.austin.rr.com...
> I never said anything about "toy story" i said photo-realistic and that is
> direct from the sony hype machine.
> > No they never, they said Toy Story quality graphics, which is proabably
> > possible in a tech demo or cut scene(seen DOA2`s?) in the furture, not a
> > game though. And not even 10 x-box`s linked up to a super cray
mainframe
> > could produce actual photo-realistic graphics, that a decade away at
> least.
> >
> > The graphics are certainly a leap over the DC`s when programmed
properly,
> > RRV craps all over any DC racer. And you have to compare the PS2`s
> current
> > games to the DC`s jap launch games (NOT the US launch) to see how much
> > better they are.
> > Compare the awesome(yet still first generation) DOA2 to Virtua Fighter
3tb
> > for a fair comparison.
> > It`s no point mentioning the poor PS2 titles because any system can have
> > crap graphics if you program it that way, even the x-box will have some
> > stinkers at launch.
> >
Ste Birmo
> I wish you people would just wake up. Sony promised a leap,
> a step up, they flat out lied.
If anyone needs to "wise up" then it is yourself. If what you're saying
were truly the case, then by now, various programmers and designers
would be express their concerns. But yet I hear no one backing you
up. All I hear are words like "untapped power", "learning curve" and
"wow, I'd love to give her one". Ahem, sorry, please ignore that one.
Anyway, if you had an open mind and read the news then you would
know what the score is. But you obviously do not, so I must presume
that you have your head stuck up Sega or Nintendo's bottom.
> These threads should not even exist. If they delivered what was said
> they were you would not be speaking of "fanboys" or "just you wait"
> or "it's the develeprs fault".
Not at all. Yes, it is unfortunate, and slightly annoying, that we are
having to wait the best part of a year to see it, but the power IS there.
Greg Nolle
night in bed!</sarcasm> lol!
Greg.
--
Please read the Official FAQ at:
http://www.obsidian.wizkids.co.uk/newsgroups/ps2faq.txt
joey wrote in message <26XD4.15238$w81.1...@typhoon.austin.rr.com>...
>I could care less about you thoughts on my posts. You are probably just
>overreacting out of your love for sony <g>
>Greg Nolle <gr...@nolle.co.uk> wrote in message
>news:954170309.26797.0...@news.demon.co.uk...
>> Hate for Sony is my guess. Don't take this the wrong way Joey but that
>tends
>> to be the way you post in this group (anti-Sony).
>>
>> Greg.
>>
>> --
>> Please read the Official FAQ at:
>> http://www.obsidian.wizkids.co.uk/newsgroups/ps2faq.txt
>>
>> jes wrote in message <8bng7...@enews2.newsguy.com>...
>> >You have to be kidding right? Or are you just saying this for your hate
>of
>> >Sony. If you said Sega GT, that would be a whole different story.
>> <snip>
>>
>>
>
>
Greg Nolle
exactly photo-realistic (ie. like real life) and as TheHut explained the
cut-scenes are Toy Story-quality.
Greg.
--
Please read the Official FAQ at:
http://www.obsidian.wizkids.co.uk/newsgroups/ps2faq.txt
joey wrote in message ...
>You are missing the point alltogether. Sony hyped photo-realistic, they did
>not deliver.
>Greg Nolle <gr...@nolle.co.uk> wrote in message
>news:954170373.26831.0...@news.demon.co.uk...
>> Well said man!
>>
>> Greg.
>>
>> --
>> Please read the Official FAQ at:
>> http://www.obsidian.wizkids.co.uk/newsgroups/ps2faq.txt
>>
>> TheHut wrote in message ...
>> >No they never, they said Toy Story quality graphics, which is proabably
>> >possible in a tech demo or cut scene(seen DOA2`s?) in the furture, not a
>> >game though. And not even 10 x-box`s linked up to a super cray
>mainframe
>> >could produce actual photo-realistic graphics, that a decade away at
>least.
>> >
>> >The graphics are certainly a leap over the DC`s when programmed
properly,
>> >RRV craps all over any DC racer. And you have to compare the PS2`s
>current
>> >games to the DC`s jap launch games (NOT the US launch) to see how much
>> >better they are.
>> >Compare the awesome(yet still first generation) DOA2 to Virtua Fighter
>3tb
>> >for a fair comparison.
>> >It`s no point mentioning the poor PS2 titles because any system can have
>> >crap graphics if you program it that way, even the x-box will have some
>> >stinkers at launch.
>> >
>> >joey wrote in message ...
>> >>Specs are what they are. Sony maintaned that they would produce
>> >>"photo-realistic graphics" and that it would be a leap over the
>Dreamcast.
>> >>They have failed.
>> >>Greg Nolle <gr...@nolle.co.uk> wrote in message
>> >>news:954105626.22948.0...@news.demon.co.uk...
>> >>> Oh, and what's so misleading about the specs?
>> >>>
>> >>> Greg.
>> >>>
>> >>> --
>> >>> Please read the Official FAQ at:
>> >>> http://www.obsidian.wizkids.co.uk/newsgroups/ps2faq.txt
>> >>>
>> >>> Greg Nolle wrote in message
>> >>> <954105444.22853.0...@news.demon.co.uk>...
>> >>> >Jeez! You're talking out of you arse again. The PS2s hardware isn't
>> >>flawed,
>> >>> >who the hell said this? The deal with the saturn is completely
>> different
>> >>> >because that was the same console. The PSX and PS2 are completely
>> >>different
>> >>> >consoles. The only developers that are moaning about the design of
>the
>> >>PS2
>> >>> >are the ones that can't program properly. All the others see the
>> >benefits
>> >>> of
>> >>> >the way it is designed.
>> >>> >
>> >>> >Greg.
>> >>> >
>> >>> >--
>> >>> >Please read the Official FAQ at:
>> >>> >http://www.obsidian.wizkids.co.uk/newsgroups/ps2faq.txt
>> >>> >
Greg Nolle
hype that Sony puts out but nobody else has heard of the things that they
supposedly said.
