Neopets day of action, on PPT.
Clotho
Front page!
:D This has really boosted my morale. Thank you ppt.
--
*Clo
-----sig------
The greatest free game on the 'net
Not just a "Virtual Pet". There's games, you can own your own shop,
Fight your pet in the battledome, Collect trophies & more!
http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=clotho
Gareeth
"Clotho" <clo...@nospam.net> wrote in message
news:40db6cf8$0$22497$7b0f...@mistral.news.newnet.co.uk...
That's great. With exposure like that the day of action might actually get
enough people for neopets to notice.
Gareeth
Balyn
"Clotho" <clo...@nospam.net> wrote in message
news:40db6cf8$0$22497$7b0f...@mistral.news.newnet.co.uk...
put it up in its entirity. Won't take more than
a gentle nudge reminder for me to not even
log on the 3rd.
Balyn
~Kerry~
"Clotho" <clo...@nospam.net> wrote in message
news:40db6cf8$0$22497$7b0f...@mistral.news.newnet.co.uk...
would risk their fan site agreement to actually help fans.
doctorgunner
"Clotho" <clo...@nospam.net> wrote in message
news:40db6cf8$0$22497$7b0f...@mistral.news.newnet.co.uk...
the basic information there - it is a guild with almost 5500 members (many
are not active tho)
coppr...@bellsouth.net
"Clotho" <clo...@nospam.net> wrote in message
news:40db6cf8$0$22497$7b0f...@mistral.news.newnet.co.uk...
I brought to the attention of my guild mates your article on PPT and I can't
believe the negative response that came back at me! I mentioned that I
thought it was a good idea and that I'd be participating and wow lol Was
just wondering if anyone else had come up against such negativity? Won't
deter me. I still think it is a good idea :)
doctorgunner
<coppr...@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:c15Dc.230$r21...@bignews2.bellsouth.net...
For the most part, the active members of my guild are expressing an
interest - starting with the leader
>
>
cjufnf
news:c15Dc.230$r21...@bignews2.bellsouth.net...
> I brought to the attention of my guild mates your article on PPT and I
can't
> believe the negative response that came back at me! I mentioned that I
> thought it was a good idea and that I'd be participating and wow lol Was
> just wondering if anyone else had come up against such negativity? Won't
> deter me. I still think it is a good idea :)
Did you read the comment box on PPT for the article? Once you get near the
end several boisterous people continue to voice their negative opinions and
lash out at others who support the article.
cjufnf
~Kerry~
well the news has made it to the neopet chat boards, i've seen quite a few
this morning . I haven't seen any being deleted yet, but am curious if
anyone else see's it happening.
who-ya
much.
"~Kerry~" <kpmatia...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:ULeDc.44879$Nz.23...@news20.bellglobal.com...
~Kerry~
"who-ya" <who...@socal.rr.com> wrote in message
news:ULhDc.521$Fy...@twister.socal.rr.com...
> which board exactly? I dont have the patience to look at those boards
very
> much.
>
>
and i think i used to many 'ands' in this sentance.
~Kerry~
Regarding neopets day of action
what really gets me is the comments on pinkpt.com that refer to neopets
being free so your getting what you pay for, Neopets had 15 million in
revenue and i doubt that the entire 15 million was sucked back into the
company, realistcally adam and donna probably walked away with 5 million
each profit (before taxes of course)., would it really hurt them to each
loose 500,000 profit and roll it back into the comany for 10 extra staff
members (assuming that their staff is paid that well to begin with)
mikki
Adam and Donna are not the owners of Neopets any more; they were bought out by a
rich business man who also happens to be a Scientologist. I mention that
because some people have very strong feelings towards Scientology. I don't
remember when Neopets was bought, but it has been a while.
>
>
~Kerry~
"mikki" <mikk...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:2k648gF...@uni-berlin.de...
is owned by Doug C. Dohring incase anyone is wondering)
mikki
> >
> uggg sorry my bad, I forgot that neo became incorporated a while back (Neo
> is owned by Doug C. Dohring incase anyone is wondering)
Not a problem, and thanks for reminding me of his name. I definitely agree with
your previous comments, though. Businesses, such as Neopets, should put much
more of their profits back into the company, and toward qualified personnel.
