Terra Nova scents
lap...@my-deja.com
In the recent post about fragrances and which ones get you the most
comments, Terra Nova "Rain" was mentioned a lot. I once smelled
another Terra Nova fragrence, it wasn't rain, but it smelled
wonderful. where do you find this line? TIA.
Linda
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
EXC JO ANN
>In the recent post about fragrances and which ones get you the most
>comments, Terra Nova "Rain" was mentioned a lot. I once smelled
>another Terra Nova fragrence, it wasn't rain, but it smelled
>wonderful. where do you find this line? TIA.
>Linda
The Terra Nova line has had some changes
over the last 10 years. Currently available
is Rain - WaterPetals - Oceana - Cloud Nine - Pikake and Plumeria in full
lines.
Perfume Essence available in China Rain,
China Lily and China Musk and Patchouli.
A new line will be available this month -
Sakura and Green Tea in a full line. Also
new this month - To Go Travel Sets in Rain
and Plumeria.
Jo Ann @ Exclusively Jo Ann
http://www.exclusivelyjoann.com/
JennP
of Terra Nova products is the price point. A very enjoyable product for
a very reasonable price.
JennP.
Lynn
Tea and Patchouli??? I feel a lemming attack coming on...
Lynn
Ellen Brickman
Ellen--
That moisturizer I bought is really incredible. This one looks like it
might be even better! Where's my credit card?! - Paraphrase of Bliss Tab
EXC JO ANN <excj...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20000828123349...@ng-fu1.aol.com...
Electra601
The Japanese restaruant where I ate dinner Saturday night :).
Every time I read that Terra Nova is introducing a fragrance called Sakura, it
makes me laugh...all I can imagine it being is teriyaki or sushi-scented!
Amy
Stellaglo
>
hey!! i was there!!
seriously, this one horse town actually does have a swell sushi
restaurant...also called...sakura.
"we really have to be careful who we sell this stuff to!!" my daughter, mocking
fred segal's sales policies.
Electra601
>>The Japanese restaruant where I ate dinner Saturday night :).
>>
>
>hey!! i was there!!
Lol...if I'd known you were there, I would have introduced myself! I've never
met another AF'er IRL before...
>seriously, this one horse town actually does have a swell sushi
>restaurant...also called...sakura.
I wonder if it's the same chain? My friends said that the sushi was quite
good. I'm not a raw fish person, so I ended up eating sesame chicken :).
Amy
EXC JO ANN
now it is Terra Nova.
EXC JO ANN
this email first thing this morning from the
anti-Terra Nova; anti-Pola regiment. Please
note the carbon copy list:
Subj: Re: Terra Nova scents
Date: 8/29/00 9:35:25 AM Eastern Daylight Time
From: maryjosep...@austin.rr.com (Mary Joseph McCarthy)
To: excj...@aol.com (EXC JO ANN)
CC: phe...@mindspring.com (Kim Hardin), mk...@austin.rr.com (Marlene
Eskin), stel...@aol.com (Linda Stanley), mind...@aol.com (Mindy),
ha...@mediaone.net (Stephanie), f...@whosthefairest.com (fig),
janet...@my-deja.com (makeup grrl), cz...@21stcentury.net (Chunae Zoh)
Leeenda, below is the portion of the thread that Joassa reacted to.
Extreme, well I guess!
MJM
============================
From: Electra601
Topic: Re: Terra Nova scents
Message: 6 of 9 (In response to Ellen Brickman)
Sent: 29 Aug 2000 01:22:19 GMT
See Also: Fashion
What is Sakura???
The Japanese restaruant where I ate dinner Saturday night :).
Every time I read that Terra Nova is introducing a fragrance called Sakura,
it makes me laugh...all I can imagine it being is teriyaki or sushi-scented!
Amy
Reply to this message
------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Stellaglo
Topic: Re: Terra Nova scents
Message: 7 of 9 (In response to Electra601)
Sent: 29 Aug 2000 02:15:44 GMT
See Also: Fashion
The Japanese restaruant where I ate dinner Saturday night :).
hey!! i was there!! seriously, this one horse town actually does have a
swell sushi restaurant...also called...sakura.
"we really have to be careful who we sell this stuff to!!" my daughter,
mocking fred segal's sales policies.
Reply to this message
------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Electra601
Topic: Re: Terra Nova scents
Message: 8 of 9 (In response to Stellaglo)
Sent: 29 Aug 2000 02:40:58 GMT
See Also: Fashion
Amy
Reply to this message
------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: EXC JO ANN
Topic: Re: Terra Nova scents
Message: 9 of 9 (In response to Electra601)
Sent: 29 Aug 2000 04:24:59 GMT
See Also: Fashion
Stellaglo
>anti-Terra Nova; anti-Pola regiment.
it's not so much a regiment as a regime. and there's nothing anti pola or anti
terra nova about it.
nice of you to post it, though!!
Marlene Eskin
emails? And you're posting on a Miss Manners thread too? That's funny.
Please tell me what is <snip> anti-Terra Nova; anti-Pola <snip> here? Seems
the dialog is about a restaurant named Sakura -- which is a Japanese shrine,
among other things. Just because Terra Nova named a fragrance after a shrine,
doesn't mean any mention of the word Sakura is at all about you.
EXC JO ANN wrote:
> Well I was pleasantly surprised to receive
> this email first thing this morning from the
> "we really have to be careful who we sell this stuff to!!" my daughter,
> mocking fred segal's sales policies.
>
Mary Joseph McCarthy
So, you received private e-mail. It was a mistake. But, mistake or not, you
broke all rules of netiquette by posting it publicly. Somehow, you continue to
create self-destructive situations.
