dog and peanut butter story: myth? really??
MAYBE
"peanut butter and dog" story in a thread's
title. I must be extremely gullible; one of
my cow-orkers told me this story a few weeks
ago, as if he were among the surprised guests
and I fell for it hook, line, and sinker...
he was full of details (e.g. the ...uh...
peanut-butter adorned person brazenly returned
to work next day -- it was a party of people
from his former employers -- and everyone
pretended nothing had happened.)
It makes me wonder how many of the other
stories my friends have passed along I have
fallen for? I have always rolled my eyes on
receiving solemn warnings about flashing my
headights, or email warnings about kidnappers
armed with bottles of Lady Clairol prowling
the shopping malls...
So, are these stories, received from friends
as first person stories ALSO well-known urban
legends? Do people who are in-the-know snicker
at me for my ingenuous belief?
Friend -- a hospital intern -- told me that,
on his shift, a Columbus car salesman, well-
known for his musical commercials, was brought
in with third-degree rectal burns. His wife,
discovering that (let's call him "Jed") had
been having an affair with another man, enticed
Jed into letting her tie him up one night.
Expecting some kinky pleasure, Jed was sorely
disappointed to receive a hot curling iron in
the rectum instead. His wife allegedly told him
that since he liked it "hot & up the butt", he
could enjoy himself all night; meanwhile, she packed
her bags and left him. According to my friend,
Jed's serious injuries were handed discreetly
by the OSU Hospital. This was given as the reason
that "Kim" was no longer appearing in "Jed Pikert's"
singing TV commercials.
Friend 2 (an ER nurse) told me that she came
on shift to discover a woman on a gurney, looking
extremely embarrassed, her body entirely covered
by a sheet. Suddenly, from under the sheet, there
came a bark. Apparently the woman had been overly
affectionate with her dog, not realizing that a
dog's penis swells up after intercourse and that
they would be locked in love's embrace for hours...
The woman's story was that she was bathing her dog
in the nude, in order to keep her clothing dry.
This same friend is a wellspring of similar stories
concerning people with things stuck on or into
bodily places (penis in a coke bottle, snake that
crawled up someplace where no snake ought to be...)
Are *these* also well-known stories? Is my notion
that an emergency room is a very odd place
based on nothing more than a misplaced trust in
the honesty of my friends?
Mary
nancy g.
> I was taken aback to see a reference to the
> "peanut butter and dog" story in a thread's
> title. I must be extremely gullible; one of
> my cow-orkers told me this story a few weeks
> ago, as if he were among the surprised guests
> and I fell for it hook, line, and sinker...
(snip)
> Are *these* also well-known stories? Is my notion
> that an emergency room is a very odd place
> based on nothing more than a misplaced trust in
> the honesty of my friends?
The FAQ for this group may be found at:
Another immensely useful and interesting site is:
And, on behalf of myself, at least, welcome to AFU.
You've already proven yourself more clueful than a great
many of the newest batch of contributors to the group.
nancy "encouraging potential" g.
K. D.
MAYBE wrote in message <7q9ajo$n79$1...@ns3.umkc.edu>...
>I was taken aback to see a reference to the
>"peanut butter and dog" story in a thread's
>stories my friends have passed along I have
>fallen for? I have always rolled my eyes on
>receiving solemn warnings about flashing my
>headights, or email warnings about kidnappers
>armed with bottles of Lady Clairol prowling
>the shopping malls...
>
<snip>
>
>Friend -- a hospital intern -- told me that,
>on his shift, a Columbus car salesman, well-
>known for his musical commercials, was brought
>in with third-degree rectal burns.
<snip>
>Friend 2 (an ER nurse) told me that she came
>on shift to discover a woman on a gurney, looking
>extremely embarrassed, her body entirely covered
>by a sheet........
It scares me to think that folks like this actually work on live human
beings in the ER. They clearly have something wrong with thir personalities
if they feel compelled to tell these tired, old stories in the first-person.
Like, it doesn't dawn on them that the person hearing the story might run
across the story from another source and realize the jig is up?
You might find it useful to become known among your family, friends, and
co-workers for debunking UL's. Almost everyone who knows me knows that I
like to do this. So, very few send me or tell me any of this stuff anymore.
On the rare occasions they do, they ask upfront if I have heard anything
about the BSness of said story, or (better yet) a few have taken to actually
checking out the veracity of said stories themselves.
If nothing else, I am hopeful that the step they have to go thru in deciding
whether or not I would want to hear about a given alleged incident will help
them evaluate the likelihood of it being bogus.
The problem with this approach is that you cut down, dramatically, on the
number of ULs you receive, compared to what you used to receive from all
these sources. So, if you want to keep up with what types of UL's are
circulating, you'll have to tune in here regularly.
This type of exchange can also be useful in educating children about UL's.
After a few such scenes involving friends of my kids (one recently, about
the AIDS needles in theater seats), in which I gently explained about UL's
and how they start and how to spot one, etc., such stories have fallen off
dramatically. Now, on the occasions when the kids share such stories with
me, they preface them with remarks like, "This is what I heard at school -
do you think it's true? Does this sound bogus? Does this sound like a UL?"
etc.
It can be fun. But, what I find the most fun is probably the rare occasions
when I run across something that sounds so crazy it must be a UL, and it is
actually true. Truth can truly be stranger than fiction.
Charles Wm. Dimmick
> So, are these stories, received from friends
> as first person stories ALSO well-known urban
> legends?
Some are, and others are perfectly true. It takes training
and some polite but careful questioning to tell the difference.
> Friend -- a hospital intern -- told me that,
> on his shift, a Columbus car salesman, well-
> known for his musical commercials, was brought
> in with third-degree rectal burns.
This one could be true. The mere fact that it has not made the
rounds as an Urban Legend increases the probability that it
is a real incident. My wife worked in an emergency room for
a while and she would occasionally come home with events
from the previous night that were just as bizarre. That's part
of what makes it harder to prove the ULs are really ULs;
they do not at first blush seem much stranger than some real
events.
[....]
> Friend 2 (an ER nurse) told me that she came
> on shift to discover a woman on a gurney, looking
> extremely embarrassed, her body entirely covered
> by a sheet. Suddenly, from under the sheet, there
> came a bark. Apparently the woman had been overly
> affectionate with her dog, not realizing that a
> dog's penis swells up after intercourse and that
> they would be locked in love's embrace for hours...
> The woman's story was that she was bathing her dog
> in the nude, in order to keep her clothing dry.
Now, _this_ one smells a little bit more like a UL.
It would merit further investigation, also more details.
The first question I would ask is What size of dog?
The swelling part is right, but even swollen the
average dog penis is just not big enough to lock in
place in a human vagina. Any experts out there?
> Are *these* also well-known stories? Is my notion
> that an emergency room is a very odd place
> based on nothing more than a misplaced trust in
> the honesty of my friends?
Good questions. Keep on being skeptical but don't
automatically disbelieve, just as you should not
automatically believe.
Charles Wm. Dimmick
"And some rin up hill and down dale, knapping
the chucky stanes to pieces wi' hammers, like
sae mony road-makers run daft -- they say it is
to see how the warld was made!"
steve
>I was taken aback to see a reference to the
>"peanut butter and dog" story in a thread's
>title. I must be extremely gullible; one of
>my cow-orkers told me this story a few weeks
>ago, as if he were among the surprised guests
>and I fell for it hook, line, and sinker...
>he was full of details (e.g. the ...uh...
>peanut-butter adorned person brazenly returned
>to work next day -- it was a party of people
>from his former employers -- and everyone
>pretended nothing had happened.)
>
>It makes me wonder how many of the other
>stories my friends have passed along I have
>fallen for? I have always rolled my eyes on
>receiving solemn warnings about flashing my
>headights, or email warnings about kidnappers
>armed with bottles of Lady Clairol prowling
>the shopping malls...
>
>So, are these stories, received from friends
>as first person stories ALSO well-known urban
>legends? Do people who are in-the-know snicker
>at me for my ingenuous belief?
>
>Friend -- a hospital intern -- told me that,
>on his shift, a Columbus car salesman, well-
>known for his musical commercials, was brought
>in with third-degree rectal burns. His wife,
>discovering that (let's call him "Jed") had
>been having an affair with another man, enticed
>Jed into letting her tie him up one night.
>Expecting some kinky pleasure, Jed was sorely
>disappointed to receive a hot curling iron in
>the rectum instead. His wife allegedly told him
>that since he liked it "hot & up the butt", he
>could enjoy himself all night; meanwhile, she packed
>her bags and left him. According to my friend,
>Jed's serious injuries were handed discreetly
>by the OSU Hospital. This was given as the reason
>that "Kim" was no longer appearing in "Jed Pikert's"
>singing TV commercials.
>
>Friend 2 (an ER nurse) told me that she came
>on shift to discover a woman on a gurney, looking
>extremely embarrassed, her body entirely covered
>by a sheet. Suddenly, from under the sheet, there
>came a bark. Apparently the woman had been overly
>affectionate with her dog, not realizing that a
>dog's penis swells up after intercourse and that
>they would be locked in love's embrace for hours...
>The woman's story was that she was bathing her dog
>in the nude, in order to keep her clothing dry.
>This same friend is a wellspring of similar stories
>concerning people with things stuck on or into
>bodily places (penis in a coke bottle, snake that
>crawled up someplace where no snake ought to be...)
>
>Are *these* also well-known stories? Is my notion
>that an emergency room is a very odd place
>based on nothing more than a misplaced trust in
>the honesty of my friends?
>
>Mary
are dogs allergic to PB?
Simon Slavin
mcro...@cctr.umkc.edu (MAYBE) wrote:
> I must be extremely gullible; one of
> my cow-orkers told me this story a few weeks
> ago, as if he were among the surprised guests
> and I fell for it
That doesn't make you extremely gullible, it makes you
average. Thousands of people fall for this story -- that's
what makes it such a widely-spread UL.
Simon.
--
<http://www.hearsay.demon.co.uk> | ... you start off with a typical message,
No junk email please. | let's say a 2.5MB Word document containing
ET may've phoned /us/. | three lines of text and a macro virus ...
Help play the tape: SETI@home. | -- Peter Gutmann
Eve
>> on his shift, a Columbus car salesman, well-
>> known for his musical commercials, was brought
>> in with third-degree rectal burns.
>
>rounds as an Urban Legend increases the probability that it
>is a real incident.
Well, it has made the rounds.
http://www.snopes.com/sex/revenge/curliron.htm
>> dog's penis swells up after intercourse and that
>> they would be locked in love's embrace for hours...
<snip>
>The first question I would ask is What size of dog?
>The swelling part is right, but even swollen the
>average dog penis is just not big enough to lock in
>place in a human vagina. Any experts out there?
Well, I'm not an exactly an expert, but I know from personal experience that a
human vagina is pretty elastic. It would have to be pretty big to be
stuck--bigger than the average baby, for instance(1). I can't imagine a dog
*that* well hung.
(1) Yes, I know some babies do get stuck, but most come right out once they get
that far.
Eve "How big was the one that got away?"
The Church of Peter Gabriel
http://members.aol.com/ninkasi/index.html
Eve
The Church of Peter Gabriel
http://members.aol.com/ninkasi/index.html
Don Whittington
<flowrchi...@prodigy.net> wrote:
> The problem with this approach is that you cut down, dramatically, on the
> number of ULs you receive, compared to what you used to receive from all
> these sources. So, if you want to keep up with what types of UL's are
> circulating, you'll have to tune in here regularly.
Hmmm...folks communicate with you...you communicate back...folks stop
communicating with you.
Don "Clues are us" Whittington
Lisa Keipp
> Well, I'm not an exactly an expert, but I know from personal experience that a human vagina is pretty elastic. It would have to be pretty big to be stuck--bigger than the average baby, for instance(1). I can't imagine a dog *that* well hung.
>
> (1) Yes, I know some babies do get stuck, but most come right out once they get that far.
>
There is also a condition (the term escapes me at the moment) in which
the vagina can "lock" up, holding captive anything put into it - dog,
human, vegetable, toy - and the only cure is muscle relaxants. There
are scientifically documented cases of this happening; it is usually
caused by a great fright or being suddenly startled (hubby walks in on
it!).
There is even a "case" (I'd call it a UL) where one of George
Washington's maids and one of his officers were "caught" by the great
general himself in the linen closet (much bigger in those days) and the
young lady did not "release" for 12 hours, when a doctor was finally
called and the young lady was administered opium.
Needless to say, she went home in disgrace. The officer? Probably kidded
for the rest of his life.
Lisa "Ain't history fun?" Keipp
Lisa Keipp
> are dogs allergic to PB?
I don't think so, but chocolate can kill them if they eat more than one
peice
Becca Ward
> steve wrote:
>
> > are dogs allergic to PB?
Based upon purely anecdotal research, Labrador Retrievers aren't.[1]
> I don't think so, but chocolate can kill them if they eat more than one
> peice
Absolutely no personal offense intended, but -- cite? I Know The Fact
that chocolate contains something toxic to dogs. But one piece? I know a
certain 8-pound poodle who gorged on Hershey's kisses on Halloween, with
little ill effect. And a 60-lb. Springer Spaniel who snarfed a five-lb.
box of Godiva one Valentine's Day, and spent the night at veterinary
emergency, but survived after a stomach-pumping.
Becca "receive/recieve, piece/peice, let's call the whole thing off" Ward
--
Taylor's is a sad, Dickensian tale, in which a cold, hard-
nosed triumvirate tries everything within its power to
separate a woman from the potbellied porcine pet she loves.
_Gebauer v. Lake Forest Property Owners Assoc., Inc.,_
723 So.2d 1288 (Ala. Civ. App. 1998)
Ian A. York
Lisa Keipp <lke...@netexpress.net> wrote:
>
>There is also a condition (the term escapes me at the moment) in which
>the vagina can "lock" up, holding captive anything put into it - dog,
The term you're looking for is "penis captivus". It doesn't exist.
>human, vegetable, toy - and the only cure is muscle relaxants. There
>are scientifically documented cases of this happening; it is usually
>caused by a great fright or being suddenly startled (hubby walks in on
No there aren't. There are rumours of scientific documentation, there's
no actual documentation. If you have a reference, please post it. (And
unless you read Czech and happen to have back issues of Cesk Gynekol. as
your bathroom reading, you don't have one.)
Don't bother posting William Osler's 1884 publication. It was, as Sir
William confessed, pure fabrication, that he published as a practical
joke. Lots of people have fallen for it, so you've got plenty of company.
You might do slightly better if you posted references to Br Med J 1980 Jan
5;280(6206):51 or to Br Med J 1979 Oct 20;2(6196):977-8, since the former
is from a guy who thinks he saw a case when he was a youth (he's now an
elderly man; I'm pretty skeptical about his memory), and the latter thinks
that it might not be *entirely* mythical--but has now completely
disappeared (again I'm pretty dubious about the ancient reports they dig
up for the "not entirely mythical" possibility). Of course, these are not
by any stretch of the imagination scientifically documented.
