Re: [JNCOBOY] EVERYONE READ!!!!

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Red Dragon

unread,
Oct 5, 2008, 12:01:56 PM10/5/08
to
emmel wrote:
> Thus Red Dragon spoke:
>
>> Neo wrote:
>>
>> <snip>
>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Oh, I have seen the new story, but this post I am
>>>>>>>>>>> replying to is older. Besides, [JNCOBOY]
>>>>>>>>>>> EVERYBODY READ!!!!
>>>>>>>>>> Yeah. Besides, it's only about one third of a
>>>>>>>>>> story. I had such trouble getting that bit done,
>>>>>>>>>> though, I just wanted to push it out, crossing both
>>>>>>>>>> the mental border of 'it's done, get on' (except
>>>>>>>>>> for a gazillion revisions and possibly a few
>>>>>>>>>> rewrites) and to see if anyone throws rotten
>>>>>>>>>> tomatoes at me for it being that abysmally
>>>>>>>>>> horrible. Showing that I'm still at it is a
>>>>>>>>>> neglectable (sp?) side effect. Not that anyone
>>>>>>>>>> really cares.
>>>>>>>>> Of course we care! Both Red Dragon and me!
>>>>>>>> You don't see too concerned, though. And where *is* Red
>>>>>>>> Dragon anyway? Still around?
>>>>>>> She posted two days ago.
>>>>>> Yes, saw it after posting. Good thing to have her around.
>>>>> Who else would fire up the BBQ?
>>>> Oh, I always keep a flame thrower or two in storage.
>>> I think the napalm in them is a bit smelly. Red Dragon gets the
>>> navens better cooked and crispy.
>>>
>>> Neo
>> Perhaps, but the flavor depends heavily on what kind of toothpaste
>> I've been using.
>
> Hm... I wonder... Is there toothpaste with authentic Naven BBQ
> flavour?

It'd be like a Summer party! In my mouth! Twice a day!

Wait...

I'd have to use it on special occasions only. I'd get terribly sick of
that in a hurry.

emmel

unread,
Oct 6, 2008, 5:07:36 AM10/6/08
to
Thus Red Dragon spoke:

Special occasion toothpaste... The mind boggles at the possibilities.
We're gonna be rich!
--
emmel <the_emmel*you-know-what-that's-for*@gmx.net>
(Don't forget to remove the ** bit)

story archives available at http://ranira.wordpress.com

Official AGC feedback maniac

"God is playing creatures - and we're the norns."

"A hundred dead are a tragedy - a hundred thousand are statistics."

"I guess you can call yourself lucky." -
"I could, but Linda suits me a little better... :)
Things called lucky tend to get hit by trucks."

Proud owner of 1 (one) DISOBEDIENCE point.
Former owner of 1 (one) eating point (eaten, sigh).

Hi, I'm a .sig virus. Just copy me to your .signature. And don't worry.

Neo

unread,
Oct 7, 2008, 3:05:00 PM10/7/08
to

I have toothpaste for the special occasion that I want to brush my
teeth!

btw, I will be getting to the Aya story once the pirates are away. I
hope you are enjoying yourself emmel!

Neo
--
Everything that has a beginning has an end.

emmel

unread,
Oct 8, 2008, 4:11:21 AM10/8/08
to
Thus Neo spoke:

> emmel wrote:
>> Thus Red Dragon spoke:
>>

>>> I'd have to use it on special occasions only. I'd get terribly sick of
>>> that in a hurry.
>>
>> Special occasion toothpaste... The mind boggles at the possibilities.
>> We're gonna be rich!
>
> I have toothpaste for the special occasion that I want to brush my
> teeth!

Erm... Care for some breath mints?

> btw, I will be getting to the Aya story once the pirates are away. I
> hope you are enjoying yourself emmel!

But... But... That could take *ages*!

Neo

unread,
Oct 8, 2008, 8:52:41 AM10/8/08
to
emmel wrote:
> Thus Neo spoke:
>
>> emmel wrote:
>>> Thus Red Dragon spoke:
>>>
>>>> I'd have to use it on special occasions only. I'd get terribly sick of
>>>> that in a hurry.
>>> Special occasion toothpaste... The mind boggles at the possibilities.
>>> We're gonna be rich!
>> I have toothpaste for the special occasion that I want to brush my
>> teeth!
>
> Erm... Care for some breath mints?

Then I would have to brush my teeth again!

>> btw, I will be getting to the Aya story once the pirates are away. I
>> hope you are enjoying yourself emmel!
>
> But... But... That could take *ages*!

True, I'll see what I can do this week. Unless you want to post a
proofread version yourself first!

emmel

unread,
Oct 9, 2008, 3:43:48 AM10/9/08
to
Thus Neo spoke:

> emmel wrote:
>> Thus Neo spoke:
>>
>>> emmel wrote:
>>>> Thus Red Dragon spoke:
>>>>
>>>>> I'd have to use it on special occasions only. I'd get terribly sick of
>>>>> that in a hurry.
>>>> Special occasion toothpaste... The mind boggles at the possibilities.
>>>> We're gonna be rich!
>>> I have toothpaste for the special occasion that I want to brush my
>>> teeth!
>>
>> Erm... Care for some breath mints?
>
> Then I would have to brush my teeth again!

Is that a yes?

>>> btw, I will be getting to the Aya story once the pirates are away. I
>>> hope you are enjoying yourself emmel!
>>
>> But... But... That could take *ages*!
>
> True, I'll see what I can do this week. Unless you want to post a
> proofread version yourself first!

Actually, I got silly and posted it on the archive site...

Neo

unread,
Oct 9, 2008, 10:54:06 AM10/9/08
to
emmel wrote:
> Thus Neo spoke:
>
>> emmel wrote:
>>> Thus Neo spoke:
>>>
>>>> emmel wrote:
>>>>> Thus Red Dragon spoke:
>>>>>
>>>>>> I'd have to use it on special occasions only. I'd get terribly sick of
>>>>>> that in a hurry.
>>>>> Special occasion toothpaste... The mind boggles at the possibilities.
>>>>> We're gonna be rich!
>>>> I have toothpaste for the special occasion that I want to brush my
>>>> teeth!
>>> Erm... Care for some breath mints?
>> Then I would have to brush my teeth again!
>
> Is that a yes?

Since all the pirates jumped ship and swam away from the Albian coast, I
fear I have to now. It is not even long! A magazine I subscribed to
split up in two and I had to cancel one subscription and now I have to
choose from several others! (they come with the part I like, a group of
computer users that help each other in their specialized areas).

Stupid thing is that I have the same subscriber number at both now. So
if they really want revenge on me cancelling my subscription they can
cancel my subscription in the part I want to keep too!

My homepage is part of the subscription I want to keep, but I am not
sure who I pay for it any more.

They had ADSL en dailup and the ADSL part wend to XS4All (where I am
now), but I am not sure where the dailup part went to. Maybe it is with
XS4All, maybe with the hobby group, maybe with the subscription I just
cancelled.

I like to keep my e-mail address, lots of people have it. People I
haven't heard from in a while and who I would like to keep in contact with.

Alas. Nothing I can do about it now. Just hoping for the best.

>>>> btw, I will be getting to the Aya story once the pirates are away. I
>>>> hope you are enjoying yourself emmel!
>>> But... But... That could take *ages*!
>> True, I'll see what I can do this week. Unless you want to post a
>> proofread version yourself first!
>
> Actually, I got silly and posted it on the archive site...

I have no idea how well read that archive is!

emmel

unread,
Oct 9, 2008, 11:28:54 AM10/9/08
to
Thus Neo spoke:

> emmel wrote:
>> Thus Neo spoke:
>>
>>> emmel wrote:
>>>> Thus Neo spoke:
>>>>
>>>>> emmel wrote:
>>>>>> Thus Red Dragon spoke:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I'd have to use it on special occasions only. I'd get terribly sick of
>>>>>>> that in a hurry.
>>>>>> Special occasion toothpaste... The mind boggles at the possibilities.
>>>>>> We're gonna be rich!
>>>>> I have toothpaste for the special occasion that I want to brush my
>>>>> teeth!
>>>> Erm... Care for some breath mints?
>>> Then I would have to brush my teeth again!
>>
>> Is that a yes?
>
> Since all the pirates jumped ship and swam away from the Albian coast, I
> fear I have to now. It is not even long! A magazine I subscribed to
> split up in two and I had to cancel one subscription and now I have to
> choose from several others! (they come with the part I like, a group of
> computer users that help each other in their specialized areas).

Should I know what you are talking about?

> Stupid thing is that I have the same subscriber number at both now. So
> if they really want revenge on me cancelling my subscription they can
> cancel my subscription in the part I want to keep too!
>
> My homepage is part of the subscription I want to keep, but I am not
> sure who I pay for it any more.
>
> They had ADSL en dailup and the ADSL part wend to XS4All (where I am
> now), but I am not sure where the dailup part went to. Maybe it is with
> XS4All, maybe with the hobby group, maybe with the subscription I just
> cancelled.
>
> I like to keep my e-mail address, lots of people have it. People I
> haven't heard from in a while and who I would like to keep in contact with.
>
> Alas. Nothing I can do about it now. Just hoping for the best.

It sounds as if you replied to the wrong post, maybe?

