SSF2 : How to execute Zangief's Magic Throw?
General Access Account
qe...@matai.vuw.ac.nz
RE : Zangiefs magic 2PD ..
No luck accomplishing it from this corner of the world.
I've been picking Zangief since I read about it, and have tried
all sorts of combinations as they were described, but I have
never accomplished a mysterious Teleporting 2PD.
I've given up trying until I get some more confirmation, so
I'm not stating that it doesn't exist. I'm just assuming
that I'm not doing it right, or else our Asian versions of SSF2
don't have this bug.
BTW : Apparently to achieve this move, you do a SPD manoeuvre
with the Foreward kick. You have to be blocking a fast
fireball, or the opponent has to be doing a Fierce/Roundhouse
move from the other side of the screen.
I must say, I've can now do the SPD a lot easier now that I've been
practicing over and over again. You don't need to do a 360, just
do this : O
O- / | \ -O /
O O O
With the running grab PD ( kick SPD from distance ) the kick button
you press determines the distance Zangief runs before grabbing them.
Basically don't use the Roundhouse, because Zangief is *very* vulnerable
when he is running, and the opponent can react at their own leisure.
Practice the ranges on the Bonus Stages.
Also : Balrog ( walking backwards ) moves faster then Zangief ( walking
forewards ). --> Zangief cannot catch Balrog until he traps
him in the corner.
----
Simon Westenra (btw. Finishing it with Honda is easy now, for some reason
Capcom seems to have forgottten him, and if you know how
to play Honda, then you can kick the cpu's butt with pretty
basic strategies )
Kerry Durham
Zangief is a dead character in SSF2.
I say this as a dedicated fanatic Z player. And I lose a tear thinking
my Z! will be forever a loser character (Even loses to Blanka!).
I believe that the "Magic 2PD" is not a magic move at all,
but a real move to make Z! playible!!! Until someone can
do it reliably, Z sucks.
"Why Oh Zangief fanatic is Z! doomed to lose?"
I have played Z since the original days of SF2.
I win much much more than I lose. BUT if everyone
knew Z as I know him, you would not fear him at all...
Z has a chance to win against the new characters and
surprizingly... Honda! All of the new characters have "weaknesses"
and Z's c.jab allows an interesting battle with Honda.
I do give the edge to all these characters except Cammy.
All other characters should win against Z without too much trouble.
At this time I won't go into details on how to beat Z,
unless all the other Z "master's" out there wish to debate.
Capcom: What were you thinking when you made the new Z! ???
You didn't even give him the same basic abilities as the other chars!
The two biggest *critical* design flaws:
1) he is the toughest char to sac throw with! He should be one of the best!!!
--- If Ken air fierce touches one unblocked hair on Z's head,
FierceX4 and stun. Repeat and the match is basically over.
I wouldn't mind a butt kick, but to have that ability from
the FRONT? Just plain Stupid!!!
He just plain takes too damn long to recoil from blows. I believe
one of the worst (if not *THE* worst) recoil times in the game.
At least in the original SF2 he could sac throw!!!
I consistantly sac throw the same *astonished* Ken players
with the *MUCH* shorter Chun Li. Height should have advantages!!!
BTW: Anyone notice how well you must time Z's air attacks to combo?
MUCH MUCH harder to do. You practically have to land the
roundhouse/fierce in the belly button of the enemy!
2) What the heck is this "Gee-I-just-kissed-the-air-right-in-front-
of-a-damn-crouched-enemy-and-now-he-laughs-hysterically-and-
nails-me-for-free" shit??? If I walk in and get in SPD range,
I should be able to suck the bastard outta crouch! ,
I can't stand the kiss-the-air and step forward missed SPD!
Everytime you try to SPD from some range, and miss, it is a free
hit from your enemy. STUPID!
Also, the SPD range is much shorter except when your
enemy is landing from the air. To SPD, you must usually "tick"
your opponent. Ie, make them block a couple of shorts or jabs.
If you just try to SPD a crouching enemy, you usually will not
get them.
(Apply this logic to other moves, and it seems stupid. For example:
make Ken stand a while after a missed DP, or sometimes the
DP just passes harmlessly through you becuase the cpu decided
it wasn't "right" this time to hit you).
Some other helpful things:
The SPD could do more damage. The RPD should do more damage.
And best: the RPD should have better RANGE at the end of the run!
I have run up and hugged *right over top* of crouching enemies
way too many times. Just depressing.
OH Yeah: how about not making that last frame of the double
lariet not vunerible? (ie, if you are in the doulbe lariet
(3 foot buttons) and finish inside a FB, your hit!, not so
for the triple lariet!).
Ultimate: make the first frame of the triple lariet a TRUE
invunerible move and knock anything away except other
invunerible moves!
Well, this post is long enough. Everything but maybe the last
"Ultimate" should be in the game, JUST to make Z! playible.
Everyone is entitled to my opinion, ;-)
---Shamrock
PS: Replys and discussion welcome. Email if you want to debate or flame.
PPS: if you have any info on the needed (magic) 2PD, email me.
maybe *we* can figure it out. I know what doesn't work :):):)
Fist of Fury
I won't talk about that, but he's a fun character.
>I say this as a dedicated fanatic Z player. And I lose a tear thinking
>my Z! will be forever a loser character (Even loses to Blanka!).
No no, he can handle few of them quite well.
>I believe that the "Magic 2PD" is not a magic move at all,
>but a real move to make Z! playible!!! Until someone can
>do it reliably, Z sucks.
Shucks, I haven't even seen it yet.
>"Why Oh Zangief fanatic is Z! doomed to lose?"
>
> I have played Z since the original days of SF2.
So did I.
>I win much much more than I lose. BUT if everyone
In the old days, 3 SPD and it's over. You can follow up too, of course
he could win pretty easy.
>knew Z as I know him, you would not fear him at all...
>Z has a chance to win against the new characters and
>surprizingly... Honda! All of the new characters have "weaknesses"
>and Z's c.jab allows an interesting battle with Honda.
Thd lariet works much better on stoping Honda's flying head thing...
especially the first couple frame of the lariet. In Turbo, it was
almost useless.
>I do give the edge to all these characters except Cammy.
>All other characters should win against Z without too much trouble.
>
> At this time I won't go into details on how to beat Z,
>unless all the other Z "master's" out there wish to debate.
I won't too. But I'll give some inputs below.
> Capcom: What were you thinking when you made the new Z! ???
>You didn't even give him the same basic abilities as the other chars!
>
> The two biggest *critical* design flaws:
>1) he is the toughest char to sac throw with! He should be one of the best!!!
> --- If Ken air fierce touches one unblocked hair on Z's head,
> FierceX4 and stun. Repeat and the match is basically over.
> I wouldn't mind a butt kick, but to have that ability from
> the FRONT? Just plain Stupid!!!
With his jab in the air, he should be easiest to force them into sac throw.
Just hit the jab early. If they didn't try to hit you early, they'll get
knok down. Walk up slightly, short, SPD (watch for DP's). If they hit
you, it means they hit early. sac-SPD or what I do usually is sac-throw
(with strong), then roundhouse (which if they don't block will knock
them down, then just walk up and roundhouse again), SPD. (again, watch
for the guys that can DP)
Ken just seem like he can hit the fierce in the air pretty early, and
still buffer into a DP.
