Stones.WAD BETTER THAN THE REST

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Sven Neuhaus

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Mar 28, 1994, 4:33:27 PM3/28/94
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Most of you have probably gotten some new level pwad files off the
ftp servers... Well - all those levels I've seen that were created
from scratch were pretty crappy - too small, simple etc.
Until I found stones.wad !!! It's the best PWAD file out there!
This level is worthy to be in one of the original episodes...
Get it now - or die of boredom! This level features some neato things
that you won't even find in the original levels...

Congrats to the creator. Incredible amount of work!

-Sven

Gary Smith

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Mar 29, 1994, 3:12:49 PM3/29/94
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In article <1994Mar28....@fuzzy.ping.de>,

Sven Neuhaus <sv...@fuzzy.ping.de> wrote:
>Most of you have probably gotten some new level pwad files off the
>ftp servers... Well - all those levels I've seen that were created
>from scratch were pretty crappy - too small, simple etc.
>Until I found stones.wad !!! It's the best PWAD file out there!
>This level is worthy to be in one of the original episodes...
>Get it now - or die of boredom! This level features some neato things
>that you won't even find in the original levels...

I agree completely. STONES is an incredible level. I rank it as the best out
there right now, with KENT2 and E2L2_GG1 as tied for second best. They've all
really enhanced our deathmatch play.

>
--

"Everyone _is_ out to get you...paranoia's just good thinking."
-Dr. Johnny Fever, 1979

dem...@rs6a.wln.com

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Mar 29, 1994, 9:16:50 PM3/29/94
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Gary Smith (ne...@sugar.NeoSoft.COM) wrote:
: In article <1994Mar28....@fuzzy.ping.de>,

: Sven Neuhaus <sv...@fuzzy.ping.de> wrote:
: >Most of you have probably gotten some new level pwad files off the
: >ftp servers... Well - all those levels I've seen that were created
: >from scratch were pretty crappy - too small, simple etc.
: >Until I found stones.wad !!! It's the best PWAD file out there!
: >This level is worthy to be in one of the original episodes...
: >Get it now - or die of boredom! This level features some neato things
: >that you won't even find in the original levels...

: I agree completely. STONES is an incredible level. I rank it as the best out
: there right now, with KENT2 and E2L2_GG1 as tied for second best. They've all
: really enhanced our deathmatch play.


JEFF-1-2.WAD is also an exellent death match level. We played it for 6
hours last night!

TB1

Eugen Woiwod

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Mar 29, 1994, 9:55:36 PM3/29/94
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> In article <2na241$a...@sugar.NeoSoft.COM>, ne...@sugar.NeoSoft.COM (Gary
> Smith) writes:
>
> Msg-ID: <2na241$a...@sugar.NeoSoft.COM>
> References: <1994Mar28....@fuzzy.ping.de>
> Posted: 29 Mar 1994 14:12:49 -0600
>
> Org. : NeoSoft Internet Services +1 713 684 5969

>
> In article <1994Mar28....@fuzzy.ping.de>,
> Sven Neuhaus <sv...@fuzzy.ping.de> wrote:
> >Most of you have probably gotten some new level pwad files off the
> >ftp servers... Well - all those levels I've seen that were created
> >from scratch were pretty crappy - too small, simple etc.
> >Until I found stones.wad !!! It's the best PWAD file out there!
> >This level is worthy to be in one of the original episodes...
> >Get it now - or die of boredom! This level features some neato things
> >that you won't even find in the original levels...
>
> I agree completely. STONES is an incredible level. I rank it as the
> best out
> there right now, with KENT2 and E2L2_GG1 as tied for second best.
> They've all
> really enhanced our deathmatch play.
>
> >
> --
>
> "Everyone _is_ out to get you...paranoia's just good thinking."
> -Dr. Johnny Fever, 1979
>


Yeah but he's lucky to get it working with DEU 5! Most of us are having
MAJOR problems trying to make levels from scratch! I think once the final
DEu 5 is released, more of us will be able to make better levels :)

Ttul

9878...@wsuvm1.csc.wsu.edu

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Mar 30, 1994, 1:10:56 AM3/30/94
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In article <1994Mar28....@fuzzy.ping.de>
It was my friend who put that one together, and after several hours of
constant brain pounding he has managed to teach me the intricacies of using the
Deu editor. Hopefully, in the next few days I will have my own level up if I
can clean up the bugs.

