Strom Thurmond's secret daughter
RichaLlo3
lots of romantic relationships between black and whites from the time this
great country was invaded by European whites. It is the most hidden history in
the US.
For the most part, blacks are not blacks but a mix of black and white blood.
The end results were denial (a form of abuse) but initiated in mutual respect
and consensual.
Kelly Petit
"RichaLlo3" <rich...@aol.com> a écrit dans le message de
news:20031214043550...@mb-m03.aol.com...
I had no idea of what you were talking about so i looked it up :
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,105695,00.html
Kelly
Rainy
news:20031214043550...@mb-m03.aol.com...
: I've said it for years and wish I had the money to reseach it.
I've traced back numerous branches of my family tree and found
several instances of unmarried African-American women giving
birth to children fathered by white men. Unfortunately it's been
very difficult to trace the lineage of the mixed offspring. I feel
pretty confident though that most Americans white and black
have distant cousins of the other race.
--
*Carol* http://www.rainy-day-laughter.com ~ Home of Happy
Liederhosen's Hollywood, The Codfather's Punny Movies,
Your Weekly Rainyscope & even more yet.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
There are some people that if they don't know,
you can't tell 'em. ~ Louis Armstrong
RichaLlo3
LOL..LOL...LOL
Marian
Is it a secret? It was *always* a white man and a black girl/woman who worked
for oe was owned by his family. Consensual? Romantic balderdash.
Marian
DittyDu...@webtv.net
compare their appearance with true African immigrants. The mixture is
fairly apparent.
The very early census reports listed mulattos and quadroons and
octaroons. Most of the early census reports have been destroyed.
As far as I can tell, the big rift came during Reconstruction, under
the Skallywags and Carpet Baggers, who set up the most ignorant of the
blacks as judges and mayors, and disenfranchised the whites. (Note :
all included were men only) It went on for 10 years of martial law.
They heavily taxed the landowners, and stole the public moneys until the
entire south was depleted. They also failed to produce the 40 acres and
a mule as promised. It was like letting the inmates of an insane asylum
run the institution, and commiting the former staff to straight jackets.
Blake
-------------------------
rich...@aol.com (RichaLlo3)
DittyDu...@webtv.net
RichaLlo3
>for oe was owned by his family. Consensual? Romantic balderdash.
>
>Marian
yep...i believe it to be. Once respect was there...there was consensual sex,
Marian.
Girl...i worked in those sweatshops in the 50's on the line rubbing butt to
butt. I know and I don't think it was a lot different in the 16-1700s.
DittyDu...@webtv.net
by someone like him.
Let me tell you about and octagonal antebellum home in Mississippi,
which at one time, was way out in the country. It has now been reworked
for the tourist trade. As late as the 1960's, it was opened for viewing
by a member of the family who made her living showing it for a fee. The
house had been started before the War of the Northern Aggression, but
not finished. Only the main floor was liveable. The workmen dropped
their tools where they were working and left. Some of the tools remain
where dropped on the upper stories -- paint brushes and such.
Well, the owner never returned from the war, which left his wife to fend
for herself. She had a black man overseer who had stayed with her all
during the war and kept the farm going. He stayed with her when he was
freed and kept the place going. She thought so much of him, she had an
oil portrait of him painted and hung over the fireplace. It was still
there when we visited. The elderly descendent was fairly white, but had
the very curly black hair.
No one talks about any of it much down there, but they all know.
After the elderly descendent died, the slave quarters, a brick building,
was converted into a gift shop. The grounds were spiffied up, and a
large fee was charged for viewing the place. And the oil portrait was
gone. Draw your own conclusions, as I know you will.
Blake
-----
For the most part, blacks are not blacks but a mix of black and white
blood. The end results were denial (a form of abuse) but initiated in
mutual respect and consensual.
--
Marian
liasons were *always* white male on black female, I deserve a comeuppance.
