Freemasonry and College Honor Societies
Rami
I was wondering if there was a link between college honor societies (US) and
freemasonry. There seems to be some similarities in the general structure
of these honor societies and freemasonry..
Rami
Acacia Press, Inc.
A better place to investigate would be regular college fraternities. Their
basic structure and the initiation rituals, secret handshakes, etc.. map
quite nicely into Freemasonry. Some would suggest the entire American
college FRaternal system is of Masonic origin. I don't know if that is
true.
The American system can then be compared to the system used in the UK,
which included a very strong Masonic presence in the English Public
(actually private) Schools, which were ritualistic training grounds for
the administrators of the Empire. That system was also used in the former
British colonies to train ritualistically indoctrinated locals to serve
as an intermediate oppressor class.
As the Brits were forced out of their former colonies they often left
behind a MAsonic infrastructure of locals who took over the task of
repressive social control and exploitation of the general population.
Acacia Press, Incorporated
http://www.crocker.com/~acacia/index.html
PO BOX 656, Amherst, MA 01004
ri...@lcc.net
An then again, it could be that Freemasonry is attractive to the best and
brightest. The sam men who people respected for their uprightness of nature
and moral values. People respecting such men, many Masons found themselves in
a positin of leadership. They still do.
Richard Jackson, PM
Corrigan Masonic Lodge #1103 AF&AM
Corrigan, Texas
the best In article
<Pine.LNX.3.95.980327...@rmc1.crocker.com>,
-----== Posted via Deja News, The Leader in Internet Discussion ==-----
http://www.dejanews.com/ Now offering spam-free web-based newsreading
Christians Against Lucifer's Lodges
-- On Fri, 27 Mar 1998 13:05:44 -0600, ri...@lcc.net scribbled:
>->An then again, it could be that Freemasonry is attractive to the best and
>->brightest. The sam men who people respected for their uprightness of nature
>->and moral values. People respecting such men, many Masons found themselves in
>->a positin of leadership. They still do.
snip
If that is the case, they only have to visit here to see the best and
brightest....ROFLMBO!!!!!!!!! Yeppers, Guss, Rene, mykye (both of
them), etc. hehehe. Yep, they are the brighest and best freemasonry
has to offer....
have a nice day!
--
kwa...@Xiamerica.net (remove the X's)
http://cust3.iamerica.net/kwayne
tagline: DISHONESTY & DISTORTION are trademarks of freemasonry!
Acacia Press, Inc.
Anyone attempting to understand what American FReemasonry is all about
should look at the THE PROCEEDINGS OF THE UNITED STATES ANTI-MASONIC
CONVENTION Held in Philadelphia, September 11, 1830.
Thousands of Masons left the lodges when it became clear that Masons were
obstructing justice to defeat the investigation of the murder of William
Morgan. Numerous Masons familiar with the organization's obligations
documented the unethical famework used by the brotherhood.
While Masonic oaths have changed over the operational characteristics of
the organization remain the same. Masonry is a profoundly unethical
organization.
Here is an except from document
>>
The royal arch mason swears, "I will aid and assist a companion royal
arch mason, when engaged in any difficulty, and espouse his cause, so far
as to extricate him from the same, if in my power, whether he be right or
wrong. I will promote a companion royal arch mason's political preferment,
in preference to another of equal qualifications. A companion royal arch
mason's secrets, given me in charge as such, and I knowing him to be such,
shall remain as secure and inviolable, in my breast as in his own, murder
and treason not excepted, &c."
From the first obligation of the thrice illustrious knight of the cross,
the candidate under oath receives the following injunctions: "To the end
of your life, you will not, in consideration of gain, interest, or honour,
nor with good or bad design, ever take any, the least step or measure, or
be instrumental in any such object, to betray any secret appertaining to
the order and degree known among masons as the thrice illustrious order of
the cross: should you know another to violate any essential point of this
obligation, you will use your most decided endeavours, by the blessing of
God, to bring such person to the strictest and most condign punishment,
agreeably to the rules and usages of our ancient fraternity, and this by
pointing him out to the world as an unworthy vagabond, by opposing his
interest, by deranging his business, by transferring his character after
him wherever he may go, and by exposing him to the contempt of the whole
fraternity, and the world, but of our illustrious order more especially,
during his whole natural life: nothing herein going to prevent yourself,
or any other, when elected to the dignity of thrice illustrious, from
retaining the ritual of the order. Should any thrice illustrious knight,
or acting officer of any council, which may have them in hand, ever
require your aid, in any emergency, in defence of the recovery of the said
charge, your swear cheerfully to exercise all assistance in his favour,
which the nature of the time and place will admit, even to the sacrifice
of life, liberty, and property, &c." From the second obligation of the
same degree, the member receives the following injunctions: "You promise
to lead a life as upright and just, in relation to all mankind, as you are
capable of; but in matters of difference, to prefer the interests of a
companion of the order, of a companion's friend, for whom he pleads, to
any mere man of the world. You promise never to engage in mean party
strife, nor conspiracies against the government or religion of your
country, whereby your reputation may suffer, nor ever to associate with
dishonourable men, for a moment, except it be to secure the interest of
such person, his family, or friends, to a companion, whose necessities may
require this degradation at your hands, &c." From the third obligation of
the same degree, the member swears," To put confidence unlimited in every
illustrious brother of the cross,-- never to permit my political
principles to come counter to his, if forbearance and brotherly kindness
can operate to prevent it,-- to look on his enemies as my enemies, &c."
<<
for more information see the WWW site below.
ri...@lcc.net
In article <352cb88f...@news.iamerica.net>,
kwa...@DELiamerica.net wrote:
>
> -- On Fri, 27 Mar 1998 13:05:44 -0600, ri...@lcc.net scribbled:
>
> >->An then again, it could be that Freemasonry is attractive to the best and
> >->brightest. The sam men who people respected for their uprightness of
nature
> >->and moral values. People respecting such men, many Masons found
themselves in
> >->a positin of leadership. They still do.
> snip
>
> If that is the case, they only have to visit here to see the best and
> brightest....ROFLMBO!!!!!!!!! Yep
Dear Ken,
By your reasoning, everyone who is a Mason and gives his opinion is
representative of Masonry and the best Masonry has to offer? By your
reasoning then, you are the best conservative Christianity has to offer? I
hope neither is true.
When we give our viewpoints, individual Masons speak from a personal
viewpoint. Unless they are the Master of a subordinate Lodge or have been
requested to act on the Lodge's behalf, they can not speak for their Lodge.
The same goes for a Grand Lodge. Since Masonry is comprized of many Grand
Lodge Jurisdictions, each a separate entity, no Mason can speak for all.
If I am the best that Freemasonry has to offer, I am a poor representative
indeed. There are far more literate men in the Fraternity. I am simply one
with the time to look at the ng and resopnd to what I consider unjust or
misleading statements. Are you and others of your like the best yor religion
has to offer?
Richard Jackson, PM
Corrigan Masonic Lodge #1103 AF&AM
Corrigan, Texas
-----== Posted via Deja News, The Leader in Internet Discussion ==-----
Dan Mc Kenzie
Anyone looking to find valid, factual information on Freemasonry from Acadia
Press should also look to have their head examined. Much of what they tout
as fact is only opinion based on their fervent desire to sell out-dated and
frequently inaccurate books.
Dan McKenzie, FC
Harmony Lodge #18 F. & A.M.
Jurisdiction of the Grand Lodge of New Jersey
Acacia Press, Inc. wrote in message ...
>Anyone attempting to understand what American FReemasonry is all about
>should look at the THE PROCEEDINGS OF THE UNITED STATES ANTI-MASONIC
>CONVENTION Held in Philadelphia, September 11, 1830.
>
<snipped in an attempt to limit the waste of bandwidth in idiocy>
Alan J. Morgan
Acacia Press, Inc. wrote in message ...
>Anyone attempting to understand what American FReemasonry is all about
>should look at the THE PROCEEDINGS OF THE UNITED STATES ANTI-MASONIC
>CONVENTION Held in Philadelphia, September 11, 1830.
>
>Thousands of Masons left the lodges when it became clear that Masons were
>obstructing justice to defeat the investigation of the murder of William
>Morgan. Numerous Masons familiar with the organization's obligations
>documented the unethical famework used by the brotherhood.
>
A total untruth or better yet a lie!
>>>
>The royal arch mason swears, "I will aid and assist a companion royal
>arch mason, when engaged in any difficulty, and espouse his cause, so far
>as to extricate him from the same, if in my power, whether he be right or
>wrong. I will promote a companion royal arch mason's political preferment,
>in preference to another of equal qualifications. A companion royal arch
>mason's secrets, given me in charge as such, and I knowing him to be such,
>shall remain as secure and inviolable, in my breast as in his own, murder
>and treason not excepted, &c."
Again, a total untruth, as I am looking at the obligation and do not see
those words in it.
But what else can be expected from a "commercial" corporation who lies to
their own ISP. Here we have a case of a clearly "commercial" organization
using a "personal" account to sell their wares. This tactic allows this
"commecial" organization to pay a lower monthly fee thereby cheating their
ISP out of revenues. So instead of paying the typical $20.00 to $30.00 a
month additonal fees required of a "commercial" site to host a website, plus
the dial-in rates, they under the guise of a personal account sell their
wares for profit and rip their ISP off to the tune of several hundreds of
dollars.
Tom Krummell (E. Scrooge, Esq.)
Brethren and lurkers,
As Bro. Alan did, I checked the California ritual and find nothing even closely
resembling that which Acacia posted. Maybe this is their idea of the 1830
ritual; maybe it's a troll.
Whatever it is, it's wrong, wrong, wrong.
S&F,
Tom Krummell, Master
Roseville Lodge #222 F&AM
Roseville, CA
(Secretary of Roseville Chapter #146, Royal Arch Masons, too)
---------------------------
Alan J. Morgan wrote:
--
- The mockingbird can change its tune eighty-seven times in seven minutes.
Politicians regard this interesting fact with envy.
Christians Against Lucifer's Lodges
-- On Sun, 29 Mar 1998 12:03:22 -0500, "Dan Mc Kenzie"
<dan_mc...@SPAMFREEmsn.com> scribbled:
>->Anyone looking to find valid, factual information on Freemasonry from Acadia
>->Press should also look to have their head examined. Much of what they tout
>->as fact is only opinion based on their fervent desire to sell out-dated and
>->frequently inaccurate books.
snip
Anyone looking to find valid, factual information on the truth about
freemasonry from a mason should have their head examined. Masons have
taken a god-oath not to reveal certain parts of masonry, parts that
people need to know in order to form a honest and informed opinion
regarding masonry. They just aren't going to tell you the truth
about masonry....if you are gullible enough to accept the ole "trust
me" bit, then...hey, have at it.
have a very nice day!
Acacia Press, Inc.
On Sun, 29 Mar 1998, Tom Krummell (E. Scrooge, Esq.) wrote:
> As Bro. Alan did, I checked the California ritual and find nothing even closely
> resembling that which Acacia posted. Maybe this is their idea of the 1830
> ritual; maybe it's a troll.
>
> Whatever it is, it's wrong, wrong, wrong.
>
> Alan J. Morgan wrote:
>
Below is a partial list of the people who signed off on the THE
PROCEEDINGS OF THE UNITED STATES ANTI-MASONIC CONVENTION Held in
Philadelphia, September 11, 1830. Now I know the Masons will endevor to
smear the intentions of ALL these people, but the fact is the
'Proceedings' acurately document the Masonic oaths of the time and help to
explain why people left the Masonic lodges in the THOUSANDS.
Masonic favoritism and collective, sometimes violent, retaliation against
their enemies continues to this day.
Acacia Press, Incorporated
http://www.crocker.com/~acacia/index.html
PO BOX 656, Amherst, MA 01004
>>
MASSACHUSETTS. Henry Gassett, Moses Thacher, Abner Phelps, Joseph Morton,
Amasa Walker, Micah H. Ruggles, Stephen Oliver, Samuel B. Barlow, Pliny
Merrick, Gardner Burbank, Nathan Adams. Joseph Goffe, Alpheus Bigelow,
Jr., Lovett Peters, Nahum Harding, Nathan Lazell, Jr., Joshua Longley,
CONNECTICUT. Nathaniel Terry, Jonathan Nichols, Zalmon Storrs, Elisha
Stearns, Calvin Barber, Henry Perkins, John M, Holley, Noble R. Strong,
NEW YORK. Rates Cooke, Joseph Case, Henry Dana Ward, Caleb Green, Samuel
St. John, John L. Curtenius, Frederick Whittlesey, Vincent Whitney,
Francis Granger, John Ellis, Henry W. Taylor, Alexander Sheildon, Samuel
M. Hopkins, Herbert A. Read, George W. Stanton, John C. Morris, Robert S,
Rose, William Williams, Thomas Lawyer, Samuel P. Lyman, John Bogardus, W.
H. Maynard, William H. Seward, George H. Boughton, Elias Manchester,
Charles Starr, Samuel N. Sweet, David Bernard, John Williams, Lebbeus
Armstrong, Myron Holley, Thomas C. Green, Edward Bancroft,
PENNSYLVANIA. Amos Ellmaker, William Miles, John Clarke, Joseph Ritner,
James Patterson, Jr., Horatio G. Jones, David Potts, Jr., Peter Knepply,
William Rutherford, William Line, Daniel Rhoads, James Todd, Michael
Fackenthall, Jr., Charles Ogle, Ner Middleswarth, Harmar Denny, Ebenezer
Greenough, Samuel Davis, George Walker, Levis Passmore, John Kauffelt,
Nathaniel B. BoiIeau, Thaddeus Stevens, Alexander Plummer, William Brown,
Samuel Leidy, William W. Irwin, Samuel Parke,
VERMONT. William Slade, Allah Sabin, Augustine Clarke, Samuel C. Loveland,
Josiah Rising, Martin Flint,
RHODE ISLAND. Walter Paine, Jr., John Hall, OHIO. Robert Hanna, Isaac
Gillert, Frederick Wadsworth, Ebenezer Currier, Thomas M. Key, Daniel
Gillett, Thomas Boyd,
NEW JERSEY. James Vanderpool, David Schencb, Kllison Conger, Abner Morse,
G. P. M'Culloch, Abraham Brittin, John A. Ring,
MICHIGAN. Samuel W. Dexter,
MARYLAND. Ezra Slifer
<<
> Acacia Press, Inc. wrote in message ...
> >
> >Anyone attempting to understand what American FReemasonry is all about
> >should look at the THE PROCEEDINGS OF THE UNITED STATES ANTI-MASONIC
> >CONVENTION Held in Philadelphia, September 11, 1830.
> >
> >Thousands of Masons left the lodges when it became clear that Masons were
> >obstructing justice to defeat the investigation of the murder of William
> >Morgan. Numerous Masons familiar with the organization's obligations
> >documented the unethical famework used by the brotherhood.
> >
> >>>
> >The royal arch mason swears, "I will aid and assist a companion royal
> >arch mason, when engaged in any difficulty, and espouse his cause, so far
> >as to extricate him from the same, if in my power, whether he be right or
> >wrong. I will promote a companion royal arch mason's political preferment,
> >in preference to another of equal qualifications. A companion royal arch
> >mason's secrets, given me in charge as such, and I knowing him to be such,
> >shall remain as secure and inviolable, in my breast as in his own, murder
> >and treason not excepted, &c."
> ><<
> >
Acacia Press, Inc.
Anyone who is interested in learning more about why the British House of
Commons: Home Affairs Committe has recommended:
"police officers, magistrates, judges, and crown prosecutors should be
required to register membership of any secret society and that the record
should be available publicly,"
would be well advised to ignore the Sunday NYT article (frequently a good
idea) and look into the serious acts of corruption linked to the British
Masonic lodges. A good starting place is the WWW page shown below.
You would also be well advised to appreciate that Freemasonry in the
United States is no less powerful or corrupt. Masons like J Edgar Hoover,
Gerald Ford and Earl Warren were major players in burying the truth about
the Kennedy assassination. Masonic good-old-boys have positions
throughout the American security apperatus, including the CIA, FBI and
your local police.
ri...@lcc.net
In article <Pine.LNX.3.95.980330...@rmc1.crocker.com>,
>
> > As Bro. Alan did, I checked the California ritual and find nothing even
closely
> > resembling that which Acacia posted. Maybe this is their idea of the 1830
> > ritual; maybe it's a troll.
> >
> > Whatever it is, it's wrong, wrong, wrong.
> >
> > Alan J. Morgan wrote:
> >
>
> Below is a partial list of the people who signed off on the THE
> PROCEEDINGS OF THE UNITED STATES ANTI-MASONIC CONVENTION Held in
> Philadelphia, September 11, 1830. Now I know the Masons will endevor to
> smear the intentions of ALL these people, but the fact is the
> 'Proceedings' acurately document the Masonic oaths of the time and help to
> explain why people left the Masonic lodges in the THOUSANDS.
>
I will be glad to talk to any of the people you listed if they will talk to
me. I doubt that anything done then has a tremendous ammount of relevance to
what is occuring today.
Masonry has periodic fluxuations in total membership. Sometimes this occurs
due to outside repression by anti's. Many times the anti's use propaganda
techniques which include innuendo and outright fabrications. The ritual you
quoted is ritual from an organization which no Mason is required to join
anyway. It is true that to belong to it, a man must be a Mason, but no Mason
has to belong to it. Another example of propaganda techniques attempting to
use outdated data about one organization to support accuzations about another.
What was the average gross monthly income of Acacia Press last year? How much
corporate income tax did you pay? How much does your CEO make? Are you or
are you not a commercial enterprize that sells books? Is it in your best
interest to keep suspicion about Freemasonry high in order to continue selling
those books about Freemasonry? Why does not Acacia Press Incorporated
distribute all such information free of charge except production and handeling
if its real purpose is to inform the World of the evils of Freemasonry?
I await your answer with baited breath.
Edward Combs Jr.
There are no more crooks in Freemasonry than in any part of the
Government.......no less either!
...............
Alan J. Morgan wrote in message <6fn90a$i9e$1...@news.dreamscape.com>...
>
>Acacia Press, Inc. wrote in message ...
>>Anyone attempting to understand what American FReemasonry is all about
>>CONVENTION Held in Philadelphia, September 11, 1830.
>>
>>obstructing justice to defeat the investigation of the murder of William
>>Morgan. Numerous Masons familiar with the organization's obligations
>>documented the unethical famework used by the brotherhood.
>>
>
>
>
>>>>
>>arch mason, when engaged in any difficulty, and espouse his cause, so far
>>as to extricate him from the same, if in my power, whether he be right or
>>wrong. I will promote a companion royal arch mason's political preferment,
>>in preference to another of equal qualifications. A companion royal arch
>>mason's secrets, given me in charge as such, and I knowing him to be such,
>>shall remain as secure and inviolable, in my breast as in his own, murder
>>and treason not excepted, &c."
>
>
>those words in it.
>
>But what else can be expected from a "commercial" corporation who lies to
>their own ISP. Here we have a case of a clearly "commercial" organization
>using a "personal" account to sell their wares. This tactic allows this
>"commecial" organization to pay a lower monthly fee thereby cheating their
>ISP out of revenues. So instead of paying the typical $20.00 to $30.00 a
>month additonal fees required of a "commercial" site to host a website,
plus
>the dial-in rates, they under the guise of a personal account sell their
>wares for profit and rip their ISP off to the tune of several hundreds of
>dollars.
>
>>
bands
In article <Pine.LNX.3.95.980330...@rmc1.crocker.com>, "Acacia Press, Inc." <aca...@rmc1.crocker.com> wrote:
>"police officers, magistrates, judges, and crown prosecutors should be
>required to register membership of any secret society and that the record
>should be available publicly,"
>Acacia Press, Incorporated
>http://www.crocker.com/~acacia/index.html
>PO BOX 656, Amherst, MA 01004
>
>
>
well, if we did that then we wouldn't be oh - so - secret now, would we?
steven
Eugene Goldman.·.
On Sun, 29 Mar 1998 12:03:22 -0500, "Dan Mc Kenzie"
乙nyone looking to find valid, factual information on Freemasonry from Acadia
匕ress should also look to have their head examined. Much of what they tout
兀s fact is only opinion based on their fervent desire to sell out-dated and
口requently inaccurate books.
The below is every bit as accurate as our little friend's posts.