Vs. Ken, I always use lariet. (which works againt any jumping character)
You should excute it late of course, 'cause after the first few frames,
he's pretty vulnerable from the air.
> He just plain takes too damn long to recoil from blows. I believe
> one of the worst (if not *THE* worst) recoil times in the game.
> At least in the original SF2 he could sac throw!!!
Besides Ken, sac throw is no problem IMO. BUt I use the larriet to be
safe. Once they're down, it's neck splah, strong, forward, SPD time...
> I consistantly sac throw the same *astonished* Ken players
> with the *MUCH* shorter Chun Li. Height should have advantages!!!
>
> BTW: Anyone notice how well you must time Z's air attacks to combo?
> MUCH MUCH harder to do. You practically have to land the
> roundhouse/fierce in the belly button of the enemy!
Much easier compare to HF because of the slow down.
>2) What the heck is this "Gee-I-just-kissed-the-air-right-in-front-
> of-a-damn-crouched-enemy-and-now-he-laughs-hysterically-and-
> nails-me-for-free" shit??? If I walk in and get in SPD range,
> I should be able to suck the bastard outta crouch! ,
You missed the SPD.
> I can't stand the kiss-the-air and step forward missed SPD!
> Everytime you try to SPD from some range, and miss, it is a free
> hit from your enemy. STUPID!
Seems better than the old one to me; if I miss SPD, I used to jump all
over the place.
> Also, the SPD range is much shorter except when your
> enemy is landing from the air. To SPD, you must usually "tick"
> your opponent. Ie, make them block a couple of shorts or jabs.
> If you just try to SPD a crouching enemy, you usually will not
> get them.
I say it's the same range, because you can roundhouse on the ground,
and SPD.
As for missing them, try to give a few miliseconds before you excute it.
ie, short-slight pause-SPD instead of short-SPD right away.
> (Apply this logic to other moves, and it seems stupid. For example:
> make Ken stand a while after a missed DP, or sometimes the
> DP just passes harmlessly through you becuase the cpu decided
> it wasn't "right" this time to hit you).
>
>Some other helpful things:
> The SPD could do more damage. The RPD should do more damage.
I use the SPD much more than leg SPD.
> And best: the RPD should have better RANGE at the end of the run!
> I have run up and hugged *right over top* of crouching enemies
> way too many times. Just depressing.
>
> OH Yeah: how about not making that last frame of the double
> lariet not vunerible? (ie, if you are in the doulbe lariet
> (3 foot buttons) and finish inside a FB, your hit!, not so
> for the triple lariet!).
>
> Ultimate: make the first frame of the triple lariet a TRUE
> invunerible move and knock anything away except other
> invunerible moves!
The first few frame are invincible from the air IMO.
>Well, this post is long enough. Everything but maybe the last
>"Ultimate" should be in the game, JUST to make Z! playible.
He is much better than HF Zan IMO.
>Everyone is entitled to my opinion, ;-)
> ---Shamrock
>
>PS: Replys and discussion welcome. Email if you want to debate or flame.
>PPS: if you have any info on the needed (magic) 2PD, email me.
> maybe *we* can figure it out. I know what doesn't work :):):)
--
frank m. lin
fm...@netcom.com
Kenichiro Tanaka
> forewards ). --> Zangief cannot catch Balrog until he traps
> him in the corner.
I'm sure everyone has noticed this already (making the subject line
inaccurate) but Fei Long can walk backwards at the same speed as a slow
sonic boom. Pretty cool.
Also, Guile has a US flag tatooed on both of his shoulders (check out
the "comb his hair" winning pose). Was it this way before? This solves
the flip-flopping bitmaps problem. Maybe Vega should have claws on both
hands. Maybe Sagat should have eyepatches over both eyes.
Ken
Kerry Durham
Subject: Re: Zangief's Magic Throw
Summary:
Expires:
References: <1993Nov9...@matai.vuw.ac.nz> <durhake.93...@lab13.duc.auburn.edu> <fmlinCG...@netcom.com>
Sender:
Followup-To:
Distribution:
Organization: Auburn University, Alabama
Keywords:
Message-ID: <durhake.93...@lab13.duc.auburn.edu>
Date: Tue Nov 9 18:20:04 CST 1993
In article <fmlinCG...@netcom.com> fm...@netcom.com (Fist of Fury) writes:
>>surprizingly... Honda! All of the new characters have "weaknesses"
>>and Z's c.jab allows an interesting battle with Honda.
>
>Thd lariet works much better on stoping Honda's flying head thing...
>especially the first couple frame of the lariet. In Turbo, it was
>almost useless.
>
Yes, the lariet first frames work great, but if you jab you can
walk up and short-SPD :) Plus I don't need to worry about timing.
Also, the jab stops the HH from mowing into me. The jab works!
In Turbo, Z! was the worst character by far!
>> The two biggest *critical* design flaws:
>>1) he is the toughest char to sac throw with! He should be one of the best!!!
>> --- If Ken air fierce touches one unblocked hair on Z's head,
>> FierceX4 and stun. Repeat and the match is basically over.
>> I wouldn't mind a butt kick, but to have that ability from
>> the FRONT? Just plain Stupid!!!
>
>With his jab in the air, he should be easiest to force them into sac throw.
>Just hit the jab early. If they didn't try to hit you early, they'll get
>knok down. Walk up slightly, short, SPD (watch for DP's). If they hit
>you, it means they hit early. sac-SPD or what I do usually is sac-throw
>(with strong), then roundhouse (which if they don't block will knock
>them down, then just walk up and roundhouse again), SPD. (again, watch
>for the guys that can DP)
>
These things do not work. The Ken's here know it, and all us Z's
know it. First, Ken does not need to time his air fierce. Trading
my standing jab is the best I can do, my Z! catching a 4Xfierce is
the best he can do. All us Z's used to eat up the Kens here, but
then, Ken figured out he could jump and not bother timing the air
fierce. If it connected, at all, 4Xfierce. None of the Z's can
sac throw any of the Kens now that they just use air fierce. Ken
can practically jump at Z at will.
On another note: none of the attack-SPD's work against Ken. they
just block jab-DP. They break it everytime. If I just hit-block
(fake a hit-SPD) the DP comes out, hits my defense, and he lands
safely outta SPD range. (unless he is in a corner). Enough on how
to beat Ken for now... This is one hellva task against any good Ken.
>
>Vs. Ken, I always use lariet. (which works againt any jumping character)
>You should excute it late of course, 'cause after the first few frames,
>he's pretty vulnerable from the air.
>
The lariet *NEVER* stops the air fierce. It trades *sometimes*
if Ken hits fierce wayyy to early. I have been working on that
lariet to stop Ken since the begining. 4Xfierce, stun, repeat, match over.
The lariet first frames does NOT stop a lot of air attacks. Fei, Chun,
Cammy, Ken, Sagat, just to name a few...
Hmmm. Maybe some info. Assume the enemy always aims attacks at Z's
standing, head to high chest area. A jump to hit higher or lower
I can handle easily.
>> He just plain takes too damn long to recoil from blows. I believe
>> one of the worst (if not *THE* worst) recoil times in the game.
>> At least in the original SF2 he could sac throw!!!
>
>Besides Ken, sac throw is no problem IMO. BUt I use the larriet to be
>safe. Once they're down, it's neck splah, strong, forward, SPD time...
>
You don't believe that Z has the worst hit recovery time?