Greg.
--
Please read the Official FAQ at:
http://www.obsidian.wizkids.co.uk/newsgroups/ps2faq.txt
joey wrote in message ...
>I never said anything about "toy story" i said photo-realistic and that is
>direct from the sony hype machine.
>TheHut <jo...@REMOVETHISBITkrik81.freeserve.co.uk> wrote in message
>news:OCJD4.186$Ym1....@news3.cableinet.net...
CoolColJ
real time - which it can :)
--
-----------------------------------------------------------------
CCJ
BLITZ_Force
My HomePage -----> http://www.geocities.com/coolcolj
Updated - 3/3/2000
Greg Nolle <gr...@nolle.co.uk> wrote in message
news:954257381.29259.0...@news.demon.co.uk...
> But they didn't. They promised Toy Story-quality graphics which isn't
> exactly photo-realistic (ie. like real life) and as TheHut explained the
> cut-scenes are Toy Story-quality.
>
> Greg.
>
> --
> Please read the Official FAQ at:
> http://www.obsidian.wizkids.co.uk/newsgroups/ps2faq.txt
>
> joey wrote in message ...
> >You are missing the point alltogether. Sony hyped photo-realistic, they
did
> >not deliver.
> >Greg Nolle <gr...@nolle.co.uk> wrote in message
> >news:954170373.26831.0...@news.demon.co.uk...
> >> Well said man!
> >>
> >> Greg.
> >>
> >> --
> >> Please read the Official FAQ at:
> >> http://www.obsidian.wizkids.co.uk/newsgroups/ps2faq.txt
> >>
> >> TheHut wrote in message ...
Greg Nolle
truthfully that the PS2 isn't a step up compared to other consoles that are
currently available.
Greg.
--
Please read the Official FAQ at:
http://www.obsidian.wizkids.co.uk/newsgroups/ps2faq.txt
joey wrote in message ...
>I wish you people would just wake up. Sony promised a leap, a step up, they
>flat out lied. These threads should not even exist. If they delivered what
>was said they were you would not be speaking of "fanboys" or "just you
wait"
>or "it's the develeprs fault". Now, i must get back to Shen Mue. <BFG>
>TheHut <jo...@REMOVETHISBITkrik81.freeserve.co.uk> wrote in message
>> >> Factor this in with the hype and downright misleading specs and
>> >> you have the answer to the question "what is wrong with the ps2.
>> >
Greg Nolle
Greg.
--
Please read the Official FAQ at:
http://www.obsidian.wizkids.co.uk/newsgroups/ps2faq.txt
CoolColJ wrote in message ...
>No what they said was that the PSX 2 had enough power to render Toy Story
in
>real time - which it can :)
>
>--
>-----------------------------------------------------------------
>
>CCJ
>
>BLITZ_Force
>
>My HomePage -----> http://www.geocities.com/coolcolj
>
>Updated - 3/3/2000
<snip>
joey
Jun <NOamoxi...@homeSPAM.com> wrote in message
news:38E04A13...@homeSPAM.com...
> So you can tell that the company lied and can **NEVER** achieve what
> they promised after less that a month on the market? Did they promise
> "photo realistic" or "toy story" graphics **at launch**? Sega promised
> online gaming - just cause it wasn't there at launch meant that they
> would never fulfill that promise? I think Chu Chu (very far from
> launch) proves that they came through. Not all things happen right away
> - these things take time. Think about it.
>
>
>
> joey wrote:
> >
did
> > not deliver.
> > Greg Nolle <gr...@nolle.co.uk> wrote in message
> > news:954170373.26831.0...@news.demon.co.uk...
> > > Well said man!
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > Please read the Official FAQ at:
> > > http://www.obsidian.wizkids.co.uk/newsgroups/ps2faq.txt
> > >
> > > >>"photo-realistic graphics" and that it would be a leap over the
> > Dreamcast.
> > > >>They have failed.
> > > >>Greg Nolle <gr...@nolle.co.uk> wrote in message
> > > >>news:954105626.22948.0...@news.demon.co.uk...
> > > >>> Oh, and what's so misleading about the specs?
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>> --
> > > >>> Please read the Official FAQ at:
> > > >>> http://www.obsidian.wizkids.co.uk/newsgroups/ps2faq.txt
> > > >>>
> > > >>> <954105444.22853.0...@news.demon.co.uk>...
> > > >>> >Jeez! You're talking out of you arse again. The PS2s hardware
isn't
> > > >>flawed,
> > > >>> >who the hell said this? The deal with the saturn is completely
> > > different
> > > >>> >because that was the same console. The PSX and PS2 are completely
> > > >>different
> > > >>> >consoles. The only developers that are moaning about the design
of
> > the
> > > >>PS2
> > > >>> >are the ones that can't program properly. All the others see the
> > > >benefits
> > > >>> of
> > > >>> >the way it is designed.
> > > >>> >
> > > >>> >
> > > >>> >--
> > > >>> >Please read the Official FAQ at:
> > > >>> >http://www.obsidian.wizkids.co.uk/newsgroups/ps2faq.txt
> > > >>> >
> > specs
> > > >>and
> > > >>> >>you have the answer to the question "what is wrong with the ps2.
> > > >>> >
> > > >>> >
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
joey
you people are reaching to cover a companies ass, if only you were being
paid for it.news:sP%D4.1242$Ym1....@news3.cableinet.net...
>
> joey wrote in message ...
is
> >direct from the sony hype machine.
>
joey
jes <j...@yifan.net> wrote in message news:8bq3n...@enews3.newsguy.com...
> What do you mean in photorealistic. Do you mean like the graphics looking
> like the real world?
> "joey" <mo...@ev1.net> wrote in message
> news:c9XD4.15247$w81.1...@typhoon.austin.rr.com...
is
> > direct from the sony hype machine.