________________________________________________
Reposted quote from an unnamed, highly placed anonymous person (who wishes to
remain nameless to protect themselves from persecution)
A highly-placed official at Acacia Press laughed as he told me, We just put out
this material to get money from the suckers. There's a huge number of gullible
idiots who will believe any notion of conspiracy as a way to liven up their
dull, meaningless lives and find someone besides themselves to blame for their
troubles. We publish anti-Masonic material under the Acacia imprint, anti-CIA
stuff as Langley HQ Press, JFK assassination material under the TSBD name, UFO
blather as Roswell Publications, and so on. Nobody suspects we just make it up
and rake it in." One of the writers for the British "Victims of Masonic
Ill-Treatment" confirmed the story after a few pints at the local. "We swap
this material with the blokes in the States all the time. They have these
'supermarket tabloids' over there with all sorts of stories; we just rewrite
them to make Masons the villains, see? Never give real names, just call them 'a
wealthy solicitor' or a 'high court justice' and the Mrs. Gumps just eat it up.
Then we send it back to Americans and they rewrite it to their language. One
story's good for thousands of quid. And with no names ever mentioned--or at
least none but what's been in the press--no one ever sues for libel. Right,
guv?"
Other sources confirmed the ties between anti-Masonic publishing houses and
those selling neo-Nazi groups anti-Semitic literature.
There have also been allegations of ties to organized crime, which cannot fail
to be interested in a lucrative opportunity for skating on the edge of
legitimate business while affording means for laundering money from shadier
enterprises.
__________________________________________________
End of quoted text
Be well. Travel with a light heart.
Eugene Goldman P.*. M.*.
W.M. Black Mountain Lodge, #845, San Diego, Ca.
p.m. Blackmer Lodge #442, San Diego, Ca.
Southern Ca. Research Lodge
A.A.S.R., Valley of San Diego
May Brotherly Love forever prevail,
and every moral and social Virtue cement us.
If you can read this, you have gone too far!
Eugene Goldman.·.
<ROFL>
Oh, FINALLY! Our little friend Lew has given us the names of some more famous
antis. This will be SO helpful Now lurkers can compare the list, immediately
below, of well known Masons against Lew's list, at the bottom, of well known
individuals who left the fraternity of their own free will, and went on with
their lives. Compare and contrast, reader, what you know of the person and
Character of members of both groups. In who's company would YOU be more proud
to be found? Who would YOU rather be known to associate with? Who's
accomplishments do YOU admire more?
EXPLORES: Hiram Bingham (Discoverer of Machu Picchu), James Bruce (Discoverer of
the source of the Blue Nile), Adm. Richard E. Byrd, Christopher "Kit" Carson,
William Clark, Merriwether Lewis, and Robert E. Peary.
WORLD LEADERS: Emilio Aguinaldo (Phillippine Patriot and General), Miguel
Aleman (Mexican President 1947-52), Eduard Benes (President of Czechoslovakia
1939-48), Sveinn Bjornsson (1st President of Iceland), Napoleon Bonaparte (and
his four brothers), King Charles XIII (King of Sweden 1748-1818), King Edward
VII and King Edward VIII (Kings of England, 1901-10 & 36, respectively), Francis
I and Francis II (Holy Roman Emperors, 1745-65 & 1768-1806), Frederick the Great
(King of Prussia 1740-86), George I & George II (Kings of Greece, 1845-1913 &
1922-47), George IV & George VI (Kings of England 1760-1820 & 1820-30), Gustavus
VI Adolphus (King of Sweden 1792-1809), Kamehemeha IV and Kemehemeha V (Kings of
Hawaii (1854-63 & 1863-72) Leopold I (King of Belgium (1831-65), Peter the Great
(Emperor of Russia 1689-1725), William I (King of Prussia 1861-88), William II
(King of the Netherlands (1792-1849), William IV (King of England (1830-37) and
many others.
UNITED STATES PRESIDENTS: George Washington, James Monroe, Andrew Jackson,
James Polk, James Buchanan, Andrew Johnson, James Garfield, William McKinley,
Theodore Roosevelt, William H. Taft, Warren G. Harding, Franklin D. Roosevelt,
Harry S. Truman and Gerald Ford.
RELIGIOUS LEADERS: Bishop Carl J Sander (United Methodist Church), Rabbi
Seymour Atlas, Dr. James P. Wesberry (Former Exectuive director of the Southern
Baptist Publication Sunday), The Reverend George W. Truett (President of the
Southern Baptist Convention), The Reverend John A O'Brien, Ph.D. (Roman Catholic
Preist and professor of theology at the University of Notre Dame), Cardinal
Mariano Rampolla (Roman Catholic Cardinal), James C. Baker (Bishop, Methodist
Church, organized first Wesley Foundation in U.S.), Hosea Ballou (Founder,
Universalist Church), Robert E. B. Baylor (Baptist clergyman, founder of Baylor
University), Preston Bradley (founder of the Peoples Church), Father Francisco
Calvo (Catholic Priest who started Freemasonry in Costa Rica in 1865), Hugh I.
Evans (National head of the Presbyterian Church, U.S.A.), Most Reverend Geoffrey
F. Fisher (former Archbishop of Canterbury), Eugene M. Frank (Methodist Bishop),
Reverend Dr. Norman Vincent Peale (Methodist Episcopal minister and author)
Titus Low (President of Methodist Council of Bishops) Dr. Martin Luthor King,
Jessie Jackson (Operation P.U.S.H. and AME Baptist Church) and many others.
UNITED STATES PATRIOTS: Francis Scott Key (wrote our National Anthem), Ralph
Bellamy (wrote our Pledge of Allegiance), Paul Revere, John Paul Jones, Benjamin
Franklin, John Hancock, Patrick Henry and many others.
MILITARY LEADERS: Generals John J. Pershing, George Marshall, Douglas
MacArthur, Joseph Stillwell, Johnathon Wainwright, Curtis E. LaMay, Omar N.
Bradley, Henry H. "Hap" Arnold, Claire L. Chenault, Mark Clark, James Doolittle,
Admirals David G. Farragut (First Admiral of the U.S. Navy), Ernest J. King,
Richard Byrd and many others.
POLITICAL: Sir Winston Churchill, Randolph Churchill, Thomas Dewey, Everett
Dirksen, Fiorello H. LaGuardia, John Marshall, Barry Goldwater, Hubert Humphrey
and others.
SPORTS: Grover C. Alexander, Cy Young, Jack Dempsey, Arnold Palmer, Tyrus R.
"Ty" Cobb, Carl O. Hubbell, Christopher "Christy" Mathewson, Mordecai P.C.
Brown, Gordon "Mickey" Corchran, Avery Brundage, Albert "Happy" Chandler, Branch
Rickey, Knute Rockne and many others.
ENTERTAINMENT: John Wayne, Gene Autry, Ernest Borgnine, Joe E. Brown, Bob Burns,
Eddie Cantor, Charles D. Coburn, William F. "Buffalo Bill" Cody, Donald Crisp,
Cecil B. DeMille, Richard Dix, Douglas Fairbanks Sr., W.C. Fields, Clark Gable,
Arthur Godfrey, David W. Griffith, Oliver Hardy, Jean Hersholt, Harry Houdini,
Al Jolson, Charles "Buck" Jones, Harry Kellar, Harold C. Lloyd, Tom Mix, Dick
Powell, Will Rogers, Charles S. "Tom Thumb" Stratton, Richard B. "Red" Skelton,
Paul Whiteman, Ed Wynn, Darryl Zanuck and many others.
COMPOSERS: Irving Berlin, George M. Cohan, Wolfgang Amadeus Mozart, John Phillip
Souza, Richard Wagner, Franz Joseph Haydn, Franz Listz, and many others.
INVENTORS AND SCIENTISTS: Samuel Colt (firearms), Sir Alexander Fleming
(penicillin), Edward Jenner (vaccination) Simon Lake (first practical
submarine), John L. McAdam (Macadamized roads) and many others.
YOUTH ORGANIZATION FOUNDERS: Daniel Carter Beard (Boy Scouts), Frank S. Land
(International Order of DeMolay), William Mark Sexton (International Order of
Rainbow for Girls)
WRITERS: Robert Burns, Samuel L. Clemens (Mark Twain), Sir Arthur Conan Doyle
(Sherlock Holmes), Edward Gibbon (Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire), Edgar
A. Guest, Rudyard Kipling, Alexander Pope, Sir Walter Scott, Johathan Swift,
Lowell Thomas, Voltair and many others.
SCULPTORS: Gutzon Borglum and his son, Lincoln Borglum (together carved Mt.
Rushmore National Memorial), Johann G. Schadow (Prussian Court Sculptor) J. Otto
Schweizer and many others.
BUSINESS: Dave Thomas (Wendy's), John Jacob Astor (financier), Lloyd Balfour
(Jewelry), Lawrence Bell (Bell Aircraft Corp.), William H. Dow (Dow
ChemicalCo.), Alfred Fuller (Fuller Brush), King C. Gillett (Gillett Razor Co.),
Sir Thomas Lipton (tea), Fredrick Maytag, Andrew W. Mellon (banker), James C.
Penny, George Pullman, David Sarnoff (father of T.V.), Leland Stanford
(railroads - Stanford Univ.) and many others.
ASTRONAUTS: Ed Aldrin, Neil Armstrong, Gordon Cooper, Don Eisle, Virgil Grissom,
Ed Michell, Tom Stafford, Fred Haise, and Wally Shirra.
On Mon, 30 Mar 1998 05:04:19 -0500, "Acacia Press, Inc."
<aca...@rmc1.crocker.com> wrote:
€Below is a partial list of the people who signed off on the THE
€PROCEEDINGS OF THE UNITED STATES ANTI-MASONIC CONVENTION Held in
€Philadelphia, September 11, 1830. Now I know the Masons will endevor to
€smear the intentions of ALL these people, but the fact is the
€'Proceedings' acurately document the Masonic oaths of the time and help to
€explain why people left the Masonic lodges in the THOUSANDS.
€ Henry Gassett, Moses Thacher, Abner Phelps, Joseph Morton,
€Amasa Walker, Micah H. Ruggles, Stephen Oliver, Samuel B. Barlow, Pliny
€Merrick, Gardner Burbank, Nathan Adams. Joseph Goffe, Alpheus Bigelow,
€Jr., Lovett Peters, Nahum Harding, Nathan Lazell, Jr., Joshua Longley,
€Nathaniel Terry, Jonathan Nichols, Zalmon Storrs, Elisha
€Stearns, Calvin Barber, Henry Perkins, John M, Holley, Noble R. Strong,
€Rates Cooke, Joseph Case, Henry Dana Ward, Caleb Green, Samuel
€St. John, John L. Curtenius, Frederick Whittlesey, Vincent Whitney,
€Francis Granger, John Ellis, Henry W. Taylor, Alexander Sheildon, Samuel
€M. Hopkins, Herbert A. Read, George W. Stanton, John C. Morris, Robert S,
€Rose, William Williams, Thomas Lawyer, Samuel P. Lyman, John Bogardus, W.
€H. Maynard, William H. Seward, George H. Boughton, Elias Manchester,
€Charles Starr, Samuel N. Sweet, David Bernard, John Williams, Lebbeus
€Armstrong, Myron Holley, Thomas C. Green, Edward Bancroft,
€Amos Ellmaker, William Miles, John Clarke, Joseph Ritner,
€James Patterson, Jr., Horatio G. Jones, David Potts, Jr., Peter Knepply,
€William Rutherford, William Line, Daniel Rhoads, James Todd, Michael
€Fackenthall, Jr., Charles Ogle, Ner Middleswarth, Harmar Denny, Ebenezer
€Greenough, Samuel Davis, George Walker, Levis Passmore, John Kauffelt,
€Nathaniel B. BoiIeau, Thaddeus Stevens, Alexander Plummer, William Brown,
€Samuel Leidy, William W. Irwin, Samuel Parke,
€ William Slade, Allah Sabin, Augustine Clarke, Samuel C. Loveland,
€Josiah Rising, Martin Flint,
€Walter Paine, Jr., John Hall, OHIO. Robert Hanna, Isaac
€Gillert, Frederick Wadsworth, Ebenezer Currier, Thomas M. Key, Daniel
€Gillett, Thomas Boyd,
€James Vanderpool, David Schencb, Kllison Conger, Abner Morse,
€G. P. M'Culloch, Abraham Brittin, John A. Ring,
€Samuel W. Dexter,Ezra Slifer
€> >Thousands of Masons left the lodges when it became clear that Masons were
€> >obstructing justice to defeat the investigation of the murder of William
€> >Morgan. Numerous Masons familiar with the organization's obligations
€> >documented the unethical famework used by the brotherhood.
Be well. Travel with a light heart.
if_m...@candoitsoc.ani
-- On Mon, 30 Mar 1998 08:30:11 -0500, "Edward Combs Jr."
<eco...@worldnet.att.net> scribbled:
>->There are no more crooks in Freemasonry than in any part of the
>->Government.......no less either!
>->...............
snip
haha
-----------------------------------------------------------------
In order to dodge the spam bots, I disguise my email address with
an assortment of fake letters, as do others including masons.
To reveal my true email address, simply remove the X's from
Xkwa...@XiamericaX.net. Thank you.
tagline: DISHONESTY is a trademark of freemasonry!
if_m...@candoitsoc.ani
-- On Sun, 29 Mar 1998 09:53:50 -0600, ri...@lcc.net scribbled:
>->In article <352cb88f...@news.iamerica.net>,
>-> kwa...@DELiamerica.net wrote:
>->>
>->> -- On Fri, 27 Mar 1998 13:05:44 -0600, ri...@lcc.net scribbled:
>->>
>->> >->An then again, it could be that Freemasonry is attractive to the best and
>->> >->brightest. The sam men who people respected for their uprightness of
>->nature
>->> >->and moral values. People respecting such men, many Masons found
>->themselves in
>->> >->a positin of leadership. They still do.
>->> snip
>->>
>->> If that is the case, they only have to visit here to see the best and
>->> brightest....ROFLMBO!!!!!!!!! Yep
>->
>->Dear Ken,
>->
>->By your reasoning, everyone who is a Mason and gives his opinion is
>->representative of Masonry and the best Masonry has to offer? By your
>->reasoning then, you are the best conservative Christianity has to offer? I
>->hope neither is true.
You do have a problem with the english language.... I never said that
anyone who is a mason and offers his opinion is the best masonry has
to offer. You simply are trying to twist it or don't understand
english "good". My comment indicates that the best and brighest can
be found here....not that all masons who post here are such. get a
life....or better yet, go back to school.
>->When we give our viewpoints, individual Masons speak from a personal
>->viewpoint. Unless they are the Master of a subordinate Lodge or have been
>->requested to act on the Lodge's behalf, they can not speak for their Lodge.
>->The same goes for a Grand Lodge. Since Masonry is comprized of many Grand
>->Lodge Jurisdictions, each a separate entity, no Mason can speak for all.
All masons reflect on masonry. do you disagree?
>->If I am the best that Freemasonry has to offer, I am a poor representative
>->indeed. There are far more literate men in the Fraternity. I am simply one
>->with the time to look at the ng and resopnd to what I consider unjust or
>->misleading statements. Are you and others of your like the best yor religion
>->has to offer?
Ah, typical masonic tactic, when talking about the shortcoming of
masonry or masons, in a masonic newsgroup, the masons always want to
toss in something else like some other religion besides masonry.
Heck, you can't even discuss masonry here because as soon as you make
a vaild point about the evils within masonry, the masons typically try
to change the topic to scouting or some other religion.
The newsgroup ain't about whether or now Joe Blow is a good example of
scouting, or if Jack Frost is a good example of the SnowJob Lodge, but
rather masonry.....
if_m...@candoitsoc.ani
-- On Sun, 29 Mar 1998 05:43:26 -0500, "Acacia Press, Inc."
<aca...@rmc1.crocker.com> scribbled:
>->Anyone attempting to understand what American FReemasonry is all about
>->should look at the THE PROCEEDINGS OF THE UNITED STATES ANTI-MASONIC
>->CONVENTION Held in Philadelphia, September 11, 1830.
Thanks for posting that. However russ's posts is enough by
themselves to show what masonry is about..imo.
>->Thousands of Masons left the lodges when it became clear that Masons were
>->obstructing justice to defeat the investigation of the murder of William
>->Morgan. Numerous Masons familiar with the organization's obligations
>->documented the unethical famework used by the brotherhood.
Their "unethical" stuff is seen in this very newsgroup.
>->While Masonic oaths have changed over the operational characteristics of
>->the organization remain the same. Masonry is a profoundly unethical
>->organization.
I understand that not only have the oaths changed but so has the
symbolsim. Now they claim that the "G" in the compass and squeer
symbol means "god" or they generic "gaotu". However it used to mean
something else. "Goat" perhaps?
>->Here is an except from document
>->
>->>>
>->The royal arch mason swears, "I will aid and assist a companion royal
>->arch mason, when engaged in any difficulty, and espouse his cause, so far
>->as to extricate him from the same, if in my power, whether he be right or
>->wrong. I will promote a companion royal arch mason's political preferment,
>->in preference to another of equal qualifications. A companion royal arch
>->mason's secrets, given me in charge as such, and I knowing him to be such,
>->shall remain as secure and inviolable, in my breast as in his own, murder
>->and treason not excepted, &c."
I have seen numerous cases of a mason supporting a mason even if the
supported mason is blantly wrong. That typical masonic conduct is
nothing new. Heck, you've been in the newsgroup for a while, I'm sure
you've seen it for yourself. It's like the old "one will lie and the
other will swear to it" routine.
>->From the first obligation of the thrice illustrious knight of the cross,
>->the candidate under oath receives the following injunctions: "To the end
>->of your life, you will not, in consideration of gain, interest, or honour,
>->nor with good or bad design, ever take any, the least step or measure, or
>->be instrumental in any such object, to betray any secret appertaining to
>->the order and degree known among masons as the thrice illustrious order of
>->the cross: should you know another to violate any essential point of this
>->obligation, you will use your most decided endeavours, by the blessing of
>->God, to bring such person to the strictest and most condign punishment,
>->agreeably to the rules and usages of our ancient fraternity, and this by
>->pointing him out to the world as an unworthy vagabond, by opposing his
>->interest, by deranging his business, by transferring his character after
>->him wherever he may go, and by exposing him to the contempt of the whole
>->fraternity, and the world, but of our illustrious order more especially,
>->during his whole natural life: nothing herein going to prevent yourself,
>->or any other, when elected to the dignity of thrice illustrious, from
>->retaining the ritual of the order. Should any thrice illustrious knight,
>->or acting officer of any council, which may have them in hand, ever
>->require your aid, in any emergency, in defence of the recovery of the said
>->charge, your swear cheerfully to exercise all assistance in his favour,
>->which the nature of the time and place will admit, even to the sacrifice
>->of life, liberty, and property, &c." From the second obligation of the
>->same degree, the member receives the following injunctions: "You promise
>->to lead a life as upright and just, in relation to all mankind, as you are
>->capable of; but in matters of difference, to prefer the interests of a
>->companion of the order, of a companion's friend, for whom he pleads, to
>->any mere man of the world. You promise never to engage in mean party
>->strife, nor conspiracies against the government or religion of your
>->country, whereby your reputation may suffer, nor ever to associate with
>->dishonourable men, for a moment, except it be to secure the interest of
>->such person, his family, or friends, to a companion, whose necessities may
>->require this degradation at your hands, &c." From the third obligation of
>->the same degree, the member swears," To put confidence unlimited in every
>->illustrious brother of the cross,-- never to permit my political
>->principles to come counter to his, if forbearance and brotherly kindness
>->can operate to prevent it,-- to look on his enemies as my enemies, &c."
>-><<
>->
>->for more information see the WWW site below.
>->
>->Acacia Press, Incorporated
>->http://www.crocker.com/~acacia/index.html
>->PO BOX 656, Amherst, MA 01004
>->
>->
if_m...@candoitsoc.ani
-- On Mon, 30 Mar 1998 05:04:19 -0500, "Acacia Press, Inc."
<aca...@rmc1.crocker.com> scribbled:
snippers
thanks for posting that info. yes the mmm's will surely try to smear.