>>>>> btw, I will be getting to the Aya story once the pirates are away. I
>>>>> hope you are enjoying yourself emmel!
>>>> But... But... That could take *ages*!
>>> True, I'll see what I can do this week. Unless you want to post a
>>> proofread version yourself first!
>>
>> Actually, I got silly and posted it on the archive site...
>
> I have no idea how well read that archive is!

Well, I think one or two people might have glanced at it. The posts,
that is. The whole thing got a few more hits, although it's far from
being well visited. Still, I think one or two people might actually
follow ATC though it. I'll never know for sure, though - same problem as
with lurkers around here.

Neo

unread,
Oct 10, 2008, 8:29:25 AM10/10/08
to

Let me say it in simpler words.

You remember my e-mail address?

That might be gone any date from now if I don't take the right steps.

There might not even be any right steps to take!

I expect your sympathy on this!!

emmel

unread,
Oct 11, 2008, 4:34:20 AM10/11/08
to
Thus Neo spoke:

You *do* have my sympathy, but I still think the reply just doesn't fit
the post you replied to.

Neo

unread,
Oct 11, 2008, 7:39:29 AM10/11/08
to

It was an excuse to put off proofreading Aya #3. I am not really good at
using excuses, which is why I usually counter any argument to get me to
do something :-)

emmel

unread,
Oct 11, 2008, 9:23:07 AM10/11/08
to
Thus Neo spoke:

> emmel wrote:
>> Thus Neo spoke:
>>
>>> emmel wrote:
>>>> Thus Neo spoke:
>>>>

>>>> It sounds as if you replied to the wrong post, maybe?
>>> Let me say it in simpler words.
>>>
>>> You remember my e-mail address?
>>>
>>> That might be gone any date from now if I don't take the right steps.
>>>
>>> There might not even be any right steps to take!
>>>
>>> I expect your sympathy on this!!
>>
>> You *do* have my sympathy, but I still think the reply just doesn't fit
>> the post you replied to.
>
> It was an excuse to put off proofreading Aya #3. I am not really good at
> using excuses, which is why I usually counter any argument to get me to
> do something :-)

Ah. You *did* reply to the wrong post!

Neo

unread,
Oct 12, 2008, 3:04:57 PM10/12/08
to
emmel wrote:
> Thus Neo spoke:
>
>> emmel wrote:
>>> Thus Neo spoke:
>>>
>>>> emmel wrote:
>>>>> Thus Neo spoke:
>>>>>
>>>>> It sounds as if you replied to the wrong post, maybe?
>>>> Let me say it in simpler words.
>>>>
>>>> You remember my e-mail address?
>>>>
>>>> That might be gone any date from now if I don't take the right steps.
>>>>
>>>> There might not even be any right steps to take!
>>>>
>>>> I expect your sympathy on this!!
>>> You *do* have my sympathy, but I still think the reply just doesn't fit
>>> the post you replied to.
>> It was an excuse to put off proofreading Aya #3. I am not really good at
>> using excuses, which is why I usually counter any argument to get me to
>> do something :-)
>
> Ah. You *did* reply to the wrong post!

Everything for the improved well-being of JNCOBOY! (Or is it a girl
actually?)

emmel

unread,
Oct 13, 2008, 6:10:40 AM10/13/08
to
Thus Neo spoke:

> emmel wrote:
>> Thus Neo spoke:
>>

>>> It was an excuse to put off proofreading Aya #3. I am not really good at
>>> using excuses, which is why I usually counter any argument to get me to
>>> do something :-)
>>
>> Ah. You *did* reply to the wrong post!
>
> Everything for the improved well-being of JNCOBOY! (Or is it a girl
> actually?)

I don't have a clue, but I don't think it is.

Neo

unread,
Oct 13, 2008, 9:11:54 AM10/13/08
to
emmel wrote:
> Thus Neo spoke:
>
>> emmel wrote:
>>> Thus Neo spoke:
>>>
>>>> It was an excuse to put off proofreading Aya #3. I am not really good at
>>>> using excuses, which is why I usually counter any argument to get me to
>>>> do something :-)
>>> Ah. You *did* reply to the wrong post!
>> Everything for the improved well-being of JNCOBOY! (Or is it a girl
>> actually?)
>
> I don't have a clue, but I don't think it is.

Maybe it is a Co-Boy. Or a Cob-Oi!

emmel

unread,
Oct 15, 2008, 7:50:49 AM10/15/08
to
Thus Neo spoke:

> emmel wrote:
>> Thus Neo spoke:
>>
>>> emmel wrote:
>>>> Thus Neo spoke:
>>>>
>>>>> It was an excuse to put off proofreading Aya #3. I am not really good at
>>>>> using excuses, which is why I usually counter any argument to get me to
>>>>> do something :-)
>>>> Ah. You *did* reply to the wrong post!
>>> Everything for the improved well-being of JNCOBOY! (Or is it a girl
>>> actually?)
>>
>> I don't have a clue, but I don't think it is.
>
> Maybe it is a Co-Boy. Or a Cob-Oi!

Um... whatever you say...
::backs away::

Neo

unread,
Oct 17, 2008, 9:33:49 AM10/17/08
to
emmel wrote:
> Thus Neo spoke:
>
>> emmel wrote:
>>> Thus Neo spoke:
>>>
>>>> emmel wrote:
>>>>> Thus Neo spoke:
>>>>>
>>>>>> It was an excuse to put off proofreading Aya #3. I am not really good at
>>>>>> using excuses, which is why I usually counter any argument to get me to
>>>>>> do something :-)
>>>>> Ah. You *did* reply to the wrong post!
>>>> Everything for the improved well-being of JNCOBOY! (Or is it a girl
>>>> actually?)
>>> I don't have a clue, but I don't think it is.
>> Maybe it is a Co-Boy. Or a Cob-Oi!
>
> Um... whatever you say...
> ::backs away::

Maybe it is the illegitimate son of satan and we are just keeping it
alive!

emmel

unread,
Oct 20, 2008, 7:11:03 AM10/20/08
to
On different notes, I hard disk committed suicide at the weekend. I can
only hope there was nothing *really* import on it - except for the stuff
that wasn't really important, but sucks to loose anyway. Not to mention
having to set up the OS; I ended up cloning my laptop's with all the
problems that brings...

emmel

unread,
Oct 20, 2008, 6:52:00 AM10/20/08
to
Thus Neo spoke:

Oh, come on. Since when are devil's brains vegetarian? (like naven
ones...)

Red Dragon

unread,
Oct 20, 2008, 11:23:28 AM10/20/08
to
emmel wrote:
> On different notes, I hard disk committed suicide at the weekend. I can
> only hope there was nothing *really* import on it - except for the stuff
> that wasn't really important, but sucks to loose anyway. Not to mention
> having to set up the OS; I ended up cloning my laptop's with all the
> problems that brings...

Oh no! That's always a gigantic pain. What happened to it exactly? And
did you have a spare?

And yeah. Let's hope nothing too important was lost.

Neo

unread,
Oct 21, 2008, 4:18:14 AM10/21/08
to
emmel wrote:
> Thus Neo spoke:
>
>> emmel wrote:
>>> Thus Neo spoke:
>>>
>>>> emmel wrote:
>>>>> Thus Neo spoke:
>>>>>
>>>>>> emmel wrote:
>>>>>>> Thus Neo spoke:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> It was an excuse to put off proofreading Aya #3. I am not really good at
>>>>>>>> using excuses, which is why I usually counter any argument to get me to
>>>>>>>> do something :-)
>>>>>>> Ah. You *did* reply to the wrong post!
>>>>>> Everything for the improved well-being of JNCOBOY! (Or is it a girl
>>>>>> actually?)
>>>>> I don't have a clue, but I don't think it is.
>>>> Maybe it is a Co-Boy. Or a Cob-Oi!
>>> Um... whatever you say...
>>> ::backs away::
>> Maybe it is the illegitimate son of satan and we are just keeping it
>> alive!
>
> Oh, come on. Since when are devil's brains vegetarian? (like naven
> ones...)

It feeds on the fears of the innocent?

emmel

unread,
Oct 21, 2008, 4:12:24 AM10/21/08
to
On 2008-10-20, Red Dragon <agcl...@lurkerson.net> wrote:
> emmel wrote:
>> On different notes, I hard disk committed suicide at the weekend. I can
>> only hope there was nothing *really* import on it - except for the stuff
>> that wasn't really important, but sucks to loose anyway. Not to mention
>> having to set up the OS; I ended up cloning my laptop's with all the
>> problems that brings...
>
> Oh no! That's always a gigantic pain. What happened to it exactly? And
> did you have a spare?

It started with plenty of error messages on bootup, severely slowing it
down. I tried fixing the file system, but to no avail... then it stopped
working at all. With plenty of time I can see parts of the OS partition,
but not even that for the data one. I fortunately still had a (half the
size) old hard disk in, that I use for experimenting (alternate OSs or
whatever else), so I at least got the machine into working condition
again. Didn't work properly until I disconnected the other HD, though...

> And yeah. Let's hope nothing too important was lost.

Problem is, I don't really know what was on it. At least not in detail.
I guess I'll just find myself missing some old data some time in the
future that doesn't seem to exist anymore.

On different notes: 42 unread messages today... Does that mean anything?


