Why we need AGCM.

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Alize

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Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
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***************
Why we need AGCM
***************

There are a lot of people in the present Creature Community who cause
problems for a lot of new, and sometimes old, people. And as such most of
those new people dont hang around. It is flamewar after flamewar,
misquoting, just look at the headers on this group. It is generally not a
great community. Sure, ok, there are worse, but I am not part of those and
they are not my concern. My wish is that a *better* community be formed.

Ok, so some of the new people do hang around. But, they usually are flamed
(more or less depending on the regular's mood), in fact most are flamed into
submission. They apologize etc. etc. but even when they apologize the
"thing" they did wrong is still hung over their head. So these people who
stick around conform to what the regulars want. Here is a post by someone
who has not been "tainted by the insanity." Hang out in AGC for a while and
you'll see its true:

<begin post>
Hello,
I've been looking over this newsgroup and I must say the comments of
people
here shock me. I've seen where people have come in and asked questions and
been slandered because of the way they typed, and their questions never
being
answered. I've also seen people moan and groan about things posted on
peoples web pages. If a person posts a program, or COB on their page and
gives you credit for it you should be proud that they thought it was good
enough to be posted there. You people are playing a very good game that can
teach people how to look after and respond to life to a degree. A game
that
you can start playing and lose yourselves in for hours and yet you take the
time to come in here and act so rude to people that are trying to share in
the experience of the game that they may not return. You should all be
ashamed. If you don't like the way a person types in their report "u" "r"
not required to read it and if your unhappy ... you can keep those opinions
to yourself. How would you all like for me to criticize all your opinions or
styles of writing? A newsgroup is a place for discussion not slander.
Thought I'd pass this along to all who cared.

Kevin J Millman
Technical Support Agent
Prince Edward Island
Canada
<end post>

I feel sorry for those that do stick around because usually, since they have
conformed to the majority, begin *act* like the regulars. Well I have been
talking of these so called regulars but here is a profile:

************************************************
AGC REGULAR'S: A PROFILE

ATTITUDE: Usually very grumpy. They write things like "meh" and "grr" often
to express this emotion. Very odd. They generally have an "elite" attitude
such as "I have been here longer than you." "I have established this FAQ or
another." "This is the way it is here in AGC follow the rules or get out."
"You're a troll navan or whatever."

FREQUENCY: They reside on the net quite a lot of the time. So if you make a
mistake doing anything you can expect it to be followed up by many posts and
maybe if you're lucky you get a FAQ in your mail box with in a few minutes
of posting.

LOGIC: Does not exist with these people. I guarantee you that!
________________
example: A member of the "regulars" Emy or Emily Sachs is a sysop on JRChat.
Well one quiet evening Emy was sysopping JRChat and one of her little
friends Chris came in. His chat nick name was "ChrissyCommunist" I found it
quite offensive and after many many minutes of debate I said, quite
generally and to no one in particular "What if I came in as NaziDillon
people would be very offened by that." So then Emy steps in "I *would* be
offended because I am Jewish."
Ok fine. That was the end of that and I ended up getting kicked by Queen
Emy.
So then we can see on the newsgroups alt.config and AGC, Emily saying "
Or how about the time you threatened to join the chat as "NaziDillon" after
learning I was Jewish. That seems rather vulgar, and certainly directed at
me."

Hmm I think not Emy. But, whatever. "Welcome to insanity" right.
_______________
SUMMARY: They are quite well known in many areas of the Creatures Community.
For instance JRChat. So if you disagree with anyone of them, prepare to be
kicked from that chat room. Well I have a solution to that as well, but we
will get into that later. If I can give any advice to a new user coming to
AGC please, do NOT conform. You do NOT have to, you can get help else where
if AGC is too much trouble. AGC exists in ALT (See my USENet Lessons post
for more info.), so there are no rules(with the exception of moderated
groups. You will end up flaming new users, acting grumpy to fit in, trying
to be clever etc... It just doesn't fit into the real world and neither do
most of these regulars.

PROOF (all of the information contained herein was part of a conversation
Emy has with AntiNorn one late night): With the above regular used as an
example, here is more information about that persons life in the real world.
She has fought with her parents ever since she was six, or so she says. Has
a very screwed up family, not my opinion, but quoted from Emy herself and
not out of context. Has no real friends. Except maybe one or two of the
other regulars on AGC. Besides that she "believes she has no real friends."
And her parents are sending her to a shrink.

Hmm...now this is one of the many who has been flaming you, and kicking you
from JRChat. Who acts so superior in the Creatures Community. This is who
the people are who *try* to run the community, don't act like them.

MORE PROOF: How a new user tries to become elite.
This was an e-mail I recieved on Sat. Feb. 6.

To Dillon Hosier,

I have a question. Did you even read the responses to your suggestion?
They
were all negative. You got no support at all. Please remove your charter
and
drop the newsgroup.
For your information, I am brand new at this and even I knew that no one
supported your measure on the agc.

I hope you comply before the e-mail pores in.

I guess he declined to sign, but this is from RNort...@aol.com
************************************************
TRYING TO CONTROL A COMMUNITY

Yep, there are those here who try to run the community. They call it
"self-moderation." Yeah, more like communism. You don't follow their rules
you get a nice "welcome to my kill-file." You get ignored. Nice people huh?
Really seems like their trying to help. Well they do often help a lot of
people, with the FAQ's etc, but the general over all attitude or ambiance of
the group is quite negative. So I suggest AGCM, a place where people can
gather peacefully. And what do I get, "why did you go behind out backs?" Umm
FYI you regulars are NOT in charge of anything on alt.* sorry to break it to
you. Oh and they say there has been an overwhelming amount of protest to
AGCM.

Well here is it...the overwhelming list of those who are opposed to A.G.C.M.
a whole fifteen people.

Martha Brummett
Denise Voskuil
Nornia
Emily Sachs
RedWordSmith
Lis Morris
Mannkind
DreMoa
Maetang
Miff
NORNGod
Waruru
AntiNorn
x0tix
Ping

*Most* of these people are the ones who flame you, kick you, etc. Boy, I
guess if all the new users (not newbies) go to AGCM they wont have anyone to
kick around. Gosh then what? It is also interesting to pint out that
whenever the AGCM proposal comes up the regs. start to be quite nice to
some.
************************************************
SO WHAT IS AGCM (alt.games.creatures.moderated)?

Well its a place you can go to discuss creatures without all of the hassel
of the above. It just doesn't exist. But, it will eventually be more than
that. We will develop into a highly productive Creatures Community. As least
that is my goal. I just want the people, the general population, to be able
to come to a newsgroup and not have to deal with the *most* of the above
people. For more information go ahead and e-mail Mike McFadden at
ALPr...@aol.com he is one of the many people who will be helping me with
this project. It will take a while for the new group to get onto everyone's
server, but it'll get there evenutally.

HAVING TROUBLE WITH JRCHAT?

Well now you have an alternative. Go to the Creatures Nexus
http://skyscraper.fortunecity.com/corel/734 Click on the Nexus COMM link.
This stands for Nexus Communications. In side there is a ChatRoom that is
moderated by me and others, but I guarantee you won't get kicked for
speaking your mind. There is also a feature that lets you have a private
chat in a separate window by double clicking on a user in the room list.
Inside the Nexus COMM there is also a FeedBack form and Forum featuring a
discussion group on Creatures 3, General Discussion, and Questions. I have
made these resources available to you in user friendly environment. Enjoy!!

_____________________

Miff

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Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
to
You my friend are a sad little prud who clearly has no clue to life at all.
99% of us told you we did NOT want that ng but you still did not get it.

Martha Brummett
Denise Voskuil
Nornia
Emily Sachs
RedWordSmith
Lis Morris
Mannkind
DreMoa
Maetang

NORNGod
Waruru
AntiNorn
x0tix
Ping

To name but a few.

You cause trouble in JR and now cause trouble here.
I wont be using it, I hope others wont use it and I'll do all I can to make
sure newbies dont.

I am putting a DONT USE AGCM button or banner on my site, Ping is putting
one on his site and I hope others will do the same <g>

Miff
Alize wrote in message <79jsvp$24d2$1...@newssvr03-int.news.prodigy.com>...