>->Below is a partial list of the people who signed off on the THE
>->PROCEEDINGS OF THE UNITED STATES ANTI-MASONIC CONVENTION Held in
>->Philadelphia, September 11, 1830. Now I know the Masons will endevor to
>->smear the intentions of ALL these people, but the fact is the
>->'Proceedings' acurately document the Masonic oaths of the time and help to
>->explain why people left the Masonic lodges in the THOUSANDS.
>->
>->Masonic favoritism and collective, sometimes violent, retaliation against
>->their enemies continues to this day.
>->
>->Acacia Press, Incorporated
>->http://www.crocker.com/~acacia/index.html
>->PO BOX 656, Amherst, MA 01004
>->
>->>>
>->MASSACHUSETTS. Henry Gassett, Moses Thacher, Abner Phelps, Joseph Morton,
>->Amasa Walker, Micah H. Ruggles, Stephen Oliver, Samuel B. Barlow, Pliny
>->Merrick, Gardner Burbank, Nathan Adams. Joseph Goffe, Alpheus Bigelow,
>->Jr., Lovett Peters, Nahum Harding, Nathan Lazell, Jr., Joshua Longley,
>->
>->CONNECTICUT. Nathaniel Terry, Jonathan Nichols, Zalmon Storrs, Elisha
>->Stearns, Calvin Barber, Henry Perkins, John M, Holley, Noble R. Strong,
>->
>->NEW YORK. Rates Cooke, Joseph Case, Henry Dana Ward, Caleb Green, Samuel
>->St. John, John L. Curtenius, Frederick Whittlesey, Vincent Whitney,
>->Francis Granger, John Ellis, Henry W. Taylor, Alexander Sheildon, Samuel
>->M. Hopkins, Herbert A. Read, George W. Stanton, John C. Morris, Robert S,
>->Rose, William Williams, Thomas Lawyer, Samuel P. Lyman, John Bogardus, W.
>->H. Maynard, William H. Seward, George H. Boughton, Elias Manchester,
>->Charles Starr, Samuel N. Sweet, David Bernard, John Williams, Lebbeus
>->Armstrong, Myron Holley, Thomas C. Green, Edward Bancroft,
>->
>->PENNSYLVANIA. Amos Ellmaker, William Miles, John Clarke, Joseph Ritner,
>->James Patterson, Jr., Horatio G. Jones, David Potts, Jr., Peter Knepply,
>->William Rutherford, William Line, Daniel Rhoads, James Todd, Michael
>->Fackenthall, Jr., Charles Ogle, Ner Middleswarth, Harmar Denny, Ebenezer
>->Greenough, Samuel Davis, George Walker, Levis Passmore, John Kauffelt,
>->Nathaniel B. BoiIeau, Thaddeus Stevens, Alexander Plummer, William Brown,
>->Samuel Leidy, William W. Irwin, Samuel Parke,
>->
>->VERMONT. William Slade, Allah Sabin, Augustine Clarke, Samuel C. Loveland,
>->Josiah Rising, Martin Flint,
>->
>->RHODE ISLAND. Walter Paine, Jr., John Hall, OHIO. Robert Hanna, Isaac
>->Gillert, Frederick Wadsworth, Ebenezer Currier, Thomas M. Key, Daniel
>->Gillett, Thomas Boyd,
>->
>->NEW JERSEY. James Vanderpool, David Schencb, Kllison Conger, Abner Morse,
>->G. P. M'Culloch, Abraham Brittin, John A. Ring,
>->
>->MICHIGAN. Samuel W. Dexter,
>->
>->MARYLAND. Ezra Slifer
>-><<
>->
>->> Acacia Press, Inc. wrote in message ...
>->> >
>->> >Anyone attempting to understand what American FReemasonry is all about
>->> >should look at the THE PROCEEDINGS OF THE UNITED STATES ANTI-MASONIC
>->> >CONVENTION Held in Philadelphia, September 11, 1830.
>->> >
>->> >Thousands of Masons left the lodges when it became clear that Masons were
>->> >obstructing justice to defeat the investigation of the murder of William
>->> >Morgan. Numerous Masons familiar with the organization's obligations
>->> >documented the unethical famework used by the brotherhood.
>->> >
>->> >>>
>->> >The royal arch mason swears, "I will aid and assist a companion royal
>->> >arch mason, when engaged in any difficulty, and espouse his cause, so far
>->> >as to extricate him from the same, if in my power, whether he be right or
>->> >wrong. I will promote a companion royal arch mason's political preferment,
>->> >in preference to another of equal qualifications. A companion royal arch
>->> >mason's secrets, given me in charge as such, and I knowing him to be such,
>->> >shall remain as secure and inviolable, in my breast as in his own, murder
>->> >and treason not excepted, &c."
>->> ><<
>->> >
>->> >for more information see the WWW site below.
>->> >
>->> >Acacia Press, Incorporated
>->> >http://www.crocker.com/~acacia/index.html
>->> >PO BOX 656, Amherst, MA 01004
-----------------------------------------------------------------
if_m...@candoitsoc.ani
-- On Mon, 30 Mar 1998 15:54:42 GMT, hypn...@ANTISPAM.pacbell.net
(Eugene Goldman.·.) scribbled:
>->
>->
>-><ROFL>
>->
>->Oh, FINALLY! Our little friend Lew has given us the names of some more famous
>->antis. This will be SO helpful Now lurkers can compare the list, immediately
>->below, of well known Masons against Lew's list, at the bottom, of well known
>->individuals who left the fraternity of their own free will, and went on with
>->their lives. Compare and contrast, reader, what you know of the person and
>->Character of members of both groups. In who's company would YOU be more proud
>->to be found? Who would YOU rather be known to associate with? Who's
>->accomplishments do YOU admire more?
snip
Oddly, the jewish-identity mason, hypnosis, failed to tell you about
the more famous masons like George Wallace....the Gov. who stood in
the doorway of the school blocking the entrance of Black kids to the
school. What was his motto? "Segragation Today, Segragation Tomorow,
Segragation Forever"? Haha. Oh, he didn't mention the great
founder of a racist cult and great contributor to the scottish rite,
Albert Pike of "morals and dogma" fame...required reading for all
masons. Oh, and then there was the traitor, Benedict Arnold...who
also was a mason. And of course he didn't mention his brother in the
newsgroup...the one who uses the racist "n" word. Ah, but in the
mind (cough) of hypnosis, it isn't what a man thinks but what he
does....
have a nice day.
Dan Mc Kenzie
Well said, Brother Gene. I had to wait 15 min. before replying... laughing
too hard to work the keyboard!
Dan McKenzie, FC
Harmony Lodge #18 F. & A.M.
Jurisdiction of the Grand Lodge of New Jersey
Eugene Goldman.·. wrote in message
<351fbdef....@pbinews.pacbell.net>...
>On Sun, 29 Mar 1998 12:03:22 -0500, "Dan Mc Kenzie"
><dan_mc...@SPAMFREEmsn.com> wrote:
>
>¤Anyone looking to find valid, factual information on Freemasonry from
Acadia
>¤Press should also look to have their head examined. Much of what they tout
>¤as fact is only opinion based on their fervent desire to sell out-dated
and
>¤frequently inaccurate books.
CMCLNSAY90
Oh ye Purveyors of Truth ---
I admit it -- WE
Hid the truth about the Roswell Incident --
Run the IMF --
Own the UN -- Definately a World Grand Lodge
Shot the Pope - Through our Bulgarian Lodges
Test Aircraft in the Desert (Area 51 is Actually - Skunkworks Lodge #51)
Shall I continue -------------------------
The sad part is --- they just might believe this.
CMCLNSAY90
I believe George Bush is a MM ? No?
Acacia Press, Inc.
Masons have abben adept at generating disinformation for a long time.
The British House of Commons: Home Affairs Committe is partially
successful in cutting through the rubbish and making a limited but
positive first step in controlling these secret societies. Their
recommendation is:
"police officers, magistrates, judges, and crown prosecutors should be
required to register membership of any secret society and that the record
should be available publicly,"
It is a simple positive first step toward registering ALL members of ANY
secret society member in a government job. Secret Societies and democratic
governmental structures are fundamentally incompatible.
Dan Mc Kenzie
Acacia Press, Inc. wrote in message ...
That's funny...I seem to recall Hitler, Mussolinin, and Stalin had similar
sentiments about Freemasonry. Hmmmmm....
Effy
It is also interesting to note that Masons and other similar organizatios
are specifically excluded from that law, and rightly so, since anyone that
knows anything about these groups realizes that they are not "secret societies"
but operate openly.
I must say that these newsgroups are interesting to observe from a
psychological point of view. Kind of a little mass hysteria and mob psychology
classroom. We can watch a couple people with an agenda and a platform at work.
The only bad part is that anything that is good and exerts a positive influence
on the world is likely to get smeared.
The bald fact of the matter is that all these groups that get smeared,
whether they be Masons, Fundamentalists, Jews, Christians, Muslims, Buddhists,
Hindu's, UFO'ers, etc, etc, etc. espouse high morals and ethics and are
populated by people that are loving, caring, moral, ethical people. When we
meet these people on a first hand basis they do not match the descriptions
given by the few wingnuts in here that have an agenda. While each of these
groups, from time to time, has no doubt had unscrupulous "wingnuts" operating
under guise of their names, it does not then follow that the group as a whole
subscibes to their agenda or that the "doctrine" of the group has changed.
The wingnuts zero in on any little negative thing they can find about a
group, expand and distort it, and then attribute that to the group as a whole,
ignoring all the good they have done. Everything reduces to Black or White with
them. Not seeing their own imperfections, they think everyone else is pure
evil. It reminds me of what Bertrand Russell said: "The whole problem with the
world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, but wiser
people so full of doubts."
Historically, these groups don't suffer much from these hateful attacks. If
a group is founded on strong rational principles, it manages to exist for long
periods of time. It is the few individuals, that the wingnut manages to
mislead, that suffer. They may miss their chance at sharing existence with a
group of wonderful people.
Ah well, I guess it's worth it as long as a book is sold.
---
Acacia Press, Inc.
>Date: Mon, 30 Mar 1998 15:37:23 -0800
>From: Effy <dex...@no-spamming.com>
>Subject: Re: NY Times on Freemasonry
>
> It is also interesting to note that Masons and other similar
>organizatios are specifically excluded from that law, and rightly so,
>since anyone that knows anything about these groups realizes that they
>are not "secret societies" but operate openly.
You are quite incorrect. The only group currently being targeted by the
House of Commons is the Freemasons.
If you want to undertand why the British House of Commons is being
compelled to act against the Masons visit the WWW site below. IT is a good
start.
Acacia Press, Incorporated
http://www.crocker.com/~acacia/index.html
ri...@lcc.net
In article <Pine.LNX.3.95.980330...@rmc1.crocker.com>,
> House of Commons is the Freemasons.
>
> If you want to undertand why the British House of Commons is being
> compelled to act against the Masons visit the WWW site below. IT is a good
> start.
>
> Acacia Press, Incorporated
> http://www.crocker.com/~acacia/index.html
> PO BOX 656, Amherst, MA 01004
>
>
You are telling a partial truth also. Freemasonry is being targeted by one
group in the House of Commons. It happens that in this case the squaking
wheel is getting the grease. The end result has yet to be determined.
Personally, I think the Grand Lodge could easily end this debate. Disarm the
loud mouth publicity hounds by publishing a list of all members and making it
available to the public. Of course, to do so might have disasterous
consequences in the future. Some of the first people to be killed if a despot
or military take over any country are the Freemasons.
How many books do you expect to sell with this ploy? I'll bet that if
we go to the www site, we'll find plenty of books published by Acacia
Press Inc. to buy for a price! Try it out you non-Masons. See if
this commercial enterprize is there to save the world or to make a
world of money
Richard Jackson, PM
Corrigan Masonic Lodge #1103 AF&AM
Corrigan, Tx
AnthonyMarsh
Edward Combs Jr. wrote:
>
> There are no more crooks in Freemasonry than in any part of the
> ...............
> Alan J. Morgan wrote in message <6fn90a$i9e$1...@news.dreamscape.com>...
> >
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >>>>
> >
> >
> >those words in it.
> >
> >But what else can be expected from a "commercial" corporation who lies to
> >their own ISP. Here we have a case of a clearly "commercial" organization
> >using a "personal" account to sell their wares. This tactic allows this
> >"commecial" organization to pay a lower monthly fee thereby cheating their
> >ISP out of revenues. So instead of paying the typical $20.00 to $30.00 a
> >month additonal fees required of a "commercial" site to host a website,
> plus
> >the dial-in rates, they under the guise of a personal account sell their
> >wares for profit and rip their ISP off to the tune of several hundreds of
> >dollars.
> >
> >>
> >>http://www.crocker.com/~acacia/index.html
> >>PO BOX 656, Amherst, MA 01004
> >
> >
How can you keep the percentage of crooks so exact? ;]>
It would seem that if you start to go under the percentage that you are
then obligated to illuminate enough supplicants to bring the percentage
up to par. On the other hand, if you exceed the percentage, what do you
do? Kill the excess? It must be a time-consuming job to keep the
percentage so exact. Whose job is that?
--
Anthony Marsh
The Puzzle Palace http://www.boston.quik.com/amarsh
AnthonyMarsh
Not even close, although quite a funny parody.
Actually, because you are anti-Christian you are not bound by the
commandment to not bear false witness, so please make up some more of
these diddies. They are hilarious.
Acacia Press, Inc.
On Tue, 31 Mar 1998 ri...@lcc.net wrote:
> In article <Pine.LNX.3.95.980330...@rmc1.crocker.com>,
> "Acacia Press, Inc." <aca...@rmc1.crocker.com> wrote:
> The only group currently being targeted by the
> > House of Commons is the Freemasons.
> >
> > If you want to undertand why the British House of Commons is being
> > compelled to act against the Masons visit the WWW site below. IT is a good
> > start.
> >
> > Acacia Press, Incorporated
> > http://www.crocker.com/~acacia/index.html
> > PO BOX 656, Amherst, MA 01004
> >
> >
>
> You are telling a partial truth also. Freemasonry is being targeted by one
> group in the House of Commons. It happens that in this case the squaking
> wheel is getting the grease. The end result has yet to be determined.
> Personally, I think the Grand Lodge could easily end this debate. Disarm the
> loud mouth publicity hounds by publishing a list of all members and making it
> available to the public.
You are absolutely right. Honest folk should have no fear of the light.
> Of course, to do so might have disasterous
> consequences in the future. Some of the first people to be killed if a despot
> or military take over any country are the Freemasons.
This makes no sense if Masonry is what the brotherhood claims to be, a
charitable organization in decline.
>
> How many books do you expect to sell with this ploy? I'll bet that if
> we go to the www site, we'll find plenty of books published by Acacia
> Press Inc. to buy for a price! Try it out you non-Masons. See if
> this commercial enterprize is there to save the world or to make a
> world of money
>
Allow me to reassure you. Acacia Press has been a loser as a money making
operation. This may change over time, but the principal objective is to
expose the organization to public scrutiny. I'm confident public awareness
will help the American people to understand the need to identify members
of secret societies, including the Mafia, Masons, KKK and OES, in
governmnent jobs.
> Richard Jackson, PM
> Corrigan Masonic Lodge #1103 AF&AM
> Corrigan, Tx
>
Eugene Goldman.·.
On Tue, 31 Mar 1998 09:44:18 -0500, AnthonyMarsh <ama...@quik.com> wrote:
刁ot even close, although quite a funny parody.
Just as accurate as Lew's offerings, yes.
乙ctually, because you are anti-Christian
Do you equate nonChristian with antiChristian, or is there some specific
statement I have made which causes you to make this accusation?
巾ou are not bound by the commandment to not bear false witness,
By what source do you claim to know by what I am "bound"?
山o please make up some more of these diddies. They are hilarious.
I did not "make this up", The article was previously posted to this very
newsgroup, about six or eight months ago. I read it, I liked it, it amused me,
and just as Lew does, I reposted it so it could be shared with others. I made,
and make at present, no claims of it's accuracy. In fact, I prefaced it with
the statement that I believed it to be every bit as accurate as Lew's posts.
I stand by that statement.
Believe it to be as you wish, it has every bit as much factual accuracy as Lew's
claims.
jwise@hal-pc.org@hal-pc.org
In <199803302121...@ladder03.news.aol.com>, cmcln...@aol.com (CMCLNSAY90) writes:
>I believe George Bush is a MM ? No?
Neither the ex-president (George H. W. Bush) nor the Govenor of Texas
(George ? Bush) is a member as of March 1998.
Jack Wise
PM, Jacques DeMolay Lodge No. 1390, AF & AM
Houston, Tx
Dan Mc Kenzie
AnthonyMarsh wrote in message <35210142...@quik.com>...
>Not even close, although quite a funny parody.
>Actually, because you are anti-Christian you are not bound by the
>commandment to not bear false witness, so please make up some more of
>these diddies. They are hilarious.
>
>--
>Anthony Marsh
>The Puzzle Palace http://www.boston.quik.com/amarsh
I have never heard Gene Goldman make a statement opposed to Christianity or
Christians. Your label of him as anti-Christian is at best inaccurate, and
at worst slanderous.
The prohibition against bearing false witness is one of the Ten
Commandments. Whereas Judaism, Christianity, and Islam all acknowlege Moses
as a prophet, any one sincerly practicing any of those faiths are equally
bound by that prohibition.
Dan Mc Kenzie
Acacia Press, Inc. wrote in message ...
>You are absolutely right. Honest folk should have no fear of the light.
>
Your implication that all Masons are dishonest is baseless and a perfect
example of the depths to which you will sink to make some money. As you
website clearly illustrates, you deal in inaccurate and often outdated
information, and your research is, at best, shoddy.
>> Of course, to do so might have disasterous
>> consequences in the future. Some of the first people to be killed if a
despot
>> or military take over any country are the Freemasons.
>
>This makes no sense if Masonry is what the brotherhood claims to be, a
>charitable organization in decline.
>
Based on past persecutions of Freemasonry bby the likes of Hitler,
Mussolini, and Stalin this is not an unreasonable concern. There does not
need to be a hidden agenda within Freemasonry for prosecution to occur, only
the specter of such an agenda is nedded. Unfortunatly, as long as there are
people like you at Acadia, reproducing and manufacturing half-truths without
doing the necessary research to establish the veracity of the same, the
possibility of the unonformed reaching erroneous conclusions about our
gentlr Craft is all too real.
>>
>> How many books do you expect to sell with this ploy? I'll bet that if
>> we go to the www site, we'll find plenty of books published by Acacia
>> Press Inc. to buy for a price! Try it out you non-Masons. See if
>> this commercial enterprize is there to save the world or to make a
>> world of money
>>
>
>Allow me to reassure you. Acacia Press has been a loser as a money making
>operation.
People from time immemorial have been able to make a buck capitalizing on
the fears of the ignorant. Wether or not it is ethical is a seperate
consideration.
> This may change over time, but the principal objective is to
>expose the organization to public scrutiny.
Rubbish. These self-proclaimed social crusades are NOT a not-for-profit
organization. As soon as there is no more money to be made in duping the
ignorant and frightened, I think their crusading zeal will fade quickly.
>I'm confident public awareness
>will help the American people to understand the need to identify members
>of secret societies, including the Mafia, Masons, KKK and OES, in
>governmnent jobs.
>
It is inaccurate and misleading to classify Freemasonry with the KKK. To the
best of my knowlege, neither the KKK nor the Mafia Contributes nearly
US$2,000,000 per day to charitable causes. Freemasonry does that every day.
How much did Acadia give today?
Dan McKenzie, FC
Harmony Lodge #18 F. & A.M.
Jurisdiction of the Grand Lodge of New Jersey
>
Dan Mc Kenzie
AnthonyMarsh wrote in message <352100BC...@quik.com>...
>How can you keep the percentage of crooks so exact? ;]>
>It would seem that if you start to go under the percentage that you are
>then obligated to illuminate enough supplicants to bring the percentage
>up to par. On the other hand, if you exceed the percentage, what do you
>do? Kill the excess? It must be a time-consuming job to keep the
>percentage so exact. Whose job is that?
>
>--
>Anthony Marsh
>The Puzzle Palace http://www.boston.quik.com/amarsh
Cute.
Insipid and snide, but cute.
Acacia Press, Inc.
On Tue, 31 Mar 1998, Dan Mc Kenzie wrote:
> Acacia Press, Inc. wrote in message ...