What was written was not anti-Pola or anti-Terra Nova or anti- anything
rational.
I retract that. It was anti-little old ladies who see aliens and enemies
hiding in the stock room and buried in every post.
Jo Ann, it is not all about you, but some of it is all about your recent
behavior.
Mary Joseph McCarthy,
"Growiong older is a serious business, but wearing a big smile and being able
to laugh at myself certainly helps in a topsy-turvy world where they may be out
to get me. Not." Ibid.
==================================================
DNYCE15
>
>So, you received private e-mail. It was a mistake.
Mistake? Well, it seems like you and the rest of your CC list make that
"mistake" whenever someone dares to disagree with you. I do believe 2 other
AFers have received CC list emails in their inboxes as well. I received several
emails from this CC list as well back in March. As a matter of fact, this
person (who is on the same CC list that Jo Ann received) sent my private email
to the rest of those on that CC list WITHOUT my permission.
> But, mistake or not, you
>broke all rules of netiquette by posting it publicly. Somehow, you continue
>to
>create self-destructive situations.
>
And you constantly break rules of netiquette everyday with your harassing and
flaming AFers on a consistant basis. Save your self-righteous blabber for
someone who really cares.
>What was written was not anti-Pola or anti-Terra Nova or anti- anything
>rational.
But you and the majority of those on that CC list do bash Jo Ann, her business,
and anyone who posts a rave for her business for no valid reason.
Electra601
Okay, that section of the thread included two posts of mine, and quite
frankly...I don't get it. What is all of this uproar about?
If I've managed to offend someone because I stated the fact that there is a
Japanese restaurant in my town named Sakura, where I happened to eat dinner on
Saturday night, whoever is offended needs to get a grip. Although I'm still
not sure why they're offended in the first place.
Amy
Marlene Eskin
DNYCE15 wrote:
> >Jo Ann: Have completely lost it. You are acting more and more bizarre.
> >
> >So, you received private e-mail. It was a mistake.
>
> Mistake? Well, it seems like you and the rest of your CC list make that
> "mistake" whenever someone dares to disagree with you.
Get real. There was no disagreement. Someone wanted to see the entire thread
about the restaurant. It was emailed to them. Jo Ann was a recipient. Then she
decided that the email was anti-her. Just a LITTLE paranoia. Sorry to see it's
contagious, cause you sure caught it.
> I do believe 2 other
> AFers have received CC list emails in their inboxes as well.
Could be. So what? Lots of people get cc'd on email from me, MJM and I'll bet,
even from you.
> I received several
> emails from this CC list as well back in March.
True. I'm one of those who emailed you. I was responding to your posts and
emails, but you blocked my email AND called it harassment. <sigh> Is this about
having the last word -- or maybe the only word? Is that why you block people you
know will disagree with you? Must be a very long list.
> As a matter of fact, this
> person (who is on the same CC list that Jo Ann received) sent my private email
> to the rest of those on that CC list WITHOUT my permission.
Could've been me. I don't remember. But once you have emailed someone, that
email belongs to them and they can do with it as they please -- EXCEPT post it,
because the netiquette rules are very firm about that.
>
>
> > But, mistake or not, you
> >broke all rules of netiquette by posting it publicly. Somehow, you continue
> >to
> >create self-destructive situations.
> >
>
> And you constantly break rules of netiquette everyday with your harassing and
> flaming AFers on a consistant basis. Save your self-righteous blabber for
> someone who really cares.
So who's flaming now? Talk about self-righteous. Talk about blabber. Talk about
deep, deep, vitriolic anger. (Seems you must really care or you wouldn't bother
with your post.)
>
>
> >What was written was not anti-Pola or anti-Terra Nova or anti- anything
> >rational.
>
> But you and the majority of those on that CC list do bash Jo Ann, her business,
> and anyone who posts a rave for her business for no valid reason.
No different than you and some others regarding Fig and WTF. But that isn't the
point. The point is that particular thread was NOT anti-Jo Ann. It was about a
restaurant named Sakura. But you and JoAnn are determined to turn it into
something ugly. Then of course, you'll blame the ugliness on someone else.
--
Marlene Eskin
RandeeFW
>this email first thing this morning from the
>anti-Terra Nova; anti-Pola regiment. Please
>note the carbon copy list:
>
>
Harumph, MJM. I am highly insulted I wasn't on your cc list. I wanna be part
of the "regiment" (sic) too!! Do we get cool uniforms?
DNYCE15
responded as if I was talking to you. Hmm...
>Could be. So what? Lots of people get cc'd on email from me, MJM and I'll
>bet,
>even from you.
But what's so interesting about that the CC list is that the majority of those
on that list are the folks who love to Jo Ann bash on alt.fashion.
>True. I'm one of those who emailed you. I was responding to your posts and
>emails, but you blocked my email AND called it harassment. <sigh>
Actually, the email I'm referring to was not originated by you, but by another
person on that list. I said MARCH. I never emailed you in March. But yes, I did
indeed block you because you were being rude and insulting just because I asked
you a question about your business. As a matter of fact, alot of AFers
questioned you about your business and you responded with the same rudeness and
insults.
>Is this about
>having the last word -- or maybe the only word? Is that why you block people
>you
>know will disagree with you? Must be a very long list.
Nah...I block people who fill my email inbox with threats, foul language,
and.or insults. People like those featured on that list. People like you.
>So who's flaming now? Talk about self-righteous. Talk about blabber. Talk
>about
>deep, deep, vitriolic anger. (Seems you must really care or you wouldn't
>bother
>with your post.)
