Why "anti-anime" people are fucking retarded...
Homyguy Z
"Wyvern" <3...@orbitbase.com> wrote in message
news:NGoF7.16362$hZ.15...@newsread2.prod.itd.earthlink.net...
>
> "sabotenderł" <feed...@goatse.cx> wrote in message
> news:Xns914F90A...@24.94.163.121...
> > the answer is: "deep down they like anime."
> >
> > Creexul, Gaza... etc etc...
> >
> > they are all closet anime fans.
>
> Um, no. I'm pretty sure they legitamitly dislike anime. The problem is
that
> they act like they deserve a medal for it, because apprentally the "anime
> sucks" concept is the most revolutionary form of thought in human history.
> Anyway, anti-anime guys, congratulations on not liking something. We're
all
> in awe of your achievement, and hope to someday be capeable of not liking
> things,too. But until that day comes, you should probably know that no one
> is going to stop liking anime because some internet guy they never met
said
> it sucks.
Anime as a type of multimedia (eg. live-action movies, cartoons) doesn't
suck. It's too broad and indefinitive to generalize as all one thing, just
as one couldn't really say, "Music sucks."
Anime as a genre, as a branch of animated storytelling, as a collection of
basic similar ideas and concepts and shared styles you can keep coming back
to, is debatable. I say it does suck. There are too many recurring ideas
that just aren't really worth keeping. Dumb, perverted jokes, wacky,
psychotic super-angry-devilish-exaggerated drawings, REALLY SLOW FRAMERATES,
filler, and a bunch of other things keep me wary of anime in general. As
with everything, though, there are exceptions. Cowboy Bebop is pretty good.
I didn't mind Ninja Scroll. And there are some other random bits of certain
anime storylines that I liked.
But that's me.
> PS-It's also possible that they're just trolls who decided to come to a
> newsgroup and attack the subject cause then people would pay attention to
> them. So either way, it's really kind of pointless to care. Anyway, I'm
not
> going to pay attention to the anti-anime folk beyond making this post, and
> neither should you.
Why not? Sometimes it's actual discussion and not trolling. We pretty much
all like Cowboy Bebop.
> PPS-Hey,look, its Rob, I remember Rob! He was in AGFF with me back when
AGFF
> wasen't retarded. Hi, Rob! (waves) Oh, wait, I'm supposed to be ignoring
you
> guys, aren't I. Bye Rob! (waves)
You were before my time, but hey.
And AGFF isn't really retarded.
-Homyguy Z
Wyvern
"Homyguy Z" <chay...@carolina.rr.com> wrote in message
news:xUFF7.103288$%B6.28...@typhoon.southeast.rr.com...
Um, those are called "genres." All forms of fiction have those. ^^;;;;; I
see your point,though, I like giant robots, but why are they THAT popular?
Of course, a japanese person watching american TV would probably wonder what
our fascination with lawyers is. Anyway, I think it's important to note that
by and large only one kind of anime- scifi/fantasy-ever gets shown to
Americans, so alot of them think that's all it is. There are a few (very
few) shows that don't fall into this catagory that show up in America, even
though they account for at least half of anime in Japan. I know one person
who says she doesen't like anime but adores His and Her Circumstances cause
it's "not like most anime." The irony is there's TONS of anime like that,
but Americans never see it. Not that I don't like the scifi fantasy, but
it's not everyone's thing. I'm pretty sure the only anime to come out in the
states without some mystical/scifi element in the last year is Princess Nine
(which is about a baseball team) and damn, but its good. (I guess you could
make a case for Kenshin, being a historical drama and all, but there are a
few unreal elements, like Shishio's fire-generating powers)
And some of the ideas AREN'T worth repeating...how many more shows do we
need where six girls all fight over one spineless guy? It was funny in
Tenchi, cause Tenchi did it first, but enough already.
Dumb, perverted jokes, wacky,
> psychotic super-angry-devilish-exaggerated drawings, REALLY SLOW
FRAMERATES,
> filler,
Yeah, framerates are evil in most anime. Of course, the feature films do
away with this, and there's always the high-budget stuff like Escaflowne or
something. Hey, here's something else-Escaflowne doesen't have any filler.
Go watch it. ;p
and a bunch of other things keep me wary of anime in general. As
> with everything, though, there are exceptions. Cowboy Bebop is pretty
good.
> I didn't mind Ninja Scroll. And there are some other random bits of
certain
> anime storylines that I liked.
Ninja Scroll? Ew.
Still, if you like that kinda thing, Kenshin is pretty good....well the
Kyoto story arc. The rest is either setup for the Kyoto arc or filler. The
animation isen't steller, but they go all-out on the fight sequences,which
are usually done at high speeds with lots of detial and motion. (note the
word "usually") Just stay away from Ninja Ressurection or you'll have a very
good reason to not like anime.
> But that's me.
>
> > PS-It's also possible that they're just trolls who decided to come to a
> > newsgroup and attack the subject cause then people would pay attention
to
> > them. So either way, it's really kind of pointless to care. Anyway, I'm
> not
> > going to pay attention to the anti-anime folk beyond making this post,
and
> > neither should you.
>
> Why not? Sometimes it's actual discussion and not trolling. We pretty much
> all like Cowboy Bebop.
Yay! Then go watch....uh....okay, there's nothing like CB, really. Well,
Trigun, kinda-sorta. But not that much. However, there are some folk here
who are wellknown trolls, so I'm gonna be guarded.
> > PPS-Hey,look, its Rob, I remember Rob! He was in AGFF with me back when
> AGFF
> > wasen't retarded. Hi, Rob! (waves) Oh, wait, I'm supposed to be ignoring
> you
> > guys, aren't I. Bye Rob! (waves)
>
> You were before my time, but hey.
Hey!
> And AGFF isn't really retarded.
>
> -Homyguy Z
Well, I think it is. At the very least, it's a far cry from what it once
was, circa 1997-2000.
But that's me. ^_-
-Wyvern
Jh5h Cable
> Um, those are called "genres." All forms of fiction have those. ^^;;;;;
Hey, I remember you. You're that guy we humiliated off of the entire
newsgroup.
