Newbie question - How does BG2 compare to Diablo?
andrewjohnson
How does BG2 compare to Diablo? I'm apologise if this seems a stupid
question but I've only played Diablo 1? I'm not an avid game player and I
rarely read game magazines?
Andy
The nth Drunken Immortal
actors, multifaceted PC/NPC interactions including romance and betrayal, an
unparalleled range of D&D monsters, Forgotten Realms heroes and locations
and cannot be finished simply by Left click, left click, left click, right
click, right click, left click, right click ad infinitum.
dont even consider D2 IMHO
"andrewjohnson" <andrew...@andrewjohnson.homechoice.co.uk> wrote in
message news:3ba95322$1...@news1.homechoice.co.uk...
Sam Worf
They both use AD&D-like systems (BG is more faithful), and you get to
collect lots of magical loot. That's about it. Other than those
aspects, the two games are like apples and oranges. Diablo is an
actionfest with almost no roleplaying, while BG2 is semi-turn based
strategy with very strong roleplaying. Having played both, I far and
away prefer BG2.
If you're feeling truly adventurous, you can download the 650MB demo
of Baldur's Gate II. It covers the whole first chapter (there are ten
chapters including the Throne of Bhaal expansion), so you get a lot
for your time. If you're on dialup just order the demo on CD from
Fileplanet.
The first of 7 parts, along with a CD request link, can be found here:
http://www.fileplanet.com/index.asp?section=340&file=51896&noloop=1
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Anthony Boyd
> Infinetely better: BG2 has a plot comparable to Tolkein, talented voice
> actors, multifaceted PC/NPC interactions including romance and
> betrayal, an unparalleled range of D&D monsters, Forgotten Realms
> heroes and locations and cannot be finished simply by Left click, left
> click, left click, right click, >>SNIP<<
Well, the newbie posted to a newsgroup populated by people who ARE buying
and playing the game, so he should know he's going to get pro-BG replies.
That said, let me try to be more evenhanded, as I like both.
First, the talented voice actors -- I think this is the one thing that
disappointed me the most, compared to D2. In D2, EVERYTHING has audio. In
BG2, it is often only the first line of dialog that is voice-acted. After
that, it's just read, read, read.
Also, the dialog systems are, in my opinion, BOTH in need of taking ideas
from the other. In D2, Cain can ramble on for a few minutes, like a
monologue. In BG2, the complete opposite is true -- so much back and
forth, oftentimes having to hit "continue" after just 3 or 4 words, and
typically you do that 5 or 10 or 15 times before you get through the
chatter. There needs to be a middle ground here.
Mr. Drunken Immortal has lots of common ground with me on two of his
observations: Diablo 2 is a click-fest -- all you do is click on monster,
kill monster, collect loot, sell loot. That's it. Repeat that over and
over again, and you have D2. I still like it. But BG2, while I wouldn't
compare the plot to Tolkein, I will say that the story is MUCH more
involved, much more fascinating than D2, and the character development of
the NPCs is amazing. Someone on the newsgroup a couple weeks ago suggested
that BG2 is like a "living story" that you interact with, and I AGREE.
In addition, BG2 has puzzles to solve, riddles to unravel, and very often
there are multiple ways out of a problem. You can turn it into a hack-and-
slash click-fest, but you can also try talking, try charming, try stealth
and avoidance, and so on. You can be diverted by subplots and romances.
Having responded to D.I., I'll drop some unrelated rants in a second post.
Anthony Boyd
You're going to like D2 better, since it appears that your gaming
experience is limited to D1. It'll be simple to pick up, and easy, and the
quests are fun, and you'll feel successful. At the same time, if I could
convince you to tackle the more complicated BG2, I think you would find it
is also MUCH more rewarding. Here are some comparisons.
Diablo 2 has a good skill "tree" system and is pretty basic -- non-gamers
can pick it up in 20 minutes of play, and be successful. Baldur's Gate 2
is more complicated -- you control many characters, you can direct them all
to do very different things, you often HAVE to pause the game just to get
everyone into position and prepare. In fact, if D2 is a "click fest" then
BG2 is a "pause fest". If you get BG2, you will be much, much happier if
you do the tutorial.