In the original sf2, Blanka's "rake and roll" move that they took
outta the game in all other versions (close+s.fierce)? If the
first one hit Z, the second *always* hit, unblockable. ALL other
characters could block the second swing! Reason: Z recovers slowest!!
>>2) What the heck is this "Gee-I-just-kissed-the-air-right-in-front-
>> of-a-damn-crouched-enemy-and-now-he-laughs-hysterically-and-
>> nails-me-for-free" shit??? If I walk in and get in SPD range,
>> I should be able to suck the bastard outta crouch! ,
>
>You missed the SPD.
>
Yes, but I meant missed the SPD from Point Blank! Sweeping my
arms over there damn head. If I SPD, and you are in range,
it outta darn well suck you up. period. *I* didn't miss the SPD,
the cpu decided it didn't want to suck up the quivering little
bastard into a well deserved SPD!!! This is especially frustrating
when I dart around while an opponent just sits and waits to c.roundhouse.
I dart in WELL INSIDE SPD range, but just kiss the air. then he just
c.roundhouses me. In other versions of the game, if you couldn't
suck up a c.defense enemy, you swing your arm once, and did another
SPD immediatly, up-up-and-away! I mean at least if it didn't suck
them up the first time, the second SPD did get them and it was
only a split second delay.
But now, you do this eternity stupid hug thin air, and it gives
your enemy all day to hit the roundhouse button.
>Seems better than the old one to me; if I miss SPD, I used to jump all
>over the place.
>
I do the SPD without jumping. just practice doing it properly
and you won't jump if you miss it. This isn't a flame! it will
improve your game, I promise. (I practice the lariet ALL the time,
becuase it is the one move I still miss every so often, and eat
that damn fireball!!! :)
>--
>frank m. lin
>fm...@netcom.com
I wrote the original post to stir up some talk. Z! is much improved
over HFsf2, that's a fact! But he still has some major weaknesses.
I am gonna work on that post about the "magic throw". I think
it is a real move, not a glitch.
I need to dig up that good Ken competition to try out some more
ideas of how to counter that air fierce stuff...
ZanGRIEF is the only true character! Anything else is cowardly!
---Shamrock
Kerry Durham
>>and Z's c.jab allows an interesting battle with Honda.
>
>Thd lariet works much better on stoping Honda's flying head thing...
>especially the first couple frame of the lariet. In Turbo, it was
>almost useless.
>
walk up and short-SPD :) Plus I don't need to worry about timing.
Also, the jab stops the HH from mowing into me. The jab works!
In Turbo, Z! was the worst character by far!
>> The two biggest *critical* design flaws:
>>1) he is the toughest char to sac throw with! He should be one of the best!!!
>> --- If Ken air fierce touches one unblocked hair on Z's head,
>> FierceX4 and stun. Repeat and the match is basically over.
>> I wouldn't mind a butt kick, but to have that ability from
>> the FRONT? Just plain Stupid!!!
>
>With his jab in the air, he should be easiest to force them into sac throw.
>Just hit the jab early. If they didn't try to hit you early, they'll get
>knok down. Walk up slightly, short, SPD (watch for DP's). If they hit
>you, it means they hit early. sac-SPD or what I do usually is sac-throw
>(with strong), then roundhouse (which if they don't block will knock
>them down, then just walk up and roundhouse again), SPD. (again, watch
>for the guys that can DP)
>
These things do not work. The Ken's here know it, and all us Z's
know it. First, Ken does not need to time his air fierce. Trading
my standing jab is the best I can do, my Z! catching a 4Xfierce is
the best he can do. All us Z's used to eat up the Kens here, but
then, Ken figured out he could jump and not bother timing the air
fierce. If it connected, at all, 4Xfierce. None of the Z's can
sac throw any of the Kens now that they just use air fierce. Ken
can practically jump at Z at will.
On another note: none of the attack-SPD's work against Ken. they
just block jab-DP. They break it everytime. If I just hit-block
(fake a hit-SPD) the DP comes out, hits my defense, and he lands
safely outta SPD range. (unless he is in a corner). Enough on how
to beat Ken for now... This is one hellva task against any good Ken.
>
>Vs. Ken, I always use lariet. (which works againt any jumping character)
>You should excute it late of course, 'cause after the first few frames,
>he's pretty vulnerable from the air.
>
The lariet *NEVER* stops the air fierce. It trades *sometimes*
if Ken hits fierce wayyy to early. I have been working on that
lariet to stop Ken since the begining. 4Xfierce, stun, repeat, match over.
The lariet first frames does NOT stop a lot of air attacks. Fei, Chun,
Cammy, Ken, Sagat, just to name a few...
Hmmm. Maybe some info. Assume the enemy always aims attacks at Z's
standing, head to high chest area. A jump to hit higher or lower
I can handle easily.
>> He just plain takes too damn long to recoil from blows. I believe
>> one of the worst (if not *THE* worst) recoil times in the game.
>> At least in the original SF2 he could sac throw!!!
>
>Besides Ken, sac throw is no problem IMO. BUt I use the larriet to be
>safe. Once they're down, it's neck splah, strong, forward, SPD time...
>
You don't believe that Z has the worst hit recovery time?
In the original sf2, Blanka's "rake and roll" move that they took
outta the game in all other versions (close+s.fierce)? If the
first one hit Z, the second *always* hit, unblockable. ALL other
characters could block the second swing! Reason: Z recovers slowest!!
>>2) What the heck is this "Gee-I-just-kissed-the-air-right-in-front-
>> of-a-damn-crouched-enemy-and-now-he-laughs-hysterically-and-
>> nails-me-for-free" shit??? If I walk in and get in SPD range,
>> I should be able to suck the bastard outta crouch! ,
>
>You missed the SPD.
>
Yes, but I meant missed the SPD from Point Blank! Sweeping my
arms over there damn head. If I SPD, and you are in range,
it outta darn well suck you up. period. *I* didn't miss the SPD,
the cpu decided it didn't want to suck up the quivering little
bastard into a well deserved SPD!!! This is especially frustrating
when I dart around while an opponent just sits and waits to c.roundhouse.
I dart in WELL INSIDE SPD range, but just kiss the air. then he just
c.roundhouses me. In other versions of the game, if you couldn't
suck up a c.defense enemy, you swing your arm once, and did another
SPD immediatly, up-up-and-away! I mean at least if it didn't suck
them up the first time, the second SPD did get them and it was
only a split second delay.
But now, you do this eternity stupid hug thin air, and it gives
your enemy all day to hit the roundhouse button.
>Seems better than the old one to me; if I miss SPD, I used to jump all
>over the place.
>
I do the SPD without jumping. just practice doing it properly
and you won't jump if you miss it. This isn't a flame! it will
improve your game, I promise. (I practice the lariet ALL the time,
becuase it is the one move I still miss every so often, and eat
that damn fireball!!! :)
>--
>frank m. lin
>fm...@netcom.com
I wrote the original post to stir up some talk. Z! is much improved
Justin C. Hogue
> No luck accomplishing it from this corner of the world.
>I've been picking Zangief since I read about it, and have tried
>all sorts of combinations as they were described, but I have
>never accomplished a mysterious Teleporting 2PD.
> I've given up trying until I get some more confirmation, so
>I'm not stating that it doesn't exist. I'm just assuming
>that I'm not doing it right, or else our Asian versions of SSF2
>don't have this bug.