Heartening to hear this [rare] story of rebuttal. Marian
>worked for or was owned by his family. Consensual? Romantic balderdash.
>Marian
Marian
>>Is it a secret? It was *always* a white man and a black girl/woman who
>worked
>>
>>Marian
From: rich...@aol.com (RichaLlo3)
>yep...i believe it to be. Once respect was there...there was consensual sex,
>Marian.
>Girl...i worked in those sweatshops in the 50's on the line rubbing butt to
>butt. I know and I don't think it was a lot different in the 16-1700s.
I'm not denying there was sex between the races, Richard, and lots of it. For
it to be "consensual", though, you'll have to exclude very young girls [the
Thurmond story] and the women who worked for the men or the families of the men
with whom they had sex. Those are power relationships which endure today,
irrelevant of race.
Mutual "respect" would be limited to those men who marry the black women & stay
in the community, or leave it together.
I enjoy reading about the white women who loved black men, but it must be
acknowledged that these relationships were the most dangerous, and therefore
the most limited...
Marian
DittyDu...@webtv.net
about any of it much. But if you look around down here, you will find
that the bi-racial children of the rich usually do rather well in
business. I suppose you haven't ever heard about certain New Orleans
customs, among other things.
Blake
-----
lust...@aol.com (Marian)
DittyDu...@webtv.net
white, according to friends who have met her. She lives in DC, they
say, and is divorced from his dad.
His dad's mother also is white. The family is quite well to do -- owns
a funeral home here. There were 12 children, all going into politics.
I used to know a white woman who was married to the Head of Music Dept.
at LeMoyne. She said she had been widowed with three small children in
Kentucky, at the time she met him. When he offered to help rear her
children, they married. Seems to me that white women marry black men
about as often as the reverse. That isn't what all the rhetoric said,
when the leadership was pumping up the civil rights movement, though.
Not PC.
Blake
Bill Becker
admitted it. Mother was a maid in the
Thurmond household.
--
BillB (Daytona FL)
RichaLlo3
>admitted it. Mother was a maid in the
>Thurmond household.
and to think that two faced sob exibited himself as a racicist for selfishness
and personal gain.
Marian
This last is absurd, Blake. How could it be "politically incorrect" to
acknowledge a white woman's attraction for a black man? Isn't that the
stereotypical nightmare scenario of the Klan, used to justify a million
lynchings? And it is just a nonsense to insinuate that as many white women were
screwing blacks as 'masters' were taking advantage of female slaves/domestic
workers.
Marriage, on the other hand, is quite another thing.
Marian
***********************
http://www.michaelmoore.com/words/wackoattacko/
http://michaelmoore.com/
http://www.al-franken.com/
***********************
DittyDu...@webtv.net
airwaves constantly for months, when the local black preachers were
trying to fire up any kind of civil revolution back in the 60's.
I can't believe there were that many white rapists in the world, much
less down here. I also doubt that there were a million lynchings, even
if you count the lynchings of whites and include the entire west.
Furthermore, if you understood the culture and human nature, you would
know that most of it was consensual with much seduction involved.
You have been snowed, Marian.
Blake
=================
Marian
Marian
***********************
http://michaelmoore.com/
http://www.al-franken.com/
***********************
Kelly Petit
her program. I think I have to disagree with you, Blake. This part of literature
was really more like a testimony and I didn't get the impression you describe
underneath (I read it too).
Kelly
<DittyDu...@webtv.net> a écrit dans le message de
news:6322-3FD...@storefull-3118.bay.webtv.net...
Jean B.
>
> I was talking about all the inflamatory rhetoric that went on over the
> airwaves constantly for months, when the local black preachers were
> trying to fire up any kind of civil revolution back in the 60's.
> I can't believe there were that many white rapists in the world, much
> less down here. I also doubt that there were a million lynchings, even
> if you count the lynchings of whites and include the entire west.
> Furthermore, if you understood the culture and human nature, you would
> know that most of it was consensual with much seduction involved.
