"rai yu" pronounciation debate
David Boudreau
Yukihiko Saisuke Saito wrote:
>
> dbou...@lynx.dac.neu.edu (David Boudreau) wrote:
>
> >and who the hell are YOU to decide that?! there is no instance of
> >letter r followed by y followed by u in the english language.
> >there is no instance of even "ry" in the english, except in the word
> >"rye". not 100% sure of this but i'd be most surprised if you could
> >find another "ry" word.
>
> Try "cry".
>
> "avery".
> Let's see... try "every".
ok. i am most surprised, these words did not come to mind....
> Oh, wait... I know what you are going to say. It's at the END of the
> word, so it doesn't count, right?
>
> Position does not matter, Boudreau.
>
> You said the "ry" doesn't exist in the English language, aside from
> the word "rye". I proved you wrong. I'm pretty sure I can think of
> some more words, but these four words are what came off of the top of
> my head.
>
> Boudreau, every time you speak, you make a fool out of yourself.
>
> James Yukihiko Saito
> jsa...@ucsd.edu
i phrased my wording poorly. you are right, there are such words with
"ry" in them in the english language, ones that are even pronounced
"ree". however, i DO believe that position does matter, as far as
"ryu" pronounciation is concerned. why? because in the words
you cited as "ry" being pronounced like "rye", you FAIL to realize one
basic difference from these words and ones like "every" and "avery".
that difference lies in the fact that, in words like "try", "cry" and
"dry", the ry word is one syllable. in the other examples, those ry
words ("every"), NOT ONLY are those words mulitple syllables (affecting
pronounciation), but in them, the "y" in the "ry" instance acts as a
vowel. in the "dry"-type words, the ENTIRE WORD is ONE syllable
(like "rye").
to a japanese person that speaks japanese natively, this is a difficult
concept to understand, as the specific points about syllables and vowels
can be extremely confusing. this is because japanese only has ONE way
to pronounce each of it's five vowels a,i,u,e, and o. in english, there
are not only MULTIPLE ways to pronounce EACH of ITS vowels (a, e, i, o,
u, AND SOMETIMES Y), many instances of phonics include arangements of
consonants and vowels together that are identical when pronounced out
loud.
"ryu" looks mostly like the word "rye" to me, and though i may KNOW the
word "ryu" has absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with the english word
"rye", most people will understand the connection with pronouncing it
as "rai yu" right away. when we americans see this word, we see a
structure containing a y followed by a u. is it 2 syllables or just 1?
if we go with 1 syllable, we are forced to make a sound inaudible to
most american-english speaking people in arcades-- this is especially
true if you actually DO pronounce it in a japanese accent, btw. if you
choose to break it up into 2 syllables, "rai" and "yu", you ensure to
include both the "u" vowel, and also the "y" as a likely vowel, and
people know what the fuck you're talking about.
david boudreau
dbou...@lynx.dac.neu.edu
dk
David Boudreau wrote:
>
> Yukihiko Saisuke Saito wrote:
> >
> > dbou...@lynx.dac.neu.edu (David Boudreau) wrote:
> >
> > >and who the hell are YOU to decide that?! there is no instance of
> > >letter r followed by y followed by u in the english language.
> > >there is no instance of even "ry" in the english, except in the word
> > >"rye". not 100% sure of this but i'd be most surprised if you could
> > >find another "ry" word.
> >
> > Try "cry".
> >
> > "avery".
> > Let's see... try "every".
hell, try "try" ;)
.
David Boudreau
Allen Jameson Klein <aj...@andrew.cmu.edu> wrote:
>>> >Mat Findlay wrote:
>>> >> The Japanese, in using a term like "aisu kurimu," are coming _AS
CLOSE
>>> >> AS THEY POSSIBLY CAN_
>>> > How little credit you give them. What a racist comment, too.
>>>
>>> My point was that "aisu kurimu" is closer to Ice Cream then RYE-You
is
>>> to Ryu. Do you care to explain to me how this is a racist comment,
>>> Dave?
>>>
>>> Try reading the entire post next time.
>>Dave? Try reading the "From:" field next time.
