Fun over the city
TOCA
recon photo gallery of Copenhagen. This means F-16's will be criscrossing
the sky, at low altitudes above my head for the next 5 days :o)
How did I find that out? Well I had two of them playing arround over the
house for abot 20 min, and wondered what on earth was going on, so I had to
vissit the AirForces website to get some info.
It didn't look like they were doing photo recon, it looked more like playing
arround up there, but who cares, as long as they'll be back tomorrow :o)
I was sitting quietly tinkering with my new computer, when all of a suddent
the silence was broken by the loud roar of a jet engine, being way lower
than normal, so I rushed to the window to see if any one was going to land
in my back yard, but it was gone before I got my a** moved all 4 metres. As
I was dissapointly moving back, then it was there again, and I got a short
glimpse of a fighter rushing past.
Next thing, I reached for my binoculars and rushed outside, to see what it
was all about, and I got to see those 2 F-16's doing tight turns and a few
nice looking maneuvers over the area, it looked like a slow chase untill the
front one made a steap climb followed by a roll, like he was indicating "OK
you got me, I'm bailing out", and then he came back down right next to his
wingmann, and they went into the clouds and dissapeared into the distance
:o)
Oh boy I hope they'll be back here again tomorrow :o)
One thing baffled me though, normally I can tell from the sound, that it's a
F-16, but these two sounded different, it was a low pitch sound like airline
engines, but F-16's usually have a verry distinct high pitch sound, followed
by a thunder, and you normally don't hear them untill they pass by. Could it
be the two huge pods mounted underneath them, that made them sound
different, or have they gotten new engines, changing the sound?
Tommy C, Denmark
My day is made :o)
Dallas
> F-16, but these two sounded different, it was a low pitch sound like airline
> engines, but F-16's usually have a verry distinct high pitch sound
The F-16's F-100 engine is equipped with a variable exhaust nozzle. When
they fly slowly, the nozzle is wide open accounting for the wall rattling,
deep thunder kinda sound. They tighten the nozzle down to fly faster and
that accounts for the different types of sound they produce.
(Disclaimer - Totally my personal observations and conclusion.. but I'd be
surprised if that wasn't the answer.)
--
Dallas
Loek
Sorry Dallas, not quite so.
The nozzle is variable, but (generally speaking!) only to avoid massive
pressure build-up when using AB. They are full open at idle and will close
when powering up until (sort of) fully closed at military power. (something
like 96% rpm in the F-16). As soon as you select AB, the nozzle will open.
If the nozzle does not open for any reason, the AB will not light.
With an open nozzle at any power setting below AB thy will not have any
thrust whatsoever making you grasp for the bailout handle. So no open nozzle
at slow flight! In flight the nozzle of the F-16 will remain closed at idle.
It will only open with the gear on the ground. The F-104 had a handle (ask
MM) to close the nozzle mechanically in case the nozzle opened due to loss
of engine oil or CADC failure if I remember correctly. The flow will go
right through the engine. You need the nozzle to close and build up that
pressure necessary to develop your thrust. It is impossible to explain that
in short here, but have a look here.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Propelling_nozzle#Convergent_nozzles
Tommy, I wonder what kind of sound you are referring to. As far as I know
we (Danes and Dutch) are using the same engine. From what you are telling
about the two F-16's I guess(!) they were switching lead. Very well possible
there was a younger guy in the chase initially. With the barrel roll (that's
aerobatics below 6000' if I understood correctly!!) and coming down next to
the other F-16 I presume the lead switched to Bravo position. Doing it the
other way around, from Bravo to lead with a manoeuvre like that would be a
wee bit too dangerous. You need to end up in front of the other and that
does not feel right. Ending up behind is a lot easier.
Capice?
Loek
"Dallas" <Cybnorm@spam_me_not.Hotmail.Com> schreef in bericht
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Loek
For some reason it says "not quit so" twice. Didn't mean it like that
Dallas, but it looks funny .... :-))
Loek
"Loek" <jus...@me.nl> schreef in bericht
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TOCA
"Loek" <jus...@me.nl> skrev i en meddelelse
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> Tommy, I wonder what kind of sound you are referring to. As far as I know
> we (Danes and Dutch) are using the same engine. From what you are telling
> about the two F-16's I guess(!) they were switching lead. Very well
> possible there was a younger guy in the chase initially. With the barrel
> roll (that's aerobatics below 6000' if I understood correctly!!) and
> coming down next to the other F-16 I presume the lead switched to Bravo
> position. Doing it the other way around, from Bravo to lead with a
> manoeuvre like that would be a wee bit too dangerous. You need to end up
> in front of the other and that does not feel right. Ending up behind is a
> lot easier.
>
>
>
> Capice?
>
>
>
> Loek
>
The sound I'm refering to is the distinct sound that F-16's normaly make,
first there is no sound at all, but as soon as it passes by, there is a
verry high pitch sound, like 100 (verry large) bullwhips are cracking verry
rapidly after each other. As far as I know they are the only planes making
that sound, and I've seen a few up close and personal, some even a bit too
close for my liking at the moment (2x F-35 Saab Draken taking off right
over my head, full AB at about 10 metres).
