Sense of Time, Economy, and Camping
Jeffrey Lin
is
because there will be more and more items harvested by players. There
are many
solutions to this problem, and I don't believe making them appearing on
one
unique NPC (and therefore a fixed, controllable maximum item population
rate) is the way to do it.
Although the design staff has good intentions with story line behind the
items and why this or that NPC are the only ones who should have them,
the
unfortunate reality is that most "campers" & "farmers" don't give a damn
about
that. They are there only because it makes good money. Not only so, it
precludes 90% of the people from getting these items, which means they
have to buy it from the farmers. For people that actually give a damn
about the plot as to why that particular NPC has it, the illusion is
shattered over and over by the farmers who sits to wait for poor Mob to
spawn over and over again, only for its items. Kinda reminds me of
stories of... gang rape in jail or something. "Hey you done with D'vinn?
Let me have a go at him."
The fact that there are many ways for the PC population to accumulate
wealth and no real way to relieve it only adds to the problem (Food,
water, and maybe some wellbalanced or combine weapons, some very cheap
spell components). I don't believe there are any ways to solve this
problem short of a complete redesign of the entire game. However I
have a suggestion to a list of changes that might slow down the problem
some what:
1- Let Set Spawn special NPCs spawn 35% at their "spawn point" and 65%
let them spawn randomly across several zones. Doesn't Ambassador D'vinn
need to stretch his legs once in awhile? Doesn't he need to pass
information back to he Indigo Brotherhood? Doesn't he feel like killing
a couple of woodelfs in Greater fay
for awhile then fade back into CB? This at least, would make people go
OUT to
search for him. Just because I live in my house doesn't mean I'm there
24
hours a day. NPCs should do the same. Let them all move around. For
people that STILL want to camp, they can still camp. But for those that
would like to hunt
them instead, they don't have to resort to play the camping game.
2- Limit the total number of unique items per server. IE, 500 PGTs.
When
that number hits, no new ones are spawned. Maybe its also time to get
rid of
the NPC and that story line. Maybe after 5000 deaths, that orc decided
to
packup his bags and reincarnate as a shark, which has no loot and a much
high life expectancy. This is an ever-changing world. Have 2 members
of your
programming staff throw in a new NPC every week or so that spawns some
limited
addition loot. It was suppose to be an ever changing world after all,
it would be fun if it actually is.
3- When a PC dies by a monsters hand, PC should lose all his money as
well
as 1 random loot, much like a duel death. It makes death a bigger
penalty, but
more importantly, items goes BACK into monsters hands, as well as
money. You
need this to balance the economy. A side impact is that, after awhile
there
will be some Legacy items. Imagine 2 years from now, you'll be proud to
own a
PGT because there are only 4 left on your server. It also should bring
a sense
of Time. "Oh those are PGTs! I thought they had all disappeared in year
4172."
ManiaK
storyline, because that would be a pain in the ass to implement of all
twenty servers, but having monsters loot you is great! The player driven
ecomomy would skyrocket, like it was in the opening of the server. Also,
that means that if that monster looted you, and someone else killed him
within a few minutes, it would circulate hi priced items around, causing
people to work a little harder. Also, maybe after like ten minutes, the item
will be destroyed on the monster, so really good items will be rare, which
is what we all want =)
I think it would discourage powergamers a lot also; face it EQ is not
meant for powergaming. It ruins the fun of RPG. Who knows what is would do
for camping, but I think Verant will find some other way to fix that. Just a
little aside on camping: If Verant made areas defined where a MOB would
randomly spawn, that would be the end of camping because people camp because
they know where the MOB will pop up - if the MOB pops up over the next hill,
then they will be forced to run around a lot, and also the MOB could spawn
right in back of you, giving an element of surprise. Maybe also have "smart"
spawning, where, depending on the level of the person in that area, the MOBs
would either spawn spread out, for a low level, so he is only attacked by
one of to of them, or two or three of them spawn very close to you if your a
high level, but the amount of spawns would always be equal to the capability
of the PC. Hehe, I guess that was a bit long, but anyway, I agree that
monsters should definately be able to loot at least one of your items and
take all of your money if it kills you.