Enigma

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Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
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Most of you don't know me as I only just started using this newsgroup, but
I've been in and around the creatures community since it started and I've
been observing all this talk Alize and agcm. I am fully in support of the
people who are flaming him, he is just a nut who wants everything his own
way and if he doesn't get it he moans. I have almost finished a site which
will hopefully get a lot of traffic and I will be putting an "anti-agcm"
button on it as I hope you all will.
-Enigma
"I am NOT a chair"

Miff wrote in message <79k1gl$945$1...@mendelevium.btinternet.com>...

jimbo

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Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
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Alize <dho...@prodigy.net> wrote

>***************
>Why we need AGCM
>***************
>
>There are a lot of people in the present Creature Community who cause
>problems for a lot of new, and sometimes old, people. And as such most of
>those new people dont hang around. It is flamewar after flamewar,
>misquoting, just look at the headers on this group. It is generally not a
>great community. Sure, ok, there are worse, but I am not part of those and
>they are not my concern. My wish is that a *better* community be formed.
>
>Ok, so some of the new people do hang around. But, they usually are flamed
>(more or less depending on the regular's mood), in fact most are flamed into
>submission. They apologize etc. etc. but even when they apologize the
>"thing" they did wrong is still hung over their head. So these people who
>stick around conform to what the regulars want. Here is a post by someone
>who has not been "tainted by the insanity." Hang out in AGC for a while and
>you'll see its true:

the only people who get turned away are the idiots off aol like ldymagic and
rick. otherwise, which group have you been reading? if a newbie says "hello,
i'm new here", check out the responses. they will all be friendly and helpful,
not shouting or anything. however, if an offensive post is produced, more
harsh responses will be posted, reasonably in my humble opinion. what are
we supposed to do? be nice still?


>
>I feel sorry for those that do stick around because usually, since they have
>conformed to the majority, begin *act* like the regulars. Well I have been
>talking of these so called regulars but here is a profile:

darnit..... it's totalitarianism! big jimbo is watching you! everyone chase
ladymagic goldenstein! watch out for the norn police and the telescreens! you
WILL LOVE BIG JIMBO! big jimbo loves you!
brainwashing, hm? nice one!

>************************************************
>AGC REGULAR'S: A PROFILE
>
>ATTITUDE: Usually very grumpy. They write things like "meh" and "grr" often
>to express this emotion. Very odd. They generally have an "elite" attitude
>such as "I have been here longer than you." "I have established this FAQ or
>another." "This is the way it is here in AGC follow the rules or get out."
>"You're a troll navan or whatever."

any redirections to faq's are reasonable, are they not? denise and mae, two of
the continual referrers to faq's, have an amazing amount of patience, in my
humble opinion.

>FREQUENCY: They reside on the net quite a lot of the time. So if you make a
>mistake doing anything you can expect it to be followed up by many posts and
>maybe if you're lucky you get a FAQ in your mail box with in a few minutes
>of posting.

only if you are an idiot and act like one. there is such a thing as netiquette, you
know!

>LOGIC: Does not exist with these people. I guarantee you that!

right.

>example: A member of the "regulars" Emy or Emily Sachs is a sysop on
JRChat.
>Well one quiet evening Emy was sysopping JRChat and one of her little
>friends Chris came in. His chat nick name was "ChrissyCommunist" I found
it
>quite offensive and after many many minutes of debate I said, quite
>generally and to no one in particular "What if I came in as NaziDillon
>people would be very offened by that." So then Emy steps in "I *would* be
>offended because I am Jewish."

i'm angry now, really. can you not see the difference between a nazi and a
communist? the sole goal of the nazis in terms of jewish people was to wipe
them off the surface of the earth, killing a ludicrous amount of them.
communism, on the other hand, is merely the opposite of capitalism... it's
really not all that bad, only the media, especially in america, portray it as the
ultimate evil. all it is is equality for all, an equal wage structure. communists do
not kill 6 million jews, hold people in concentration camps, and torture them to
death. i am not personally in favour of communism, but i can see there is a
huge difference between naziism and communism.

what was that you were saying about logic? how about getting to grips with
the real world, hm?

<snip rest of annoying, ridiculous, plain rubbish post>

i've had enough of replying to your post. you are quite clearly a fool. and as for
that bit about comparing the newsgroup elite to communists..... deary me. do
you actually know what communsim is, or are you just opposed to it because
of all the hollywood films etc? "yeah, let's get those commie bastards!"
you make me sick.
--
jimbo

official a.g.c. fingerpuppet ubermeister
fingerpuppets! fingerpuppets! get 'em while they're hot!

chirpy deck swabber of the jolly weeble

http://surf.to/jimbo123 - norns, grendels, ettins, hybrids, jayd's cobs plus bucketloads
of others, creature gallery, links, music and a PHOTO OF JIMBO! you want more?!?

if for some reason the above url works not, here is the full one:
http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Cavern/1556

"i thought i was wrong once. i was mistaken." - karl kennedy

"hope is the one thing we will always have. hopefully." - me!

"WAR IS PEACE
FREEDOM IS SLAVERY
IGNORANCE IS STRENGTH"
and most importantly,
"JIMBO IS COOL." hehe.

you may have noticed that there are few capital letters in my posts. frankly, i can't be
arsed with them.

Lis Morris

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Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
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Enigma wrote in message <79k3uj$hmg$1...@newnews.global.net.uk>...

>Most of you don't know me as I only just started using this newsgroup, but
>I've been in and around the creatures community since it started and I've
>been observing all this talk Alize and agcm. I am fully in support of the
>people who are flaming him, he is just a nut who wants everything his own
>way and if he doesn't get it he moans. I have almost finished a site which
>will hopefully get a lot of traffic and I will be putting an "anti-agcm"
>button on it as I hope you all will.
>-Enigma
>"I am NOT a chair"
>

Thank you enigma! Nice to have the newbie vote too!
--
Lis Morris,
A.G.C. Goddess of Shee,
Evil Potato Grower,
Destroyer of Keyboards
http://www.shee.demon.co.uk

Lis Morris

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Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
to
Oh, Shut up. You can't categorise everyone into one little section. I am
sick of hearing about this whole thing.
It seems to me that you have a bee in your bonnet about the fact that emy
kicked you. You have no right to insult Emy's lifestyle here. In fact, for
someone who reckons everyone should not comform, it seems a little odd to me
that you want her to conform in real life!


--
Lis Morris, <- exceedingly peeved

Miff

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Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
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<Lis Morris, <- exceedingly peeved>

I think we all are! :)

Miff
Lis Morris wrote in message
<918395643.12371.0...@news.demon.co.uk>...

Bean 118

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Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
to
>Martha Brummett
>Denise Voskuil
>Nornia
>Emily Sachs
>RedWordSmith
>Lis Morris
>Mannkind
>DreMoa
>Maetang
>NORNGod
>Waruru
>AntiNorn
>x0tix
>Ping
>To name but a few.

Add me.

Trust me, only newbies would go there, since the rest of us cannot stand the
idea. No one would learn anything, thereby defeating the purpose. Go ahead and
create it, see if we care, but IT WILL NOT WORK.

Bean, Goddess of Ettin, member of the pantheon, ect, ect..

"11 minutes 'til we die."
-Kenton

Visit ALB-Labs!
http://members.aol.com/bean118/alblabs.html

Remove ma to reply

Brad Fermanich

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Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
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Miff wrote:
>
> You my friend are a sad little prud who clearly has no clue to life at all.
> 99% of us told you we did NOT want that ng but you still did not get it.
>
> Martha Brummett
> Denise Voskuil
> Nornia
> Emily Sachs
> RedWordSmith
> Lis Morris
> Mannkind
> DreMoa
> Maetang
> NORNGod
> Waruru
> AntiNorn
> x0tix
> Ping
Brad Fermanich

> You cause trouble in JR and now cause trouble here.
> I wont be using it, I hope others wont use it and I'll do all I can to make
> sure newbies dont.
>

Proly the ones to go there will be the newbies...They will all be asking
how to get their norns to eat and nobody will be there to answer them.
Eventually they will find their way back here and agcm will be a ghost
town.

--

Brad.
EagerBevar Hunter of Sarcastica,
First to Answer, Last to be Heard!
Prime Minister of Kingdomality

Morghana: Don't wear any cement kilts!
Emy S.:How come I've never said anything quotable?
Kristin: I have this terrible urge to get a sig as pointless as are my
posts. hmmm.

ICQ: 5690051

http://i.am/brf/

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Enigma

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Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
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Newbie?
-?
"?"

Lis Morris wrote in message
<918395467.12278.0...@news.demon.co.uk>...