Neopets could certainly use lots more help!
>
>
Les
Maybe they do.
I was having a conversation with father-in-law sometime ago about the
cost of medicines; he thinks they are outrageously priced and are sold
by profiteers. Now as it happens, my brother works in the US for a
medical research company and they have just released their first drug on
to the market and I have a vague idea how much this has all cost as well
as how much time it has taken.
They have make no money for 5 years and have used millions of dollars of
venture capital to fund their work. This drug means that those who
risked their money are going to see an excellent return on their
investment, but one can only assume that in such a risky business some
bets pay off while others do not.
My thoughts are it is the same with companies like Neopets and other
Internet ventures - most haven't made it and lots of investors have lost
money, and they are probably the same people who are now doing OK with
Neopets. And for all we know, Neopets may have millions of dollars in
debt from their start up days.
$15,000,000 revenue does not mean $15,000,000 profit. Nor does it mean
$15,000,000 wages.
Just my thoughts, and without seeing their accounts I am just
speculating of course. :-)
wotsitgizmo
"Les" <L...@invalid.com.invalid> wrote in message
news:MPG.1b4813d26...@News.individual.DE...
Neopets was started by Adam and Donna when they were in college, back when
they were in the UK, so I doubt very much that they would have started in
debt(at least not millions, just the usual college debts).
Les
> > Just my thoughts, and without seeing their accounts I am just
> > speculating of course. :-)
>
> Neopets was started by Adam and Donna when they were in college, back when
> they were in the UK, so I doubt very much that they would have started in
> debt(at least not millions, just the usual college debts).
I have read about Neopets history and I was in fact born just down the
road from Guilford (useless fact number 345234).
Starting a business is not cheap, and until the profits start rolling in
you have to rely on savings or loans (or another job). You need
premises, computers, staff, and you still need to pay for somewhere to
live and to eat at the same time.
A group of my friends bought out a business 4 or 5 years ago and they
had to mortgage their houses for the capital. The rent of their factory
alone is £10,000 a month (they are now looking to buy and the going rate
is £1.2 million they tell me). They however are now turning a profit and
pay themselves a large Christmas bonus that is going towards paying off
the loans they took out to fund their initial investment.
Another of my friends has just lost his business to the banks because be
had a few customers that would not pay (long story and some was my
friend's fault while some was not), he reached his overdraft limit and
the bank foreclosed. He had left a "proper" job to set up on his own
around 10 years ago and took out a business loan to pay the rent on the
building, for computers and for initial stock. While the business turned
a small profit, it was never enough to clear all his start-up loans - he
just had enough to pay wages and overheads - so when it all went tits up
he was left with a massive debt. He has sadly lost his house.
The point to my ramblings, is that starting a business is very expensive
and even if you start in your bedroom, unless you turn a profit quickly
and can expand using that profit, businesses need to borrow money.
Neopets moved half way round the world, set up in a building and bought
computers and hired staff - it all needed to be paid for and I doubt
their student loans covered it. But there again, maybe one of them had a
rich parent or something. :-)
Duckie Ž
<kpmatia...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>i've seen boards on the games chat and the help chat and the battledome chat
>and i think i used to many 'ands' in this sentance.
>
Remember that female that was in here--promoting her 10k per day
manual? I see she is in the games chat---doing the same exact thing.
Duckie
Duckie Ž
<kpmatia...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>i've seen boards on the games chat and the help chat and the battledome chat
>and i think i used to many 'ands' in this sentance.
>
Forgot the link :(
http://www.neopets.com/neoboards/topic.phtml?topic=28321632
Ray Newman
> uggg sorry my bad, I forgot that neo became incorporated a while back (Neo
> is owned by Doug C. Dohring incase anyone is wondering)
Discovering that Neopets is owned by a follower of L. Ron Hubbard is one
of the biggest buzzkills I have encountered in a long while. :-(
--
Ray Newman
r...@spankaroonietwounderpants.com
(remove underpants to reply)
http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=goofyspouse
Charlie
Charlie.
"Ray Newman" <r...@spankaroonietwounderpants.com> wrote in message
news:40e07bcc$0$87051$45be...@newscene.com...