>Lisa "Ain't history fun?" Keipp
Especially when it's all made up, yeah.
Much more fun is http://www.urbanlegends.com, which includes the AFU FAQ,
which in turn includes this line--
Fb. Hetero couple get stuck together while coupling. Separated at
hospital. ["The Stuck Couple" in TCD]
The "Fb" means "beleived false", and the "TCD" refers to Jan Harold
Brunvand's book on urban legends that discussed this UL, The Choking
Doberman.
Ian "That's http://www.urbanlegends.com" York
--
Ian York (iay...@panix.com) <http://www.panix.com/~iayork/>
"-but as he was a York, I am rather inclined to suppose him a
very respectable Man." -Jane Austen, The History of England
Robert Alston
Lisa Keipp <lke...@netexpress.net> wrote in message
news:C8AF80BB310EC3AE.B524466E...@lp.airnews.net
...
> Eve wrote:
>
> > Well, I'm not an exactly an expert, but I know from personal
experience that a human vagina is pretty elastic. It would have to be
pretty big to be stuck--bigger than the average baby, for instance(1).
I can't imagine a dog *that* well hung.
> >
> > (1) Yes, I know some babies do get stuck, but most come right out
once they get that far.
> >
which
> the vagina can "lock" up, holding captive anything put into it -
dog,
There
> are scientifically documented cases of this happening; it is usually
> caused by a great fright or being suddenly startled (hubby walks in
on
There are? Are you absolutely sure of this little fact? Good. Now all
you have to do is find a case of it listed somewhere. Then post where
you found it to the group. This is called a cite. You see some of us
have a problem with this one. We have never been able to track this
one down. We have tho heard of it hapening, but it was always one of
those third hand reports. And when it is considered that me and my
friends play in ways that would cause this to happen (if it were of
course possible) then the fact that we have never run into to it is a
definite counter to the claim.
>
> There is even a "case" (I'd call it a UL) where one of George
> Washington's maids and one of his officers were "caught" by the
great
> general himself in the linen closet (much bigger in those days) and
the
> young lady did not "release" for 12 hours, when a doctor was finally
> called and the young lady was administered opium.
>
Now that is a new one to me.
> Needless to say, she went home in disgrace. The officer? Probably
kidded
> for the rest of his life.
Why would she go home in disgrace? It would be more likely that she
would have no problems finding other employment with someone else if
the General for some reason discharged her.
>
> Lisa "Ain't history fun?" Keipp
Yes it is but that wasn't history.
Robert Alston
Madeleine Page
>steve wrote:
>> are dogs allergic to PB?
>I don't think so, but chocolate can kill them if they eat more than one
>peice
It'd need to be a small dog and a fairly substantial piece of the wrong
sort of chocolate. Theobromine, the agent in chocolate that can be lethal
to dogs, has not been fatal at less than 200 mg per kg dog body weight.
Dark chocolate has 450 mg an ounce, so I guess a one ounce piece of
chocolate could render a toy poodle somewhat dead. (Ask Binky: as
I recall, he was hospitalized as a result of scarfing chocolate). Some
forms of cocoa or baker's chocolate go as high as 600 mg/oz, so a 1 kg toy
poodle wouldn't need a lot to wind up croaking.
Then again, I believe it's a UL that something that weighs 1 kg *is* a
dog.
Madeleine "Binky, for instance, is more like a very loud hamster" Page
Paul Tomblin
>that chocolate contains something toxic to dogs. But one piece? I know a
>certain 8-pound poodle who gorged on Hershey's kisses on Halloween, with
>little ill effect. And a 60-lb. Springer Spaniel who snarfed a five-lb.
And I know a 10 pound waste of skin^W^W^Wpoodle who ate 8 ounces of finest
Godiva chocolates, and had to be rushed to the vet because he'd lost control
over his legs and kept falling over (as well as the usual barfing and shitting
that accompanies his experiences with lesser amounts of chocolate). The vet
said that one ounce of chocolate per pound of dog weight is sometimes enough
to be fatal.
--
Paul Tomblin, not speaking for anybody.
SETI@Home: Finally a *good* way to impress Jodie Foster
http://www.setiathome.ssl.berkeley.edu/
Madeleine Page
>There is also a condition (the term escapes me at the moment) in which
>the vagina can "lock" up, holding captive anything put into it - dog,
>human, vegetable, toy - and the only cure is muscle relaxants.
Vaginismus, I think, though that classically refers to a spasmodic
contraction of vaginal muscles that prevents penetration rather than
withdrawal.
There is some question about whether it's a bona fide medical condition
(found a paper on it via MedLine and now cannot find it again, dammit).
But since MedLine shows 11,433 mentions of the term, I rather think it is
a recognized condition. Interestinly, most of the cites seem to be
connected to issues of male erectile dysfunction.
>There
>are scientifically documented cases of this happening; it is usually
>caused by a great fright or being suddenly startled (hubby walks in on
>it!).
Can you tell us where? I went to MedLine, but wasn't able to refine my
query enough to get anything germane to this discussion. (What *is* the
proper medical term for "clamp on like a bastard", anyway?)
>There is even a "case" (I'd call it a UL) where one of George
>Washington's maids and one of his officers were "caught" by the great
>general himself in the linen closet (much bigger in those days) and the
>young lady did not "release" for 12 hours, when a doctor was finally
>called and the young lady was administered opium.
Madeleine "by which time I would have expected him to have had something
like the after-effects of priapism -- penile gangrene" Page
David Hatunen
Lisa Keipp <lke...@netexpress.net> wrote:
>steve wrote:
>
>> are dogs allergic to PB?
>
>I don't think so, but chocolate can kill them if they eat more than one
>peice
Shirley the Wonderdog, a pet of mine some years back, once managed
to get to a plate of chocolate chip cookies we left out while we
were gone. She looked as sick as you'd expect anyone to look after
they'd eaten that many cookies for their weight, but she
suffered no longer term ill effects, despite the rather large
number of chocolate chips involved.
Perhaps you have a citation for the supposed poisonous effects of
chocolate on dogs? Or perhaps the definition of "one piece" means
a kilogram.
--
********** DAVE HATUNEN (hat...@sonic.net) ***********
* Daly City California *
******* My typos are intentional copyright traps ******
Chip Taylor
>
>Perhaps you have a citation for the supposed poisonous effects of
>chocolate on dogs? Or perhaps the definition of "one piece" means
>a kilogram.
>
Kirk and Bistner's Handbook of Veterinary Procedures & Emergency Treatment
by Stephen I. Bistner, Richard B. Ford, Robert Warren Kirk ISBN: 0721649726
states that:
" Chocolate is Poison!
For a 50-pound dog a toxic dose of milk chocolate is 50 ounces.
For a 50-pound dog a toxic dose of semi-sweet chocolate is 15 ounces.
For a 50-pound dog a toxic dose of baking chocolate is 5 ounces.
Obviously the chocolate in milk chocolate is diluted and this is why many
dogs can eat a piece of chocolate and seem not to show any toxic effects. The
problem with feeding a dog milk chocolate treats is that it develops a liking
for chocolate. Since dogs do not seem to be as sensitive to bitter tastes as
humans it may then eat the more concentrated - and very toxic - baker's
chocolate if it gets a chance.
Chip Taylor
"Some days you're the dog, some days you're the hydrant."
Bob Ward
David Hatunen <hat...@bolt.sonic.net> wrote in message
news:7qehp1$omm$1...@ultra.sonic.net...
> In article
<808BB933F5670B3D.A83E903E...@lp.airnews.net>,
> Lisa Keipp <lke...@netexpress.net> wrote:
> >steve wrote:
> >
> >> are dogs allergic to PB?
> >
> >I don't think so, but chocolate can kill them if they eat more than one
> >peice
>
> Shirley the Wonderdog, a pet of mine some years back, once managed
> to get to a plate of chocolate chip cookies we left out while we
> were gone. She looked as sick as you'd expect anyone to look after
> they'd eaten that many cookies for their weight, but she
> suffered no longer term ill effects, despite the rather large
> number of chocolate chips involved.
>
> chocolate on dogs? Or perhaps the definition of "one piece" means
> a kilogram.
Presented for your consideration:
http://dspace.dial.pipex.com/town/square/tac61/dogchoc.htm
Chocolate and Dogs
Theobromine, a constituent of chocolate, is toxic to dogs. The effect on the
dog is dependant upon the amount ingested and the body weight of the dog,
ie. a small dog will be more affected than a large dog if both eat the same
amount.
The reaction will vary between dogs, some only suffering mild diarrhoea
whilst it may trigger cardiac irregularity or even epileptic fits or in
others.
Dark cooking chocolate contains the highest amount of theobromine (up to
28mg/g) with the dark continental type chocolate (16mg/g) next, even milk
chocolate contains a small amount (2mg/g). Theobromine cannot be easily
metabolised and excreted from the dog's system so the effect is cumulative.
Chocolate Drops made specifically for dogs should, of course, contain little
or no theobromine but one has to wonder whether the quality control
procedures of all manufacturers of dog chocolates are adequate to guarantee
the absence of theobromine and the most prudent policy may well be to avoid
giving chocolate of any kind to dogs.
Above all, keep those dark made-for-human chocolates well out of reach.
Veterinary help should be sought if it is suspected that your dog has
ingested a large amount of chocolate.
http://www.choco.com/faq.html#Section_3.3
3.3 Can I give chocolate to my dog?
Unequivocally, no. The theobromine in chocolate that stimulates the cardiac
and nervous systems is too much for dogs, especially smaller pups. A
chocolate bar is poisonous to dogs and can even be lethal. The same holds
true for cats, and other household pets.
http://goodhousekeeping.com/depts/pastime/vetq05b2.htm
Q:My dog seems to like chocolate, and I occasionally give him a small
amount. Is it true that this could make him sick? - Michael E.
A:Yes - chocolate contains theobromine, a toxicant responsible for causing
illness. Signs of toxicity - including vomiting, excessive thirst, diarrhea,
restlessness, and agitation - typically develop in six to eight hours.
Kidney damage, seizures, heart rhythm irregularities, and death may result
in severe cases.
There is no real antidote for a theobromine overdose. Supportive care can be
given, and vomiting can be induced if the case is caught early enough.
Obviously, the best course of action is not to feed your dog chocolate to
begin with and to be sure to hide your own chocolate stash so your dog can't
help himself!
http://www.netpet.com/articles/choc.tox.html
The Net.Pet Home Page
Notes on Chocolate Toxicity in Dogs
by Bonnie Dalzell, MA
The following information is taken from: Kirk and Bistner's Handbook of
Veterinary Procedures and Emergency Treatment (6th edition) (a very useful
book):
Chocolate - active ingredient = theobromine:
The half life in the dog is 17.5 hours
The Toxic dose in the dog is 100-150 mg/kg.
A kilogram ()kg = 2.2 lbs.
A milligram(mg) = 1/1000 of a gram
So for a 50 lb. dog a toxic dose would be roughly 2.2 grams (2200 mg) of
pure chocolate.
However the concentration of theobromine varies with the formulation of the
chocolate so:
Milk chocolate has 44mg/oz (154mg/100gm): toxic dose for 50 lb dog - 50 oz
of milk chocolate.
Semisweet chocolate has 150 mg/oz (528mg/100gm): toxic dose for 50 lb dog -
15 oz of semisweet chocolate
Baking chocolate 390mg/oz (1365 mg/100gm): toxic dose for 50 lb dog - 5 oz
of baking chocolate
Thus a dog eating one oz of baking chocolate would have to eat almost 3 oz
of semisweet or 10 oz of milk chocolate to get the same dose of theobromine.
The theobromine in candies consisting of chocolate that is coated over some
other substance - as in filled candies and chocolate coated dried fruits,
etc will be more dilute than that in pure chocolate bars and solid chocolate
candies.
Obviously the chocolate in milk chocolate is quite dilute and this is why
many dogs can eat a piece here and there and seem not to show toxic effects,
how many dogs would get ahold of 50 oz at a time? This is not true of the
more concentrated forms however. Dr Sue Bank's experience was that she had
two dogs, a 95 pound one and a 60 pound one. Thye got ahold of 2 one pound
bags of Nestle's semi-sweet chocolate pieces (a bag each). The 95 pound dog
survived but the 60 pound dog ingested a toxic dose.
The problem with feeding a dog milk chocolate as a treat is that it develops
a liking for chocolate and since dogs do not seem to be as sensitive to
bitter tastes as humans - it may then eat the more concentrated, and thus
quite toxic, baker's chocolate if it gets a chance or it will consume a
toxic amount of milk or semi-sweet chocolate if it can get into a improperly
stored supply.
Treatment which is best administered by someone with medical training
follows the same strategy as treatment for caffine overdose:
Support Respiration
Support cardiovascular function, control arrhythmias, control electrolytes
and acid-base balance.
Control CNS excitation.
Emesis
Gastric lavage
Cathartic
Activated charcoal
Administration of an activated charcoal slurry is a major component of the
treatment and needs to be administered by a verterinarian - it is not a home
treatment.
How about it? Will that suffice? If not, I still have 497 more links I
found by doing a websearch on "Dog + Chocolate"
David Hatunen
Well, duh. The same applies to drinking water. I have little doubt
that chocolate has some bad stuff in limited quantities. Antying
that good *must*.
[Stuff telling us how much bad stuff is in chocolate but not how
much is how bad for dogs deleted]
You're missing the point, to wit: the toxicity that makes one piece
fatal. We already have considerable anecdotal evidence, namely two
posts, that certainly one reasonable size piece is not sufficient.
Charles Wm. Dimmick
> Can you tell us where? I went to MedLine, but wasn't able to refine my
> query enough to get anything germane to this discussion. (What *is* the
> proper medical term for "clamp on like a bastard", anyway?)
I donno, but when I was growing up we called it "snapping turtle pussy."
Charles
Chris W.
Madeleine Page wrote:
>
> Lisa Keipp <lke...@netexpress.net> wrote:
>
> >There is also a condition (the term escapes me at the moment) in which
> >the vagina can "lock" up, holding captive anything put into it - dog,
> >human, vegetable, toy - and the only cure is muscle relaxants.
>
> Vaginismus, I think, though that classically refers to a spasmodic
> contraction of vaginal muscles that prevents penetration rather than
> withdrawal.
>
> There is some question about whether it's a bona fide medical condition
> (found a paper on it via MedLine and now cannot find it again, dammit).
> But since MedLine shows 11,433 mentions of the term, I rather think it is
> a recognized condition. Interestinly, most of the cites seem to be
> connected to issues of male erectile dysfunction.
>
From _Women's Encyclopedia of Health & Emotional Healing_ by Denise
Foley and Eileen Nechas, 1993:
"(something takes the place of pleasure - like pain.)