I don't care about trolls, like MJM, who constantly talk about "netiquette".
But what I do care about is when the namecalling turns into cyberstalking,
harassing offline, and trying to negatively affect a person's livelihood. That
is crossing the line, and the majority of the people on that list have crossed
that line and it needs to stop.
>No different than you and some others regarding Fig and WTF.
Here we go again....I didn't mention the above individual or her site, yet you
felt the need to. Interesting...Furthermore, I've never bashed her or her site.
Even when I posted a rave in regards to Jo Ann's excellent customer service, I
didn't put Fig down. As a matter of fact, when people give Jo Ann and her
business kudos, they don't bash Fig.
>But you and JoAnn are determined to turn it into
>something ugly.
No, I'm just telling it like it is.The CC list always appears whenever those on
AF either disagree with one of its members or asks why someone is bashing Jo
Ann. It's used to attempt to intimidate people, but it doesn't work.
Besides...this whole anti-Jo Ann campaign was ugly and unnecessary a loooong
time ago, way before this thread. That's why someone asked why people were
bashing Jo Ann.
Enough bandwidth has been wasted. Back to fashion......
~D.
"I am the author of the only dictionary that defines me...".
Mary Joseph McCarthy
that you are volunteering for action in the *regiment.*
As soon as the regimen has been established by the regime in power, we will
activate the regiment and be at full battalion strength.
Oh, the first meeting of the Uniform Design Committee will be next Saturday
afternoon. We'll be meeting for tea at Sakura's.
Mary Joseph McCarthy,.
"Growing older is a serious business, but it is easy to wear a big smile and have
an optimistic attitude when one is enlisted in the Army of the Lord High
Commissioner. Ain't it a topsy-turvy world." Ibid.
=======================================
Mary Joseph McCarthy
DNYCE15 wrote:
<Snipped to the relevant part>
Oh, how very chi-chi poo-poo of you. You should be proud.
Mary Joseph McCarthy,
"Growing older is a serious business, but it is so easy to wear a big smile and
have an optimistic attitude when others display their ineptitude in this
topsy-turvy world." Ibid.
fig
> Well I was pleasantly surprised to receive
> this email first thing this morning from the
> anti-Terra Nova; anti-Pola regiment. Please
> note the carbon copy list:
>
> Subj: Re: Terra Nova scents
> Date: 8/29/00 9:35:25 AM Eastern Daylight Time
> From: maryjosep...@austin.rr.com (Mary Joseph McCarthy)
> To: excj...@aol.com (EXC JO ANN)
> CC: phe...@mindspring.com (snipped), mk...@austin.rr.com (snipped),
> stel...@aol.com (snipped), mind...@aol.com (Mindy),
> ha...@mediaone.net (snipped), f...@whosthefairest.com (fig),
> janet...@my-deja.com (snipped), cz...@21stcentury.net (Chunae Zoh)
Jo Ann--
Aside from the fact that you recently seem to have forgotten all rules of good
netiquette (publicly posting an email to your "file" that denigrated an af
contributor and now posting a private email with its cc list (including real
names) attached), you have the audacity to consider me part of your so-called
"anti Pola regiment".
You can't have forgotten that I very much respect Pola and its products and
that I'm your downline for crying out loud!
Further, have you ever considered that it isn't Pola or Terra Nova that some
people find distasteful? fig
who's the fairest?
http://www.whosthefairest.com
bob and linda apholz
Linda
Ruddell
rand...@aol.com says...
> Harumph, MJM. I am highly insulted I wasn't on your cc list.
Can't make the troll list, can't make the cc list...sheesh, where does
one fit in?
> I wanna be part
> of the "regiment" (sic) too!! Do we get cool uniforms?
Now there's a great idea! I've ordered shirts from sites, but never
seen an *official* af shirt/top/whatever. Or it wouldn't take much work
to design something that could be printed on a transfer to suit whatever
one wanted it on...
Any interest in this? Of course if I've missed it somewhere, please
send me the url.
Dennis
--
WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Pricey cashmere sweaters from Italy and Britain
soon could cost U.S. consumers twice as much because of a long-running
trade dispute over bananas.
RandeeFW
>people find distasteful? fig
>
>
WOO! You go girl!!!
Ruddell
maryjosep...@austin.rr.com says...
>
>
> DNYCE15 wrote:
>
>
> <Snipped to the relevant part>
>
>
> Oh, how very chi-chi poo-poo of you. You should be proud.
Finally a sig that will shine above the rest ;-)
Dennis
--
Oh, how very chi-chi poo-poo of you.
Mary Joseph McCarthy
Ruddell
rand...@aol.com says...
> >Further, have you ever considered that it isn't Pola or Terra Nova that some
> >people find distasteful? fig
> >
> >
>
>
> WOO! You go girl!!!
>
Yeah...the distasteful part. Hmmmm, it's not us as we didn't make the
troll list, and it's not fig, and it's not Jo Ann...who's left? ;-)
Stellaglo
>troll list,
sure you did, you just don't know it.
Linda
>Further, have you ever considered that it isn't Pola or Terra Nova that some
>people find distasteful?
Then what is it? And who are the people who find it, whatever it is,
distasteful?
Linda
Ruddell
stel...@aol.com says...
> sure you did, you just don't know it.
Do you mean I'm listed on a secret af troll list? Well, that makes me
real special ;-)
fig
> If I've managed to offend someone because I stated the fact that there is a
> Japanese restaurant in my town named Sakura, where I happened to eat dinner on
> Saturday night, whoever is offended needs to get a grip. Although I'm still
> not sure why they're offended in the first place.