---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.707 / Virus Database: 463 - Release Date: 15/06/2004
evianhat
> wotsitgizmo said
>
> > > Just my thoughts, and without seeing their accounts I am just
> > > speculating of course. :-)
> >
> > Neopets was started by Adam and Donna when they were in college, back when
> > they were in the UK, so I doubt very much that they would have started in
> > debt(at least not millions, just the usual college debts).
>
> Neopets moved half way round the world, set up in a building and bought
> computers and hired staff - it all needed to be paid for and I doubt
> their student loans covered it. But there again, maybe one of them had a
> rich parent or something. :-)
Actually, the neopets.com website was started in the U.S. (in an
apartment in Beverly Hills) by 4 people: Donna, Adam, a web designer
also named Adam, and myself, Thomas Deaton, another game programmer,
in late 1999. Adam, Adam and Donna were here in the U.S. on VISA's
doing work for the same company I was doing work for in Malibu.
We started it on a shoestring budget, and several companies became
quickly interested in purchasing it from us. We recognized that we
did not have the financial resources to buy the servers to handle the
incredible growth that we were seeing. We also could not hire any
people to help us handle all of the emails we were getting.
We ended up selling it to a company that did have those resources.
Today, from what I understand (I don't work on the neopets.com website
anymore), neopets runs on something like 200 servers and they have
around 50 employees.
I imagine that, with all the expenses for salaries, advertising,
web-hosting, office space, etc., Neopets does not have much left over
from that $15 million annual income. And remember, income is not the
same as profit.
I'm not a businessman, but I've heard it said that it takes the
average start-up company 5 years before it becomes profitable. And,
that 99 out of 100 start-ups fail. Neopets, so far, is one of those
rare 1 out of 100 that is still around. Hopefully, it can make it
down that last stretch to get to the point where it is profitable and
has the legs to be around for a long time to come.
- Thomas Deaton
ps: there were no rich parents involved; that would have made things
really easy for us way back then. :)
mikki
news:12842e30.04062...@posting.google.com...
<snip>
> Actually, the neopets.com website was started in the U.S. (in an
> apartment in Beverly Hills) by 4 people: Donna, Adam, a web designer
> also named Adam, and myself, Thomas Deaton, another game programmer,
> in late 1999. Adam, Adam and Donna were here in the U.S. on VISA's
> doing work for the same company I was doing work for in Malibu.
> - Thomas Deaton
>
> ps: there were no rich parents involved; that would have made things
> really easy for us way back then. :)
Thanks for posting - this is very interesting, an especially fun surprise to
hear from someone involved from the beginning! When did you stop working with
Neopets?
Les
> > ps: there were no rich parents involved; that would have made things
> > really easy for us way back then. :)
>
> Thanks for posting - this is very interesting, an especially fun surprise to
> hear from someone involved from the beginning! When did you stop working with
> Neopets?
It has long been published that it all started as a student site in the
UK. There is even a picture of the first Neopet's office in Guilford on
the Neocam page of the web site, and apparently, again according to the
Neopet's website, they bought pizza in the pub across the road. Hadn't
someone better tell Adam or Donna that it never happened. :-)
But then I suppose there is started and there is *started*. First ideas
(while in Nottingham apparently) through to the site called Neopets.com
based in CA that we see today. Who takes the credit? Who claims to have
"been there"?
Or has it just been one long shaggy dog story all the time? A cover to
indoctrinate children into scientology and eating hamburgers?
LOL!
evianhat
Oh, I don't think it's anything as sinister as indoctrination or
anything. ;)
We hatched the idea in around August of '99, then started building the
site in September. All of this occurred in California. We launched
it in November, then Donna, Adam and Adam had to go back to the U.K.
for VISA reasons. While they were over there, the sale of the site
started to go through, and I stopped working on the site sometime
around February of 2000. So, they may indeed have worked out of an
office in the U.K.. I'm not sure. Technically, Neopets, Inc. (which
purchased the neopets.com site from us) came into being after I left,
and the original offices of Neopets, Inc. might have been in the U.K.
We actually took Polaroid pictures in November of each of us pressing
the Enter button on Adam's computer to launch the web server that
launched neopets.com. I don't know where those are at anymore.
Looking back, it would have been cool to keep a set. :)
Ray Newman
> Or has it just been one long shaggy dog story all the time? A cover to
> indoctrinate children into scientology and eating hamburgers?