>I did. I think you missed what I was getting at.
uh, yeah well i missed it to there smart guy. i am not the one who said
"how little credit you give them. what a racist comment, too". that
was shaun. i don't fake my email address as shaun's (unlike SOME people
in this thread). i am also getting a little sick of you (specifically)
in this thread, and responding to much anything that you're writing
about. this came about with your post on trying to "inform" mr. tanaka
about how alex valle pronounces his name.
but SINCE you seem to be requesting my personal touch on the matter,
i'll give it to you. i am in totally agreement with shaun, and yes i
CAN explain how this is a racist comment
thatwasprobablymaLICIOUSlydirectedatthegoodpeopleinjapanyouRACIST!.
you said:
> >> The Japanese, in using a term like "aisu kurimu," are coming _AS
> >> CLOSE AS THEY POSSIBLY CAN_
it is unclear (maybe just to ME cause i'm such a moron) what the "THEY"
in "_AS CLOSE AS THEY POSSIBLY CAN_" means. we like to, as you said,
"give you the benefit of the doubt" in this debate and just assume you
are refering to the japanese language, instead of the japanese people
(there is a difference, big guy).
but, since this _is_, after all, a debate of linguistics and all about
linguistics... one just HAS to wonder... why you would use "they" to
refer to the japanese language? you obviously know english well enough
to think about linguistics, don't you? otherwise you wouldn't have
gotten involved with this entire debate to begin with (let alone carry
on with those continuing to debate). since your english-speaking skills
and abilities are not even QUESTIONED in such a debate as this one, why
on EARTH would you say "they"? why why why why why why why? unless...
unless... oh my GAWD... oh no... aw shit... AUGHHHHHH SHIT... UNLESS you
were, IN FACT referring to the japanese PEOPLE and not the japanese
_language_ when you said "they"! holy shit... it HAS to be, it doesn't
make sense any other way, because otherwise he doens't even know shit
about english.
you know i once saw this episode of ripley's believe-it-or-not, a long
time ago, and it had this really fat guy with short hair, and his thing
was, he could put a cherry in his mouth, with the stem, and he could eat
the cherry and tie the stem into a knot with his tongue. are you that
guy?
david boudreau
dbou...@lynx.dac.neu.edu
Allen Jameson Klein
Excerpts from netnews.alt.games.sf2: 28-Nov-96 "rai yu" pronounciation
debate by David Boud...@lynx.dac.
> "how little credit you give them. what a racist comment, too". that
> was shaun. i don't fake my email address as shaun's (unlike SOME people
> in this thread). i am also getting a little sick of you (specifically)
> in this thread, and responding to much anything that you're writing
> about. this came about with your post on trying to "inform" mr. tanaka
> about how alex valle pronounces his name.
Mat Findlay: has definately been rude. It _is_ kinda frustrating to
argue with you, sir... I think you can excuse findlay for the drop in
politeness, ok? ^_^
Shaun McIsaac: seems to be the dumbest person to ever get a 'net
account. No excusing him for anything: he's a fuck-up.
> but, since this _is_, after all, a debate of linguistics and all about
> linguistics... one just HAS to wonder... why you would use "they" to
> refer to the japanese language? you obviously know english well enough
> to think about linguistics, don't you? otherwise you wouldn't have
> gotten involved with this entire debate to begin with (let alone carry
> on with those continuing to debate). since your english-speaking skills
> and abilities are not even QUESTIONED in such a debate as this one, why
> on EARTH would you say "they"? why why why why why why why? unless...
> unless... oh my GAWD... oh no... aw shit... AUGHHHHHH SHIT... UNLESS you
> were, IN FACT referring to the japanese PEOPLE and not the japanese
> _language_ when you said "they"! holy shit... it HAS to be, it doesn't
> make sense any other way, because otherwise he doens't even know shit
> about english.
I dunno:
"Using those shotguns, they are going to kill some ducks."
Dave Boudreau asks: what? They are going to use their bare hands to
kill the ducks? Why not use a gun or something? Buncha morons!
^_^ Anyway...
Speaking Japanese, they come as close as they can get with "aisu whatever."
Speaking English, they'll say something more like the actual "ICE CREAM."
Speaking English, they (different they :-) *DO NOT* come as close as
they can get with rye-you.
al
--
allen j. klein YR3VALSN1SS yan...@cmu.edu 3N1PPAH don't goad th' toad
Mat Findlay
dbou...@lynx.dac.neu.edu (David Boudreau) wrote:
>uh, yeah well i missed it to there smart guy. i am not the one who said
>"how little credit you give them. what a racist comment, too". that
>was shaun. i don't fake my email address as shaun's (unlike SOME people
>in this thread). i am also getting a little sick of you (specifically)
>in this thread, and responding to much anything that you're writing
>about. this came about with your post on trying to "inform" mr. tanaka
>about how alex valle pronounces his name.