>
>Enigma wrote in message <79k3uj$hmg$1...@newnews.global.net.uk>...
>>Most of you don't know me as I only just started using this newsgroup, but
>>I've been in and around the creatures community since it started and I've
>>been observing all this talk Alize and agcm. I am fully in support of the
>>people who are flaming him, he is just a nut who wants everything his own
>>way and if he doesn't get it he moans. I have almost finished a site which
>>will hopefully get a lot of traffic and I will be putting an "anti-agcm"
>>button on it as I hope you all will.
>>-Enigma
>>"I am NOT a chair"
>>
>
>
>
>Thank you enigma! Nice to have the newbie vote too!
>--
>Lis Morris,

Denise L. Voskuil

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Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
to
On Sun, 7 Feb 1999 03:20:35 -0800, "Alize" <dho...@prodigy.net>
wrote:

>ATTITUDE: Usually very grumpy. They write things like "meh" and "grr" often
>to express this emotion.

It seems you lack a sense of humor then; that's usually written
jokingly. :)

> "I have established this FAQ or
>another."

That's called a "FAQ pointer" on Usenet; they occur on most all
newsgroups.

>Well here is it...the overwhelming list of those who are opposed to A.G.C.M.
>a whole fifteen people.

15 or so people who were opposed in the 18 hours between you posting
the proposal and the follow-up from you that I'm replying to now.
That's compared to 2 people who posted in support of it, so yes, the
amount opposed is pretty overwhelming.

Just the method by which you _created_ this newsgroup should make most
people who are undecided wonder about it:

* You posted _two_ control messages at least a day before posting the
proposal here, indicating you didn't care what _anyone_ else thought
about it, either those opposed or those for it. What if some of those
people who are supposedly _yearning_ for a moderated newsgroup had
some good ideas for its creation? You showed that you don't care
about their input. (Also, creating a.g.c.mod after a.g.c2.mod was
heavily criticized in alt.config is a pretty good sign that you didn't
care, as is your defense of, "Because I say so." in alt.config in
response to Miff's question about why yet another moderated newsgroup
is needed.)

* You lied in the control message by saying, "Discussed in alt.config,
some complaints, more discussion, all cleared up, no replies." In
reality, the group discussed was alt.games.creatures2.moderated, not
alt.games.creatures.moderated; you never posted an amended proposal
and in fact, your proposal here still reflects the C2-only nature of
the original. _More importantly_, there was a long thread (nearly 40
posts) and a shorter one, both composed mostly of complaints about
it/disagreements with it. You posted three followups to the two
threads, resolving very few complaints about it, and came up with such
memorable justifications as, "Because I say so.", calling those who
were against your proposal "uneducated", and being purposely dense
about questions like why we need another moderated newsgroup when
there are _five_ CyberLife-moderated newsgroups on the subject of
Creatures already (your response: "And...? Your point is?").

But, hey, it's done, right? So, go have fun in your new newsgroup.
There's some porn there already, evidently - your excellent squad of
moderators seem to really be on top of things. People will decide
which is better.

- Denise

--
Denise L. Voskuil-Marre' - grend...@hotmail.com
The Truth About Grendels! - <http://welcome.to/grendels/>
*New* C2 COBs: Coconut Vendor, Extra Toy Car, Extra Carrot Seed Dispenser!
Website Graphics FAQ, and C2 FAQs on Eating/Sleeping, the Color Machine,
and the Volcano; C1/C2 FAQ on Wolfling/Feral Runs; A.G.C Newbie FAQ, the
Edibles of Albia guide to foods for C2 (with pictures), and more!
Dibs on C2 COB species numbers 42400-42499! :)

Martha Brummett

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Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
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On Sun, 7 Feb 1999 03:20:35 -0800, "Alize" <dho...@prodigy.net>
wrote:


>they are not my concern. My wish is that a *better* community be formed.

Then have your own, with my blessing. But despite your desperate
attempt to enforce concensus by the use of a plural pronoun in your
heading, there is no "we" involved--just you and your imaginary
friends.

>example: A member of the "regulars" Emy or Emily Sachs is a sysop on JRChat.
>Well one quiet evening Emy was sysopping JRChat and one of her little
>friends Chris came in. His chat nick name was "ChrissyCommunist" I found it
>quite offensive and after many many minutes of debate I said, quite
>generally and to no one in particular "What if I came in as NaziDillon
>people would be very offened by that." So then Emy steps in "I *would* be
>offended because I am Jewish."
> Ok fine. That was the end of that and I ended up getting kicked by Queen
>Emy.
> So then we can see on the newsgroups alt.config and AGC, Emily saying "
>Or how about the time you threatened to join the chat as "NaziDillon" after
>learning I was Jewish. That seems rather vulgar, and certainly directed at
>me."

The preceding paragraphs speak for themselves more eloquently than the
poster must realize.

>PROOF (all of the information contained herein was part of a conversation
>Emy has with AntiNorn one late night): With the above regular used as an
>example, here is more information about that persons life in the real world.

<snip further ad hominem attacks on Emy>

>Yep, there are those here who try to run the community. They call it
>"self-moderation." Yeah, more like communism. You don't follow their rules
>you get a nice "welcome to my kill-file." You get ignored. Nice people huh?

Sorry, sonny, but the cold war is over. LOL.

>Really seems like their (sic) trying to help. Well they do often help a lot of


>people, with the FAQ's etc,

This seems to be a direct contradiction of the poster's previous
stance--what was that bit about logic?

<more rant snipped>


Martha Brummett (C2 species range 39001-39100)
Piratical Maid-of-All-Work, P.B. Jolly Weeble
mailto:mo...@diac.com
Bonadrey Nornery
http://www.diac.com/~mokus/bonadrey.html

Nornina

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Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
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>> Martha Brummett
>> Denise Voskuil
>> Nornia
>> Emily Sachs
>> RedWordSmith
>> Lis Morris
>> Mannkind
>> DreMoa
>> Maetang
>> NORNGod
>> Waruru
>> AntiNorn
>> x0tix
>> Ping
>Brad Fermanich

Cati
Cati of th' Wolfpack
Nornina's norns: http://www.geocities.com/EnchantedForest/Tower/5642/
"Callan flabber!" My grendel Callan.
"Grunchy thleep" My grendel Grunchy
I am Drunk of Borg. Resistance is floor tile.
My keyboard';\s broken. Sorry gfor typos.

Pool Shark

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Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
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Alize wrote in message <79jsvp$24d2$1...@newssvr03-int.news.prodigy.com>...
>example: A member of the "regulars" Emy or Emily Sachs is a sysop on
JRChat.
>Well one quiet evening Emy was sysopping JRChat and one of her little
>friends Chris came in. His chat nick name was "ChrissyCommunist" I found it
>quite offensive and after many many minutes of debate I said, quite
>generally and to no one in particular "What if I came in as NaziDillon
>people would be very offened by that." So then Emy steps in "I *would* be
>offended because I am Jewish."
> Ok fine. That was the end of that and I ended up getting kicked by
Queen
>Emy.
> So then we can see on the newsgroups alt.config and AGC, Emily saying "
>Or how about the time you threatened to join the chat as "NaziDillon" after
>learning I was Jewish. That seems rather vulgar, and certainly directed at
>me."
>

Have you no shame, Alize?!

>_______________
>SUMMARY: They are quite well known in many areas of the Creatures
Community.
>For instance JRChat. So if you disagree with anyone of them, prepare to be
>kicked from that chat room. >

Oh wah, you got kicked out of the chat room! GET OVER IT.


>Well here is it...the overwhelming list of those who are opposed to
A.G.C.M.
>a whole fifteen people.
>
>Martha Brummett
>Denise Voskuil
>Nornia
>Emily Sachs
>RedWordSmith
>Lis Morris
>Mannkind
>DreMoa
>Maetang
>Miff
>NORNGod
>Waruru
>AntiNorn
>x0tix
>Ping
>

HEY, you forgot to add me!
If you hadn't noticed, you're not getting much support on your little
newsgroup idea.....
-Pool Shark
"Just when you make something idiot-proof, they go and make a better idiot!"


MadFish387

unread,
Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
to
>Yep, there are those here who try to run the community. They call it
>"self-moderation." Yeah, more like communism.

Communism is a great idea, just human nature gets in the way.

>Well here is it...the overwhelming list of those who are opposed to A.G.C.M.
>a whole fifteen people.

<snip for space>

16, add me to that list. And from the E-,ail you got it seems that RNorton601
is also against it.

BTW isn't a vote note cast, one in the favour of the status quo, instead of
posting the againsts, why not post the fors instead?

>You don't follow their rules you get a nice "welcome to my kill-file." You
> get ignored. Nice people huh?