> >You are absolutely right. Honest folk should have no fear of the light.
> >
> Your implication that all Masons are dishonest is baseless and a perfect
> example of the depths to which you will sink to make some money. As you
> website clearly illustrates, you deal in inaccurate and often outdated
> information, and your research is, at best, shoddy.
>
I would agree most Masons don't believe they are dishonest, but then most
NAZIs were convinced they were doing the right thing as well. Masonic
dishonesty is wrapped up in a delusional understanding of what Masonry is
about and a willingness to embrace unethical conduct in the name of the
shared Masonic delusion.
At the top of the delusional pyramid are government thugs, like Mason J.
Edgar Hoover, and closet dope dealers, like Mason George Bush, both of
whom were willing to use the Mafia to advance their criminal agendas. But
these guys need the average Masonic airhead to help cover their trails or
crime in the name of brotherhood.
> >> Of course, to do so might have disasterous
> >> consequences in the future. Some of the first people to be killed if a
> despot
> >> or military take over any country are the Freemasons.
> >
> >This makes no sense if Masonry is what the brotherhood claims to be, a
> >charitable organization in decline.
> >
>
> Based on past persecutions of Freemasonry bby the likes of Hitler,
> Mussolini, and Stalin this is not an unreasonable concern. There does not
> need to be a hidden agenda within Freemasonry for prosecution to occur, only
> the specter of such an agenda is nedded. Unfortunatly, as long as there are
> people like you at Acadia, reproducing and manufacturing half-truths without
> doing the necessary research to establish the veracity of the same, the
> possibility of the unonformed reaching erroneous conclusions about our
> gentlr Craft is all too real.
>
Hitler did indeed outlaw the MAsons, but then Hitler was also funded by
the Mason Henry Ford, who went on to achieve the 33rd degree. Hitler
turned against Masonry because he correctly believed the organization
wasn't just a charitable social club, but a tool of British Imperialism.
Masonry has always been used by ruling classes as a tool for social
control. That fact is pretty much acknowledged by Royal Historical Society
Mason P. J. Rich. Hitler dumped the Masons and made his own ruling class
secret society. Big deal.
I will also point out that it is a long streach to suggest the Masons were
aggressive in defending the jews during WWII. FDR and Churchill knew what
was going on and didn't do much.
>
> > the principal objective is to
> >expose the organization to public scrutiny.
>
> Rubbish. These self-proclaimed social crusades are NOT a not-for-profit
> organization. As soon as there is no more money to be made in duping the
> ignorant and frightened, I think their crusading zeal will fade quickly.
>
I'm afraid you guys are the ones doing the duping. Masonry is a cancer on
the republic.
> >I'm confident public awareness
> >will help the American people to understand the need to identify members
> >of secret societies, including the Mafia, Masons, KKK and OES, in
> >governmnent jobs.
> >
> It is inaccurate and misleading to classify Freemasonry with the KKK. To the
> best of my knowlege, neither the KKK nor the Mafia Contributes nearly
> US$2,000,000 per day to charitable causes. Freemasonry does that every day.
> How much did Acadia give today?
>
Actually, the KKK and the Knights of Labor were post civil war spin-offs
from the MAsons. The leaders of both organizaions were known Masons. I
would also point out that many criminal groups donate money to charity.
The Cali drug cartel were active in charity. After you steal billions it
is easy to give millions. I'm sure NAZIs ran charities as well. Were they
the good guys?
> Dan McKenzie, FC
> Harmony Lodge #18 F. & A.M.
> Jurisdiction of the Grand Lodge of New Jersey
>
> >
Carl Meglan
Oh boy, here's another little piggy that gets "upset" by his singing
lessons.
Tsk Tsk Tsk ( Teaching an anti-mason the truth iws like teaching a pig
to
sing - it's not ever possible and besides, it annoys the pig.)
Take it to heart - No one will EVER take your anti-mason rantings
SERIOUSLY -
save those who have already bought into the anti-mason cause - Go pick
on an
Elk, a Moose, a Redman, a Granger or a Redman and see what happens -
False Witness occurs under sworn oath, friend - Hand on the Bible or
Koran
and other hand in the air toward God - Strange how things get twisted
and convoluted isn't it?
Have a great day!
Carl P. Meglan, PM
Secretary
Triangle Lodge #748 F&AM (Ohio)
AnthonyMarsh wrote:
> > Be well. Travel with a light heart.
> >
> > Eugene Goldman P.*. M.*.
> > W.M. Black Mountain Lodge, #845, San Diego, Ca.
> > p.m. Blackmer Lodge #442, San Diego, Ca.
> > Southern Ca. Research Lodge
> > A.A.S.R., Valley of San Diego
> >
> > May Brotherly Love forever prevail,
> > and every moral and social Virtue cement us.
> >
> > If you can read this, you have gone too far!
>
> Not even close, although quite a funny parody.
> Actually, because you are anti-Christian you are not bound by the
> commandment to not bear false witness, so please make up some more of
> these diddies. They are hilarious.
>
Eugene Goldman.·.
On Tue, 31 Mar 1998 15:10:06 -0500, "Acacia Press, Inc."
<aca...@rmc1.crocker.com> wrote:
儿 would agree most Masons don't believe they are dishonest, but then most
刁AZIs were convinced they were doing the right thing as well. Masonic
千ishonesty is wrapped up in a delusional understanding of what Masonry is
兀bout and a willingness to embrace unethical conduct in the name of the
山hared Masonic delusion.
I would agree mostAntis don't believe they are dishonest, but then most
NAZIs were convinced they were doing the right thing as well. Anti
dishonesty is wrapped up in a total and utter lack of comprehension of what
Masonry is about, a refusal to accept reality and a willingness to embrace hate,
slandar and "heavenly deception" conduct in the name of the shared anti
delusion.
人itler did indeed outlaw the MAsons, but then Hitler was also funded by
川he Mason Henry Ford, who went on to achieve the 33rd degree.
Ford "funded" hitler? Tell us, Lew, how did old Henry "fund Hitler" without
going bankrupt? Wars, particularly global ones, must be horribly expensive, and
for one man, even Ford, to fund an entire nation must have been a fantastic
operation.
Tell us also, while you are at it, how one individual's financial contributions
can be taken to represent a policy statement for an organization he happens to
belong to. As I recall, Ford was also a Scout, Eagle Scout if I am not
mistaken. Was Scouting also behind the nazi horrors? Really?
人itler turned against Masonry because he correctly believed the organization
已asn't just a charitable social club, but a tool of British Imperialism.
<ROFL>
I'm sure George Washington, James Monroe, Andrew Jackson, James Polk, James
Buchanan, Andrew Johnson, James Garfield, William McKinley, Theodore Roosevelt,
William H. Taft, Warren G. Harding, Franklin D. Roosevelt, Harry S. Truman and
Gerald Ford would have been amused to no end to learn that you consider them
"British Imperialists".
<ROFL>
Lew, you are a funny, funny guy.
乙fter you steal billions it is easy to give millions.
And how much have you and your anti-buddies given? Or haven't you stolen enough
yet?
Funnier by the day, Lew old buddy. Thanks for this one. We have a District
Officer's School comming up, and I was looking for some fresh jokes to offer.
Your post has saved the day.
Thanks.
Dan Mc Kenzie
George Bush is not and never was a Mason. Period.
The balance of the message is an opinionated, biased, and poorly thought out
sales pitch from a company out to make money off the fears of the
uninitiated. Criticize Freemasonry all you want...anyone who checks on the
facts will will find your info to be slanted, inaccurate, and frequently
inaccurate. Not to mention the fact that when they do discover the truth
about what you have to say, their next action is often to petition their
local Lodge for membership.
Who knows, if you keep this up long enough you may be credited by the
history books as helping to end the "decline" of Freemasonry...
Dan McKenzie, FC
Harmony Lodge #18 F. & A.M.
Jurisdiction of the Grand Lodge of New Jersey
Acacia Press, Inc. wrote in message ...
>Hitler did indeed outlaw the MAsons, but then Hitler was also funded by
>the Mason Henry Ford, who went on to achieve the 33rd degree. Hitler
>turned against Masonry because he correctly believed the organization
>wasn't just a charitable social club, but a tool of British Imperialism.
David Ryan
Bill Wiles wrote in message <3521b0c7.6912688@news>...
>First, George Bush is NOT (for you antimasons, I will repeat as you do
>not understand the first time) NOT(!) a Mason...he is (was?) a member
>of Skull & Bones...not freemasonry.
>Second, give me your definition of
>Secret Society since you seem to like using those words a lot. The
>only way you can add freemasonry to the list of Secret Societies is if
>you have a VERY broad and distorted definition.
Interesting.
Then why can one never gain a direct answer from Masons?
Most low level Masons are happy to tell people what you just did.
An upper echeolon Mason...never speaks.
Why do you suppose that is?
David Ryan
>
>Bill Wiles
Tom Krummell (E. Scrooge, Esq.)
Hi, David.
What good does it do for anyone to get straight to the point? Nobody wants
to hear the truth.
Just to set the record straight, the last President who was also a Master
Mason was Gerald Ford. Before that, Harry Truman and Franklin D.
Roosevelt. Lyndon B. Johnson was not a Master Mason, though he received
the Entered Apprentice Degree in 1938.
Bob Dole is a Master Mason. Bill Clinton is not, though he is a Senior
DeMolay.
Tom Krummell
Roseville, CA
-----------------------
David Ryan wrote:
--
- The mockingbird can change its tune eighty-seven times in seven
minutes. Politicians regard this interesting fact with envy.
Peter Jack
David Ryan wrote:
>
> Bill Wiles wrote in message <3521b0c7.6912688@news>...
>
> Interesting.
> Then why can one never gain a direct answer from Masons?
> Most low level Masons are happy to tell people what you just did.
> An upper echeolon Mason...never speaks.
> Why do you suppose that is?
>
> David Ryan
> >
> >Bill Wiles
Because, when you get really wise, you realize that all of the
stuff that comes out of the mouth is one's own personal opinion,
or the repeating of hearsay from another person's opinion, or
the regurgitation of what one has read, or one has overheard,
the passing of rumor, and so on. God has, in fact, made each
man very limited in his ability to obtain much information
through direct contact himself, and so no man can actually
know all the things he speaks of, about events transpiring,
nor of subjects and activities of others in diverse parts of
the larger society. But, within each man is the desire to be
thought of as more knowledgable than he really is, and to be
considered wise, but the problem is that he must be heard by
his fellow men, otherwise, how would they know? :)
When you reach the high levels of wisdom you obtain your
rewards elsewhere, but for the low mason, and people like
me, we talk to obtain our entertainment, for it's fun to
jostle with the views of the other. We learn how other
people think, and they see how we think, and we don't
mind the contradictory things that we say upon occasion,
because all dialog is contradictory on some level of
understanding.
So, for some, the art is to learn how to lower your
sights in order to be able to talk.
Think about it, how many men are in the room when a
mason takes his vows? Those are the only ones that know.
Everyone else is spouting beliefs.
p
nosp...@nospam.bot
-- On Tue, 31 Mar 1998 23:24:07 GMT, hypn...@ANTISPAM.pacbell.net
(Eugene Goldman.·.) scribbled:
snip
>->I would agree mostAntis don't believe they are dishonest, but then most
>->NAZIs were convinced they were doing the right thing as well. Anti
>->dishonesty is wrapped up in a total and utter lack of comprehension of what
>->Masonry is about, a refusal to accept reality and a willingness to embrace hate,
>->slandar and "heavenly deception" conduct in the name of the shared anti
>->delusion.
snip
Since hypnosis is of the jewish-identity? crowd, let's take a look at
his crowd via the words from the Bible (that most masons take their
oaths on).
Matthew 27:24-AV When Pilate saw that he could prevail nothing,
but [that] rather a tumult was made, he took water, and washed
[his] hands before the multitude, saying, I am innocent of the
blood of this just person: see ye [to it].
Matthew 27:25-AV Then answered all the people, and said, His
blood [be] on us, and on our children.
Matthew 21:15-AV And when the chief priests and scribes saw the
wonderful things that he did, and the children crying in the
temple, and saying, Hosanna to the Son of David; they were sore
displeased,
Matthew 26:59-AV Now the chief priests, and elders, and all the
council, sought false witness against Jesus, to put him to death;
Matthew 27:12-AV And when he was accused of the chief priests and
elders, he answered nothing.
When it comes to speaking about slander, hate, deception and delusion,
ole hypnosis seems to be in the right group?....unless they've changed
their colors? Millions of people consider the One, that was lied
upon, slandered, and delivered up to (and cried out for) execution, as
God in the flesh..... Note, according to the Bible, these people
were jews, which hypnosis also is, is that not correct hypnosis? Now
with a background like that, he dares to speak about someone else and
use terms like "slander", "hate", "deception" and "delusion"?
Whether one believes that Christ was God incarnate in the flesh isn't
the issue, but rather the fact that certain people had no problem
using slander and delusion to spew their hate against an innocent
person. Perhaps hypnosis will tell us that his group has changed it's
views or, perhaps, offer an apology for their actions. I heard that
a certain people is requesting the an apology from the
Pope.....perhaps they could give one.....what about hypnopsis?
Unless hypnosis offers an apology or disclaims any connection with
those jewish people, then I feel that he has no honest right to point
the finger of hate and slander at anyone else.
nosp...@nospam.bot
-- On Tue, 31 Mar 1998 12:36:17 -0500, "Dan Mc Kenzie"
<dan_mc...@SPAMFREEmsn.com> scribbled:
snip
>->I have never heard Gene Goldman make a statement opposed to Christianity or
>->Christians. Your label of him as anti-Christian is at best inaccurate, and
>->at worst slanderous.
Kinda hard not to be anti-Christianity if one is of the jewish
religion, have you not read the Bible (that most masons take their
oaths on) and what those of the jewish religion did to the "Christ" of
Christianty. The jews want the Pope to apologize for not doing
enough during the supposedly holocaut.....wonder if the jews would
apologize to the Christians for what they did to Christ?
Gene Goldman
On Tue, 31 Mar 1998 12:36:17 -0500, "Dan Mc Kenzie"
§I have never heard Gene Goldman make a statement opposed to Christianity or
§Christians.
Of course not, I have never made any such statement. Nor would I. Personally I
think Christianity is a beautiful (if sometimes confusing <s>) religion.
§Your label of him as anti-Christian is at best inaccurate, and
§at worst slanderous.
No, it is born of hate. Some people, claiming to be Christian because it gives
them an air of veracity, believe anyone who does not share their
narrowly-defined beliefs must, therefore, be against them. Some of them go so
far as to attribute blame for the very foundation of Christianity, the actions
of a dozen or so individuals two thousand years ago, on an entire religion - as
if those who are members of that religion were somehow involved.
If this sort of behavior were directed at a group who shared a different skin
color, instead of a religion, it would obviously, easily and correctly be labled
bigotry. The hate with which some antis speak of others, who differ from them
in opinion, political, religious or otherwise, is sometimes shocking.
Slander and innacuracy are nothing new to antis such as this. Hate is his stock
in trade, evidenced by his feeble attempts to blame an entire group for the
actions of a very few, or to attribute characteristics to an entire group that
are not there in reality. Hate like this, I find best to ignore, for to
confront it seems to just fuel it. Antis like this are not willing to see the
truth, are not willing to accept reality, will not even try to have an open mind
about anyone or anything. The only thing the world can do is keep loving them
in spite of the hate burning inside them, keep looking after those of them
unable or unwilling to earn their own way in the world, keep others safe from
them and the harm they intend toward others, and let them vent.
Better they vent, even (or particularly) here, than that they start passing out
the poison cool-aid or hale-bop jello, or start killing more federal agents
trying to serve a warrant.
Be well. Travel with a light heart.
Y.I.S.
In Waimachtendink
Gene Goldman
Blackmer Lodge #442, San Diego, Ca. (p.*. m.*.)
Black Mountain Masonic Lodge, #845 (W.*. M.*.)
Southern Ca. Research Lodge
A.A.S.R., Valley of San Diego
Can you imagine a world without hypothetical situations?
I can be found on ICQ
-- There are a few Masons
using ICQ as an effective communication tool!
Join us!
Bill Wiles
"Acacia Press, Inc." <aca...@rmc1.crocker.com> wrote:
> like Mason George Bush, both of
First, George Bush is NOT (for you antimasons, I will repeat as you do
not understand the first time) NOT(!) a Mason...he is (was?) a member
of Skull & Bones...not freemasonry. Second, give me your definition of
Secret Society since you seem to like using those words a lot. The
only way you can add freemasonry to the list of Secret Societies is if
you have a VERY broad and distorted definition.
Bill Wiles
Dan Mc Kenzie
Hello David,
In my experience as a Mason, I have found that there is a lot of
misinformation, and quite a bit of blatant misrepresentation, about
Freemasonry. Some people (either through a genuine lack of info or through
having been exposed to erroneous information) develop an unfavorable opinion
of our gentle Craft.
Some will ask genuine questions seeking genuine anwsers, while others look
to find you making a statement linking Freemasonry to the Kennedy
assasination, or British imperialism, or Satanism ,or whatever else happens
to be their personal embodyment of evil.
I can only assure you that after dealing with a couple of people from the
second category (usually referred to in the ng's as "anti's") that it gets
rather boring.
I, personally, petitioned the Lodge bcause I knew of their extensive
involvement in charitable work and of their views that embrace both a love
of God and a tolerance for each man's way to understand, approach, and serve
him. I have been accused by association of being: inherently dishonest, a
buggerer, a pornogropher, a murderer, a Luciferian (whatever that is), and
part of a plot to take over the world.
So I suppose that it is only reasonable that some (many?) Masons are
reluctant to enter a discussion about Freemasonry untill they have a feel
for the charecter and motives of the other party involved. I think you will
find that once it is understood that you intrest is recieving a genuine
anwser to a genuine question that most of us will be rather forthcoming,
within the bounds of our obligations.
I sincerely hope that I've been helpful.
Dan McKenzie, FC
Harmony Lodge #18 F. & A.M.
Jurisdiction of the Grand Lodge of New Jersey
David Ryan wrote in message <6fse5o$c...@examiner.concentric.net>...
>
>Bill Wiles wrote in message <3521b0c7.6912688@news>...
>
>>First, George Bush is NOT (for you antimasons, I will repeat as you do
>>not understand the first time) NOT(!) a Mason...he is (was?) a member
>>of Skull & Bones...not freemasonry.
>>Second, give me your definition of
>>Secret Society since you seem to like using those words a lot. The
>>only way you can add freemasonry to the list of Secret Societies is if
>>you have a VERY broad and distorted definition.
>
Geoffrey J. Transom
Carl Meglan wrote:
> Teaching an anti-mason the truth is like teaching a pig
> to sing - it's not ever possible and besides, it annoys the pig.
I like that! It reminds me of something which was on Blackadder (a British
comedy with Rowan Atkinson), where Samual Johnson (compiler of perhaps the
first english dictionary) was asked if he had made a copy of his dictionary.
He replied:
"That, Sir, would be like fitting wheels to a tomato: time-consuming, and
utterly pointless!"
ditto educating the anti, n'est-ce pas? I can't remember which philosopher
said that one can't claim an antiphilosophy as a philosophy, because
antiphilosophy is a method of _not_ thinking about an issue. (Gurdjieff,
maybe)
Regards,
S&F
Geoffrey.
___________________________________________________________
Geoffrey J. Transom
Centre of Policy Studies
Faculty of Economics
Monash University
AUSTRALIA
___________________________________________________________
David Ryan
Tom Krummell (E. Scrooge, Esq.) wrote in message
<3521D7DB...@ix.netcom.com>...
>Hi, David.
>
>What good does it do for anyone to get straight to the point? Nobody wants
>to hear the truth.
Sometimes I actually *do* look for the USA Today version of things.
You can't delve deeply into all of the stuff you read in the NGs.
You know, straight to the point in a slanted/biased/short ill-informed
manner.
>
>Just to set the record straight, the last President who was also a Master
>Mason was Gerald Ford. Before that, Harry Truman and Franklin D.
>Roosevelt. Lyndon B. Johnson was not a Master Mason, though he received
>the Entered Apprentice Degree in 1938.
Facinating!
>
>Bob Dole is a Master Mason. Bill Clinton is not, though he is a Senior
>DeMolay.