Gid wonders if you're still fixated on assfucking.
--
Nepchewn "John 'Creexul' Cable" Salad (AIM name: Jhoh Cable)
http://clansrgay.clanpages.com/
Having what appears to be my own website domain makes me, as a person, better than you.
"WE GOT THE LAW ON OUR SIDE, I'M GONNA FAIL TO YIELD!"
- Mike "Crazy Legs" Nelson, MST3K
I'm a fleabit peanut monkey, all my friends are junkies.
But that's not really true. :(
Homyguy Z
I meant things like out-of-control exaggerations just to show an emotion
like anger in humorous situation (some exaggeration is okay, but turning
purple, growing huge, and growing fangs for the duration of the screaming is
not), or overused forms of fanservice, like nudity where it isn't needed and
in fact drags down the rest of the plot. Those aren't exactly genres.
> I
> see your point,though, I like giant robots, but why are they THAT popular?
> Of course, a japanese person watching american TV would probably wonder
what
> our fascination with lawyers is. Anyway, I think it's important to note
that
> by and large only one kind of anime- scifi/fantasy-ever gets shown to
> Americans, so alot of them think that's all it is. There are a few (very
> few) shows that don't fall into this catagory that show up in America,
even
> though they account for at least half of anime in Japan. I know one person
> who says she doesen't like anime but adores His and Her Circumstances
cause
> it's "not like most anime." The irony is there's TONS of anime like that,
> but Americans never see it.
This comes down to a matter of opinion on most accounts, one that you and I
probably wouldn't share. I think for every good anime, there are tons of bad
animes. The genre is just loaded with all kinds of problems, unnecessary
fanservice and sick, disgusting themes. And for a lot of animes that don's
have those problems, there is often a lot of bad writing, plot, and just a
general boring presentation. And for still more that don't, reused frames,
pointless flashing and white space, limited movement (too many STILL shots),
etc., etc.
Now, I'll admit that I haven't seen much. Most of what I know is based on
what I've heard from other people. But I know enough to make a
generalization like "anime isn't all that great," (or "anime sucks", maybe)
and while it's not totally correct, neither is any generalization. I will
watch any individual anime to get my own idea of what it is, but until I've
seen it, I probably wouldn't get my hopes up.
> Not that I don't like the scifi fantasy, but
> it's not everyone's thing. I'm pretty sure the only anime to come out in
the
> states without some mystical/scifi element in the last year is Princess
Nine
> (which is about a baseball team) and damn, but its good. (I guess you
could
> make a case for Kenshin, being a historical drama and all, but there are a
> few unreal elements, like Shishio's fire-generating powers)
You're right here, though - there might be some anime out there that nobody
has bothered to translate that is actually pretty good. But I probably
wouldn't go out of my way to seek it out.... that's kind of like looking for
a live-action movie that I'm not sure exists in a genre that I'm not
familiar with. I have no information on it at all, and it's probably fairly
inaccessible if it even exists. I'm not one to buy something after reading a
bunch of reviews by strangers. If one of my friends perhaps recommended to
me, then I would probably take a look. Maybe.
> And some of the ideas AREN'T worth repeating...how many more shows do we
> need where six girls all fight over one spineless guy? It was funny in
> Tenchi, cause Tenchi did it first, but enough already.
I thought it might be an amusing situation, but for a commercial or
something, not an entire show. After a few sub-scenarios inside the idea, it
just gets to be too much to watch. But I guess some people enjoy it, so
watch what you like.
> Dumb, perverted jokes, wacky,
> > psychotic super-angry-devilish-exaggerated drawings, REALLY SLOW
> FRAMERATES,
> > filler,
>
> Yeah, framerates are evil in most anime. Of course, the feature films do
> away with this, and there's always the high-budget stuff like Escaflowne
or
> something.
It's really a pain on the eyes sometimes, but if the show is REALLY GOOD, I
don't really notice. Unfortunately, CB is about the only show where I don't
notice.
> Hey, here's something else-Escaflowne doesen't have any filler.
> Go watch it. ;p
I was thinking about checking out Escaflowne. I probably wouldn't go out of
my way to watch it, though, if it came on TV then I might.
> and a bunch of other things keep me wary of anime in general. As
> > with everything, though, there are exceptions. Cowboy Bebop is pretty
> good.
> > I didn't mind Ninja Scroll. And there are some other random bits of
> certain
> > anime storylines that I liked.
>
> Ninja Scroll? Ew.
Posted a more elaborate description about that in AGFF.
"A friend of mine bought it and we watched it last night. Lots of pointless
sex and nudity early on, and the whole movie had the annoying quirk of 50
gallons of blood spurting out like a faucet every time someone was cut in
any way. But about halfway through the story started getting pretty good,
and I enjoyed it somewhat.
I probably wouldn't bother watching it again, but it wasn't too bad."
> Still, if you like that kinda thing, Kenshin is pretty good....well the
> Kyoto story arc. The rest is either setup for the Kyoto arc or filler.
The
> animation isen't steller, but they go all-out on the fight sequences,which
> are usually done at high speeds with lots of detial and motion. (note the
> word "usually") Just stay away from Ninja Ressurection or you'll have a
very
> good reason to not like anime.
Sometimes I or others may generalize, not liking anime in general, but
enjoying specific shows like CB. Most of the anime I've seen I haven't been
very impressed with, so I've come to not expect much out of it. But if it's
on, I'll give it as much of a chance as anything else.
> > But that's me.
> >
> > > PS-It's also possible that they're just trolls who decided to come to
a
> > > newsgroup and attack the subject cause then people would pay attention
> to
> > > them. So either way, it's really kind of pointless to care. Anyway,
I'm
> > not
> > > going to pay attention to the anti-anime folk beyond making this post,
> and
> > > neither should you.
> >
> > Why not? Sometimes it's actual discussion and not trolling. We pretty
much
> > all like Cowboy Bebop.
>
> Yay! Then go watch....uh....okay, there's nothing like CB, really. Well,
> Trigun, kinda-sorta. But not that much. However, there are some folk here
> who are wellknown trolls, so I'm gonna be guarded.