> > > No they never, they said Toy Story quality graphics, which is
proabably
> > > possible in a tech demo or cut scene(seen DOA2`s?) in the furture, not
a
> > > game though. And not even 10 x-box`s linked up to a super cray
> mainframe
> > > could produce actual photo-realistic graphics, that a decade away at
> > least.
> > >
> > > The graphics are certainly a leap over the DC`s when programmed
> properly,
> > > RRV craps all over any DC racer. And you have to compare the PS2`s
> > current
> > > games to the DC`s jap launch games (NOT the US launch) to see how much
> > > better they are.
> > > Compare the awesome(yet still first generation) DOA2 to Virtua Fighter
> 3tb
> > > for a fair comparison.
> > > It`s no point mentioning the poor PS2 titles because any system can
have
> > > crap graphics if you program it that way, even the x-box will have
some
> > > stinkers at launch.
> > >
joey
> And you work for the sony hype machine do you? You keep going on about the
> hype that Sony puts out but nobody else has heard of the things that they
> supposedly said.
>
joey
it takes to program for the system, and the results. Look around. There are
some articles about this subject on the dailyradar site.
Ste Birmo <steb...@cableinet.co.uk> wrote in message
news:Lw1E4.1312$Ym1....@news3.cableinet.net...
> joey <mo...@ev1.net> wrote:
> > I wish you people would just wake up. Sony promised a leap,
> > a step up, they flat out lied.
>
> were truly the case, then by now, various programmers and designers
> would be express their concerns. But yet I hear no one backing you
> up. All I hear are words like "untapped power", "learning curve" and
> "wow, I'd love to give her one". Ahem, sorry, please ignore that one.
> Anyway, if you had an open mind and read the news then you would
> know what the score is. But you obviously do not, so I must presume
> that you have your head stuck up Sega or Nintendo's bottom.
>
> > they were you would not be speaking of "fanboys" or "just you wait"
> > or "it's the develeprs fault".
>
joey
year old console is NOT a step up in my eyes.news:954257540.29335.0...@news.demon.co.uk...
> Ha! You seriously consider what the PS2 will become and then try and say
> truthfully that the PS2 isn't a step up compared to other consoles that
are
> currently available.
>
>
> --
> Please read the Official FAQ at:
> http://www.obsidian.wizkids.co.uk/newsgroups/ps2faq.txt
>
> joey wrote in message ...
they
what
> >was said they were you would not be speaking of "fanboys" or "just you
> wait"
> >> >> you have the answer to the question "what is wrong with the ps2.
> >> >
Ste Birmo
> I saw "photo-realistic" from an interview with the designer of the ps2.
The only time I can remember Ken Kutaragi talking about photo realism
in games is when he gave a speech about the Emotion Engine 2 and 3.
See here: www.coremagazine.com/news/974.php3
> God you people are reaching to cover a companies ass....
No were not. Were just pointing out your mistakes.
Ste Birmo
> Developers are bitching! They are bitching about how much time
> and resources it takes to program for the system, and the results.
Yes, well, as far as I know Sony never promised to make it the
easiest system to program for. They did say however that it will
be a major leap up in performance. And they're right, it is.
> Look around. There are some articles about this subject on the
> dailyradar site.
I know, I've read them all. And there seems to be a mixed response
to this subject so far.
Ste Birmo
> eclipsed by a year old console is NOT a step up in my eyes.
Now you're just being stupid.
Greg Nolle
Yeah, so? You just buy a multitap and you have 4, buy another multitap and
you have 8 which is more than any other console.
> no way to get online,
Bullshit and you know it! I'm not even going to bother to explain what's
wrong with this because you know.
>and games that are eclipsed by a
>year old console is NOT a step up in my eyes.
What are you going on about now?
Greg.
---
Please read the Official FAQ at:
http://www.obsidian.wizkids.co.uk/newsgroups/ps2faq.txt
<snip>
TheHut
CoolColJ wrote in message ...
>No what they said was that the PSX 2 had enough power to render Toy Story
in
>real time - which it can :)
>
>--
>-----------------------------------------------------------------
Yeah thats it.
Not Toy Story 2 though, have you see that puppy?!
What a flick.
TheHut
joey wrote in message ...
resources
>some articles about this subject on the dailyradar site.
They would, most programmers have a hard enough time and really can`t be
bothered learning new techniques. And it`s only the crap companies
bitching, and they are the ones who choked the PS market with rapidly
programmed crap. The good companies are saying still like what Ste said,
"Learning curve"(what system doesn`t, a crap one thats what), "power
available" and about how they wish they had more time as there was so much
more they could do.
You keep going on as if you are trying to make us see the light, as if you
are the only one who never fell for the Sony hype.
Well we never either. Do you think that when we were reading about "The
Emotion Engine" and how it has the abilities to show effects like clothing,
wind, rain, hair and "real emotions" we believed them? And that we were
expecting a earth shattering Japanese launch game arsenal? (which means
nothing to most of us, the launch in the US and UK is the big one)
We never beleived them, we know very well that all companies try to brag
about their new toy as best they can. You keep going on about the way Sony
never lived up to their "promises", well it sounds like you are the only one
here who fell for the hype.
Sony never promised anything for launch, just what it can do if you give it
time.
And despite your protestations Sony will be top of the pile for the next 4
or 5 years. If they still haven`t lived up their promises by then i`ll join
you in the PS3 group and bitch about it`s "lame" launch.
TheHut
joey wrote in message ...
>year old console is NOT a step up in my eyes.
If you have four mates and spare pads you have the choice of a very cool
looking multitap, sony couldn`t build one inside as they needed full
backwards compatibility.
As for online Unreal Tourny is lauching with online capability so they must
know something, maybe a cheap PCMCIA modem will be out for the US launch, it
would be easy to do.
And as for the games. It has taken 18 months for programmers to get the DC
to squeeze out DOA2, the PS2 is on the scene for a month and the programmers
convert it over and have plenty of horsepower left for motion blur, weather
and special effects and higher poly counts and god knows what else.