I never accused you of faking an address, did I? Why are you so
defensive? I just make a crack that he was sounding a lot like you.
Your reaction may get other people to question your validity, though.
As for me "informing" Mr. Tanaka about the pronounciation of Valle...
Well, as far as I was concerned, that was a level discussion about the
pronounciation of a word, much more intellectual than the one the
entire group is having with you. I happen to know the Spanish and
French pronounciations...
>but SINCE you seem to be requesting my personal touch on the matter,
>i'll give it to you. i am in totally agreement with shaun, and yes i
>CAN explain how this is a racist comment
>thatwasprobablymaLICIOUSlydirectedatthegoodpeopleinjapanyouRACIST!.
>you said:
>> >> The Japanese, in using a term like "aisu kurimu," are coming _AS
>> >> CLOSE AS THEY POSSIBLY CAN_
>it is unclear (maybe just to ME cause i'm such a moron) what the "THEY"
>in "_AS CLOSE AS THEY POSSIBLY CAN_" means. we like to, as you said,
>"give you the benefit of the doubt" in this debate and just assume you
>are refering to the japanese language, instead of the japanese people
>(there is a difference, big guy).
Well, since the debate is about the language, why would you take a
post any other way?
>but, since this _is_, after all, a debate of linguistics and all about
>linguistics... one just HAS to wonder... why you would use "they" to
>refer to the japanese language?
I meant "they" as in "those who only speak the language."
>you obviously know english well enough
>to think about linguistics, don't you?
But even the best literary genius makes mistakes. The fact is that I
can admit my mistakes.
>otherwise you wouldn't have
>gotten involved with this entire debate to begin with (let alone carry
>on with those continuing to debate). since your english-speaking skills
>and abilities are not even QUESTIONED in such a debate as this one, why
>on EARTH would you say "they"? why why why why why why why? unless...
>unless... oh my GAWD... oh no... aw shit... AUGHHHHHH SHIT... UNLESS you
>were, IN FACT referring to the japanese PEOPLE and not the japanese
>_language_ when you said "they"! holy shit... it HAS to be, it doesn't
>make sense any other way, because otherwise he doens't even know shit
>about english.
Like I said... Simple mistake. When I said "they," I assumed people
would realize I was talking about the people that were speaking that
language, and none other. I realize now I should have clarified that.
Perhaps I should have said "That's the closest a unilingual Japanese
person can come to saying Ice Cream without practicing certain sounds
in the English language which are used in saying Ice Cream." Of
course, that's a little unweildy, isn't it?
>you know i once saw this episode of ripley's believe-it-or-not, a long
>time ago, and it had this really fat guy with short hair, and his thing
>was, he could put a cherry in his mouth, with the stem, and he could eat
>the cherry and tie the stem into a knot with his tongue. are you that
>guy?
No, but based on your past claims, I'm sure you've told some people
that you were.
Interestingly enough, I once heard of a guy that could shove his head
so far up his ass that he'd stop thinking. Be careful when you sit
down, Dave.
"A man has two things in this world... His word, and his balls...
Or is that three things?"
-Jeff Goldblum - Deep Cover
Take it EEZ...
Mat. <tet...@interlog.com>
Mat Findlay
Allen Jameson Klein <aj...@andrew.cmu.edu> wrote:
>Excerpts from netnews.alt.games.sf2: 28-Nov-96 "rai yu" pronounciation
>debate by David Boud...@lynx.dac.
>> uh, yeah well i missed it to there smart guy. i am not the one who said
>> "how little credit you give them. what a racist comment, too". that
>> was shaun. i don't fake my email address as shaun's (unlike SOME people
>> in this thread). i am also getting a little sick of you (specifically)
>> in this thread, and responding to much anything that you're writing
>> about. this came about with your post on trying to "inform" mr. tanaka
>> about how alex valle pronounces his name.
>Mat Findlay: has definately been rude.
Well, I didn't intend to be rude to anyone other than those people who
deserved it, namely Dave Boudreau and his pal Shaun.
> It _is_ kinda frustrating to
>argue with you, sir... I think you can excuse findlay for the drop in
>politeness, ok? ^_^
Well, thanks for the support.
