BRAD, how about some answers for RANGERS?
Greybow Wildemane
I've been told there is a bug with Bow & Arrow ranges not
combining as they are intended to, stated in the Fletch/Bow
guides. I can say I've not
noticed any significant increase in range from a Rough
Hickory at 50 to my Rough Ash at 100, regardless of arrows
used. (Typically the store
bough 1 silver arrows with a range of 100.) Do they not
combine? Or if they do, is the difference between 50 and 100
so small in distance on the
maps as to be so undetectable.
At 22nd level, Rangers get Harmony. I can detect no change
in either aggressiveness nor how an NPC /con's to me with
this spell in effect. Seems its intended as a type of
area-effect Lull, but is broken. What is the deal on this?
While on Spells, Rangers receive Spirit of the Wolf at 39th
level. This is extremely late in a Rangers game life to have
such a spell. If there were a ranking of the classess based
on 'travel ability' I would say the best at it would be a
Ranger. Druids get SoW much earlier, 14th level, and in no
fantasy genre I can think of, are Druids thought to be more
proficient at travel than a Woodsman or Ranger. If we are to
look to Real Life for an
example, Druids did very little travel. They were a part of
a Clan and rarely left the Clan-holdings for anything, save
certain special events. Shamans recieve SoW even earlier
than a Druid, at 9th level. Again, I cant think of a reason
why a Shaman, a tribal spiritual leader, would be known for
fast or far travels. Now Bards, with their Accelerando
spell, I can rationalize. The traveling Bard is common in
the fantasy genre, though not entirely common in real world
history. The Bards were a caste of the Druids in gaelic &
celtic society and as such, were attached to a Clan. Bards
did travel about as they went along with war parties for
moral support as well as their entertainment value. :-) In
short (too late, I know) I should think that a Ranger would
be one of the fastest classes in the game, when in fact they
are the last class to recieve this speed-increasing spell.
Please allow us earlier access of this spell.
On yet another spell rant, Rangers have a single Conjuration
spell, Stinging Swarm. In, and of, itself this isn't bad.
Being at 30th level with a 9 skill in Conjuration, makes the
casting of this spell nigh-impossible. Many hours of useless
casting of fizzles or the expenditure of many vital Practice
points must be used to be able to cast a single spell. There
should be a low-level, 9th or 15th, type of Conjuration
spell for Rangers to at least allow a modicum of practice.
Other classes were given (ultimately) useless spells (re:
Sense Magic) that can be used to raise a spell skill for use
later in a PC's career.
Concerning Pine Needles and Tiny Daggers. I've heard these
are considered bugged. I've heard they were implemented as
such to allow a slightly more usefull tool in raising
Archery. Are they bugged or are they intended to be tools
for working on the Archery skill?
The lack of Fletching and Bowyering suppliers. I've found a
few outside of Surefall Glade. There is a Centaur in South
Karanas who has bows and nocks. No fletches/vanes, shafts or
heads. Why bother to sell nocks? What fletcher is not going
to have bought an equal amount of supplies before leaving SG
or Kelethin? I've also run across a couple other vendors,
one in East Karanas and one in Kithicor Forest, that look as
if they should be suppliers but only carry 1 silver arrows,
2 store-bough bows, a quiver, 1 or 2 other pieces to make
arrows. Nothing usefull for any aspiring Fletcher. These
places ought to carry either the staves for bowyering, or
much more usefull (and realistic) should carry fletching
supplies. No need, short of a sudden sale, to make a bow
when out adventuring but you may need to suddenly make a
quiver-full of arrows.
About the fletching of arrows for personal use: I can
understand and accept the lack of a batch-combine in regards
to gaining skill. I should not be able to buy 20 of each
item, pop them in the Kit and get any number of skill
increases. It would be nice though to be able to make an
entire batch of 4cp arrows for ammo once they've become
trivial to make. (On this, the ability to select an amount
of a stackable item during purchase would be incredibly
convenient. Also, concerning triviality. Once a task is
trivial, failure at that task should be very rare. Writing
ones name is a trivial task. When was the last time (sans
mass-alcohol consumption :-) ) you messed that up?
Quivers. Why bother? When I first saw one, I assumed they
would allow the auto-loading into my Ammo slot during
combat. However, arrows can be placed anywhere and this
still occurs; backpacks, bags, boxs, etc. For a time, I
carried one for a strictly role-playing aspect, but have
since replaced it with the Fletching kit. Both have 4 slots
to hold 80 arrows and both function equally well.
Many of these things I have /bug'ed or /feedback'ed in game,
including leaving my email address on those that should
elicit a response and have
been given none. Sans satisfaction, I now must turn to a
direct query. I hope you can provide answers, reasonings and
your own thoughts on the above issues.