LMAO! I just spewed saltine dust all over the place. Never did a "dry"
spit take before...it was kinda funny. :-p
The whole Scientology connection at Neopets is a little creepy. *shudder*
A. M. Hawk Widner
>
> The whole Scientology connection at Neopets is a little creepy. *shudder*
>
what he believed could be a profitable business is creepy? How odd. If he
was a Catholic or a Wiccan, would that also be creepy? What if he was a
Jehovah's Witness? Or a Muslim?
I fail to see what his faith has to do with his business investment.
Les
Knowing something about such things, anyone who is into scientology is a
little "odd" IMO. Sure it is their prerogative but round here (a seaside
holiday town) they walk the streets and actively try to suck lonely
young people into their rather expensive cult. When I was younger and
went to such places, they would often hang around the amusement arcades
and pester pester pester anyone who was on their own.
When was the last time a catholic or a muslim (I don't know what a
Wiccan is) did that to you?
Sure Christians can hassle with the best of them, especially the born
again ones who latch on to people they wish to "save" - but how often do
you see them picking on children and how often are they really after
money rather than the "soul"?
And of course Scientologists do not believe in "god" (but little
creatures from outer space existing within each of us or at least
something like that) so it remains to be seen that it is indeed a
religion and in the UK (and most of Europe) this status has been
withheld from it - much to their irritation as it means they must pay
taxes. This status was withheld from then in US until the early 90s -
and the story of how it changed is worth a read if you enjoy a good
"conspiracy theory".
Anyone can believe what they like as far as I'm concerned, as long as it
doesn't involve sucking the brains or finances out of people, especially
those who are vulnerable.
Gets of soapbox.
A. M. Hawk Widner
>>
> When was the last time a catholic or a muslim (I don't know what a
> Wiccan is) did that to you?
>
in some countries some Muslims are still doing so). And Wicca is a sort of
revival of ancient cults that worship the various "spirits of nature". They
also can be a bit evangelical.
There are Scientology nuts around here - and never have they misbehaved as
far as I can see. You meet a few bad apples in one religious sect and judge
the whole lot by them? And I don't believe that anyone has yet tried to use
Neopets to recruit me to anything except occasionally to buy a box of Reeses
Puffs cereal or a McD Happy Meal.
I just think being creeped out because a business man who happens to belong
to an odd sect invested in a game site is just plain silly.
Anonymous
> Knowing something about such things, anyone who is into scientology is a
> little "odd" IMO. Sure it is their prerogative but round here (a seaside
> holiday town) they walk the streets and actively try to suck lonely
> young people into their rather expensive cult. When I was younger and
> went to such places, they would often hang around the amusement arcades
> and pester pester pester anyone who was on their own.
>
> When was the last time a catholic or a muslim (I don't know what a
> Wiccan is) did that to you?
I have a hard time believing you live in the UK but you don't know what a
Wiccan is (nope, I'm not being mean. I'm genuinely surprised!) Everyone I
know from the UK is either a Wiccan or they definitely know about the
religion. I never thought people over there wouldn't know about it. Maybe
it's just the group of people I'm friends with. Not to mention it has been
the "fad" for many a teenager who think they are immediately witches for
being Wiccan. Those people are not usually considered true Wiccans. It is
more of a rebellion phase I guess (Maybe from their parents or the religion
they were raised with.) Anyways, here's part of an FAQ from
alt.religion.wicca.moderated:
1.2 What is Wicca?
Wicca, (pronounced Wick-ah) is a nature based religion which celebrates and
venerates nature and life and worships the Goddess and God in their various
forms. There are many different "Traditions" in Wicca, but the religion as a
whole has no central authority or ruling body, and it is without strict
dogma.
There is an emphasis on individuality, as each person is essentially
responsible for their own actions and free to follow their own paths and
beliefs. This is not to say that Wicca itself is structureless. Many Wiccans
work with like-minded others to form covens which do have an internal
hierarchy, but covens often differ from one to another as to their practices
and beliefs.
>
> Sure Christians can hassle with the best of them, especially the born
> again ones who latch on to people they wish to "save" - but how often do
> you see them picking on children and how often are they really after
> money rather than the "soul"?