Even trolls can have a discussion, though. I can be considered a troll on
some accounts. Not everything a troll says is trolling. You just have to
know when they're not being serious. Usually it's easy to spot.
> > > PPS-Hey,look, its Rob, I remember Rob! He was in AGFF with me back
when
> > AGFF
> > > wasen't retarded. Hi, Rob! (waves) Oh, wait, I'm supposed to be
ignoring
> > you
> > > guys, aren't I. Bye Rob! (waves)
> >
> > You were before my time, but hey.
>
> Hey!
>
> > And AGFF isn't really retarded.
> >
> > -Homyguy Z
>
> Well, I think it is. At the very least, it's a far cry from what it once
> was, circa 1997-2000.
We've strayed away from the things you're probably used to, but now anything
is open to debate, nothing is too sacred to talk about, etc. etc. And no
more of the high and mighty reg ideal, where just being accepted gives you a
bigger voice than someone who should have just as equal an opportunity.
I've only been in AGFF for a year....I think I came in just after you left.
> But that's me. ^_-
A few people have come back over the past year, for a little while, anyway.
Bob is still around. Eyeglazer was back for a few months. And Falimortalis,
but that was actually Cypher having a good laugh and successfully trolling
just about all of us.
-Homyguy Z
Avenger 1998
> > Well, I think it is. At the very least, it's a far cry from what it once
> > was, circa 1997-2000.
>
> We've strayed away from the things you're probably used to, but now anything
> is open to debate, nothing is too sacred to talk about, etc. etc. And no
> more of the high and mighty reg ideal, where just being accepted gives you a
> bigger voice than someone who should have just as equal an opportunity.
>
> I've only been in AGFF for a year....I think I came in just after you left.
>
> > But that's me. ^_-
>
> A few people have come back over the past year, for a little while, anyway.
> Bob is still around. Eyeglazer was back for a few months. And Falimortalis,
> but that was actually Cypher having a good laugh and successfully trolling
> just about all of us.
How idealistic of you. I think Wyv is justified in staying away from the group
because, even if he were to come back with a complete acceptance of the way the
group is now, the Cables would still undoubtedly insult him a lot. The group
isn't the equality-for-all solace you think it is.
--
## ######
## ##++##++++++###### Avenger the Paladin, "Friendly to Everyone"
##--##++==++====##++==++###### Defender of FFIV, Disciple of Peace
##**--##++==####--##++==++++xx## Official President of AGFF --
##<>**--####--%%%%##++==++xx## -- (February 16th, 2000 to July 31st, 2000)
##**%%%%--######--##++xx## ** Member of the Princes of AGFF **
##%%######## xx##++++++xx##
#### $$ # xx++xxxx## http://personal.nbnet.nb.ca/giles
###### $$__ xx######&&## AIM: Final Avenger ICQ: 11810276
##--&&## ##&&----## E-Mail: tomblador at yahoo dot com
##--## ##--OO&&##&&##
##OO&&## ##xx@@&&@@##--&&## "My love is vengeance that's never free..."
######xx####xx--######****--## - The Who
## ##&&xxxx--@@## ##&&####
## ##&&&&@@## ##--&&## "And how can you smile
## ####xxxx## ##@@## when the reasons for smiling are wrong?"
##@@####++xx--########&&## - Jethro Tull
##&&**##xx--##&&@@##**--&&##
##--**##--##@@##@@##**----## "Remember when you were young?
##--****####&&--####**------## You shone like the sun.
##--******##&&--&&@@##--@@&&## Now there's a look in your eyes
##&&******##****&&@@##&&@@&&## like black holes in the sky.
##&&######&&--****@@##&&@@&&## Shine on, you crazy diamond!"
#### ########## ###### - Pink Floyd
*** Distributor of Raving and Drooling Points and Friendly White Roses ***
______
X=X=X=X=X=X=X=X=X=X=X=X=X= |||__||| | Resident Final Fantasy ASCII Art Guy |
EIGHTY FIVE HUNDRED POSTS \/ \/ | Maintainer of the AGFFU Compilation |
TO ALT.GAMES.FINAL-FANTASY (8500) | 80% Insane and 90% Paladinly Pure |
=X=X=X=X=X=X=X=X=X=X=X=X=X \__/ | Author of FFT-based fic: Unification |
Official AGFF Rock Star!
Semi-official hottest member of AGFF.
Points and Other Garbage:
------------------------
100000000000 Metal ArmT Points (from Zohar, in spite)
15 MARUCHAN POINTS (for co-writing a spontaneous FF8 fic with Sky Render)
29.5 Final Fantasy Geek Points
74 Final Fantasy Obsession Points
10 Confused Cock Points (from a confused cock)
7 Technicoloured Dreamcoat Points (from Jonny)
25 Nightshade Undead Madness Points (for reading his entire goodbye post)
60 Slut Points (from Small Girl)
24 Ramen Points (from Ramen Junkie)
1 Tolkien Point (from Ramen Junkie)
1 Gollum Point (from Ramen Junkie)
4 Log Points (from A.Weirdo)
9.5 Hexadecimal Points (from Qhimm's Quizzes)
15 Luddite Points (from A.Weirdo)
20 Flying Monkey Points (from DiSiLLuSiOn)
52 Calvin and Hobbes Points (from DiSiLLuSiOn)
1 Boredom Point (from Eyeglazer, for being boring)
4 Bzzzzzzzzzzzzz Points (from Corwin of Amber's Bee Quiz)
1 Unsafe Children's Toy -- "Keep Out Of Reach Of Children" (from Twinkle)
1 Voucher for Jonny's Ice Cream Store
The "Thank You" Award (from Linda)
An FFT Gold Star, for clever FFT Strategy (from Steve Jones)
Join the Fun:
------------
IRC: irc.esper.net:5555
Channel: #ramenjunkie
Homyguy Z
"Avenger 1998" <jbr...@darkwing.uoregon.edu> wrote in message
news:myZF7.9384$R%6.13...@news-nb00s0.nbnet.nb.ca...
> So says Homyguy Z:
>
> > > Well, I think it is. At the very least, it's a far cry from what it
once
> > > was, circa 1997-2000.