--
emmel <the_emmel*you-know-what-that's-for*@gmx.net>
(Don't forget to remove the ** bit)

story backlogs available at http://ranira.wordpress.com

Neo

unread,
Oct 21, 2008, 4:33:44 AM10/21/08
to

I set up a computer yesterday to show a Windows 95 game to my girlfriend
(Starcontrol 3, she liked the puppets though she lacks the grasp of the
English language to avoid a fight with them). It is a very old case I
got for free some someone. 64 MB, really too few to run a modern day
anti-virus solution on it.

Anyways, I had some crashes because of the mobo I think (very cheap
design) and one error message made me run Seatools on it. It said the
harddisk temperature was 53 degrees Celsius and the max temperature was
no less than 62 degrees Celsius! (in the summer I presume). So I opened
up the case, and it was indeed very hot in there. Problem is that there
is no extra rear fan in the case and no space to fit one. And in the
side panels of the case there are no ventilation holes either, so the
case just heats up with prolonged use.

Nothing I can do about that except take the side off or put it in a new
case (which would be a shame because the mobo is crap).

On a related note, since this is JNCOBOY, I used the same Seatools on
another computer I have and it said "This drive is Security Freeze
Locked". That had me a bit worried because the computer came from a
business setup, but it had always worked fine (except that when I got it
the only case fan present wasn't moving, hence the reason for me being
enthusiastic at first about it being so silent). So I fired up google to
find out what that meant.

Well, it turns out Seagate added encryption to their HDs because MS
needed that for it's XBOX (which is totally broken btw in terms of DRM).
Problem was, if you don't use the encryption, malware can set your
encryption to a random passphrase thus making your HD inaccessible at
the next reboot! That is what "This drive is Security Freeze Locked it
for". To prevent malware from doing that.

It is an option in your BIOS though, so you might still be out of luck
if you use the same HD in another machine. Talk about ransomware!

Neo

unread,
Oct 21, 2008, 4:42:01 AM10/21/08
to
emmel wrote:
> On 2008-10-20, Red Dragon <agcl...@lurkerson.net> wrote:
>> emmel wrote:
>>> On different notes, I hard disk committed suicide at the weekend. I can
>>> only hope there was nothing *really* import on it - except for the stuff
>>> that wasn't really important, but sucks to loose anyway. Not to mention
>>> having to set up the OS; I ended up cloning my laptop's with all the
>>> problems that brings...
>> Oh no! That's always a gigantic pain. What happened to it exactly? And
>> did you have a spare?
>
> It started with plenty of error messages on bootup, severely slowing it
> down. I tried fixing the file system, but to no avail... then it stopped
> working at all. With plenty of time I can see parts of the OS partition,
> but not even that for the data one. I fortunately still had a (half the
> size) old hard disk in, that I use for experimenting (alternate OSs or
> whatever else), so I at least got the machine into working condition
> again. Didn't work properly until I disconnected the other HD, though...

Maybe the electronics of one of your hard drives is fried. Just
guessing! Are they on the same IDE cable? Is one set as master and the
other one as slave? (you can use jumpers to do this).

>> And yeah. Let's hope nothing too important was lost.
>
> Problem is, I don't really know what was on it. At least not in detail.
> I guess I'll just find myself missing some old data some time in the
> future that doesn't seem to exist anymore.

I heard you can put USB sticks that stopped working in a vacuum bag in
the freezer. Maybe that will work for your HD too. As a last resort I
might add, condensation on the platters might ruin it for good.

Maybe it is best to run a low level tool from the manufacturer first.
You can download an iso for that (probably).

> On different notes: 42 unread messages today... Does that mean anything?

That probably means the pirates from aglami are getting all excited over
something again ;-D

Neo

unread,
Oct 21, 2008, 6:46:17 AM10/21/08
to
emmel wrote:

> On 2008-10-21, Neo <wh...@thematrix.is> wrote:
>> emmel wrote:
>>> On 2008-10-20, Red Dragon <agcl...@lurkerson.net> wrote:
>>>> emmel wrote:
>>>>> On different notes, I hard disk committed suicide at the weekend. I can
>>>>> only hope there was nothing *really* import on it - except for the stuff
>>>>> that wasn't really important, but sucks to loose anyway. Not to mention
>>>>> having to set up the OS; I ended up cloning my laptop's with all the
>>>>> problems that brings...
>>>> Oh no! That's always a gigantic pain. What happened to it exactly? And
>>>> did you have a spare?
>>> It started with plenty of error messages on bootup, severely slowing it
>>> down. I tried fixing the file system, but to no avail... then it stopped
>>> working at all. With plenty of time I can see parts of the OS partition,
>>> but not even that for the data one. I fortunately still had a (half the
>>> size) old hard disk in, that I use for experimenting (alternate OSs or
>>> whatever else), so I at least got the machine into working condition
>>> again. Didn't work properly until I disconnected the other HD, though...
>> Maybe the electronics of one of your hard drives is fried. Just
>> guessing! Are they on the same IDE cable? Is one set as master and the
>> other one as slave? (you can use jumpers to do this).
>
> Yeah, that's the setup. My guess is that it's indeed the interface
> electronics, but of course that doesn't help me one bit.

Just write "Kaput" on your drive and keep it for future reference when
you miss something terribly important (like your GPG key).

>>>> And yeah. Let's hope nothing too important was lost.
>>> Problem is, I don't really know what was on it. At least not in detail.
>>> I guess I'll just find myself missing some old data some time in the
>>> future that doesn't seem to exist anymore.
>> I heard you can put USB sticks that stopped working in a vacuum bag in
>> the freezer. Maybe that will work for your HD too. As a last resort I
>> might add, condensation on the platters might ruin it for good.
>

> As I said, it's likely the control electronics. Condensation shouldn't
> be a problem since the platters are packed air tight, but even so I
> don't see myself putting the hard drive into the freezer. I think it's
> gone for good, and even so I don't have the necessary capacities to make
> a backup if it ought to work.

There is the vent hole in harddisks. Next to the sticker that says "Do
Not Cover This Hole"

>> Maybe it is best to run a low level tool from the manufacturer first.
>> You can download an iso for that (probably).
>>
>>> On different notes: 42 unread messages today... Does that mean anything?
>> That probably means the pirates from aglami are getting all excited over
>> something again ;-D
>

> Yeah, sounds likely.

They are easily exited.

Neo

unread,
Oct 21, 2008, 6:52:50 AM10/21/08
to
emmel wrote:
> On 2008-10-21, Neo <wh...@thematrix.is> wrote:
>> Red Dragon wrote:
>>> emmel wrote:
>>>> On different notes, I hard disk committed suicide at the weekend. I can
>>>> only hope there was nothing *really* import on it - except for the stuff
>>>> that wasn't really important, but sucks to loose anyway. Not to mention
>>>> having to set up the OS; I ended up cloning my laptop's with all the
>>>> problems that brings...
>>> Oh no! That's always a gigantic pain. What happened to it exactly? And
>>> did you have a spare?
>>>
>>> And yeah. Let's hope nothing too important was lost.
>> I set up a computer yesterday to show a Windows 95 game to my girlfriend
>> (Starcontrol 3, she liked the puppets though she lacks the grasp of the
>> English language to avoid a fight with them). It is a very old case I
>> got for free some someone. 64 MB, really too few to run a modern day
>> anti-virus solution on it.
>
> Linux & Wine...

Starcontrol 3 doesn't run natively on Linux ;-)
Starcontrol 2 does though! It is a novel /and/ a game!

>> Anyways, I had some crashes because of the mobo I think (very cheap
>> design) and one error message made me run Seatools on it. It said the
>> harddisk temperature was 53 degrees Celsius and the max temperature was
>> no less than 62 degrees Celsius! (in the summer I presume). So I opened
>> up the case, and it was indeed very hot in there. Problem is that there
>> is no extra rear fan in the case and no space to fit one. And in the
>> side panels of the case there are no ventilation holes either, so the
>> case just heats up with prolonged use.
>

> Mine is reasonably well vented and besides, it's not even that hot
> anymore. I used to run it with over thirty degrees Celsius room
> temperature... The only problem is that it sits pretty much above the
> other hard driver, but that shouldn't really be critical. Probably ages
> capacitators or something - that's what killed my old main board (or
> rather the AGP).

That would be your problem. If you stack two HDs on top of each other in
your floppy drive bays, the top one will get very hot. And the lower one
won't be able to get rid of the heat it generates.

Lots of air above and below your HD is best. You have cheap kits to
modify a 5 1/4" bay to a 3 1/2" one.

>> Nothing I can do about that except take the side off or put it in a new
>> case (which would be a shame because the mobo is crap).
>

> Or leave the case open. It helps.

Not if you have cats (which I don't btw).

>> On a related note, since this is JNCOBOY, I used the same Seatools on
>> another computer I have and it said "This drive is Security Freeze
>> Locked". That had me a bit worried because the computer came from a
>> business setup, but it had always worked fine (except that when I got it
>> the only case fan present wasn't moving, hence the reason for me being
>> enthusiastic at first about it being so silent). So I fired up google to
>> find out what that meant.
>>
>> Well, it turns out Seagate added encryption to their HDs because MS
>> needed that for it's XBOX (which is totally broken btw in terms of DRM).
>> Problem was, if you don't use the encryption, malware can set your
>> encryption to a random passphrase thus making your HD inaccessible at
>> the next reboot! That is what "This drive is Security Freeze Locked it
>> for". To prevent malware from doing that.
>

> Interesting way of telling you that.

Yeah, I thought the drive only worked in that computer! Not that it was
a big drive, but still.