I see Christians pick on children all the time. That's why I don't like most
of them. Baptists are the worst in my neighborhood. They'll knock on your
door, corner you, and talk to you about God and Jesus for 40 minutes (child
or adult). You get to the point where you want to set up a mine field in
your front yard so they can't reach your door. Or bear traps. Those are good
too.
Duckie Ž
Wait until you run into a Jehovah Witness.
Duckie
Charlie
"Anonymous" <notha...@nothankyou.com> wrote in message
news:v9zEc.3214$wY5.1245@attbi_s54...
>
> I have a hard time believing you live in the UK but you don't know what a
> Wiccan is (nope, I'm not being mean. I'm genuinely surprised!) Everyone I
> know from the UK is either a Wiccan or they definitely know about the
> religion.
Maybe you only know a small group of people with similar intrests. I don't
know any Wiccans. I dabbled with Paganism for a while, but decided my
Christian roots were more for me. Although I do like some of the principals
of Satanism (i.e. - enjoyy yourself!)
Charlie
Les
> There are Scientology nuts around here - and never have they misbehaved as
> far as I can see. You meet a few bad apples in one religious sect and judge
> the whole lot by them?
In the case of something like Scientology - then "yes".
What I have experienced is how they operate as an organisation rather
than the "misbehaviour" of one or two individuals - and that is exactly
the point.
> And I don't believe that anyone has yet tried to use
> Neopets to recruit me to anything except occasionally to buy a box of Reeses
> Puffs cereal or a McD Happy Meal.
Indeed.
> I just think being creeped out because a business man who happens to belong
> to an odd sect invested in a game site is just plain silly.
What is silly about making money?
Les
> I have a hard time believing you live in the UK but you don't know what a
> Wiccan is (nope, I'm not being mean. I'm genuinely surprised!) Everyone I
> know from the UK is either a Wiccan or they definitely know about the
> religion.
Nope - never heard of it, in life or on the TV. Maybe it is a "new
generation" thing?
> I never thought people over there wouldn't know about it. Maybe
> it's just the group of people I'm friends with. Not to mention it has been
> the "fad" for many a teenager who think they are immediately witches for
> being Wiccan. Those people are not usually considered true Wiccans. It is
> more of a rebellion phase I guess (Maybe from their parents or the religion
> they were raised with.) Anyways, here's part of an FAQ from
> alt.religion.wicca.moderated:
So it is a young people thing. I'm middle-aged. :-)
> I see Christians pick on children all the time. That's why I don't like most
> of them. Baptists are the worst in my neighborhood. They'll knock on your
> door, corner you, and talk to you about God and Jesus for 40 minutes (child
> or adult). You get to the point where you want to set up a mine field in
> your front yard so they can't reach your door. Or bear traps. Those are good
> too.
Yep, the "born again" types. While not condoning this behaviour, it is
not the same as the recruiting techniques used by Scientology - not
least because Christians tend to be "genuinely" after your soul, not
*all* your savings (although Christians do donate a fixed percentage of
their income to their church).
Also, with over zealous Christians, whatever the sect, you know what and
who you are dealing with. Scientology techniques often include getting
people through their door under false pretenses and then slowly, while
building up trust, they are pulled into the the ideas and indoctrination
of the organisation.
I may not know what Wiccan means but I do know a bit about Scientology.
Les
> (although Christians do donate a fixed percentage of their income to their church).
That should have said "some" Christians.
Clotho
> > I have a hard time believing you live in the UK but you don't know what
a
> > Wiccan is (nope, I'm not being mean. I'm genuinely surprised!) Everyone
I
> > know from the UK is either a Wiccan or they definitely know about the
> > religion.
*hangs head* well.. I'm a 'merikn soon to become UK-citizen.. So not quite
the same..
But I fall into the second category.
I'm a wiccan :D
--
*Clo
-----sig------
The greatest free game on the 'net
Not just a "Virtual Pet". There's games, you can own your own shop,
Fight your pet in the battledome, Collect trophies & more!
http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=clotho
Anonymous
news:40e2e480$0$22504$7b0f...@mistral.news.newnet.co.uk...
> *hangs head* well.. I'm a 'merikn soon to become UK-citizen.. So not quite
> the same..
> But I fall into the second category.