Diablo is a vast, randomly-generated world, where maps and magic items are
different from game to game. Baldur's Gate is even bigger, but maps and
magic items are always the same. This isn't a problem. Here's why. D2 is
VERY linear. You MUST complete each quest in each act. In BG2, there are
so many quests -- I'll guess maybe 35 quests in Chapter 2 alone -- that
there is no way to do them all the first time. In many cases, the game
simply won't let you do all the quests, depending on choices you make.
Because of this, I'm actually finding BG2 more replayable. I've done it
three times now, and have had vastly different quests each time.
The graphics appear to be similar in quality at first, but in truth, I was
disappointed with the BG graphics compared to Diablo. The D2 look & feel
rates as "highly cool" with me, while BG2 rates as "crufty" at best. But
BG2 is less about graphic flash and more about story, anyway. So I rarely
notice. And BG2 lets me do something D2 cannot: play in 1024x768 or even
1600x1200 screen size. This is FAR better for strategic play, positioning
characters for ambushes, and so on.
Finally, in D2, you are a "hero" that saves the world. No matter what, you
have to complete the quests and vanquish evil. If you don't, the game
doesn't progress. In BG2, you are anything you wish. You can align
yourself with evil, help Bodhi slaughter innocent people, have filthy sex
with Viconia, and watch as the good NPCs in your party leave the group in
disgust. Or you can align yourself with good, rescue the "damsels" such as
Nalia and Aerie, build up a reputation for yourself, and watch as evil
characters drop out of your party in disgust.
You can tag along as haughty Anomen is accepted into his order and turns
"good", and then watch as his lame-ass father berates him. You can rescue
Valgayer and help him defeat his long-lost family, or stare at your screen
in stunned silence when you realize one of the NPCs has (ahem, small
spoiler) done something terrible to betray you. BG2 is more complex, more
interesting. If D2 is for item-hunters, BG2 is for explorers.
Barbarian X
"Anthony Boyd" <webwa...@my-deja.com> skrev i meddelandet
news:31gq7.24331$L%5.194...@news1.rdc1.sfba.home.com...
> "andrewjohnson" <andrew...@andrewjohnson.homechoice.co.uk> wrote:
>
> The graphics appear to be similar in quality at first, but in truth, I was
> disappointed with the BG graphics compared to Diablo. The D2 look & feel
> rates as "highly cool" with me, while BG2 rates as "crufty" at best.
Are you kidding? Non-LOD D2 looks awful! Actually I like the graphics in D1
better than in Non-LOD D2!
> ...have filthy sex
> with Viconia, and watch as the good NPCs in your party leave the group in
> disgust.
What are you talking about?
1: Sex with Viconia is not filthy. It's wonderful
2: there's only 2 npcs that can't stand Viconia as far as I know.
3: Sex with Viconia is NEVERNEVERNEVER
filthy!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
!!!!!!!
/S
The nth Drunken Immortal
"Anthony Boyd" <webwa...@my-deja.com> wrote in message
news:3sfq7.24076$L%5.193...@news1.rdc1.sfba.home.com...
> "The nth Drunken Immortal" <nth_drunk...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Infinetely better: BG2 has a plot comparable to Tolkein, talented voice
> > actors, multifaceted PC/NPC interactions including romance and
> > betrayal, an unparalleled range of D&D monsters, Forgotten Realms
> > heroes and locations and cannot be finished simply by Left click, left
> > click, left click, right click, >>SNIP<<
>
> Well, the newbie posted to a newsgroup populated by people who ARE buying
> and playing the game, so he should know he's going to get pro-BG replies.
> That said, let me try to be more evenhanded, as I like both.
He should have cross posted to alt.games.diablo2 then. :o)
> First, the talented voice actors -- I think this is the one thing that
> disappointed me the most, compared to D2. In D2, EVERYTHING has audio.
In
> BG2, it is often only the first line of dialog that is voice-acted. After
> that, it's just read, read, read.