>
> Amy
You poor thing, Amy! You got caught in the crossfire. fig
--
marlen...@my-deja.com
dny...@aol.comnojunk (DNYCE15) wrote:
ut that the CC list is that the majority of those
> ... But yes, I did indeed block you because you were being rude and insulting just because I asked
> you a question about your business.
True Donna, you DID ask me about my business and my answer was:
To: DNY...@aol.com
From: Marlene Eskin <mk...@austin.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Question About Your Business From A Concerned A.F. Poster
Hi Donna,
I appreciate your email, and will answer your questions as best I
can. I'll begin with your comment, "I am very concerned that someone
could be possibly using my opinions/ideas for their own personal gain."
First - any posts to USENET are non-copyrightable. They are
*voluntary* contributions to the public domain of knowledge - hence
your comments have been posted in the public domain.
Second - most, if not all, ISP member agreements are structured so
that you relinquish “ownership” of your words to that ISP in certain
instances, including message boards and forums. Check your AOL FAQs, and
you’ll see this applies to your membership. AOL owns your words and is free
to use them for its profit.
You are correct that certain people are "upset with you because you
have created links to their posts without their permission and without
giving them credit, and that you are using a.f. posts for your commercial
site." My response is:
1. The original uproar was in October, when I was crediting the quote
to the quoter's name. The complaint at that time was that their
privacy was being invaded. Since these posts were in a public
forum, privacy was not a substantial issue - nonetheless, I stopped
attributing names to the quotes.
2. Then came an onslaught that words were being used, but the author
was not being acknowledged.
3. So, I started the direct links to threads via Deja.com. The
complaints continue.
4. The fact is, certain members of this group will not be pleased with
anything I do. It is important to me that I continue conducting my site
in a legal, ethical and fair manner. If you wish to prevent your posts
from being accessed through Deja.com, please use the "no archive"
command. Those who choose to be archived, however, can lean back and
enjoy being read by hundreds more people.
5. Back to posting in a public site. Deja.com is shaping their site to
be a place where all internet users can find out what others think about
various topics, products, news, etc. A large part of that is done by
archiving USENET posts. USENET posts are public domain -- the author of
the post is voluntarily contributing information for public consumption.
Permission has been granted to me by Deja.com to link directly to
threads on its website; in fact, this is a practice Deja.com encourages
through its "Linkback Program."
6. Beau-t.com/CosmeticIndustry.com is not a commercial site. There is
not a single, solitary item for sale on it. There is not a paid banner
or a paid ad to be found. It is nothing more than a very extensive,
albeit well kept, library of links.
8. CosmeticMarket.com IS a commercial site. It also is a separate
domain. There are no alt.fashion quotes or links on CosmeticMarket.com.
Regarding your questions about CosmeticMarket.com, the words you cut
and pasted do appear on that site. Providing easy access to public
information on specific topics is a part of the way I make my living. What I
"sell" is my knowledge, my expertise and my judgement. The internet
is a fact of life in the marketing, merchandising and promotion of
products, and it is a piece of my knowledge which I choose to share with my
clients. It is legal and ethical.
On re-reading the statement about email addresses, I see your point
and that has been modified. Thank you for calling my attention to it.
Marlene
> As a matter of fact, alot of AFers questioned you about your business and you responded with the same rudeness
> and insults.
Hmmm. "...the same rudeness and insults"? Which rudeness and insults?
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
Mary Joseph McCarthy
Ruddell, Ruddell, Ruddell, please give credit where credit is due. The
sig line for which you give me credit really is only partially mine.
The portion of the line that so impresses you is authored by no other
than the compiler of the empty tome that defines her.
Your compatriot and colleague in arms, DNYCE 15, she of the impeccable
manners and precise command of her own unique language is the author of
"chi-chi poo-poo." Lord forbid that I should lay claim to those
immemorable words full of sound and fury and signifying nothing. Now,
who said that.
The way you are going Ruddell, you'll never make the cut.
Mary Joseph McCarthy,
"Growing older is a serious business, but it is so easy to wear a big
smile and greet the world with an optimistic attitude, when one
observes a confederacy of dunces tripping the light fantastic in this
topsy-turvy world. Doesn't it make you feel so chi-chi poo-poo?" Ibid
* Sent from Novell Discussion Forums http://novell.remarq.com The Internet's Discussion Network *
The fastest and easiest way to search and participate in Usenet - Free!
ahmward
in the different Terra Nova scents there is no reason why you should
not ask about them. Not everyone has taken sides for or against
specific people who post here. You will consistently see a handful of
names on each side of this issue and it shouldn't concern all the
others who are just interested in finding out about products be in
Pola, Terra Nova or anything else.
audrey
rob....@worldnet.att.net
Ruddell
Mary Joseph McCarthy wrote:
> Ruddell, Ruddell, Ruddell, please give credit where credit is due. The
> sig line for which you give me credit really is only partially mine.
Partially?
> The portion of the line that so impresses you is authored by no other
> than the compiler of the empty tome that defines her.
And you're telling me to give credit where credit is due?
> Your compatriot and colleague in arms,
My what?
> DNYCE 15, she of the impeccable
> manners and precise command of her own unique language is the author of
> "chi-chi poo-poo."
But you do it so well... Reminds me of when Streetheart did 'Under My Thumb'
> Lord forbid that I should lay claim to those
> immemorable words full of sound and fury and signifying nothing. Now,
> who said that.
Must be someone whom impressed you all to heck...
> The way you are going Ruddell, you'll never make the cut.