The two planes today sounded just like any other jet engines, except they
moved a bit faster than the normal traffic passing over this place, which
made me wonder if one of the upgrades they've gotten were a new type of
engines, also I could hear them comming, which is a first for me, with that
model :o/
And yes they were well below 6000 ft, my estimate is about 2 - 3000 ft or
maybe less :o)
It was quite a wiew, but not the greatest I've seen, by far. My best memory
is still a dogfight between an American F-14 and a Danish F-16 also below
3000 ft, above one of the suburbs of Copenhagen, durring a large NATO
exersice about 10 years ago, THAT was spectacular :o)
Tommy C, Denmark
Dallas
> So no open nozzle at slow flight!
Damn, see why I used a disclaimer.. :- )
But, I know what Tommy is talking about. Most years the National Guard
will fly over my house with F-16s in the missing man formation on Memorial
day.
I grew up on Air Force Bases so I'm pretty used to fighter jet sounds, but
the F-16s flying low and slow made a tremendously loud sound that was
surprising to me.
--
Dallas
Günter Mangold
news:4a523010$0$10729$a926...@news.buzzardnews.com...
> Sorry Dallas, not quite so.
Guten Tag Loek
Somehow OT. May I ask, how many real F-104 landings did you do at ETSL. ?
Still today GAF JG-32 Lechfeld Tornado wing.
Regards G�nter
Loek
Not too often. I need to check my logbook for that.
F�rsty was more popular as it was closer to M�nchen, especially during
Oktoberfest :-)). And with our tasks at those times our training took place
more in the centre part of the country, let's say around G�tersloh -
Hannover - Kassel area.
However, I do remember a great squadron exchange we had in Memmingen with
F-104's. With an exchange part of our squadron went to Memmingen and part of
their squadron came to Volkel during about a week, weekend included! The
goal was just to get to know each other better during training together and
socializing. We enjoyed some great games at the squadron with hammer and
nails, sneezing powder and (some) beer, BBQ's and of course the weekend trip
to Kloster Andechs for some reel fine beer. At least, that was what we
thought of it. I still have the blue white scarf in remembrance of a great
time with some very hospitable people!
Loek
"G�nter Mangold" <guenter...@t-online.de> schreef in bericht
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Cow@me.com Canuck
I just checked http://www.abbotsfordairshow.com/ and am disappointed that we
have no major US teams this year.
In previous years we have had the T-Birds visit with their F-16's. They
practiced on each occasion for about 4 days prior to the show for long
periods.
Living almost directly under the flightpath it was a tremendous sight to
see. Scared the bejeezus out of my pup last year though......
This year no big teams other than the Snowbirds (and they are quiet in
comparison), although I see a MiG17 (restored) will be flying - should be
very interesting.
Sorry to steal your thread....... :-)
"TOCA" <n...@valid.com> wrote in message
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TOCA
"TOCA" <n...@valid.com> skrev i en meddelelse
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>
> Oh boy I hope they'll be back here again tomorrow :o)
>
Unfortunately not right on top of my home, but a bit further to the East,
and a bit higher, and only one plane :o/
Guess you winn some and loose some :o/
I think I have the difference in sounds figured out? They fly verry slow and
has to fly with the nose at about 10-15 deg. up, to compensate for the low
speed, maybe that's why they sound different, I normaly see them straight
and level, going kind of fast :o/
Tommy C, Denmark
John Ward
Pardon my ignorance, mate, but what's a hammer and nail game?
Regards,
John Ward
"Loek" <jus...@me.nl> wrote in message
news:4a52fb1b$0$7721$a926...@news.buzzardnews.com...
rob
> Hi Loek,
>
> Pardon my ignorance, mate, but what's a hammer and nail game?
>
> Regards,
>
> news:4a52fb1b$0$7721$a926...@news.buzzardnews.com...
>
>
>
> > Gee,
>
> > Not too often. I need to check my logbook for that.
> > Oktoberfest :-)). And with our tasks at those times our training took
> > Hannover - Kassel area.
>
> > However, I do remember a great squadron exchange we had in Memmingen with
> > F-104's. With an exchange part of our squadron went to Memmingen and part
> > of their squadron came to Volkel during about a week, weekend included!
> > The goal was just to get to know each other better during training
> > together and socializing. We enjoyed some great games at the squadron with
> > hammer and nails, sneezing powder and (some) beer, BBQ's and of course the
> > weekend trip to Kloster Andechs for some reel fine beer. At least, that
> > was what we thought of it. I still have the blue white scarf in
> > remembrance of a great time with some very hospitable people!
>
> > Loek
>
> >news:h2upna$5k2$00$1...@news.t-online.com...
> >> "Loek" <just...@me.nl> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
> >>news:4a523010$0$10729$a926...@news.buzzardnews.com...
> >>> Sorry Dallas, not quite so.
> >> [snip]
> >> Guten Tag Loek
> >> Somehow OT. May I ask, how many real F-104 landings did you do at ETSL. ?
> >> Still today GAF JG-32 Lechfeld Tornado wing.
>
> - Show quoted text -
Günter Mangold
ETSL is a little closer to Andechs then EDJA (no more GAF there today)
G�nter
"Loek" <jus...@me.nl> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
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Loek
You should try that :-O. G�nther, correct my memory if necessary, but first
you take about 4 inches of this sneezing powder (very popular then!),
followed by this huge glass of beer, after which you then have to try to hit
a big nail in this piece of tree trunk with as less hammer blows as
possible. I'll try to find some photos I made then. It was a good thing it
was nice weather with the windows open and close by!! :-). Some could not
keep it all in.....
Loek
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