So a first gen PS2 game kicks the arse off a very advanced 2nd-gen DC game?
How on earth is the PS2 "eclipsed"?
(and let me not mention how no DC racer looks as good as RRV or GT2000)
joey
U.S. Chu Chu rocket is playable online. Get your facts straight buddy.
simon hutchinson <s...@spamisbad.eidosnet.co.uk> wrote in message
news:8br92l$2c1i$4...@quince.news.easynet.net...> news:_afD4.12340$OV.17...@typhoon.austin.rr.com...
> ====
> > Tokyo extreme racing was out in japan within 2 months of launch, it
looks
> > better than rr5 and is playable on-line in Japan.
> is it.......really?
>
> nope
>
> there are no online multiplayer games yet for the dreamcast
>
>
> --
> --
> From Simon Hutchinson
> I Dont Put My Email On Newsgroup Posts!
> <smhATeidosnetDOTcoDOTuk>
>
>
joey
> joey <mo...@ev1.net> wrote in message:
> > 2 controller ports, no way to get online, and games that are
> > eclipsed by a year old console is NOT a step up in my eyes.
>
joey
> you have 8 which is more than any other console.
I don't think so, 4 should be there in my opinion.
Bullshit and you know it! I'm not even going to bother to explain what's
> wrong with this because you know (online Problem)
Really? Do you have a special ps2 that can get online?
and games that are eclipsed by a
> >year old console is NOT a step up in my eyes.
>
> What are you going on about now?
Going on about? I stand by my statement
Greg Nolle <gr...@nolle.co.uk> wrote in message
news:954271930.16700.0...@news.demon.co.uk...
> joey wrote in message ...
> >2 controller ports,
>
> Yeah, so? You just buy a multitap and you have 4, buy another multitap and
> you have 8 which is more than any other console.
>
> > no way to get online,
>
> Bullshit and you know it! I'm not even going to bother to explain what's
> wrong with this because you know.
>
> >and games that are eclipsed by a
> >year old console is NOT a step up in my eyes.
>
joey
> (and let me not mention how no DC racer looks as good as RRV or GT2000)
>
TheHut <jo...@REMOVETHISBITkrik81.freeserve.co.uk> wrote in message
news:YM8E4.584$VE1....@news3.cableinet.net...
>
> joey wrote in message ...
> >2 controller ports, no way to get online, and games that are eclipsed by
a
> >year old console is NOT a step up in my eyes.
>
joey
>
> joey wrote in message ...
joey
joey
> Ha! <sarcasm>Yes, I really love Sony. I dream about the Sony logo every
> night in bed!</sarcasm> lol!
>
> Greg.
>
> --
> >I could care less about you thoughts on my posts. You are probably just
> >overreacting out of your love for sony <g>
> >> Hate for Sony is my guess. Don't take this the wrong way Joey but that
> >tends
> >> to be the way you post in this group (anti-Sony).
> >>
> >> Greg.
> >>
> >> --
> >> http://www.obsidian.wizkids.co.uk/newsgroups/ps2faq.txt
> >>
joey
Jun <NOamoxi...@homeSPAM.com> wrote in message
news:38E04A13...@homeSPAM.com...
> So you can tell that the company lied and can **NEVER** achieve what
> they promised after less that a month on the market? Did they promise
> "photo realistic" or "toy story" graphics **at launch**? Sega promised
> online gaming - just cause it wasn't there at launch meant that they
> would never fulfill that promise? I think Chu Chu (very far from
> launch) proves that they came through. Not all things happen right away
> - these things take time. Think about it.
>
>
>
> joey wrote:
> >
> > You are missing the point alltogether. Sony hyped photo-realistic, they
did
> > not deliver.
> > > Well said man!
> > >
> > > Greg.
> > >
> > > --
> > > Please read the Official FAQ at:
> > > http://www.obsidian.wizkids.co.uk/newsgroups/ps2faq.txt
> > >
> > > >No they never, they said Toy Story quality graphics, which is
proabably
> > > >possible in a tech demo or cut scene(seen DOA2`s?) in the furture,
not a
> > > >game though. And not even 10 x-box`s linked up to a super cray
> > mainframe
> > > >could produce actual photo-realistic graphics, that a decade away at
> > least.
> > > >
> > > >The graphics are certainly a leap over the DC`s when programmed
properly,
> > > >RRV craps all over any DC racer. And you have to compare the PS2`s
> > current
> > > >games to the DC`s jap launch games (NOT the US launch) to see how
much
> > > >better they are.
> > > >Compare the awesome(yet still first generation) DOA2 to Virtua
Fighter
> > 3tb
> > > >for a fair comparison.
> > > >It`s no point mentioning the poor PS2 titles because any system can
have
> > > >crap graphics if you program it that way, even the x-box will have
some
> > > >stinkers at launch.
> > > >
> > > >>"photo-realistic graphics" and that it would be a leap over the
> > Dreamcast.
> > > >>They have failed.
> > > >>> Oh, and what's so misleading about the specs?
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>> --
> > > >>> Please read the Official FAQ at:
> > > >>> http://www.obsidian.wizkids.co.uk/newsgroups/ps2faq.txt
> > > >>>
> > > >>> <954105444.22853.0...@news.demon.co.uk>...
> > > >>> >Jeez! You're talking out of you arse again. The PS2s hardware
isn't
> > > >>flawed,
> > > >>> >who the hell said this? The deal with the saturn is completely
> > > different
> > > >>> >because that was the same console. The PSX and PS2 are completely
> > > >>different
> > > >>> >consoles. The only developers that are moaning about the design
of
> > the
> > > >>PS2
> > > >>> >are the ones that can't program properly. All the others see the
> > > >benefits
> > > >>> of
> > > >>> >the way it is designed.
> > > >>> >
> > > >>> >
> > > >>> >--
> > > >>> >Please read the Official FAQ at:
> > > >>> >http://www.obsidian.wizkids.co.uk/newsgroups/ps2faq.txt
> > > >>> >
> > > >>> >>ps2 games. Factor this in with the hype and downright misleading
> > specs
> > > >>and
> > > >>> >>you have the answer to the question "what is wrong with the ps2.