It's called vaginismus and it's the third most common cause of sexual
dysfunction in women. What happens? There's an involuntary tightening
of the muscles surrounding the opening of the vagina and the outer
one-third of the vagina that prevents the penis from penetrating. It
means that sex is impossible at worst, or sporadic and painful at best."
However, although there are many medical doctors and other professionals
acknowledged for their expertise in writing the book, the non-MD writers
don't have a citation for the particular paragraph I just used.
There are many trustable web sites out there that address the issue of
vaginismus. Among them are:
http://www.womentc.com/vaginismus.htm
http://mentalhelp.net/disorders/sx97.htm
http://wso.williams.edu/orgs/peerh/women/wsexfunc.html
http://homepages.go.com/~mypenis1/illness550.html
http://www.siu.edu/offices/counsel/sexbehav.htm
http://cpmcnet.columbia.edu/texts/guide/hmg09_0011.html
These ones all suggest that the disorder is of psychological origin
(anxiety) and that the main problem is inability to penetrate or painful
intercourse rather than "clamping down" *after* successful penetration.
Chris Webb
Ulo Melton
>Madeleine Page wrote:
>> Can you tell us where? I went to MedLine, but wasn't able to refine my
>> query enough to get anything germane to this discussion. (What *is* the
>> proper medical term for "clamp on like a bastard", anyway?)
>I donno, but when I was growing up we called it "snapping turtle pussy."
Are you sure you're not thinking of vagina dentata?
Ulo "bimolar disorder" Melton
Becca Ward
> How about it? Will that suffice? If not, I still have 497 more links I
> found by doing a websearch on "Dog + Chocolate"
What about "white chocolate"?
No, nevermind. My personal thanks for the information from you, Paul
Tomblin and Chip Taylor. Though I was aware that Something in Chocolate
is bad for dogs (I wasn't aware of the cat-angle), I did not know the
dog-weight/chocolate-weight ratio, or how the different types of chocolate
compared. We've simply tried to take the safe route and keep the stuff
out of nose range.
Just don't tell my dogs that they can't ever ever have pizza.
Becca Ward
Steve Jones
>
> Madeleine Page wrote:
>
> > Can you tell us where? I went to MedLine, but wasn't able to refine my
> > query enough to get anything germane to this discussion. (What *is* the
> > proper medical term for "clamp on like a bastard", anyway?)
>
> I donno, but when I was growing up we called it "snapping turtle pussy."
>
Similar terminology in mid-60's Oklahoma...minus the "turtle". I learned it
while in high school, working in the "food service" at the VA hospital in
Oklahoma City. It was related to me by a fellow dishwasher who claimed to
have experienced same.
Of course, during WWII he also helped raise the American flag on Mt.
Surabachi, was a turret gunner on a PBY-5, and was with Patton in Sicily.
Since he was a reliable source of bummed Pall Malls, I felt obligated to
believe him.
Steve "got a smoke?" Jones
Ulo Melton
>Similar terminology in mid-60's Oklahoma...minus the "turtle". I learned it
>while in high school, working in the "food service" at the VA hospital in
>Oklahoma City. It was related to me by a fellow dishwasher who claimed to
>have experienced same.
>Of course, during WWII he also helped raise the American flag on Mt.
>Surabachi, was a turret gunner on a PBY-5, and was with Patton in Sicily.
>Since he was a reliable source of bummed Pall Malls, I felt obligated to
>believe him.
I once worked with a fellow who'd been a smokejumper, a Green Beret, a
Montana sheriff (for two years), and a rodeo rider who'd broken every
bone in his body. He was 19 years old and working as a receiving clerk
when I knew him. Had I known him a bit better, I suspect he'd have been
the diver who was found dead in a tree, probably by himself during his
smokejumping career.
Ulo Melton
Michele Tepper
>And I know a 10 pound waste of skin^W^W^Wpoodle who ate 8 ounces of finest
>Godiva chocolates, and had to be rushed to the vet because he'd lost control
>over his legs and kept falling over (as well as the usual barfing and shitting
>that accompanies his experiences with lesser amounts of chocolate). The vet
>said that one ounce of chocolate per pound of dog weight is sometimes enough
>to be fatal.
So close and yet so far, eh, Paul?
Michele "we'll make sure that next shipment of chocolate does the trick
for sure^W^W^W^W^W^W^W^W^W^W^W^W all be sorry to see Binky go" Tepper
--
Michele Tepper "In Europe, we all think you're barbaric!"
mte...@panix.com -- Jon Langford, in Chicago
Visit the scenic AFU archives and FAQ! http://www.urbanlegends.com
JoAnne Schmitz
wrote:
>You might find it useful to become known among your family, friends, and
>co-workers for debunking UL's. Almost everyone who knows me knows that I
>like to do this. So, very few send me or tell me any of this stuff anymore.
Actually, they still do, you just have them all killfiled.
JoAnne "hey, this is fun" Schmitz
JoAnne Schmitz
wrote:
>> Friend 2 (an ER nurse) told me that she came
>> on shift to discover a woman on a gurney, looking
>> extremely embarrassed, her body entirely covered
>> by a sheet. Suddenly, from under the sheet, there
>> came a bark. Apparently the woman had been overly
>> affectionate with her dog, not realizing that a
>> dog's penis swells up after intercourse and that
>> they would be locked in love's embrace for hours...
>> The woman's story was that she was bathing her dog
>> in the nude, in order to keep her clothing dry.
>
>Now, _this_ one smells a little bit more like a UL.
>It would merit further investigation, also more details.
>The first question I would ask is What size of dog?
>The swelling part is right, but even swollen the
>average dog penis is just not big enough to lock in
>place in a human vagina. Any experts out there?
I'm no expert, but this is a nice combination of the Peanut Butter Dog and the
Stuck Couple.
I read a similar story in Nancy Friday's _Men In Love_, which is basically a
pretty interesting and diverse book of men's fantasies (in contrast, her book of
women's fantasies is full of stupid fluff and posturing). In that story, the
dog's paramour was a man, not a woman, and his wife came home early, and he
decided to hurt himself (and I suppose the dog too) rather than be caught in
such a compromising position.
That tale had an element of the "nailing body part to floor of burning building"
sort of curse.
JoAnne "why is the dog yelping, Bob?" Schmitz
------------------------------------------------------+----------------------------
"an intact pus-filled anything isn't going to survive | http://www.snopes.com
the processing fast food is subjected to." | http://www.urbanlegends.com
Barbara Mikkelson, on alt.folklore.urban | http://www.dejanews.com
visit the afu info page at <http://www.qis.net/~jschmitz/afu>
Randy Poe
> The vet said that one ounce of chocolate per pound of dog weight is
> sometimes enough to be fatal.
Oh my god, an actual number. First one I've ever seen on
this subject.
Now I can stop freaking when my thieving 65-pound lab
snatches a piece of chocolate chip cookie.
Randy "doing the experiment on the cats now" Poe
Brian Yeoh
> In article <C8AF80BB310EC3AE.B524466E...@lp.airnews.net>,
> Lisa Keipp <lke...@netexpress.net> wrote:
> >There is also a condition (the term escapes me at the moment) in which
> >the vagina can "lock" up, holding captive anything put into it - dog,
> The term you're looking for is "penis captivus". It doesn't exist.
Doesn't vaginismus exist as a condition?
> >human, vegetable, toy - and the only cure is muscle relaxants. There
> >are scientifically documented cases of this happening; it is usually
> >caused by a great fright or being suddenly startled (hubby walks in on
> No there aren't. There are rumours of scientific documentation, there's
> no actual documentation. If you have a reference, please post it. (And
> unless you read Czech and happen to have back issues of Cesk Gynekol. as
> your bathroom reading, you don't have one.)
There seem to be several sites on teh web at least referencing vaginismus,
among them:
http://cpmcnet.columbia.edu/texts/guide/hmg09_0011.html
where it says (begin unfair use)
Vaginismus. This is the sudden contraction of the muscles of the lower
outer third of the vagina, which can occur at any point in the sexual
response cycle. In some women, it occurs before the sexual response begins
and is precipitated by the knowledge that her partner is about to begin
sexual activity. Usually, vaginal penetration cannot occur, and when
penetration is forced, pain frequently results, leading to further muscle
contractions.
The underlying cause of vaginismus, as with many of the other
dysfunctions, is anxiety. The causes of the anxiety range from fears
associated with earlier painful intercourse, rape or a rapelike situation,
or fear of penetration associated with injury, violation, or impregnation.
Vaginismus, when not due to organic factors, usually can be treated by the
use of dilators or, in milder cases, the woman's and her partner's own
fingers. Both partners should understand the vaginal contraction is an
automatic response outside the woman's control and participate in
treatment
Now, I agree that it is a long way from vaginismus to penis captivus, but
this does seem to more closely reflect what Lisa was saying. And, m*tt*,
_IT COULD HAPPEN_.
Brian "I just like scare caps" Yeoh
Clear, unscaleable, ahead |
Rise the Mountains of Instead | -- WH Auden, "Autumn Song"
From whose cold cascading streams |
None may drink except in dreams. |
Brian Yeoh
> lke...@netexpress.net wrote:
> > There is also a condition (the term escapes me at the moment) in which
> > the vagina can "lock" up, holding captive anything put into it - dog,
> > human, vegetable, toy - and the only cure is muscle relaxants. There
> > are scientifically documented cases of this happening;
> YM "fabricated":
> http://snopes.simplenet.com/sex/penile/captivus.htm
<snip other cites>
> Lara "Brian can't resist a food thread, I can't resist a dysfunctional sex
> thread" Hoksnip
Brian carefully disguises his interest in dysfunctional sex threads. And
there are more than one tie-ins to food than the obvious.
As I was saying to the esteemable Dr Nyork, though; What about vaginismus?
Brian "I am what I eat" Yeoh
Lara Hopkins
> There is also a condition (the term escapes me at the moment) in which
> the vagina can "lock" up, holding captive anything put into it - dog,
> human, vegetable, toy - and the only cure is muscle relaxants. There
> are scientifically documented cases of this happening;
YM "fabricated":
http://snopes.simplenet.com/sex/penile/captivus.htm
This UL was also vectored in TMWDNSIM:
http://urbanlegends.about.com/library/weekly/aa093098.htm?rf=dp&COB=home&TMog=354328350121710&Mint=354328350121710
For some stuff you really don't want to know, and a lot of made-up or
exaggerated stuff, including "penis captivus" stories:
http://www.geocities.com/HotSprings/Spa/4502/vagfacts.html
Madeleine Page
>Paul Tomblin wrote:
>> The vet said that one ounce of chocolate per pound of dog weight is
>> sometimes enough to be fatal.
>Oh my god, an actual number. First one I've ever seen on
>this subject.
Ahem. The archive:
It has a whole piece about the effects of chocolate on dogs, written by
the late Justin Bukowski. Try
http://www.urbanlegends.com/animals/chocolate_and_dogs.html
>Now I can stop freaking when my thieving 65-pound lab
>snatches a piece of chocolate chip cookie.
Well, to be precise, you might be justified in continuing to freak about
the dog's manners, but ceasing to freak about its imminent demise.
Madeleine "Emily the Quadruped would, of course, never do anything like
steal a chocolate chip cookie" Page
Vicki Robinson
:
:Madeleine "Emily the Quadruped would, of course, never do anything like
:steal a chocolate chip cookie" Page
:
"Misha, sniff Emily's breath and see if she's eaten the Stilton."
Vicki "On the shelf, next to the pasta maker" Robinson
--
Mediation and Alternative Dispute Resolution Resources:
http://www.rit.edu/~vjrnts/mediation/mediation.html
The alt.folklore.urban FAQ and archive can be found at
http://www.urbanlegends.com/
Paul Tomblin
>Paul Tomblin <ptom...@xcski.com> wrote:
>>that accompanies his experiences with lesser amounts of chocolate). The vet
>>said that one ounce of chocolate per pound of dog weight is sometimes enough
>>to be fatal.
>
Yeah, next time make it two pounds of bakers chocolate.
Judy Johnson
>Charles Wm. Dimmick wrote:
>
>>Madeleine Page wrote:
>
>>> Can you tell us where? I went to MedLine, but wasn't able to refine my
>>> query enough to get anything germane to this discussion. (What *is* the
>>> proper medical term for "clamp on like a bastard", anyway?)
>
>>I donno, but when I was growing up we called it "snapping turtle pussy."
>
>Are you sure you're not thinking of vagina dentata?
Why are you bringing up musical meercats?
>Ulo "bimolar disorder" Melton
Judy "watch out for Cuspid's arrows" Johnson
Eve
>
>Vaginismus. This is the sudden contraction of the muscles of the lower
>outer third of the vagina, which can occur at any point in the sexual
>response cycle. In some women, it occurs before the sexual response begins
>and is precipitated by the knowledge that her partner is about to begin
>sexual activity. Usually, vaginal penetration cannot occur, and when
>penetration is forced, pain frequently results, leading to further muscle
>contractions.
>
>The underlying cause of vaginismus, as with many of the other
>dysfunctions, is anxiety. The causes of the anxiety range from fears
>associated with earlier painful intercourse, rape or a rapelike situation,
>or fear of penetration associated with injury, violation, or impregnation.
Right, but it seems to me (and I freely admit this is a)theoretical and
b)anecdotal information, please don't hurt me) that if you tensed up like that
after penetration you'd be more likely to push things out than hold them in.
In my experience, that's basically what vaginal muscles do--push things out
(aside from certain recreational uses, of course). So while I can see
vaginismus as a legitimate condition, it's hard for me to see how it could trap
a penis. Keep one out, yes. Keep one in, no. Especially since most male
organs are a (very little) bit wider at the bottom than they are at the top,
which ought to facilitate an exit (sort of like a watermelon seed--now there's
an image...). And if the female partner is enjoying herself to any degree,
then things should slide along pretty easily. A real medical cite would make
me reconsider, but as the owner of a standard model, I just don't see it
happening exept in some guy's fantasy.
Eve "I'll have to do some hands on research--you know, just to make sure"
The Church of Peter Gabriel
http://members.aol.com/ninkasi/index.html
Larry Palletti
wrote:
>On 30 Aug 1999, Ian A. York wrote:
>
>> In article <C8AF80BB310EC3AE.B524466E...@lp.airnews.net>,
>> Lisa Keipp <lke...@netexpress.net> wrote:
>> >There is also a condition (the term escapes me at the moment) in which
>> >the vagina can "lock" up, holding captive anything put into it ...
[...]
>> no actual documentation. If you have a reference, please post it. (And
>> unless you read Czech and happen to have back issues of Cesk Gynekol. as
>> your bathroom reading, you don't have one.)
>
>There seem to be several sites on teh web at least referencing vaginismus,
>among them:
>
>http://cpmcnet.columbia.edu/texts/guide/hmg09_0011.html
>
>where it says (begin unfair use)
>
>Vaginismus. This is the sudden contraction of the muscles of the lower
>outer third of the vagina, which can occur at any point in the sexual
>response cycle. In some women, it occurs before the sexual response begins
>and is precipitated by the knowledge that her partner is about to begin
>sexual activity. Usually, vaginal penetration cannot occur...