Oh I like that.
That's one for quoting.
" BOB DOLE IS A MASTER MASON. BILL CLINTON IS NOT, THOUGH HE IS A SENIOR
DeMolay".
Yeah I like that one.
################
David Ryan
AnthonyMarsh
AnthonyMarsh wrote:
>
> Eugene Goldman.·. wrote:
> >
> >
> > W.M. Black Mountain Lodge, #845, San Diego, Ca.
> > Southern Ca. Research Lodge
> > A.A.S.R., Valley of San Diego
> >
> > and every moral and social Virtue cement us.
> >
>
> Actually, because you are anti-Christian you are not bound by the
> commandment to not bear false witness, so please make up some more of
> these diddies. They are hilarious.
>
> --
> Anthony Marsh
> The Puzzle Palace http://www.boston.quik.com/amarsh
Gee, I would have thought that these Masons might have appreciated my
complimenting them on their humor. But instead of getting a thank you
for my compliment, I instead received a threatening e-mail from one of
them. And they claim that they are non-violent and promote brotherhood?
Well, maybe amongst themselves, but certainly not in the unwashed masses
they wish to enslave.
David Ryan
Dan Mc Kenzie wrote in message <6fsm28$hrc$1...@usenet56.supernews.com>...
>Hello David,
>
>In my experience as a Mason, I have found that there is a lot of
>misinformation, and quite a bit of blatant misrepresentation, about
>Freemasonry. Some people (either through a genuine lack of info or through
>having been exposed to erroneous information) develop an unfavorable
opinion
>of our gentle Craft.
Probably the latter.
I classify it along with Scientology in that I have a negative opinion but
couldn't tell you why if asked.
I had those opinions long before I found Usenet.
I don't develop predjudices easily, so it had to be something that was said,
but it somehow wound up in the conspiracy storage partition of my mind...
>
>Some will ask genuine questions seeking genuine anwsers, while others look
>to find you making a statement linking Freemasonry to the Kennedy
>assasination, or British imperialism, or Satanism ,or whatever else happens
>to be their personal embodyment of evil.
Yes.
Those are my vague recollections.
Everything lumped together.
It obviously wasn't very important to me at the time or my retention would
have been much sharper.
>
>I can only assure you that after dealing with a couple of people from the
>second category (usually referred to in the ng's as "anti's") that it gets
>rather boring.
Seems fairly equally divided to me.
I just choose the wrong threads.
Surely it is a random thing?
Otherwise...
>
>I, personally, petitioned the Lodge bcause I knew of their extensive
>involvement in charitable work and of their views that embrace both a love
>of God and a tolerance for each man's way to understand, approach, and
serve
>him. I have been accused by association of being: inherently dishonest, a
>buggerer, a pornogropher, a murderer, a Luciferian (whatever that is), and
>part of a plot to take over the world.
I at one time was a member of both the NRA and ACLU at the same time.
Go figure that one out.
Turns out that they're BOTH wacked out.
>
>So I suppose that it is only reasonable that some (many?) Masons are
>reluctant to enter a discussion about Freemasonry untill they have a feel
>for the charecter and motives of the other party involved.
I don't have any alterior motives.
I just have occasion to spend a bit of time on the machine for the next few
days and I want to learn a more about Freemasonry.
>I think you will
>find that once it is understood that you intrest is recieving a genuine
>anwser to a genuine question that most of us will be rather forthcoming,
>within the bounds of our obligations.
What are the bounds of obligations?
Are they personal restrictions or mandated?
In other words, are there secret rituals and laws like the Mormons?
I guess it's the cloak of secrecy that also leaves a negative connotation in
my mind.
>
>I sincerely hope that I've been helpful.
Yes, thank you very much.
Dave
Jim Bennie
In <351F31C6...@ix.netcom.com>, "Tom Krummell (E. Scrooge, Esq.)"
<tom...@ix.netcom.com> wrote:
> Brethren and lurkers,
> As Bro. Alan did, I checked the California ritual and find nothing even
closely
> resembling that which Acacia posted. Maybe this is their idea of the 1830
> ritual; maybe it's a troll.
> Whatever it is, it's wrong, wrong, wrong.
Tom, as I may have mentioned here before the RA ceremony is quite
different here in most of Canada west of the Atlantic than what you
have in the US, and having given the obl. for the last two years in
Chapter, I can tell you it aint anything like anything up here.
Judging by the fact it was revealed at some Anti-Mason convention,
maybe it's the "Anti-Royal Arch" obligation :)
Jim Bennie, IPZ, Joppa No. 31 (RA), Vancouver
bands
>>...Acacia Press has been a loser..blah blah blah....
>>will help the American people to understand the need to identify members
>
>>of secret societies, including the Mafia, Masons, KKK and OES, in
Not too good at being secret if you know about them, eh?
Steven
Eugene Goldman.·.
On Tue, 31 Mar 1998 23:03:50 -0500, "David Ryan" <da...@maybelater.com> wrote:
儿nteresting.
三hen why can one never gain a direct answer from Masons?
刀ost low level Masons are happy to tell people what you just did.
乙n upper echeolon Mason...never speaks.
上hy do you suppose that is?
<ROFL>
Never speaks? <LOL>
That is a good one. Oh, wait a minute. "Upper echelon? I see. Allow me to
explain the error in your concept. The fraternity of Freemasonry has a concept
called equality. No one is "higher echeolon" than anyone else. We all meet on
the level, just as we were when born, and as we will be when we pass on to that
which awaits us. Even Officers, presiding or otherwise, of Lodges or entire
Jurisdictions are no "higher echeolon" than anyone else. They are simply
charged with the *temporary* responsibility for seeing to certain administrative
tasks.
No one can speak "for Masonry", not even a Grand Master. A Grand Master *may*
speak for HIS jurisdiction alone, and then only on matters of the fraternity.
Even then, he speaks for his term alone.
All ANY Mason may do is speak for themselves, express their thoughts, personal
and individual. Authoritative to their own personal experience and opinions,
any and all are free to express themselves.
Let us read what several Masons, whose names you might recognise, have to say
about *their own DIRECT experiences* vis: Freemasonry. No rumor, no inuendo, no
"someone told me". First hand accounts, each and every one. Based on personal
experience. Each and every one a Mason. Each and every one on the same
"echelon" as every other Mason in the world.
____________________________________________________
-- Bishop Carl J. Sanders
United Methodist Church
"In a day of mistrust, suspicion, discrimination, separation and even
hatred, Freemasonry removes the distance between men. Friendship,
morality, and brotherly love are the hallmarks of our relationships.
There is a basic integrity in the Fraternity so often lacking in many of
life's relationships.... Let me quickly and emphatically say that
Freemasonry is not and has never been a religion; however, Freemasonry
has always been a friend and ally of religion. In 50 years as a
minister and as a Mason, I have found no conflict between my Masonic
beliefs and the Christian faith."
________________________________________________________
-- The Reverend Dr. Norman Vincent Peale
"Freemasonry is, for its members, a supplement to good living which has
enhanced the lives of millions who have entered its doors. Though it is
not a religion, as such, it supplements faith in God the Creator. It is
supportive of morality and virtue.... I think that a good Mason is made
even more faithful to the tenets of his faith by his membership in the
Lodge."
_______________________________________________________
-- Dr. James P. Wesberry
Former Executive Director and Editor of
the Southern Baptist Publication "Sunday"
"I have had the privilege of being a member of many organizations, but
none outside of my church has meant more to me than Masonry.... All
Masons obligate themselves to help, aid and assist the poor, the
distressed, the widows and orphans. Nor is charity restricted to fellow
Masons only, but extended to all. It shares the common bonds of race as
children of one great Creator, and seeks to unite men of every race,
color, sect and opinion. Masonry practices the Golden Rule and seeks
always to eliminate divisive forces which build walls between people."
_______________________________________________________
-- Rabbi Seymour Atlas
"I was brought up in a religious home, a son of a Rabbi with seven
generations of Rabbis preceding me; and yet with this religious
background, I felt I could still derive much from and give much to this
Fraternity for the good and welfare of mankind.... My experience has
shown me that Masons are for the most part religious men. I am proud to
be a Mason and proud to be a part of an organization that is devoted to
helping widows and orphans primarily, and also those who are in need
without question or embarrassment.... I am proud to be a Mason who
believes in the dignity of God's children and opposes hatred and
bigotry, and stands for truth, justice, kindness, integrity and
righteousness for all."
__________________________________________________________
It's Great To Be A Freemason
By Danny Thomas, 33*
The years found me an admirer of the great work the Masonic Order has
been doing in making this world a better place for all of us to live.
I have, for a long time, desired to be one of you and rejoice that now
I can proudly boast of my membership in one of the world's greatest
fraternal associations. I am grateful for those individuals who have
in quiet ways motivated me in my work on behalf of unfortunate
children. I am grateful for the high moment in my life when the doors
of Freemasonry were opened to me. Since then I have had many pleasant
times of fraternal fellowship and even opportunities for service in
the work of many branches of Freemasonry.
______________________________________________________
When is a man a Mason?
by
Rev. Joseph Fort Newton (Master Mason)
When he can look out over the rivers, the hills, and the far horizon
with a profound sense of his own littleness in the vast scheme of
things, and yet have faith, hope, and courage-which is the root of
every virtue.
When he knows that down in his heart every man is as noble, as vile,
as divine, as diabolic, and as lonely as himself, and seeks to know,
to forgive, and to love his fellowman.
When he knows how to sympathize with men in their sorrows, yea, even
in their sins-knowing that each man fights a hard fight against many
odds.
When he has learned how to make friends and to keep them, and above
all how to keep friends with himself.
When he loves flowers, can hunt birds without a gun, and feels the
thrill of an old forgotten joy when he hears the laugh of a little
child.
When he can be happy and high-minded amid the meaner drudgeries of
life.
When star-crowned trees and the glint of sunlight on flowing waters
subdue him like the thought of one much loved and long dead.
When no voice of distress reaches his ears in vain, and no hand seeks
his aid without response.
When he finds good in every faith that helps any man to lay hold of
divine things and sees majestic meanings in life, whatever the name of
that faith may be.
When he can look into a wayside puddle and see something beyond mud,
and into the face of the most forlorn fellow mortal and see something
beyond sin.
When he knows how to pray, how to love, how to hope.
When he has kept faith with himself, with his fellowman, and with his
God; in his hands a sword for evil, in his heart a bit of a song-glad
to live, but not afraid to die!
Such a man has found the only real secret of Masonry, and the one
which it is trying to give to all the world.
_______________________________________________________
Eugene Goldman.·.
On Wed, 1 Apr 1998 02:51:43 -0500, "David Ryan" <da...@maybelater.com> wrote:
上hat are the bounds of obligations?
To treat our fellow man as a part of our own family, based on the teaching of
the Brotherhood of Man under the Fatherhood of G-d. To respect the rights and
privacies of others. To observe the rules and regulations of the fraternity, To
obey the Civil law. To maintain the high Moral and Ethical standards that
demonstrated our worthyness for admission.
乙re they personal restrictions or mandated?
I'm not sure what you mean here, but let me take a shot at it. The
"restrictions" are personal, as it is a personal matter, when someone asks you
to keep something private - between the two of you - it is a personal decision
to respect that privacy. It is "mandated" that before anyone can be admitted to
the fraternity, they meet certain qualifications.
儿n other words, are there secret rituals and laws like the Mormons?
Our ceremonies are private, although some descriptions of them (some closer to
reality than others) have been published from time to time. Our laws, rules and
regulations, like any organization, are open and available. For example, the
California Masonic Code (which is the complete set of codified law for the
jurisdiction in which I hold membership) is a copyrighted document, available to
anyone in plain (albeit legalistic) English from my Grand Lodge. Write to the
Grand Secretary, 1111 California St. San Fransisco, Ca. 94108 for details on
pricing and availability. I believe they go for about $35.00, but I have only
purchased updates for some time now, so I may be off on the price.
儿 guess it's the cloak of secrecy that also leaves a negative connotation in
孑y mind.
"Cloak of secrecy"? We openly discuss the fraternity here, and elsewhere.
There are literally thousands of web pages, many by Grand Lodges, devoted to
Masonry. The "cloak of secrecy" is getting tattered and worn, no longer used or
usefull, except in those societies where membership in a fraternity may cost
someone his livelyhood or even his life.
no-sp...@nospam.bot
-- On Tue, 31 Mar 1998 23:03:50 -0500, "David Ryan"
<da...@maybelater.com> scribbled:
snip
>->Interesting.
>->Then why can one never gain a direct answer from Masons?
>->Most low level Masons are happy to tell people what you just did.
>->An upper echeolon Mason...never speaks.
>->Why do you suppose that is?
I don't have a problem getting a direct answer from masons. However
getting a direct "honest" answer from them is quite hard.
Sometimes you find one but he usually leaves the newsgroup disgusted
and ashamed at the ilk that represent his group here. It's the good
masons that should stick around and run the goof-balls off. It does
seem that now-a-days there is a larger percentage of the "russ" type
masons which even the more honest masons find disgusting.
David Ryan
Eugene Goldman.·. wrote in message
<352259c2...@pbinews.pacbell.net>...
>On Wed, 1 Apr 1998 02:51:43 -0500, "David Ryan" <da...@maybelater.com>
wrote:
>
>
>¤What are the bounds of obligations?
>
>To treat our fellow man as a part of our own family, based on the teaching
of
>the Brotherhood of Man under the Fatherhood of G-d. To respect the rights
and
>privacies of others. To observe the rules and regulations of the
fraternity, To
>obey the Civil law. To maintain the high Moral and Ethical standards that
>demonstrated our worthyness for admission.
Sounds good so far.
With the exception of "God", pretty much the same standards I attempt to
live by myself.
Don't get me wrong on the "God" part.
I am not an athiest.
More of a spiritual agnostic who just can't be satisfied with explanations
to date.
Others claim I have no faith.
Which is patently untrue.
I have faith in my wife for example.
I also have faith in my son.
>
>¤Are they personal restrictions or mandated?
>
>I'm not sure what you mean here, but let me take a shot at it. The
>"restrictions" are personal, as it is a personal matter, when someone asks
you
>to keep something private - between the two of you - it is a personal
decision
>to respect that privacy. It is "mandated" that before anyone can be
admitted to
>the fraternity, they meet certain qualifications.
So what are the qualifications?
As I understand it, the Bible says all men are equal (sinners).
Christ didn't exclude anyone did he?
How do Freemasons judge the worthiness of an applicant?
>
>¤In other words, are there secret rituals and laws like the Mormons?
>
>Our ceremonies are private, although some descriptions of them (some closer
to
>reality than others) have been published from time to time. Our laws,
rules and
>regulations, like any organization, are open and available. For example,
the
>California Masonic Code (which is the complete set of codified law for the
>jurisdiction in which I hold membership) is a copyrighted document,
available to
>anyone in plain (albeit legalistic) English from my Grand Lodge. Write to
the
>Grand Secretary, 1111 California St. San Fransisco, Ca. 94108 for details
on
>pricing and availability. I believe they go for about $35.00, but I have
only
>purchased updates for some time now, so I may be off on the price.
Thank you.
I believe I will.
>
>¤I guess it's the cloak of secrecy that also leaves a negative connotation
in
>¤my mind.
>
>"Cloak of secrecy"? We openly discuss the fraternity here, and elsewhere.
I just found this out!
Please pardon my ignorance of Freemasonry.
>There are literally thousands of web pages, many by Grand Lodges, devoted
to
>Masonry.
Again, please pardon my ignorance here.
I shall look for them.
Any you can recommend for me?
> The "cloak of secrecy" is getting tattered and worn, no longer used or
>usefull, except in those societies where membership in a fraternity may
cost
>someone his livelyhood or even his life.
I'm tempted to go on a political rant here but I won't.
Wouldn't have anything to do with Freemasonry.
What an opening for me though!...Okay, impulse under control...I'll pass on
that. ;-)
>
>
>Be well. Travel with a light heart.
You too, and thank you very much for your time and information.
Sincerely,
Dave
David Ryan
Eugene Goldman.·. wrote in message
<3522549d...@pbinews.pacbell.net>...
>On Tue, 31 Mar 1998 23:03:50 -0500, "David Ryan" <da...@maybelater.com>
wrote:
>
>¤Interesting.
>¤Then why can one never gain a direct answer from Masons?
>¤Most low level Masons are happy to tell people what you just did.
>¤An upper echeolon Mason...never speaks.
>¤Why do you suppose that is?
>
><ROFL>
>Never speaks? <LOL>
Go ahead, laugh at me.
>
>That is a good one. Oh, wait a minute. "Upper echelon? I see. Allow me
to
>explain the error in your concept. The fraternity of Freemasonry has a
concept
>called equality. No one is "higher echeolon" than anyone else. We all
meet on
>the level, just as we were when born, and as we will be when we pass on to
that
>which awaits us. Even Officers, presiding or otherwise, of Lodges or
entire
>Jurisdictions are no "higher echeolon" than anyone else. They are simply
>charged with the *temporary* responsibility for seeing to certain
administrative
>tasks.
>
>No one can speak "for Masonry", not even a Grand Master. A Grand Master
*may*
>speak for HIS jurisdiction alone, and then only on matters of the
fraternity.
>Even then, he speaks for his term alone.
>
>All ANY Mason may do is speak for themselves, express their thoughts,
personal
>and individual. Authoritative to their own personal experience and
opinions,
>any and all are free to express themselves.
Thanks for the education.
An impressive and diverse list.
Thanks for taking the time to converse with me.
I may have asked this before but, what exactly are the qualifications for
membership?
Thank you,
Dave
David Ryan
no-sp...@nospam.bot wrote in message
<3525866a...@news.iamerica.net>...
>-- On Tue, 31 Mar 1998 23:03:50 -0500, "David Ryan"
><da...@maybelater.com> scribbled:
>
>snip
>>->Interesting.
>>->Then why can one never gain a direct answer from Masons?
>>->Most low level Masons are happy to tell people what you just did.
>>->An upper echeolon Mason...never speaks.
>>->Why do you suppose that is?
>
>I don't have a problem getting a direct answer from masons. However
>getting a direct "honest" answer from them is quite hard.
>
>Sometimes you find one but he usually leaves the newsgroup disgusted
>and ashamed at the ilk that represent his group here. It's the good
>masons that should stick around and run the goof-balls off. It does
>seem that now-a-days there is a larger percentage of the "russ" type
>masons which even the more honest masons find disgusting.
What is a "russ" type?
And what exactly do you have against the Masons?
How are they "dishonest"?
I have found those who took the time to reply to me quite interesting,
friendly and willing to talk with me.( I know they could find more
stimulating conversation but they chose to enlighten me)
Dave
Eugene Goldman.·.
On Wed, 1 Apr 1998 16:26:43 -0500, "David Ryan" <da...@maybelater.com> wrote:
又o what are the qualifications?
In this jurisdiction, they are few. A belief in a Supreme Being as The Creator
of the Universe, Being of good Moral Character, getting the proper recommenders
and paying the appropriate fees. Then, after the investigation (to verify the
qualifications, you must be elected by a unanamous ballot.
乙s I understand it, the Bible says all men are equal (sinners).
七hrist didn't exclude anyone did he?
Can't recall any. However, Freemasonry is a fraternity, not a religious
movement or decipleship.
人ow do Freemasons judge the worthiness of an applicant?
By knowing the applicant before recommending him, and properly investigating his
qualifications.
匕lease pardon my ignorance of Freemasonry.
No problem, thank you for asking questions rather than casting accusations.
乙gain, please pardon my ignorance here.
儿 shall look for them.
乙ny you can recommend for me?
Try Yahoo, searching for Freemasonry.
儿'm tempted to go on a political rant here but I won't.
上ouldn't have anything to do with Freemasonry.
上hat an opening for me though!...Okay, impulse under control...I'll pass on
川hat. ;-)
You show great restraint, sir. I applaud you.
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
(That was applause)
<s>
Be well. Travel with a light heart.
Eugene Goldman.·.
On Wed, 1 Apr 1998 16:26:43 -0500, "David Ryan" <da...@maybelater.com> wrote:
¤Any you can recommend for me?