>> It is an option in your BIOS though, so you might still be out of luck
>> if you use the same HD in another machine. Talk about ransomware!
>

> Oh yeah. On a sidenote, software encryption works fine for me. Might
> decrease the performance a bit, but not noticeably so.

OTFE works great I hear.

Neo

unread,
Oct 21, 2008, 6:55:38 AM10/21/08
to
emmel wrote:
> On 2008-10-21, Neo <wh...@thematrix.is> wrote:
> Navens? Devils? Brains?

Navens aren't innocent!

emmel

unread,
Oct 21, 2008, 7:01:55 AM10/21/08
to

I meant 'it'.


--
emmel <the_emmel*you-know-what-that's-for*@gmx.net>
(Don't forget to remove the ** bit)

story backlogs available at http://ranira.wordpress.com

emmel

unread,
Oct 21, 2008, 6:57:43 AM10/21/08
to
On 2008-10-21, Neo <wh...@thematrix.is> wrote:
> emmel wrote:
>> On 2008-10-21, Neo <wh...@thematrix.is> wrote:
>>> Red Dragon wrote:
>>>> emmel wrote:
>>>>> On different notes, I hard disk committed suicide at the weekend. I can
>>>>> only hope there was nothing *really* import on it - except for the stuff
>>>>> that wasn't really important, but sucks to loose anyway. Not to mention
>>>>> having to set up the OS; I ended up cloning my laptop's with all the
>>>>> problems that brings...
>>>> Oh no! That's always a gigantic pain. What happened to it exactly? And
>>>> did you have a spare?
>>>>
>>>> And yeah. Let's hope nothing too important was lost.
>>> I set up a computer yesterday to show a Windows 95 game to my girlfriend
>>> (Starcontrol 3, she liked the puppets though she lacks the grasp of the
>>> English language to avoid a fight with them). It is a very old case I
>>> got for free some someone. 64 MB, really too few to run a modern day
>>> anti-virus solution on it.
>>
>> Linux & Wine...
>
> Starcontrol 3 doesn't run natively on Linux ;-)

Hence Wine.

> Starcontrol 2 does though! It is a novel /and/ a game!

Someone actually novellised it?!

>>> Anyways, I had some crashes because of the mobo I think (very cheap
>>> design) and one error message made me run Seatools on it. It said the
>>> harddisk temperature was 53 degrees Celsius and the max temperature was
>>> no less than 62 degrees Celsius! (in the summer I presume). So I opened
>>> up the case, and it was indeed very hot in there. Problem is that there
>>> is no extra rear fan in the case and no space to fit one. And in the
>>> side panels of the case there are no ventilation holes either, so the
>>> case just heats up with prolonged use.
>>
>> Mine is reasonably well vented and besides, it's not even that hot
>> anymore. I used to run it with over thirty degrees Celsius room
>> temperature... The only problem is that it sits pretty much above the
>> other hard driver, but that shouldn't really be critical. Probably ages
>> capacitators or something - that's what killed my old main board (or
>> rather the AGP).
>
> That would be your problem. If you stack two HDs on top of each other in
> your floppy drive bays, the top one will get very hot. And the lower one
> won't be able to get rid of the heat it generates.
>
> Lots of air above and below your HD is best. You have cheap kits to
> modify a 5 1/4" bay to a 3 1/2" one.

The drive in question was in a 5¼" bay. And above the other one. Which
had a full empty 5¼" bay above it (with a missing slot at the front).

>>> Nothing I can do about that except take the side off or put it in a new
>>> case (which would be a shame because the mobo is crap).
>>
>> Or leave the case open. It helps.
>
> Not if you have cats (which I don't btw).

So do it.

>>> It is an option in your BIOS though, so you might still be out of luck
>>> if you use the same HD in another machine. Talk about ransomware!
>>
>> Oh yeah. On a sidenote, software encryption works fine for me. Might
>> decrease the performance a bit, but not noticeably so.
>
> OTFE works great I hear.

OTFE? I know, I could look it up, but I'm too lazy right now.


--
emmel <the_emmel*you-know-what-that's-for*@gmx.net>
(Don't forget to remove the ** bit)

story backlogs available at http://ranira.wordpress.com

emmel

unread,
Oct 21, 2008, 7:00:26 AM10/21/08
to

It's 'kaputt', actually. And how would that help me anyway? I won't be
able to retrieve anything from a broken drive even if I keep it.
Besides, I ought to have plenty of backups of my PGP key. (Yes, it *is*
an actual PGP key; it's that old.)

>>>>> And yeah. Let's hope nothing too important was lost.
>>>> Problem is, I don't really know what was on it. At least not in detail.
>>>> I guess I'll just find myself missing some old data some time in the
>>>> future that doesn't seem to exist anymore.
>>> I heard you can put USB sticks that stopped working in a vacuum bag in
>>> the freezer. Maybe that will work for your HD too. As a last resort I
>>> might add, condensation on the platters might ruin it for good.
>>
>> As I said, it's likely the control electronics. Condensation shouldn't
>> be a problem since the platters are packed air tight, but even so I
>> don't see myself putting the hard drive into the freezer. I think it's
>> gone for good, and even so I don't have the necessary capacities to make
>> a backup if it ought to work.
>
> There is the vent hole in harddisks. Next to the sticker that says "Do
> Not Cover This Hole"

Not on this one. Not that I know of.

>>> Maybe it is best to run a low level tool from the manufacturer first.
>>> You can download an iso for that (probably).
>>>
>>>> On different notes: 42 unread messages today... Does that mean anything?
>>> That probably means the pirates from aglami are getting all excited over
>>> something again ;-D
>>
>> Yeah, sounds likely.
>
> They are easily exited.

Like electrons in a electric field.

emmel

unread,
Oct 21, 2008, 5:59:57 AM10/21/08
to
On 2008-10-21, Neo <wh...@thematrix.is> wrote:
> emmel wrote:
>> On 2008-10-20, Red Dragon <agcl...@lurkerson.net> wrote:
>>> emmel wrote:
>>>> On different notes, I hard disk committed suicide at the weekend. I can
>>>> only hope there was nothing *really* import on it - except for the stuff
>>>> that wasn't really important, but sucks to loose anyway. Not to mention
>>>> having to set up the OS; I ended up cloning my laptop's with all the
>>>> problems that brings...
>>> Oh no! That's always a gigantic pain. What happened to it exactly? And
>>> did you have a spare?
>>
>> It started with plenty of error messages on bootup, severely slowing it
>> down. I tried fixing the file system, but to no avail... then it stopped
>> working at all. With plenty of time I can see parts of the OS partition,
>> but not even that for the data one. I fortunately still had a (half the
>> size) old hard disk in, that I use for experimenting (alternate OSs or
>> whatever else), so I at least got the machine into working condition
>> again. Didn't work properly until I disconnected the other HD, though...
>
> Maybe the electronics of one of your hard drives is fried. Just
> guessing! Are they on the same IDE cable? Is one set as master and the
> other one as slave? (you can use jumpers to do this).

Yeah, that's the setup. My guess is that it's indeed the interface


electronics, but of course that doesn't help me one bit.

>>> And yeah. Let's hope nothing too important was lost.


>>
>> Problem is, I don't really know what was on it. At least not in detail.
>> I guess I'll just find myself missing some old data some time in the
>> future that doesn't seem to exist anymore.
>
> I heard you can put USB sticks that stopped working in a vacuum bag in
> the freezer. Maybe that will work for your HD too. As a last resort I
> might add, condensation on the platters might ruin it for good.

As I said, it's likely the control electronics. Condensation shouldn't


be a problem since the platters are packed air tight, but even so I
don't see myself putting the hard drive into the freezer. I think it's
gone for good, and even so I don't have the necessary capacities to make
a backup if it ought to work.

> Maybe it is best to run a low level tool from the manufacturer first.


> You can download an iso for that (probably).
>
>> On different notes: 42 unread messages today... Does that mean anything?
>
> That probably means the pirates from aglami are getting all excited over
> something again ;-D

Yeah, sounds likely.

emmel

unread,
Oct 21, 2008, 6:06:22 AM10/21/08
to
On 2008-10-21, Neo <wh...@thematrix.is> wrote:
> Red Dragon wrote:
>> emmel wrote:
>>> On different notes, I hard disk committed suicide at the weekend. I can
>>> only hope there was nothing *really* import on it - except for the stuff
>>> that wasn't really important, but sucks to loose anyway. Not to mention
>>> having to set up the OS; I ended up cloning my laptop's with all the
>>> problems that brings...
>>
>> Oh no! That's always a gigantic pain. What happened to it exactly? And
>> did you have a spare?
>>
>> And yeah. Let's hope nothing too important was lost.
>
> I set up a computer yesterday to show a Windows 95 game to my girlfriend
> (Starcontrol 3, she liked the puppets though she lacks the grasp of the
> English language to avoid a fight with them). It is a very old case I
> got for free some someone. 64 MB, really too few to run a modern day
> anti-virus solution on it.

Linux & Wine...

> Anyways, I had some crashes because of the mobo I think (very cheap
> design) and one error message made me run Seatools on it. It said the
> harddisk temperature was 53 degrees Celsius and the max temperature was
> no less than 62 degrees Celsius! (in the summer I presume). So I opened
> up the case, and it was indeed very hot in there. Problem is that there
> is no extra rear fan in the case and no space to fit one. And in the
> side panels of the case there are no ventilation holes either, so the
> case just heats up with prolonged use.