[...]
I'm a very old man (1) who has little experience these days with
Things Sexual (2). But it looks to me as though Lisa is addressing
one side of intercourse -- getting that thing out -- while Brian's
post talks about putting the little booger in. Quite a difference,
nuh?
Unless there's tons more (unquoted) info in the cite about vaginismus,
I don't see anything that backs the concept of "once in, you can't get
out."
But it *is* a happy thought (3).
(1) Harmless, too. Trust me.
(2) Okay, I lied.
(3) But still not a food thread.
Larry Palletti
East Point/Atlanta, Georgia
www.palletti.com la...@palletti.com booksonscreen.com
--
Opinionated, but lovable
"Boris, we know you're in there. Now, are you coming out like a sensible fellow, or are we going to have to drag you out?" -- Dick Tracy
Larry Palletti
<dim...@ccsu.edu> wrote:
>Madeleine Page wrote:
>
>> Can you tell us where? I went to MedLine, but wasn't able to refine my
>> query enough to get anything germane to this discussion. (What *is* the
>> proper medical term for "clamp on like a bastard", anyway?)
>
>I donno, but when I was growing up we called it "snapping turtle pussy."
>
Ah -- the noble Snapper. Much beloved among connoisseurs.
Having sired five bairns, I got to be fairly familiar with the
practice known as "Kegeling" (somebody correct that spelling,
please), in which the woman strengthens her vaginal muscles by
repeatedly contracting them. It helps control the actual contractions
of labor. And it tends to make later relations --- interesting.
Even Kegeling, which can hold back those massive birthing
contractions, can't grab hard enough to keep a perky penis from
withdrawing.
Mileage may certainly vary, and likely there are women who can snap
that thing like a bear trap. But I've not yet met one.
More's the pity.
Michele Tepper
Vicki Robinson <vjr...@xcski.com> wrote:
>In a previous article, Madeleine Page <mp...@panix.com> said:
>
>:
>:Madeleine "Emily the Quadruped would, of course, never do anything like
>:steal a chocolate chip cookie" Page
>
>"Misha, sniff Emily's breath and see if she's eaten the Stilton."
Actually, I believe she started with "Lovey, would you sniff Em's breath
for me?" Softens the victim up, don't you know.
>Vicki "On the shelf, next to the pasta maker" Robinson
Michele "in the CD case" Tepper
--
Michele Tepper "James is actually speaking of the Monroe Doctrine.
mte...@panix.com The Munro Doctrine -- 'If you make it to your bed you
didn't pass out' -- is probably of little use here."
-- Ian Munro
TMOliver
>
> On Tue, 31 Aug 1999, Lara Hopkins wrote:
>
> > > There is also a condition (the term escapes me at the moment) in which
> > > human, vegetable, toy - and the only cure is muscle relaxants. There
> > > are scientifically documented cases of this happening;
> > YM "fabricated":
> > http://snopes.simplenet.com/sex/penile/captivus.htm
>
>
> > Lara "Brian can't resist a food thread, I can't resist a dysfunctional sex
> > thread" Hoksnip
>
> there are more than one tie-ins to food than the obvious.
>
> As I was saying to the esteemable Dr Nyork, though; What about vaginismus?
>
My God, they've rediscovered Atlantis, the Grand "Snapping Pussy"
thread. Will the world never sleep? Is man's search for knowledge
inevitably unstoppable?
--
TMOliver, el pelon sinverguenza
From a small observatory overlooking the confluence of the Three
Bosques...
"Ask not what your government can do for you,
but how to get out of the way when it does!"
Lisa Keipp
>
> Perhaps you have a citation for the supposed poisonous effects of
> chocolate on dogs? Or perhaps the definition of "one piece" means
> a kilogram.
>
> --
> ********** DAVE HATUNEN (hat...@sonic.net) ***********
> * Daly City California *
> ******* My typos are intentional copyright traps ******
Note the previous posts. I was going on what my vet told me. Obviously a
scare tactic.
I'll stick with rats for pets. They can eat almost anything to no
effect. Except the one who got a lip burn from chewing on an electric
cord during one of his fabulous escapes.
Lisa Keipp
> > There is even a "case" (I'd call it a UL) where one of George
> > Washington's maids and one of his officers were "caught" by the
> great
> > general himself in the linen closet (much bigger in those days) and
> the
> > young lady did not "release" for 12 hours, when a doctor was finally
> > called and the young lady was administered opium.
> >
>
> Now that is a new one to me.
>
> > Needless to say, she went home in disgrace. The officer? Probably
> kidded
> > for the rest of his life.
>
> Why would she go home in disgrace? It would be more likely that she
> would have no problems finding other employment with someone else if
> the General for some reason discharged her.
>
I DID call it a UL. I read it a long time ago; I can tell where to find
the book in my old library, but not the title! LOL
Check the time period. Any woman caught in a compromising position in
those days was sent home in disgrace. Part of the sexual mores of the
time.
Yes, she would have a problem finding other work. Possibly she would
have had a bastard child from this or other encounters; a detriment to
employment, since many employees lived with their employers, and an
employer would not want to take on the feeding of another, virtually
useless person. Also, a child would take time away from her duties, and
the employer would not be getting the "most bang for his buck" so to
speak. Employers did not want to take on a woman of obviously loose
morals, for it implied that her morals would be loose in other respects
as well (theivery, lying, possibly violent crimes).
Though I'm sure she could find a fine position (or several) in a house
of prostitution.
I will cite this if you wish it.
Lisa "and this part IS history, thank goodness" Keipp
Lisa Keipp
>
> I'm no expert, but this is a nice combination of the Peanut Butter Dog and the
> Stuck Couple.
>
> I read a similar story in Nancy Friday's _Men In Love_, which is basically a
> pretty interesting and diverse book of men's fantasies (in contrast, her book of
> women's fantasies is full of stupid fluff and posturing). In that story, the
> dog's paramour was a man, not a woman, and his wife came home early, and he
> decided to hurt himself (and I suppose the dog too) rather than be caught in
> such a compromising position.
Someone recently (for what ungodly reason, I don't know)sent us a video
clip of a woman and her favorite horse.
I find it to be incontrovertable proof that even a Great Dane could not
possibly get "stuck", doggie style or no.
Thanks, but I'll stick with humans.
Lisa "apparently, size does matter" Keipp
John Francis
The same could be said of paghat.
Robert Warinner
: Check the time period. Any woman caught in a compromising position in
: those days was sent home in disgrace. Part of the sexual mores of the
: time.
*Any* woman? Are you sure that the sexual mores of an entire society
can be so neatly characterized?
: I will cite this if you wish it.
Much obliged if you did.
Andrew "near cited" Warinner
wari...@xnet.com
wari...@enteract.com
http://www.xnet.com/~warinner
Urban Legend Zeitgeist: http://www.urbanlegends.com/ulz
Chris W.
Lisa Keipp wrote:
> Someone recently (for what ungodly reason, I don't know)sent us a video
> clip of a woman and her favorite horse.
>
> I find it to be incontrovertable proof that even a Great Dane could not
> possibly get "stuck", doggie style or no.
Errm, you can't compare dogs to horses _or_ humans for their unique
penile anatomy. As a former dog breeder, the way I understand it is
that during (or shortly after the main part of) intercourse male dogs
have something called a "root ball" (anybody know the scientific term?)
at the base of their penis which swells and makes it impossible for the
male to withdraw from the bitch for a considerable period of time. If
you've ever seen dogs mating, you'll agree that this part looks
painful. I don't know of any other species other than canine that uses
this particular "trick" to ensure the proliferation of the species.
Although I've (accidentally, honest!) come across at least one
bestiality story on the internet in the past where the woman protagonist
describes accidentally letting the dog "root" her, causing pain and
inability to withdraw, I've no idea whether these stories are true or
merely fantasy. Does anyone know any bestialists who admit to having
this "special" acquaintance with their pooch? Or is someone a little
less shy than I who would ask somebody who carries a bestiality web
site? If so, perhaps we can get to the "root" of this story.
Chris "glad my Square doesn't have a root" Webb
JoAnne Schmitz
>As a former dog breeder, the way I understand it is
>that during (or shortly after the main part of) intercourse male dogs
>have something called a "root ball"
I'll never think of Arbor Day the same way again.
JoAnne "bury that bone" Schmitz
K. D.
Chris W. wrote in message <37CC3B66...@usa.net>...
>Errm, you can't compare dogs to horses _or_ humans for their unique
>penile anatomy. As a former dog breeder, the way I understand it is
>that during (or shortly after the main part of) intercourse male dogs
>have something called a "root ball" (anybody know the scientific term?)
>at the base of their penis which swells and makes it impossible for the
>male to withdraw from the bitch for a considerable period of time
<snip>
>Although I've (accidentally, honest!) come across at least one
>bestiality story on the internet
(Yeah, right! "Gee, honey, I really don't know how that bestiality URL got
into the history file!")
I've always figured that the bestiality stories were all bogus, the product
of someone's fantasies. People lie about matters sexual all the time, for
all sorts of reasons. Are we all in agreement on that statement
Women, in particular (it seems) lie about what turns them on, at least
sometimes. I think some reasons they do this is:
Some think that what they are saying will be a turn on for their partner.
Some really don't know what turns them on, so make it up on the fly, based
on erroneous information they have gotten from, hmmmm, I'm guessing
Cosmopolitan Magazine and/or Redbook. (I've never purchased nor read Cosmo,
so this idea is based on incomplete information)
Some just like to lie, about anything.
Some really do find the thought of certain strange sexual acts to be
appealing, even if such acts are probably anatomically and/or
physiologically impossible. The most believable female sexual fantasy I
have ever "accidentally" (a la Chris here) come across which involves a dog
involves, gee, how can I say this delicately? It involves Gravy Magic (?)
or some such food product used for making gravy, and applying said gravy
magic to critical areas of the body, and letting the dog have at it with his
TONGUE.
In this situation, although it supposedly involves the dog's tongue, the
teeth would be a little too close for MY peace of mind. But, hey --
whatever floats your boat.
So, let's open this discussion to include this variation on a theme, as
well.
Melissa7m
>Lisa Keipp <lke...@netexpress.net> wrote:
>: Check the time period. Any woman caught in a compromising position in
>: those days was sent home in disgrace. Part of the sexual mores of the
>: time.
>
>*Any* woman? Are you sure that the sexual mores of an entire society
>can be so neatly characterized?
What I like about all of this is the overriding assumption that somehow things
are different these days and being found in a compromising sexual position is
no longer disgraceful.
-Amanda "but enviable" Marcotte
Alice Faber
<flowrchi...@prodigy.net> wrote:
>
> Some really do find the thought of certain strange sexual acts to be
> appealing, even if such acts are probably anatomically and/or
> physiologically impossible. The most believable female sexual fantasy I
> have ever "accidentally" (a la Chris here) come across which involves a dog
> involves, gee, how can I say this delicately? It involves Gravy Magic (?)
> or some such food product used for making gravy, and applying said gravy
> magic to critical areas of the body, and letting the dog have at it with his
> TONGUE.
>
> In this situation, although it supposedly involves the dog's tongue, the
> teeth would be a little too close for MY peace of mind. But, hey --
> whatever floats your boat.
>
> So, let's open this discussion to include this variation on a theme, as
> well.
Uh, KD, did you look at the subject heading you posted under?
You might want to have a look at www.urbanlegends.com, in particular
the following item:
http://www.urbanlegends.com/afu/snide/1994/peanut_butter_dog_faq.html
This will give you an idea how long such a story has been around, but
not how recently it's been discussed.
Or, you could go to DejaNews and search the group for items about pate.
Now, if you have in fact heard a comparable story involving Gravy
Magic, that, indeed, would constitute a kewl nudie tail.
Alice "Gravy Train" Faber
--
I don't read crossposts...
***** Check out the goodies at http://www.urbanlegends.com *****
Lon Stowell
Chris Clarke
<jfra...@dungeon.engr.sgi.com> wrote:
| And, in fact, our freindly vector generator, Chuck Shepherd, over at
| "News of the Weird" had this to say today :
|
| "..... by spreading puree of hot dogs on his naked posterior as he lay
| face down on a cypress branch and permitting eight dogs to enter the room.
| Immediately one dog, Hercules, bit Zhang on the butt, drawing blood."
|
| Admittedly this was done under the banner of art, not sexual gratification.
The difference being ... ?
ob"Cite! Cite! Cite!":
Performance Artist Takes a Licking
Dogs find Zhang delectable at Asian
Jesse Hamlin, Chronicle Staff Writer
Monday, April 19, 1999
Won't Dan Stern be surprised to learn how his dog Hercules spent
Saturday afternoon. While the San Francisco fitness trainer was
out of town, his beloved Akita was at the Asian Art Museum,
licking hot dog puree off the naked body of a Chinese
performance artist who was lying on a cypress branch in front of
hundreds of people.
Oh yeah, and after a little scrap with a Samoyed named Sitka --
one of eight dogs featured in Zhang Huan's performance piece
``Dream of the Dragon'' -- Hercules bit the artist in the behind.
A wee bit of blood appeared, dramatizing, in a nebulous way,
Zhang's stated aim to ``explore the physical and psychological
effects of human violence in modern society.'' The artist flinched
but maintained his mood of sacrificial concentration.
``I'm pretty embarrassed,'' said marketing consultant Lee McCoy,
who was dog-sitting Hercules and volunteered the canine's
services for Saturday's performance, part of the exhibition ``Inside
Out: New Chinese Art.'' McCoy also brought his own dog, a
shar-pei named Morgan, who showed no interest in even lick ing
the artist.
``I was afraid Hercules might pee on the tree,'' said McCoy, 37,
``but he bit him in the ass instead. Wait until Dan finds out I didn't
take his dog to the beach. It was a fun performance. A visual treat.''
McCoy was walking the dogs in Duboce Park last week when
Zhang, an acclaimed Beijing-born artist who lives in Brooklyn,
asked him and other dog owners to be in his piece. (As Zhang
doesn't speak English, Asian Art Museum staffer Elizabeth Medel
did the asking.) Intrigued, McCoy said yes, as did Kevin DuBay,
who signed up Cassady, a Rottweiler-Doberman mix.
DuBay found Zhang ``very charming and persuasive'' -- the art ist
showed photos of a recent New York performance in which he lay
nude on a bed of ice. Zhang suggested that the dog owners might
also want to appear nude, but they declined.
Joined by various Asian museum folk and their bowsers -- an
eclectic -- mix of French bulldogs, Norwegian elkhounds and
springer spaniels -- Hercules and company rehearsed a few times
at the Asian. When the dogs didn't go for the chicken gravy that
Zhang smeared on his torso, a new meal was cooked up using hot
dogs (Safeway brand), beef gravy and a doggie supplement called
Nutri-Cal. That did the trick. Medel whipped up a big batch Friday
night in a food processor.