> > > >>> ><snip>
> > > >>> >
> > > >>> >
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
joey
joey
for some developers, and even if it was it would only do so much at this
time. Looks like another saturn to me, unless it really takes off in
America. The U. K. and Europe will not boost sales that much.news:mE8E4.556$VE1....@news3.cableinet.net...
>
> joey wrote in message ...
Carl221
>you see that leap with VF3Tb? With Godzilla? With Pen Pen? I don't
>think so.
Yes you did, VF3 and Pen Pen run in 640x480 / 60 fps / textures smoothed etc
etc..
The DC was a much bigger leap to PSX / N64 than PS2 to DC. Even the launch
titles were.
Carl221
They dont look better.
TXR - 60 fps , no jaggies, not too many details.
Sega GT 30 fps, no jaggies, great details.
RR5 60fps , huge jaggies, great details
There is no winner here.
The Fuzz
although personally I don't think it's all that necessary, and the 4meg
vram (eram? evram? evrbram? it's all just getting too much for me...) is
just that -- a stumbling block. There are ways around it, and not just
by streaming textures off the disk. It was a conscious decision by Sony
to trade size for bandwidth, and although I don't know all THAT much
about the benefits of one over the other, I'm willing to put my money on
Sony.
joey wrote:
>
> In my opinion, the design is flawed. 1st gen games that have A-A problems is
> a sign, developers bitching about the design is a sign, only 4m texture
> memory is one of the stumbling blocks. And yes, i do realize that the ps and
> ps2 a diff. consoles. Your point?> news:954105444.22853.0...@news.demon.co.uk...
> > Jeez! You're talking out of you arse again. The PS2s hardware isn't
> flawed,
> > who the hell said this? The deal with the saturn is completely different
> > because that was the same console. The PSX and PS2 are completely
> different
> > consoles. The only developers that are moaning about the design of the PS2
> > are the ones that can't program properly. All the others see the benefits
> of
> > the way it is designed.
> >
> > Greg.
> >
> > --
> > Please read the Official FAQ at:
> > http://www.obsidian.wizkids.co.uk/newsgroups/ps2faq.txt
> >
> > >then the ps was announced with it's use of polygons? At that point the
> > >saturn was "upgraded" to compete and eclipse the ps. The result was a
> > >console that was a nightmare to program for. The same thing happened with
> > >the ps2, and now the ps2 owners are saying things like, wait until the
> > >emotion engine is harnessed, wait until the 2nd or 3rd gen. games. The
> > ps2's
> > >design is flawed, developers are having a hard time implementing
> > >anti-aliasing in the games? Bad design.
> > > And all the while the dreamcast has games that look better or equal to
> the
> > >ps2 games. Factor this in with the hype and downright misleading specs
> and
> > >you have the answer to the question "what is wrong with the ps2.
> > <snip>
> >
> >
--
-"And after that, my guess is you'll never hear from him again"-
*The Fuzz*
mmmmm...spamalicious!
Guess what to remove if you *really*
want to e-mail me...
The Fuzz
distinctly recall the term 'televisual quality' being bandied about,
which pretty much amounts to the same thing. Not that I actually
expected Sony to deliver on such a promise, but they DID say it.
Greg Nolle wrote:
>
> But they didn't. They promised Toy Story-quality graphics which isn't
> exactly photo-realistic (ie. like real life) and as TheHut explained the
> cut-scenes are Toy Story-quality.
>
> Greg.
>
> --
> Please read the Official FAQ at:
> http://www.obsidian.wizkids.co.uk/newsgroups/ps2faq.txt
>
> joey wrote in message ...
> >You are missing the point alltogether. Sony hyped photo-realistic, they did
> >not deliver.
--
Jun
least comparable on a PC. However, as games, were those considered
"leaps" above the current games on PSX or N64? Not largly by the gaming
community. It is so commonly known that Japanese launch titles don't
display all of the consoles' abilities - so anyone who thinks the PS2
has shown all it can do is a fool (or better yet a troll.) If I were to
look at pen pen and godzilla in DC's first month in Japan and blatantly
claim that it sucked and it would never get any better, would I have
been correct? Think about it.
Jun
DC's first day launch titles? VF3tb wasn't, Pen Pen wasn't, July
wasn't, and Godzilla wasn't. So please enlighten me - what game was
multiplayer?
joey wrote:
>
> Um, there was online gaming in Japan at launch.
> Jun <NOamoxi...@homeSPAM.com> wrote in message
> news:38E04A13...@homeSPAM.com...
> > So you can tell that the company lied and can **NEVER** achieve what
> > they promised after less that a month on the market? Did they promise
> > "photo realistic" or "toy story" graphics **at launch**? Sega promised
> > online gaming - just cause it wasn't there at launch meant that they
> > would never fulfill that promise? I think Chu Chu (very far from
> > launch) proves that they came through. Not all things happen right away
> > - these things take time. Think about it.
> >
> >
> >
> > joey wrote:
> > >
> > > You are missing the point alltogether. Sony hyped photo-realistic, they
> did
> > > not deliver.
> > > Greg Nolle <gr...@nolle.co.uk> wrote in message
> > > news:954170373.26831.0...@news.demon.co.uk...
> > > > Well said man!
> > > >
> > > > Greg.
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > Please read the Official FAQ at:
> > > > http://www.obsidian.wizkids.co.uk/newsgroups/ps2faq.txt
> > > >
> > > > >joey wrote in message ...
> > > > >>Specs are what they are. Sony maintaned that they would produce
> > > > >>"photo-realistic graphics" and that it would be a leap over the
> > > Dreamcast.
> > > > >>They have failed.
> > > > >>Greg Nolle <gr...@nolle.co.uk> wrote in message
> > > > >>news:954105626.22948.0...@news.demon.co.uk...