> >
> > We've strayed away from the things you're probably used to, but now
anything
> > is open to debate, nothing is too sacred to talk about, etc. etc. And no
> > more of the high and mighty reg ideal, where just being accepted gives
you a
> > bigger voice than someone who should have just as equal an opportunity.
> >
> > I've only been in AGFF for a year....I think I came in just after you
left.
> >
> > > But that's me. ^_-
> >
> > A few people have come back over the past year, for a little while,
anyway.
> > Bob is still around. Eyeglazer was back for a few months. And
Falimortalis,
> > but that was actually Cypher having a good laugh and successfully
trolling
> > just about all of us.
>
> How idealistic of you.
It's just the way I see the group.
> I think Wyv is justified in staying away from the group
> because, even if he were to come back with a complete acceptance of the
way the
> group is now, the Cables would still undoubtedly insult him a lot.
That's why I didn't suggest he come back. We were talking about AGFF and I
shared what I thought about it.
> The group
> isn't the equality-for-all solace you think it is.
I don't think is.
-Homyguy Z
Avenger 1998
It is no better than it was back in the day, as you _seem_ to believe. We are
just mean to a different group of people now.
- Avenger
Steve Jones
But a more deserving one, so it's ok.
- Steve
John D. Ford
>Um, those are called "genres." All forms of fiction have those. ^^;;;;; I
>see your point,though, I like giant robots, but why are they THAT popular?
>Of course, a japanese person watching american TV would probably wonder what
>our fascination with lawyers is. Anyway, I think it's important to note that
>by and large only one kind of anime- scifi/fantasy-ever gets shown to
>Americans, so alot of them think that's all it is. There are a few (very
>few) shows that don't fall into this catagory that show up in America, even
>though they account for at least half of anime in Japan. I know one person
>who says she doesen't like anime but adores His and Her Circumstances cause
>it's "not like most anime." The irony is there's TONS of anime like that,
>but Americans never see it. Not that I don't like the scifi fantasy, but
>it's not everyone's thing. I'm pretty sure the only anime to come out in the
>states without some mystical/scifi element in the last year is Princess Nine
>(which is about a baseball team) and damn, but its good. (I guess you could
>make a case for Kenshin, being a historical drama and all, but there are a
>few unreal elements, like Shishio's fire-generating powers)
For all this said about traditions, I have to say the anime I enjoy
the most is that which breaks the traditions (in the case of Eva) or
doesn't linger on them (Cowboy Bebop).
>And some of the ideas AREN'T worth repeating...how many more shows do we
>need where six girls all fight over one spineless guy? It was funny in
>Tenchi, cause Tenchi did it first, but enough already.
The ideas are repeated because this is what sells. Make other things
sell, and...
>Yeah, framerates are evil in most anime. Of course, the feature films do
>away with this, and there's always the high-budget stuff like Escaflowne or
>something. Hey, here's something else-Escaflowne doesen't have any filler.
>Go watch it. ;p
Escaflowne has a plot from the SNES RPG days, though.
>Ninja Scroll? Ew.
Ninja Scroll was okay, I guess, except for the poison rape sequences.
>Still, if you like that kinda thing, Kenshin is pretty good....well the
>Kyoto story arc. The rest is either setup for the Kyoto arc or filler. The
>animation isen't steller, but they go all-out on the fight sequences,which
>are usually done at high speeds with lots of detial and motion. (note the
>word "usually") Just stay away from Ninja Ressurection or you'll have a very
>good reason to not like anime.
I don't think I can stick with the Kenshin series until the fabled
"Kyoto arc" which is supposed to blow me away. The OVA reminded me of
Ninja Scroll, only less rapey.
>Yay! Then go watch....uh....okay, there's nothing like CB, really. Well,
>Trigun, kinda-sorta. But not that much. However, there are some folk here
>who are wellknown trolls, so I'm gonna be guarded.
There's nothing like Bebop.
Lupin has Jet and Spike and a fraction of the style, though.
>Well, I think it is. At the very least, it's a far cry from what it once
>was, circa 1997-2000.
>
>But that's me. ^_-
I suggest you visit alt.games.final-fantasy.rpg.
Wyvern
"Jh5h Cable" <cree...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:8nkfutsm5b0rh1p4d...@4ax.com...
> On Tue, 06 Nov 2001 05:12:49 GMT, "Wyvern" <3...@orbitbase.com> wrote:
>
> > Um, those are called "genres." All forms of fiction have those. ^^;;;;;
>
> Hey, I remember you. You're that guy we humiliated off of the entire
> newsgroup.
Hey, I remember you,too. You're that guy who put on a dress and asked all
the guys to have sex with him. I think I've missed you most of all.
> Gid wonders if you're still fixated on assfucking.
> --
> Nepchewn
I learned from the master.
-Wyvern
"You're not really gay. All that's coming out of your mouth is nonsense. If
you were gay, it would be hot sperm and nonsense."-Seanbaby
Wyvern
>
> I meant things like out-of-control exaggerations just to show an emotion
> like anger in humorous situation (some exaggeration is okay, but turning
> purple, growing huge, and growing fangs for the duration of the screaming
is
> not), or overused forms of fanservice, like nudity where it isn't needed
and
> in fact drags down the rest of the plot. Those aren't exactly genres.
Ah,okay. Wait, turning purple? What show is this? oo;;
Still shots bug me a bit unless they're at the very end of an episode (alot
of shows use them there to provide a "to be continued" feel) but the only
show I've seen to overuse them was Violinist of Hamlin (where like every
third shot was a still with chalk lines and crap) You're right on about
limited movement, but to be fair, until about five years ago American
animation was just as bad and usually worse. Then came Batman: The Animated
Series and now any American show that wants to be succsessful has alot of
motion.
Some of the bigger-budget anime shows are very animated, but smaller budget
shows (or ones with higher episode counts) are not. And to be fair, Japan's
economy is in the toilet and has been for a decade, so alot of studios
simply CAN'T animate the shows as well as they'd like cause it would cost
too much. If the econonmic situation picks up (won't happen anytime soon)
maybe shows will become a bit more motion-heavy...they seem to want to go in
that direction. Not that that's much help to anyone now.
