Diplomatic victory?
Andrew R. Gillett
In my first game, I saved the game and decided to see what would happen
if I tried to get myself elected Supreme Leader.
Political situation:
Me - huge
Morgan (pact) - tiny
Yang and Zakharov (vendetta) - small
Myself and Morgan voted Yea, Yang and Zakharov voted Nay. I still won.
Why? What's this about having to eliminate anyone who defies the will of
the council? And it can't be right that I'm allowed to vote myself in
just because I'm huge. That's not diplomatic. Diplomatic should MEAN
diplomatic, I should have to get everyone to like me.
--
Andrew Gillett http://argnet.fatal-design.com/ ICQ: See homepage
"I am not a hobby horse, oh no. I am a hobby lion, which is the king of the
hobby kingdom and much better than a horse which is rubbish." - Simon Quinlank
Jim Halpin
Were you playing the Peacekeepers (Lal) faction? They get an
extra vote on the council, if I read/remember the manual correctly.
--
Jim Halpin jha...@ma.ultranet.com
jn...@my-dejanews.com
a...@whangomatic.freeserve.co.uk (Andrew R. Gillett) wrote:
>
> In my first game, I saved the game and decided to see what would happen
> if I tried to get myself elected Supreme Leader.
>
> Political situation:
>
> Me - huge
> Morgan (pact) - tiny
> Yang and Zakharov (vendetta) - small
>
> Myself and Morgan voted Yea, Yang and Zakharov voted Nay. I still won.
> Why? What's this about having to eliminate anyone who defies the will of
> the council? And it can't be right that I'm allowed to vote myself in
> just because I'm huge. That's not diplomatic. Diplomatic should MEAN
> diplomatic, I should have to get everyone to like me.
>
I disagree, who cares if Iraq, Iran, Libya, Cuba, or North Korea don't like
us, their too insignificant too mater. This is why you only need 75% of the
votes. There's also no law in this country against voting for youself, so why
should there be in SMAC?
Jon Nunn
Friends Don't Let Friends Do Cobol
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Andrew R. Gillett
> Were you playing the Peacekeepers (Lal) faction? They get an
> extra vote on the council, if I read/remember the manual correctly.
No, I was the Gaians, although I had a wonder which gave me +50% votes.
That's not the point though - you can hardly call it a diplomatic victory
if you won by conquering most of your opponents, thus having far more
votes than everyone else, and you shouldn't be able to vote yourself in
as Supreme Leader.
--
Andrew Gillett http://argnet.fatal-design.com/ ICQ: See homepage
"No mustard? You dare to insult me with a mustard-less pizza? You will die
for this!" - Michelangelo, Starship Losers
Andrew J. Grall
I've actually never played the game through to the end yet, unless you
consider the end conquest or cooperative victory...
Jim Halpin wrote in message <36D2FEF7...@ma.ultranet.com>...
>
>
> Were you playing the Peacekeepers (Lal) faction? They get an
>extra vote on the council, if I read/remember the manual correctly.
>
>>
>> In my first game, I saved the game and decided to see what would happen
>> if I tried to get myself elected Supreme Leader.
>>
>> Political situation:
>>
>> Me - huge
>> Morgan (pact) - tiny
>> Yang and Zakharov (vendetta) - small
>>
>> Myself and Morgan voted Yea, Yang and Zakharov voted Nay. I still won.
>> Why? What's this about having to eliminate anyone who defies the will of
>> the council? And it can't be right that I'm allowed to vote myself in
>> just because I'm huge. That's not diplomatic. Diplomatic should MEAN
>> diplomatic, I should have to get everyone to like me.
>>
jn...@my-dejanews.com
Jim Halpin <jha...@ma.ultranet.com> wrote:
>
>
> Were you playing the Peacekeepers (Lal) faction? They get an
> extra vote on the council, if I read/remember the manual correctly.
>
Actually they get their vote doubled for choosing plantary governor and
possiably supreme leader as well. (A whole lot more than 1 extra vote.)
Based on score differental, those going the conquest route attempting to
maximize score would leave one non-surendered faction left with one city and
elect himself the plantary governor rather than conquering the last city, for
200 extra points. I think one can also conquer most of the world but win by
transcedance as well much like Civ IIs take all but 1 city, then lauch the
spaceship.
jn...@my-dejanews.com
> No, I was the Gaians, although I had a wonder which gave me +50% votes.