You've gotta admit, I'm going at it in a nice way ;-D
Dennis
Mary Joseph McCarthy
Ruddell wrote:
> Yeah...the distasteful part. Hmmmm, it's not us as we didn't make the
> troll list, and it's not fig, and it's not Jo Ann...who's left? ;-)
>
> Dennis
> ===============================
Who's left????
Why you are Ruddell.
Next question or is it time for a spin job.
Mary Joseph McCarthy,
"Growing older is a serious business, but it is easy to wear a big smile and
have an optimistic attitude when you watch all the chicks coming home to
roost in this topsy-turvy world. Ain't life wonderful?" Ibid.
Ruddell
ahmward wrote:
>
> Don't be intimidated by others in this group. If you are interested
> in the different Terra Nova scents there is no reason why you should
> not ask about them. Not everyone has taken sides for or against
> specific people who post here. You will consistently see a handful of
> names on each side of this issue and it shouldn't concern all the
> others who are just interested in finding out about products be in
> Pola, Terra Nova or anything else.
Well done...
Dennis
Ruddell
Mary Joseph McCarthy wrote:
> Who's left????
>
> Why you are Ruddell.
>
> Next question or is it time for a spin job.
But you just said I'll never make the cut?
Dennis
Ripley7173
>From: bob and linda apholz blap...@gte.net
>Date: 8/29/00 3:13 PM Central Daylight Time
>Message-id: <39AC196D...@gte.net>
>
>I will SO never ask about Terra Nova again! : )
>Linda
All the bullshit aside, Terra Nova is a divine line of scents that must have
been manufactured for the goddesses on Olympus. Rain in particular. I ALWAYS go
back to Rain, no matter what else I may stray to. It looks like it may be the
first bottle of perfume I ever finish! I highly recommend trying it. Terra Nova
is based in Berkley I believe, or www.exclusivelyjoann.com carries it, and best
of all it's not expensive at all.
(note, I am a firm supporter of Joann AND Fig, they both have great sites with
fabulous stuff. Anyone wants to flame me? Save it for somebody who cares.)
Dove Studio, stop in and take a look!
http://users.lanminds.com/%7Ejandove/index.html
Mary Joseph McCarthy
<rud...@unibase.com> wrote:
> But you just said I'll never make the cut?
>
> Dennis
===================================================
Correct, Ruddell. I did say you would never make the cut.
You're left. Buh-bye.
Mary Joseph McCarthy,
"Growing older is a serious business, but a big smile, an optimistic
attitude and patience in dealing with those of the chi-chi poo-poo
persuasion certainly helps in this topsy-turvy world." Ibid.
JennP
valid question to which I think I posted a reply before it got ugly.
Remember, contrary to the way it may seem (since these flame threads
last so long) the vast majority of us don't care about the nonsense.
Every Terra Nova product I've sampled has been wonderful and again, the
pricepoint makes it even more attractive.
JennP.
Candy Cane
Dnyce15 hop into this argument thinking you know it all. Since Deja now only
archives Usenet posts from the last year, none of us can look back to find
the true beginnings of these arguments. If we could just look back, we
could see this started before fig ever sold a bit of Pola. Oh yes. Fig
started Who's the Fairest in 1999. This goes way back to the days of threads
like, "I'm Sick of alt.fashion.Joann." (Or something to that effect.) That
would be 1997, btw. We could even go back to 1996 when Joann regularly
posted about "this great skincare she has used for X years now." In the
beginning, she didn't mention Pola by name. No, she'd refer to it as the
wonderful line she discovered. Of course, some of us emailed her wondering
what this fabulous line of products was. Why it was Pola! And she just
happened to sell it! (And gave directions to her site.) Yes, Innocent Joann.
The one who never started any of this.
After that, the raves started. The constant Pola discussions started. In the
beginning, many people were interested and just participated in discussion.
When others would point out other places to get Pola, (I believe C.Lin was
one, but don't quote me.) Joann would pipe up with her line about them not
being properly trained and such. That was often the response when someone
said you could buy Pola in many Asian beauty stores. Yes, Innocent Joann.
I know why some of these people post their disgust. They've been listening
to this for 4 years and are sick of it. I can even understand how Figaro
feels. IIRC, she was one of the original ravers. What I never get is someone
like yourself or Dnyce jumping in without asking a few questions first. This
isn't about Pola, it's about Joann and the shit she pulled in the past. And
as much as some people don't want to believe it, this has nothing to do with
fig. Sorry, but this went down long before fig sold Pola. I don't even think
she was a regular poster back in those days. Nope, it really isn't a
conspiracy. All this is the result of what Joann did many years ago.
If you wanna keep shopping with Joann, go ahead. Shop anywhere you like.
There aren't many people who give a damn where you shop. But, don't jump
into a long standing fight to defend her without knowing what you are
talking about. I will admit Dnyce 15 is far worse than you. She certainly
doesn't know what she's talking about. Still, neither of you look very
convincing when you are so misinformed.
"Ruddell" <rud...@unibase.comREMOVE> wrote in message
news:MPG.1415dec68...@news.sk.sympatico.ca...
> Yeah...the distasteful part. Hmmmm, it's not us as we didn't make the
> troll list, and it's not fig, and it's not Jo Ann...who's left? ;-)
>
> Dennis
>
> --
Charlie Perrin
On 30 Aug 2000 00:37:33 GMT, jjjj...@aol.com (Jjjjjulie) wrote:
>AOL does not own USENET.
Well, first of all, they'd have to buy it from Al Gore (the inventor
of the Internet). <grin/duck>
---
Your mouse has moved. Windows must be restarted for
the change to take effect. Reboot now? [OK]
Jjjjjulie
>From: marlen...@my-deja.com
>Message-ID: <8ohcrh$d68$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>
>NNTP-Posting-Host: 24.27.20.8
[...]