But I guess some people enjoy it, so
> watch what you like.
And THAT right there is the whole point. ^_^ Just watch what you like,
everyone.
> > Dumb, perverted jokes, wacky,
> > > psychotic super-angry-devilish-exaggerated drawings, REALLY SLOW
> > FRAMERATES,
> > > filler,
> >
> > Yeah, framerates are evil in most anime. Of course, the feature films do
> > away with this, and there's always the high-budget stuff like Escaflowne
> or
> > something.
>
> It's really a pain on the eyes sometimes, but if the show is REALLY GOOD,
I
> don't really notice. Unfortunately, CB is about the only show where I
don't
> notice.
Well, CB's framerates are relativly good, and in parts where they aren't,
the show is smart enough to cover it up with lots of detail and/or lots of
motion in backgrounds and crowds.
> > Hey, here's something else-Escaflowne doesen't have any filler.
> > Go watch it. ;p
>
> I was thinking about checking out Escaflowne. I probably wouldn't go out
of
> my way to watch it, though, if it came on TV then I might.
Actually, it WAS on TV (only for a few weeks before it was canceled) but the
TV versian was awful. It cut out the entire first episode, thus ruining the
setup to the story (and there were plans to cut another episode later on)
and they changed the music,easily one of the best scores ever written for
ANY television series. But anyway, the chances of it showing up on TV again
are pretty much nill. But if you see volume one for rent somewhere, give it
a shot. Just make sure you're getting the uncut versian if it's a tape (the
edited tapes have the Fox Kids logo; the DVD's are all uncut) There's no fan
service or anything like that in this show; it can be bloody at times, but
it's never gratiuitous.
> > and a bunch of other things keep me wary of anime in general. As
> > > with everything, though, there are exceptions. Cowboy Bebop is pretty
> > good.
> > > I didn't mind Ninja Scroll. And there are some other random bits of
> > certain
> > > anime storylines that I liked.
> >
> > Ninja Scroll? Ew.
>
> Posted a more elaborate description about that in AGFF.
>
> "A friend of mine bought it and we watched it last night. Lots of
pointless
> sex and nudity early on, and the whole movie had the annoying quirk of 50
> gallons of blood spurting out like a faucet every time someone was cut in
> any way. But about halfway through the story started getting pretty good,
> and I enjoyed it somewhat.
>
> I probably wouldn't bother watching it again, but it wasn't too bad."
Yeah, I guess that's about right, but the whole blood-orgy of the first half
kind of killed my enjoyment of it. So I really didn't like it at all. I
think the reason its so popular is cause its the first anime alot of people
saw, so kids who've only seen Disney animation can go "Dude, it's a cartoon,
but there's blood!" I hate overly gory crap like that......
> Even trolls can have a discussion, though. I can be considered a troll on
> some accounts. Not everything a troll says is trolling. You just have to
> know when they're not being serious. Usually it's easy to spot.
Yeah, its usually the difference between acting like a lobotomized idiot and
a halfway intellegent human being. I just don't want to cause trouble
anywhere. Sorry if I offended someone.
Anyway, I think we should all just take the "Watch what you like" mantra to
heart. It's good advice. (watches porn) Fun!
-Wyvern
Homyguy Z
In a generalistic sense, it is no better. Pick a random person out of a
crowd of everyone, and there's no guarantee that they'll like this better
than the previous incarnations of AGFF. However, *I* think it is better. I
was really only sharing my opinion.
-Homyguy Z
Homyguy Z
>
> >
> > I meant things like out-of-control exaggerations just to show an emotion
> > like anger in humorous situation (some exaggeration is okay, but turning
> > purple, growing huge, and growing fangs for the duration of the
screaming
> is
> > not), or overused forms of fanservice, like nudity where it isn't needed
> and
> > in fact drags down the rest of the plot. Those aren't exactly genres.
>
> Ah,okay. Wait, turning purple? What show is this? oo;;
Well, purple cheeks, or under the eyes, something like that. It was either
Pokemon or Tenchi.
Yes, true. What I don't like is slowly panning a camera over a still shot
and placing a voice-over on top of it. Sometimes it's not a still shot,
they'll reuse some basic animation frames like blinking. If the conversation
is important and interesting, then there's no problem. But a lot of times
they'll do it over NOTHING, just for the dramatic effect, and it tends to go
on for just a little bit too long.
> Some of the bigger-budget anime shows are very animated, but smaller
budget
> shows (or ones with higher episode counts) are not. And to be fair,
Japan's
> economy is in the toilet and has been for a decade, so alot of studios
> simply CAN'T animate the shows as well as they'd like cause it would cost
> too much. If the econonmic situation picks up (won't happen anytime soon)
> maybe shows will become a bit more motion-heavy...they seem to want to go
in
> that direction. Not that that's much help to anyone now.
I guess. I don't know too much about Japan's economy, just that it's
currently fairly unstable.
> > > Dumb, perverted jokes, wacky,
> > > > psychotic super-angry-devilish-exaggerated drawings, REALLY SLOW
> > > FRAMERATES,
> > > > filler,
> > >
> > > Yeah, framerates are evil in most anime. Of course, the feature films
do
> > > away with this, and there's always the high-budget stuff like
Escaflowne
> > or
> > > something.
> >
> > It's really a pain on the eyes sometimes, but if the show is REALLY
GOOD,
> I
> > don't really notice. Unfortunately, CB is about the only show where I
> don't
> > notice.
>
> Well, CB's framerates are relativly good, and in parts where they aren't,
> the show is smart enough to cover it up with lots of detail and/or lots of
> motion in backgrounds and crowds.
One of the things I've noticed about CB that I really like is how different
things can be happening in the background of a scene, and it's just obvious
enough to catch. Most animes I've seen always cut to a different shot to
show surprise, dawning realization, whatever. CB shows it right in the same
frame, and it's a really intelligent move that makes the show a lot more
interesting.
e.g. When Jet is demanding that Faye pay the charges for the tape, you can
see her annoyed surprise change to realization while he's in mid-sentence,
just like it would happen in real life.
> > > Hey, here's something else-Escaflowne doesen't have any filler.