At 2 p.m. Saturday, Zhang, strapped to a cypress branch downed
in Golden Gate Park by a storm, was wheeled into the Asian's
Gruhn Court to the taped sound of Tibetan monks chanting,
banging cymbals and blowing horns (the branch was steam-
cleaned and sprayed with pesticide to make sure no pests were
brought into the museum).
The original plans called for Zhang to be raised and lowered from
the floor to the ceiling, but the structure couldn't support the
weight. Instead, he lay on the tree while the museum's Andrea Lum
ceremoniously painted the goop -- which looked like hummus --
on the artist's shaved head and over his lean body, sprinkling flour
on top to create a ghostlike effect. Hot dogs usually go in the
buns; in this case, they went on it.
BARKS, LICKS AND SNICKERS
One at a time, the dogs were led up to Zhang and encouraged to
lick. After about 10 minutes of barking and licking -- during
which the crowd snickered and gasped in amusement, amazement
and bewilderment -- Zhang stood up, brushed some flour off his
neck and bowed. The crowd applauded as the artist slipped into a
green terry cloth robe and departed.
The reaction was decidedly mixed.
``It was amusing, but I didn't get it,'' said Walter Gonzales, a
28-year-old student. ``Visually, it was kind of appealing, but other
than that . . .''
``I loved it,'' said Ruth Doty, 79, a retired San Francisco bank
employee. ``It's so real; it's life itself. I got sense of freedom from
it. We have too many inhibitions. And the dogs were
well-behaved.''
Less enthusiastic was Superior Court clerk supervisor Ella Michel,
58. ``I think it was just weird. Too far out for me,'' she said. But
her friend Barbara Blake enjoyed herself. ``It was a happening,''
she said. ``I'm not sure what happened, but I was part of it.''
Outside the museum, San Francisco tattoo artist Mark Marcus
was complaining that the show didn't live up to its billing.
WHERE'S THE RAW MEAT?
``It was lame,'' said Marcus. ``I read that he was going to be
suspended with raw meat on him. A bunch of dogs licking a naked
guy face-down? We need something more for $7. If that's what
passes for art these days, I want my money back.''
Asian museum director Emily Sano raved about the work, particularly the
composition formed by Zhang's body and the tree limb, ``very sculptural
and elegant.''
Zhang was pleased with the performance, despite the nip in the
butt. It hurt, but ``I tried to relate the pain to life experiences,''
said the artist, cleaned up and clothed.
The piece, he said through translator Annie Ng, deals with the idea
that despite all its technological advances, mankind has not really
evolved. ``The dogs represent different people and cultures and
how they treat each other.'' Being licked by dogs feels ``kind of
strange,'' he said, suggesting with a smile that the dogs should be
asked how they liked tasting him.
``She enjoyed it,'' said Sitka's master, Pearl Kim-Kregel. ``She had
no clue what was happening -- it was just an eating fest.''
Meanwhile, at the San Francisco Museum of Modern Art
yesterday, another ``Inside Out'' artist, Ma Liuming, offered ``Fen-
Ma Liuming,'' a performance piece exploring ``issues of gender
and sexuality.'' Wearing light facial makeup and nothing else, he
invited visitors from the crowd to pose with him for photos, naked
or dressed. Of all the people who got up there with him, only four
men let it all hang out. That's art.
©1999 San Francisco Chronicle Page C1
K. D.
Alice Faber wrote in message <310819992022010733%fab...@rcn.com>...
>Now, if you have in fact heard a comparable story involving Gravy
>Magic, that, indeed, would constitute a kewl nudie tail.
I didn't claim that it had ever happened, I claimed that it was a female
fantasy I had "stumbled" upon (not THIS female's fantasy).
I don't recall the exact name of the product -- but I do recall that it was
a food product used as a base for gravy (Kitchen Bouquet, perhaps?).
Since we were on the topic of alleged encounters btwn human females and male
dogs, I was opening the, er, topic to include this potential variation.
R H Draney
> Don't see why anyone would want to fantasize about that... it could only
> be painful. Just think how the penis would feel having all that blood
> trapped in it for hours! Sorry guys! I saw you wince at that.
There's a name for that condition too (having the blood trapped in it for a long
time)...look up "priapism"....r
John Francis
K. D. <flowrchi...@prodigy.net> wrote:
>
>Some really do find the thought of certain strange sexual acts to be
>appealing, even if such acts are probably anatomically and/or
>physiologically impossible. The most believable female sexual fantasy I
>have ever "accidentally" (a la Chris here) come across which involves a dog
>involves, gee, how can I say this delicately? It involves Gravy Magic (?)
>or some such food product used for making gravy, and applying said gravy
>magic to critical areas of the body, and letting the dog have at it with his
>TONGUE.
>
>In this situation, although it supposedly involves the dog's tongue, the
>teeth would be a little too close for MY peace of mind. But, hey --
>whatever floats your boat.
And, in fact, our freindly vector generator, Chuck Shepherd, over at
"News of the Weird" had this to say today :
"..... by spreading puree of hot dogs on his naked posterior as he lay
face down on a cypress branch and permitting eight dogs to enter the room.
Immediately one dog, Hercules, bit Zhang on the butt, drawing blood."
Admittedly this was done under the banner of art, not sexual gratification.
--
John "I don't know much about art ..." Francis
Robert Alston
Lisa Keipp <lke...@netexpress.net> wrote in message
news:4214E6CEEFB900ED.D5B9E215...@lp.airnews.net
...
> Robert Alston wrote:
>
> > > There is even a "case" (I'd call it a UL) where one of George
> > > Washington's maids and one of his officers were "caught" by the
> > great
> > > general himself in the linen closet (much bigger in those days)
and
> > the
> > > young lady did not "release" for 12 hours, when a doctor was
finally
> > > called and the young lady was administered opium.
> > >
> >
> > Now that is a new one to me.
> >
> > > Needless to say, she went home in disgrace. The officer?
Probably
> > kidded
> > > for the rest of his life.
> >
> > Why would she go home in disgrace? It would be more likely that
she
> > would have no problems finding other employment with someone else
if
> > the General for some reason discharged her.
> >
> I DID call it a UL. I read it a long time ago; I can tell where to
find
> the book in my old library, but not the title! LOL
>
in
> those days was sent home in disgrace. Part of the sexual mores of
the
> time.
I am aware of the time period thank you. And I am well aware of the
sexual mores of those times. And I submit that there would be very
little chance that she would have been sent home in disgrace. The
officer on the other hand would stand a far better chance of that
happening.
>
> Yes, she would have a problem finding other work. Possibly she would
> have had a bastard child from this or other encounters; a detriment
to
> employment, since many employees lived with their employers, and an
> employer would not want to take on the feeding of another, virtually
> useless person. Also, a child would take time away from her duties,
and
> the employer would not be getting the "most bang for his buck" so to
> speak.
If she got pregnant from the encounter then that would change things.
But in the instance you related all that happened was that she was
caught in a compromising position. That does not imply that there was
a pregnancy.
>Employers did not want to take on a woman of obviously loose
> morals, for it implied that her morals would be loose in other
respects
> as well (theivery, lying, possibly violent crimes).
>
Depends on the employer. Some would hire her BECAUSE of her `loose
morals'. Please note that your talking about the time of King George
not the time of Queen Victoria.
> Though I'm sure she could find a fine position (or several) in a
house
> of prostitution.
Possibly. That was considered an acceptable trade for a single woman
with no other means of support in those days. And the madam could very
well have been a respected business lady in the community. That state
of affairs didn't change until the time of Queen Victoria.
>
> I will cite this if you wish it.
Yes I do wish for the cite. Also note that in the story you related
there was no child mentioned. So no mentioning problems that would be
caused by her having a child. In any case, there are several ways a
lady could have had a child, been single, and the child not be a
bastard. And in those days it would not have caused many employment
problems for a live-in maid.
>
> Lisa "and this part IS history, thank goodness" Keipp
Robert "I loved history class as it gave me a chance to annoy my
teachers by pointing out where the books were wrong" Alston
Robert Alston
Alice's post to respond.
Alice Faber <fab...@rcn.com> wrote in message
news:310819992022010733%fab...@rcn.com...
> In article <7qhlg9$5k6q$1...@newssvr04-int.news.prodigy.com>, K. D.
> <flowrchi...@prodigy.net> wrote:
>
> >
> > Some really do find the thought of certain strange sexual acts to
be
> > appealing, even if such acts are probably anatomically and/or
> > physiologically impossible.
Sex with dogs is neither anatomically nor physiologically impossible.
The most believable female sexual fantasy I
> > have ever "accidentally" (a la Chris here) come across which
involves a dog
> > involves, gee, how can I say this delicately? It involves Gravy
Magic (?)
> > or some such food product used for making gravy, and applying said
gravy
> > magic to critical areas of the body, and letting the dog have at
it with his
> > TONGUE.
> >
None of the people that I have talked to that enjoy their dogs in ways
that most people wouldn't (and that most includes me) have ever
mentioned needing to put anything in the way of food on the critical
areas to get the dog into the mood. Some have mentioned giving their
dog a treat that way but it was plain that it wasn't a normal thing to
do.
> > In this situation, although it supposedly involves the dog's
tongue, the
> > teeth would be a little too close for MY peace of mind. But,
hey --
> > whatever floats your boat.
> >
> > So, let's open this discussion to include this variation on a
theme, as
> > well.
Altho I snipped all of Alice's reply I agree that this is a kewl nudie
tail.
Robert "I only do humans" Alston
Robert Alston
Chris W. <chrisda...@usa.net> wrote in message
news:37CC3B66...@usa.net...
>
>
> Lisa Keipp wrote:
>
> > Someone recently (for what ungodly reason, I don't know)sent us a
video
> > clip of a woman and her favorite horse.
> >
> > I find it to be incontrovertable proof that even a Great Dane
could not
> > possibly get "stuck", doggie style or no.
>
> penile anatomy. As a former dog breeder, the way I understand it is
> that during (or shortly after the main part of) intercourse male
dogs
> have something called a "root ball" (anybody know the scientific
term?)
> at the base of their penis which swells and makes it impossible for
the
If
> you've ever seen dogs mating, you'll agree that this part looks
> painful. I don't know of any other species other than canine that
uses
> this particular "trick" to ensure the proliferation of the species.
>
protagonist
> describes accidentally letting the dog "root" her, causing pain and
> inability to withdraw, I've no idea whether these stories are true
or
> merely fantasy. Does anyone know any bestialists who admit to
having
> this "special" acquaintance with their pooch? Or is someone a
little
> less shy than I who would ask somebody who carries a bestiality web
> site? If so, perhaps we can get to the "root" of this story.
You rang?
For most women it would be painful if the dog pulled it out after
getting it in. But if the woman is having sex with the dog and the
ball is in her then it is up to her to keep him in or accept the pain
as he pops out. From what I have been told the idea is to keep it
outside of the vagina but if you enjoy large objects in you then go
ahead as it can't get stuck in you. Let's not discuss anal sex with a
dog tho.
>
> Chris "glad my Square doesn't have a root" Webb
Robert "Not a Square but would prefer to NOT think about some things"
Alston
Don Whittington
<rom...@tcon.net> wrote:
> Chris W. <chrisda...@usa.net> wrote in message
> news:37CC3B66...@usa.net...
> >
> > Although I've (accidentally, honest!) come across at least one
> > bestiality story on the internet in the past where the woman
> protagonist
> > describes accidentally letting the dog "root" her, causing pain and
> > inability to withdraw, I've no idea whether these stories are true
> or
> > merely fantasy. Does anyone know any bestialists who admit to
> having
> > this "special" acquaintance with their pooch? Or is someone a
> little
> > less shy than I who would ask somebody who carries a bestiality web
> > site? If so, perhaps we can get to the "root" of this story.
>
> You rang?
> For most women it would be painful if the dog pulled it out after
> getting it in. But if the woman is having sex with the dog and the
> ball is in her then it is up to her to keep him in or accept the pain
> as he pops out. From what I have been told the idea is to keep it
> outside of the vagina but if you enjoy large objects in you then go
> ahead as it can't get stuck in you. Let's not discuss anal sex with a
> dog tho.
> >
> > Chris "glad my Square doesn't have a root" Webb
>
This root ball would have to be enormous, don't you think, to keep them
locked with an adult female human? As a dog person, I've been around a
lot of matings, but more practically, seen a lot of excited males. I've
yet to see a breed whose wang competes with that of the average male
human. (Based on years of male bonding in the great diplomatic showers of
our land, and the odd porno video.)
Having also separated more than a few coupling sets of canines I've yet to
see the alleged root ball. At least, anything that might bother the
average King of Prussia housewife.
I can't imagine an instance where there was an inability to withdraw.
Seems unlikely to me.
Don "Particularly if there is a sandwich waiting" Whittington
Eve
>This root ball would have to be enormous, don't you think, to keep them
>locked with an adult female human?
I should say so. Consider that human vaginas routinely pass 6-7 lb babies with
no real assistance required. Well, yeah, it hurts, as a rule, but it's not
like the baby is stuck in there until the Dr. does something magic to make it
come out. (All bets are off with bigger babies, of course, but I can't imagine
a dog with a 10lb penis). So unless this "root ball" is bigger than a small
baby, I can't imagine it making withdrawal impossible. Painful, maybe.
Eve
Eve
>be painful. Just think how the penis would feel having all that blood
>trapped in it for hours! Sorry guys! I saw you wince at that.
Well, I was thinking more of that sort of mysoginistic end of the male fantasy
spectrum. It's been my experience that a certain percentage of heterosexual
men do not actually like women or are afraid of them on some level (1). It's
the best theory I have come up with to explain men I've met who are clearly
sexually attracted to females but insult women in general frequently, and enjoy
stories about how stupid or treacherous women are. I think the "devouring
vagina" is part of that.
Of course, I seem to recall a few posts in this thread that said something
like, "gosh, I wish I'd found the woman who could do that!" So in that case,
it would seem to be an appealing fantasy for some. I don't get it, but
fantasies are very personal, as they should be.
(1)Lest I be accused of sexism, let me say that I also believe in the existence
of a certain percentage of heterosexual women who, despite their physical
attraction, dislike and/or fear men.
Deborah Stevenson
On 1 Sep 1999, Eve wrote:
> Don writes:
> >This root ball would have to be enormous, don't you think, to keep them
> >locked with an adult female human?
>
> I should say so. Consider that human vaginas routinely pass 6-7 lb babies with
> no real assistance required. Well, yeah, it hurts, as a rule, but it's not
> like the baby is stuck in there until the Dr. does something magic to make it
> come out. (All bets are off with bigger babies, of course, but I can't imagine
> a dog with a 10lb penis). So unless this "root ball" is bigger than a small
> baby, I can't imagine it making withdrawal impossible. Painful, maybe.
This then prompts a question about "stickage" in mating dogs as
well--after all, newborn puppies are larger than yer basic dog peepee.