Mine is reasonably well vented and besides, it's not even that hot


anymore. I used to run it with over thirty degrees Celsius room
temperature... The only problem is that it sits pretty much above the
other hard driver, but that shouldn't really be critical. Probably ages
capacitators or something - that's what killed my old main board (or
rather the AGP).

> Nothing I can do about that except take the side off or put it in a new


> case (which would be a shame because the mobo is crap).

Or leave the case open. It helps.

> On a related note, since this is JNCOBOY, I used the same Seatools on


> another computer I have and it said "This drive is Security Freeze
> Locked". That had me a bit worried because the computer came from a
> business setup, but it had always worked fine (except that when I got it
> the only case fan present wasn't moving, hence the reason for me being
> enthusiastic at first about it being so silent). So I fired up google to
> find out what that meant.
>
> Well, it turns out Seagate added encryption to their HDs because MS
> needed that for it's XBOX (which is totally broken btw in terms of DRM).
> Problem was, if you don't use the encryption, malware can set your
> encryption to a random passphrase thus making your HD inaccessible at
> the next reboot! That is what "This drive is Security Freeze Locked it
> for". To prevent malware from doing that.

Interesting way of telling you that.

> It is an option in your BIOS though, so you might still be out of luck
> if you use the same HD in another machine. Talk about ransomware!

Oh yeah. On a sidenote, software encryption works fine for me. Might


decrease the performance a bit, but not noticeably so.

--
emmel <the_emmel*you-know-what-that's-for*@gmx.net>
(Don't forget to remove the ** bit)

story backlogs available at http://ranira.wordpress.com

emmel

unread,
Oct 21, 2008, 6:06:51 AM10/21/08
to
On 2008-10-21, Neo <wh...@thematrix.is> wrote:

Navens? Devils? Brains?


--
emmel <the_emmel*you-know-what-that's-for*@gmx.net>
(Don't forget to remove the ** bit)

story backlogs available at http://ranira.wordpress.com

Red Dragon

unread,
Oct 21, 2008, 10:58:08 AM10/21/08
to
Neo wrote:

<snip>


>>> And yeah. Let's hope nothing too important was lost.
>>
>> Problem is, I don't really know what was on it. At least not in detail.
>> I guess I'll just find myself missing some old data some time in the
>> future that doesn't seem to exist anymore.
>
> I heard you can put USB sticks that stopped working in a vacuum bag in
> the freezer. Maybe that will work for your HD too. As a last resort I
> might add, condensation on the platters might ruin it for good.
>

This trick is generally for freeing up stuck heads on HDs. Double
bagging it reduces condensation risk. I was able to get one of my HDs to
work with this just long enough to get important things off it.

Then it promptly sung the song of the head crash. I seem to have an
issue with head crashes.

emmel

unread,
Oct 21, 2008, 12:02:19 PM10/21/08
to
Hm... I seem to be getting hit on the archive through AFDA. Seems
putting the link in the sig wasn't such a bad idea. Interesting.

emmel

unread,
Oct 21, 2008, 11:40:49 AM10/21/08
to

As I said, it's probably the control electronic - no real reason for a
head crash, I switched the machine off as usual and didn't hit it with a
hammer or something - and besides, I miss about a hundred megs or so of
storage where I could backup things to (the actual used amount on the
data partition; it was a 160GB drive). Still, something to keep in mind
for the next time (hopefully not).

Neo

unread,
Oct 22, 2008, 8:20:31 AM10/22/08
to
emmel wrote:
> On 2008-10-21, Red Dragon <agcl...@lurkerson.net> wrote:
>> Neo wrote:
>>
>> <snip>
>>>>> And yeah. Let's hope nothing too important was lost.
>>>> Problem is, I don't really know what was on it. At least not in detail.
>>>> I guess I'll just find myself missing some old data some time in the
>>>> future that doesn't seem to exist anymore.
>>> I heard you can put USB sticks that stopped working in a vacuum bag in
>>> the freezer. Maybe that will work for your HD too. As a last resort I
>>> might add, condensation on the platters might ruin it for good.
>>>
>> This trick is generally for freeing up stuck heads on HDs. Double
>> bagging it reduces condensation risk. I was able to get one of my HDs to
>> work with this just long enough to get important things off it.
>>
>> Then it promptly sung the song of the head crash. I seem to have an
>> issue with head crashes.
>
> As I said, it's probably the control electronic - no real reason for a
> head crash, I switched the machine off as usual and didn't hit it with a
> hammer or something - and besides, I miss about a hundred megs or so of
> storage where I could backup things to (the actual used amount on the
> data partition; it was a 160GB drive). Still, something to keep in mind
> for the next time (hopefully not).

Let me inject you with some hope of recovery of your data.

When you buy a can with inert gas (shouldn't cost you more than 10
euro), you can open up your case and put the IDE cable and molex into
the drive.

When you spray the chips on the green board with this air, they will
start briefly working again. Until they heat up and fail again.

Might need some experimentation to get it right, but my uncle used to
fix amplifiers and other consumer electronics like this. Well. He used
the air to find the component that needed to be replaced.

Just a warning, if you spray the whole can in one go, the can will get
very cold. Just a warning. I always wait a bit between sprays.

Neo

unread,
Oct 22, 2008, 8:24:34 AM10/22/08
to
emmel wrote:
> On 2008-10-21, Neo <wh...@thematrix.is> wrote:
>> emmel wrote:
>>> On 2008-10-21, Neo <wh...@thematrix.is> wrote:
>>>> Red Dragon wrote:
>>>>> emmel wrote:
>>>>>> On different notes, I hard disk committed suicide at the weekend. I can
>>>>>> only hope there was nothing *really* import on it - except for the stuff
>>>>>> that wasn't really important, but sucks to loose anyway. Not to mention
>>>>>> having to set up the OS; I ended up cloning my laptop's with all the
>>>>>> problems that brings...
>>>>> Oh no! That's always a gigantic pain. What happened to it exactly? And
>>>>> did you have a spare?
>>>>>
>>>>> And yeah. Let's hope nothing too important was lost.
>>>> I set up a computer yesterday to show a Windows 95 game to my girlfriend
>>>> (Starcontrol 3, she liked the puppets though she lacks the grasp of the
>>>> English language to avoid a fight with them). It is a very old case I
>>>> got for free some someone. 64 MB, really too few to run a modern day
>>>> anti-virus solution on it.
>>> Linux & Wine...
>> Starcontrol 3 doesn't run natively on Linux ;-)
>
> Hence Wine.

Starcontrol 3 doesn't even run on DOSBox.

And it doesn't run at the right speed in Windows XP (might also be the
processor or memory that is too fast).

>> Starcontrol 2 does though! It is a novel /and/ a game!
>
> Someone actually novellised it?!

The readme said it has enough conversation to fill a complete novel!

Neo

unread,
Oct 22, 2008, 8:27:00 AM10/22/08
to

Navens are too naive to feed on anything but their own 'navenness'.

Neo

unread,
Oct 22, 2008, 8:29:15 AM10/22/08
to

I had a broken laptop in 2002.
I recovered everything on the harddisk this year!
The laptop is still broken!

>>>>>> And yeah. Let's hope nothing too important was lost.
>>>>> Problem is, I don't really know what was on it. At least not in detail.
>>>>> I guess I'll just find myself missing some old data some time in the
>>>>> future that doesn't seem to exist anymore.
>>>> I heard you can put USB sticks that stopped working in a vacuum bag in
>>>> the freezer. Maybe that will work for your HD too. As a last resort I
>>>> might add, condensation on the platters might ruin it for good.
>>> As I said, it's likely the control electronics. Condensation shouldn't
>>> be a problem since the platters are packed air tight, but even so I
>>> don't see myself putting the hard drive into the freezer. I think it's
>>> gone for good, and even so I don't have the necessary capacities to make
>>> a backup if it ought to work.
>> There is the vent hole in harddisks. Next to the sticker that says "Do
>> Not Cover This Hole"
>
> Not on this one. Not that I know of.
>
>>>> Maybe it is best to run a low level tool from the manufacturer first.
>>>> You can download an iso for that (probably).
>>>>
>>>>> On different notes: 42 unread messages today... Does that mean anything?
>>>> That probably means the pirates from aglami are getting all excited over
>>>> something again ;-D
>>> Yeah, sounds likely.
>> They are easily exited.
>
> Like electrons in a electric field.

Like pirates on a steel ship!

emmel

unread,
Oct 23, 2008, 4:11:01 AM10/23/08
to
On 2008-10-22, Neo <wh...@thematrix.is> wrote:

> I had a broken laptop in 2002.
> I recovered everything on the harddisk this year!
> The laptop is still broken!

Well, a broken laptop is very different from a broken hard drive.

>>> They are easily exited.
>>
>> Like electrons in a electric field.
>
> Like pirates on a steel ship!