> > > Go watch it. ;p
> >
> > I was thinking about checking out Escaflowne. I probably wouldn't go out
> of
> > my way to watch it, though, if it came on TV then I might.
>
> Actually, it WAS on TV (only for a few weeks before it was canceled) but
the
> TV versian was awful. It cut out the entire first episode, thus ruining
the
> setup to the story (and there were plans to cut another episode later on)
> and they changed the music,easily one of the best scores ever written for
> ANY television series. But anyway, the chances of it showing up on TV
again
> are pretty much nill. But if you see volume one for rent somewhere, give
it
> a shot. Just make sure you're getting the uncut versian if it's a tape
(the
> edited tapes have the Fox Kids logo; the DVD's are all uncut) There's no
fan
> service or anything like that in this show; it can be bloody at times, but
> it's never gratiuitous.
I might try it out sooner or later. It sounds pretty interesting from what
I've heard. I don't know about the DVDs, though. How many episodes are on a
DVD for that series?
I don't hate it, but I don't think I'd bother seeing it again. It had a kind
of interesting plot in the second half, but the ending and last fight were
kind of dumb. I don't think it ever explained how his old buddy/enemy, or
whoever that was (I'm not totally sure, thinking back) got resurrected, or
couldn't die, but I guess it's just some kind of mystical unexplained thing.
> > Even trolls can have a discussion, though. I can be considered a troll
on
> > some accounts. Not everything a troll says is trolling. You just have to
> > know when they're not being serious. Usually it's easy to spot.
>
> Yeah, its usually the difference between acting like a lobotomized idiot
and
> a halfway intellegent human being. I just don't want to cause trouble
> anywhere. Sorry if I offended someone.
Trolling can be fun. I usually don't do it, but I like to see good ones.
Some people will get offended by -anything-, and I think that's kind of
funny. My attitude is don't take yourself too seriously and trolls won't
offend you.
> Anyway, I think we should all just take the "Watch what you like" mantra
to
> heart. It's good advice. (watches porn) Fun!
Well, my amendment would be "Watch what you like, but don't be afraid of
someone else not liking it." But just the same, do what you enjoy.
-Homyguy Z
Triptych
<jbr...@darkwing.uoregon.edu> scribbled and scraped at the paper with
a rusty quill and came up with:
>So says Homyguy Z:
>
>> > Well, I think it is. At the very least, it's a far cry from what it once
>> > was, circa 1997-2000.
>>
>> We've strayed away from the things you're probably used to, but now anything
>> is open to debate, nothing is too sacred to talk about, etc. etc. And no
>> more of the high and mighty reg ideal, where just being accepted gives you a
>> bigger voice than someone who should have just as equal an opportunity.
>>
>> I've only been in AGFF for a year....I think I came in just after you left.
>>
>> > But that's me. ^_-
>>
>> A few people have come back over the past year, for a little while, anyway.
>> Bob is still around. Eyeglazer was back for a few months. And Falimortalis,
>> but that was actually Cypher having a good laugh and successfully trolling
>> just about all of us.
>
>How idealistic of you. I think Wyv is justified in staying away from the group
>because, even if he were to come back with a complete acceptance of the way the
>group is now, the Cables would still undoubtedly insult him a lot. The group
>isn't the equality-for-all solace you think it is.
He could just ignore them. Not difficult. If you don't want to get
involved, then carry on and only reply to the posts you want.
*shrug*
Homyguy Z
"John D. Ford" <agent...@yay.yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:vc0hutk2rj2ela7mm...@4ax.com...
I forgot all about AGFFR. And Sky Render is still there too, I think.
Occasionally I've noticed people popping up randomly in ACE, also.
-Homyguy Z
Avenger 1998
He IS ignoring them.
- Avenger
Jh5h Cable
<chay...@carolina.rr.com> wrote:
>
> "John D. Ford" <agent...@yay.yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:vc0hutk2rj2ela7mm...@4ax.com...
> > On Tue, 06 Nov 2001 05:12:49 GMT, "Wyvern" <3...@orbitbase.com> wrote:
> > >Well, I think it is. At the very least, it's a far cry from what it once
> > >was, circa 1997-2000.
> > >
> > >But that's me. ^_-
> >
> > I suggest you visit alt.games.final-fantasy.rpg.
>
> I forgot all about AGFFR. And Sky Render is still there too, I think.
So, it's retarded then.
> Occasionally I've noticed people popping up randomly in ACE, also.
Very rarely, because the old FFAG is dead.
And anime eats gay dicks.
Homyguy Z
> On Thu, 08 Nov 2001 00:49:48 GMT, "Homyguy Z"
> <chay...@carolina.rr.com> wrote:
>
> >
> > "John D. Ford" <agent...@yay.yahoo.com> wrote in message
> > news:vc0hutk2rj2ela7mm...@4ax.com...
> > > On Tue, 06 Nov 2001 05:12:49 GMT, "Wyvern" <3...@orbitbase.com> wrote:
> > > >Well, I think it is. At the very least, it's a far cry from what it
once
> > > >was, circa 1997-2000.
> > > >
> > > >But that's me. ^_-
> > >
> > > I suggest you visit alt.games.final-fantasy.rpg.
> >
> > I forgot all about AGFFR. And Sky Render is still there too, I think.
>
> So, it's retarded then.
HRHRHRHH Okay, but Wyvern might get along with him.
> > Occasionally I've noticed people popping up randomly in ACE, also.
>
> Very rarely, because the old FFAG is dead.
THROWS A SNOWBALL AT YOU LOL
> And anime eats gay dicks.
Sounds painful. :(
-Homyguy Z
Jh5h Cable
<chay...@carolina.rr.com> wrote:
> "Jh5h Cable" <cree...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:2m9lut0kk10q7mvd1...@4ax.com...
> > On Thu, 08 Nov 2001 00:49:48 GMT, "Homyguy Z"
> > <chay...@carolina.rr.com> wrote:
> >
> > >
> > > "John D. Ford" <agent...@yay.yahoo.com> wrote in message
> > > news:vc0hutk2rj2ela7mm...@4ax.com...