> First - any posts to USENET are non-copyrightable. They are
>*voluntary* contributions to the public domain of knowledge - hence
>your comments have been posted in the public domain.
First, this is not true. From http://www.templetons.com/brad/copymyths.html:
-----
3) "If it's posted to Usenet it's in the public domain."
False. Nothing modern is in the public domain anymore
unless the owner explicitly puts it in the public domain(*). Explicitly, as in
you have a note from the author/owner saying, "I grant this to the public
domain." Those exact words or words very much like them.
-----------
There's more about this on that website, and the issue is not completely black
and white, but merely posting to USENET does not mean you instantly relinquish
the ownership of your own words.
> Second - most, if not all, ISP member agreements are structured so
>that you relinquish “ownership” of your words to that ISP in certain
>instances, including message boards and forums. Check your AOL FAQs, and
>you’ll see this applies to your membership. AOL owns your words and is
free
>to use them for its profit.
Second, you are wrong. The AOL member agreement says:
--------
Bear in mind that some areas of AOL are "public," like message boards, forums,
or the Member Directory, and other members will have access to your posted
material and might copy, modify or distribute it. By submitting or posting
content there, you are representing that you are the owner of such material or
have authorization to distribute it. Once you post content on AOL, you
expressly grant AOL the complete right to use, reproduce, modify, distribute,
etc. the content in any form, anywhere.
------
Please note the section "Once you post content _on AOL_" [emphasis added]. AOL
does not own USENET. (Nor does Deja.com, since you seem to have some confusion
about that still.) AOL's ownership of my words only extends to material that I
add _within_ AOL. Just as Deja.com owns my words ONLY if under certain
circumstances (such as if I post to one of their "forums").
> various topics, products, news, etc. A large part of that is
done by
> archiving USENET posts. USENET posts are public domain -- the
author of
> the post is voluntarily contributing information for public
consumption.
Please see http://www.templetons.com/brad/copymyths.html.
I know this is a waste of my time to even try to explain these obvious points,
so I'll quit.
--
Julie P., the alt.fashion curmudgeon
"She was a shiver looking for a spine"--Tim Finn
http://hometown.aol.com/jjjjjulie/myhomepage/index.html
Jjjjjulie
>From: Marlene Eskin <mk...@austin.rr.com>
[...]
> once you have emailed someone, that
email belongs to them
>and they can do with it as they please -- EXCEPT post it,
>because the netiquette rules are very firm about that.
Sorry, but you don't own their words. They still own them. That is why you
cannot post them to a public place. That is why you are not free to forward
them onto other people willy-nilly. That is why when you read the "collected
letters" of Mr. or Ms. X, you will find that often the return letters are
missing. This is because the people who wrote them, or their estates, have
not given permission for those words to be published.
I know you so desperately want to believe otherwise Marlene, and I sincerely
hope you get through the Looking Glass soon.
Kris in Philly
>>:
Umm, I hate to stray from the topic of this thread but what is Sakura
besides a place to eat? And what does it smell like?
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Kris in Philly
"The ability to quote is a serviceable substitute for wit."
- W. Somerset Maugham
Kim
Usenet Netiquette no-no's by not *only* posting a private email but in
doing so you have given out posters real names. Why not just go
ahead and post my address and phone number too? What a pathetic old
fool you are-do you suffer from geriatric dementia? God help you. As
horrible as some think I am, even *I've* never stooped that low.
So, hello alt.fashion-my name is Kim Hardin. Related by marriage to
western bad-boy John Wesley Hardin and the man who invented the
seedless watermelon! My maiden name is Smith, btw. Just in case you
were wondering.
On 29 Aug 2000 15:50:07 GMT, excj...@aol.com (EXC JO ANN) wrote:
>Well I was pleasantly surprised to receive
>this email first thing this morning from the
>anti-Terra Nova; anti-Pola regiment. Please
>note the carbon copy list:
>
>Subj: Re: Terra Nova scents
>Date: 8/29/00 9:35:25 AM Eastern Daylight Time
>From: maryjosep...@austin.rr.com (Mary Joseph McCarthy)
>To: excj...@aol.com (EXC JO ANN)
>CC: phe...@mindspring.com (Kim Hardin), mk...@austin.rr.com (Marlene
>Eskin), stel...@aol.com (Linda Stanley), mind...@aol.com (Mindy),
>ha...@mediaone.net (Stephanie), f...@whosthefairest.com (fig),
>janet...@my-deja.com (makeup grrl), cz...@21stcentury.net (Chunae Zoh)
>
>Leeenda, below is the portion of the thread that Joassa reacted to.
>Extreme, well I guess!
>
>MJM
>============================
>
>From: Electra601
>Topic: Re: Terra Nova scents
>Message: 6 of 9 (In response to Ellen Brickman)
>Sent: 29 Aug 2000 01:22:19 GMT
>See Also: Fashion
>What is Sakura???
>
>
>The Japanese restaruant where I ate dinner Saturday night :).
>
>Every time I read that Terra Nova is introducing a fragrance called Sakura,
>it makes me laugh...all I can imagine it being is teriyaki or sushi-scented!
>
>Amy
>
>Reply to this message
>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>From: Stellaglo
>Topic: Re: Terra Nova scents
>Message: 7 of 9 (In response to Electra601)
>Sent: 29 Aug 2000 02:15:44 GMT
>See Also: Fashion
>The Japanese restaruant where I ate dinner Saturday night :).