> You have been snowed, Marian.
> Blake
Hey what?! I can't understand your statement "I can't believe
there were that many white rapists in the world, much less down
here." Does this imply that a) whites don't rape? Or b) that the
south is immune to such acts? I wonder what the statistics are.
--
Jean B.
DittyDu...@webtv.net
agenda. Furthermore, most of what was printed in the 1850's was by and
for abolitionists who lived in the north, and also had an agenda. Uncle
Tom's Cabin, written by a northern abolitionist, was taught to us as
children as fiction, pure fiction, with an agenda. Most of the southern
literature that ever got published was derogatory to the south.
However, what I was describing was what I heard on our local radio
stations, when the black leadership was trying to fire up a revolution
for the civil rights movement.
A million lynchings? There weren't a million blacks living here, and
half of the ones who were here, were women. The Ku Klux was not
responsible for all of them, either. I suppose you never heard of the
Jewish man who was lynched in Atlanta for allegedly raping a girl mill
worker?
Very few of the white families ever lived in a house like Tara. Most of
this area was rural farming community, living in log houses. White
girls did not want to report a rape then any more then than now. If a
black baby was born, it was evident, though. Black and white children
played together, had friendships that lasted, and still do. When I was
a child, some of my teachers had lived through the Reconstruction, and
their parents and teachers had lived through the War.
I can asssure you that MLK grew up in an upper middle class neighborhood
with considerable comfort; that Rosa Parks was asked if she would be
willing to cause a disturbance on the bus; that she consulted with the
white family she worked for, who agreed with her; that this entire
movement was orchestrated not by poor mistreated blacks, but by the
wealthy who were able to send their children to Berekley in California,
where they got their heads messed up along with the whites that went
there. It was not a grass roots movement; there were as many poor white
sharecroppers as there were blacks..
As for black/white marriage, that was prohibited by law until mid 20th
century. If you will notice, I used present tense???
But seems to me that the black culture is overly concerned with
recreational sex; that in the past, having the white ole massa pay court
might be well received, and could likely turn into a status symbol,
rather than be a rape. It is a different culture. As I said before,
not all white men were ole massahs, and not all women were house
servants. .
Perhaps if you look at the copyright and who wrote the slave literature
program, you could put it in perspective.
However, I doubt that anything I say will tend to change what anyone
else tends to think. People who can't actually remember tend to believe
what they are taught.
Blake
----------------------
kelly...@wanadoo.invalid (Kelly Petit)
When my daughter did her degree in English, she had American slave
literature on her program. I think I have to disagree with you, Blake.
This part of literature was really more like a testimony and I didn't
get the impression you describe underneath (I read it too).
Kelly
--
DittyDu...@webtv.net
men do rape. The south has plenty more than we want. The rhetoric
which we were constantly bombarded with, back then, implied that all
white men were rapists. It was insulting. It implied that all young
black women were being raped by white men.
This was in the middle of the so=called sexual revolution, when it
became socially acceptable to copulate in public parks, at least in
Berekley..
Do you think we have more in the south than are in the rest of the
country?
Furthermore, I think the statistics will bear out that most rapists tend
to go for their own race. I read that somewhere when I was studying
crimes.
Also, I think I read that most men do not desire to go beyond what the
woman is amenable to.
To get back to the statement, interracial marriage was prohibited by
law at the time. To add another bit of knowledge, the black community
has always been fairly open about sex, and found that recreational sex
was enhoyable. Black girls who had babies out of wedlock were still
loved, along with the babies.
White girls were whisked away to another town until the baby came. It
was then put up for adoption frequently. The white community seldom
mentioned sex. Remember how Queen Victoria put pantaloons on the
piano's legs? It's a different culture, with the exception of the
lowest classes of whites.
I still do not believe there were a million lynchings, or that there
were a million white rapists.