I do think that there are relevant differences in the preparation of, at
least, the human body for the two situations, and also in the direction of
the pressure and the action of the thing exerting the pressure. While not
having given birth myself, I can't imagine the experience would be
improved by attaching the baby to an external Rockwider who yanks hard and
fast and in one pass while bolting from the room without even pausing for
a cigarette.
I'll also ask those who *have* done the baby thing if they had the choice
of waiting a few minutes and letting things slide out on their own or
going through pushing something past the barriers again which they'd
choose. The former sounds preferable to me, but then I don't even like
putting on turtlenecks.
Deborah Stevenson
(stev...@alexia.lis.uiuc.edu)
K. D.
Eve wrote in message <19990901090708...@ng-cc1.aol.com>...
>Don writes:
>>This root ball would have to be enormous, don't you think, to keep them
>>locked with an adult female human?
>
>I should say so. Consider that human vaginas routinely pass 6-7 lb babies
with
>no real assistance required. Well, yeah, it hurts, as a rule, but it's not
>like the baby is stuck in there until the Dr. does something magic to make
it
>come out. (All bets are off with bigger babies, of course, but I can't
imagine
>a dog with a 10lb penis). So unless this "root ball" is bigger than a small
>baby, I can't imagine it making withdrawal impossible. Painful, maybe.
>
Eve,
This is the best point I have read on this topic, so far. I have been
following this "root ball" conversation, puzzling about it, and wondering
how it could be possible (based on my many years of living in a female body,
having babies, and many of the other attendant situations).
Which now makes me think of a related UL I heard many (over 20) years ago,
the "getting stuck" part of which had not one ounce of credibility to me
then, now, or probably ever. The story goes like this: Classmate teenage
girl of the boy/boys telling the story is home experimenting with
masturbatory techniques. Her choice of item today is a hot dog [and you
thought a cigar was ineffectual, huh?]. Her vigorous manipulations of said
hot dog cause it to break off in her vagina. She is brought to the doc/ER
for removal of same.
The physician in question just happens to be the father of one of her
classmates, and he (the father physician) tells his son/daughter of what
transpired. Next thing you know, the story is all over the school.
Thoughts:
I've never seen a hot dog which is as large in circumference as a male
penis. Luckily, I have not been exposed to the entire range of male
manhood, and I'm betting that there have been some of them that are as small
as the average hot dog. We're not talking "foot-long" here.
A hot dog, being of the dimensions which hot dogs are (refer to the
preceding paragraph) and being very greasy would not be a good candidate for
use in the aforementioned science experiment. I don't know this from
personal experience -- I'm just assuming.
A hot dog, being fairly flexible, would be unlikely to "break off" in a
space which is long. basically straight, and fairly flexible.
If a hot dog were to break off in said space, I think that the broken piece
would come out almost immediately on its own, if the young lady were to sit
up, sit on the toilet, whatever.
If the hot dog were to get stuck, and if the girl were taken to the doctor,
the idea that the doctor would tell the story to his son/daughter/classmate
of the girl is not believable. The obvious risk of legal ramifications is
astronomical.
John Francis
Lon Stowell <lsto...@dnai.com> wrote:
>In article <7qh3o3$7h...@fido.engr.sgi.com>,
>John Francis <jfra...@dungeon.engr.sgi.com> wrote:
>>In article <Pine.NEB.4.10.990830...@panix7.panix.com>,
>>Brian Yeoh <by...@panix.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>Brian "I am what I eat" Yeoh
>>
>>The same could be said of paghat.
>
> How would she/he know what Brian eats?
Shirley by now _everyone_ knows what Brian eats?
At least, everyone who has spent any time in afu.
--
John "What Brian doesn't eat is less well known ... " Francis
John Francis
Robert Alston <rom...@tcon.net> wrote:
>
>You rang?
>For most women it would be painful if the dog pulled it out after
>getting it in. But if the woman is having sex with the dog and the
>ball is in her then it is up to her to keep him in or accept the pain
>as he pops out.
In fact, as you might say, the ball is in her court.
Chris W.
>
> This then prompts a question about "stickage" in mating dogs as
> well--after all, newborn puppies are larger than yer basic dog peepee.
>
And after all, mating dogs *do* indeed get stuck. The dogs usually end
up contorted facing opposite directions, both with a tortured look on
their faces. (And I don't think it's ecstasy) Since it's been about 15
years since I've watched my last dog breeding I don't remember how long
this stage lasts - five, ten minutes? I could swear the first breeding
I attended lasted half an hour.
> I do think that there are relevant differences in the preparation of, at
> least, the human body for the two situations, and also in the direction of
> the pressure and the action of the thing exerting the pressure. While not
> having given birth myself, I can't imagine the experience would be
> improved by attaching the baby to an external Rockwider who yanks hard and
> fast and in one pass while bolting from the room without even pausing for
> a cigarette.
Indeed. I don't see how anyone can compare the birth of a human baby
(to a woman who has physically been preparing for the moment for ~nine
months) to having something large extraneously presenting itself in your
reproductive tract.
However, nature Shirley has intended a reason for a male dog to get
"stuck" in the bitch - perhaps to ensure ejaculation (there are three
stages to a dog's ejaculation) has been completed fully, or perhaps to
ensure that the spermies have a chance to find their goal before the
channel they are swimming in decides to take a romp around the yard.
The physique of a bitch in heat, swollen vulva and all, is markedly
different than that of an adult human female engaging in intercourse.
Therefore the question is whether the human female is so different that
the inability for a male dog in throes of the final stage of coitus to
withdraw is impossible. I believe so but have no proof either way, but
the "humans can pass something as big as a baby therefore it's
impossible" or "dogs have little peepees" don't cut it with me. I'll
take Robert's version that "bestialists avoid it because it's painful
when the dog pulls it out".
Oh, and for Don who has only seen the dogs with small penii, I'll agree
that most are - but I've seen a couple that would make most men green
with envy and most women run for cover.
Vaginismus has been discussed already in this thread. I wonder if a
combination of the fear of having a dog rooting while inside could cause
vaginismus while the dog is engaged. If so I could see a probability of
stickage - but slim to nil. I'm especially extremely sceptical that a
dog could remain rooted for so long that a hospital visit would be in
order to disengage the hapless coupling.
Chris "can't believe I'm still discussing this" Webb
Eve
>girl of the boy/boys telling the story is home experimenting with
>masturbatory techniques. Her choice of item today is a hot dog [and you
>thought a cigar was ineffectual, huh?]. Her vigorous manipulations of said
>hot dog cause it to break off in her vagina. She is brought to the doc/ER
>for removal of same.
Just for the gross out factor, in college I heard a story similar to this in
which the object used was a banana, but unfortunately the young woman decided
to peel it before use. You know the rest--ER visit, etc.
Eve
>least, the human body for the two situations, and also in the direction of
>the pressure and the action of the thing exerting the pressure. While not
>having given birth myself, I can't imagine the experience would be
>improved by attaching the baby to an external Rockwider who yanks hard and
>fast and in one pass while bolting from the room without even pausing for
>a cigarette.
You've got a point there. It seems to me that it might be easier to get the
kiddo out if there were some sort of external attatchment, you know, like a
handle. That way, there'd be some extra force being applied, and it wouldn't
all come down to the mother's pushing. There are ways to do this, of course,
but none of them is risk free, and they're methods reserved for those times
when it's flat out neccesary. But yanking hard in one pass.....you just made
me nearly faint with that thought!! "Ouch" doesn't begin to describe it.
>I'll also ask those who *have* done the baby thing if they had the choice
>of waiting a few minutes and letting things slide out on their own or
>going through pushing something past the barriers again which they'd
>choose. The former sounds preferable to me, but then I don't even like
>putting on turtlenecks.
I'm not sure what you mean here. The baby never exactly slides out on its own
(especially if you're on your back with your feet in stirrups--gravity just
isn't on your side), you just push until it slides out. And pushing itself
isn't entirely under voluntary control--I was surprised at how much it was like
vomiting. The muscles were just going to do what they were doing. The nurse
said to me, "If you're dilated enough, I'll let you push." If I hadn't been in
too much pain to speak I would have laughed in her face, because nothing was
going to stop me. Does this make sense, or answer your question?
Deborah Stevenson
On 1 Sep 1999, Eve wrote:
I said:
> >I'll also ask those who *have* done the baby thing if they had the choice
> >of waiting a few minutes and letting things slide out on their own or
> >going through pushing something past the barriers again which they'd
> >choose. The former sounds preferable to me, but then I don't even like
> >putting on turtlenecks.
>
> I'm not sure what you mean here. The baby never exactly slides out on its own
> (especially if you're on your back with your feet in stirrups--gravity just
> isn't on your side), you just push until it slides out. And pushing itself
> isn't entirely under voluntary control--I was surprised at how much it was like
> vomiting. The muscles were just going to do what they were doing. The nurse
> said to me, "If you're dilated enough, I'll let you push." If I hadn't been in
> too much pain to speak I would have laughed in her face, because nothing was
> going to stop me. Does this make sense, or answer your question?
Not quite--I was talking about the other way around. With yer
hypothetical dog weiner, the thing will detumesce and come on out on its
own. A woman aware of that might choose to wait even while being aware
it was physically possible to remove the inflated version, since it
doesn't sound like any picnic. "Stuck" might well be a shorthand way of
describing that state.
We've been talking about babies managing to come out of the same space,
but we really haven't acknowledged the absence of such a simple
alternative in the childbirth situation. If you all *could* have
just waited 15 minutes and had the baby slither on out on its own without
all those entertaining contractions (which I suppose aren't germane) and
vaginal stretching (which is germane, and we haven't even mentioned
episiotomies), my guess is that most of you would have done so. The woman
with the dog apaprently has the option, and what we are calling "stuck"
may just be "didn't plan to force something that large through her vaginal
opening at the moment and would just as soon wait a bit and avoid it,
thanks so much."
Deborah Stevenson
(stev...@alexia.lis.uiuc.edu)
TMOliver
substantially depressed) by one of the great 8mm epics de porn, a grainy
B&W feature in which Southwestern exotique performer/dancer Ms. Candy
Barr, presumably not the name on her Birth Certificate, accommodated (an
ungodly portion of) the extremely large, long and entirely intimidating
phallus of a male of the donkey tribe. candy, grimacing a bit,
maintained the lovely, smooth, cherub sheeked features of a high school
cheerleader, a look which over the years added to her appeal.
If you've not seen a donkeypizzle, imagine the main gun of an M1A1 tank
in comparison to the insignificant pizzle of a .38 Chiefs Special.
Since that adolescent moment, I've had no doubt that women were capable
of far more than that for which they were given credit.
--
TMOliver, el pelon sinverguenza
From a small observatory overlooking the confluence of the Three
Bosques...
"Ask not what your government can do for you,
but how to get out of the way when it does!"
Chris W.
TMOliver wrote:
>
> As a young lad, I can remember being terribly impressed (and
> substantially depressed) by one of the great 8mm epics de porn, a grainy
> B&W feature in which Southwestern exotique performer/dancer Ms. Candy
> Barr, presumably not the name on her Birth Certificate, accommodated (an
> ungodly portion of) the extremely large, long and entirely intimidating
> phallus of a male of the donkey tribe. candy, grimacing a bit,
> maintained the lovely, smooth, cherub sheeked features of a high school
> cheerleader, a look which over the years added to her appeal.
>
> If you've not seen a donkeypizzle, imagine the main gun of an M1A1 tank
> in comparison to the insignificant pizzle of a .38 Chiefs Special.
>
> Since that adolescent moment, I've had no doubt that women were capable
> of far more than that for which they were given credit.
And I've seen the Pamela and Tommy Lee video. And I'm still
incredulous.
Chris "scared of Tommypizzles" Webb
Vicki Robinson
:
:Since that adolescent moment, I've had no doubt that women were capable
:of far more than that for which they were given credit.
Pah. I don't care how big that donkey was, it doesn't compare to the
proportions of an entire 8-to-10-pound human being, the accommodation
of which women collectively manage on a daily basis.
You guys marvel at some of the silliest things.
Vicki "And some of us do it more than once" Robinson
--
Mediation and Alternative Dispute Resolution Resources:
http://www.rit.edu/~vjrnts/mediation/mediation.html
The alt.folklore.urban FAQ and archive can be found at
http://www.urbanlegends.com/
K. D.
wa...@iinet.net.au wrote in message ...
>K. D. wrote:
>> A hot dog, being fairly flexible, would be unlikely to "break off" in a
>> space which is long. basically straight, and fairly flexible.
>
>most uneducated people don't expect (i.e. 45 degrees towards the back).
The angle has nothing to do with whether or not it is basically straight.
Something could be at a one-degree angle (to something else) and be (unto
itself) straight. "Basically straight" and "kinda curved" are not mutually
exclusive. Tampons, along with (especially in the past) long, straight, and
somewhat bulky applicators, have easily been inserted into vaginas all over
the world for decades.
I'm not quite sure what point (so to speak) you're trying to make. Are you
saying that a vagina is angled enough to be a serious impediment to a hot
dog?
>> If a hot dog were to break off in said space, I think that the broken
piece
>> would come out almost immediately on its own, if the young lady were to
sit
>> up, sit on the toilet, whatever.
>
>Do your tampons fall out?
Saturated tampons can, indeed, "fall out" very easily, especially when a
woman is "bearing down" as she sits on a toilet. In addition, a hot dog is
quite different from a tampon, most importantly being (in this regard) that
it is slick (ooooh, yeah), and somewhat "greasy" (slippery). Quite
different from a mass of absorbent, wadded up, expandable material.
Tampons have gotten lost inside on numerous occasions, undoubtedly
well-documented in the medical literature. I would even believe stories
about other things getting lost inside, the variability of human imagination
and stupidity being what it is. Again, tho, a wad of absorbent material is
quite another story from a piece of slimy, slippery, hot dog.
>> If the hot dog were to get stuck, and if the girl were taken to the
doctor,
>> the idea that the doctor would tell the story to his
son/daughter/classmate
>> of the girl is not believable. The obvious risk of legal ramifications
is
>> astronomical.
>
>Unfortunately, a small minority of my so-called colleagues do all sorts of
>things I would classify as unbelievable.
You are, of course, right. Doctors do idiotic and inappropriate things on a
fairly regular basis. I'd even say that they do them all the time. I was
trying to give the benefit of the doubt to the doctor in question, as well
as kinda to the medical profession, as a whole (or is that hole? <sorry>)
I do think that most doctors (for the sakes of their careers, if nothing
else) would try not to be so indiscreet as to mention this sort of
situation, especially in a small town where it would most likely get back to
the wrong people.
Could this story about the young lady, the hot dog, and the indiscreet
physician have happened? Well, of course it COULD have happened. It just
didn't strike me as very probable. (Too many UL red flags)
Until someone can provide me with proof that this, or something very
similar, DID happen, I will choose to believe that it was more likely the
product of someone's overactive imagination. (a teen-age boy springs to
mind)
Glenn Dowdy
Becca Ward wrote in message ...