Yes, if you don't like someone or there attitude you ignore them, you don't
flame, swear or mail bomb or do similar things to them

>They are quite well known in many areas of the Creatures Community.
>For instance JRChat. So if you disagree with anyone of them, prepare to >be
kicked from that chat room.

Not that with agcm you'd _ever_ do a thing like that..................

>Has a very screwed up family, not my opinion, but quoted from Emy
>herself and not out of context. Has no real friends. Except maybe one or
>two of the other regulars on AGC. Besides that she "believes she has no
>real friends."

And this bears on the current argument how?

>Well its a place you can go to discuss creatures without all of the hassel
>of the above.

Of which most is as biased as a polititions election campian(sp)

>We will develop into a highly productive Creatures Community.

By banning the most knowledgable and helpful people........... isn't that like
fighting a war with your brains shot out?

>There is also a feature that lets you have a private chat in a separate
>window by double clicking on a user in the room list. Inside the Nexus
>COMM there is also a FeedBack form and Forum featuring a discussion
>group on Creatures 3, General Discussion, and Questions. I have made
>these resources available to you in user friendly environment. Enjoy!!

So why if you have this do you need your own 'select' newsgroup? (Which by
definition will be a Dictatorship, far worse than, as you put it, communism)


Madfish - Hater of all that is Mind(less)sc(r)ape

We are all lifers with only one way out

Murphy was right, O'Tool more so

ACWP- http://member.aol.com/madfish387/index.html
ICQ 19001858
AIM- madfish387
Furcadia- Roy
E-mail- madfi...@aol.com

MadFish387

unread,
Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
to
>Newbie?

A new person in the newsgroup : )

Jcarrcwalk

unread,
Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
to
I am sorry, I have tolerated the last post like this, but your behavior here
demonstrates the exact same kind of behavior you accuse others of. You attempt
to slander, flame, and discredit the entire communtity.

>"What if I came in as NaziDillon
>people would be very offened by that."

I find this very offensive, Nazism and Communism are two completely different
things. Nazism is a racially biased system, whereas communism is a valid form
of government. I see no reason you should take offense for someone being a
communist. I consider myself a liberal socialist(a very modified sence of the
word), and I take offense at the negative connotations you imply on communism
which well, we won't go into, but you've prompted me to start writing a
communalist manifest to put on my site <g>. Your behavior in that post was very
immature (as is mine on this post). Realise that setting up a moderated system
will catalyse the formation of exactly the same problems you accuse JRchat of
having.

>They call it
>"self-moderation." Yeah, more like communism. You don't follow their rules

*blood boils, clinches mouse*... I find the "oldbies" have distinct
personalities and are generally non-conformist. Lets start going down the list
from top to bottom:

Martha Brummett- A reasonable intelligent person with a great ability for
exposing hypocrisy
Denise Voskuil- One of the nicer people to newbies, she generally restrains
from flaming and offers helpful advise.
Nornia- A generally friendly person with a great sense of humour
Emily Sachs- She's certainly got character and common sense, I'd watch your
insults toward her cause she's another good exposer of hypocrisy.
RedWordSmith- Hasn't been here too long, but a reasonable person
Lis Morris- One of the most knowledgeable people I know, has a great sense of
humour and is nice to newbies
Mannkind- Another great character, exposer of the ironic, and one of the more
capable jokesters
DreMoa- Sorry, don't know this person
Maetang- One of the nicest on AGC, friendly to newbies, with a head of common
sense and good intentions
Miff- Has one of the best senses of humour on AGC, puts a lot of effort into
boosting CL, AL, and AGC
NORNGod- Though occasionally confrontational, a nice person if not directly
provoked, and another person skilled in showing the ironic
Waruru- A great contributer to Creatures, displays common sense and a friendly
attitude.
AntiNorn- One of the most helpful people here, has a cool temper, and an
ability to think clearly
x0tix- Another person very nice to newbies, puts a lot of effort into FAQs and
her site, one of the nicest and most helpful people here
Ping- Words cannot describe, he's a character.

Those who want to go there are free to, but please don't post these
confrontational universal flames here (the irony). The reason you have been
getting flammed is probably because you are being so confrontational. If you
stop flamming(trolling?) AGC, you'll be welcome here.

*No offence is meant by this modified sig, I'm sorry*

Andrew Carroll
jcarr...@aol.communist
members.aol.communist/jcarrcwalk/creatures/Index2.htm
I support ERFNB, ERFS, and ERFC
"Those who advocate free speech by denouncing another system of government are
advocating censorship" -me

Jcarrcwalk

unread,
Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
to
>
>Martha Brummett
>Denise Voskuil
>Nornia
>Emily Sachs
>RedWordSmith
>Lis Morris
>Mannkind
>DreMoa
>Maetang
>Miff
>NORNGod
>Waruru
>AntiNorn
>x0tix
>Ping

kindly add me to the list as well. (Not because I don't like you, but I dislike
the idea)
Andrew Carroll
I support ERFNB (Equal Rights For NewBies)!!!

Miff

unread,
Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
to
LOL- it gets worse for Dom :)

Miff
MadFish387 wrote in message <19990207123831...@ng33.aol.com>...

Miff

unread,
Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
to
Hey Ali! A new guy for your Nature of agc page! :-)

And Alize, lets face it, your ng is not a good idea for us, enjoy it with
your friends
but dont include us in it. We have a winning formula here and dont need it
changing
as the views show above.

Miff D Fahey.
MI5 and general on rent Support Agent
The artist formerly known as Prince Island
<for those who dont know, my post ends here>

Alize wrote in message <79jsvp$24d2$1...@newssvr03-int.news.prodigy.com>...

Alize

unread,
Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
to

Jcarrcwalk wrote in message <19990207124651...@ng115.aol.com>...
:I am sorry, I have tolerated the last post like this, but your behavior

here
:demonstrates the exact same kind of behavior you accuse others of. You
attempt
:to slander, flame, and discredit the entire communtity.
:
:>"What if I came in as NaziDillon

:>people would be very offened by that."
:
:I find this very offensive,
Good that was my point in the rest of the statement that you snipped.

Nazism and Communism are two completely different
:things. Nazism is a racially biased system, whereas communism is a valid
form
:of government. I see no reason you should take offense for someone being a
:communist.

Like I said *I* find it offensive.It was MY opinion. Sorry if no one liked
it but... "Those who advocate free speech by denouncing another system of
government are advocating censorship"


Magic T. Dragon

unread,
Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
to
Nornina wrote:
>
> >> Martha Brummett
> >> Denise Voskuil
> >> Nornia
> >> Emily Sachs
> >> RedWordSmith
> >> Lis Morris
> >> Mannkind
> >> DreMoa
> >> Maetang
> >> NORNGod
> >> Waruru
> >> AntiNorn
> >> x0tix
> >> Ping
> >Brad Fermanich
> Cati

Natasha V.

--Go ahead, guess...


Alwac

unread,
Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
to
>Martha Brummett
>Denise Voskuil
>Nornia
>Emily Sachs
>RedWordSmith
>Lis Morris
>Mannkind
>DreMoa
>Maetang
>Miff
>NORNGod
>Waruru
>AntiNorn
>x0tix
>Ping

Please add me to this list.
Anna C

Frazz Coull

unread,
Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
to
On 7 Feb 1999 18:14:30 GMT, al...@aol.com (Alwac) wrote:

>>Martha Brummett
>>Denise Voskuil
>>Nornia
>>Emily Sachs
>>RedWordSmith
>>Lis Morris
>>Mannkind
>>DreMoa
>>Maetang
>>Miff
>>NORNGod
>>Waruru
>>AntiNorn
>>x0tix
>>Ping

What is this? If it's to join agcm, then count me (Frazz) in.

"Her lips said no, but her eyes said, 'read my lips' - Niles Crane,
Frasier
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Fr...@Total.Reality.freeserve.co.uk
http://www.totalreality.freeserve.co.uk
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>


MagicPantz

unread,
Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
to

>Nornina wrote:
>>
>> >> Martha Brummett
>> >> Denise Voskuil
>> >> Nornia
>> >> Emily Sachs
>> >> RedWordSmith
>> >> Lis Morris
>> >> Mannkind
>> >> DreMoa
>> >> Maetang
>> >> NORNGod
>> >> Waruru
>> >> AntiNorn
>> >> x0tix
>> >> Ping
>> >Brad Fermanich
>> Cati
>
>Natasha V.

What's this for?