I think that's actually 'easily toasted'.

emmel

unread,
Oct 23, 2008, 4:08:27 AM10/23/08
to

What about other people's nerves?

emmel

unread,
Oct 23, 2008, 4:10:03 AM10/23/08
to
On 2008-10-22, Neo <wh...@thematrix.is> wrote:
> emmel wrote:
>> On 2008-10-21, Neo <wh...@thematrix.is> wrote:
>>> emmel wrote:
>>>> On 2008-10-21, Neo <wh...@thematrix.is> wrote:
>>>>> Red Dragon wrote:
>>>>>> emmel wrote:
>>>>>>> On different notes, I hard disk committed suicide at the weekend. I can
>>>>>>> only hope there was nothing *really* import on it - except for the stuff
>>>>>>> that wasn't really important, but sucks to loose anyway. Not to mention
>>>>>>> having to set up the OS; I ended up cloning my laptop's with all the
>>>>>>> problems that brings...
>>>>>> Oh no! That's always a gigantic pain. What happened to it exactly? And
>>>>>> did you have a spare?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> And yeah. Let's hope nothing too important was lost.
>>>>> I set up a computer yesterday to show a Windows 95 game to my girlfriend
>>>>> (Starcontrol 3, she liked the puppets though she lacks the grasp of the
>>>>> English language to avoid a fight with them). It is a very old case I
>>>>> got for free some someone. 64 MB, really too few to run a modern day
>>>>> anti-virus solution on it.
>>>> Linux & Wine...
>>> Starcontrol 3 doesn't run natively on Linux ;-)
>>
>> Hence Wine.
>
> Starcontrol 3 doesn't even run on DOSBox.

Ah, it's still DOS, isn't it? Any idea where DOSBox fails? And what
about a DOS in qemu?

> And it doesn't run at the right speed in Windows XP (might also be the
> processor or memory that is too fast).

Try qemu. You can configure the processor speed there, IIRC.

>>> Starcontrol 2 does though! It is a novel /and/ a game!
>>
>> Someone actually novellised it?!
>
> The readme said it has enough conversation to fill a complete novel!

Ah, so nobody actually did. When are you going to?

emmel

unread,
Oct 23, 2008, 7:15:10 AM10/23/08
to
On 2008-10-22, Neo <wh...@thematrix.is> wrote:
> emmel wrote:
>> On 2008-10-21, Red Dragon <agcl...@lurkerson.net> wrote:
>>> Neo wrote:
>>>
>>> <snip>
>>>>>> And yeah. Let's hope nothing too important was lost.
>>>>> Problem is, I don't really know what was on it. At least not in detail.
>>>>> I guess I'll just find myself missing some old data some time in the
>>>>> future that doesn't seem to exist anymore.
>>>> I heard you can put USB sticks that stopped working in a vacuum bag in
>>>> the freezer. Maybe that will work for your HD too. As a last resort I
>>>> might add, condensation on the platters might ruin it for good.
>>>>
>>> This trick is generally for freeing up stuck heads on HDs. Double
>>> bagging it reduces condensation risk. I was able to get one of my HDs to
>>> work with this just long enough to get important things off it.
>>>
>>> Then it promptly sung the song of the head crash. I seem to have an
>>> issue with head crashes.
>>
>> As I said, it's probably the control electronic - no real reason for a
>> head crash, I switched the machine off as usual and didn't hit it with a
>> hammer or something - and besides, I miss about a hundred megs or so of
>> storage where I could backup things to (the actual used amount on the
>> data partition; it was a 160GB drive). Still, something to keep in mind
>> for the next time (hopefully not).
>
> Let me inject you with some hope of recovery of your data.

That would mean I know what data I wanted to recover in the first place
(mirroring a complete hard disk takes time, you know...) and where to
recover it to.

> When you buy a can with inert gas (shouldn't cost you more than 10
> euro), you can open up your case and put the IDE cable and molex into
> the drive.

Why inert gas? Dry air should be fine.

> When you spray the chips on the green board with this air, they will
> start briefly working again. Until they heat up and fail again.
>
> Might need some experimentation to get it right, but my uncle used to
> fix amplifiers and other consumer electronics like this. Well. He used
> the air to find the component that needed to be replaced.

Nice one.

> Just a warning, if you spray the whole can in one go, the can will get
> very cold. Just a warning. I always wait a bit between sprays.

I know that kind of thing. I also know where I could nick some dry ice.
Hm... Maybe I should even try that. In fact they might even sell me
some, I'd just have to bring my thermos along.

Neo

unread,
Oct 23, 2008, 1:13:16 PM10/23/08
to

Keep your bad drive for a year and you will remember the most important
stuff! (like Norn sprites for Dragon Norns).

>> When you buy a can with inert gas (shouldn't cost you more than 10
>> euro), you can open up your case and put the IDE cable and molex into
>> the drive.
>
> Why inert gas? Dry air should be fine.

So you don't get corrosion on the components you spray it on? I have
inert gas that I can spray on my components while my computer is turned
on. Never hurts that it doesn't cause any electric or other reactions
:-)

>> When you spray the chips on the green board with this air, they will
>> start briefly working again. Until they heat up and fail again.
>>
>> Might need some experimentation to get it right, but my uncle used to
>> fix amplifiers and other consumer electronics like this. Well. He used
>> the air to find the component that needed to be replaced.
>
> Nice one.

I have seen him fix things this way. Most people would just throw away
the stuff he can fix. Too bad people don't know he can do this and buy
new stuff when they could get it fixed for 25 euro (excluding
components).

>> Just a warning, if you spray the whole can in one go, the can will get
>> very cold. Just a warning. I always wait a bit between sprays.
>
> I know that kind of thing. I also know where I could nick some dry ice.
> Hm... Maybe I should even try that. In fact they might even sell me
> some, I'd just have to bring my thermos along.

I don't know what that is, but it sounds TOO cold :-)

Neo

unread,
Oct 23, 2008, 3:33:43 PM10/23/08
to

I don't need a Pentium emulated, I need a whole computer from those days
emulated! Soundblaster support seems to be the biggest problem for these
things. If it was easy they would have put that in Windows itself.

But a full CD-ROM emulation is also needed. So the copy protection will
work.

>> And it doesn't run at the right speed in Windows XP (might also be the
>> processor or memory that is too fast).
>
> Try qemu. You can configure the processor speed there, IIRC.

Here are the complete specs needed to run the game:
----------------------------------------------------------------------
SYSTEM REQUIREMENTS
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Minimum Hardware Requirements:
IBM or 100% Compatible 486/66 MHz, 2X CD-ROM drive, 8MB RAM,
5MB free Hard Drive space, Microsoft(R) compatible mouse
Operating System: Windows(R) 95, MS-DOS(R) 5.0 or higher
Music: Sound Blaster & Compatibles, General MIDI Compatibles
Voice and S/FX: Sound Blaster & Compatibles
Graphics: VESA compatible Super VGA, (640x480, 256 color)

Recommended:
CPU: Pentium(TM)/60 MHz or better
4x CD-ROM Drive or better
65MB free Hard Drive space

Optional:
2 Player Remote Hyper Melee: 9600 BPS or faster modem, null modem
connection, or IPX compliant network.

>>>> Starcontrol 2 does though! It is a novel /and/ a game!
>>> Someone actually novellised it?!
>> The readme said it has enough conversation to fill a complete novel!
>
> Ah, so nobody actually did. When are you going to?

I think there are novels written from the game. But SC2 is just
completely weird. There is a race called the thraddash that evolve with
ever more violent cultures that overthrow the old one.

Like one culture ripped off their own arms on the battle field and waved
with them. That was so brutal that they became the new leaders of their
culture.

Or some surgery race that keeps offering you extra arms and eyes who
also pull pranks in the universe like causing a race to go to war with
another race.

The game is just insane. Almost like a Douglas Adams book.

Neo

unread,
Oct 23, 2008, 3:38:17 PM10/23/08
to

You just change the polarity and they won't like what they are feeding
on! (saw that on a startrek episode).

emmel

unread,
Oct 24, 2008, 8:19:44 AM10/24/08
to

It's not like I haven't *any* backups. Although it has been a while
since I actually made one. Thing is, all the important stuff I usually
have on my laptop, too. I hope.

>>> When you buy a can with inert gas (shouldn't cost you more than 10
>>> euro), you can open up your case and put the IDE cable and molex into
>>> the drive.
>>
>> Why inert gas? Dry air should be fine.
>
> So you don't get corrosion on the components you spray it on? I have
> inert gas that I can spray on my components while my computer is turned
> on. Never hurts that it doesn't cause any electric or other reactions
>:-)

Air is 77% nitrogen and the oxygen isn't that agressive. After all it
usually gets in contact with it, too. Corrosions would very likely be a
result of condensation, and that's a question of surface temperature and
not the inertness of the gas.

>>> When you spray the chips on the green board with this air, they will
>>> start briefly working again. Until they heat up and fail again.
>>>
>>> Might need some experimentation to get it right, but my uncle used to
>>> fix amplifiers and other consumer electronics like this. Well. He used
>>> the air to find the component that needed to be replaced.
>>
>> Nice one.
>
> I have seen him fix things this way. Most people would just throw away
> the stuff he can fix. Too bad people don't know he can do this and buy
> new stuff when they could get it fixed for 25 euro (excluding
> components).

::nods::
As long as you can get the appropriate parts. If I knew where to get the
right condensators I would have fixed my ols motherboard instead of
replacing it, but condensators with these ratings are hard to get
outside of industrial delivery contracts.