>On Mon, 30 Aug 1999, Lisa Keipp wrote:
>
>> steve wrote:
>>
>> > are dogs allergic to PB?
>
>Based upon purely anecdotal research, Labrador Retrievers aren't.[1]
>
>> I don't think so, but chocolate can kill them if they eat more than one
>> peice
>
>Absolutely no personal offense intended, but -- cite? I Know The Fact
>that chocolate contains something toxic to dogs. But one piece? I know a
>certain 8-pound poodle who gorged on Hershey's kisses on Halloween, with
>little ill effect. And a 60-lb. Springer Spaniel who snarfed a five-lb.
>box of Godiva one Valentine's Day, and spent the night at veterinary
>emergency, but survived after a stomach-pumping.
>
And I know a 45 lb shepherd mix who ate 4-6 ounces of chocolate covered
espresso beans and has survived _to_this_very_day_. I'm also willing to
believe he'd eat gravel if you put peanut butter on it.
--
Glenn "dammit, Alex, I said sit. Don't let me tell you again" Dowdy
Brian Yeoh
> In article <7qi338$oll$1...@triton.dnai.com>,
> Lon Stowell <lsto...@dnai.com> wrote:
> >In article <7qh3o3$7h...@fido.engr.sgi.com>,
> >John Francis <jfra...@dungeon.engr.sgi.com> wrote:
> >>In article <Pine.NEB.4.10.990830...@panix7.panix.com>,
> >>Brian Yeoh <by...@panix.com> wrote:
> >>>Brian "I am what I eat" Yeoh
> >>The same could be said of paghat.
> > How would she/he know what Brian eats?
> Shirley by now _everyone_ knows what Brian eats?
> At least, everyone who has spent any time in afu.
Hoi! I'll have you know that now I'm becoming more discriminate. Before, I
wouldn't eat fish eyes. Now I do.
> John "What Brian doesn't eat is less well known ... " Francis
And shall justly remain so.
Brian "hint -- tomatoes" Yeoh
Clear, unscaleable, ahead |
Rise the Mountains of Instead | -- WH Auden, "Autumn Song"
From whose cold cascading streams |
None may drink except in dreams. |
R H Draney
> I'm not sure what you mean here. The baby never exactly slides out on its own
> (especially if you're on your back with your feet in stirrups--gravity just
> isn't on your side), you just push until it slides out. And pushing itself
> isn't entirely under voluntary control--I was surprised at how much it was like
> vomiting. The muscles were just going to do what they were doing. The nurse
> said to me, "If you're dilated enough, I'll let you push." If I hadn't been in
> too much pain to speak I would have laughed in her face, because nothing was
> going to stop me. Does this make sense, or answer your question?
A quick literary reference: in one of Heinlein's (think it's "I Shall Fear No Evil"
but would have to check to be sure), an older man piloting a spaceship has to help
deliver an infant of a passenger...he supplies the "birthing stool" and has her
assume the "third world" squatting position thereon...turns the ship's artificial
gravity down to the minimum required to keep tools and implements from floating
about the delivery room, then, at the exact moment of a contraction, turns it back
up...he claims the baby squirted out like a watermelon seed with little muss or
fuss....
So if it's *that* easy, how the heck did we end up on a planetary surface where
it's more difficult?....r
--
"But time is not like tomatoes; it's more like bulk flour"--sam
Andrea Jones
R H Draney wrote in message <37CDFDAF...@earthlink.net>...
>A quick literary reference: in one of Heinlein's (think it's "I Shall Fear
No Evil"
>but would have to check to be sure), an older man piloting a spaceship has
to help
>deliver an infant of a passenger...he supplies the "birthing stool" and has
her
>assume the "third world" squatting position thereon...turns the ship's
artificial
>gravity down to the minimum required to keep tools and implements from
floating
>about the delivery room, then, at the exact moment of a contraction, turns
it back
>up...he claims the baby squirted out like a watermelon seed with little
muss or
>fuss....
"older man" is Heinlein's infamous character "Lazarus Long." The relevant
paragraph, on pages 203-4 of the Ace Science Fiction August 1988 edition is:
Big one! As [the contraction] peaked, I switched from one-quarter
gravity up to two gravities almost in one motion--and Llita let out a yip
and the baby squirted like a watermelon seed right into my hands.
This is my week for odd coincidences on afu, I'd set the book down to read
the froup today!
Andrea "It's a really good book, too." Jones
Greg Franklin
news:310819991938447496%ccl...@faultlinemag.org...
> Performance Artist Takes a Licking
> Dogs find Zhang delectable at Asian
>
> Jesse Hamlin, Chronicle Staff Writer
>
> Monday, April 19, 1999
> [....]
Thanks for the article. This guy must be a good reporter to get such
motto-rific quotes from the viewers of the piece. If there had been a
"Sheesh!", the cycle would have been complete.
Next step is to cross-breed this with an "National Endowment for the Arts"
scare story, then it might become a legend with some legs. ("Someone sent me
this email about Zhang taking NEA money for this filth! Write your
congressman!")
> ``It was amusing, but I didn't get it,'' said Walter Gonzales, a
> 28-year-old student. ``Visually, it was kind of appealing, but other
> than that . . .''
That's my exact reaction to a few of the longer threads here.....
Greg "hacking and slashing" Franklin
Eric Hocking
<schnippo>
> None of the people that I have talked to that enjoy their dogs in ways
> that most people wouldn't (and that most includes me)
er..
> have ever
> mentioned needing to put anything in the way of food on the critical
> areas to get the dog into the mood.
oh errr..
> Some have mentioned giving their dog a treat that way
> but it was plain that it wasn't a normal thing to do.
Robert you always surprise, but that last line is
sigable.
--
Eric "more than a mouthful" Hocking
"A closed mouth gathers no feet"
=== London, England (nee Melbourne, Australia) ===
http://www.ozemail.com.au/~ehocking
wa...@iinet.net.au
[hot dog breaks, stuck in vagina, doctor removes, tells kid, story all
over school]
[Critique includes:]
> A hot dog, being fairly flexible, would be unlikely to "break off" in a
> space which is long. basically straight, and fairly flexible.
Not really straight. Kinda curved, with fornices, and at an angle that
most uneducated people don't expect (i.e. 45 degrees towards the back).
> If a hot dog were to break off in said space, I think that the broken piece
> would come out almost immediately on its own, if the young lady were to sit
> up, sit on the toilet, whatever.
Do your tampons fall out?
> If the hot dog were to get stuck, and if the girl were taken to the doctor,
> the idea that the doctor would tell the story to his son/daughter/classmate
> of the girl is not believable. The obvious risk of legal ramifications is
> astronomical.
Unfortunately, a small minority of my so-called colleagues do all sorts of
things I would classify as unbelievable.
Lara "not that I necessarily believe this story, of course, but I've heard
worse as first-person reports[1]" Hopkins
[1] and removed a couple of retained tampons [2] myself
[2] from other people.
Larry Palletti
<flowrchi...@prodigy.net> wrote:
[...]
>
>Could this story about the young lady, the hot dog, and the indiscreet
>physician have happened? Well, of course it COULD have happened. It just
>didn't strike me as very probable. (Too many UL red flags)
>
>Until someone can provide me with proof that this, or something very
>similar, DID happen, I will choose to believe that it was more likely the
>product of someone's overactive imagination. (a teen-age boy springs to
>mind)
>
My gawd, did I just see you calling for a cite?
What a difference a day makes.
Larry Palletti
East Point/Atlanta, Georgia
www.palletti.com la...@palletti.com booksonscreen.com
--
Opinionated, but lovable
H Gilmer
[snip]
> masturbatory techniques. Her choice of item today is a hot dog [and you
> thought a cigar was ineffectual, huh?]. Her vigorous manipulations of said
> hot dog cause it to break off in her vagina. She is brought to the doc/ER
> for removal of same.
> A hot dog, being of the dimensions which hot dogs are (refer to the
> preceding paragraph) and being very greasy would not be a good candidate for
> use in the aforementioned science experiment. I don't know this from
> personal experience -- I'm just assuming.
> A hot dog, being fairly flexible, would be unlikely to "break off" in a
> space which is long. basically straight, and fairly flexible.
The version I heard involved a frozen hot dog, which is neither greasy
nor flexible. And, dimensionally speaking, it's bigger than yer
average finger.
Hg
H Gilmer
> Pah. I don't care how big that donkey was, it doesn't compare to the
> proportions of an entire 8-to-10-pound human being, the accommodation
> of which women collectively manage on a daily basis.
Yabbut how long does it take them to dilate to the point that they
could accomodate said small human, and how much screaming, yelling,
and tearing was involved in the process?
Hg
Margaret Lillard
<stev...@alexia.lis.uiuc.edu> sez:
>On 1 Sep 1999, Eve wrote:
>
>> Don writes:
>> >This root ball would have to be enormous, don't you think, to keep them
>> >locked with an adult female human?
>>
>> I should say so. Consider that human vaginas routinely pass 6-7 lb babies with
>> no real assistance required. Well, yeah, it hurts, as a rule, but it's not
>> like the baby is stuck in there until the Dr. does something magic to make it
>> come out. (All bets are off with bigger babies, of course, but I can't imagine
>> a dog with a 10lb penis). So unless this "root ball" is bigger than a small
>> baby, I can't imagine it making withdrawal impossible. Painful, maybe.
>
>This then prompts a question about "stickage" in mating dogs as
>well--after all, newborn puppies are larger than yer basic dog peepee.
>
>[some musings with regard to vaginal expellation of offspring of various species]
This is from _Dog Owner's Home Veterinary Handbook_, a tome I've found
very handy thanks to the fragile physiology of your average Sheltie
Gone Bad. ISBN 0-87605-764-4. It's got a lot of technical information
presented in a way that's generally understandable to your average dog
owner.
The vaginal snappage information is at the bottom under "Prolonged
Tie;" the other stuff, however, is also relevant to the conversation.
Note that it appears the tie occurs *after* ejaculation -- kind of
obligatory afterplay...
Basically, it sounds as though it's the bitch's vulvar (?) swelling
that keeps the dog's penis locked, not the size of the bulbus glandis.
This swelling doesn't occur when the bitch is giving birth, so the
size ratio of puppy to penis is immaterial.
This particular section isn't illustrated until you get to the part
about artificial insemination and there the view of the erect penis
and swelled bulbus glandis are somewhat obscured by a plastic funnel
(this is a great book). But based on that and on some other
illustrations of doggie reproductive systems, I'd estimate the largest
diameter of the bulbus glandis is less than than a quarter greater
than the diameter of the main shaft of the penis. If that makes sense.
I guess you could compare it to a garden-variety turkey baster, stem
to squeeze-bulb, in terms of respective diameter size.
Anyway, this -- along with Ian's post of 8/30 on the lack of
documented cases of penis captivus -- makes me highly skeptical that a
dog could get stuck in a human female any more than a human male
could. But if it does happen, please note there are helpful
instructions at the bottom. Of this post.
Commence excerpts:
_The Tie_
Dogs differ from men in that they do not have tubes above the prostate
(seminal vesicles) to store the sperm. Sperm flows directly into the
urethra from the vas deferens and does not mix first with prostatic
fluid.
The mechanics of sexual intercourse in the dog also are different from
those of human beings. After intromission a knot at the base ofthe
penis, called the bulbus glandis, becomes swollen. It is held by the
constrictor muscles of the vagina forming a union between the two
animals called the "tie".
During intercourse the first part of the male's ejaculate is clear and
contains no sperm. The second part is cloudy and does contain sperm.
The final fraction is composed of prostatic fluid. It serves to wash
out the urethra and neutralize the acidity of the vagina and propel
sperm up into the uterus.
The exact function of the tie is unknown. Perhaps it holds the penis
in place while the sperm flow up from the testicles. For a tie to be
effective, it must last for at least two to three minutes. Many ties
last 30 to 40 minutes. ...
If the knot at the base of the penis swells up *before* intromission,
the penis may be withdrawn prematurely. ... For dogs to mate, full
erection must take place after intromission.
MATING
...
_Normal Mating Procedure_
...
If the bitch is ready to be mated, she will hold her tail to the side
and stand quietly for the male while he mounts [from the rear, as
established earlier in the passage]. As the male begins to penetrate
he will grasp her with his forelegs around the loin and thrust
forward, raising her pelvis. At full penetration he will begin to
tread up and down instead of thrusting forward. The bulbous glandis
swells and is clasped by the vulva. This produces the tie and
stimulates the male to ejaculate.
After the tie is accomplished, the male unclasps his forelegs and
places both feet on the ground on the side of the bitch. He may lift
his hindleg over the back of the bitch so that the two stand back to
back. The dogs will remain joined for 10 to 30 minutes. It is wise to
have someone posted at the head of the bitch to steady her.
Bitches may cry, whine or grunt during a tie. This is not a cause for
alarm. The important thing is to be sure that the bitch does not
become frightened and begin to struggle and try to pull away from the
male.
When a dog and bitch separate after a tie, momentarily it can be
painful. Be prepared for either one to make a sudden snap. ...
_Prolonged Tie_
One may encounter a situation in which the animals remain tied for an
hour or longer. The problem is that the constricting vaginal ring
maintains the erection. The blood cannot leave the bulbus glandis and
return to the body. As the animals become frustrated and begin to tug
against each other the situation is aggravated. Do not throw water on
the dogs or try to pull them apart. They are unable to help
themselves. Instead, turn the male so that he remounts the female and
then push his rump to increase the depth of penetration. This relieves
the constricting effect of the vaginal ring so that the dogs can slide
apart.
Margaret "Next: How to squeeze blood from a turnip" Lillard
__________=
"You know, I was just thinking how we never get any
variants on the old Plastic Money From Up Yukky Man's
Bum story any more." -- Phil Edwards on the decline
of AFU.
Eve
>A woman aware of that might choose to wait even while being aware
>it was physically possible to remove the inflated version, since it
>doesn't sound like any picnic. "Stuck" might well be a shorthand way of
>describing that state.
>
Ah, I understand you now. Yes, I would agree. But that form of "stuck"
wouldn't send you to the ER, it would just leave you in an awkward position for
a few. I think your "stuck" is entirely likely, given the "rootball" thing,
which I don't have the expertise to comment on by itself. Perhaps it's partly
the source of the dog/woman UL? You know, pump things up with a little drama
(as if bestiality isn't bizarre enough on it's own, but you know what I mean).
>If you all *could* have
>just waited 15 minutes and had the baby slither on out on its own without
>all those entertaining contractions (which I suppose aren't germane) and
>vaginal stretching (which is germane, and we haven't even mentioned
>episiotomies),
Don't! My first was nine pounds even--not the size that comes out
easily.....I'm hoping number two is less hefty.
>my guess is that most of you would have done so.
Oh, yes. Definitely.