>I dunno:
>"Using those shotguns, they are going to kill some ducks."
>Dave Boudreau asks: what? They are going to use their bare hands to
>kill the ducks? Why not use a gun or something? Buncha morons!
>^_^ Anyway...
>Speaking Japanese, they come as close as they can get with "aisu whatever."
>Speaking English, they'll say something more like the actual "ICE CREAM."
>Speaking English, they (different they :-) *DO NOT* come as close as
>they can get with rye-you.
Okay, so I was right in assuming those of us in this Newsgroup with a
brain could understand what I said... Here I thought I was actually
slipping.
Mat Findlay
"derek" <dho...@lnx.dac.neu.edu> wrote:
>As for me, I feel this isn't where the problem lies. I agree with that part
>about not coming as close as we can. I can say ryu as close to its actual
>pronounciation. But you forgot to write in the 'Speaking English' part,
>that they are speaking to other English Speaking people, who all grew up
>knowing our fellow shotokaner as rye-you. I think the real debate lies in
>what one should we say. I have freinds majoring in Japanesse who still
>chose to say rye-you for sheer convience.
I don't know so much about everyone learning to say "Rye-you." In
different areas in Toronto, different people pronounced the name
differently. What gets me is that the whole time, the machine was
sitting there saying the friggin name correctly the whole time, and
everyone ignored it.
>Like English speaking people can get away without trying to keep actual
>pronounciation. I can get my point made by saying rye-you.
Unfortunately, I think you have a point. Whether or not it's right or
wrong, it's understood... Of course, it's still not correct... Just
understood.
>As for ice cream, it is opposite. A japanesse speaking person has to try to
>say aisu kareamu (whatever) to get his point across. If he doesnt say it,
>nobody save other Japanesse speaking people understand him/her. Anyone see
>my point here?
From what I understand, aisu kurimu is the actual Japanese term for
Ice Cream... It's kind of like when you're watching Spanish
television, and suddenly you hear a few English words... Some terms
come from English, and other languages just use the common terms from
English... Especially if whatever they are referring to is big in
English/American culture...
Although there's some nagging feeling in the back of my mind that is
screaming that the Japanese were the first ones to make Ice Cream.
derek
Mat Findlay <tet...@interlog.com> wrote in article
<57pa6t$1...@news.interlog.com>...
As for me, I feel this isn't where the problem lies. I agree with that part
about not coming as close as we can. I can say ryu as close to its actual
pronounciation. But you forgot to write in the 'Speaking English' part,
that they are speaking to other English Speaking people, who all grew up
knowing our fellow shotokaner as rye-you. I think the real debate lies in
what one should we say. I have freinds majoring in Japanesse who still
chose to say rye-you for sheer convience.
Like English speaking people can get away without trying to keep actual
pronounciation. I can get my point made by saying rye-you.
As for ice cream, it is opposite. A japanesse speaking person has to try to
Ohgan
David Boudreau wrote:
> "ryu" looks mostly like the word "rye" to me, and though i may KNOW the
> word "ryu" has absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with the english word
> "rye", most people will understand the connection with pronouncing it
> as "rai yu" right away. when we americans see this word, we see a
> structure containing a y followed by a u. is it 2 syllables or just 1?
> if we go with 1 syllable, we are forced to make a sound inaudible to
> most american-english speaking people in arcades-- this is especially
> true if you actually DO pronounce it in a japanese accent, btw. if you
> choose to break it up into 2 syllables, "rai" and "yu", you ensure to
> include both the "u" vowel, and also the "y" as a likely vowel, and
> people know what the fuck you're talking about.
>
> david boudreau
> dbou...@lynx.dac.neu.edu
Huh? I always thought it was pronouned "Roger", it works for me.
Mr Ka Kwok
Not related but anyway, I noticed that on the machine, the "how-to-play"
instructions had Ryu's name as Rhy or Ryh, is this just a typo, or was
it intended?