**** Posted from RemarQ - http://www.remarq.com - Discussions Start Here (tm) ****
Davian
>
> Brad, please take the time to answer these concerns:
>
> I've been told there is a bug with Bow & Arrow ranges not
> combining as they are intended to, stated in the Fletch/Bow
> guides. I can say I've not
> noticed any significant increase in range from a Rough
> Hickory at 50 to my Rough Ash at 100, regardless of arrows
> used. (Typically the store
> bough 1 silver arrows with a range of 100.) Do they not
> combine? Or if they do, is the difference between 50 and 100
> so small in distance on the
> maps as to be so undetectable.
My rouge uses a bow and arrow set that has a combined range of 225, and
can definatley fire from a lot farther awau than my old monk, who used
100 range (or is it 50?) throwing stars.
In any event, between 50 and 100 is a very small difference in range.
Even with 225, I have to get relatively close before i'm able to shoot.
> While on Spells, Rangers receive Spirit of the Wolf at 39th
> level. This is extremely late in a Rangers game life to have
> such a spell. If there were a ranking of the classess based
> on 'travel ability' I would say the best at it would be a
> Ranger. Druids get SoW much earlier, 14th level, and in no
> fantasy genre I can think of, are Druids thought to be more
> proficient at travel than a Woodsman or Ranger. If we are to
> look to Real Life for an
> example, Druids did very little travel. They were a part of
> a Clan and rarely left the Clan-holdings for anything, save
> certain special events. Shamans recieve SoW even earlier
> than a Druid, at 9th level. Again, I cant think of a reason
> why a Shaman, a tribal spiritual leader, would be known for
> fast or far travels. Now Bards, with their Accelerando
> spell, I can rationalize. The traveling Bard is common in
> the fantasy genre, though not entirely common in real world
> history. The Bards were a caste of the Druids in gaelic &
> celtic society and as such, were attached to a Clan. Bards
> did travel about as they went along with war parties for
> moral support as well as their entertainment value. :-) In
> short (too late, I know) I should think that a Ranger would
> be one of the fastest classes in the game, when in fact they
> are the last class to recieve this speed-increasing spell.
> Please allow us earlier access of this spell.
>
Rangers get this spell late in the game for a simple reason. Because it
is extremely, extremely powerful. At least you get it at 39, Paladins
have to wait for 49 before getting thier resurrection spell, thier "best
spell".
Oh, and rangers should be the fastest class in the game? Not even
close. A rogue should be if anything, and they don't get any quick
running ability at all.
Simply put, SoW is a magical enhancement. It summons the spirit of a
wolf to magicly enhance your muscles and make you run faster. Now I
don't know what kind of fantasy you're reading, but that kind of magic
is way, way beyond any simple woodsman and archer I've ever heard of.
> On yet another spell rant, Rangers have a single Conjuration
> spell, Stinging Swarm. In, and of, itself this isn't bad.
> Being at 30th level with a 9 skill in Conjuration, makes the
> casting of this spell nigh-impossible. Many hours of useless
> casting of fizzles or the expenditure of many vital Practice
> points must be used to be able to cast a single spell. There
> should be a low-level, 9th or 15th, type of Conjuration
> spell for Rangers to at least allow a modicum of practice.
> Other classes were given (ultimately) useless spells (re:
> Sense Magic) that can be used to raise a spell skill for use
> later in a PC's career.
>
You had something better to do with those practice points? *amused look*
Anyways, it's part of price a mostly fighting class pays to be able to
cast thier little bit of magic. My own paladin had to spend more than a
few hours blasting decaying skeletons before he could cast Ward Undead
without fizzling 9 out of 10 times. And I'm not even going to bother
training conjuration. To hell with the summoned hammers ; ) Not worth
the effort to get them.
Davian
drocket
>My rouge uses a bow and arrow set that has a combined range of 225, and
>can definatley fire from a lot farther awau than my old monk, who used
>100 range (or is it 50?) throwing stars.
>
>In any event, between 50 and 100 is a very small difference in range.
>Even with 225, I have to get relatively close before i'm able to shoot.
When you use a bow and arrow, the range isn't found my adding the
range of the bow to the arrow. The range is the minimum of the two.
So if your bow has a range of 125 and your arrows 100, the range that
you can shoot from is 100.
>Rangers get this spell late in the game for a simple reason. Because it
>is extremely, extremely powerful. At least you get it at 39, Paladins
>have to wait for 49 before getting thier resurrection spell, thier "best
>spell".
So horribly overwhelmingly powerful that shaman get it at 9? Its not
like it even does any damage to monsters, it just takes away some of
the tedium of traveling from city to city, which is what a ranger is
supposed to be good at (traveling quickly through wilderness areas)
>Oh, and rangers should be the fastest class in the game? Not even
>close. A rogue should be if anything, and they don't get any quick
>running ability at all.