Here are a few to get you started.
http://www.cacr.caltech.edu/~rfire/masonry/
http://www.nv-net.com/acacia16
http://www.freemason.com
http://www.freemasons.com
http://www.alagl.org/
http://www.geocities.com/Heartland/Plains/9946/
http://www.trellis.net/users/alhart/AMD/
http://www1.kingston.net/~wanderso/masonl.htm
http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Forum/3619/index.html
http://www.neta.com/~kottinge/AZGL/index.html
http://www.neta.com/~kottinge/az-activity.html
http://www.neta.com/~ottinger/azrl-1.html
http://www.lisp.com.au/~jrcooper
http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/5796/caled1.htm
http://www.ozemail.com.au/~matt2/freemaso.htm
http://www.freemason.aust.com/~uglodge
http://www.tq.com
http://www.telusplanet.net/public/glassewe/Beacon.htm
http://www.kdi.com/~benhur
http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Acropolis/1362
http://www.geocities.com/Athens/1799
http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Parthenon/4223
http://members.aol.com/bosiem
http://host.pc.centuryinter.net/mason/curtpage.htm
http://www.mason.com.br/
http://vax1.bemidji.msus.edu/~gurnee/homepage.html
http://www.pacific-online.com/bc-freemasonry/
http://www.padrak.com/bc_303/
http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Parthenon/7492/
http://brookings.itctel.com/~docsue/bkx24.html
http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Parthenon/3416/
http://www.oescal.org/
http://www.freemason.org/gcram
http://www.freemason.org/index.html
http://www.freemason.org/ncrl/
http://www.freemason.org/scrl/
http://www.clinton.net/~rsampson/mason/mason.htm
http://www.hookup.net/~glcanada
http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/5796/caled1.htm
http://www.scsn.net/~barton/scafm
http://members.tripod.com/~becca6/cydoc.htm
http://www.avana.net/~davo3/Chamblee444.htm
http://www.sqlweb.com/fey/rtj/
http://www.charlton.demon.co.uk/
http://host.pc.centuryinter.net/mason/curtpage.htm
http://www.aasrvoc.com/
http://www.charlton.demon.co.uk/card/
http://www.geocities.com/Athens/1799/cwlr.html
http://www.luckymojo.com/CoMasonry.html
http://www.co-masonry.org
http://www.coloradomasons.org
http://userpages.itis.com/camelot6
http://www.netins.net/showcase/tommiles/computerpin.html
http://www.btinternet.com/~squaremile.tours/Lodge.html
http://www.flash.net/~cml334/
http://www.netcom.com/~matthram/mason.html
http://www.btinternet.com/~w.j.d/galloway/
http://www.eskimo.com/~daylight
http://nsn.nslsilus.org/wgkhome/cregier/index.html
http://gl-mi.org/lodges/dearborn-172
http://www.demolay.org
http://www.freemasonry.org/gl.de/
http://www.demolay.com
http://www.chaumont.com/DeMolayPI.html
http://www.freimaurerei.com/
http://www.geocities.com/Athens/1799/dcra.html
http://altern.com/dh/ukindex.htm
http://www.tbos2cla.com/masons
http://freemasonry.org/gl-eq
http://www.cyberspace.com/~robfrat/fratrnl.html
http://www.federallodge.org
http://home.istar.ca/~bobprice/index.htm
http://members.tripod.com/~CSharpe/INDEX.HTM
http://www.sci.fi/ttg/masonry.html
http://www.cacr.caltech.edu/~rfire/masonry/
http://www.gl-mi.org/lodges/flintmta/
http://www.sitesurfer.com/F&AM-FL-D26
http://www.glflamason.org/
http://www.lisp.com.au/~jrcooper/
http://www.gldf.org
http://www.chaumont.com/freemasonry.html
http://www.gl-mi.org/lodges/genesee-174/
http://www.cais.com/webweave/masonic.htm
http://www.glofga.org
http://freimaurer.org
http://freimaurer.org/gll/
http://167.217.91.133/graphics/home.htm
http://www.novia.net/~jdenney/masonic.html
http://www.southwind.net:80/~btalbott/mucovers.html
http://167.217.91.135/graphics/home.htm
http://bartertown.austasia.net/masonic/page5.html
http://www.imperium.net/~dgree186/index.html
http://www.greenberg.org
http://www.pixi.com/~masonsgl/
http://www.glhawaii.org
http://www.tripod.com/userland/B/Baron91/index.html
http://www.unterland.de
http://www.avana.net/~davo3/Davo.htm
http://pages.prodigy.com/hiram
http://www.radiks.net/rek
http://home.bd.edu.amu.se/~dixie/mason.htm
http://www.netcom.com/~ghuntnyc
http://home.sol.no/hvilen/
http://www.ilmasons.org/
http://www.ilmasons.org/docs/lodgecity.htm
http://www.ora.uic.edu/lodge/lodgelocator.html
http://www.indianamasons.org/
http://www.chrysalis.org/masonry/
http://www.charlton.demon.co.uk/ilodge/
http://internet.lodge.org.uk
http://www.iorg.org/index.html
http://www.erols.com/wwhjr/ionic31.htm
http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Forum/4302/alllodges.html
http://www.glri.org/
http://www.freemasonry.it/
http://www.netins.net/showcase/tommiles/ramblin1.html
http://www.iac.co.jp/~masonic/
http://home1.gte.net/wiljen/fmy.htm
http://cord.iupui.edu/~jvoils/bethel107
http://167.217.91.135/bethel107/home.html
http://home.sprynet.com/sprynet/skywise1
http://www.geocities.com/TheTropics/2075/
http://www.kena.org/
http://www.mastermason.com/glky
http://www.barsew.on.ca/kerr
http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Acropolis/2800
http://montanaweb.com/kessinger
http://www.KessingerPub.com/
http://www.geocities.com/TheTropics/Shores/3064/
http://freemasonry.org/nking
http://www.radiks.net/rek
http://www.netins.net/showcase/tommiles/lapelpin.html
http://www.sqlweb.com/fey/rtj/emason.cgi
http://www.masoun-loubnan.org/
http://www.followme.com/lebanon
http://members.tripod.com/~jomastes/leichhardt_lodge/info.html
http://www.enternet.co.nz/client/personal/rvanl/
http://www.rpi.edu/~nichot3/masonry/library/index.html
http://www.elcic.com/lodgeical/
http://members.aol.com/dms30/lfc.htm
http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Delphi/4254/
http://www2.linknet.net/mig/
http://www.erols.com/macoy/
http://www.macoy.com/
http://www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/Lobby/9766
http://www.mysterynet.mb.ca/masons
http://www.infocomm.net/~jeff/magan/hirammyth.html
http://www.pinn.net/%7Enctcamp/
http://www.msana.com/
http://freemasonry.org/mlc/
http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/2903
http://www.freemasonry.org/psoc
http://www.avana.net/~davo3/MasonicLinks.htm
http://www.zia.com/freemasonry.htm
http://www.zia.com/masons/
http://www.mmrl.edu/
http://members.aol.com/YorkRiteFM/MSRICF.html
http://coyote.accessnv.com/cards/mu.html
http://www.gryffin.com/mu
http://www.gslink.com/~gcanard/
http://www.southwind.net:80/~btalbott/mucovers.html
http://www.eskimo.com/~daylight
http://www.glmasons-mass.org
http://www.mastermason.com/
http://www.geocities.com/athens/9042
http://sales.dolg.com/private/masonic
http://www.mendocinomasons.org/
http://sykuta.business.pitt.edu/Masonic/Mentor.htm
http://ronb.rust.net/lodges/genesee-174
http://www.gl-mi.org/
http://www.rsm-mi.org/
http://qb.island.net/~nryder/milerhom.html
http://www.mn-mason.org/
http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Forum/7849/index.html
http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Oracle/1190/index.html
http://www.ctaz.com/~rqk1/mvlodge.htm
http://genesis.ixi.net/glofmt/
http://www.zelacom.com/~hawthorn/org/acacia/
http://www.geocities.com/Athens/1799/mtp.html
http://www.ionet.net/~rlf
http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Acropolis/1151
http://members.aol.com/glofnj/index.html
http://www.nymasons.org/
http://enterprise.newcomm.net/masonic/
http://members.aol.com/diekabbala/masonicfamily.html
http://www.grandlodge-nc.org/
http://www.sol.no/frimurer
http://www.grandlodge.ns.ca/gl.html
http://www.freemason.com
http://www.neta.com/~kottinge/masonry.html
http://www.netcom.com/~jpannell/masony.html
http://people.delphi.com/pannellj/masonry/index.htm
http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Parthenon/4356
http://www.pixi.com/~johnnick
http://www.northeastweb.com/masonic/index.html
http://www.icubed.com/users/blulodge/blulodge.html
http://www.PAgrandlodge.org/
http://www.freemasonry.org/psoc
http://www.ka.net/doninky/
http://www.chaumont.com/ShrinePI.html
http://freemasonry.org/phylaxis
http://www.geocities.com/Heartland/Meadows/3645
http://www.wwa.com/~tedhogan/index.html
http://www.rhad.com/redfez/club.html
http://www.gl-mi.org/lodges/genesee-174/regius_t.html
http://www.clinton.net/~rsampson/mason/ritual1.htm
http://Weddings-Online.com/off/DavidRoller.html
http://members.aol.com/GlenGordon/St.JohnsLodge.html
http://www.aye.net/~masons
http://www.ipgeek.com/~marksand/
http://www.srmason-sj.org/council/index.htm
http://www.ezin.net/personal/mason/okrite.htm
http://www.meridian.com/nwta/masons.jpg
http://www.cybercomm.net/~hsherman/shriners.html
http://pagemaker.com/~shriners/
http://shriners.com/hospitals
http://members.aol.com/YaGaYaGaYa/index1.html
http://www.geocities.com/Athens/1799/skidmore.html
http://home1.gte.net/wiljen/sllodge.htm
http://www.digital.net.au/mason.html
http://expage.com/page/southaustralianlodgeofresearch
http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Delphi/7594/
http://www.geocities.com/athens/7999
http://www.springfield217.org/
http://www.datasys.net/users/per/stjohnbap/index.html
http://denton.computek.net/masonic/
http://www.geocities.com/Hollywood/3558/
http://www.trowel.com/flamason
http://www.frimurarorden.se/eng.htm
http://www.algonet.se/~hfalk/svehere.htm
http://www.netti.fi/~leifholm/freemasonry.html
http://www.t2.net/masonry
http://www.pitt.edu/~msykuta/masonic/clayton.htm
http://sykuta.business.pitt.edu/Masonic/other.html
http://www.pitt.edu/~msykuta/iln/iln.html
http://www.tq.com/
http://www.gltexas.org/
http://www.gower.net/Community/tlr
http://hudson.acad.umn.edu/TofF/TofF.html
http://www.webtours.fr/expo-franc-maconnerie/index2.html
http://www.webtours.fr/expo-franc-maconnerie
http://www.ziplink.net/users/trei/masonurl.html
http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Academy/4239
http://linknet.net/masonic
http://www.freemasonry.org/mu/
http://www.charlton.demon.co.uk/UGLE/history/
http://www.utahmason.org/
http://www.freemasonsvic.net.au/
http://www.gslink.com/~gcanard/
http://web-span.com/GLVA
http://members.aol.com/GCRAMVA/HomePage.html
http://aw22.com/
http://vsa.base.org
http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Forum/4966
http://www.geocities.com/Athens/1799/dc9612.html
http://www.concentric.net/~jcov/masoniclink.shtml
http://www.newcomm.net/masonic
http://members.aol.com/YorkRiteFM/HomePage.html
http://www.luckymojo.com/CoMasonry.html
http://www.geocities.com/Athens/5020/NEWRGLY.htm
Chigger800
In Missouri one cannot join a Lodge if he has o felony conviction. and should a
brother be convicted of a felony he can have Masonic charges brought against
him and possiably be expelled from the Craft
ri...@lcc.net
In article <3521E940...@quik.com>,
AnthonyMarsh <ama...@quik.com> wrote:
>
> Gee, I would have thought that these Masons might have appreciated my
> complimenting them on their humor. But instead of getting a thank you
> for my compliment, I instead received a threatening e-mail from one of
> them. And they claim that they are non-violent and promote brotherhood?
> Well, maybe amongst themselves, but certainly not in the unwashed masses
> they wish to enslave.
>
> --
> Anthony Marsh
> The Puzzle Palace http://www.boston.quik.com/amarsh
>
Let's see here. You posted to this ng and someone supposedly sent you one
piece of threatening e-mail. Are you sure it was a Freemason? Anyone can
claim to be a Mason. There are cowardly cowans who will counterfit an e-mail
message to get this type of response from those that are not knowledgable.
Others will post claiming to be Masons when they are,in fact, not. One of the
reasons Masons have grips and passwords is that we may verify when another man
claims to be a Mason, he is! Do you have that ability? How did you verify he
is a Mason? Please post the evidence of what you claim on the ng.
Richard Jackson, PM
Corrigan Masonic Lodge #1103 AF&AM
Corrigan, Texas
-----== Posted via Deja News, The Leader in Internet Discussion ==-----
http://www.dejanews.com/ Now offering spam-free web-based newsreading
David Ryan
ri...@lcc.net wrote in message <6fv2os$b75$1...@nnrp1.dejanews.com>...
>In article <3521E940...@quik.com>,
> AnthonyMarsh <ama...@quik.com> wrote:
>
>>
>> Gee, I would have thought that these Masons might have appreciated my
>> complimenting them on their humor. But instead of getting a thank you
>> for my compliment, I instead received a threatening e-mail from one of
>> them. And they claim that they are non-violent and promote brotherhood?
>> Well, maybe amongst themselves, but certainly not in the unwashed masses
>> they wish to enslave.
>
>Let's see here. You posted to this ng and someone supposedly sent you one
>piece of threatening e-mail. Are you sure it was a Freemason? Anyone can
>claim to be a Mason. There are cowardly cowans who will counterfit an
e-mail
>message to get this type of response from those that are not knowledgable.
>Others will post claiming to be Masons when they are,in fact, not. One of
the
>reasons Masons have grips and passwords is that we may verify when another
man
>claims to be a Mason, he is! Do you have that ability? How did you verify
he
>is a Mason? Please post the evidence of what you claim on the ng.
Hi.
There sure does seem to be alot of hate out there focused on you guys.
You really have passwords and grips?
Is that how you will "enslave us all" as the previous poster suggested were
your intentions? ;-)
Line us up, see if we have the password, and if we do, then see if we can do
the handshake, and if we can, then we get our allotment of land and people?
Just wanted you to know that there is someone out here who is truly
interested in what Freemasons are about.
David Ryan
Dan Mc Kenzie
David Ryan wrote in message <6fv4ai$a...@examiner.concentric.net>...
>
>Hi.
>There sure does seem to be alot of hate out there focused on you guys.
>You really have passwords and grips?
>Is that how you will "enslave us all" as the previous poster suggested were
>your intentions? ;-)
>Line us up, see if we have the password, and if we do, then see if we can
do
>the handshake, and if we can, then we get our allotment of land and people?
>
HEY! Who told ?!?! (;->
Dan McKenzie, FC
Harmony Lodge #18 F. & A.M.
Jurisdiction of the Grand Lodge of New Jersey
>Just wanted you to know that there is someone out here who is truly
AnthonyMarsh
Eugene Goldman.·. wrote:
>
> On Tue, 31 Mar 1998 09:44:18 -0500, AnthonyMarsh <ama...@quik.com> wrote:
>
> ¤Not even close, although quite a funny parody.
>
> Just as accurate as Lew's offerings, yes.
>
+
I have not read Lew's offerings, so I can't comment. But I did think
your message was hilarious.
+
> ¤Actually, because you are anti-Christian
>
> Do you equate nonChristian with antiChristian, or is there some specific
> statement I have made which causes you to make this accusation?
>
+
No, non-Christian does not necessarily mean anti-Christian. But most
pagan sects turn out to be resentful of and anti Christianity.
+
> ¤you are not bound by the commandment to not bear false witness,
>
> By what source do you claim to know by what I am "bound"?
>
+
If you are pagan, then you are not bound by the 10 commandments.
+
> ¤so please make up some more of these diddies. They are hilarious.
>
> I did not "make this up", The article was previously posted to this very
> newsgroup, about six or eight months ago. I read it, I liked it, it amused me,
> and just as Lew does, I reposted it so it could be shared with others. I made,
> and make at present, no claims of it's accuracy. In fact, I prefaced it with
> the statement that I believed it to be every bit as accurate as Lew's posts.
>
+
Whatever the origin of that diddy, it was pure fabrication, but funny
nonetheless. Just a joke in poor taste. I would only quibble that your
passing it along as if it were true is just like someone quoting from
the Protocols of the Elders of Zion and forgetting to point out that the
work is fictious.
+
> I stand by that statement.
>
> Believe it to be as you wish, it has every bit as much factual accuracy as Lew's
> claims.
>
+
When you know something has no basis in fact, it seems illogical to
claim that it is "every bit" as factual as someone else's fiction. Lew's
story may contain only 60% facts, whereas this other story may have only
5% facts. It is a matter of degree. To use the words, "ever bit" implies
that the percentages are roughly equal, which they may not be.
+
> Be well. Travel with a light heart.
>
> Eugene Goldman P.*. M.*.
> W.M. Black Mountain Lodge, #845, San Diego, Ca.
> p.m. Blackmer Lodge #442, San Diego, Ca.
> Southern Ca. Research Lodge
> A.A.S.R., Valley of San Diego
>
> May Brotherly Love forever prevail,
> and every moral and social Virtue cement us.
>
> If you can read this, you have gone too far!
--
WeedT...@zerospam.net
I'm sorry Gene, we can't take your word on this matter, we have to wait 'til the
Acacia Press book comes out on this to learn the "true" facts. How do we know you're
not lying to us...
Gene Goldman wrote:
> On Tue, 31 Mar 1998 12:36:17 -0500, "Dan Mc Kenzie"
> <dan_mc...@SPAMFREEmsn.com> wrote:
>
> 兌 have never heard Gene Goldman make a statement opposed to Christianity or
> 低hristians.
>
> Of course not, I have never made any such statement. Nor would I. Personally I
> think Christianity is a beautiful (if sometimes confusing <s>) religion.
>
> 即our label of him as anti-Christian is at best inaccurate, and
> 吧t worst slanderous.
>
> No, it is born of hate. Some people, claiming to be Christian because it gives
> them an air of veracity, believe anyone who does not share their
> narrowly-defined beliefs must, therefore, be against them. Some of them go so
> far as to attribute blame for the very foundation of Christianity, the actions
> of a dozen or so individuals two thousand years ago, on an entire religion - as
> if those who are members of that religion were somehow involved.
>
> If this sort of behavior were directed at a group who shared a different skin
> color, instead of a religion, it would obviously, easily and correctly be labled
> bigotry. The hate with which some antis speak of others, who differ from them
> in opinion, political, religious or otherwise, is sometimes shocking.
>
> Slander and innacuracy are nothing new to antis such as this. Hate is his stock
> in trade, evidenced by his feeble attempts to blame an entire group for the
> actions of a very few, or to attribute characteristics to an entire group that
> are not there in reality. Hate like this, I find best to ignore, for to
> confront it seems to just fuel it. Antis like this are not willing to see the
> truth, are not willing to accept reality, will not even try to have an open mind
> about anyone or anything. The only thing the world can do is keep loving them
> in spite of the hate burning inside them, keep looking after those of them
> unable or unwilling to earn their own way in the world, keep others safe from
> them and the harm they intend toward others, and let them vent.
>
> Better they vent, even (or particularly) here, than that they start passing out
> the poison cool-aid or hale-bop jello, or start killing more federal agents
> trying to serve a warrant.
>
> Be well. Travel with a light heart.
> Y.I.S.
> In Waimachtendink
>
> Gene Goldman
>
> Blackmer Lodge #442, San Diego, Ca. (p.*. m.*.)
> Black Mountain Masonic Lodge, #845 (W.*. M.*.)
> Southern Ca. Research Lodge
> A.A.S.R., Valley of San Diego
>
> Can you imagine a world without hypothetical situations?
>
> I can be found on ICQ
> -- There are a few Masons
> using ICQ as an effective communication tool!
> Join us!
>
WeedT...@zerospam.net
The Puzzle Palace? When they find you they'll bury you six feet down and three feet
across eh?
> Gee, I would have thought that these Masons might have appreciated my
> complimenting them on their humor. But instead of getting a thank you
> for my compliment, I instead received a threatening e-mail from one of
> them. And they claim that they are non-violent and promote brotherhood?