Alwac

unread,
Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
to
>What is this? If it's to join agcm, then count me (Frazz) in.

It's a list of people who don't want to join.
Anna C

Emily Sachs

unread,
Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
to
Alize wrote:
>
<snip>

May I ask just one thing? Why are you so obsessed with making me look bad?

--
Just a thought from: Emily Sachs | "When you come to the edge of all that
-> http://members.xoom.com/Emy/ | you know, you must believe one of
-> ICQ: 8980276 | two things; there will be earth
-> AIM: Emy Elis | upon which to stand, or you will be
-> I need to change my sig more. | given wings to fly."
-----------------------------------------------------
"Ambition is a poor excuse for not having sense enough to be lazy."
~Charlie McCarthy

Miff

unread,
Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
to
Take a peek Alize.

>Martha Brummett
>Denise Voskuil
>Nornia
>Emily Sachs
>RedWordSmith
>Lis Morris
>Mannkind
>DreMoa
>Maetang
>NORNGod
>Waruru
>AntiNorn
>x0tix
>Ping

>Bean
>Brad
>Cati
>Natasha
>Pool Shark
>Jcarr
>Anna C
>Frazz
>Enigma
>LummoxJR (well, he thought the idea of agc2 was poor)
>Mike
>Sarah
>Elliot Rati
>Cave

And more Im sure...Ali...Kinnison..?

Miff -

>Martha Brummett
>Denise Voskuil
>Nornia
>Emily Sachs
>RedWordSmith
>Lis Morris
>Mannkind
>DreMoa
>Maetang

>Miff


>NORNGod
>Waruru
>AntiNorn
>x0tix
>Ping
>

Alize

unread,
Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
to

:
:May I ask just one thing? Why are you so obsessed with making me look bad?


I'm not Emy, you make yourself look bad on your own. Should Clinton ask the
Congree and Senate Democrates "Why are ya'll so obsessed with makin' me look

Miff

unread,
Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
to
<you make yourself look bad on your own. >
She must of learnt form you, b/c from where I'm standing the one
person looking bad in this thread is YOU. Well done.

Its clear you and your ng isnt wanted here, you can get more reason
out of a bread crumb than you can from you Mr. "Because I say so".

Miff

Alize wrote in message <79km5c$2coa$1...@newssvr04-int.news.prodigy.com>...

MagicPantz

unread,
Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
to
Martha Brummett
Denise Voskuil
Nornia
Emily Sachs
RedWordSmith
Lis Morris
Mannkind
DreMoa
Maetang
NORNGod
Wafuru

AntiNorn
x0tix
Ping
Brad Fermanich
Cati
Natasha V.
Pam Rice (MagicPantz)

-The Pantz
Site under construction........


Alize

unread,
Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
to
Nice Miff and I'm rubber you're glue right?

Grow up...


Miff wrote in message <79kmca$7fg$1...@uranium.btinternet.com>...
:<you make yourself look bad on your own. >

Alize

unread,
Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
to
Outstanding, those are exactly the people I want to see on the list. BTW
Frazz wanted AGCM so you should take his name off the list.


:

:

Miff

unread,
Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
to
<Grow up...>
Already have done, care to follow me or do ya wish to stay a immature little
brat? :-)

Miff

Alize wrote in message <79kn7m$6456$1...@newssvr04-int.news.prodigy.com>...

Miff

unread,
Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
to
Ok, and replace it with Alis for certain b/c he posted at alt.config.

I think the expression na nana na na naaa na! would be ideal here, its on
your level
and contains words that arent big so you should understand it!

Miff
Alize wrote in message <79kn9d$3eqi$1...@newssvr04-int.news.prodigy.com>...

LJVPM

unread,
Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
to
None of the people you mentioned have ever flamed or annoyed me. I think you're
being very unfair to say things like that. I'm not a newbie or a regular, I
think I'm in between; but at the minute you strike me as behaving worse than
the silliest newbie or the most grumpy regular on the newsgroup. I mean, if the
people you mention really ARE the reason we get flamewars what's to stop them
coming to the new newsgroup. And by banning them you're doing exactly what you
are supposedly trying to stop as quoted in your example >example: A member of

the "regulars" Emy or Emily Sachs is a sysop on JRChat.
>Well one quiet evening Emy was sysopping JRChat and one of her little
>friends Chris came in. His chat nick name was "ChrissyCommunist" I found it
>quite offensive and after many many minutes of debate I said, quite
>generally and to no one in particular "What if I came in as NaziDillon
>people would be very offened by that." So then Emy steps in "I *would* be
>offended because I am Jewish."
> Ok fine. That was the end of that and I ended up getting kicked by Queen
>Emy.