Has anybody outside UIUC done this--I have seen a few post on it
from UIUC, but nowhere else...hmmmmmmm it IS convienient he tried it the
first time he got to a SSFII and accidentally pulled it off (if I have
my history of this right), and then was able to reproduce a bug noone
outside UIUC (I've seen) has pulled it off. Anyone else do it? See it?
Maybe its just the UIUC machine or they are pulling a very good joke. If
so it was pretty good.
--Jowfus and his incredible BUAK!!!!!
_ _____\\ \\
___| |___ / ___ \ "Look brain, I'm Heidi!
(___ ___) _______ /_/ / / Yodololay-hi-NARF!"
__ | | __ (_______) / / --Pinky, from Pinky and the Brain,
/_/ | | \_\ / / The Animaniacs
|_| /_/ ho...@cs.arizona.edu
Derek Chan
Yeah, I got it off on some Ken as I was getting up from across the screen. I
won with that move! Heh heh...You should have seen the look on his face when I took away that inch of energy when I only had 1 pixel of life left!!!
--
Derek V. Chan | Harvard University | ch...@husc.harvard.edu
Biochemistry & Molecular Bio. | Senior - Class of '94 | ========================
====================== Yale WHO? Don't they make locks? =======================
"You wouldn't be here if you already knew everything. . ." - Organic Chem. TF
Scott D Bradburn
|> These things do not work. The Ken's here know it, and all us Z's
|> know it. First, Ken does not need to time his air fierce. Trading
|> my standing jab is the best I can do, my Z! catching a 4Xfierce is
|> the best he can do. All us Z's used to eat up the Kens here, but
|> then, Ken figured out he could jump and not bother timing the air
|> fierce. If it connected, at all, 4Xfierce. None of the Z's can
|> sac throw any of the Kens now that they just use air fierce. Ken
|> can practically jump at Z at will.
|> On another note: none of the attack-SPD's work against Ken. they
|> just block jab-DP. They break it everytime. If I just hit-block
|> (fake a hit-SPD) the DP comes out, hits my defense, and he lands
|> safely outta SPD range. (unless he is in a corner). Enough on how
|> to beat Ken for now... This is one hellva task against any good Ken.
|>
Hmmm... I know I sac throw lots of Kens easily. I also know that standing
rapid jabs stops a Ken/Ryu jumping in. I've never had a problem provided I
react fast enough. And IF the jumping fierce is knocking Zangief too far
away to sac throw (not the SPD), then block the combo and beat Ken up afterwards.
I know if you fierce Zangief in the top of the head he can block or sac throw
the computer does it quite frequently.
|> >
|> >Besides Ken, sac throw is no problem IMO. BUt I use the larriet to be
|> >safe. Once they're down, it's neck splah, strong, forward, SPD time...
|> >
|> You don't believe that Z has the worst hit recovery time?
|> In the original sf2, Blanka's "rake and roll" move that they took
|> outta the game in all other versions (close+s.fierce)? If the
|> first one hit Z, the second *always* hit, unblockable. ALL other
|> characters could block the second swing! Reason: Z recovers slowest!!
|>
I don't think using a classic SF2 detail has any relevance in the world
of Turbo and Super.
|> >
|> I do the SPD without jumping. just practice doing it properly
|> and you won't jump if you miss it. This isn't a flame! it will
|> improve your game, I promise. (I practice the lariet ALL the time,
|> becuase it is the one move I still miss every so often, and eat
|> that damn fireball!!! :)
|>
|> >--
|> >frank m. lin
|> >fm...@netcom.com
|>
|> I wrote the original post to stir up some talk. Z! is much improved
|> over HFsf2, that's a fact! But he still has some major weaknesses.
|> I am gonna work on that post about the "magic throw". I think
|> it is a real move, not a glitch.
Zangief was lethal in HF. He only had to work his way in. Chun Li and
Vega were much tougher then Ken and Ryu.
Fist of Fury
>>Just hit the jab early. If they didn't try to hit you early, they'll get
>>knok down. Walk up slightly, short, SPD (watch for DP's). If they hit
>>you, it means they hit early. sac-SPD or what I do usually is sac-throw
>>(with strong), then roundhouse (which if they don't block will knock
>>them down, then just walk up and roundhouse again), SPD. (again, watch
>>for the guys that can DP)
>>
> These things do not work. The Ken's here know it, and all us Z's
>know it. First, Ken does not need to time his air fierce. Trading
>my standing jab is the best I can do, my Z! catching a 4Xfierce is
>the best he can do. All us Z's used to eat up the Kens here, but
>then, Ken figured out he could jump and not bother timing the air
>fierce. If it connected, at all, 4Xfierce. None of the Z's can
>sac throw any of the Kens now that they just use air fierce. Ken
>can practically jump at Z at will.
IMO, a Ryu/Ken do not beat Zan by jumping in. They beat zan by good
combination of FB, roundhouse, and I guess, occasional jump in (at
a pretty far distance).
> On another note: none of the attack-SPD's work against Ken. they
>just block jab-DP. They break it everytime. If I just hit-block
>(fake a hit-SPD) the DP comes out, hits my defense, and he lands
>safely outta SPD range. (unless he is in a corner). Enough on how
>to beat Ken for now... This is one hellva task against any good Ken.
I think your doing the SPD at too-obvoius times? (especially a "buffered"
one; you do a hit before you SPD...)
>>Vs. Ken, I always use lariet. (which works againt any jumping character)
>>You should excute it late of course, 'cause after the first few frames,
>>he's pretty vulnerable from the air.
>>
> The lariet *NEVER* stops the air fierce. It trades *sometimes*
>if Ken hits fierce wayyy to early. I have been working on that
>lariet to stop Ken since the begining. 4Xfierce, stun, repeat, match over.
>The lariet first frames does NOT stop a lot of air attacks. Fei, Chun,
>Cammy, Ken, Sagat, just to name a few...
In my experience, it works pretty much like a DP. I can stop everyone
when they jump in. It only works at a close range though; if they jump
in far away, they can almost always hit you. But if they're above you,
you can hit them down cleanly.
> Hmmm. Maybe some info. Assume the enemy always aims attacks at Z's
>standing, head to high chest area. A jump to hit higher or lower
>I can handle easily.
How I choose to lariet or block depends on the distance they jumped in.
When in doubt, block. (especially vs. Ken), they can only hit you with
a FB at best.
> You don't believe that Z has the worst hit recovery time?
>In the original sf2, Blanka's "rake and roll" move that they took
>outta the game in all other versions (close+s.fierce)? If the
>first one hit Z, the second *always* hit, unblockable. ALL other
>characters could block the second swing! Reason: Z recovers slowest!!
I guess so, but I don't find it to be a problem. Can you name some
instances?
>>You missed the SPD.
>>
> Yes, but I meant missed the SPD from Point Blank! Sweeping my
>arms over there damn head. If I SPD, and you are in range,
>it outta darn well suck you up. period. *I* didn't miss the SPD,
>the cpu decided it didn't want to suck up the quivering little
>bastard into a well deserved SPD!!! This is especially frustrating
>when I dart around while an opponent just sits and waits to c.roundhouse.