Blake
-------------------------
Anne Jackson
from DittyDu...@webtv.net contains these words:
> Furthermore, I think the statistics will bear out that most rapists
> tend to go for their own race. I read that somewhere when I was
> studying crimes.
> Also, I think I read that most men do not desire to go beyond what
> the woman is amenable to.
Hmmph! That statement could only have been written by a man!
--
AnneJ
ICQ #:- 119531282
DittyDu...@webtv.net
using local statistics. I think some women have since written a
rebuttal.
However, it is true here, at least, that most of the rape is black on
black, or else white on white. A mix sometimes
occurs during the course of an extended crime. Any is too much.
However, I can't believe Strom Thurmond raped his housemaid. If he had,
her family would not have been so cooperative. I think it was probly
seduction. There IS a difference.
Blake
================
these words:
Furthermore, I think the statistics will bear out that most rapists tend
to go for their own race. I read that somewhere when I was studying
crimes.
Also, I think I read that most men do not desire to go beyond what the
woman is amenable to. Blake
-----------
Yoj
<DittyDu...@webtv.net> wrote in message
news:23547-3F...@storefull-3113.bay.webtv.net...
Probably was, as the course I had was taught by a local cop, and he was
using local statistics. I think some women have since written a
rebuttal.
However, it is true here, at least, that most of the rape is black on
black, or else white on white. A mix sometimes
occurs during the course of an extended crime. Any is too much.
However, I can't believe Strom Thurmond raped his housemaid. If he had,
her family would not have been so cooperative. I think it was probly
seduction. There IS a difference.
Blake
================
If the housemaid submits because she is afraid of losing her job, the
difference is only technical.
Joy
RichaLlo3
the big problem here is resetting the Thurmond legacy. The captured media
cannot do for fear of job loss....which means no food for the family and no
money to pay off the car. Only on yhe internet can freedom ring. The plain
truth is had the color been reversed, Thurmond would be in prison for life or
hung from a tree for statutory rape. The idea he could live this lie, promote
racism and live, steal from the tax payer longer than any other Senator is a
disgrace. It would be nice to know just how much money he took from the
taxpayer in salary,retirement, medical benefits as a hidden felon.
Jean B.
>
> Jean, it refers to the number of rapists, to wit, white rapists. White
> men do rape. The south has plenty more than we want. The rhetoric
> which we were constantly bombarded with, back then, implied that all
> white men were rapists. It was insulting. It implied that all young
> black women were being raped by white men.
> This was in the middle of the so=called sexual revolution, when it
> became socially acceptable to copulate in public parks, at least in
> Berekley..
>
> Do you think we have more in the south than are in the rest of the
> country?
Of course I don't! You just seemed to be saying that white men
weren't rapists.
>
> Furthermore, I think the statistics will bear out that most rapists tend
> to go for their own race. I read that somewhere when I was studying
> crimes.
I can believe that, although I am sure there are exceptions with
both black men raping white women and white men raping black
women.
> Also, I think I read that most men do not desire to go beyond what the
> woman is amenable to.
Okay. I agree to that too. Most men are decent. But
unfortunately there are many who think a woman means "yes" when
she is saying "no". I once had a run-in with a man like that....
>
> To get back to the statement, interracial marriage was prohibited by
> law at the time. To add another bit of knowledge, the black community
> has always been fairly open about sex, and found that recreational sex
> was enhoyable. Black girls who had babies out of wedlock were still
> loved, along with the babies.
>
> White girls were whisked away to another town until the baby came. It
> was then put up for adoption frequently. The white community seldom
> mentioned sex. Remember how Queen Victoria put pantaloons on the
> piano's legs? It's a different culture, with the exception of the
> lowest classes of whites.
>
> I still do not believe there were a million lynchings, or that there
> were a million white rapists.
I have no knowledge of the statistics that are bandied about, so I
can't comment on that.
--
Jean B.
DittyDu...@webtv.net
deal of resentment. Seems unlikely any further relationship would be
cooperative.