>
>hey!! i was there!! seriously, this one horse town actually does have a
>swell sushi restaurant...also called...sakura.
>
>"we really have to be careful who we sell this stuff to!!" my daughter,
>mocking fred segal's sales policies.
>
>Reply to this message
>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>From: Electra601
>Topic: Re: Terra Nova scents
>Message: 8 of 9 (In response to Stellaglo)
>Sent: 29 Aug 2000 02:40:58 GMT
>See Also: Fashion
>Stellaglo wrote:
>The Japanese restaruant where I ate dinner Saturday night :).
>hey!! i was there!!
>
>
>Lol...if I'd known you were there, I would have introduced myself! I've
>never met another AF'er IRL before...
>
>seriously, this one horse town actually does have a swell sushi
>restaurant...also called...sakura.
>
>
>I wonder if it's the same chain? My friends said that the sushi was quite
>good. I'm not a raw fish person, so I ended up eating sesame chicken :).
>
>Amy
>
>Reply to this message
>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>From: EXC JO ANN
>Topic: Re: Terra Nova scents
>Message: 9 of 9 (In response to Electra601)
>Sent: 29 Aug 2000 04:24:59 GMT
>See Also: Fashion
>deja vue all over again - shades of Pola -
>now it is Terra Nova.
>Jo Ann @ Exclusively Jo Ann
>http://www.exclusivelyjoann.com/
>
>Jo Ann @ Exclusively Jo Ann
>http://www.exclusivelyjoann.com/
WiggliGirl
boutiques - at least here in Los Angeles it is. I've seen it at Larchmont
Beauty Supply, Beverly Hills Beauty Supply and The Soap Plant, to name a few.
wiggli
Ruddell
Candy Cane wrote:
>
> You know, Denny,
Me friends call me Denny, thank you...
> the thing that baffles me most is why people like you and
> Dnyce15 hop into this argument thinking you know it all.
Well, everyone is allowed input to a ng...
<snipo>
> If you wanna keep shopping with Joann, go ahead. Shop anywhere you like.
That's what I'll do, and if I order from fig or anyone else, guess
that's also my option.
> There aren't many people who give a damn where you shop.
Nor I where you do...
> But, don't jump
> into a long standing fight to defend her without knowing what you are
> talking about.
I don't know what I'm talking about? If you don't like my posts, then
filter them...
> I will admit Dnyce 15 is far worse than you.
I don't have contact personally with Dnyce15 if that's what you're
suggesting, but it's just a bloody ng and everyone is entitled to their
input.
> She certainly
> doesn't know what she's talking about. Still, neither of you look very
> convincing when you are so misinformed.
So inform us all so we can meet at your level...
Dennis
fig
>
> >>:>What is Sakura???
> >>:
>
> Umm, I hate to stray from the topic of this thread but what is Sakura
> besides a place to eat? And what does it smell like?
cherry blossom.
(Incidentally, Pola makes a line of scented products called Sakura
Garden. I can't describe any of it because I've only seen it on a
Japanese site!) fig
Mary Joseph McCarthy
=================================
Terra Nova is also available on-line at the following sites:
http://www.ebubbles.com
http://www.halcyonday.com
http://www.therootcellar.com
http://www.ebound.com
http://www.uncommonscents.com
I'm sure that there are other on-line sites where Terra Nova can be found, but
the above URLs are the result of a five minute search.
Mary Joseph McCarthy,
"Growing older is a serious business, but a big smile and a positive attitude
are easy,when you are providing information others are seeking, in this
topsy-turvy Terra Nova world." Ibid.
Jjjjjulie
>Message-ID: <39ABE19F...@austin.rr.com>
>From: Marlene Eskin
>Naughty, naughty Jo Ann. What's that etiquette rule about not posting
>private
>emails? And you're posting on a Miss Manners thread too? That's funny.
No, what's funny is your lecturing anyone on this topic since you deliberately
posted a private email I sent to you to this very newsgroup. Glass houses,
stones, etc.
MakeupGrrl
>Sorry, but you don't own their words. They still own them. That is why you
>cannot post them to a public place. That is why you are not free to forward
>them onto other people willy-nilly. That is why when you read the "collected
>letters" of Mr. or Ms. X, you will find that often the return letters are
>missing. This is because the people who wrote them, or their estates, have
>not given permission for those words to be published.
Argh, I can't believe I'm getting myself into this, buuuuuuut...what
about those FWD:FWD:FWD:FWD:FWD:FWD mails that you, me, and the guy in
the next cubicle get all the time from friends/co-workers? Usually
they're stories, jokes, polls, lists, whatever... nary an author in
sight... is this technically illegal? And I'm not being facetious, I
actually don't know.
I do know that my newreader has a "forward post" feature, and that I
forward good makeup posts to my colleague all the time. Is this
illegal as well? What if she forwards it to someone else?
I do know one thing -- that it is a clear and blatant violation of
Netiquette, and just about every NG FAQ around, to post private emails
and real names in a worldwide, public forum.
MG
MakeupGrrl
>Well I was pleasantly surprised to receive
>this email first thing this morning from the
>anti-Terra Nova; anti-Pola regiment. Please
>note the carbon copy list:
Anti-wha? I'm not anti-anything. Though being considered part of a
"regiment" makes me sound kinda disciplined, not too bad... I have no
idea what Terra Nova is, actually, or what it has to do with Pola. I
thought the whole Pola thing was finally dead, gone, buried.
JoAnn, what's going on? You've gone all Fox Mulder and decided
there's some sort of consipracy against you, and apparently I'm part
of it, though no one ever told me about it.