>I dart in WELL INSIDE SPD range, but just kiss the air. then he just
>c.roundhouses me. In other versions of the game, if you couldn't
>suck up a c.defense enemy, you swing your arm once, and did another
>SPD immediatly, up-up-and-away! I mean at least if it didn't suck
>them up the first time, the second SPD did get them and it was
>only a split second delay.
I know what you mean then, there hasn't been any changed, excpet it now
does the huggin the air motion. What you're doing is excuting the SPD
too early. For example, jump in and punch/kick late, then SPD right
away, you will always grab the air. You need to give a slight pause
after the air move.
> But now, you do this eternity stupid hug thin air, and it gives
>your enemy all day to hit the roundhouse button.
I guess excute the SPD more cautiously?
>>Seems better than the old one to me; if I miss SPD, I used to jump all
>>over the place.
>>
> I do the SPD without jumping. just practice doing it properly
>and you won't jump if you miss it. This isn't a flame! it will
>improve your game, I promise. (I practice the lariet ALL the time,
>becuase it is the one move I still miss every so often, and eat
>that damn fireball!!! :)
I've been doing the full motion since the classic. :-) It won't make
any difference now anyway, 'cause Zan will hug the air.
No flames from me neither! :-) Just discussion.
> I wrote the original post to stir up some talk. Z! is much improved
>over HFsf2, that's a fact! But he still has some major weaknesses.
>I am gonna work on that post about the "magic throw". I think
>it is a real move, not a glitch.
I've yet to see it, go figure... Yeah, I was really good with all the
Guile invisible throw stuff, so Zan's shouldn't be a problem. :-)
> I need to dig up that good Ken competition to try out some more
>ideas of how to counter that air fierce stuff...
Again, I think if anyone jumps in a Zan, they're doomed.
Fist of Fury
>Vega were much tougher then Ken and Ryu.
Blanka and Honda could easily kill Zan in HF...
Brian Odom
> Has anybody outside UIUC done this--I have seen a few post on it
>from UIUC, but nowhere else...hmmmmmmm it IS convienient he tried it the
>first time he got to a SSFII and accidentally pulled it off (if I have
>my history of this right), and then was able to reproduce a bug noone
>outside UIUC (I've seen) has pulled it off. Anyone else do it? See it?
>Maybe its just the UIUC machine or they are pulling a very good joke. If
>so it was pretty good.
It has been posted that it's been done (quite frequently) at UCLA. It's also
been done here by one person. It will catch on soon.
Kerry Durham
>>RE : Zangiefs magic 2PD ..
>> No luck accomplishing it from this corner of the world.
>>I've been picking Zangief since I read about it, and have tried
>>all sorts of combinations as they were described, but I have
>>never accomplished a mysterious Teleporting 2PD.
>> I've given up trying until I get some more confirmation, so
>>I'm not stating that it doesn't exist. I'm just assuming
>>that I'm not doing it right, or else our Asian versions of SSF2
>>don't have this bug.
>
> Has anybody outside UIUC done this--I have seen a few post on it
>from UIUC, but nowhere else...hmmmmmmm it IS convienient he tried it the
>first time he got to a SSFII and accidentally pulled it off (if I have
>my history of this right), and then was able to reproduce a bug noone
>outside UIUC (I've seen) has pulled it off. Anyone else do it? See it?
>Maybe its just the UIUC machine or they are pulling a very good joke. If
>so it was pretty good.
>
>--Jowfus and his incredible BUAK!!!!!
I hadn't read the first until after I posted. I am not from UIUC,
but from the deep south, Auburn, AL. :)
Now onto cool info: Since Ming finally posted a little info,
I can get the Teleport 2PD (T2PD) with ease. The instructions
are simple.
Whenever you defend against a hit (maybe not against jab/short,
I haven't confirmed that becuase NO-ONE ever uses them against a Z! )
you get stuck in a frozen defense for a moment. Right as you come
out of the freeze, throw the 2PD with *forward*. The timing is
as soon as you come out of the defensive freeze. After Ming's
post I went out and got it first time! All I heard all day
was "How'd you do that?" THANKS MING! Funny thing is everyone
I faced started *worring* so much about me pulling the T2PD
that they played much worse :)
You CAN!!! pull the T2PD against Slow fireballs/sonic booms/ etc!
I have been unable to pull people out of the air :(
Also: you need only time your 2PD and hit the button once. I had
no trouble just hitting the button once, but only one other Z player
has even gotten to do the move once. (Funny: the guy who originally
pulled the move cannot do it! :) Of course some of the Z players
here either snap the stick to SPD (ie: meaning they do a 1/4 to 1/2
a circle and let go of the stick, and it "twangs" when they let
go) or jam the buttons a lot. I just spin a 1/2 circle, back to
my start position and hit a button. Obviously doing the move
correctly helps...
ZanGRIEF is awesome! (and back from the dead :)
---Shamrock
Kerry Durham
>In article <durhake.93...@lab6.duc.auburn.edu>, dur...@duc.auburn.edu (Kerry Durham) writes:
>|> These things do not work. The Ken's here know it, and all us Z's
>|> know it. First, Ken does not need to time his air fierce. Trading
>|> my standing jab is the best I can do, my Z! catching a 4Xfierce is
>|> the best he can do. All us Z's used to eat up the Kens here, but
>|> then, Ken figured out he could jump and not bother timing the air
>|> fierce. If it connected, at all, 4Xfierce. None of the Z's can
>|> sac throw any of the Kens now that they just use air fierce. Ken
>|> can practically jump at Z at will.
>|> On another note: none of the attack-SPD's work against Ken. they
>|> just block jab-DP. They break it everytime. If I just hit-block
>|> (fake a hit-SPD) the DP comes out, hits my defense, and he lands
>|> safely outta SPD range. (unless he is in a corner). Enough on how
>|> to beat Ken for now... This is one hellva task against any good Ken.
>|>
>
>Hmmm... I know I sac throw lots of Kens easily. I also know that standing
>rapid jabs stops a Ken/Ryu jumping in. I've never had a problem provided I
>react fast enough. And IF the jumping fierce is knocking Zangief too far
>away to sac throw (not the SPD), then block the combo and beat Ken up afterwards.
>I know if you fierce Zangief in the top of the head he can block or sac throw
>the computer does it quite frequently.
>
is when Ken is timing his hit on your face/neck area. This is
very high on Zangief. The computer sac throws it all the time,
but us humans cannot. It *looks* like the s.jabs or lariet
will hit Ken easily outta the air, but it doesn't. 5% of the time
I might hit Ken cleanly outta the air with jabs. 30% of the time
we trade damage. 65% of the time the computer says "nice combo 3500pts"
This is not working.
Now I just simply always block. The trouble is that Ken can
jump at me at will. I cannot keep him from doing this to me.
(actually there are 6 of us Z'ers that cannot figure this out).
Also: there is a couple of Ken players that actually aim and time
there air hits. These guys know that they must time there hits
low onto there targets. The trouble is the scrub Kens see that they
need not worry about jumping at Zangief, as long as he cannot walk
under or back away from your jump. Most of these jumps come after
anyone lariets through a fireball. The Kens just hit the fierce
button about halfway through there jump, and hope we try to hit them
out of it. The tauting is annoying too.
"awww, come'on... At least *try* to hit me outta the air...<grin>..."
Of course these same jerks get sac thrown by me and the others
like crazy when we switch to any other character... but we like Z!
As for "mopping up"... it is the same:
air fierce, c.roundhouse, jump backwards.