> That's not the point though - you can hardly call it a diplomatic victory
> if you won by conquering most of your opponents, thus having far more
> votes than everyone else, and you shouldn't be able to vote yourself in
> as Supreme Leader.
>
Why not, the winners write the history books.
And those voting no can still comit suicide by refusing to follow the will of
the council.
Avatar
>
> In alt.games.firaxis.alpha-centauri, jn...@my-dejanews.com wrote:
> > > No, I was the Gaians, although I had a wonder which gave me +50% votes.
> > > That's not the point though - you can hardly call it a diplomatic victory
> > > if you won by conquering most of your opponents, thus having far more
> > > votes than everyone else, and you shouldn't be able to vote yourself in
> > > as Supreme Leader.
> > >
> > Why not, the winners write the history books.
> > And those voting no can still comit suicide by refusing to follow the will of
> > the council.
>
> ended. It's a pretty dull victory.
Then you missed the point of said victory... they voted against your
leadership, but didn't defy the will of the Council. We get a lot of
parallels in our own governmental systems, you'll notice. Under the
diplomatic victory, almost all computer-controlled civilizations will go
quietly, even after the victory of the winner... the only ones that
continue to kick up a fuss are factions against which you have committed
significant atrocities (and not just stomping them into dirt, mind;
we're talking planet busting, nerve gassing, genetic warfare,
captured-city-reducing-into-rubble level action here.)
--
"Why do you not let me contemplate in peace?"
"'Cause I'm the GOD OF DESTRUCTION, that's why!"
-Kushinada and Susano Orbatos, "Orion", Shirow
Andrew R. Gillett
> > No, I was the Gaians, although I had a wonder which gave me +50% votes.
> > That's not the point though - you can hardly call it a diplomatic victory
> > if you won by conquering most of your opponents, thus having far more
> > votes than everyone else, and you shouldn't be able to vote yourself in
> > as Supreme Leader.
> >
> Why not, the winners write the history books.
> And those voting no can still comit suicide by refusing to follow the will of
> the council.
They didn't commit suicide. I didn't have to conquer them. The game just
ended. It's a pretty dull victory.
--
Andrew Gillett http://argnet.fatal-design.com/ ICQ: See homepage
Paul Hodgson
> In alt.games.firaxis.alpha-centauri, Jim Halpin wrote:
> > Were you playing the Peacekeepers (Lal) faction? They get an
> > extra vote on the council, if I read/remember the manual correctly.
>
> No, I was the Gaians, although I had a wonder which gave me +50% votes.
> That's not the point though - you can hardly call it a diplomatic victory
> if you won by conquering most of your opponents, thus having far more
> votes than everyone else, and you shouldn't be able to vote yourself in
> as Supreme Leader.
>
hmm, this doesn't quite scan - if you won by conquering most of your
opponents... you shouldn't be able to vote yourself in as Supreme Leader..
Why not? It's one man/woman/mind worm one vote - if you're the man then
you've got the vote, who's going to stop you? I do think though that
people who don't vote for you (and you still get in) should then have to
be destroyed, after all they have defied the will of the Supreme Leader :)
ttfn (said Tigger)
pH
"He was a wise man who invented beer"
- Plato
"D'OH!!"
- Homer
"Hand me my lightsaber - its the one that says bad mother f**ker!"
-Samuel L Jackson (from Quentin Tarentino's remake of Star Wars)
Dredd
Avatar <ak...@pdq.net> wrote:
... the only ones that
> continue to kick up a fuss are factions against which you have committed
> significant atrocities (and not just stomping them into dirt, mind;
> we're talking planet busting, nerve gassing, genetic warfare,
> captured-city-reducing-into-rubble level action here.)
>
I have to disagree with the level of atrocity required for them to defy your
election. I was playing as the Gaians, had been almost constantly at war
with the Spartans and PKs, but HAD NOT committed any atrocities. When
elected Supreme Leader by some overwhelming majority, both said no way and
waxed poetic about executing me, right down to their last breath.