> Well, maybe amongst themselves, but certainly not in the unwashed masses
> they wish to enslave.
>
AnthonyMarsh
Geez, if they can't find me when the name of the region is right in the
URL address, then they aren't much of a secretive, conspiratorial
society. ;]>
AnthonyMarsh
nosp...@nospam.bot wrote:
>
> -- On Tue, 31 Mar 1998 12:36:17 -0500, "Dan Mc Kenzie"
> <dan_mc...@SPAMFREEmsn.com> scribbled:
>
> snip
>
> >->I have never heard Gene Goldman make a statement opposed to Christianity or
> >->Christians. Your label of him as anti-Christian is at best inaccurate, and
> >->at worst slanderous.
>
> Kinda hard not to be anti-Christianity if one is of the jewish
> religion, have you not read the Bible (that most masons take their
> oaths on) and what those of the jewish religion did to the "Christ" of
> Christianty. The jews want the Pope to apologize for not doing
> enough during the supposedly holocaut.....wonder if the jews would
> apologize to the Christians for what they did to Christ?
>
> -----------------------------------------------------------------
> In order to dodge the spam bots, I disguise my email address with
> an assortment of fake letters, as do others including masons.
> To reveal my true email address, simply remove the X's from
> Xkwa...@XiamericaX.net. Thank you.
> tagline: DISHONESTY is a trademark of freemasonry!
It was not "The Jews" who killed Jesus. It was a cabal of a few corrupt
Jewish leaders and the Romans who controlled the territory. The Romans
were equally to blame. But not all Jews are to blame. Remember that
Jesus was himself a Jewish Rabbi and he had a popular following amongst
many of the Jews.
There are going to be a few corrupt leaders in lmost any society. You
can't extend that to state that everyone of the same religion or creed
is equally guilty. Remember that the Jews in that region were under the
domination of the Romans. The Romans had more to fear from Jesus than
the Jews did.
Eugene Goldman.·.
On Thu, 02 Apr 1998 01:38:23 -0500, AnthonyMarsh <ama...@quik.com> wrote:
¤I have not read Lew's offerings, so I can't comment. But I did think
¤your message was hilarious.
Thank you. I am not the author, as stated in the post, so I cannot accept
credit for it's humorous comment. It was written by someone else. I found it
humorous, almost as humurous as many of Lew's posts. FWIW, Lew is "Acacia
Press".
¤No, non-Christian does not necessarily mean anti-Christian. But most
¤pagan sects turn out to be resentful of and anti Christianity.
Tell me, how can an entire "sect" be "resentful"? Do these "sects" teach
resentment? Is resentment a Teaching of their Scriptures?
¤If you are pagan, then you are not bound by the 10 commandments.
True, IF I am pagan. I will ask again, by what source do you claim to know by
what I am bound? Do you claim I am pagan? By virtue of what information do you
base THAT claim?
¤Whatever the origin of that diddy, it was pure fabrication, but funny
¤nonetheless. Just a joke in poor taste. I would only quibble that your
¤passing it along as if it were true is just like someone quoting from
¤the Protocols of the Elders of Zion and forgetting to point out that the
¤work is fictious.
Which our friend Lew has done on more than one ocasion. That was my point,
exactly.
¤When you know something has no basis in fact, it seems illogical to
¤claim that it is "every bit" as factual as someone else's fiction. Lew's
¤story may contain only 60% facts, whereas this other story may have only
¤5% facts. It is a matter of degree. To use the words, "ever bit" implies
¤that the percentages are roughly equal, which they may not be.
Both the protocols and the piece I reposted are 100% total fabrications. Each
EVERY BIT as accurate as the other. Not "roughly equal", exactly equal.
Thanks for expressing your appreciation.
Be well. Travel with a light heart.
Eugene Goldman P.*. M.*.
W.M. Black Mountain Lodge, #845, San Diego, Ca.
p.m. Blackmer Lodge #442, San Diego, Ca.
Southern Ca. Research Lodge
A.A.S.R., Valley of San Diego
May Brotherly Love forever prevail,
and every moral and social Virtue cement us.
Dan Mc Kenzie
Hello Anthony,
I'm not entirely sure that I understand the basis for the label "pagan" as
applied in your post. Could you expand on the point? I'd genuinely like to
understand where you're coming from on this.
Dan McKenzie, FC
Harmony Lodge #18 F. & A.M.
Jurisdiction of the Grand Lodge of New Jersey
AnthonyMarsh wrote in message <3523325F...@quik.com>...
>Eugene Goldman.·. wrote:
>>
>> On Tue, 31 Mar 1998 09:44:18 -0500, AnthonyMarsh <ama...@quik.com> wrote:
>>
>> ¤Not even close, although quite a funny parody.
>>
>> Just as accurate as Lew's offerings, yes.
>>
>+
>I have not read Lew's offerings, so I can't comment. But I did think
>your message was hilarious.
>+
>> ¤Actually, because you are anti-Christian
>>
>> Do you equate nonChristian with antiChristian, or is there some specific
>> statement I have made which causes you to make this accusation?
>>
>+
>No, non-Christian does not necessarily mean anti-Christian. But most
>pagan sects turn out to be resentful of and anti Christianity.
>+
>> ¤you are not bound by the commandment to not bear false witness,
>>
>> By what source do you claim to know by what I am "bound"?
>>
>+
>If you are pagan, then you are not bound by the 10 commandments.
>+
>> ¤so please make up some more of these diddies. They are hilarious.
>>
>> I did not "make this up", The article was previously posted to this very
>> newsgroup, about six or eight months ago. I read it, I liked it, it
amused me,
>> and just as Lew does, I reposted it so it could be shared with others. I
made,
>> and make at present, no claims of it's accuracy. In fact, I prefaced it
with
>> the statement that I believed it to be every bit as accurate as Lew's
posts.
>>
>+
>Whatever the origin of that diddy, it was pure fabrication, but funny
>nonetheless. Just a joke in poor taste. I would only quibble that your
>passing it along as if it were true is just like someone quoting from
>the Protocols of the Elders of Zion and forgetting to point out that the
>work is fictious.
>+
>> I stand by that statement.
>>
>> Believe it to be as you wish, it has every bit as much factual accuracy
as Lew's
>> claims.
>>
>+
>When you know something has no basis in fact, it seems illogical to
>claim that it is "every bit" as factual as someone else's fiction. Lew's
>story may contain only 60% facts, whereas this other story may have only
>5% facts. It is a matter of degree. To use the words, "ever bit" implies
>that the percentages are roughly equal, which they may not be.
>+
>> Be well. Travel with a light heart.
>>
>> Eugene Goldman P.*. M.*.
>> W.M. Black Mountain Lodge, #845, San Diego, Ca.
>> p.m. Blackmer Lodge #442, San Diego, Ca.
>> Southern Ca. Research Lodge
>> A.A.S.R., Valley of San Diego
>>
>> May Brotherly Love forever prevail,
>> and every moral and social Virtue cement us.
>>
>> If you can read this, you have gone too far!
>
Edward Combs Jr.
The Masons believe in EVERYONE, that why Jews can't make it the 25th
degree(where you must affirm faith in Christ). I would think it would be
hard for a Christian to affirm belief in Mohammed, but there are all kinks
of (professed) Christians.
....................
AnthonyMarsh wrote in message <3523B77D...@quik.com>...
>WeedT...@zerospam.net wrote:
>>
>> The Puzzle Palace? When they find you they'll bury you six feet down and
three feet
>> across eh?
>>
>> > Gee, I would have thought that these Masons might have appreciated my
>> > complimenting them on their humor. But instead of getting a thank you
>> > for my compliment, I instead received a threatening e-mail from one of
>> > them. And they claim that they are non-violent and promote brotherhood?
>> > Well, maybe amongst themselves, but certainly not in the unwashed
masses
>> > they wish to enslave.
>> >
>URL address, then they aren't much of a secretive, conspiratorial
>society. ;]>
>
Eugene Goldman.·.
On Thu, 2 Apr 1998 12:47:42 -0500, "Edward Combs Jr." <eco...@worldnet.att.net>
wrote:
三he Masons believe in EVERYONE, that why Jews can't make it the 25th
千egree(where you must affirm faith in Christ). I would think it would be
士ard for a Christian to affirm belief in Mohammed, but there are all kinks
寸f (professed) Christians.
<ROFL>
Yes, Masons believe in everyone. We believe everyone is a part of the
Brotherhood of Man under the Fatherhood of G-d. We believe everyone in need has
a claim on our kind offices. We believe everyone has a responsibility to be
good, just and true.
As far as Jews not being able to "make it the 25th degree(where you must affirm
faith in Christ)" - this is false on both counts. Virtually all members of
Scottish Rite Bodies are 32nd Degree, this absolutely requires the 25th Degree
before the 26th. There are thousands of Jewish men who are 32nd Degree Scottish
Rite members and none of us have had to "affirm faith in Christ". At least not
in the Southern Jurisdiction. It, quite simply, does not happen. There is NO
"affirmaition of faith in" ANY particular diety or Name of the Creator.
I am curious where you get your "information" from.
Walter T Rejuney
You know what? God probably doesn't care WHAT we believe. If He/She/It
is actually our creator that He/She/It doesn't need our acknowledgement
for the sake of self-affirmation. Mankind has worried far to much about
what God thinks of what we believe.
If I believe in Budda, Krishna, Vishnu, Allah, Elohim, Jesus, or
whatever other word I use to indicate a diety, then it really doesn't
mean anything because those are just words in a synthetic language which
we have adopted for the sake of communication with others. My God
consciousness is something that is part of my spirit/soul which existed
before my body did and will survive long after my body is gone.
Now, what does interest me is the tie between the Masons and the Knights
Templar. Apparently the only real secret of the Masons is that they are
a recruiting ground for candidates to become Knights Templar (and I'm
not referring to the York Rite degree by that name).
Ken
Eugene Goldman.·. wrote:
> ¤The Masons believe in EVERYONE, that why Jews can't make it the 25th
> ¤degree(where you must affirm faith in Christ). I would think it would
> be
> ¤hard for a Christian to affirm belief in Mohammed, but there are all
> kinks
> ¤of (professed) Christians.
d...@zerospam.net
Hey, better not give out too much information ... You might end up on ... (their
mailing list.) shhhh. Then you might be asked to support childrens hospitals and other
treacherous activities. Maybe even end up at a pancake breakfast or something.
I know it's exhilarating to dance on the brink of catastrophy like that, but perhaps
moderation is in order with so much at stake.
Dan Mc Kenzie
Hello Ed,
There are only three degrees in Freemasonry: Entered Apprentice, Fellow
Craft, and Master Mason.
York and Scottish Rite are not directly under the jurisdiction of any Grand
Lodge. Your local country club, Knights of Columbus, Elks, Moose, etc. are
also not under the Jurisdiction of any Grand Lodge, and as such may set any
guidelines for membership they choose.
Not all Masons choose to participate in York or Scottish Rite bodies, and
your veiled allegation that Masonry is anti-Semitic is as baseless as it is
ludicrous.
As I am not yet a Master Mason, and am therefore not eligible to pursue
involvement in either York or Scottish Rite and will not comment on their
ritual. It is a verifiable fact that the only religious requirement for a
petitioner for membership in a Masonic Lodge is a belief in God. Anyone
practicing Judaism clearly meets that requirement.
Dan McKenzie, FC
Harmony Lodge #18 F. & A.M.
Jurisdiction of the Grand Lodge of New Jersey
Edward Combs Jr. wrote in message <6g0j3q$r...@bgtnsc02.worldnet.att.net>...
>The Masons believe in EVERYONE, that why Jews can't make it the 25th
>degree(where you must affirm faith in Christ). I would think it would be
>hard for a Christian to affirm belief in Mohammed, but there are all kinks
>of (professed) Christians.
>....................
>AnthonyMarsh wrote in message <3523B77D...@quik.com>...
>>WeedT...@zerospam.net wrote:
>>>
>>> The Puzzle Palace? When they find you they'll bury you six feet down and
>three feet
>>> across eh?
>>>
>>> > Gee, I would have thought that these Masons might have appreciated my
>>> > complimenting them on their humor. But instead of getting a thank you
>>> > for my compliment, I instead received a threatening e-mail from one of
>>> > them. And they claim that they are non-violent and promote
brotherhood?
>>> > Well, maybe amongst themselves, but certainly not in the unwashed
>masses
>>> > they wish to enslave.
>>> >
AnthonyMarsh
d...@zerospam.net wrote:
>
> Hey, better not give out too much information ... You might end up on ... (their
> mailing list.) shhhh. Then you might be asked to support childrens hospitals and other
> treacherous activities. Maybe even end up at a pancake breakfast or something.
> I know it's exhilarating to dance on the brink of catastrophy like that, but perhaps
> moderation is in order with so much at stake.
>
> > URL address, then they aren't much of a secretive, conspiratorial
> > society. ;]>
> >
> > --
> > Anthony Marsh
> > The Puzzle Palace http://www.boston.quik.com/amarsh
Yeah, I'm really worried that they might make me drive one of those
funny little motorcycles! ;]>
There is no denying that Masons have done many fine things. But lying
and bearing false witness does their cause more harm than good.
AnthonyMarsh
David Ryan wrote:
>
> ri...@lcc.net wrote in message <6fv2os$b75$1...@nnrp1.dejanews.com>...
> >In article <3521E940...@quik.com>,
> > AnthonyMarsh <ama...@quik.com> wrote:
> >
> >>
> >> complimenting them on their humor. But instead of getting a thank you
> >> for my compliment, I instead received a threatening e-mail from one of
> >> them. And they claim that they are non-violent and promote brotherhood?
> >> Well, maybe amongst themselves, but certainly not in the unwashed masses
> >> they wish to enslave.
> >
> >piece of threatening e-mail. Are you sure it was a Freemason? Anyone can
> >claim to be a Mason. There are cowardly cowans who will counterfit an
> >message to get this type of response from those that are not knowledgable.
> >Others will post claiming to be Masons when they are,in fact, not. One of
> the
> >reasons Masons have grips and passwords is that we may verify when another
> man
> >claims to be a Mason, he is! Do you have that ability? How did you verify
> he
> >is a Mason? Please post the evidence of what you claim on the ng.
>
> There sure does seem to be alot of hate out there focused on you guys.
> You really have passwords and grips?
> Is that how you will "enslave us all" as the previous poster suggested were
> your intentions? ;-)
> Line us up, see if we have the password, and if we do, then see if we can do
> the handshake, and if we can, then we get our allotment of land and people?
>
> interested in what Freemasons are about.
>
> David Ryan
Yes, most secret societies have secret passwords, code words, secret
signs and signals, and even secret handshakes. Not every secret society
is out to enslave all of mankind. But you can be sure that in most
countries there are people who would like to take over. You don't think
that Hitler and the Thule Society which trained him were just doing
their civic duty, do you?
AnthonyMarsh
Eugene Goldman.·. wrote:
>
> On Thu, 02 Apr 1998 01:38:23 -0500, AnthonyMarsh <ama...@quik.com> wrote:
>
> ¤your message was hilarious.
>
> credit for it's humorous comment. It was written by someone else. I found it
> humorous, almost as humurous as many of Lew's posts. FWIW, Lew is "Acacia
> Press".
>
> ¤pagan sects turn out to be resentful of and anti Christianity.
>
> resentment? Is resentment a Teaching of their Scriptures?
>
For example, the Thuggies. Some have scriptures of their own, such as
Satanic cults, others do not. Some Satanic cults teach that Jesus
usurped Lucifer's rightful position and are thus resentful.
> ¤If you are pagan, then you are not bound by the 10 commandments.
>
> True, IF I am pagan. I will ask again, by what source do you claim to know by
> what I am bound? Do you claim I am pagan? By virtue of what information do you
> base THAT claim?
>
I neve made a claim. I just offered one example that IF you were a
pagam, for example, that you would not be bound by the 10 commandments.
That is a conditional phrase, not a claim. OTHO, if you were a Jew or a
Christian, FOR EXAMPLE, then you would be bound by the 10 commandments.
As far as I know, no reformed branch has gone so far as to throw out the
10 commandments. And you can't pick and choose which ones you WANT to
obey. Neither can you prioritze them and state that one is an absolute
while others are relative.
> ¤Whatever the origin of that diddy, it was pure fabrication, but funny
> ¤nonetheless. Just a joke in poor taste. I would only quibble that your
> ¤passing it along as if it were true is just like someone quoting from
> ¤the Protocols of the Elders of Zion and forgetting to point out that the
> ¤work is fictious.
>
> Which our friend Lew has done on more than one ocasion. That was my point,
> exactly.
>
Your point may be very accurate. I would prefer if you would stick to
the facts. And please don't fall for the intellectually lazy trick of
saying that there is no point in explaining things to people who are not
capable of understanding them. Better to light one candle than curse the
darkness (hint, hint).
> ¤When you know something has no basis in fact, it seems illogical to
> ¤claim that it is "every bit" as factual as someone else's fiction. Lew's
> ¤story may contain only 60% facts, whereas this other story may have only
> ¤5% facts. It is a matter of degree. To use the words, "ever bit" implies
> ¤that the percentages are roughly equal, which they may not be.
>
> Both the protocols and the piece I reposted are 100% total fabrications. Each
> EVERY BIT as accurate as the other. Not "roughly equal", exactly equal.
>
The Protocols are 100% fabrication, but you have not shown that Lew's
postings are 100% fabrications. If you would take the time to do so it
would help everyone.
>
> Thanks for expressing your appreciation.
>
> Be well. Travel with a light heart.
>
> Eugene Goldman P.*. M.*.
> W.M. Black Mountain Lodge, #845, San Diego, Ca.
> p.m. Blackmer Lodge #442, San Diego, Ca.
> Southern Ca. Research Lodge
> A.A.S.R., Valley of San Diego
>
> May Brotherly Love forever prevail,
> and every moral and social Virtue cement us.
>
> If you can read this, you have gone too far!
--
Wiley997
AnthonyMarsh wrote in message <3524FE27...@quik.com>...
>David Ryan wrote:
>> Hi.
>> There sure does seem to be alot of hate out there focused on you guys.
>> You really have passwords and grips?
>> Is that how you will "enslave us all" as the previous poster suggested
were
>> your intentions? ;-)
>> Line us up, see if we have the password, and if we do, then see if we can
do
>> the handshake, and if we can, then we get our allotment of land and
people?
>>
>> Just wanted you to know that there is someone out here who is truly
>> interested in what Freemasons are about.
>>
>> David Ryan
>
>Yes, most secret societies have secret passwords, code words, secret
>signs and signals, and even secret handshakes.
Sort of like the Crips and the Bloods?
Are they working in league with each other?
The Freemasons supply the dope, the gangs sell it and don't even know who
they're working for?
This is just getting too big for me, I need a break!
> Not every secret society
>is out to enslave all of mankind. But you can be sure that in most
>countries there are people who would like to take over. You don't think
>that Hitler and the Thule Society which trained him were just doing
>their civic duty, do you?
Oh no.
They were Racists and freaks and quite insane.
Besides, you can't say that Hitler didn't give people a forewarning of his
plans.
He put them all on paper while still imprisoned.
--
Wiley997
Eugene Goldman.·.
On Fri, 03 Apr 1998 10:33:24 -0500, AnthonyMarsh <ama...@quik.com> wrote:
€Yes, some sects do and have taught resentment as part of their mantra.
€For example, the Thuggies. Some have scriptures of their own, such as
€Satanic cults, others do not. Some Satanic cults teach that Jesus
€usurped Lucifer's rightful position and are thus resentful.
Having never heard of them, I cannot comment.
€I neve made a claim. I just offered one example that IF you were a
€pagam, for example, that you would not be bound by the 10 commandments.
€That is a conditional phrase, not a claim. OTHO, if you were a Jew or a
€Christian, FOR EXAMPLE, then you would be bound by the 10 commandments.
€As far as I know, no reformed branch has gone so far as to throw out the
€10 commandments. And you can't pick and choose which ones you WANT to
€obey. Neither can you prioritze them and state that one is an absolute
€while others are relative.
I see. And where did you get your education in both Judiasm and Christianity?