> The woman
>with the dog apaprently has the option, and what we are calling "stuck"
>may just be "didn't plan to force something that large through her vaginal
>opening at the moment and would just as soon wait a bit and avoid it,
>thanks so much."
I think you have a good point here, and it's far more plausible than the whole
Emergency Room business.
Eve
>Yabbut how long does it take them to dilate to the point that they
>could accomodate said small human, and how much screaming, yelling,
>and tearing was involved in the process?
The dilation is cervical, so it has nothing to do with whether things can get
through the vagina or not. The vagina stays the same size. Well, you know, it
stretches when the baby comes through, but it doesn't dilate. As for tearing,
that varies from woman to woman. Obviously, the bigger the baby.....it's my
understanding that your average kiddo doesn't have that much of a problem. And
as for yelling and screaming, well, I did mine with no medication and nary a
scream was heard (and she wasn't tiny, either). Besides, most of the pain is
from the contractions and the cervical dilation. By the time the kid comes
out, well, that's nothing. That was my experience, anyway, YMMV.
Besides, how many dog (or human) penises are the size of babies? I have yet to
meet the man with a penis even remotely that size. Don't want to either. As a
cow-orker of mine once said, "it's not the size of your rod that counts, it's
how you wiggle your worm."
wa...@iinet.net.au
> I'm not quite sure what point (so to speak) you're trying to make. Are you
> saying that a vagina is angled enough to be a serious impediment to a hot
> dog?
Nope, I'm saying that a lot of people really believe that the vagina is
just a straight simple tube that goes straight up in a caudal direction.
Lots of people never explore their own bodies. I can conceive of a
situation where a schoolgirl, unfamiliar with her anatomy, would push&pull
the hot dog in a direction not aligned with the vaginal axis, and that
this would make it more likely to break. That's all. Once broken (I
continue to assume that this is not a frozen hot dog - yowch), I imagine
she would try to retrieve it, breaking off little bits progressively until
a piece remains which she is unable to reach. Yes, some people can't even
reach their cervix; the posterior fornix extends a fair way further back.
This is why even saturated tampons sometimes get stuck, and have to be
retrieved with instruments.
> Saturated tampons can, indeed, "fall out" very easily, especially when a
> woman is "bearing down" as she sits on a toilet.
Perhaps, if they're close to the introitus (this has never happened to me;
perhaps it's a function of pelvic floor muscles?[1]) but not if they're
higher up. In my opinion and experience, of course. There's an AFU
research project in here somewhere; care to apply for a grant?
> Could this story about the young lady, the hot dog, and the indiscreet
> physician have happened? Well, of course it COULD have happened. It just
> didn't strike me as very probable. (Too many UL red flags)
I totally agree. The possibility of the story is a completely different
argument from the likelihood of the story.
Lara
[1] You may have big tits, but I have big tits AND great pelvic floor
muscles neenerneener[2]
[2]Not to be interpreted as a Cameronism. Just taking the piss [3][4]
[3] Yes, it's still fun.
[4] Do I need an ObTWIAVBP here?
wa...@iinet.net.au
> The dilation is cervical, so it has nothing to do with whether things can get
> through the vagina or not. The vagina stays the same size. Well, you know, it
> stretches when the baby comes through, but it doesn't dilate.
What's your definition of dilate?
>As for tearing,
> that varies from woman to woman. Obviously, the bigger the baby.....it's my
> understanding that your average kiddo doesn't have that much of a
problem. And
> as for yelling and screaming, well, I did mine with no medication and nary a
> scream was heard (and she wasn't tiny, either). Besides, most of the pain is
> from the contractions and the cervical dilation. By the time the kid comes
> out, well, that's nothing. That was my experience, anyway, YMMV.
YMMV, all right! OK, first stage takes longer than second stage (usually 6
to 12 hoursish, varies widely). Second stage begins when the cervix is
dilated enough to accommodate the head, and the baby starts to negotiate
the vagina. This, according to most women, is Bloody Painful too. Many
find it more painful than first stage contractions (described as 'period
pains' by one friend of mine). Stretching at crowning [1] (or tearing, and
LOTS of women tear; a majority in my experience) is also extremely painful
for many women, even those using chemical relief.
Lara "I still don't believe a dog would get stuck" Hopkins
[1] What do they call this in a breech birth?
Lee Rudolph
>Vicki Robinson <vjr...@xcski.com> wrote:
>
>> Pah. I don't care how big that donkey was, it doesn't compare to the
>> proportions of an entire 8-to-10-pound human being, the accommodation
>> of which women collectively manage on a daily basis.
>
>Yabbut how long does it take them to dilate to the point that they
>could accomodate said small human, and how much screaming, yelling,
>and tearing was involved in the process?
Also, my understanding of the process of childbirth is that it does
not involve much oscillation on the part of the 8-to-10-pound human
being (at least not along the relevant axis); whereas Ms. Barr's
partner-in-(what-I-assume-was-then-and-there-a-)crime, though he
may not have been a totally enthusiastic participant, presumably
would have been replaced by the impresario had he not indulged
in at least a little photogenic in-and-out.
Lee "one-way ticket, yeah" Rudolph
Eve
When I say dilate, I think of cervical dilation, or say the dilation of your
pupils, where the opening expands more or less by itself. I guess (w/o
consulting a dictionary) dilate techically means expand in any case, but to me
at least, in childbirth the word dilate refers specifically to cervical
dilation.>Second stage begins when the cervix is
>dilated enough to accommodate the head, and the baby starts to negotiate
>the vagina. This, according to most women, is Bloody Painful too. Many
>find it more painful than first stage contractions (described as 'period
>pains' by one friend of mine).
This sounds accurate, but that second stage, in my case at least, doesn't
really last too long, and it was the worst part. Or, I should say, it was
transition that was bloody awful. Once I actually started pushing, I was in
less pain (relatively). It still wasn't a picnic, but the whole screaming and
yelling thing just didn't happen, and if it had, it wouldn't have been from
vaginal stretching.
>Stretching at crowning [1] (or tearing, and
>LOTS of women tear; a majority in my experience) is also extremely painful
>for many women, even those using chemical relief.
Well, for me crowning wasn't such a big deal, pain-wise. As for tearing, I
must say that the majority of people I know have either not torn at all or had
an episiotomy. I realize this isn't a statistically useful sample. And I also
realize that people experience and manage pain in very different ways. But I
still say that, passage of babies being as routine (and therefore possible) as
it is, and there being no dog or human penis even remotely as large as said
babies, the dog getting stuck thing just seems impossible to me.
Melissa7m
>
>> Pah. I don't care how big that donkey was, it doesn't compare to the
>> proportions of an entire 8-to-10-pound human being, the accommodation
>> of which women collectively manage on a daily basis.
Jesus, I get annoyed if I have to accomodate a tiny piece of cotton on a daily
basis for too long. Kudos to the women who accomodate small children daily!
-Amanda "the word collectively does not make that a logical sentence" Marcotte
Chip Taylor
>(this is a great book). But based on that and on some other
>illustrations of doggie reproductive systems, I'd estimate the largest
>diameter of the bulbus glandis is less than than a quarter greater
>than the diameter of the main shaft of the penis. If that makes sense.
>I guess you could compare it to a garden-variety turkey baster, stem
>to squeeze-bulb, in terms of respective diameter size.
Ok, I tried to stay out of this discussion but... I have been involved in
breeding large dogs for many years, including collection of semen for
freezing. The bulbus glandis (or "dogknot") varies in size, of course, from
breed to breed. In most large breeds the dogknot is the size of a tennis ball
to half again that large.
Chip "feeling inadequate again" Taylor
God, grant me the Senility to forget the people I never liked anyway, the
good fortune to run into the ones I do, and the eyesight to tell the
difference.
K. D.
Chris W. wrote in message <37CD6FC6...@usa.net>...
>Oh, and for Don who has only seen the dogs with small penii,
Hi, Chris.
What follows is meant not as a means to insult, belittle, or disparage you
or your remarks, but as a genuine attempt to shed some light on words with
LATIN ROOTS. (I don't get much of a chance to put to practical use my
undergraduate major, so please humor me.)
And hey, speaking of "roots," that means that we're still on topic!
There are two correct plurals for the word penis (which comes to us,
unchanged, from Latin, meaning "tail.") The plural for penis, remaining
consistent with Latin form, would be "penes." (explanation to follow) It
is also perfectly correct to use the "English" form of the plural,
"penises."
I wish I had saved a copy of a post I read on this topic (in another
newsgroup, I think) several months ago. The letter writer to which the very
funny Latin lover responded had used the word "genii" as a plural for
"genus." The plural for "genus" is, of course, "genera." (Maybe the post
was only funny for those who have studied Latin, but the writer did a very
good and also funny job of going thru Latin noun declensions.) My
explanation will not be as entertaining, but I believe it is at least valid.
In short, Latin words of the second declension, masculine (which end in -us
in the nominative singular) form their plurals by dropping the -us and
adding -i. A well-recognized example would be "alumnus - alumni." There is
another form of masculine, second-declension nouns (ending in "-r"), which
also forms its plural by adding "-i," but let's not confuse matters.
PENIS, on the other hand, is a third declension, masculine noun. The plural
of such nouns is formed by dropping the ending, "-is," and adding "-es."
Hence: PENES.
Which probably won't be worth much in life, outside of impressing folks who
know Latin. Maybe not even that.
Here is a web site where you can input "penis" (eh hem, not literally!) and
see both forms of the plural:
Margaret Lillard
>In article <37cdeef4....@news.panix.com>, pe...@panix.comPANIX.COM wrote:
>>(this is a great book). But based on that and on some other
>>illustrations of doggie reproductive systems, I'd estimate the largest
>>diameter of the bulbus glandis is less than than a quarter greater
>>than the diameter of the main shaft of the penis. If that makes sense.
>>I guess you could compare it to a garden-variety turkey baster, stem
>>to squeeze-bulb, in terms of respective diameter size.
>Ok, I tried to stay out of this discussion but... I have been involved in
>breeding large dogs for many years, including collection of semen for
>freezing. The bulbus glandis (or "dogknot") varies in size, of course, from
>breed to breed. In most large breeds the dogknot is the size of a tennis ball
>to half again that large.
Yes, but what's the dogknot size in relation to the dog penis it
accompanies? My point being, if the woman has managed to get the dog's
penis inside, how much additional stretching would be needed to accomodate
the dogknot?
>Chip "feeling inadequate again" Taylor
I remind you of the concept "Too much of a good thing."
Margaret "Who's Inadequate and does she mind?" Lillard
K. D.
Margaret Lillard wrote in message <37cdeef4....@news.panix.com>...
>This is from _Dog Owner's Home Veterinary Handbook_, a tome I've found
>very handy thanks to the fragile physiology of your average Sheltie
>Gone Bad. ISBN 0-87605-764-4.
<snip>
>This particular section isn't illustrated until you get to the part
>about artificial insemination and there the view of the erect penis
>and swelled bulbus glandis are somewhat obscured by a plastic funnel
>(this is a great book).
Hahahahaha -- I love that last remark!
Thank you for this very informative post. I've thought all along that most
aspects of the woman - male dog copulation stories were probably bogus. Not
being an expert on doggie penes (see my other post about Latin roots), and
not particularly desiring to become an expert, I will still glad to be
enlightened on this important topic!
Deborah Stevenson
On Thu, 2 Sep 1999, Margaret Lillard wrote:
> This is from _Dog Owner's Home Veterinary Handbook_, a tome I've found
> very handy thanks to the fragile physiology of your average Sheltie
> Gone Bad. ISBN 0-87605-764-4. It's got a lot of technical information
> presented in a way that's generally understandable to your average dog
> owner.
Actually, I believe it was in a guide to the Shetland Sheepdog that I read
the immortal statement "Stud work comes in spurts."
> The vaginal snappage information is at the bottom under "Prolonged
> Tie;" the other stuff, however, is also relevant to the conversation.
> Note that it appears the tie occurs *after* ejaculation -- kind of
> obligatory afterplay...
>
> Basically, it sounds as though it's the bitch's vulvar (?) swelling
> that keeps the dog's penis locked, not the size of the bulbus glandis.
> This swelling doesn't occur when the bitch is giving birth, so the
> size ratio of puppy to penis is immaterial.
[snip of further information]
Aha. Sounds then like my speculations were in vain--that a human female
would be unlikely to get stuck in any sense, let alone the technical
sense. I guess this scenario has more implications for human male looking
lustfully at the Basset bitch snoring on the carpet next to him. Thanks
for the useful information.
Interesting the hold animal sex has on the collective, though; I would
imagine it's the source of the various "stuck" legends for even
intra-human coitus (Jerzy Kozinski had one on _The Painted Bird_, I
believe). I suppose we should be just as relieved that we haven't done
the same thing with porcine sex and had corkscrew penises getting stuck in
human cervices...
Deborah Stevenson
(stev...@alexia.lis.uiuc.edu)
K. D.
Eve wrote in message <19990901150734...@ng-ck1.aol.com>...
>I'm not sure what you mean here. The baby never exactly slides out on its
own
>(especially if you're on your back with your feet in stirrups--gravity just
>isn't on your side), you just push until it slides out. And pushing itself
>isn't entirely under voluntary control
Yes, much of the pushing is beyond voluntary control. However, I know from
personal experience, and also from labor and birth situations of people I
know, that sometimes the baby does seem to "slide out."
My second son was born naturally. Labor was kinda plodding along, when the
midwife decided it would speed things up to "break the water". What
happened next was not too dissimilar to opening the floodgates.
Midwife: "Don't push!"
Me: "I'm NOT pushing!"
I could almost feel the cervix opening up (from about 6 or 7 to complete
dilation in, oh, about 0.5 seconds), and before we knew it, out came the
baby with a gush of amniotic fluid.
Very intense. VERY intense! I wouldn't recommend it.
I have a friend who delivered twins vaginally. The twins came a little
early and rather quickly, as her doctor had been planning a C-section if one
of the twins did not turn in time (it was feet down, not head down).
As my friend was wheeled into the ER, a little foot was protruding from the
birth canal. This is not the best presentation, as you know, but it was
kinda too late to do anything about it. She never even made it to labor and
delivery. As some OB and other residents were gathering to observe (most of
whom had never seen a footling presentation born vaginally), out came #1,
with #2 (head first) not too far behind. Altho the twins were slightly
premature, they were of good size and both healthy (yay!).
I just want to know who these women are who have labors and deliveries like
in the textbooks!!!!?????? Especially the ones for whom the sensation of
heavy labor is "intense" (the word used by my childbirth instructor before
the birth of my first child -- she refused to use the word "pain.")
Show of hands, from women who did it without anesthesia:
"Intense?" ________
"Painful?" ________
Bob Ward
H Gilmer <gil...@io.com> wrote in message news:7qkqa7$lad$1...@hiram.io.com...
It must be one stone-cold bitch who could keep said hot dog frozen
throughout the ordeal. Was she English, by chance?