>>> Just a warning, if you spray the whole can in one go, the can will get
>>> very cold. Just a warning. I always wait a bit between sprays.
>>
>> I know that kind of thing. I also know where I could nick some dry ice.
>> Hm... Maybe I should even try that. In fact they might even sell me
>> some, I'd just have to bring my thermos along.
>
> I don't know what that is, but it sounds TOO cold :-)

Dry ice is frozen carbon dioxide:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dry_ice

You shouldn't keep it in your hand too long, that's for sure, but it's
kinda need to play with.

emmel

unread,
Oct 24, 2008, 8:20:11 AM10/24/08
to

I'll just pretend yopu never said that.

emmel

unread,
Oct 24, 2008, 8:28:01 AM10/24/08
to

::nods::
Use qemu. Although I still don't see why DOSBox doesn't work. You can
throttle the speed of that thing, you know.

>>> And it doesn't run at the right speed in Windows XP (might also be the
>>> processor or memory that is too fast).
>>
>> Try qemu. You can configure the processor speed there, IIRC.
>
> Here are the complete specs needed to run the game:
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> SYSTEM REQUIREMENTS
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Minimum Hardware Requirements:
> IBM or 100% Compatible 486/66 MHz, 2X CD-ROM drive, 8MB RAM,
> 5MB free Hard Drive space, Microsoft(R) compatible mouse
> Operating System: Windows(R) 95, MS-DOS(R) 5.0 or higher
> Music: Sound Blaster & Compatibles, General MIDI Compatibles
> Voice and S/FX: Sound Blaster & Compatibles
> Graphics: VESA compatible Super VGA, (640x480, 256 color)
>
> Recommended:
> CPU: Pentium(TM)/60 MHz or better
> 4x CD-ROM Drive or better
> 65MB free Hard Drive space
>
> Optional:
> 2 Player Remote Hyper Melee: 9600 BPS or faster modem, null modem
> connection, or IPX compliant network.

Should work.

>>>>> Starcontrol 2 does though! It is a novel /and/ a game!
>>>> Someone actually novellised it?!
>>> The readme said it has enough conversation to fill a complete novel!
>>
>> Ah, so nobody actually did. When are you going to?
>
> I think there are novels written from the game. But SC2 is just
> completely weird. There is a race called the thraddash that evolve with
> ever more violent cultures that overthrow the old one.
>
> Like one culture ripped off their own arms on the battle field and waved
> with them. That was so brutal that they became the new leaders of their
> culture.
>
> Or some surgery race that keeps offering you extra arms and eyes who
> also pull pranks in the universe like causing a race to go to war with
> another race.
>
> The game is just insane. Almost like a Douglas Adams book.

Nah, it's crazier.

Neo

unread,
Oct 25, 2008, 7:32:44 AM10/25/08
to

I made a backup last week (e-mail, downloads and other stuff). I didn't
do it earlier because I didn't have a burning program! I now have a free
one that can verify the data written against the original files.
Something I deem very important when making a backup!

If you want to do that in Windows XP, you have to launch up a command
prompt and do a 'fc /b' for each file. I can put it in a 'for' loop but
it is still too much trouble and kind-of unreliable with the mess I make
in my head when performing such operations. (And checks afterwards to
compensate for this).

>>>> When you buy a can with inert gas (shouldn't cost you more than 10
>>>> euro), you can open up your case and put the IDE cable and molex into
>>>> the drive.
>>> Why inert gas? Dry air should be fine.
>> So you don't get corrosion on the components you spray it on? I have
>> inert gas that I can spray on my components while my computer is turned
>> on. Never hurts that it doesn't cause any electric or other reactions
>> :-)
>
> Air is 77% nitrogen and the oxygen isn't that agressive. After all it
> usually gets in contact with it, too. Corrosions would very likely be a
> result of condensation, and that's a question of surface temperature and
> not the inertness of the gas.

I use one of these
http://www.crcind.com/csp/web/functdisp.csp?country=NL&business=ELECTRONIC&lng=3#CLP
because a computer store here uses that.

I can't find the exact same can though. Maybe they don't make it any more.

(Good subject for the AGLAMI discussion about things that come in cans).

>>>> When you spray the chips on the green board with this air, they will
>>>> start briefly working again. Until they heat up and fail again.
>>>>
>>>> Might need some experimentation to get it right, but my uncle used to
>>>> fix amplifiers and other consumer electronics like this. Well. He used
>>>> the air to find the component that needed to be replaced.
>>> Nice one.
>> I have seen him fix things this way. Most people would just throw away
>> the stuff he can fix. Too bad people don't know he can do this and buy
>> new stuff when they could get it fixed for 25 euro (excluding
>> components).
>
> ::nods::
> As long as you can get the appropriate parts. If I knew where to get the
> right condensators I would have fixed my ols motherboard instead of
> replacing it, but condensators with these ratings are hard to get
> outside of industrial delivery contracts.

He had a computer program for that (two actually). He would select the
parts, dial into their computer and he would get them delivered after a
couple of days.

He lives close to the German border btw, but he closed his shop because,
well, I don't really know. He was best at fixing VRCs and televisions. I
know he can't fix flat screen televisions (I looked at his site and he
actually does!).

Maybe you can send me an e-mail and I will give his homepage and you can
ask him to send you the components over mail. If he is still in business
that is.

>>>> Just a warning, if you spray the whole can in one go, the can will get
>>>> very cold. Just a warning. I always wait a bit between sprays.
>>> I know that kind of thing. I also know where I could nick some dry ice.
>>> Hm... Maybe I should even try that. In fact they might even sell me
>>> some, I'd just have to bring my thermos along.
>> I don't know what that is, but it sounds TOO cold :-)
>
> Dry ice is frozen carbon dioxide:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dry_ice
>
> You shouldn't keep it in your hand too long, that's for sure, but it's
> kinda need to play with.

They used that to remove a wart on my foot once. It is still gone!

Neo

unread,
Oct 25, 2008, 7:56:46 AM10/25/08
to

I think I tried it in XP once, but the galaxy would rotate like mad! And
that was on an Athlon XP 2000+ processor. It is probably worse now.

Since time progresses while you are in the galaxy screen, this is a bad
thing.

Also http://www.dosbox.com/comp_list.php?showID=1727&letter=S seems
inconclusive. They say the game works in .60 but was broken again in
.61.

>>>> And it doesn't run at the right speed in Windows XP (might also be the
>>>> processor or memory that is too fast).
>>> Try qemu. You can configure the processor speed there, IIRC.
>> Here are the complete specs needed to run the game:
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>> SYSTEM REQUIREMENTS
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> Minimum Hardware Requirements:
>> IBM or 100% Compatible 486/66 MHz, 2X CD-ROM drive, 8MB RAM,
>> 5MB free Hard Drive space, Microsoft(R) compatible mouse
>> Operating System: Windows(R) 95, MS-DOS(R) 5.0 or higher
>> Music: Sound Blaster & Compatibles, General MIDI Compatibles
>> Voice and S/FX: Sound Blaster & Compatibles
>> Graphics: VESA compatible Super VGA, (640x480, 256 color)
>>
>> Recommended:
>> CPU: Pentium(TM)/60 MHz or better
>> 4x CD-ROM Drive or better
>> 65MB free Hard Drive space
>>
>> Optional:
>> 2 Player Remote Hyper Melee: 9600 BPS or faster modem, null modem
>> connection, or IPX compliant network.
>
> Should work.

I am not too optimistic about the sound blaster support though. I have a
Sound Blaster 2.0 ISA card laying around just for sound support. Not
sure it will fit on any of the mobo's I have though!

>>>>>> Starcontrol 2 does though! It is a novel /and/ a game!
>>>>> Someone actually novellised it?!
>>>> The readme said it has enough conversation to fill a complete novel!
>>> Ah, so nobody actually did. When are you going to?
>> I think there are novels written from the game. But SC2 is just
>> completely weird. There is a race called the thraddash that evolve with
>> ever more violent cultures that overthrow the old one.
>>
>> Like one culture ripped off their own arms on the battle field and waved
>> with them. That was so brutal that they became the new leaders of their
>> culture.
>>
>> Or some surgery race that keeps offering you extra arms and eyes who
>> also pull pranks in the universe like causing a race to go to war with
>> another race.
>>
>> The game is just insane. Almost like a Douglas Adams book.
>
> Nah, it's crazier.

That would make discussing it completely OT in AGC!

emmel

unread,
Oct 28, 2008, 5:10:12 AM10/28/08
to
On 2008-10-25, Neo <wh...@thematrix.is> wrote:
> emmel wrote:
>> On 2008-10-23, Neo <wh...@thematrix.is> wrote:
>>> emmel wrote:
>>>>> Starcontrol 3 doesn't even run on DOSBox.
>>>> Ah, it's still DOS, isn't it? Any idea where DOSBox fails? And what
>>>> about a DOS in qemu?
>>> I don't need a Pentium emulated, I need a whole computer from those days
>>> emulated! Soundblaster support seems to be the biggest problem for these
>>> things. If it was easy they would have put that in Windows itself.
>>>
>>> But a full CD-ROM emulation is also needed. So the copy protection will
>>> work.
>>
>> ::nods::
>> Use qemu. Although I still don't see why DOSBox doesn't work. You can
>> throttle the speed of that thing, you know.
>
> I think I tried it in XP once, but the galaxy would rotate like mad! And
> that was on an Athlon XP 2000+ processor. It is probably worse now.

Well, you didn't throttle the speed then.