€Your point may be very accurate. I would prefer if you would stick to
€the facts. And please don't fall for the intellectually lazy trick of
€saying that there is no point in explaining things to people who are not
€capable of understanding them. Better to light one candle than curse the
€darkness (hint, hint).
I have never resorted to such childishness. You may have me confused with
someone else.
Ok, fact: Lew Crocker, alias Acacia Press, has posted the "protocols" right
here, as fact, on more than one ocasion.
That was my point, that was why I said my repost was every bit as accurate as
some of his.
€The Protocols are 100% fabrication, but you have not shown that Lew's
€postings are 100% fabrications. If you would take the time to do so it
€would help everyone.
Do I need to locate the post of Lew's where he posted the Protocols as fact? I
don't think I retained the trash, but soemone else may have it.
.
AnthonyMarsh wrote:
>
> d...@zerospam.net wrote:
> >
> > Hey, better not give out too much information ... You might end up on ... (their
> > mailing list.) shhhh. Then you might be asked to support childrens hospitals and other
> > treacherous activities. Maybe even end up at a pancake breakfast or something.
> > I know it's exhilarating to dance on the brink of catastrophy like that, but perhaps
> > moderation is in order with so much at stake.
> >
> > > Geez, if they can't find me when the name of the region is right in the
> > > URL address, then they aren't much of a secretive, conspiratorial
> > > society. ;]>
> > >
> funny little motorcycles! ;]>
> There is no denying that Masons have done many fine things. But lying
> and bearing false witness does their cause more harm than good.
>
Mr. Marsh,
Before I plunk you into the killfile cesspool, please explain what
you meant by Masons lying and bearing false witness. Enquiring minds
want to know...............................
Kurt MM, SDeM, PMC
AnthonyMarsh
ri...@lcc.net wrote:
>
> In article <3521E940...@quik.com>,
> AnthonyMarsh <ama...@quik.com> wrote:
>
> >
> > Gee, I would have thought that these Masons might have appreciated my
> > complimenting them on their humor. But instead of getting a thank you
> > for my compliment, I instead received a threatening e-mail from one of
> > them. And they claim that they are non-violent and promote brotherhood?
> > Well, maybe amongst themselves, but certainly not in the unwashed masses
> > they wish to enslave.
> >
> piece of threatening e-mail. Are you sure it was a Freemason? Anyone can
> claim to be a Mason. There are cowardly cowans who will counterfit an e-mail
> message to get this type of response from those that are not knowledgable.
> Others will post claiming to be Masons when they are,in fact, not. One of the
> reasons Masons have grips and passwords is that we may verify when another man
> claims to be a Mason, he is! Do you have that ability? How did you verify he
> is a Mason? Please post the evidence of what you claim on the ng.
>
> Corrigan Masonic Lodge #1103 AF&AM
> Corrigan, Texas
>
> -----== Posted via Deja News, The Leader in Internet Discussion ==-----
> http://www.dejanews.com/ Now offering spam-free web-based newsreading
You have pinpointed one of the problems with the Internet. Anyone can
pretend to be anyone. For example, how do we know that you really are a
Mason? How do we know that you are who you are claiming to be? Even your
messsage might be a prank by a 10-year-old kid just trying to stir up
trouble.
There are occassionally hints in the raw headers of message which tell
us if the person could possibly be who he claims to be. For example, if
the headers reveal that the message was actually posted on a system in
Texas while the poster claims to come (in his signature, for example)
from California, then I would tend to be suspicious. Likewise, someone
may provide information in the signature which is obviously bogus, or
could be easily checked out. Sometimes a few simple searches such as 411
or the like will confirm that the poster is indeed the person he claims
to be. But, given the nature of the Internet you will rarely find
absolute proof. If the matter were referred to law enforcement, as Bill
Gates had to do recently, there are ways to positively confirm who sent
the message.
AnthonyMarsh
Dan Mc Kenzie wrote:
>
> Hello Anthony,
>
> I'm not entirely sure that I understand the basis for the label "pagan" as
> applied in your post. Could you expand on the point? I'd genuinely like to
> understand where you're coming from on this.
>
> Harmony Lodge #18 F. & A.M.
> Jurisdiction of the Grand Lodge of New Jersey
>
> >>
> >> On Tue, 31 Mar 1998 09:44:18 -0500, AnthonyMarsh <ama...@quik.com> wrote:
> >>
> >> ¤Not even close, although quite a funny parody.
> >>
> >> Just as accurate as Lew's offerings, yes.
> >>
> >+
> >your message was hilarious.
> >> ¤Actually, because you are anti-Christian
> >>
> >> Do you equate nonChristian with antiChristian, or is there some specific
> >> statement I have made which causes you to make this accusation?
> >>
> >+
> >pagan sects turn out to be resentful of and anti Christianity.
> >> ¤you are not bound by the commandment to not bear false witness,
> >>
> >> By what source do you claim to know by what I am "bound"?
> >>
> >+
> >If you are pagan, then you are not bound by the 10 commandments.
> >+
> >> ¤so please make up some more of these diddies. They are hilarious.
> >>
> >> I did not "make this up", The article was previously posted to this very
> >> newsgroup, about six or eight months ago. I read it, I liked it, it
> amused me,
> >> and just as Lew does, I reposted it so it could be shared with others. I
> made,
> >> and make at present, no claims of it's accuracy. In fact, I prefaced it
> with
> posts.
> >>
> >+
> >Whatever the origin of that diddy, it was pure fabrication, but funny
> >nonetheless. Just a joke in poor taste. I would only quibble that your
> >passing it along as if it were true is just like someone quoting from
> >the Protocols of the Elders of Zion and forgetting to point out that the
> >work is fictious.
> >> I stand by that statement.
> >>
> >> Believe it to be as you wish, it has every bit as much factual accuracy
> as Lew's
> >> claims.
> >>
> >+
> >claim that it is "every bit" as factual as someone else's fiction. Lew's
> >story may contain only 60% facts, whereas this other story may have only
> >5% facts. It is a matter of degree. To use the words, "ever bit" implies
> >that the percentages are roughly equal, which they may not be.
> >> Be well. Travel with a light heart.
> >>
> >> Eugene Goldman P.*. M.*.
> >> W.M. Black Mountain Lodge, #845, San Diego, Ca.
> >> p.m. Blackmer Lodge #442, San Diego, Ca.
> >> Southern Ca. Research Lodge
> >> A.A.S.R., Valley of San Diego
> >>
> >> May Brotherly Love forever prevail,
> >> and every moral and social Virtue cement us.
> >>
> >> If you can read this, you have gone too far!
> >
"Pagan" in this case is not a label. It is an example. It is one
situation where a person would not be bound by the 10 commandments. I
still don't understand why no one seems to be able to understand what a
conditional phrase is. There seems to be a deliberate attempt to change
a conditional phrase into an accusation in order to derive sympathy.
AnthonyMarsh
Your example of the CRIPs and Bloods is purely YOUR invention, not mine.
If YOU want to imagine some all-powerful conspiracy where street gangs
who are supposedly rivals are actually secretly allies, that is fine
with me. But I did not invent this theory, you did, as a strawman
argument. I didn't even consider mentioning the FreeMasons in terms of
dope dealing, you did. So, please don't force your theories on me.
Wiley997
AnthonyMarsh wrote in message <35259A6B...@quik.com>...
>Wiley997 wrote:
>>
>> AnthonyMarsh wrote in message <3524FE27...@quik.com>...
***SNIP***
>> >Yes, most secret societies have secret passwords, code words, secret
>> >signs and signals, and even secret handshakes.
>>
>> Sort of like the Crips and the Bloods?
>> Are they working in league with each other?
>> The Freemasons supply the dope, the gangs sell it and don't even know who
>> they're working for?
>> This is just getting too big for me, I need a break!
>>
>> > Not every secret society
>> >is out to enslave all of mankind. But you can be sure that in most
>> >countries there are people who would like to take over. You don't think
>> >that Hitler and the Thule Society which trained him were just doing
>> >their civic duty, do you?
>>
>> Oh no.
>> They were Racists and freaks and quite insane.
>> Besides, you can't say that Hitler didn't give people a forewarning of
his
>> plans.
>> He put them all on paper while still imprisoned.
>> --
>> Wiley997
>
>Your example of the CRIPs and Bloods is purely YOUR invention, not mine.
It's not such a stretch compared to other things found in alt.conspiracy.
YOU say they want to enslave us all!
Whats a little dope-dealing when yo're already talkin' slavery?
>If YOU want to imagine some all-powerful conspiracy where street gangs
>who are supposedly rivals are actually secretly allies, that is fine
>with me.
I do like to imagine wild and preposterous things.
Why do you think I'm playing in here?
>But I did not invent this theory, you did, as a strawman
>argument.
No, it was a simple ratcheting up of the heat on the Freemasons.
More fuel on the fire!
Get them Freemasons!
> I didn't even consider mentioning the FreeMasons in terms of
>dope dealing, you did.
Boy, you're a serious chap are'nt you?
>So, please don't force your theories on me.
Okay.
Stick Wiley997 in your killfile.
--
Wiley997
Wiley997
Bolivar T. Shagnasty wrote in message
<35278c47...@enews.newsguy.com>...
>On Wed, 01 Apr 1998 07:14:22 GMT, we...@southeast.net (Don West)
>wrote:
>
>>Are you not aware that in our Republic an accuser must make
>>him/herself know to the accused?
>
>Bolivar regrets to inform you that this is not so, Master West.
>
>Not only do law enforcement agents routinely get search and seizure
>warrants on the strength of (alleged) "secret" informants, but your
>friendly Demican government has instituted non-public trials for those
>whom it labels (without recourse) "terrorists".
That's right!
Secret trials without the right to face an accuser is now a routine
operation in the Federal courts.
All they need to do is pin a label on you and "Poof", you're a
terrorist...you Gore Vidal reading FREAKS better watch out!
Damn, this subject gets me riled.
Its one of those topics where if you try to tell someone it is happening,
they get the glazed-over look like they took a few too many bong-hits.
They think YOU are the crazy one!
"But it's the USA!" they say.
Okay...whatever.
"Don't you get tired of inhaling all that sand?", I ask them.
"Huh?" they say, eyes a glaze and stuttering as they walk away.
--
Wiley997
ri...@lcc.net
In article <35255876...@quik.com>,
AnthonyMarsh <ama...@quik.com> wrote:
>
> > is a Mason? Please post the evidence of what you claim on the ng.
> >
> > Richard Jackson, PM
> > Corrigan Masonic Lodge #1103 AF&AM
> > Corrigan, Texas
> >
> > -----== Posted via Deja News, The Leader in Internet Discussion ==-----
> > http://www.dejanews.com/ Now offering spam-free web-based newsreading
>
> You have pinpointed one of the problems with the Internet. Anyone can
> pretend to be anyone. For example, how do we know that you really are a
> Mason? How do we know that you are who you are claiming to be? Even your
> messsage might be a prank by a 10-year-old kid just trying to stir up
> trouble.
> There are occassionally hints in the raw headers of message which tell
> us if the person could possibly be who he claims to be. For example, if
> the headers reveal that the message was actually posted on a system in
> Texas while the poster claims to come (in his signature, for example)
> from California, then I would tend to be suspicious. Likewise, someone
> may provide information in the signature which is obviously bogus, or
> could be easily checked out. Sometimes a few simple searches such as 411
> or the like will confirm that the poster is indeed the person he claims
> to be. But, given the nature of the Internet you will rarely find
> absolute proof. If the matter were referred to law enforcement, as Bill
> Gates had to do recently, there are ways to positively confirm who sent
> the message.
> --
> Anthony Marsh
> The Puzzle Palace http://www.boston.quik.com/amarsh
>
Actually, it is not hard to determine who is a Freemason. Most Masons post
under their real name and give authentic addresses. Some of the reply
addresses have anti-spam components. Also, Masonic membership is not secret.
The first thing is to confirm there is a Masonic Lodge by the name given in
the address. Secondly, contact the Lodge if you are not sure I am a Mason,
and ask them if I am a member.
Of course, Freemasons have ways to recognize each other even over the
internet. Ways that non-Masons are not knowledgeable with.
Dan Mc Kenzie
AnthonyMarsh wrote in message <352597E9...@quik.com>...
>
>"Pagan" in this case is not a label. It is an example. It is one
>situation where a person would not be bound by the 10 commandments. I
>still don't understand why no one seems to be able to understand what a
>conditional phrase is. There seems to be a deliberate attempt to change
>a conditional phrase into an accusation in order to derive sympathy.
>--
>Anthony Marsh
>The Puzzle Palace http://www.boston.quik.com/amarsh
Perhaps I misunderstood the tone of your post. I can assure you that your
sympathy is the last thing in which I am interseted.
I am equally sure that based on the previous item you posted in the thread,
you can see that the misinterpertation is understandable.
Dan Mc Kenzie
That having been said, what do you think we do?
Dan McKenzie, FC
Harmony Lodge #18 F. & A.M.
Jurisdiction of the Grand Lodge of New Jersey
AnthonyMarsh wrote in message <35259A6B...@quik.com>...
>Wiley997 wrote:
>>
>> AnthonyMarsh wrote in message <3524FE27...@quik.com>...
>> >David Ryan wrote:
>>
>> >> Hi.
>> >> There sure does seem to be alot of hate out there focused on you guys.
>> >> You really have passwords and grips?
>> >> Is that how you will "enslave us all" as the previous poster suggested
>> were
>> >> your intentions? ;-)
>> >> Line us up, see if we have the password, and if we do, then see if we
can
>> do
>> >> the handshake, and if we can, then we get our allotment of land and
>> people?
>> >>
>> >> Just wanted you to know that there is someone out here who is truly
>> >> interested in what Freemasons are about.
>> >>
>> >> David Ryan
>> >
>> >Yes, most secret societies have secret passwords, code words, secret
>> >signs and signals, and even secret handshakes.
>>
>> Sort of like the Crips and the Bloods?
>> Are they working in league with each other?
>> The Freemasons supply the dope, the gangs sell it and don't even know who
>> they're working for?
>> This is just getting too big for me, I need a break!
>>
>> > Not every secret society
>> >is out to enslave all of mankind. But you can be sure that in most
>> >countries there are people who would like to take over. You don't think
>> >that Hitler and the Thule Society which trained him were just doing
>> >their civic duty, do you?
>>
>> Oh no.
>> They were Racists and freaks and quite insane.
>> Besides, you can't say that Hitler didn't give people a forewarning of
his
>> plans.
>> He put them all on paper while still imprisoned.
>> --
>> Wiley997
>
>Your example of the CRIPs and Bloods is purely YOUR invention, not mine.
>If YOU want to imagine some all-powerful conspiracy where street gangs
>who are supposedly rivals are actually secretly allies, that is fine
>with me. But I did not invent this theory, you did, as a strawman
>argument. I didn't even consider mentioning the FreeMasons in terms of
>dope dealing, you did. So, please don't force your theories on me.
Tom Krummell (E. Scrooge, Esq.)
Brother Jackson--
Be that the Modem Handshake?
Oh, ohh-h-h-hh. Another secret revealed.
Tom Krummell
Roseville, CA
----------
ri...@lcc.net wrote:
> I<small snip>
> Of course, Freemasons have ways to recognize each other even over the
> internet. Ways that non-Masons are not knowledgeable with.
>
> Richard Jackson, PM
> Corrigan Masonic Lodge #1103 AF&AM
> Corrigan, Texas
>
--
- The mockingbird can change its tune eighty-seven times in seven minutes.
Politicians regard this interesting fact with envy.
Bolivar T. Shagnasty
>Are you not aware that in our Republic an accuser must make
>him/herself know to the accused?
Bolivar regrets to inform you that this is not so, Master West.
Not only do law enforcement agents routinely get search and seizure
warrants on the strength of (alleged) "secret" informants, but your
friendly Demican government has instituted non-public trials for those
whom it labels (without recourse) "terrorists".
/----------------------------------------------\
| Bolivar T. Shagnasty |
| President for Life |
| International War Orphans Fund |
| |
| "God put peat only in Celtic lands because |
| He knows Celts are the only people who drink |
| enough to try to burn mud." -- P.J. O'Rourke |
\----------------------------------------------/
Wiley997
ri...@lcc.net wrote in message <6g4hrs$p2e$1...@nnrp1.dejanews.com>...
***SNIP***
>Also, Masonic membership is not secret.
> The first thing is to confirm there is a Masonic Lodge by the name given
in
>the address. Secondly, contact the Lodge if you are not sure I am a Mason,
>and ask them if I am a member.
>
>Of course, Freemasons have ways to recognize each other even over the
>internet. Ways that non-Masons are not knowledgeable with.
Not helping much to dispell the myths now are we?
--
Wiley997
zerospam.net
David Ryan wrote:
> Interesting.
> Then why can one never gain a direct answer from Masons?
> Most low level Masons are happy to tell people what you just did.
> An upper echeolon Mason...never speaks.
> Why do you suppose that is?
>
> David Ryan
It is perhaps dangerous to couch arguments in inuendo. As a great man
said, "When love walks out the door, hate flies inuendo."
It is difficult to name any great personage, from almost any field of
endeavor, scientific, religious, philosophic, that did not talk somewhat
paradoxically (indirectly). Your accusation against Masons could as well
be, and indeed often is, directed at, say, college professors eh?
Perhaps the answer to your question lies more in ones ability to "hear"
rather than in the answer given. Speaking to His disciples Jesus said,
'Unto you is given to know the mystery of the kingdom of God: but unto them
that are without, all these things are done in parables: that seeing they
may see, and not perceive; and hearing they may hear, and not understand;
lest at any time they should be converted, and their sins should be
forgiven them.” - Mark 4:10..,Luke 8:10, Matt 13:11. Doesn't that just
smack of conspiracy? Well, it depends upon ones understanding.
Silence is held in high esteem by all esoteric organizations. A
person’s highest experiences cannot be shared in words and actually lose
meaning for trying to speak it, there being no common terminology or common
understanding between people.
Beyond our ideas of wrongdoing and rightdoing, there is a field. I'll
meet you there.
ri...@lcc.net
In article <3525D206...@ix.netcom.com>,
tom...@ix.nospam.netcom.com wrote:
>
> Brother Jackson--
>
> Be that the Modem Handshake?
>
> Oh, ohh-h-h-hh. Another secret revealed.
>
> Tom Krummell
> Roseville, CA
> ----------
> - The mockingbird can change its tune eighty-seven times in seven minutes.
> Politicians regard this interesting fact with envy.
>
>
Brother Krummell,
Shhh! We do not want to tell the electronic cowans one of our electronic
secrets do we? The next thing we might disclose would be the deer antlers and
Mickey Mouse ears we wear at our midnight meetings. Oops! They might even
learn the real reason Masons meet!
Richard Jackson, PM
Corrigan Masonic Lodge #1103 AF&AM
Corrigan, Tx.
ri...@lcc.net
In article <3525F3BD...@zerospam.net>,
@zerospam.net wrote:
>
>
> David Ryan wrote:
>
> > Interesting.
> > Then why can one never gain a direct answer from Masons?
> > Most low level Masons are happy to tell people what you just did.
> > An upper echeolon Mason...never speaks.
> > Why do you suppose that is?
> >
> > David Ryan
>
>
David,
Although it has been said time and time again, I will repeat this:
No one Mason can speak for all of Masonry. Masonry is not organized under one
World wide governing body, but state by state, province by provence or country
by country. The highest degree a Mason can receive in Lodge is the Third, or
Master Mason's Degree. In Lodge or Grand Lodge all Master Masons are of the
same standing. Anyone we put over us is elected by us. The other degrees
that Master Masons earn ,if they wish, are not Degrees of the Masonic Lodge,
but organizations that are outside of the regular Lodge. These Organizations
require a man be a Master Mason, but Master Masons do not have to join them.
Many Masons do join these worthwhile bodies because of the good work they do
and the brotherhood. A man who loves Masonry and has the time to devote to it
will often join two, and in some jurisdictions three or more Lodges as well as
Scottish or York Rite and the Shrine, or others.
The old saw about "higher level Masons" is inaccurate and downright ignorant.
Perhaps you mean Grand Lodge Officers? Since most Grand Lodge officers are
have many years in Masonry, perhaps they have learned, as I should, that
nothing they can say will change the mind of someone who is not willing to
listen.
Richard Jackson, PM
Corrigan Masonic Lodge #1103 AF&AM
Corrigan, Texas