> > > > On Tue, 06 Nov 2001 05:12:49 GMT, "Wyvern" <3...@orbitbase.com> wrote:
> > > > >Well, I think it is. At the very least, it's a far cry from what it
> once
> > > > >was, circa 1997-2000.
> > > > >
> > > > >But that's me. ^_-
> > > >
> > > > I suggest you visit alt.games.final-fantasy.rpg.
> > >
> > > I forgot all about AGFFR. And Sky Render is still there too, I think.
> >
> > So, it's retarded then.
>
> HRHRHRHH Okay, but Wyvern might get along with him.
Well that would go without saying.
> > > Occasionally I've noticed people popping up randomly in ACE, also.
> >
> > Very rarely, because the old FFAG is dead.
>
> THROWS A SNOWBALL AT YOU LOL
LOL ME TOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! SNOW
Wyvern
> > > I meant things like out-of-control exaggerations just to show an
emotion
> > > like anger in humorous situation (some exaggeration is okay, but
turning
> > > purple, growing huge, and growing fangs for the duration of the
> screaming
> > is
> > > not), or overused forms of fanservice, like nudity where it isn't
needed
> > and
> > > in fact drags down the rest of the plot. Those aren't exactly genres.
> >
> > Ah,okay. Wait, turning purple? What show is this? oo;;
>
> Well, purple cheeks, or under the eyes, something like that. It was either
> Pokemon or Tenchi.
I still don't remember this in either show, but I'll take your word for it.
^^;;
It's usually more to fill time at as little expense as possible than for
dramatic effect. --;;; DBZ does this a whole lot; in fact most shows that
adapt mangas will do this since trying to turn a 14-page weekly comic into a
25-minute weekly TV show leaves alot of space to fill. (especially with DBZ,
where you can read a chapter in two minutes-there's often no dialouge, just
sound effects and grunts. Bleh) (shrugs) I think DBZ has lowered the bar for
anime, and given alot of people a bad impression. As a matter of fact, most
anime on american TV are, at best, middle-of-the-road in terms of quality;
most of the really good stuff is on video only. This is cause they're trying
to market the shows to kids, so they either air kids shows or take adult
shows and dumb them down (with noteable exceptions being Gundam and Bebop)
The end result is alot of people end up disliking anime as a whole, and its
hard to blame them if thier only exposure to it is Dragon Ball Z and
Pokemon. (for the record, I like Pokemon, but it can get REALLY tedious when
you have to wait thirty episodes in between each gym battle)
> One of the things I've noticed about CB that I really like is how
different
> things can be happening in the background of a scene, and it's just
obvious
> enough to catch. Most animes I've seen always cut to a different shot to
> show surprise, dawning realization, whatever. CB shows it right in the
same
> frame, and it's a really intelligent move that makes the show a lot more
> interesting.
I think the thing that makes Bebop so good is that the animators were trying
to direct it as if it were a live-action film. It's usually easier to cut to
a person's reaction then animate it as part of a scene,but in live action
the reverse is true. Damn,that show has style.
The first two DVD's have four, the rest have three. That makes 26 episodes
on (winces) eight DVD's at $30 each,though you can probably find them online
for a bit cheaper. Most shows don't come on this many volumes anymore, but I
guess Bandai figured we'd pay the extra money since its such a classic (just
like ADV did with Evangelion. Evil.)
> Well, my amendment would be "Watch what you like, but don't be afraid of
> someone else not liking it." But just the same, do what you enjoy.
>
> -Homyguy Z
(nods) Okay, cool. ^^
-Wyvern
Wyvern
While I find this somewhat true in my case as well, I guess tradition
doesen't bother me as much. I would add to that list shows that openly mock
tradition (Nadesico,Slayers) or build on it to create something traditional
yet somehow new and fresh at the same time (Giant Robo,Evangelion)
> >And some of the ideas AREN'T worth repeating...how many more shows do we
> >need where six girls all fight over one spineless guy? It was funny in
> >Tenchi, cause Tenchi did it first, but enough already.
>
> The ideas are repeated because this is what sells. Make other things
> sell, and...
And people will start imatating those other things until they're
cliches,too. --;;; When Eva came out, suddenly alot more anime shows started
having religous overtones, and at least one show was made specifically to
"be the next Eva" according to its director (this was Brain Powered, and it
sucked) This is true in America,too-when a new show becomes a big hit, the
other networks scramble to copy everything about it, except the actual
quality. Remember all those awful animated sitcoms that cropped up after the
Simpsons premiered ten years ago? Same in anime. Sailor Moon had Wedding
Peach, Evangelion had Brain Powered, Simpsons had Capital Critters.
> >Yeah, framerates are evil in most anime. Of course, the feature films do
> >away with this, and there's always the high-budget stuff like Escaflowne
or
> >something. Hey, here's something else-Escaflowne doesen't have any
filler.
> >Go watch it. ;p
>
> Escaflowne has a plot from the SNES RPG days, though.
I really liked the plot, I thought it went deep enough to be good but didn't
get bogged down in being overly complex. And what's wrong with SNES RPG's?
FFVI had a great plot! Well, until halfway through. FFIV's plot was good in
the correctly translated versian.Chrono Trigger's was great,too.
>
> I don't think I can stick with the Kenshin series until the fabled
> "Kyoto arc" which is supposed to blow me away. The OVA reminded me of
> Ninja Scroll, only less rapey.
The OAV is not very much like the TV series, it should be noted. And also,
despite what some people say, the episodes leading up to the Kyoto Arc are
almost all very good (except the Crimson Pirate arc, but it's just three
episodes) if a bit predictable. It's just that the Kyoto arc suddenly drives
the quality up several notches. But if you don't want to worry about it,
just hit the highlights-you could get the first three volumes, which set up
and introduce pretty much everything you need to know for the Kyoto arc,
then skip to volume seven, where it begins. You'll miss out on a couple of
minor things, but nothing vital.
> >Yay! Then go watch....uh....okay, there's nothing like CB, really. Well,
> >Trigun, kinda-sorta. But not that much. However, there are some folk here
> >who are wellknown trolls, so I'm gonna be guarded.
>
> There's nothing like Bebop.
Nope, but there's other stuff that's just as good. ^^
> Lupin has Jet and Spike and a fraction of the style, though.