On the other hand, if there had been mutual respect, admiration, and
amour, the further relationship would tend to protect their secret, as
was necessary at the time..
Just my opinion. I'm not saying housemaids don't get raped. As a
matter of fact, wives get raped, too, in which case, they tend to turn
to their housemaids for comfort and help. At least the housemaid can
quit and get another job. Blake
================
If the housemaid submits because she is afraid of losing her job, the
difference is only technical.
Joy
Re: Strom Thurmond's secret daughter
DittyDu...@webtv.net
situations like this happened after mutual respect was established. I'm
not defending the guy; although, I do think he did the right thing,
later, by supporting her, whether or not it was because of intimidation
or a sense of duty.
Actually, I don't know for certan that, if the situation had been
reversed, he would have been strung up from a tree. In many cases, the
offender was simply told to get out of town NOW, before it was too late;
and if the girl turned up pregnant, an illegal abortion took care of the
evidence. Not every crime is punished.
Furthermore, you know as well as I that for some years after the War,
there were bands of unemployed black men roaming the countryside, and
that the girls in remote farmhouses were terrified of them with good
reason, and that there was no legal recourse..
Blake
------------------------
rich...@aol.com (RichaLlo3)
Marian
Blake wrote:
[...]
>A million lynchings? There weren't a million blacks living here, and
>half of the ones who were here, were women.
That was indeed a Great exaggeration, for which I apologize. I should have said
"a gazillion" because that's what I meant. According to this site, there were
*only* a few thousand:
http://www.law.umkc.edu/faculty/projects/ftrials/shipp/lynchingsstate.html
Marian
************************
http://www.whitehouse.org
http://johnkerry.com/
http://www.clark04.com/
http://www.johnedwards2004.com/
http://www.democrats.org/
***************************************
Marian
However, I can't believe Strom Thurmond raped his housemaid. If he had,
>her family would not have been so cooperative. I think it was probly
>seduction. There IS a difference.
>Blake
>================
>If the housemaid submits because she is afraid of losing her job, the
>difference is only technical.
>
>Joy
Precisely. A distinction without a difference, except, in addition ~ a 22
year-old [high school teacher & coach at the time] who "seduces" a 16 year-old
is breaking the law. Then as now...
Marian
>[...]
>The plain
>truth is had the color been reversed, Thurmond would be in prison for life or
>hung from a tree for statutory rape. The idea he could live this lie, promote
>racism and live, steal from the tax payer longer than any other Senator is a
>disgrace. [...]
That. Is. THE. Scandal.
Bill Becker
the women and her child so, I guess, they tried
to do something of the right thing.
--
BillB (Daytona FL)
<DittyDu...@webtv.net> wrote in message
news:22724-3F...@storefull-3111.bay.webtv.net...
Rex Thomas
> Probably was, as the course I had was taught by a local cop, and he was
> using local statistics. I think some women have since written a
> rebuttal.
> However, it is true here, at least, that most of the rape is black on
> black, or else white on white. A mix sometimes
> occurs during the course of an extended crime. Any is too much.
>
> However, I can't believe Strom Thurmond raped his housemaid. If he had,
> her family would not have been so cooperative. I think it was probly
> seduction. There IS a difference.
> Blake
Cooperative? What were they gonna do? Tell the papers? First of all,
the cops would not have helped them, and the papers wouldn't either.
Her family really had no choice but to accept the child.
And it was rape -- at least statutory. Essie Mae's mom was only 16 at
the time -- while that oversexed white chimp Thurmond was 22.
DittyDu...@webtv.net
have no idea whether he was oversexed or not. Certainly, she was
underage.
In considering that fact, also take into consideration that most of the
black girls mature earlier than most of the white girls. Local
statistics bear out the fact that most teen age pregnancies here, at
least, are caused by older men - not teen age boys.