C. Miller


JOHN D CAPRIOTTI

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Mar 30, 1994, 10:13:32 AM3/30/94
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In <2na241$a...@sugar.NeoSoft.COM> ne...@sugar.NeoSoft.COM writes:

But where is it? I can't find it at ocf.unc.edu (or whatever).

thanks
j

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
John Capriotti irc: murpes | Some dude: Did you really do all those things, sir?
JDCA...@vax1.acs.jmu.edu | Duke: It's possible. I don't remember anything
My opinions are yours. | between 1968 and 1981. - DOONESBURY
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
All spelling and grammatical errors are because I go to JMU, where
education is subservient to process.

Michael Kelsey - EECS (Cpts499)

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Mar 31, 1994, 1:04:51 AM3/31/94
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It's not "luck" people. If you design your levels properly (with some exceptions) you can easily get your levels to compile. Try some simple stuff
first and keeping designing simple stuff until you are completely competent.
Not meant to be egotistical, but, I *rarely* have problems with DEU except for
"nodeline picked twice." This *only* happened because I used DEU 5.0 (non-BETA)
to generate the level (it had some very bad clipping effects) and then tried
importing back into DEU 5.0 BETA 4 to alleviate the clipping side effect. So,
like I said, and I have a friend (whom I trained) who can vouch for this, you
just need to design your levels carefully *each* step of the way, save often,
and run Doom after each modification to test your levels. Why do you suppose
it took me 14+ hours to develop -- not because I am slow, but, because I am
fortunate enough to have a VLB-EISA DX2/66 that operates very fast.
I cannot possibly know exactly what problems each and every devel-
oper is facing, but, with each level I have developed, I have *never* had any
troubles with clipping, compiling, or loading, with DEU. The only exception I
have is when I added a nice deathmatch arena and DEU5B4 came up with the error
that it couldn't read from my source file. I have tried everyone's suggestions
including Raphael's and the only way it *saved* was with DEU 5.0 (non-BETA).
Hopefully this won't offend anyone, as it is *not* intended to do so.
If you have any questions regarding level compilation, just ask; I am more than
happy to help. Also, I should add, I am not a programmer, thus, I can't tell
you how it works, I just know that I have discovered a method that *does* work.
I apologize if I have offended anyone (please E-mail if I have, perhaps
we can negotiate the situation) and I wish you good fortune while developing
your levels.


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
-=#| Michael Kelsey |#=- "I used to like Mac's, until I got my PC." <grin>
-=#| mke...@eecs.wsu.edu |#=-
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Gary Smith

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Mar 31, 1994, 12:35:42 PM3/31/94
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In article <1994Mar31.0...@serval.net.wsu.edu>,

Michael Kelsey - EECS (Cpts499) <mke...@rayshade.eecs.wsu.edu> wrote:
>>
>>Yeah but he's lucky to get it working with DEU 5! Most of us are having
>>MAJOR problems trying to make levels from scratch! I think once the final
>>DEu 5 is released, more of us will be able to make better levels :)
>>
> It's not "luck" people. If you design your levels properly (with some exceptions) you can easily get your levels to compile. Try some simple stuff
>first and keeping designing simple stuff until you are completely competent.
>Not meant to be egotistical, but, I *rarely* have problems with DEU except for
>"nodeline picked twice." This *only* happened because I used DEU 5.0 (non-BETA)
>to generate the level (it had some very bad clipping effects) and then tried
>importing back into DEU 5.0 BETA 4 to alleviate the clipping side effect. So,
>like I said, and I have a friend (whom I trained) who can vouch for this, you
>just need to design your levels carefully *each* step of the way, save often,
>and run Doom after each modification to test your levels. Why do you suppose
>it took me 14+ hours to develop -- not because I am slow, but, because I am
>fortunate enough to have a VLB-EISA DX2/66 that operates very fast.
> Hopefully this won't offend anyone, as it is *not* intended to do so.
>If you have any questions regarding level compilation, just ask; I am more than
>happy to help. Also, I should add, I am not a programmer, thus, I can't tell
>you how it works, I just know that I have discovered a method that *does* work.


Well, since you seem to have come up with a method that allows virtually bug-
free levels with DEU5.0, I'm sure we'd all appreciate it if you were able to
write up a small tutorial (similar to the FAQ posted recently by Cameron
Newham) on exactly how you do it, including the basics, how to avoid clipping
problems, creating different types of doors, limitations on the size of levels,
etc.