By the time I get done blocking, Ken is completely across the screen.
He jukes a little. Throws a fireball, jumps in again.
Ok course throw in a little fakes and ticks. If I get behind it is
a real pain to come back. If the 2-swing lariet would allow
blocking fireballs at the end, I could work in a SPD as they land :)
This post is probably pointless once I start T2PDing the little
buggers!!!
ZanGRIEF's future is so bright,... He's gotta wear SHADES! 8)
---Shamrock
Kenichiro Tanaka
user Brian Od...@silver.ucs.in writes:
>[...]
>>Maybe its just the UIUC machine or they are pulling a very good joke. If
>>so it was pretty good.
>
>It has been posted that it's been done (quite frequently) at UCLA. It's also
>been done here by one person. It will catch on soon.
Yeah, there are at least four people here at CMU who have done it.
Follow Eu-Ming Lee's instructions and it really isn't _that_ hard to
pull off.
Ken
Fist of Fury
>>the computer does it quite frequently.
>>
> Ok, not to harp on this problem too much longer, but the trouble
>is when Ken is timing his hit on your face/neck area. This is
>very high on Zangief. The computer sac throws it all the time,
>but us humans cannot. It *looks* like the s.jabs or lariet
>will hit Ken easily outta the air, but it doesn't. 5% of the time
>I might hit Ken cleanly outta the air with jabs. 30% of the time
>we trade damage. 65% of the time the computer says "nice combo 3500pts"
>This is not working.
I know what you mean than; you should be able to block the second hit.
Even though you can't sac-throw. Ken's "recovery" from punches just
seems quicker; he can hit the fierce in the air fairly eary (against
anyone), and stuff buffer to a DP.
> Now I just simply always block. The trouble is that Ken can
>jump at me at will. I cannot keep him from doing this to me.
>(actually there are 6 of us Z'ers that cannot figure this out).
> Also: there is a couple of Ken players that actually aim and time
>there air hits. These guys know that they must time there hits
>low onto there targets. The trouble is the scrub Kens see that they
>need not worry about jumping at Zangief, as long as he cannot walk
>under or back away from your jump. Most of these jumps come after
>anyone lariets through a fireball. The Kens just hit the fierce
AHha! My advise would to to lariert towards him; but keep out of the
rousehouse range. (use the shorter lariet), and if he jumps in, he
should be right above you and anotehr lariet should knock him down
cleanly.
>button about halfway through there jump, and hope we try to hit them
>out of it. The tauting is annoying too.
> "awww, come'on... At least *try* to hit me outta the air...<grin>..."
>Of course these same jerks get sac thrown by me and the others
>like crazy when we switch to any other character... but we like Z!
>
> As for "mopping up"... it is the same:
>air fierce, c.roundhouse, jump backwards.
Looks like a perfect candidate to try the magic SPD. :-)
> By the time I get done blocking, Ken is completely across the screen.
>He jukes a little. Throws a fireball, jumps in again.
>Ok course throw in a little fakes and ticks. If I get behind it is
>a real pain to come back. If the 2-swing lariet would allow
>blocking fireballs at the end, I could work in a SPD as they land :)
Sounds like you don't move around when you lariet?
> This post is probably pointless once I start T2PDing the little
>buggers!!!
Fist of Fury
Thanks to the suggestions by Ming and others, I've got it down pretty
well now.
You can mSPD when you're recovering from block, it can be jab, strong,
fierce, short, forward, or roundhouse. You just need to excute it faster
than roundhouse/fierce.
After you block something, while recovering, excute the leg SPD with
forward button. If you do the running thing, you're doing it too late;
if you miss mSPD, you should still be blocking; that's the time you
have to excute it in.
- I have had no luck getting it while I get up
- I have had no luck if the other character isn't doing anything, and
I do roundhouse, then try to mSPD (somebody said they got it like that)
- I've mSPDed jabs; when Chun-Li hits you down, sometimes she comes up and
use lots of jabs. She jabed me about 4 times, which I blocked, then
I mSPDed her (definetely out of regular leg SPD range)
- I've mSPDed shorts; when DJ jumps in, he usually follows up with 3 or 4
shorts, I mSPDed him afterwards
- I've mSPDed forward, Cammy walks up, and does standing forward sometimes,
I mSPDed her afterwards. Sometimes she jumps in, and use couple of
short punches, mSPDed it
- I think somebody else mentioned this one, Honda does the RAM headbutt
thing, I mSPEDed him after he landed
- the punch/kick you're blocking doesn't have to be ground based; I've
mSPDed T. Hawk, he jumped straight up in the air, roundhouse kicked
me, which I blocked, when he landed, I mSPDed
- projectiles are a little harder to mSPD; if they have to charge thein,
it's harder. It seems like when you block one projectile, and while
your opponent is throwing another one, there is a little time which
you can't mSPD
Zangief definetely can kick butt with this move. :-)
ps, it isn't like Guile's invisible throw where he and you are not together;
when you get the mSPD, your oppoenet teleports into your arm, even when
they're all the way across the screen.
It is more useful than Guile's was, because mSPD have no range restrictions.
They just need to be on the ground. Guile's could be used no matter
if they're in the air or not, they just need to be within about 2/3
of SPD range when you excute it; they could be jumping away, then it'll
seem like a far grab. Oh well, enough babbling. :-)
Kerry Durham
One more way to T2PD (teleport-SPD):
After you take a hit, same timing, T2PD!
ie: after attempting to T2PD, I missed and ran into a FB,
and T2PD'ed before the next one hit!
I haven't gotten the c.roundhouse+T2PD to work.
Anyone gotten the jump forward+SPD to work in the air?
Someone posted that the T2PD was a "buffered" move. I
disagree. It is a timing move. You do it to early (ie: buffer)
and you won't get it. When "buffering" you throw the move
while doing another move.
ie: You throw the DP anytime during a fierce hit, and you
get the buffered DP. Timing is everthing for the T2PD.
---Shamrock
Brian Odom
>I've been messing with msgic SPD lately, here're some observations.
>Thanks to the suggestions by Ming and others, I've got it down pretty
>well now.
Well, I'm still working on it.... Give me some time...
>You can mSPD when you're recovering from block, it can be jab, strong,
>fierce, short, forward, or roundhouse. You just need to excute it faster
>than roundhouse/fierce.
For some reason, I can't do it real well after blocking an attack or FB.
>After you block something, while recovering, excute the leg SPD with
>forward button. If you do the running thing, you're doing it too late;
>if you miss mSPD, you should still be blocking; that's the time you
>have to excute it in.
This is what I believe:
If you did the running thing, you did it too late.
If you did nothing, you did it too early (you were still in block stun).
The way I time it is to do it the moment *after* block stun.
>- I have had no luck getting it while I get up
This is when I can do it best. Lots of times I get a running thing, but I
can pull it off from getting up best.
>- I have had no luck if the other character isn't doing anything, and
> I do roundhouse, then try to mSPD (somebody said they got it like that)
I've had no such luck either. I also can't do it at the beginning of the
round.
>- I've mSPDed jabs; when Chun-Li hits you down, sometimes she comes up and
> use lots of jabs. She jabed me about 4 times, which I blocked, then
> I mSPDed her (definetely out of regular leg SPD range)
I haven't done it between attacks.