> > > > >>> Oh, and what's so misleading about the specs?
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>> Greg.
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>> --
> > > > >>> Please read the Official FAQ at:
> > > > >>> http://www.obsidian.wizkids.co.uk/newsgroups/ps2faq.txt
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>> Greg Nolle wrote in message
> > > > >>> <954105444.22853.0...@news.demon.co.uk>...
> > > > >>> >Jeez! You're talking out of you arse again. The PS2s hardware
> isn't
> > > > >>flawed,
> > > > >>> >who the hell said this? The deal with the saturn is completely
> > > > different
> > > > >>> >because that was the same console. The PSX and PS2 are completely
> > > > >>different
> > > > >>> >consoles. The only developers that are moaning about the design
> of
> > > the
> > > > >>PS2
> > > > >>> >are the ones that can't program properly. All the others see the
> > > > >benefits
> > > > >>> of
> > > > >>> >the way it is designed.
> > > > >>> >
> > > > >>> >Greg.
> > > > >>> >
> > > > >>> >--
> > > > >>> >Please read the Official FAQ at:
> > > > >>> >http://www.obsidian.wizkids.co.uk/newsgroups/ps2faq.txt
> > > > >>> >
> > > > >>> >joey wrote in message ...
joey
The Fuzz <randr...@ozemail.com.au> wrote in message
news:38E1A0B8...@ozemail.com.au...
> While I don't know about the phrase 'photo realistic' being used, I do
> distinctly recall the term 'televisual quality' being bandied about,
> which pretty much amounts to the same thing. Not that I actually
> expected Sony to deliver on such a promise, but they DID say it.
>
> Greg Nolle wrote:
> >
> > But they didn't. They promised Toy Story-quality graphics which isn't
> > exactly photo-realistic (ie. like real life) and as TheHut explained the
> > cut-scenes are Toy Story-quality.
> >
> >
> > --
> > Please read the Official FAQ at:
> > http://www.obsidian.wizkids.co.uk/newsgroups/ps2faq.txt
> >
> > joey wrote in message ...
did
> > >not deliver.
>
joey
(seriously premature) add up to a obviously flawed design in my book.news:38E19DF6...@ozemail.com.au...
> Personally, I wouldn't call the design flawed. AA will happen,
> although personally I don't think it's all that necessary, and the 4meg
> vram (eram? evram? evrbram? it's all just getting too much for me...) is
> just that -- a stumbling block. There are ways around it, and not just
> by streaming textures off the disk. It was a conscious decision by Sony
> to trade size for bandwidth, and although I don't know all THAT much
> about the benefits of one over the other, I'm willing to put my money on
> Sony.
> joey wrote:
> >
> > In my opinion, the design is flawed. 1st gen games that have A-A
problems is
> > a sign, developers bitching about the design is a sign, only 4m texture
> > memory is one of the stumbling blocks. And yes, i do realize that the ps
and
> > ps2 a diff. consoles. Your point?
> > > Jeez! You're talking out of you arse again. The PS2s hardware isn't
> > flawed,
> > > who the hell said this? The deal with the saturn is completely
different
> > > because that was the same console. The PSX and PS2 are completely
> > different
> > > consoles. The only developers that are moaning about the design of the
PS2
> > > are the ones that can't program properly. All the others see the
benefits
> > of
> > > the way it is designed.
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > Please read the Official FAQ at:
> > > http://www.obsidian.wizkids.co.uk/newsgroups/ps2faq.txt
> > >
> > > joey wrote in message ...
and
> > > >then the ps was announced with it's use of polygons? At that point
the
> > > >saturn was "upgraded" to compete and eclipse the ps. The result was a
> > > >console that was a nightmare to program for. The same thing happened
with
> > > >the ps2, and now the ps2 owners are saying things like, wait until
the
> > > >emotion engine is harnessed, wait until the 2nd or 3rd gen. games.
The
> > > ps2's
> > > >design is flawed, developers are having a hard time implementing
> > > >anti-aliasing in the games? Bad design.
> > > > And all the while the dreamcast has games that look better or equal
to
> > the
> > > >ps2 games. Factor this in with the hype and downright misleading
specs
> > and
> > > >you have the answer to the question "what is wrong with the ps2.
> > > <snip>
> > >
> > >
>
>
joey
though. Just my opinion
Carl221 <car...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20000328234406...@ng-fg1.aol.com...
joey
can play without having my eyes burned out. Try to play Madden 2000 after
playing NKL2K for the Dreamcast, you will laugh your ass off at the
playstations attempts at a decent frame rate or the inability to even see
your players. Get a grip fanboy.
Jun <NOamoxi...@homeSPAM.com> wrote in message
> Okay, and who said there won't be a leap. You're comparing 1st gen PS2
> games to 2nd and 3rd gen DC games and there isn't much difference.
> People have been saying "there's barely a difference" between PS2 and DC
> graphics - Well, if japanese PS2 launch titles look that good, then
> imagine how good they will look when they have more time to develop the
> games -when they harness the hardware. Sega promised a leap too, did
> you see that leap with VF3Tb? With Godzilla? With Pen Pen? I don't
> would talk about it, and if no one talked about it, then only a small
> amount of people would know about it. Hype is a way to get more people
> to buy. It's those who don't take it with a grain of salt that end up
> dissappointed. You know, I wish you'd wake up from your anti-sony state
> of mind - many already have. I just don't understand why you tell
> everyone they shouldn't buy a PS2 - if you don't like it that's fine,
> don't get one, but don't tell me or anyone else what to buy or what not
> to like. We all have our own opinions, and yours obviously differs, I
> respect that, can you respect mine? Think about it.
>
>
>
> joey wrote:
> >
> > I wish you people would just wake up. Sony promised a leap, a step up,
they
> > flat out lied. These threads should not even exist. If they delivered
what
> > was said they were you would not be speaking of "fanboys" or "just you
wait"
> > or "it's the develeprs fault". Now, i must get back to Shen Mue. <BFG>
> > > >> you have the answer to the question "what is wrong with the ps2.