Kenneth N. Miller
The point is, that, knowing the correct pronounciation, there is no reason
to still pronounce it "rai yu" Whenever I hear people in the arcade
pronounce it that way, I tell them the correct pronounciation and most
people appreciate my doing so. (Same thing for "raiden") Obviously, most
Americans who see the name are going to think it is pronounced "rai yu" I
did too until I learned the correct way to say it. I do not harp on people
for not pronouncing the "r" correctly, that becomes just silly, but the
general pronounciation of the word is easy for Americans to say -- just as
easy as the common incorrect way and thus once one knows it, one might as
well say it that way. Hell, I have heard people mispronounce other SF
names like my alltime favorite, "Goo lee ae" for "Guile" ^_^ So it is not
especially Japanese names being difficult to pronounce. The reason
Japanese pronounce certain English words differently from Americans is
because they are fitting the word into the Japanese sylablery (sp?) to
make it pronounceable. In English, every sound combonation is accounted
for, thus, it is natural to pronounce many Japanese words when the same
may not be true for English words in Japanese. So, as I said, my point
being, if you know how to pronounce it correctly, why not do so? Oh well.
No one ever listens anyway. Mata na.
--
THE Kenneth Miller hh...@cleveland.freenet.edu
http://http.tamu.edu/~katdavd <- Come get the Legend of Oasis Walkthrough
Neo Freak Code 1.0 Gm A+[18] N C+++ j++ F+*# Px p n+ c+++
SF2 code 2.1 t A- C+ c+ T r+ f++ g- m+ S v M+ n--:-- o
In emptiness there is good but no evil. Wisdom exists, logic exists, the Way exists, mind is empty. - Miyamoto Musashi Translator - Thomas Cleary
David Boudreau
Kenneth N. Miller (hh...@cleveland.freenet.edu) wrote:
: The point is, that, knowing the correct pronounciation, there is no reason
listen bud, go back and read the "katana" thread and catch up with
everyone else ok? THANKS.
: for not pronouncing the "r" correctly, that becomes just silly, but the
: general pronounciation of the word is easy for Americans to say -- just as
: easy as the common incorrect way and thus once one knows it, one might as
(as has been said before) there is NO "ryu" syllable in the english
language. you are just a "mall dork".
: being, if you know how to pronounce it correctly, why not do so? Oh well.
: No one ever listens anyway. Mata na.
: --
: THE Kenneth Miller hh...@cleveland.freenet.edu
duh, i wonder why. mata na ne?
david boudreau
dbou...@lynx.dac.neu.edu
dk
David Boudreau wrote:
<!---generous amounts of "who cares" snippage-->
anyone else feel like forming a new newsgroup...
mebbe...alt.fan.david-boudreau.shut.the.hell.up
or ....alt.linguistics.professor.die.die.die
-dk
Mr Ka Kwok
Computing & Info Services
In article <57v1c3$9...@chaos.dac.neu.edu>, dbou...@lynx.dac.neu.edu
(David Boudreau) wrote:
> listen bud, go back and read the "katana" thread and catch up with
> everyone else ok? THANKS.
>
> (as has been said before) there is NO "ryu" syllable in the english
> language. you are just a "mall dork".
> duh, i wonder why. mata na ne?
>
> david boudreau
> dbou...@lynx.dac.neu.edu
Man, what the Hell is wrong with you? Do you somehow get pleasure from
randomly posting insulting replies to messages for no reason? This reply
that you gave has nothing to do with the topic, did not help me in any
way, and was a failed attemp to somehow offend me. Perhaps you need to
take up a new hobby . . .
Mat Findlay
dbou...@lynx.dac.neu.edu (David Boudreau) wrote:
>Kenneth N. Miller (hh...@cleveland.freenet.edu) wrote:
>: The point is, that, knowing the correct pronounciation, there is no reason
>: to still pronounce it "rai yu" Whenever I hear people in the arcade
>listen bud, go back and read the "katana" thread and catch up with
>everyone else ok? THANKS.
Dave, if he were to do that, he'd still think the same way. You've
done absolutely nothing for your point in that thread, and you have
convinced nobody.
>: for not pronouncing the "r" correctly, that becomes just silly, but the
>: general pronounciation of the word is easy for Americans to say -- just as
>: easy as the common incorrect way and thus once one knows it, one might as
>(as has been said before) there is NO "ryu" syllable in the english
>language. you are just a "mall dork".
So what if there's no ryu syllable in the english language? It can
still be said. See, here's the difference between ignorance and
thought. Ignorance is saying "Well, I've never run into a syllable
like that, so I ain't gunna say it, duhhhh." Thought is saying "Hmmm,
that's a weird word, and I've never heard it before, but I'll try my
BEST!"
Dickweed...