At any rate, the girl's family certainly had many later years they could
have ruined his career by telling the newspapers, yet they did not. I
consider that cooperation..
Blake
------------------------
Kelly Petit
also remember sending a request on 40+ atr the time and got a very nice answer
from a lecturer at a University in the South somewhere. He sent me his own work
and my daughter wa very grateful for this. He also sent us to different works
written by black slaves in the South. There were all kinds of witnesses, but to
me it was all boiled down to one thing. A black wo/man was not looked upon as a
person, but as a secondhand citizen. S/he was not allowed to learn how to read
and write and even though some "massahs" treated their slaves humanely, they
were still not a person. That was what impressed me.
I must have kept some of it somewhere, but this happened 8 or 9 years ago, so
it's a bit far back for me.
Kelly
<DittyDu...@webtv.net> a écrit dans le message de
news:23545-3FE...@storefull-3113.bay.webtv.net...
Marian
domestic, or where they lived, except when taking the maid home. They were
truly invisible back when I was growing up in Kentucky in the forties and
fifties. Florida was still segregated in the sixties, as was the life of a
Naval officer's family. It was not until the death of Martin Luther King, Jr.
in 1968, when my husband was in law school in Florida, that I began to learn
about the Civil Rights Movement or to appreciate the man...
Blake, on the other hand, has lived her entire life in Memphis.
Marian
p.s. Correction: Changed "million" to "gazillion" in post below
>stereotypical nightmare scenario of the Klan, used to justify a gazillion
>lynchings? And it is just a nonsense to insinuate that as many white
>women were screwing blacks as 'masters' were taking advantage of female
>slaves/domestic workers.
>Marriage, on the other hand, is quite another thing. Marian
Dink
>
>Precisely. A distinction without a difference, except, in addition ~ a 22
>year-old [high school teacher & coach at the time] who "seduces" a 16 year-old
>is breaking the law. Then as now...
>
>Marian
Not really, Marian. Not then, not now.
http://www.ageofconsent.com/southcarolina.htm
Dink
DittyDu...@webtv.net
before I could guess anything about his reliability for the simple
reason that so much of history has been rewritten in the past 40 years.
It is true that no slave or indentured servant had any rights except
those of a child to be fed, clothed and sheltered. You could guess that
after the farmer had spent several thousand dollars for a slave, the
farmer would tend to take care of him/her. I think women cost less,
though.
In the deep south where they grew cane, tobacco, and cotton, I surmise
that there were more slaves than the upper states. Slavery was not
profitable except for labor intensive crops grown on rich lands such as
river bottomland, and the work was harder, a threat to ensure obedience
: hence the saying, " We were sold down the river" indicates betrayal/
However, there were not that many rich plantation owners to start with.
(I have in the back of my mind the figure 3000, but that seems too
high.) No doubt one could collect stories of cruelty where there were
large numbers of slaves. The more people, the more crime. Even today,
men who are in charge of a large group of black laborers have their
problems.
Also, one should take in context what the acceptable punishments were in
the early days of this country. not just for slaves, but for other
criminals as well. Hanging was not uncommon. I know a white man whose
white gggrandfather was hung in his own front yard. Happened in
Missouri..
But to get back to what was common, most farmers would have no more than
one or two slaves, and worked along with them in the fields. Women
worked in the fields, too.
Some places had laws that slaves were not to be taught to read or write.
It was partly a matter of maintaining control, especially where the
slaves greatly outnumbered the owners of slaves. But farmers have never
put learning to read high on their priority list. It is more important
to learn to plow a straight line and a number of other skills. There
are many whites down here even now, who read only at low level. The
no-teaching law was not universal over the south. The house servants
often learned along with ole massah's children, for in rural areas,
children were taught at home. Consider also, that slaves fresh from
Africa would be regarded as uncivilized until they were acclimated to
their new surroundings.
Since the 60's there has been a great deal of emphasis on black history.