You must admit that the two don't compare in this respect. There are no
battle cries in D2 (in particular those of Minsc and Boo) to make you smile,
no recognizable talent (Warner's Irenicus is the *ultimate* villain which is
created by his fantastic voice). It is misleading to say that EVERYTHING has
audio in D2 c/f BG2 when there are many times the number of dialogue choices
that can occur. Having all of these voice acted would be unnecessarily
expensive.
> Also, the dialog systems are, in my opinion, BOTH in need of taking ideas
> from the other. In D2, Cain can ramble on for a few minutes, like a
> monologue. In BG2, the complete opposite is true -- so much back and
> forth, oftentimes having to hit "continue" after just 3 or 4 words, and
> typically you do that 5 or 10 or 15 times before you get through the
> chatter. There needs to be a middle ground here.
OT: Planescape Torment suffers terribly from this, especially when so much
of the game revolves around exploring all possible dialogue options.
> Mr. Drunken Immortal has lots of common ground with me on two of his
> observations: Diablo 2 is a click-fest -- all you do is click on monster,
> kill monster, collect loot, sell loot. That's it. Repeat that over and
> over again, and you have D2. I still like it.
Each to their own I suppose. I did like D2 for a while, then I realised that
my mouse wasnt working as it should..... Having played BG2 however I would
not advise any of my friends to even bother with D2.
But BG2, while I wouldn't
> compare the plot to Tolkein, <snip>
SPOILERS
I think that in as much as all D&D is essentially derived from Tolkein's
works, and BG2 being a very faithful AD&D game with an epic plot it is
difficult for it not to be Tolkeinesque, no? I felt this especially when it
is revealed that Bodhi & Irenicus attempted to steal the essence of the tree
of life, as occured in one of the pre-middle earth novels (Melkior & a giant
spider IIRC). I didnt mean Tolkein in the sense of "the one ring", rather
the middle earth fantasy environment that he defined so well.
Anthony Boyd
> 1: Sex with Viconia is not filthy. It's wonderful
Filthy = wonderful
(if done right)
8^)
Barbarian X
Well Yesssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssss *L*
Craig Chambers
"The nth Drunken Immortal" <nth_drunk...@hotmail.com> wrote in
message news:9oc7qa$4f0$1...@enyo.uwa.edu.au...
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> I think that in as much as all D&D is essentially derived from Tolkein's
> works, and BG2 being a very faithful AD&D game with an epic plot it is
> difficult for it not to be Tolkeinesque, no? I felt this especially when
it
> is revealed that Bodhi & Irenicus attempted to steal the essence of the
tree
> of life, as occured in one of the pre-middle earth novels (Melkior & a
giant
> spider IIRC). I didnt mean Tolkein in the sense of "the one ring", rather
> the middle earth fantasy environment that he defined so well.
>
>
Two trees from which Arda (Middle-Earth + Valinor) gained light.
The white trees of the kings of Numenor/Gondor are descended from Telperion
(the moon tree).
I think that most fantasy tries to emulate middle-earth in many ways, look
at D&D Balor and Tolkien Balrog...
Craig Chambers
The nth Drunken Immortal
> I think that most fantasy tries to emulate middle-earth in many ways, look
> at D&D Balor and Tolkien Balrog...
>
> Craig Chambers
eggs-actly
Rough Rider II
"Craig Chambers" <craig-c...@line-one.net> wrote in message
news:9ocnti$c4v1c$1...@ID-79483.news.dfncis.de...
Luke Goaman-Dodson
news:9ocnti$c4v1c$1...@ID-79483.news.dfncis.de...
ways, look
> at D&D Balor and Tolkien Balrog...
Of course - this is well accepted among fantasy gamers/writers.
However, there is such a thing as over-doing it, and D&D IMO overdoes
it quite a lot.
What I really hate is the way the creators of D&D just dropped large
chunks of Tolkien into a pseudo-mediaeval environment, and then added
bits of RE Howard, Fritz Lieber, and even Jack Vance, creating a
completely unfocused game.