> > > >
The Fuzz
team) overlooked or ignored something. All of these flaws (and yes, I
agree, they are flaws: no console will ever be perfect) seem to me to
have been left unfixed for a reason, a trade-off of one kind or another
(performance, time etc.). But I wouldn't call these flaws serious, and
I wouldn't call them design flaws. I know it sounds like I'm getting
pedantic, but you're making the people who designed the PS2 sound
incompetent, and I just don't think that they are.
> specs
> > > and
> > > > >you have the answer to the question "what is wrong with the ps2.
Jun
Nowhere did I ever talk about PSX games having better visuals than DC
games - nowhere. If I ever did a PSX comparison, it would be in
gameplay - if it were a graphics comparison, it would be between the 1st
gen PSX games and the 2nd gen PSX games. If you can't admit that PSX
games (and Saturn games for that matter) didn't get better visuals as
time progressed. It's true with the DC too - Why the hell can't you see
that? Why the hell do you insist the PS2 has shown all that it can do?
By doing so you are the fanboy that has to get a grip.
> > > > >> Factor this in with the hype and downright misleading specs and
> > > > >> you have the answer to the question "what is wrong with the ps2.
> > > > >
The Fuzz
joey wrote:
>
> Your expectations are irrelevant.
> The Fuzz <randr...@ozemail.com.au> wrote in message
> news:38E1A0B8...@ozemail.com.au...
> > While I don't know about the phrase 'photo realistic' being used, I do
> > distinctly recall the term 'televisual quality' being bandied about,
> > which pretty much amounts to the same thing. Not that I actually
> > expected Sony to deliver on such a promise, but they DID say it.
> >
> > Greg Nolle wrote:
> > >
> > > But they didn't. They promised Toy Story-quality graphics which isn't
> > > exactly photo-realistic (ie. like real life) and as TheHut explained the
> > > cut-scenes are Toy Story-quality.
> > >
> > > Greg.
> > >
> > > --
> > > Please read the Official FAQ at:
> > > http://www.obsidian.wizkids.co.uk/newsgroups/ps2faq.txt
> > >
> > > joey wrote in message ...
> > > >You are missing the point alltogether. Sony hyped photo-realistic, they
> did
> > > >not deliver.
> >
CoolColJ
--
-----------------------------------------------------------------
CCJ
BLITZ_Force
My HomePage -----> http://www.geocities.com/coolcolj
Updated - 3/3/2000
The Fuzz <randrSPAMAL...@ozemail.com.au> wrote in message
news:38E1B43D...@ozemail.com.au...
CoolColJ
In a car game, these are the things I look for, tyre marks, tyre smoke,
reflections of car body, sun light reflecting of car, with glare efffects,
heat ripple effect
suspension effects and motion, brake disc glow, depiction of driver, exhaust
pop and flames, feeling of speed, simulation of torque, long draw distance,
amount of scenery detail.
ok which of the above 3 games do all of these and which does them better?
Then you have the winner ;)
-----------------------------------------------------------------
CCJ
BLITZ_Force
My HomePage -----> http://www.geocities.com/coolcolj
Updated - 3/3/2000
joey <mo...@ev1.net> wrote in message
news:4iiE4.18950$w81.1...@typhoon.austin.rr.com...
Ste Birmo
> > > no way to get online....
>
[Greg]
> > Bullshit and you know it! I'm not even going to bother to explain
> > what's wrong with this because you know.
>
> Really? Do you have a special ps2 that can get online?
You're making a fool out of yourself again Joey.
Ste Birmo
> Don't you get it by now?
No.
> The system is flawed, middleware is not an option for some developers,
> and even if it was it would only do so much at this time.
Just how big is your wooden spoon?
> Looks like another saturn to me, unless it really takes off in America.
> The U. K. and Europe will not boost sales that much.
Talking out of your arse again I see, as PlayStation is bigger here in
Europe than it is in America. Sony's UK MD predicts that, at launch,
PS2 will sell ten times more than PS1 did. He's wrong! - it will sell
at least 20 times more.
Greg Nolle
Greg.
--
Please read the Official FAQ at:
http://www.obsidian.wizkids.co.uk/newsgroups/ps2faq.txt
joey wrote in message <4mfE4.18911$w81.1...@typhoon.austin.rr.com>...
>Your fantasies are frankly embarassing.
>Greg Nolle <gr...@nolle.co.uk> wrote in message
>news:954257268.29224.0...@news.demon.co.uk...
>> Ha! <sarcasm>Yes, I really love Sony. I dream about the Sony logo every
>> night in bed!</sarcasm> lol!
>>
>> Greg.
>>
>> --
>> Please read the Official FAQ at:
>> http://www.obsidian.wizkids.co.uk/newsgroups/ps2faq.txt
>>
>> joey wrote in message <26XD4.15238$w81.1...@typhoon.austin.rr.com>...
>> >I could care less about you thoughts on my posts. You are probably just
>> >overreacting out of your love for sony <g>
>> >Greg Nolle <gr...@nolle.co.uk> wrote in message
>> >news:954170309.26797.0...@news.demon.co.uk...
>> >> Hate for Sony is my guess. Don't take this the wrong way Joey but that
>> >tends
>> >> to be the way you post in this group (anti-Sony).
>> >>
>> >> Greg.
>> >>
>> >> --
>> >> Please read the Official FAQ at:
>> >> http://www.obsidian.wizkids.co.uk/newsgroups/ps2faq.txt
>> >>
joey
something they should back it up, don't take it personal <g>
The Fuzz <randrSPAMAL...@ozemail.com.au> wrote in message
news:38E1B43D...@ozemail.com.au...
> Umm... I was actually trying to back you up there -- why get so narcky?
>
> joey wrote:
> >
> > Your expectations are irrelevant.
> > The Fuzz <randr...@ozemail.com.au> wrote in message
> > news:38E1A0B8...@ozemail.com.au...