> Since time progresses while you are in the galaxy screen, this is a bad
> thing.
>
> Also http://www.dosbox.com/comp_list.php?showID=1727&letter=S seems
> inconclusive. They say the game works in .60 but was broken again in
> .61.

OK, that /might/ be a bit of a problem.

>> Should work.
>
> I am not too optimistic about the sound blaster support though. I have a
> Sound Blaster 2.0 ISA card laying around just for sound support. Not
> sure it will fit on any of the mobo's I have though!

Yeah, that's a real problem, isn't it? And actually qemu does a good
job in my experience. Never tried runbning DOS on it, though.

>>> The game is just insane. Almost like a Douglas Adams book.
>>
>> Nah, it's crazier.
>
> That would make discussing it completely OT in AGC!

Oh, yeah. Sorry.

emmel

unread,
Oct 28, 2008, 5:08:06 AM10/28/08
to
On 2008-10-25, Neo <wh...@thematrix.is> wrote:
> emmel wrote:
>> On 2008-10-23, Neo <wh...@thematrix.is> wrote:
>>> Keep your bad drive for a year and you will remember the most important
>>> stuff! (like Norn sprites for Dragon Norns).
>>
>> It's not like I haven't *any* backups. Although it has been a while
>> since I actually made one. Thing is, all the important stuff I usually
>> have on my laptop, too. I hope.
>
> I made a backup last week (e-mail, downloads and other stuff). I didn't
> do it earlier because I didn't have a burning program! I now have a free

How could that happen?

> one that can verify the data written against the original files.
> Something I deem very important when making a backup!

I use k3b. And diff rules when it comes to comparing files.

> If you want to do that in Windows XP, you have to launch up a command
> prompt and do a 'fc /b' for each file. I can put it in a 'for' loop but
> it is still too much trouble and kind-of unreliable with the mess I make
> in my head when performing such operations. (And checks afterwards to
> compensate for this).

I *think* there is a diff for windows as well. Anyway, I wasn't away you
could do proper loops in batch files...

>>>>> When you buy a can with inert gas (shouldn't cost you more than 10
>>>>> euro), you can open up your case and put the IDE cable and molex into
>>>>> the drive.
>>>> Why inert gas? Dry air should be fine.
>>> So you don't get corrosion on the components you spray it on? I have
>>> inert gas that I can spray on my components while my computer is turned
>>> on. Never hurts that it doesn't cause any electric or other reactions
>>> :-)
>>
>> Air is 77% nitrogen and the oxygen isn't that agressive. After all it
>> usually gets in contact with it, too. Corrosions would very likely be a
>> result of condensation, and that's a question of surface temperature and
>> not the inertness of the gas.
>
> I use one of these
> http://www.crcind.com/csp/web/functdisp.csp?country=NL&business=ELECTRONIC&lng=3#CLP
> because a computer store here uses that.

::shurgs::
Probably convenient to use.

> I can't find the exact same can though. Maybe they don't make it any more.
>
> (Good subject for the AGLAMI discussion about things that come in cans).

Go, do it.

>> ::nods::
>> As long as you can get the appropriate parts. If I knew where to get the
>> right condensators I would have fixed my ols motherboard instead of
>> replacing it, but condensators with these ratings are hard to get
>> outside of industrial delivery contracts.
>
> He had a computer program for that (two actually). He would select the
> parts, dial into their computer and he would get them delivered after a
> couple of days.
>
> He lives close to the German border btw, but he closed his shop because,
> well, I don't really know. He was best at fixing VRCs and televisions. I
> know he can't fix flat screen televisions (I looked at his site and he
> actually does!).
>
> Maybe you can send me an e-mail and I will give his homepage and you can
> ask him to send you the components over mail. If he is still in business
> that is.

Nah, probably not worth the effort. Besides, I can get condensators that
should work, but getting the ones with the same heat specs is pretty
hard. They probably don't even sell them in Europe.

>>>>> Just a warning, if you spray the whole can in one go, the can will get
>>>>> very cold. Just a warning. I always wait a bit between sprays.
>>>> I know that kind of thing. I also know where I could nick some dry ice.
>>>> Hm... Maybe I should even try that. In fact they might even sell me
>>>> some, I'd just have to bring my thermos along.
>>> I don't know what that is, but it sounds TOO cold :-)
>>
>> Dry ice is frozen carbon dioxide:
>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dry_ice
>>
>> You shouldn't keep it in your hand too long, that's for sure, but it's
>> kinda need to play with.
>
> They used that to remove a wart on my foot once. It is still gone!

Acid works as well.

Neo

unread,
Oct 29, 2008, 2:10:38 PM10/29/08
to
emmel wrote:
> On 2008-10-25, Neo <wh...@thematrix.is> wrote:
>> emmel wrote:
>>> On 2008-10-23, Neo <wh...@thematrix.is> wrote:
>>>> Keep your bad drive for a year and you will remember the most important
>>>> stuff! (like Norn sprites for Dragon Norns).
>>> It's not like I haven't *any* backups. Although it has been a while
>>> since I actually made one. Thing is, all the important stuff I usually
>>> have on my laptop, too. I hope.
>> I made a backup last week (e-mail, downloads and other stuff). I didn't
>> do it earlier because I didn't have a burning program! I now have a free
>
> How could that happen?

I used an illegal copy of Nero for years. But everyone says it is
bloated now. There used to be a time when Nero was the proper tool to
copy copy protected games. But they gave in to the entertainment
industry since. And bloated their product.

>> one that can verify the data written against the original files.
>> Something I deem very important when making a backup!
>
> I use k3b. And diff rules when it comes to comparing files.

Sounds like a pain :-( I just have to check this box 'verify' and it
verifies directly after the burning process.

I think Nero was even better. It didn't reduce speed on bad sectors but
rejected the whole disk when it couldn't read a part at full speed! That
equals better backups!

>> If you want to do that in Windows XP, you have to launch up a command
>> prompt and do a 'fc /b' for each file. I can put it in a 'for' loop but
>> it is still too much trouble and kind-of unreliable with the mess I make
>> in my head when performing such operations. (And checks afterwards to
>> compensate for this).
>
> I *think* there is a diff for windows as well. Anyway, I wasn't away you
> could do proper loops in batch files...

It is confusing though.

for %a in (*.*) do echo %a

works but in a batchfile you have to use

for %%a in (*.*) do echo %%a

to do the same thing. DOS artefact I am sure.

>>>>>> When you buy a can with inert gas (shouldn't cost you more than 10
>>>>>> euro), you can open up your case and put the IDE cable and molex into
>>>>>> the drive.
>>>>> Why inert gas? Dry air should be fine.
>>>> So you don't get corrosion on the components you spray it on? I have
>>>> inert gas that I can spray on my components while my computer is turned
>>>> on. Never hurts that it doesn't cause any electric or other reactions
>>>> :-)
>>> Air is 77% nitrogen and the oxygen isn't that agressive. After all it
>>> usually gets in contact with it, too. Corrosions would very likely be a
>>> result of condensation, and that's a question of surface temperature and
>>> not the inertness of the gas.
>> I use one of these
>> http://www.crcind.com/csp/web/functdisp.csp?country=NL&business=ELECTRONIC&lng=3#CLP
>> because a computer store here uses that.
>
> ::shurgs::
> Probably convenient to use.

My gf bought a new can of air for me. But somehow it seems very
dangerous to me. Even comes with a sheet what to do if you spray in onto
yourself! And you have to ventilate too.

The stuff I had before was much more forgiving. I can't even spray this
on a computer that is in operation!

>> I can't find the exact same can though. Maybe they don't make it any more.
>>
>> (Good subject for the AGLAMI discussion about things that come in cans).
>
> Go, do it.

I ain't hav'n time to play them old pirate games!! ARRRR!

>>> ::nods::
>>> As long as you can get the appropriate parts. If I knew where to get the
>>> right condensators I would have fixed my ols motherboard instead of
>>> replacing it, but condensators with these ratings are hard to get
>>> outside of industrial delivery contracts.
>> He had a computer program for that (two actually). He would select the
>> parts, dial into their computer and he would get them delivered after a
>> couple of days.
>>
>> He lives close to the German border btw, but he closed his shop because,
>> well, I don't really know. He was best at fixing VRCs and televisions. I
>> know he can't fix flat screen televisions (I looked at his site and he
>> actually does!).
>>
>> Maybe you can send me an e-mail and I will give his homepage and you can
>> ask him to send you the components over mail. If he is still in business
>> that is.
>
> Nah, probably not worth the effort. Besides, I can get condensators that
> should work, but getting the ones with the same heat specs is pretty
> hard. They probably don't even sell them in Europe.

'Whatever' as you would put it.

>>>>>> Just a warning, if you spray the whole can in one go, the can will get
>>>>>> very cold. Just a warning. I always wait a bit between sprays.
>>>>> I know that kind of thing. I also know where I could nick some dry ice.
>>>>> Hm... Maybe I should even try that. In fact they might even sell me
>>>>> some, I'd just have to bring my thermos along.
>>>> I don't know what that is, but it sounds TOO cold :-)
>>> Dry ice is frozen carbon dioxide:
>>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dry_ice
>>>
>>> You shouldn't keep it in your hand too long, that's for sure, but it's
>>> kinda need to play with.
>> They used that to remove a wart on my foot once. It is still gone!
>
> Acid works as well.

I'm not having any plastic surgery!

Neo

unread,
Oct 29, 2008, 2:16:26 PM10/29/08