Mephistopheles
It, much like XMvsSF, was probably a harmless mistake. :)
Shaun
Shaun P. McIsaac
Mr Ka Kwok wrote:
>
> Not related but anyway, I noticed that on the machine, the "how-to-play"
> instructions had Ryu's name as Rhy or Ryh, is this just a typo, or was
> it intended?
It, much like XMvsSF, was a harmless mistake. :)
Shaun
Mephistopheles
Mat Findlay wrote:
> Although there's some nagging feeling in the back of my mind that is
> screaming that the Japanese were the first ones to make Ice Cream.
Then wouldn't the inventor have named it with sounds that he could
easily pronounce?
Peace,
Shaun
David Boudreau
Distribution:
Mat Findlay (tet...@interlog.com) wrote:
: dbou...@lynx.dac.neu.edu (David Boudreau) wrote:
: >(as has been said before) there is NO "ryu" syllable in the english
: >language. you are just a "mall dork".
: So what if there's no ryu syllable in the english language? It can
: still be said. See, here's the difference between ignorance and
: thought. Ignorance is saying "Well, I've never run into a syllable
: like that, so I ain't gunna say it, duhhhh." Thought is saying "Hmmm,
oh!! like, "well, i've never run into the word 'ice cream' before, so i
ain't gunna say it, duhhhhhHHHHHuhuhghghghghUHUHUGhghghhgUHUUHUUH, i'll
just make up a new word 'aisu kurimu'."? the difference between
ignorance and thought, now i get it.
you said it yourself, mat. "it can still be said." if _i_ gutta say
"ryu" like a japanese native, _they_ gutta say "ice cream" like an
english-speaking native. if not... (you guessed it...)
DOUBLE fuckingSTANDARD.
: that's a weird word, and I've never heard it before, but I'll try my
: BEST!"
: Dickweed...
: Mat. <tet...@interlog.com>
pussywillow...
david boudreau
dbou...@lynx.dac.neu.edu
Mat Findlay
Mephistopheles <de...@bitch.fire.edu> wrote:
>Mat Findlay wrote:
I don't know...
Who created Ice Cream? It was either the Japanese, the Chinese, or the
Italians...
After all, a lot of Italian things were created by the Chinese...
Spaghetti... Pizza (I think)...
dan...@hawaii.edu
Newsgroups: alt.games.sf2
Subject: Re: "rai yu" pronounciation debate
In article <hh267-01129...@ppp1a-19.rns.tamu.edu>,
hh...@cleveland.freenet.edu (Kenneth N. Miller) writes:
>The point is, that, knowing the correct pronounciation, there is no reason
>to still pronounce it "rai yu" Whenever I hear people in the arcade
>pronounce it that way, I tell them the correct pronounciation and most
>people appreciate my doing so. (Same thing for "raiden") Obviously, most
>Americans who see the name are going to think it is pronounced "rai yu" I
>did too until I learned the correct way to say it. I do not harp on people
>for not pronouncing the "r" correctly, that becomes just silly, but the
>general pronounciation of the word is easy for Americans to say -- just as
>easy as the common incorrect way and thus once one knows it, one might as
>well say it that way. Hell, I have heard people mispronounce other SF
>names like my alltime favorite, "Goo lee ae" for "Guile" ^_^ So it is not
>especially Japanese names being difficult to pronounce. The reason
>Japanese pronounce certain English words differently from Americans is
>because they are fitting the word into the Japanese sylablery (sp?) to
>make it pronounceable. In English, every sound combonation is accounted
>for, thus, it is natural to pronounce many Japanese words when the same
>may not be true for English words in Japanese. So, as I said, my point
>being, if you know how to pronounce it correctly, why not do so? Oh well.
>No one ever listens anyway. Mata na.
Did you know that Los Angeles is a Spanish name? Did you know that the
Spanish pronunciation of "Los" uses the same "o" sound as "hope" and
"Angeles" is pronounced with the same "a" sound as "father" and the "g"
sound is pronounced something like the "h" sound. The names of San
Francisco and San Diego also fall into this category. The "a" sound is
like "father", not "sand". Does this mean that we've all been pronouncing
Los Angeles and San Francisco "wrong"?