Lupin INVENTED the style, my friend.
-Wyvern
John D. Ford
>While I find this somewhat true in my case as well, I guess tradition
>doesen't bother me as much. I would add to that list shows that openly mock
>tradition (Nadesico,Slayers) or build on it to create something traditional
>yet somehow new and fresh at the same time (Giant Robo,Evangelion)
I view most of these conventions as undesirable, just as a lot of
conventions in American films are undesirable. They detract from the
work by removing the audience from it. Now if were apparent this was
intended, it would be different.
>And people will start imatating those other things until they're
>cliches,too. --;;; When Eva came out, suddenly alot more anime shows started
>having religous overtones, and at least one show was made specifically to
>"be the next Eva" according to its director (this was Brain Powered, and it
>sucked) This is true in America,too-when a new show becomes a big hit, the
>other networks scramble to copy everything about it, except the actual
>quality. Remember all those awful animated sitcoms that cropped up after the
>Simpsons premiered ten years ago? Same in anime. Sailor Moon had Wedding
>Peach, Evangelion had Brain Powered, Simpsons had Capital Critters.
Yes, but I want that *not* to happen.
>I really liked the plot, I thought it went deep enough to be good but didn't
>get bogged down in being overly complex. And what's wrong with SNES RPG's?
>FFVI had a great plot! Well, until halfway through. FFIV's plot was good in
>the correctly translated versian.Chrono Trigger's was great,too.
The problem with SNES RPG's is 1. I went through them all in 1994 and
2. I can recite them like the pledge of allegiance. For example, the
Escaflowne is an ancient wonder with secret reserves of untapped power
which no doubt assists the hero in the salvation of the world.
>The OAV is not very much like the TV series, it should be noted. And also,
>despite what some people say, the episodes leading up to the Kyoto Arc are
>almost all very good (except the Crimson Pirate arc, but it's just three
>episodes) if a bit predictable. It's just that the Kyoto arc suddenly drives
>the quality up several notches. But if you don't want to worry about it,
>just hit the highlights-you could get the first three volumes, which set up
>and introduce pretty much everything you need to know for the Kyoto arc,
>then skip to volume seven, where it begins. You'll miss out on a couple of
>minor things, but nothing vital.
Kenshin struck me as a cute, amiable show but not anything that I
could really dig into, at least over the first four episodes. He
screams "ORO!!!!" a little too much for me.
>Nope, but there's other stuff that's just as good. ^^
Hmm, research has indicated otherwise.
>> Lupin has Jet and Spike and a fraction of the style, though.
>
>Lupin INVENTED the style, my friend.
Lupin didn't invent the Seat Belts, Yoko Kanno did. And as good as
Miyazaki is, even Castle Cagliostro doesn't top the editing in Bebop.
Besides, I can't really groove with all the anachronisms in Lupin.
Wyvern
> >And people will start imatating those other things until they're
> >cliches,too. --;;; When Eva came out, suddenly alot more anime shows
started
> >having religous overtones, and at least one show was made specifically to
> >"be the next Eva" according to its director (this was Brain Powered, and
it
> >sucked) This is true in America,too-when a new show becomes a big hit,
the
> >other networks scramble to copy everything about it, except the actual
> >quality. Remember all those awful animated sitcoms that cropped up after
the
> >Simpsons premiered ten years ago? Same in anime. Sailor Moon had Wedding
> >Peach, Evangelion had Brain Powered, Simpsons had Capital Critters.
>
> Yes, but I want that *not* to happen.
Yeah, but it ain't going to stop. What I'm saying is it's not really anime's
fault,it's a symtom of TV in general.
> >I really liked the plot, I thought it went deep enough to be good but
didn't
> >get bogged down in being overly complex. And what's wrong with SNES
RPG's?
> >FFVI had a great plot! Well, until halfway through. FFIV's plot was good
in
> >the correctly translated versian.Chrono Trigger's was great,too.
>
> The problem with SNES RPG's is 1. I went through them all in 1994 and
> 2. I can recite them like the pledge of allegiance. For example, the
> Escaflowne is an ancient wonder with secret reserves of untapped power
> which no doubt assists the hero in the salvation of the world.
Hm,yeah, pretty much. But half of any story is presentation, which is what
Escy does well. I've heard alot of praise heaped on Cowboy Bebop, and no one
has bothered to mention how the basic plot (bounty hunters-with mysterious
pasts!- in space) had been done to death years before Bebop even came out.
Fundamentally,neither show is very original, but it's how the story is told
that counts in these cases (and both shows came from essentially the same
production team) Come to think of it, Evangelion has a pretty unoriginal
basic plot,too....
>
> Kenshin struck me as a cute, amiable show but not anything that I
> could really dig into, at least over the first four episodes. He
> screams "ORO!!!!" a little too much for me.
I didn't like the show too much until the Kurogawa story began (that's
episodes six and seven) plus at that point the producers were using the oros
like crazy to fill time. Since the Kyoto arc started, I think he's said
"oro" maybe twice in thirteen episodes I've seen. The real problem with
Kenshin though, is that it becomes almost an entirly different show upon the
start of that storyline-editing, pacing, writing quality, music, everything
improves dramatically. But once the arc is over, it all reportadly reverts
to how it was before Kyoto started. --;; Quite a shame,really.
> >Nope, but there's other stuff that's just as good. ^^
>
> Hmm, research has indicated otherwise.
>
> >> Lupin has Jet and Spike and a fraction of the style, though.
> >
> >Lupin INVENTED the style, my friend.
>
> Lupin didn't invent the Seat Belts, Yoko Kanno did.
True, but there's more to the show than just the music (though that's a
big,big part of it) and I contend that it managed to both bottle the spirit
of the Lupin shows as well as mold it into its own style.
> And as good as
> Miyazaki is, even Castle Cagliostro doesn't top the editing in Bebop.
Yeah, but I think that as a pure action/adventure Cagliostro outdoes
Bebop,reguardless of editing. I also think the film has more appeal to a
greater number of people; I wish it had been the big movie that ended up
representing anime in this country instead of the overrated Akira.
-Wyvern