I noticed that once elected Supreme Leader, my pact-mates would no longer
communicate with me. They never answered their commlinks. Is that supposed
to happen?
Dredd
Andrew R. Gillett
> "Andrew R. Gillett" wrote:
> > They didn't commit suicide. I didn't have to conquer them. The game just
> > ended. It's a pretty dull victory.
>
> leadership, but didn't defy the will of the Council. We get a lot of
> parallels in our own governmental systems, you'll notice. Under the
> diplomatic victory, almost all computer-controlled civilizations will go
> continue to kick up a fuss are factions against which you have committed
> significant atrocities (and not just stomping them into dirt, mind;
> we're talking planet busting, nerve gassing, genetic warfare,
> captured-city-reducing-into-rubble level action here.)
Then where's the challenge in a Diplomatic victory?
--
Andrew Gillett http://argnet.fatal-design.com/ ICQ: See homepage
"Green! We're going to die! Help! Run away!" - Bonecrusher, Starship
Losers
John Dilick
a...@whangomatic.freeserve.co.uk (Andrew R. Gillett) proclaimed:
>Then where's the challenge in a Diplomatic victory?
Mustering the 3/4 of total votes needed, perhaps?
ObSheesh: Sheesh.
--
John Dilick dili...@home.com
If at first you don't succeed, cheat. Cheat until caught, then lie.
Mersey
It's also a method of ending a game with a victory without having to
beat all the other factions to a pulp, doing the whole tech tree, or
amassing great wealth. Even if you think you have the votes at some
point, you needn't call for an election. You can play on knowing that
when the game become boring, you can end it with an election instead
of just retiring or quitting.
mersey@mind#spring.com
remove the # to email
Brian Reynolds
BR
On Wed, 24 Feb 1999 16:58:07 GMT, Dredd <dredd...@my-dejanews.com>
wrote:
>In article <36D38E94...@pdq.net>,
> Avatar <ak...@pdq.net> wrote:
>... the only ones that
>> continue to kick up a fuss are factions against which you have committed
>> significant atrocities (and not just stomping them into dirt, mind;
>> we're talking planet busting, nerve gassing, genetic warfare,
>> captured-city-reducing-into-rubble level action here.)
>>
>
Jon Nunn
> Then where's the challenge in a Diplomatic victory?
Conquering 3/4ths of the world along with your pact-mates and aquiring
mind/machine interface.
Oh and if one really doesn't like Diplomatic victory, one can disable it.
Jon Nunn
Programmer Analyst
Friends Don't Let Friends Do Cobol
http://www.mc.vanderbilt.edu/users/nunnacl/personal.html
Brian Reynolds
declare victory when you reach the point where "you know you've won",
rather than having to destroy every single last base.
Brian Reynolds
Alpha Centauri Designer
FIRAXIS Games
On Wed, 24 Feb 1999 19:15:15 -0000, a...@whangomatic.freeserve.co.uk
(Andrew R. Gillett) wrote:
>In alt.games.firaxis.alpha-centauri, Avatar wrote:
>> "Andrew R. Gillett" wrote:
>> > They didn't commit suicide. I didn't have to conquer them. The game just
>> > ended. It's a pretty dull victory.
>>
>> Then you missed the point of said victory... they voted against your
>> leadership, but didn't defy the will of the Council. We get a lot of
>> parallels in our own governmental systems, you'll notice. Under the
>> diplomatic victory, almost all computer-controlled civilizations will go
>> quietly, even after the victory of the winner... the only ones that
>> continue to kick up a fuss are factions against which you have committed
>> significant atrocities (and not just stomping them into dirt, mind;
>> we're talking planet busting, nerve gassing, genetic warfare,
>> captured-city-reducing-into-rubble level action here.)
>
Andrew R. Gillett
> The idea behind the Diplomatic Victory is to allow you to gracefully
> declare victory when you reach the point where "you know you've won",
> rather than having to destroy every single last base.
Why does a diplomatic victory score more points than a conquest victory?
Surely that makes conquest totally obsolete - eliminate all but one base,
then declare a diplomatic victory.
--
Andrew Gillett http://argnet.fatal-design.com/ ICQ: See homepage
long double double_long;