> I'm a wiccan :D
>
>
> --
> *Clo
> -----sig------
> The greatest free game on the 'net
> Not just a "Virtual Pet". There's games, you can own your own shop,
> Fight your pet in the battledome, Collect trophies & more!
> http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=clotho
Hurray! I'm considering. Still haven't decided yet...
Ray Newman
Then you fail to understand the nature of Scientology and should
really educate yourself about it.
Dreamstalker
> "Les" <> wrote in message
>
>>When was the last time a catholic or a muslim (I don't know what a
>>Wiccan is) did that to you?
>
> A few times (and in days long ago they did so by force - believe or die, and
> in some countries some Muslims are still doing so). And Wicca is a sort of
> revival of ancient cults that worship the various "spirits of nature". They
> also can be a bit evangelical.
Wicca is NOT a cult by the accepted definition of such...at least not
the definition used by law enforcement to determine the probable danger
of a group. Some sub-groups (traditions) or individuals can be
evangelical, but it is not the accepted practice. Education, yes;
attempted conversion, no.
> There are Scientology nuts around here - and never have they misbehaved as
> far as I can see. You meet a few bad apples in one religious sect and judge
> the whole lot by them? And I don't believe that anyone has yet tried to use
> Neopets to recruit me to anything except occasionally to buy a box of Reeses
> Puffs cereal or a McD Happy Meal.
>
> I just think being creeped out because a business man who happens to belong
> to an odd sect invested in a game site is just plain silly.
IMO/E, Scientology is not just an "odd" sect. It is far worse than
that. YOu can always leave a sect. Scientology, you literally cannot
leave. They can and will ruin you if you do (A&E did an expose program
on the cult some time ago).
Ray Newman
wrote:
>IMO/E, Scientology is not just an "odd" sect. It is far worse than
>that. YOu can always leave a sect. Scientology, you literally cannot
>leave. They can and will ruin you if you do (A&E did an expose program
>on the cult some time ago).
Exactly. My favorite tactic they have used to combat those who would
label them a cult: take over CAN (the Cult Awareness Network) and
simply redefine what a cult is. Insidious bastards.
http://www.rickross.com/reference/scientology/scien427.html
Anonymous
"Ray Newman" <ray_n...@hotmailunderpants.com> wrote in message
news:6rc6e0pjrlefq1n7r...@4ax.com...
> Exactly. My favorite tactic they have used to combat those who would
> label them a cult: take over CAN (the Cult Awareness Network) and
> simply redefine what a cult is. Insidious bastards.
>
> http://www.rickross.com/reference/scientology/scien427.html
>
> --
> Ray Newman
> r...@spankaroonietwounderpants.com
> (remove underpants to reply)
> http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=goofyspouse
Here's a website that dedicates itself to fighting the Church of Scientology
(I did a little googling after this discussion about Scientology arose.)
It has quite a bit of interesting information!
A. M. Hawk Widner
> Here's a website that dedicates itself to fighting the Church of
Scientology
I guess I have seen too much of what evil individuals, religious, and
political bodies can and will do - even mainstream ones, in fact especially
mainstream ones - to be put off by the Scientology boogieman. Every
religion, even my own, has a dirty little secret or two they wish they could
forget - and has influence in areas where they ought not - and whether by
direct evangelism or by becoming the establishment and thereby de facto law
of the land, every religion tries to put its grubby hands on my puppet
strings.
Les
Scientology is *not* a religion.
L. Ron simply understood that promoting his business as a religion would
be good for business. He also understood that courting celebrates would
give him credibility and that the core of Scientology, telling all your
secrets and paying for the privilege, would mean that a hold could be
maintained over all who entered, including the celebrities.
Scientology does not have a few "dirty little secrets" but has
exploitation at it's very core, and *that* is the difference between
Scientology and the sort of shameful behaviour sometimes seen in day-to-
day religions that can usually just be attributed to single individuals.
If someone I knew told me they were to become a member of an
organisation - religious or otherwise - I would either be pleased for
them or maybe a little worried, depending on the organisation. If that
same person told me that had become a member of The Church (sic) of
Scientology I would be scared shitless.
OverRun
Do some research on Google and judge for yourself. Time Magazine, the
Los Angeles Times, and others have published articles on Scientology
also.
http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=overrun204