Good thinking; I hope Brad reads this and gets some cool ideas. Or maybe
he will do a poll or something.
-Tigerwind
Jeffrey Lin <j...@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
news:3786B7D7...@sympatico.ca...
Numrennos
1. I am a powergamer.
2. I roleplay
3. I have fun
4. The people that i play with have fun
5. Both powergamers and others pay for the game
6. Without people paying for the game, the game would never
have been developed.
You choose to hurt people to enhance your own preceived fun.
Please realize that people can and do have fun in different
ways.
**** Posted from RemarQ - http://www.remarq.com - Discussions Start Here (tm) ****
D. Bingham Brown
>> When
>> that number hits, no new ones are spawned. Maybe its also time to get
>> rid of
>> the NPC and that story line. Maybe after 5000 deaths, that orc decided
>> to
>> packup his bags and reincarnate as a shark, which has no loot and a much
>> high life expectancy. This is an ever-changing world. Have 2 members
>> of your
>> programming staff throw in a new NPC every week or so that spawns some
>> limited
>> addition loot. It was suppose to be an ever changing world after all,
>> it would be fun if it actually is.
Personally, I think it would be better to equate the number of certain
items to the number of people high enough level to both get it and of
the right class to use it...
Example:
PGTs: 1 for each warrior 18+, 1/2 per ranger, paladin, SK, bard 18+
Screaming Maces: 1/2 for each warrior or cleric 15+
Serrated Bone Dirks: 1 for each rogue 30-45, 2 for each rogue 46+
etc, etc.
I think this prevents items from devaluing as much as they do now,
but doesn't make the game world too biased towards the _initial_
powergamers on a particular server.
Lowinor Silverleaf
Wood elf rogue, 24th level, Tunare
Tatter_D
wrote:
>1- Let Set Spawn special NPCs spawn 35% at their "spawn point" and 65%
>let them spawn randomly across several zones. Doesn't Ambassador D'vinn
>need to stretch his legs once in awhile? Doesn't he need to pass
>information back to he Indigo Brotherhood? Doesn't he feel like killing
>a couple of woodelfs in Greater fay
>for awhile then fade back into CB? This at least, would make people go
>OUT to
>search for him. Just because I live in my house doesn't mean I'm there
>24
>hours a day. NPCs should do the same. Let them all move around. For
>people that STILL want to camp, they can still camp. But for those that
>would like to hunt
>them instead, they don't have to resort to play the camping game.
D'Vinn spawning in a newbie zone? He's a holy terror for newbies
already, when he just stays in Crushbone.
>2- Limit the total number of unique items per server. IE, 500 PGTs.
>When
>that number hits, no new ones are spawned. Maybe its also time to get
>rid of
>the NPC and that story line. Maybe after 5000 deaths, that orc decided
>to
>packup his bags and reincarnate as a shark, which has no loot and a much
>high life expectancy. This is an ever-changing world. Have 2 members
>of your
>programming staff throw in a new NPC every week or so that spawns some
>limited
>addition loot. It was suppose to be an ever changing world after all,
>it would be fun if it actually is.
This is a good idea. I like it. Fat chance. <grin>
>3- When a PC dies by a monsters hand, PC should lose all his money as
>well
>as 1 random loot, much like a duel death. It makes death a bigger
>penalty, but
>more importantly, items goes BACK into monsters hands, as well as
>money. You
>need this to balance the economy. A side impact is that, after awhile
>there
>will be some Legacy items. Imagine 2 years from now, you'll be proud to
>own a
>PGT because there are only 4 left on your server. It also should bring
>a sense
>of Time. "Oh those are PGTs! I thought they had all disappeared in year
>4172."
Interesting concept. Might just be the kick the economy needs. Maybe
we should have this happen, instead of losing experience for dying.