OK I don't visit JR chat but whether or not Emy was within her rights doesn't
matter. You are against people being kicked out for a difference of opinion so
you can't kick them out of "AGCM" for not going along with you're opinion.
Please add me to your list of people who are opposed to AGCM.
~~~Eljay

Hater of Cruelty (to ANYTHING) And People Who Try To Order Me About.

"I say what I think. Unfortunately, I don't often think what I say."

My Fav. Norns: Popple, Jinky2, Felessan, Canth, Lessa, Caylith, JustRite....

Remove "ical"

Miff

unread,
Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
to
Hey Alize... heres another for your list! :-)
Another one you wanted, eh? :) Seems you want a ng just for yourself!

Miff
LJVPM wrote in message <19990207135530...@ng40.aol.com>...

MadFish387

unread,
Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
to
>Outstanding, those are exactly the people I want to see on the list. BTW
>Frazz wanted AGCM so you should take his name off the list.

As I said, fighting a war with your brains shot out

Harlander

unread,
Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
to
Enigma wrote in message <79kcjq$p8o$1...@newnews.global.net.uk>...
>Newbie?
>-?
>"?"
Newbie (noo-bee) [comp/net] 1. New user, new addition to the community.

Harlander

unread,
Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
to
***************
Why we don't need AGCM
***************

There are a lot of people in the present Creature Community who are helpful
towards a lot of new, and ometimes old, people. And as such most of those
new people hang around. It is generally a
great community. My wish is that a *worse* community be formed.

Ok, so most of the new people do hang around. They are helped
(more or less depending on the regular's mood).
I feel sorry for those that don't stick around because they miss out on
being part of such a great community.


Miff

unread,
Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
to
Add your name to list <G>

Miff
Harlander wrote in message <79koc4$rtc$2...@news4.svr.pol.co.uk>...

Lis Morris

unread,
Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
to

Alize wrote in message <79km5c$2coa$1...@newssvr04-int.news.prodigy.com>...
>
>
>:
>:May I ask just one thing? Why are you so obsessed with making me look
bad?
>
>
>I'm not Emy, you make yourself look bad on your own. Should Clinton ask the
>Congree and Senate Democrates "Why are ya'll so obsessed with makin' me
look
>bad?"


She's never made herself look bad, she just humilated you. And you are too
immature to be able to stand that.

Martha Brummett

unread,
Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
to
On Sun, 7 Feb 1999 10:30:06 -0800, "Alize" <dho...@prodigy.net>
wrote:

>I'm not Emy, you make yourself look bad on your own. Should Clinton ask the

>Congree (sic) and Senate Democrates (sic) "Why are ya'll so obsessed with makin' me look
>bad?"

You'd better stop denigrating people based on state of origin before
you get to the Citadel (if you're indeed accepted). Oh, and don't
lean over in the showers...


Martha Brummett (C2 species range 39001-39100)
Piratical Maid-of-All-Work, P.B. Jolly Weeble
mailto:mo...@diac.com
Bonadrey Nornery
http://www.diac.com/~mokus/bonadrey.html

LdyMagic33

unread,
Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
to
People that may want to join...

Celeste(Once she comes back)
NornLove(probably)
EttinBoy(Celeste's friend)(might join)
Me
Didn't Frazz think that the list was the people who did want to join and he
wanted to join? I think he did. Although someone added him to the list 'cause
they thaught he said he wanted to join that list of people who did not want to
join.


MadFish387

unread,
Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
to
>>I'm not Emy, you make yourself look bad on your own. Should Clinton ask the
>>Congree (sic) and Senate Democrates (sic) "Why are ya'll so obsessed with
>makin' me look
>>bad?"
>
>You'd better stop denigrating people based on state of origin before
>you get to the Citadel (if you're indeed accepted). Oh, and don't
>lean over in the showers...
>

Citadel?

Alize

unread,
Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
to

:>
:
:Citadel?
:


The Military College of the South
Charleston South Carolina

Been there done that...Echo Company Rules!!!!!!

If your not familar with The Citadel see CNN or 60 minutes news stories...

Magic T. Dragon

unread,
Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
to
MagicPantz wrote:

>
> >Nornina wrote:
> >>
> >> >> Martha Brummett
> >> >> Denise Voskuil
> >> >> Nornia
> >> >> Emily Sachs
> >> >> RedWordSmith
> >> >> Lis Morris
> >> >> Mannkind
> >> >> DreMoa
> >> >> Maetang
> >> >> NORNGod
> >> >> Waruru

> >> >> AntiNorn
> >> >> x0tix
> >> >> Ping
> >> >Brad Fermanich
> >> Cati
> >
> >Natasha V.
>
> What's this for?

AGCers agains AGCM.

--Natasha V.


AntiNorn

unread,
Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
to
On Sun, 7 Feb 1999 03:20:35 -0800, "Alize" <dho...@prodigy.net>
wrote:


>************************************************
>AGC REGULAR'S: A PROFILE
>
>ATTITUDE: Usually very grumpy. They write things like "meh" and "grr" often
>to express this emotion. Very odd. They generally have an "elite" attitude
>such as "I have been here longer than you." "I have established this FAQ or
>another." "This is the way it is here in AGC follow the rules or get out."
>"You're a troll navan or whatever."
>
>FREQUENCY: They reside on the net quite a lot of the time. So if you make a
>mistake doing anything you can expect it to be followed up by many posts and
>maybe if you're lucky you get a FAQ in your mail box with in a few minutes
>of posting.
>
>LOGIC: Does not exist with these people. I guarantee you that!
>________________

>example: A member of the "regulars" Emy or Emily Sachs is a sysop on JRChat.
>Well one quiet evening Emy was sysopping JRChat and one of her little
>friends Chris came in. His chat nick name was "ChrissyCommunist" I found it
>quite offensive and after many many minutes of debate I said, quite
>generally and to no one in particular "What if I came in as NaziDillon
>people would be very offened by that." So then Emy steps in "I *would* be
>offended because I am Jewish."
> Ok fine. That was the end of that and I ended up getting kicked by Queen
>Emy.

> So then we can see on the newsgroups alt.config and AGC, Emily saying "
>Or how about the time you threatened to join the chat as "NaziDillon" after
>learning I was Jewish. That seems rather vulgar, and certainly directed at
>me."
>
>Hmm I think not Emy. But, whatever. "Welcome to insanity" right.

Hmm, it may appear innocent when you leave out a tons of other info:
Your lame attempts at Cybersex in JRchat. Your horribly offensive chat
remarks to Emy in the form of foul language and innuendo. Your
repeated attempts to stir up arguments and cause problems for newbies
in chat. And last, but certainly not least, your "Hitler went to
heaven" posts to another newsgroup.

>_______________
>SUMMARY: They are quite well known in many areas of the Creatures Community.
>For instance JRChat. So if you disagree with anyone of them, prepare to be
>kicked from that chat room. Well I have a solution to that as well, but we
>will get into that later. If I can give any advice to a new user coming to
>AGC please, do NOT conform. You do NOT have to, you can get help else where
>if AGC is too much trouble. AGC exists in ALT (See my USENet Lessons post
>for more info.), so there are no rules(with the exception of moderated
>groups. You will end up flaming new users, acting grumpy to fit in, trying
>to be clever etc... It just doesn't fit into the real world and neither do
>most of these regulars.
>

Yes Alize, if they disagree in the way that you did. IE: why can't I
use foul language here? What's wrong with cybersex? etc..

>PROOF (all of the information contained herein was part of a conversation
>Emy has with AntiNorn one late night): With the above regular used as an
>example, here is more information about that persons life in the real world.
>She has fought with her parents ever since she was six, or so she says. Has
>a very screwed up family, not my opinion, but quoted from Emy herself and
>not out of context. Has no real friends. Except maybe one or two of the
>other regulars on AGC. Besides that she "believes she has no real friends."
>And her parents are sending her to a shrink.
>
>Hmm...now this is one of the many who has been flaming you, and kicking you
>from JRChat. Who acts so superior in the Creatures Community. This is who
>the people are who *try* to run the community, don't act like them.

Hmm, I was wondering who that person was that lurks in chat late at
night for hours at a time saying absolutely nothing. Gee, isn't it
wonderful to know that a person who is obsessed enough to stay in a
chat room, scribbling down notes about someone while eavesdropping on
a conversation, will now be a "moderator" for a newsgroup? I bet all
the people out there who are/were considering joining your new group
will just feel all warm and fuzzy inside knowing that the creator of
said group will go to any means necessary in order to tell the whole
world about the personal lives of those people he deems "superior".

Oh, and given your attitude in this, and many other threads, I'm
certain we all can see that you don't have any sort of superiority
complex..

>
>MORE PROOF: How a new user tries to become elite.
>This was an e-mail I recieved on Sat. Feb. 6.
>
>To Dillon Hosier,
>
> I have a question. Did you even read the responses to your suggestion?
>They
>were all negative. You got no support at all. Please remove your charter
>and
>drop the newsgroup.
> For your information, I am brand new at this and even I knew that no one
>supported your measure on the agc.
>
>I hope you comply before the e-mail pores in.
>
>I guess he declined to sign, but this is from RNort...@aol.com
>************************************************

Hmm, sounds more like an honest response from someone who doesn't wish
to see someone like you filling the heads of newbies with nonsense.

>TRYING TO CONTROL A COMMUNITY
>
>Yep, there are those here who try to run the community. They call it
>"self-moderation." Yeah, more like communism. You don't follow their rules
>you get a nice "welcome to my kill-file." You get ignored. Nice people huh?
>Really seems like their trying to help. Well they do often help a lot of
>people, with the FAQ's etc, but the general over all attitude or ambiance of
>the group is quite negative. So I suggest AGCM, a place where people can
>gather peacefully. And what do I get, "why did you go behind out backs?" Umm