>- I've mSPDed shorts; when DJ jumps in, he usually follows up with 3 or 4
> shorts, I mSPDed him afterwards
>- I've mSPDed forward, Cammy walks up, and does standing forward sometimes,
> I mSPDed her afterwards. Sometimes she jumps in, and use couple of
> short punches, mSPDed it
>- I think somebody else mentioned this one, Honda does the RAM headbutt
> thing, I mSPEDed him after he landed
>- the punch/kick you're blocking doesn't have to be ground based; I've
> mSPDed T. Hawk, he jumped straight up in the air, roundhouse kicked
> me, which I blocked, when he landed, I mSPDed
>- projectiles are a little harder to mSPD; if they have to charge thein,
> it's harder. It seems like when you block one projectile, and while
> your opponent is throwing another one, there is a little time which
> you can't mSPD
>Zangief definetely can kick butt with this move. :-)
Most definitely. He rewls the machine. Zangief with a teleport move....
and his teleport is a double throw unlike Dhalsim's weak-ass teleport.
Zangief is definitely the best character on this edition.
>ps, it isn't like Guile's invisible throw where he and you are not together;
>when you get the mSPD, your oppoenet teleports into your arm, even when
>they're all the way across the screen.
It looks so funny too and it's so *fast*. It looks like a blur....
I did it against computer Dhalsim while a FB was still traveling across.
I must of did it across the length of the entire screen... *chuckle*
>It is more useful than Guile's was, because mSPD have no range restrictions.
>They just need to be on the ground. Guile's could be used no matter
>if they're in the air or not, they just need to be within about 2/3
>of SPD range when you excute it; they could be jumping away, then it'll
>seem like a far grab. Oh well, enough babbling. :-)
Seems easier to do than Guiles, since the first time I tried magic throw with
Guile, I did it, but I was never able to do it again (even though I can get
out of handcuffs pretty easily -- I don't get it....).
--
* NCSA Mosaic http://moose.cs.indiana.edu/hyplan/bodom.html * _ __ indiana
* |) ,_ /\ | ,_ (aka Sub-Zero) * |` | go
* |)|`|(||| \/(|()||| the SF2 FAQ is at mrcnext.cso.uiuc.edu! * | | big red
* comp sci reject!! 2stupid2pass finger me for more info * /__-' IU
Philip John Stroffolino
>>After you block something, while recovering, excute the leg SPD with
>>forward button. If you do the running thing, you're doing it too late;
>>if you miss mSPD, you should still be blocking; that's the time you
>>have to excute it in.
>This is what I believe:
>If you did the running thing, you did it too late.
>If you did nothing, you did it too early (you were still in block stun).
>The way I time it is to do it the moment *after* block stun.
If you do it wayyy too late, after blocking, you'll do the running grab.
But doing it right after blocking also results in a running grab.
The 'CMU consensus' is that you need to wait a moment, and then do it.
The timing seems pretty precise.
I believe that if you are occasionally getting it while attempting a
forward kick SPD right_after_ blocking, chances are you missed the move,
and then got it a split second later, in mid grind.
Good luck to all...
Phil "and to all a good night" Stroffolino
Richard C. Lee
Amidst all these interesting and stimulating discussions about how the Z-man
can mindlessly pull magic SPDs one after another, almost like the good old days
of Guile magic throws, while their poor opponents can't do CRAP... (well if
there's some way outta it if you're not Zangief and I'm still in the stone age,
someone please enlighten me.) Why would anybody play the rest of the 15 guys?
They don't stand a chance, as the excited Zangief masters seem to suggest.
Why all those Ken/Ryu vs Chun/Cammy debate and Balrog/Honda matchups and those
four new characters... why bother?
At least Ken has to jump in to do his TOD and Ryu has to get into position for
his fireball trap. Not that I'm calling those cheap BTW. Not that I'm calling
ANYTHING cheap, for that matter. But the Z magic SPD, just like the Guile MT,
doesn't seem to be an intended addition on Capcom's part... at least it takes
the excitement of the match away anyway, in my opinion.
BUT I guess if you can pull it, and wouldn't mind doing it again and again...
more power to you.
Just my 2 cents. Sorry if I disagree with you excited Z-masters out there.
Richard Lee
infi...@leland.stanford.edu
Scott D Bradburn
|> Ok, not to harp on this problem too much longer, but the trouble
|> is when Ken is timing his hit on your face/neck area. This is
|> very high on Zangief. The computer sac throws it all the time,
|> but us humans cannot. It *looks* like the s.jabs or lariet
|> will hit Ken easily outta the air, but it doesn't. 5% of the time
|> I might hit Ken cleanly outta the air with jabs. 30% of the time
|> we trade damage. 65% of the time the computer says "nice combo 3500pts"
|> This is not working.
It's not the look. I've had quite a bit of success using them. More with
the jab then the lariet. But, not to sound like I'm bragging, if it can be
countered/sacrificed I've done it. I've counter-thrown SPD's and Typhoon's
from people who did them from too close. I can sacrifice anything that leaves
me in sac-throw range. And with the SPD that's considerable, although harder
to pull off then a regular throw. Usually I try the regular pile driver with
Zangief for my sac throw. It works well, and leaves you close to your opponent
for the 4-hit SPD combo.
|> Now I just simply always block. The trouble is that Ken can
|> jump at me at will. I cannot keep him from doing this to me.
|> (actually there are 6 of us Z'ers that cannot figure this out).
Your other choice is jump at him with roundhouse or fierce when he jumps at
you. Zangief has incredible priority with this. Especially over Ken/Ryu.
|> Also: there is a couple of Ken players that actually aim and time
|> there air hits. These guys know that they must time there hits
|> low onto there targets. The trouble is the scrub Kens see that they
|> need not worry about jumping at Zangief, as long as he cannot walk
|> under or back away from your jump. Most of these jumps come after
|> anyone lariets through a fireball. The Kens just hit the fierce
|> button about halfway through there jump, and hope we try to hit them
|> out of it. The tauting is annoying too.
Yeah, quite annoying. I think your problem (as long as x-hit combo doesn't
pop up on the screen...) is that you're slightly off on sac-throw timing
or spacing. If their too far away or you're too slow on the button you'll
get hit.
|>
|> ---Shamrock
|>
Scott
Scott D Bradburn
|>
|> This is what I believe:
|>
|> If you did the running thing, you did it too late.
I think this also comes out when the opponent is in the air.
|> If you did nothing, you did it too early (you were still in block stun).
|> The way I time it is to do it the moment *after* block stun.
|>
|> Most definitely. He rewls the machine. Zangief with a teleport move....
|> and his teleport is a double throw unlike Dhalsim's weak-ass teleport.
|> Zangief is definitely the best character on this edition.
You can fight him by knowing when it's possible to mSPD and making sure you're
not on the ground then. It also results in Zangief running at you asking to be
kicked if they miss this one.
|>
|> >It is more useful than Guile's was, because mSPD have no range restrictions.
|> >They just need to be on the ground. Guile's could be used no matter
|> >if they're in the air or not, they just need to be within about 2/3
|> >of SPD range when you excute it; they could be jumping away, then it'll
|> >seem like a far grab. Oh well, enough babbling. :-)
|>
|> Seems easier to do than Guiles, since the first time I tried magic throw with
|> Guile, I did it, but I was never able to do it again (even though I can get
|> out of handcuffs pretty easily -- I don't get it....).