It has been portrayed mostly from the perspective of the black
leadership striving to take control of the south in particular. MOst
previously white colleges have a black history dept. where the teachers
are black. This does not mean that all the citizens of the south, both
black and white, agree with everything taught. There are still many who
remember how we lived, and how our parents and grandparents said they
lived. Many many people alive today remember their black nursemaid whom
they adored, whose children played with them in the backyard.
I think you have gotten only half the picture.
Blake
--------------------------------
kelly...@wanadoo.invalid (Kelly Petit)
Kelly Petit
I'm fairly well aware that I only have half the picture, there are many things
we've just got from books we read, etc.
It still remains that there was something called discrimination though.
Thanks for explaining this so well, Blake and have a happy Chritsmas, I'll soon
log off for this year-:)
kelly
<DittyDu...@webtv.net> a écrit dans le message de
news:20658-3FE...@storefull-3117.bay.webtv.net...
Jean B.
My goodness! I started reading that and totally forgot why I was
reading it for a moment.
--
Jean B.
Marian
>>year-old [high school teacher & coach at the time] who "seduces" a 16
>year-old
>>is breaking the law. Then as now...
>>
>>Marian
>
>Not really, Marian. Not then, not now.
>http://www.ageofconsent.com/southcarolina.htm
>
>Dink
Really, Dink? Here's another point-of-view for you [from Working Assets Radio -
Laura's spin]:
"...Essie Mae Washington Williams is a 78-year-old Los Angeles woman whose
father was segregationist senator Strom Thurmond. William's mother, an African
American, worked as a maid in Thurmond's parents' home. She bore his child in
1925 when he was 22 and she was 16, conveniently the "age of consent." While
Thurmond lived a long and lavish life, Williams' mother, Carrie Butler, did
not. Upon becoming pregnant she seems to have lost her job, left home, and
moved north. She died at 38.
Thurmond, who served as South Carolina's governor as well as senator (he died
at 100 this August), made payments when called upon. And he even visited with
his daughter, his family now admits. A leading segregationist, and foe of
civil rights, Thurmond's hypocrisy has come in for criticism -- but here are
some words that haven't come up: hush money, white supremacy, crime, statutory
rape. One question that hasn't been asked is just what age Butler was when
Thurmond impregnated her. And what exactly, in the context of apartheid
America, is the meaning of 'consent.'
Segregationist Thurmond's story is not simply personal, it's political. Like
Rush Limbaugh and Bill Bennett, he benefited from a power structure his
rhetoric undergirded, but he did not practice what he preached. In a press
conference Wednesday, Williams says she's not bitter or angry. She didn't like
his segregationist views, but she didn't think she could do anything about it.
What do you think? What power did this woman have really, and how could she
have used it, if she had felt support? How might contemporary US history be
different if women like Williams and her mother had the means and security to
be heard?"
DittyDu...@webtv.net
man who had been close the S. T. --a member of his staff -- was smiling
and saying happily how Thurmond loved her--how he was proud to have a
daughter, --his first wife died childless-- and how Thurmond had
confided in him about his biracial child.
Marriage to Carrie Butler was an impossibility, and probably never even
considered by either party.
Soon after this happy clip, the thread went to the black political
leader who started lambasting the "segregationist."
It probably won't change any minds who believe that southern whites hate
blacks, and how they mistreated them--
Most people don't see the political innuendo.
But it won't surprise the older southerners that much.
Blake
Rex Thomas
> In considering that fact, also take into consideration that most of the
> black girls mature earlier than most of the white girls.
-----------------------------------
And where the fuck did you get these statistics? The Jimmy the Greek
School of Eugenics?
Marian
NYTimes' EDITORIAL OBSERVER
Senator Strom Thurmond's Not-So-Secret Black Daughter-By BRENT STAPLES
Published: December 18, 2003
African-Americans and white Americans are so deeply entangled by blood that
racial categories have become meaningless. When discussing the issue in public,
I typically offer my own family as an example. We check "black" on the census
and appear black to the naked eye, but we are also descended from white
ancestors on both sides. Despite appearances, I told an audience not long ago,
"I am as `white' as anyone in this room."