Well, in the city the rogues should be the fastest, but out in the
wild, they should be tripping over tree roots while the ranger is half
a mile ahead.
Davian
>
> On Sat, 29 May 1999 06:10:33 -0400, Davian <n...@e.mail> wrote:
>
>
> >Rangers get this spell late in the game for a simple reason. Because it
> >is extremely, extremely powerful. At least you get it at 39, Paladins
> >have to wait for 49 before getting thier resurrection spell, thier "best
> >spell".
>
> So horribly overwhelmingly powerful that shaman get it at 9? Its not
> like it even does any damage to monsters, it just takes away some of
> the tedium of traveling from city to city, which is what a ranger is
> supposed to be good at (traveling quickly through wilderness areas)
>
Hah... it's one of the very few spells in the game that lets you run
faster than a monster, so you have a *good* chance of actually surviving
a fight that goes badly. Quite frankly, anyone with access to this
spell who doesn't use it constantly, and only uses it to travel from
city to city is an idiot.
Ok, how about this? We'll reduce your melee fighting ability to that of
a shaman, and then you can have it at 9 too. But no double attack, no
dual wield, no tracking, no kick, no parry, no ability to use bladed
weapons at all... etc... etc..
It's the basic idea that each class should have advantages and each
class should have disadvantages.
Davian
Rick Russell
Greybow Wildemane <anon...@web.remarq.com> wrote:
<much complaining about Ranger spellcasting abilities deleted>
Honestly, do you expect a Ranger to get a spell like Spirit of the
Wolf before Druids and Shamans? Both are dedicated spellcasting
classes, while the Ranger is a hybrid warrior.
There are three ways to travel in the game:
1) Speed
2) Stealth
3) Intelligence
Shamans and Druids get speed, because they are in tune with the animal
spirits of wood and vale. Enchanters get stealth as a result of their
magical abilities, and rogues probably should too although their
stealth abilities appear to be very poorly developed.
Rangers and the rest of us depend on intelligence. Observe monsters,
avoid monsters, travel carefully. Rangers' tracking skill allows them
to exercise their intelligence more than the rest of us.
I don't know why Bards enjoy such a speed benefit, except that the
game designers were having trouble thinking of useful Bard songs so
they tossed in Accelerando.
You're not in competition with anyone but yourself. This class envy
just doesn't make any sense.
Rick R.
Ken Nicolson
>Rangers and the rest of us depend on intelligence. Observe monsters,
>avoid monsters, travel carefully. Rangers' tracking skill allows them
>to exercise their intelligence more than the rest of us.
Good points, but Rangers also get sneak at level 10, so they've got
two of your three capabilities.
>You're not in competition with anyone but yourself. This class envy
>just doesn't make any sense.
Yup.
>Rick R.
Ken
Jason Smith
> game designers were having trouble thinking of useful Bard songs so
> they tossed in Accelerando.
Bards are a catch-all for anything that might augment other classes. They're
the ultimate party member simply for their vast range of abilities, but they
only help if you are grouped with them in most cases.
Actually, bards singing Accellerando and beating a drum move faster than
anyone with SoW, but they pay for it in that they can't cast the spell on
anyone other than themselves.
IIIGEEIII
>a shaman, and then you can have it at 9 too. But no double attack, no
>dual wield, no tracking, no kick, no parry, no ability to use bladed
>weapons at all... etc... etc..
>
Lvl 9's a bit low for a ranger to get it, but i think it should be part of the
lvl 22 spells for a Ranger.
GEE
Mandrik, 19th lvl wood elf ranger on Karana
Davian
>
> >Ok, how about this? We'll reduce your melee fighting ability to that of
> >a shaman, and then you can have it at 9 too. But no double attack, no
> >dual wield, no tracking, no kick, no parry, no ability to use bladed
> >weapons at all... etc... etc..
> >
>
> Lvl 9's a bit low for a ranger to get it, but i think it should be part of the
> lvl 22 spells for a Ranger.
>
Ok, you completely missed the point of that paragraph.
Jim
Nor can they effectively melee while using the song/drum. Any fighter with
SoW on them can still fight just as well as without SoW.
Plissken
>
>Shamans and Druids get speed, because they are in tune with the animal
>spirits of wood and vale. Enchanters get stealth as a result of their
>magical abilities, and rogues probably should too although their
>stealth abilities appear to be very poorly developed.
>
>Rangers and the rest of us depend on intelligence. Observe monsters,
>avoid monsters, travel carefully.
Rangers DO get "Feet Like Cat" at Level 15. Though not exactly a
"speed" spell, it does help speed indirectly by raising your agility
20 or so points...it seems I run a bit faster with my 124 or 129 or
whatever Agility rating.
Plissken