Danny
Unknown
dan...@hawaii.edu wrote:
>Newsgroups: alt.games.sf2
>Subject: Re: "rai yu" pronounciation debate
>In article <hh267-01129...@ppp1a-19.rns.tamu.edu>,
>hh...@cleveland.freenet.edu (Kenneth N. Miller) writes:
>>The point is, that, knowing the correct pronounciation, there is no reason
>>to still pronounce it "rai yu" Whenever I hear people in the arcade
>>pronounce it that way, I tell them the correct pronounciation and most
>>people appreciate my doing so. (Same thing for "raiden") Obviously, most
>>Americans who see the name are going to think it is pronounced "rai yu" I
>>did too until I learned the correct way to say it. I do not harp on people
>>for not pronouncing the "r" correctly, that becomes just silly, but the
This is one reason I don't say it with the Japanese pronounciation.
It is because I canNOT say it right. I know a dude with Japanese
ancestry, and even tho he speaks Japanese well... he cannot even
pronounce it right.
So, if i can't pronounce it right... i will pronounce it the easiest
way which is also the way it looks in English. When I speak in
English ... I don't want to make a huge effort for one word. It makes
the sentence come out rough and choppy. You have to pause, then say
the word in a totally different language which you cant even speak,
then go on with your sentence. If i did that every time i said Ryu i
would go nuts.
>>general pronounciation of the word is easy for Americans to say -- just as
>>easy as the common incorrect way and thus once one knows it, one might as
>>well say it that way. Hell, I have heard people mispronounce other SF
>>names like my alltime favorite, "Goo lee ae" for "Guile" ^_^ So it is not
>>especially Japanese names being difficult to pronounce. The reason
>>Japanese pronounce certain English words differently from Americans is
>>because they are fitting the word into the Japanese sylablery (sp?) to
>>make it pronounceable. In English, every sound combonation is accounted
>>for, thus, it is natural to pronounce many Japanese words when the same
>>may not be true for English words in Japanese. So, as I said, my point
>>being, if you know how to pronounce it correctly, why not do so? Oh well.
>>No one ever listens anyway. Mata na.
And what is the "easy but almost correct" way of saying Ryu? Tell me
it is not "roo." That is the dumbest sounding pronounciation I have
ever witnessed. Plain old goofy. And he isn't a marsupial (sp?)
anyway. Rei Yoo sounds like a cool name. So i will say it that way.
Thanks.
more....
>Did you know that Los Angeles is a Spanish name? Did you know that the
>Spanish pronunciation of "Los" uses the same "o" sound as "hope" and
>"Angeles" is pronounced with the same "a" sound as "father" and the "g"
>sound is pronounced something like the "h" sound. The names of San
>Francisco and San Diego also fall into this category. The "a" sound is
>like "father", not "sand". Does this mean that we've all been pronouncing
>Los Angeles and San Francisco "wrong"?
>Danny
This guy has a similar point to what I am saying. We can't pronounce
stuff like it is supposed to be pronounced in the original country.
It's too hard and sounds bad. Just pretend that we completely renamed
Ryu with a new American English word : Rei Yoo. I mean, when that guy
in the Shogun movie went to Japan, didn't they rename him "AnJeen-san"
or something? Not that it was close to his real name... or whatever.
But he was renamed.
blah blah blah
rathead
Chocobo
dan...@hawaii.edu wrote:
>
> Newsgroups: alt.games.sf2
> Subject: Re: "rai yu" pronounciation debate
>
> In article <hh267-01129...@ppp1a-19.rns.tamu.edu>,
> hh...@cleveland.freenet.edu (Kenneth N. Miller) writes:
>
> >The point is, that, knowing the correct pronounciation, there is no reason
> >to still pronounce it "rai yu" Whenever I hear people in the arcade
> >pronounce it that way, I tell them the correct pronounciation and most
> >people appreciate my doing so. (Same thing for "raiden") Obviously, most
> >Americans who see the name are going to think it is pronounced "rai yu" I
> >did too until I learned the correct way to say it. I do not harp on people
> >for not pronouncing the "r" correctly, that becomes just silly, but the
> >easy as the common incorrect way and thus once one knows it, one might as
> >well say it that way. Hell, I have heard people mispronounce other SF
> >names like my alltime favorite, "Goo lee ae" for "Guile" ^_^ So it is not
> >especially Japanese names being difficult to pronounce. The reason
> >Japanese pronounce certain English words differently from Americans is
> >because they are fitting the word into the Japanese sylablery (sp?) to
> >make it pronounceable. In English, every sound combonation is accounted
> >for, thus, it is natural to pronounce many Japanese words when the same
> >may not be true for English words in Japanese. So, as I said, my point
> >being, if you know how to pronounce it correctly, why not do so? Oh well.