White people mainly blank-faced and perplexed typically don't get it. But
black people get it fine: they chuckle, cover their faces in mock embarrassment
or nod in quiet agreement. Racial ambiguity is a theme they have heard
discussed in their families and communities throughout their lives.
Black families have always talked openly about white ancestors and relatives.
In hotbeds of race-mixing like New Orleans or Charleston, S.C., black and white
branches of a family sometimes lived so close at hand that they ran into one
another on the street, and black children were warned that their pale relatives
could react violently if approached. Black parents who passed on news of white
ancestry to their offspring were not trying to arrange family reunions. They
were debunking racism by showing their children that black families and white
families were more closely connected by ancestry than racists liked to admit.
White families, by contrast, were terrified by blackness in the family tree.
Relationships that could not simply be ignored were deliberately buried. The
cover-up hatched 200 years ago by Thomas Jefferson's family was blown away a
few years back after genetic evidence showed that Jefferson almost certainly
fathered Sally Hemings's final son, Eston, born in 1808. This led historians to
conclude that Jefferson fathered all of her children in a relationship that
lasted more than 35 years.
The big lesson for historians in the Hemings-Jefferson case was that the oral
histories passed down by slaves and their descendants were more reliable than
the official written record. This put historians on notice that they should
give the oral tradition more credence, especially when working on issues of
interracial intimacy.
The point was underscored dramatically when the family of Strom Thurmond, the
former United States senator, dropped decades of denials and acknowledged that
Mr. Thurmond, who died last summer at the age of 100, had fathered a daughter
with a black maid in the family household in 1925. The daughter, a retired
teacher named Essie Mae Washington-Williams, 78, had periodically denied Mr.
Thurmond's paternity for the public record but had passed on the truth to her
children, who pressured her to come forward after Mr. Thurmond's death last
June.
Like most stories of its kind, this one would have died out long ago had it not
been carried for nearly a century on the tongues of black South Carolinians,
who recognized the story of Strom Thurmond and Essie Mae Washington-Williams's
mother as a universal story of black families across the state.
It was not, however, the official story. The biographer Nadine Cohodas
dismissed it as a "legend in the black community" a decade ago in her book
"Strom Thurmond and the Politics of Southern Change." Another writer of the
South described it as apparently without foundation a phrase that is used all
the time to dismiss the black oral tradition as apocryphal.
In the 1998 biography, "Ol' Strom," however, a journalism professor, Jack Bass,
and a Washington Post reporter, Marilyn Thompson, went back to the oral stories
of black South Carolinians, some of whom knew the household, as well as the
accounts of a black elevator operator who recalled seeing a light-skinned black
woman riding the elevator to visit Mr. Thurmond when he was governor.
How could Mr. Thurmond, who sought the presidency on a segregationist platform
in 1948, have lived publicly as a racist while secretly helping to support a
black daughter? This was a common practice in the South, where slaveholders and
their descendants produced mulatto children. While some white fathers treated
their mixed-race children like dirt, others supported and educated them. They
refused to acknowledge them to keep the nonexistent barrier between the races
firmly intact.
Like the Jefferson story, this one seems more sensational because of who Strom
Thurmond was. In truth, it is the story of the entire American South and the
great secret of race that until just recently dared not speak its name.
Copyright 2003 The New York Times Company
>From: rich...@aol.com (RichaLlo3)
>I've said it for years and wish I had the money to reseach it. There were
>lots,
>lots of romantic relationships between black and whites from the time this
>great country was invaded by European whites. It is the most hidden history
>in
>the US.
>For the most part, blacks are not blacks but a mix of black and white blood.
>The end results were denial (a form of abuse) but initiated in mutual respect
>and consensual.