>FYI you regulars are NOT in charge of anything on alt.* sorry to break it to
>you. Oh and they say there has been an overwhelming amount of protest to
>AGCM.
>
>Well here is it...the overwhelming list of those who are opposed to A.G.C.M.
>a whole fifteen people.
>

>Martha Brummett
>Denise Voskuil
>Nornia
>Emily Sachs
>RedWordSmith
>Lis Morris
>Mannkind
>DreMoa
>Maetang

>Miff


>NORNGod
>Waruru
>AntiNorn
>x0tix
>Ping
>

>*Most* of these people are the ones who flame you, kick you, etc. Boy, I
>guess if all the new users (not newbies) go to AGCM they wont have anyone to
>kick around. Gosh then what? It is also interesting to pint out that
>whenever the AGCM proposal comes up the regs. start to be quite nice to
>some.
>************************************************

Well, as you can see, in less than 12 hours after your original post
many names have been added to that list.

Yes, you went behind the backs of everyone here. You posted your
proposal to alt.config without mentioning it here. you lied in your
control message(btw, nice way you misspelled your own email address on
that first one), created the group, and only then brought it up here.

>SO WHAT IS AGCM (alt.games.creatures.moderated)?
>
>Well its a place you can go to discuss creatures without all of the hassel
>of the above. It just doesn't exist. But, it will eventually be more than
>that. We will develop into a highly productive Creatures Community. As least
>that is my goal. I just want the people, the general population, to be able
>to come to a newsgroup and not have to deal with the *most* of the above
>people. For more information go ahead and e-mail Mike McFadden at
>ALPr...@aol.com he is one of the many people who will be helping me with
>this project. It will take a while for the new group to get onto everyone's
>server, but it'll get there evenutally.
>

Oh, so is he also one of the people who's failed to remove the porn
posts from your "moderated" group?

>HAVING TROUBLE WITH JRCHAT?
>
>Well now you have an alternative. Go to the Creatures Nexus
>http://skyscraper.fortunecity.com/corel/734 Click on the Nexus COMM link.
>This stands for Nexus Communications. In side there is a ChatRoom that is
>moderated by me and others, but I guarantee you won't get kicked for
>speaking your mind. There is also a feature that lets you have a private
>chat in a separate window by double clicking on a user in the room list.
>Inside the Nexus COMM there is also a FeedBack form and Forum featuring a
>discussion group on Creatures 3, General Discussion, and Questions. I have
>made these resources available to you in user friendly environment. Enjoy!!
>

Yeah, I went there a few minutes ago. There were three people
"hitting on" female chatters, and two people fighting about Pokemon...

>_____________________


Overall, it looks as if the only thing you're concerned with is
creating a group you, and some imaginary people, have complete control
over. You disregard the fact that there are 5 Cyberlife-moderated
groups. When you *do* answer direct questions it's usually a reply of
"because I said so", or "so what"(hmm a bit elitist responses). You
target the personal aspects of certain people that have absolutely no
bearing on the Creatures Community as a whole. You falsely accuse
people you dislike of flaming newbies and forcing them to "conform".

Hmmm, Shades of AVS in your actions? Does anyone else sense this or
am I just reading between the lines a bit *too* much?

Tortured Norns: http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Park/2495/

AntiNorn

unread,
Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
to
On Sun, 7 Feb 1999 10:08:12 -0800, "Alize" <dho...@prodigy.net>
wrote:

>

>Like I said *I* find it offensive.It was MY opinion. Sorry if no one liked
>it but... "Those who advocate free speech by denouncing another system of
>government are advocating censorship"
>
Umm, nice quote.. So in your mind it's quite alright to ignore your
own advice, but everyone else *must* follow it?

Tortured Norns: http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Park/2495/

Martha Brummett

unread,
Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
to
On Sun, 7 Feb 1999 11:36:04 -0800, "Alize" <dho...@prodigy.net>
wrote:

>:Citadel?
>
>The Military College of the South
>Charleston South Carolina
>

>If your not (sic) familar with The Citadel see CNN or 60 minutes news stories...
>
like this one: http://detnews.com/menu/stories/13948.htm .

Ali (Alastair Maggs)

unread,
Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
to
OOoohhhh.... Well, I haven't done anything for Tuesday's updates....So....
Consider it done,

Ali

--
Genetic Engineerer and Cobbler. Webmaster of Albia2000 and Creatures
Newbie Resource

All Newbies with questions about the game, Creatures (1 and 2) or the
community should visit http://welcome.to/creatures.newbies for the
Creatures Newbies Resource

'ALBIA2000' ---> www.albia2000.force9.co.uk
(Cobs, Creatures , Help and Features - the second most popular unofficial
Creatures site on the net)
--->Updates every Tuesday and Saturday!

email: a...@albia2000.force9.co.uk
Miff <M.F...@btinternet.com> wrote in message
news:79kk5l$h3l$1...@plutonium.btinternet.com...
>Hey Ali! A new guy for your Nature of agc page! :-)
>
>And Alize, lets face it, your ng is not a good idea for us, enjoy it with
>your friends
>but dont include us in it. We have a winning formula here and dont need it
>changing
>as the views show above.
>
>Miff D Fahey.
>MI5 and general on rent Support Agent
>The artist formerly known as Prince Island
><for those who dont know, my post ends here>

>>_______________
>>SUMMARY: They are quite well known in many areas of the Creatures
>Community.
>>For instance JRChat. So if you disagree with anyone of them, prepare to be
>>kicked from that chat room. Well I have a solution to that as well, but we
>>will get into that later. If I can give any advice to a new user coming to
>>AGC please, do NOT conform. You do NOT have to, you can get help else
where
>>if AGC is too much trouble. AGC exists in ALT (See my USENet Lessons post
>>for more info.), so there are no rules(with the exception of moderated
>>groups. You will end up flaming new users, acting grumpy to fit in, trying
>>to be clever etc... It just doesn't fit into the real world and neither do
>>most of these regulars.
>>

>>PROOF (all of the information contained herein was part of a conversation
>>Emy has with AntiNorn one late night): With the above regular used as an
>>example, here is more information about that persons life in the real
>world.
>>She has fought with her parents ever since she was six, or so she says.
Has
>>a very screwed up family, not my opinion, but quoted from Emy herself and
>>not out of context. Has no real friends. Except maybe one or two of the
>>other regulars on AGC. Besides that she "believes she has no real
friends."
>>And her parents are sending her to a shrink.
>>
>>Hmm...now this is one of the many who has been flaming you, and kicking
you
>>from JRChat. Who acts so superior in the Creatures Community. This is who
>>the people are who *try* to run the community, don't act like them.
>>

>>MORE PROOF: How a new user tries to become elite.
>>This was an e-mail I recieved on Sat. Feb. 6.
>>
>>To Dillon Hosier,
>>
>> I have a question. Did you even read the responses to your suggestion?
>>They
>>were all negative. You got no support at all. Please remove your charter
>>and
>>drop the newsgroup.
>> For your information, I am brand new at this and even I knew that no one
>>supported your measure on the agc.
>>
>>I hope you comply before the e-mail pores in.
>>
>>I guess he declined to sign, but this is from RNort...@aol.com
>>************************************************

>>SO WHAT IS AGCM (alt.games.creatures.moderated)?
>>
>>Well its a place you can go to discuss creatures without all of the hassel
>>of the above. It just doesn't exist. But, it will eventually be more than
>>that. We will develop into a highly productive Creatures Community. As
>least
>>that is my goal. I just want the people, the general population, to be
able
>>to come to a newsgroup and not have to deal with the *most* of the above
>>people. For more information go ahead and e-mail Mike McFadden at
>>ALPr...@aol.com he is one of the many people who will be helping me with
>>this project. It will take a while for the new group to get onto
everyone's
>>server, but it'll get there evenutally.
>>

>>HAVING TROUBLE WITH JRCHAT?
>>
>>Well now you have an alternative. Go to the Creatures Nexus
>>http://skyscraper.fortunecity.com/corel/734 Click on the Nexus COMM link.
>>This stands for Nexus Communications. In side there is a ChatRoom that is
>>moderated by me and others, but I guarantee you won't get kicked for
>>speaking your mind. There is also a feature that lets you have a private
>>chat in a separate window by double clicking on a user in the room list.
>>Inside the Nexus COMM there is also a FeedBack form and Forum featuring a
>>discussion group on Creatures 3, General Discussion, and Questions. I have
>>made these resources available to you in user friendly environment.
Enjoy!!
>>

>>_____________________
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>

The ghost of the god of Sarcasm passed

unread,
Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
to

Alize wrote in message <79jsvp$24d2$1...@newssvr03-int.news.prodigy.com>...

>ATTITUDE: Usually very grumpy. They write things like "meh" and "grr" often
>to express this emotion. Very odd.
>


Nyaaa!! even the state of 'unsubscribed' can't hide this from my beady eye.
How dare you insult my adopted phrase like that, you taunt the memory of
DAL.


-TGOTGOSP

MadFish387

unread,
Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
to
>>:Citadel?
>>
>>The Military College of the South
>>Charleston South Carolina
>>
>>If your not (sic) familar with The Citadel see CNN or 60 minutes news
>stories...
>>
>like this one: http://detnews.com/menu/stories/13948.htm .

Ah................

Das

unread,
Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
to
"Alize" <dho...@prodigy.net> wrote:


>
>LOGIC: Does not exist with these people. I guarantee you that!
>________________
>example: A member of the "regulars" Emy or Emily Sachs is a sysop on JRChat.
>Well one quiet evening Emy was sysopping JRChat and one of her little
>friends Chris came in. His chat nick name was "ChrissyCommunist" I found it
>quite offensive and after many many minutes of debate I said, quite
>generally and to no one in particular "What if I came in as NaziDillon
>people would be very offened by that." So then Emy steps in "I *would* be