> >No one ever listens anyway. Mata na.
>
> Spanish pronunciation of "Los" uses the same "o" sound as "hope" and
> "Angeles" is pronounced with the same "a" sound as "father" and the "g"
> sound is pronounced something like the "h" sound. The names of San
> Francisco and San Diego also fall into this category. The "a" sound is
> like "father", not "sand". Does this mean that we've all been pronouncing
> Los Angeles and San Francisco "wrong"?
Well, technically yes I guess. But the equivalent of calling Ryu
"Rye-you" is like calling LA "Loos Angle-eye-ees".
dan...@hawaii.edu
>Did you know that Los Angeles is a Spanish name? Did you know that the
>Spanish pronunciation of "Los" uses the same "o" sound as "hope" and
>"Angeles" is pronounced with the same "a" sound as "father" and the "g"
>sound is pronounced something like the "h" sound. The names of San
>Francisco and San Diego also fall into this category. The "a" sound is
>like "father", not "sand". Does this mean that we've all been pronouncing
>Los Angeles and San Francisco "wrong"?
Whoops! The "g" in Los Angeles is pronounced correctly after all. Sorry
about that, I was thinking of the Spanish "j". Man, I really need to
brush up on my Spanish. The parts about the vowel sounds are accurate,
though.
Another point: Cuba is pronounced "kuba" in Spanish.
Since I live here, I might as well tell you all that in Hawaiian, Hawai'i
is pronounced Ha-vai-i. The /w/ is supposed to be read as a "v" sound.
The /'/ symbol indicates that you have to make a stop before continuing
with the word.
Danny
Mat Findlay
dan...@hawaii.edu wrote:
>Did you know that Los Angeles is a Spanish name? Did you know that the
>Spanish pronunciation of "Los" uses the same "o" sound as "hope" and
>"Angeles" is pronounced with the same "a" sound as "father" and the "g"
>sound is pronounced something like the "h" sound. The names of San
>Francisco and San Diego also fall into this category. The "a" sound is
>like "father", not "sand". Does this mean that we've all been pronouncing
>Los Angeles and San Francisco "wrong"?
Yes. It does.
But it's "accepted" the other way, so that's the more common one...
Doesn't make it correct, though.
Let's say you've got a buddy that comes over from Spain, and is just
learning English, and refers to Los Angeles as "Lohs Ahnghalees." If
you were to tell him that the English people pronounced it "Lawss
Anjilis," he'd probably say, "Why? it's a Spanish name?"
What would you say? How would you explain it? I really can't think of
anything else to say to him other than "I don't know... That's just
the way most Americans pronounce it..." He'd probably say, "But it's
wrong." And I'd say, "Yeah, well try telling them that... These
Americans are crazy."
So he'd say, "Really?" and I'd say, "Yeah." Then he'd say "So where's
a good bar?" and I'd say, "Well, there's a few..." and he'd say "But
I'm not sure about this beer..."
I think I'm getting into the part of the conversation that has nothing
to do with the subject, though.
Mat Findlay
dbou...@lynx.dac.neu.edu (David Boudreau) wrote:
>oh!! like, "well, i've never run into the word 'ice cream' before, so i
>ain't gunna say it, duhhhhhHHHHHuhuhghghghghUHUHUGhghghhgUHUUHUUH, i'll
>just make up a new word 'aisu kurimu'."? the difference between
>ignorance and thought, now i get it.
>you said it yourself, mat. "it can still be said." if _i_ gutta say
>"ryu" like a japanese native, _they_ gutta say "ice cream" like an
>english-speaking native. if not... (you guessed it...)
>DOUBLE fuckingSTANDARD.
Once again, idiot, you miss the point. Aisu Kurimu is pretty damn
close to the actual words Ice Cream. In fact, it actually sounds like
Ice Cream with a Japanese accent. RYE-you is nowhere near close to
Ryu.
I give up... You're so fucking thick that it must be painful.
StrPltNm
who cares how you pronounce it, if you dominate with him call him what you
want untill another guy kicks your butt then I guess the name is P-yu
Allen Jameson Klein
Excerpts from netnews.alt.games.sf2: 13-Dec-96 Re: "rai yu"
pronounciation.. by StrP...@aol.com
> want untill another guy kicks your butt then I guess the name is P-yu
P-yu. Works for me! Dave, Mat, Shaun, James, Bob? @_@