The handcuffs was a simple buffer: strong throw into RK. No tough timing was
required. The same timing as St/RK only the joystick motion is done earlier.
The buffer Rh/SB does the Guile freeze. The magic throw requires very tight
timing. Both with the joystick/button press, and the spacing between button
presses. Zangief's move probably has tougher timing since it revolves around
a move the opponent does to you, but the motion and button presses are quite
easy. I doubt we'll get anyone better then 80% because of the differences
in timing depending on which attack hit you.
|> --
|> * NCSA Mosaic http://moose.cs.indiana.edu/hyplan/bodom.html * _ __ indiana
|> * |) ,_ /\ | ,_ (aka Sub-Zero) * |` | go
|> * |)|`|(||| \/(|()||| the SF2 FAQ is at mrcnext.cso.uiuc.edu! * | | big red
|> * comp sci reject!! 2stupid2pass finger me for more info * /__-' IU
Scott
Roberto Rodriguez
I didn't see it mentioned so I will. If it has, forgive my rewrite.
Zangief's magic throw can also be done just when you're getting up from
the ground (no matter what range of course).
I was playing in N.Y. and had stayed a very long time; I was Magic throwing
everyone that came in. One guy came in with Dee Jay and after I gave
him 2nd round, like I always do, I was about to loose the 3rd (couple of
missed magic throws). I was down on the ground, had no energy, he had
thrown a sonic boom that was just on top of me, and he was at the opposite
end of the screen. At this, my opponent took his hands off the controls
and sayed, "Finally!" But suddenly Dee Jay's body got teleported to my
awaiting 2PD, phasing the sonic boom and winning the match. The guy
cryed outloud as others laughed with amazement. All thanks to doing Magic
throw just when I was getting up.
I've never seen it done to a character in the air and I think it's not
possible. I've never seen it done without blocking, getting hit, or
being in range of an attack (i.e. If the opponent is just standing
there, out of range, without attacking). It can always be done against
any fireball.
John Q. Ronstedt
>|> Most definitely. He rewls the machine. Zangief with a teleport move....
>|> and his teleport is a double throw unlike Dhalsim's weak-ass teleport.
>|> Zangief is definitely the best character on this edition.
>You can fight him by knowing when it's possible to mSPD and making sure you're
>not on the ground then. It also results in Zangief running at you asking to be
>kicked if they miss this one.
>|>
>|> >It is more useful than Guile's was, because mSPD have no range restrictions.
>|> >They just need to be on the ground. Guile's could be used no matter
>|> >if they're in the air or not, they just need to be within about 2/3
>|> >of SPD range when you excute it; they could be jumping away, then it'll
>|> >seem like a far grab. Oh well, enough babbling. :-)
>|>
>|> Seems easier to do than Guiles, since the first time I tried magic throw with
>|> Guile, I did it, but I was never able to do it again (even though I can get
>|> out of handcuffs pretty easily -- I don't get it....).
>The handcuffs was a simple buffer: strong throw into RK. No tough timing was
>required. The same timing as St/RK only the joystick motion is done earlier.
>The buffer Rh/SB does the Guile freeze. The magic throw requires very tight
>timing. Both with the joystick/button press, and the spacing between button
>presses. Zangief's move probably has tougher timing since it revolves around
>a move the opponent does to you, but the motion and button presses are quite
>easy. I doubt we'll get anyone better then 80% because of the differences
>in timing depending on which attack hit you.
All those people who propose jumping as a simple counter to the magic 2PD...
I saw Caine 2PD T. Hawk while he was at the apex of his maneuver.
T Hawk was clearly in the air, and he still got teleport-thrown.
julius yang
Well, if this is true, then the only way to beat a Z would be to knock him
down less than three times in a round, or dizzy him every time you knock him
down. Otherwise he'll just SPD you every time you knock him down, no? This
seems to bode ill for the future of Super!
--
"Thou art a lame-o."
Matthew A Wallace
Except that as far as I have seen, it IS impossible to m2PD out of the air.
I've heard someone did it, but....
I HAVE gotten it consistently getting up, after blocked FB's, and after
blocked "standard" moves. BTW, on an interesting side note, Capcom did
already know about this move....(Though it IS a glitch...)
-Matthew Wallace
mwal...@ucscb.ucsc.edu
Rasheed H Rankins
|> >|> Most definitely. He rewls the machine. Zangief with a teleport move....
|> >|> and his teleport is a double throw unlike Dhalsim's weak-ass teleport.
|> >|> Zangief is definitely the best character on this edition.
|>
|> >You can fight him by knowing when it's possible to mSPD and making sure you're
|> >not on the ground then. It also results in Zangief running at you asking to be
|> >kicked if they miss this one.
|> All those people who propose jumping as a simple counter to the magic 2PD...
|> I saw Caine 2PD T. Hawk while he was at the apex of his maneuver.
|> T Hawk was clearly in the air, and he still got teleport-thrown.
Really?? I've personally seen it done while Zangief was reeling in flames.
Basically it was this: I was Dhalsim and Scott was Zangief. I was helping him
practice the magic throw and I threw a fireball at him. He messed it up and
basically ran into the fireball. He is reeling in flames and then proceeds to
magic throw me. This move is becoming more and more dangerous.
Rasheed Rankins
Brian Odom
Well, after you knock him down, you must jump.
Yes, this pretty much ruins the "fun" out of the game. But, I can do the
magic move best when getting up. For some odd reason, I can do it 80% of the
time while getting up playing against THawk. Usually while getting up I am
about 30% proficient now. But, THawk is so damn easy to T2PD. Anyone else
feel the same way?
I can T2PD after a blocked projectile about 5%
I can do it about regular blocked attack about 10-15%
I can do it after getting knocked down about 25-30%
I can do it to THawk about 75% of the time.
weird aint it?
Kenneth K Lee
Yesterday I went 4 for 4 against Ryu the fierball-monger. four blocked
fireballs, four M2PD's. Then the next round, I had 3 mega-long range M2PD's,
which grabbed Ryu after he had thrown a second fireball, which passed
harmlessly through us as Ryu went up for a ride. I had Ryu's number that
game =) Too bad I probably already lost the timing...
Brian Odom
>Except that as far as I have seen, it IS impossible to m2PD out of the air.
>I've heard someone did it, but....
>I HAVE gotten it consistently getting up, after blocked FB's, and after
>blocked "standard" moves. BTW, on an interesting side note, Capcom did
>already know about this move....(Though it IS a glitch...)
Huh? Are you telling me they knew about it and didn't bother to fix it?
That doesn't sound right. And where did you find this information from?
Maybe you mean that they know about it already which I would be willing to
believe, but I don't think they would have released this game knowing that
the glitch was there. I know they wanted to hurry up and get SSF2 shipped
out and all, but I'm most positive they wouldn't have sent us a buggy version
on purpose.
Scott C. Dang
It's not that hard, all you need to do is whenever you knock Z down, just
jump up while he's getting up, so that he can not MT you. I haven't seen
nor have I been able to execute a MT while a person is airborn. I've
read somewhre that a person claims he has seen people get thrown out of
the air. I'm finding that hard to believe.
has anyone here been able to do this? I know I haven't nor have the people
I've shown this to have.
.-------------------------------------------------.
[ A Message from Scott C. Dang <scd...@ctp.org> |
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