Then again, we would likely see NMS on *all* the servers then. Not
that this would really be a bad thing. (I for one would find it
interesting to see a 45th level mage wearing no armor or weapon,
relying solely on his spells to stay alive. Wouldn't want to be one,
but it would be interesting to see. <grin>)
Krystian
armor or weapons. That'd be real rough on the newbies, but only inconvient
for the vets. Sure, you might not have your fancy stuff, but you could
probably at least manage to scrounge up enough for basic equipment. Heh, I
still only have half a suit of PW/leather and a tarnished 2-hander.
--
Krystian
7th Ranger, Prexus
Tatter_D <n...@spam.please> wrote in message
news:3787ba4a....@news.mindspring.com...
Tatter_D
<kgb...@ply.adelphia.net> wrote:
>I'd rather be a 45th level mage with no armor or items, than myself with no
>armor or weapons. That'd be real rough on the newbies, but only inconvient
>for the vets. Sure, you might not have your fancy stuff, but you could
>probably at least manage to scrounge up enough for basic equipment. Heh, I
>still only have half a suit of PW/leather and a tarnished 2-hander.
Good point. Monster looting would really hurt the newbies most, since
they die the most often. Maybe we could have it so it only kicks in
after level 20, when you're expected to know how to take care of
yourself.
Krystian
caps, but it's really bugging me that I have no clue what anyone is talking
about...
--
Krystian
7th Ranger, Prexus
D. Bingham Brown <dbr...@stny.lrun.com> wrote in message
news:tZOh3.935$i6....@newsr2.twcny.rr.com...
> >Jeffrey Lin <j...@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> >news:3786B7D7...@sympatico.ca...
> >> 2- Limit the total number of unique items per server. IE, 500 PGTs.
> >> When
> >> that number hits, no new ones are spawned. Maybe its also time to get
> >> rid of
> >> the NPC and that story line. Maybe after 5000 deaths, that orc decided
> >> to
> >> packup his bags and reincarnate as a shark, which has no loot and a
much
> >> high life expectancy. This is an ever-changing world. Have 2 members
> >> of your
> >> programming staff throw in a new NPC every week or so that spawns some
> >> limited
> >> addition loot. It was suppose to be an ever changing world after all,
> >> it would be fun if it actually is.
>
>
Adam Connor
>Call me an idiot, but WHAT IN THE THIRTEEN HELLS IS A PGT? Sorry 'bout the
>caps, but it's really bugging me that I have no clue what anyone is talking
>about...
Polished Granite Tomahawk.
--
adam connor / remove "_nospam" and "spamlite." to email
Jeffrey Lin
Tatter_D wrote:
> Good point. Monster looting would really hurt the newbies most, since
> they die the most often. Maybe we could have it so it only kicks in
> after level 20, when you're expected to know how to take care of
> yourself.
I don't know if I agree. Anything a level 20 character has that is NOT twinked
is not hard to replace. It should also help character twinking. You'll now
think twice before you hand a PGT over to a level 1 character.
ly...@aol.com
players to camp. There is enough trouble getting your corpse
now, to go after a half empty one - to lose experience and also
lose all your stuff? The numbers of people going back to UO, on
to Asheron and even back to stand alone games on the PC
would probably shut EQ down.
As for random spawn stopping camping. Nope, wouldnt do it. The
spawn cannot be truly random, to do that would cause so much
lag and ploss (every npc has to check if they are coming in under
the world,inside a mountain, 500 feet up in the sky etc). So what
you would have is a npc spawning at 2 or 3 different places, how
long before everyone knows those two or three places? It would
spread the camping out, but stop it? No way. Son as you define
areas where a mob will spawn you create a camp site, the more
areas the more spread out the camping but still camping there is.