I realize that you're probably busy creating new levels, but it would certainly
be a great public service if you could do this.

Thanks,

Gary>

Tom Neff

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Mar 31, 1994, 5:54:25 PM3/31/94
to
Gary Smith (ne...@sugar.NeoSoft.COM) wrote:
: Well, since you seem to have come up with a method that allows virtually

: bug- free levels with DEU5.0, I'm sure we'd all appreciate it if you
: were able to write up a small tutorial (similar to the FAQ posted
: recently by Cameron Newham) on exactly how you do it, including the
: basics, how to avoid clipping problems, creating different types of
: doors, limitations on the size of levels, etc.

It's all out there already: get the DEU.TXT files, DEUTUTOR and the
other things that come with 5.0 and the ALLDOC ZIP file.

All you have to add to this is one sentence:

DON'T SKIP ANYTHING.

The penalty for cutting corners, forgetting textures, etc, is usually
the same: your level screws up. DOOM's engine never knows "what you
really meant."

Hopefully future editor releases will get better and better at doing
these consistency checks for us. In the meantime, use the coprocessor
mounted on your neck. :-)

My general advice for building complicated things is: see how Id does
it! With an editor like DEU you can examine the official levels in
great detail, seeing exactly how your favorite lifts, sniper's nests, or
torture chambers are built.

Tom Rauschenbach

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Mar 31, 1994, 8:04:24 PM3/31/94
to
I agree with the poster who said he's having trouble making levels from
scratch. I can't get DEU to close a sector. The doc says to just add
the last linedef. Fine. Anybody know how to add a linedef to a sector ?

--
Tom Rauschenbach An irrelevant and uninteresting actor, of no import
to this discussion, mentioned only so that this
t...@vmark.com sentence would not be in the passive voice, did the deed.

Badger

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Apr 1, 1994, 5:46:39 AM4/1/94
to
: >>Yeah but he's lucky to get it working with DEU 5! Most of us are having

: >>MAJOR problems trying to make levels from scratch! I think once the final
: >>DEu 5 is released, more of us will be able to make better levels :)
: >>
: >Not meant to be egotistical, but, I *rarely* have problems with DEU except for
: >like I said, and I have a friend (whom I trained) who can vouch for this, you

: >just need to design your levels carefully *each* step of the way, save often,
: >and run Doom after each modification to test your levels. Why do you suppose

I agree with the person who has no (few) problems. I also have had a lot
of luck with my start-from-scratch levels, the only time I have it go
haywire is when I'm editing a pre-made level (one of the standard ones),
I sometimes get clipping problems in those for no apparent reason.

I DO have a question or two, for anyone who can answer them. (regarding
DEU 5.0 non-beta) First, what is 'unpegged'? (referring to upper/lower
texture unpegged, in the linedef flags)

Second, and this isn't really a DEU question, could someone make a
program that puts new graphics in a pwad, so people can use 'em without
editing their main WAD? I think some specialty levels would look nice
with some customized graphics, but I have no knowledge about programming
so it's up to others... :) If it was an editor as well as an
extractor/inserter, so you could draw a pic and insert it in a pwad all
at once, that would be perfect. :) Thanks to all the designers out
there who have given me so much reason to play Doom. :)

(yeah, I'm excited about DEU-ming. Who wouldn't be?)

Michael Kelsey - EECS (Cpts499)

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Apr 1, 1994, 11:46:23 AM4/1/94
to
>
>Well, since you seem to have come up with a method that allows virtually bug-
>free levels with DEU5.0, I'm sure we'd all appreciate it if you were able to
>write up a small tutorial (similar to the FAQ posted recently by Cameron
>Newham) on exactly how you do it, including the basics, how to avoid clipping
>problems, creating different types of doors, limitations on the size of levels,
>etc.
>
>I realize that you're probably busy creating new levels, but it would certainly
>be a great public service if you could do this.
>
>Thanks,
>
>Gary>
>
>
>--
>
>"Everyone _is_ out to get you...paranoia's just good thinking."
> -Dr. Johnny Fever, 1979
>

Okay Gary, you and the rest of the net will get a smal FAQ demonstrating the usage of DEU for creating levels.

-Michael

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