> > > While I don't know about the phrase 'photo realistic' being used, I do
> > > distinctly recall the term 'televisual quality' being bandied about,
> > > which pretty much amounts to the same thing. Not that I actually
> > > expected Sony to deliver on such a promise, but they DID say it.
> > >
> > > Greg Nolle wrote:
> > > >
> > > > But they didn't. They promised Toy Story-quality graphics which
isn't
> > > > exactly photo-realistic (ie. like real life) and as TheHut explained
the
> > > > cut-scenes are Toy Story-quality.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > Please read the Official FAQ at:
> > > > http://www.obsidian.wizkids.co.uk/newsgroups/ps2faq.txt
> > > >
Greg Nolle
those rolled into one make Joey. He turns on you even when you back him up.
Maybe he'll start rooting for the PS2 now! :)
Greg.
--
Please read the Official FAQ at:
http://www.obsidian.wizkids.co.uk/newsgroups/ps2faq.txt
The Fuzz wrote in message <38E1B43D...@ozemail.com.au>...
joey
> To state that something is a design flaw implies that they (the PS2
> team) overlooked or ignored something. All of these flaws (and yes, I
> agree, they are flaws: no console will ever be perfect) seem to me to
> have been left unfixed for a reason, a trade-off of one kind or another
> (performance, time etc.). But I wouldn't call these flaws serious, and
> I wouldn't call them design flaws. I know it sounds like I'm getting
> pedantic, but you're making the people who designed the PS2 sound
> incompetent, and I just don't think that they are.
> joey wrote:
> >
> > That problem, the memory texture limitations, and middleware situation
> > (seriously premature) add up to a obviously flawed design in my book.
> > > Personally, I wouldn't call the design flawed. AA will happen,
> > > although personally I don't think it's all that necessary, and the
4meg
> > > vram (eram? evram? evrbram? it's all just getting too much for me...)
is
> > > just that -- a stumbling block. There are ways around it, and not
just
> > > by streaming textures off the disk. It was a conscious decision by
Sony
> > > to trade size for bandwidth, and although I don't know all THAT much
> > > about the benefits of one over the other, I'm willing to put my money
on
> > > Sony.
> > > joey wrote:
> > > >
> > > > In my opinion, the design is flawed. 1st gen games that have A-A
> > problems is
> > > > a sign, developers bitching about the design is a sign, only 4m
texture
> > > > memory is one of the stumbling blocks. And yes, i do realize that
the ps
> > and
> > > > ps2 a diff. consoles. Your point?
> > > > > Jeez! You're talking out of you arse again. The PS2s hardware
isn't
> > > > flawed,
> > > > > who the hell said this? The deal with the saturn is completely
> > different
> > > > > because that was the same console. The PSX and PS2 are completely
> > > > different
> > > > > consoles. The only developers that are moaning about the design of
the
> > PS2
> > > > > are the ones that can't program properly. All the others see the
> > benefits
> > > > of
> > > > > the way it is designed.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > --
> > > > > Please read the Official FAQ at:
> > > > > http://www.obsidian.wizkids.co.uk/newsgroups/ps2faq.txt
> > > > >
> > > > > joey wrote in message ...
go
> > and
> > > > > >then the ps was announced with it's use of polygons? At that
point
> > the
> > > > > >saturn was "upgraded" to compete and eclipse the ps. The result
was a
> > > > > >console that was a nightmare to program for. The same thing
happened
> > with
> > > > > >the ps2, and now the ps2 owners are saying things like, wait
until
> > the
> > > > > >emotion engine is harnessed, wait until the 2nd or 3rd gen.
games.
> > The
> > > > > ps2's
> > > > > >design is flawed, developers are having a hard time implementing
> > > > > >anti-aliasing in the games? Bad design.
> > > > > > And all the while the dreamcast has games that look better or
equal
> > to
> > > > the
> > specs
> > > > and
> > > > > >you have the answer to the question "what is wrong with the ps2.
joey
> >you see that leap with VF3Tb? With Godzilla? With Pen Pen? I don't
> >think so.
>
Jun <NOamoxi...@homeSPAM.com> wrote in message
joey
joey
Greg Nolle
--
Please read the Official FAQ at:
http://www.obsidian.wizkids.co.uk/newsgroups/ps2faq.txt
joey wrote in message <75fE4.18900$w81.1...@typhoon.austin.rr.com>...
>Really?
>Ste Birmo <steb...@cableinet.co.uk> wrote in message
>news:or7E4.430$VE1....@news3.cableinet.net...
>> joey <mo...@ev1.net> wrote in message:
>> > 2 controller ports, no way to get online, and games that are
>> > eclipsed by a year old console is NOT a step up in my eyes.
>>
>> Now you're just being stupid.
>>
>>
>>
>
>
Greg Nolle
>> you have 8 which is more than any other console.
>
>I don't think so, 4 should be there in my opinion.
As you've said before: you're opinions are irrelevant, to be frank.
Ultimately the PS2 offers more controller ports than any other console.
Period.
>
>Bullshit and you know it! I'm not even going to bother to explain what's
>> wrong with this because you know (online Problem)
>
>Really? Do you have a special ps2 that can get online?
No, nobody does. But, unless you've had your head in the sand (which you
probably have), then you would know that Sony have designed the PS2 to be
compatible with broadband internet which is much better than dial-up and IS
the internet of the future.
>
>and games that are eclipsed by a
>> >year old console is NOT a step up in my eyes.
>>
>> What are you going on about now?
>
>Going on about? I stand by my statement
Yes, but I don't understand your statement!
Greg.
---
Please read the Official FAQ at:
http://www.obsidian.wizkids.co.uk/newsgroups/ps2faq.txt
>
<snip>
Greg Nolle
Greg.
--
Please read the Official FAQ at:
http://www.obsidian.wizkids.co.uk/newsgroups/ps2faq.txt
joey wrote in message <1gfE4.18905$w81.1...@typhoon.austin.rr.com>...
>Fanboys? Get real.