As for powergamers, yes they do add to camping, but the design
of the game demands camping from all players, not just the
powergamers. You want a decent weapon, not to powergame but
to survive? you camp. You want some armor for the same reason?
you camp. You want any kind of magic items? you camp. You want
to complete almost any quest in the game? you camp. - if the only
reason to camp was to powergame then we would be fine, the
powergamers only camp while they can gain experience then move
on to higher things. Evreyone camps because it is the only way
given to play - you need or want items, you want to do the quests,
all leads to camping.
> I think that is a great idea. Maybe not removing npcs from the
> storyline, because that would be a pain in the ass to implement of all
> twenty servers, but having monsters loot you is great! The player driven
> ecomomy would skyrocket, like it was in the opening of the server. >
Tatter_D
wrote:
>I don't know if I agree. Anything a level 20 character has that is NOT twinked
>is not hard to replace. It should also help character twinking. You'll now
>think twice before you hand a PGT over to a level 1 character.
People who twink are going to twink regardless; most never expect to
see their stuff again anyhow. It may swing the balance of twinking
more in favor of armor, but that's about all the effect it would have.
In fact, it would likely *encourage* twinking level 1 characters, so
they are less likely to die and lose the precious money they've
managed to scrape together on their outing as they're running back to
town.
Howard Perkins
ly...@aol.com wrote:
> Well, there wouldnt be any more camping if this went through - no more
> players to camp. There is enough trouble getting your corpse
> now, to go after a half empty one - to lose experience and also
> lose all your stuff? The numbers of people going back to UO, on
> to Asheron and even back to stand alone games on the PC
> would probably shut EQ down.
>
I played one of the first online MUDs. When you died, all your stuff dropped on
the ground and anyone could pick it up, including the MOB.( Some of the highest
level MOBs like dragons would EAT you and your character was destroyed! ) A
fight in this game was a true risk! If you died, you had better have some
backup stuff in the bank , or some good friends to help you recover. Often you
had to go back and fight the MOBs that killed you in the first place to get back
your stuff that they were now using against you! What a rush!
The game had teleport/binding rings for anyone. Put on a ring, and you were
bound to that spot. Remove the ring, and you gated back to the spot. One use per
ring, but there were 8 finger slots .The rings were somewhat expensive but not
ridiculous. This made it possible to gate each way once you reached a spot, but
limited the gates due to the finger slots because you needed the slots for other
important rings as well.
Keith
most is, it would make the zones dangerous again. As a lev 17 ranger,
I can walk around CB and GF all day long with out even the chance of
death unless someone pulls out Crush and his friends in the tower.
Imagin if while walking from CB to kelethin DVinn spawned right next to
me. It would be a mad dash to a zone, or I would have to start shouting
for help and hope I could last long enough for it to arrive. These are
the things that made the game fun when I was lev 1-7. It would also
encourage travailing in groups, Right now I can go from kelethin to
eurdin almost with out worry.
> 1- Let Set Spawn special NPCs spawn 35% at their "spawn point" and 65%
> let them spawn randomly across several zones. Doesn't Ambassador D'vinn
> need to stretch his legs once in awhile? Doesn't he need to pass
> information back to he Indigo Brotherhood? Doesn't he feel like killing
> a couple of woodelfs in Greater fay
> for awhile then fade back into CB? This at least, would make people go
> OUT to
> search for him. Just because I live in my house doesn't mean I'm there
> 24
> hours a day. NPCs should do the same. Let them all move around. For
> people that STILL want to camp, they can still camp. But for those that
> would like to hunt
> them instead, they don't have to resort to play the camping game.
>
> 2- Limit the total number of unique items per server. IE, 500 PGTs.
> When
> that number hits, no new ones are spawned. Maybe its also time to get
> rid of
> the NPC and that story line. Maybe after 5000 deaths, that orc decided
> to
> packup his bags and reincarnate as a shark, which has no loot and a much
> high life expectancy. This is an ever-changing world. Have 2 members
> of your
> programming staff throw in a new NPC every week or so that spawns some
> limited
> addition loot. It was suppose to be an ever changing world after all,
> it would be fun if it actually is.
>