>offended because I am Jewish."
> Ok fine. That was the end of that and I ended up getting kicked by Queen
>Emy.
> So then we can see on the newsgroups alt.config and AGC, Emily saying "
>Or how about the time you threatened to join the chat as "NaziDillon" after
>learning I was Jewish. That seems rather vulgar, and certainly directed at
>me."
>

Communism is a type of government, the Nazis were communist, and so is
Cuba, but that doesn't mean that Communism is evil, just bad in the
wrong hands. Remeber Carter? if not, I'm sure you've heard about
him....DemocratDas....<eg>....but to be offended by communism is quite
narrow-minded, I have heard of several good and happy communes,
they're much smaller, but work quite effectively. Nazis were the ones
which kill Judaists, they just happened to also be Communists, that'd
be like the British saying all Democrats are evil because of the
Revolutionary war or such. ;p

and mark me on the "opposed to" list too, if we are elitest, than what
would you call this small group of people, practically unknown to the
rest of the community, who wish to control the newsgroup? and the
only support FOR that newsgroup has come FROM this small group? meh.
<g>


Another thought revoking message from your friendly neighborhood spider...

er.....wait...that's Peter Parker.....oh well, here's something from

Das (pronounced DOS) of NORN

other aliases: Das le' `chaz, MechaDas, Das_Albia, SM-Angel-Das, Das treq',Admiral Meepy
annoying petnames: Dassypooh, Dassy, Dassie, DoilyDude, Dassydoodle, <insert another annoying name here>
former aol listings, may they burn with Netscape: Das Shivan, DEMO101, Das Gly, FF Cait

Admiral Meepy of the Weeble Pirating organization

regional Pyromania director within NORN collective
"bringing new ways to set objects aflame"

UIN:6920984

Master of the sacred Hiss and Bite Technique

To reply remove binky

"at base, science is no more than an investigation
miracle we can never explain, and art is an interpetation
of that miracle" -Ray Bradbury, The Martian Chronciles

"A woman can pour hot wax on her legs and rip out the
hair but still be afraid of a spider" -Jerry Seinfeld, Sein Language

"Why be positive when being negative is so much easier?" -Das (hey, that's ME!!)

"And here's what <insert name> sez, with a mouth full of PEZ!" - Jason Westman :)

"lol" - anyone who's ever been within 20 feet of a computer (or a mac <G>)

"where's my pants?" - anyone that's been through college (also myself after being at home for 2 weeks)

"if ignorance is bliss then maybe humans are the holy ones" - another one from my thought vaults

"Never eat anything bigger than your head" - Max Jerome

"I refuse be quoted in a Sig" - AntiNorn

"Stupid people are a drag on society. Intelligent people should rule the world. All idiots
should be forced into hard physical labor or be executed, while Intelligence supervises to make sure
they're doing it correctly. Welcome to the economics." - Book of Das, Chapter 4, Section 1

"32 bit performance, as opposed to 32 emulated on 16 bit platform, for an 8 bit patch,based on a 4 bit processor, built by a 2 bit company, who cant stand for 1 bit of competition." - Jason Moran, aka Tetsyck, comparing WinNT and Win95/98

"The new and improved CDN, it makes your blackers black, your whiters white, costs less, has a great taste AND is less filling, it slices, it dices, it Catches fish! That's right, it's the Creatures Developers Network!!" - Lisa de Araujo, marketing shark

"I want a pony, either lavender or periwinkle, and I also wish for a cookie" - more Das

"I am perfect, your perception is flawed" - Das's ego.

"if this is evolution, I think I'll go back to a chimp" - wow, I do like to ramble.

note: I neither know nor care about any typo I amke, please do nto bother me about thme.

Alize

unread,
Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
to
:Hmm, it may appear innocent when you leave out a tons of other info:

:Your lame attempts at Cybersex in JRchat. Your horribly offensive chat
:remarks to Emy in the form of foul language and innuendo. Your
:repeated attempts to stir up arguments and cause problems for newbies
:in chat. And last, but certainly not least, your "Hitler went to
:heaven" posts to another newsgroup.
:
:
:Yes Alize, if they disagree in the way that you did. IE: why can't I

:use foul language here? What's wrong with cybersex? etc..


What cybersex AntiNorn? Give me proof. Quotes. You're a flat out liar.


:Well, as you can see, in less than 12 hours after your original post


:many names have been added to that list.

Again those are the names I want on the list.

:Yes, you went behind the backs of everyone here. You posted your
:proposal to alt.config without mentioning it here. you lied in your
:control message(btw, nice way you misspelled your own email address on
:that first one), created the group, and only then brought it up here.


Refer to my USENet lessons for more on that....

:Oh, so is he also one of the people who's failed to remove the porn


:posts from your "moderated" group?

There is NO porn...again you're a liar.

:Yeah, I went there a few minutes ago. There were three people


:"hitting on" female chatters, and two people fighting about Pokemon...

Why must you constantly lie? Give me factual proof as I have in all of my
posts.


_____________________
:
:
:Overall, it looks as if the only thing you're concerned with is
:creating a group you, and some imaginary people, have complete control
:over. You disregard the fact that there are 5 Cyberlife-moderated
:groups.

I have nothing to do with Cyberlife. Or their newsgroups.

When you *do* answer direct questions it's usually a reply of
:"because I said so", or "so what"(hmm a bit elitist responses).

Hey this is ALT.

You
:target the personal aspects of certain people that have absolutely no
:bearing on the Creatures Community as a whole. You falsely accuse
:people you dislike of flaming newbies and forcing them to "conform".


Its not false and I have posted proof.

:Hmmm, Shades of AVS in your actions? Does anyone else sense this or


:am I just reading between the lines a bit *too* much?


I dont think you can read at all...

:Tortured Norns: http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Park/2495/

DJ-ack

unread,
Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
to
Magic T. Dragon wrote in message <36BDCFC7...@earthlink.net>...

>Nornina wrote:
>>
>> >> Martha Brummett
>> >> Denise Voskuil
>> >> Nornia
>> >> Emily Sachs
>> >> RedWordSmith
>> >> Lis Morris
>> >> Mannkind
>> >> DreMoa
>> >> Maetang
>> >> NORNGod
>> >> Waruru
>> >> AntiNorn
>> >> x0tix
>> >> Ping
>> >Brad Fermanich
>> Cati
>
>Natasha V.
DJ-ack

Ali (Alastair Maggs)

unread,
Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
to
<cough> Scum <cough>

Alize

unread,
Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
to

:
:Communism is a type of government, the Nazis were communist, and so is


:Cuba, but that doesn't mean that Communism is evil, just bad in the
:wrong hands. Remeber Carter? if not, I'm sure you've heard about
:him....DemocratDas....<eg>....but to be offended by communism is quite
:narrow-minded, I have heard of several good and happy communes,
:they're much smaller, but work quite effectively. Nazis were the ones
:which kill Judaists, they just happened to also be Communists, that'd
:be like the British saying all Democrats are evil because of the
:Revolutionary war or such. ;p

:
The Nazi's were actually Socialist. There is a difference but the point is
that I was offended by the communist name, and I made the point that people
would also be offended by the Nazi name. So basically everyone who is
posting with history lessons is simply backing up my original post.

Das

unread,
Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
to
"Alize" <dho...@prodigy.net> wrote:


>The Nazi's were actually Socialist. There is a difference but the point is
>that I was offended by the communist name, and I made the point that people
>would also be offended by the Nazi name. So basically everyone who is
>posting with history lessons is simply backing up my original post.
>
>

well, I was a bit off with communism too, it's just an economic
system, so I *should* hate capitolism, not democracy, and be offended
by any companies smaller than the largest one in each area. Viva
Microsoft!

but being offended by communism is silly, because as stated, they do
work, just when people like unnamed Cuban tyrants get ahold of
them....

but back to the other point, the support for no agcm is drastic, and
rather permission is required or not, it is quite inconsiderate to
just form one, when it is well-known that the majority was against it.
There is little support, and much resentment. this sounds much more
like an elitest than any agc'er.


Das's sig currently AWOL in memory of Ping.

Das

unread,
Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
to
"Alize" <dho...@prodigy.net> wrote:


>:Well, as you can see, in less than 12 hours after your original post


>:many names have been added to that list.
>

>Again those are the names I want on the list.

you mean well-respected, much-praised, active, high-moral, majority of
the community? AND Ping? ;p

AntiNorn

unread,
Feb 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM2/7/99
to
On Sun, 7 Feb 1999 11:58:18 -0800, "Alize" <dho...@prodigy.net>
wrote:

>:Hmm, it may appear innocent when you leave out a tons of other info:


>:Your lame attempts at Cybersex in JRchat. Your horribly offensive chat
>:remarks to Emy in the form of foul language and innuendo. Your
>:repeated attempts to stir up arguments and cause problems for newbies
>:in chat. And last, but certainly not least, your "Hitler went to
>:heaven" posts to another newsgroup.

>:
>:
>:Yes Alize, if they disagree in the way that you did. IE: why can't I


>:use foul language here? What's wrong with cybersex? etc..
>
>

>What cybersex AntiNorn? Give me proof. Quotes. You're a flat out liar.

Unlike you Alize, I don't sit in my dark little room, scribbling down
everything everyone says. I don't see the need to post "proof" when a
large number of people in chat have witnessed you doing these things.

>
>
>:Well, as you can see, in less than 12 hours after your original post


>:many names have been added to that list.
>

>Again those are the names I want on the list.

Hmm, and *we're* the Elitists?

>
>:Yes, you went behind the backs of everyone here. You posted your


>:proposal to alt.config without mentioning it here. you lied in your
>:control message(btw, nice way you misspelled your own email address on
>:that first one), created the group, and only then brought it up here.
&g