I won't even START about the major breach of Netiquette you made by
posting a private email... or perhaps I forgot to include that bit in
my paraphrase of the FAQ... must go fix that.
MG
Linda
>Further, have you ever considered that it isn't Pola or Terra Nova that some
>people find distasteful?
Then what is it? And who are the people who find it, whatever it is,
distasteful?
Linda
Linda
RebBrooks
I fully understand venting and saying generalistic things I've said in the past
that enraged people about bikini waxing.. still don't understand it, but oh
well. Each to their own opinion,, right? But it seem people taking the
mentioning of select products personally.
However, no one posting about products are out to blow off steam and IMO offend
others.. they are expressing opinions and in my cases reviewing products much
like every one else.
Why attack another person for an opinion. It's just that and nothing more. We
all have them... and if we can't share them here... then where?
We are a close-knit community that shares and no one should feel ashamed to
post about anything as long as you are not victimizing or picking on
individuals with a mean-spirit. Please don't stop posting because a few flame
you. Lots of others look forward to a variety of input.
RebeccaB.
ha...@mediaone.net
Well I was pleasantly surprised to receive
> this email first thing this morning from the
> anti-Terra Nova; anti-Pola regiment. Please
> note the carbon copy list:
Oh for the love of Mumphrey, am I considered to be "anti-Pola"? So by
purchasing the Vitax Toku-Toku set, the Vitax Essence, a Vitax massage mask, the
old Pola sunblock, 1/F sunblock, a lip pencil & a Salus gel cleanser, I've taken
an anti-Pola stance? Good Lord, what do I have to do to join the ranks of the
pro-Pola regiment? Pola bootcamp? I can see it now...up at dawn for facials,
with the sarge bouncing quarters off of my freshly-exfoliated face to make sure
I've done it right. Marching through the streets of Akron with Pola-filled
backpacks, everybody chanting, "I want to be a Pola ranger, I want to live a
life of danger..."
Now as far as Terra Nova goes, I have no official stance at this juncture. If
you'd like to send me samples, however, I'd be happy to smell them all & get
back to you.
Kim
a once peaceful newsgroup is single-handedly turned into a cesspool of
product shilling. For those of us who have been here for a long time,
I want you to think back to the pre-JoAnn days. Did we call each
other names? Did we snipe and tear at each other like the packs of
bitches that we act like today? No. The arrival of JoAnne was the
cancer that weakened this newsgroup to what it is now. Now af is a
troll's wet dream where blatent advertising is not only tolerated but
encouraged. So thanks, JA-hope you are happy now. I hope you sell so
much crap that you can use those pension checks you get for kindling
this winter.
Kim
Laura
Good one Charlie, I just about spilled my coffee on the keyboard on
that one.
On Tue, 29 Aug 2000 21:20:46 -0500, Charlie Perrin
<clpe...@prodigy.net> wrote:
>
>On 30 Aug 2000 00:37:33 GMT, jjjj...@aol.com (Jjjjjulie) wrote:
>
>>AOL does not own USENET.
>
>Well, first of all, they'd have to buy it from Al Gore (the inventor
>of the Internet). <grin/duck>
>
>---
>Your mouse has moved. Windows must be restarted for
>the change to take effect. Reboot now? [OK]
Laura
To email replace stargates with stargate
lilsweetie
~Lilsweetie
ahmward
flower blossoms along the border. I never knew the meaning of the
name till reading af this week and I celebrated my 27th anniversary on
August 26th.
audrey
rob....@worldnet.att.net
EXC JO ANN
>I think "sakura" is a type of blossom -- plum, I believe.
>
>~Lilsweetie
>
My Terra Nova literature indicates that Sakura is a delicate Japanese Cherry
Blossom.
Linda
>I can't answer for fig, but in my opinion what is distasteful is when
>a once peaceful newsgroup is single-handedly turned into a cesspool of
>product shilling. For those of us who have been here for a long time,
>I want you to think back to the pre-JoAnn days. Did we call each
>other names? Did we snipe and tear at each other like the packs of
>bitches that we act like today? No. The arrival of JoAnne was the
>cancer that weakened this newsgroup to what it is now.
No, it's not Kim, and you know that as well as I do. Jo Ann came in posting
on-topic, informative posts. It was the *reaction* of a small handful of very
vocal individuals, including you, who 'weakened' the group. The only thing it's
accomplished is to add stress to an otherwise nice, peaceful place to relax.
Now af is a
>troll's wet dream where blatent advertising is not only tolerated but
>encouraged.
And does this include Fig? She openly sells on a.f., yet no one makes an issue
of it. Now, why is Jo Ann's 'selling' so distasteful to this small group of
vocals, yet Fig's 'selling' is tolerated by them? What *is* that, Kim?
>So thanks, JA-hope you are happy now. I hope you sell so
>much crap that you can use those pension checks you get for kindling
>this winter.
This comment doesn't deserve a response.
Linda
frayed
Karen
I love A.F
Ruddell <rud...@unibase.comREMOVE> wrote in message >
> One of the nice things about this place is the wide variety of opinions
> that are offered voluntarily...
>
> Dennis
>
> --
Jjjjjulie
>From: janet...@my-deja.com (MakeupGrrl)
>Message-ID: <39ac8e3d....@news.mindspring.com>
>Argh, I can't believe I'm getting myself into this, buuuuuuut...what
>about those FWD:FWD:FWD:FWD:FWD:FWD mails that you, me, and the guy in
>the next cubicle get all the time from friends/co-workers? Usually
>they're stories, jokes, polls, lists, whatever... nary an author in
>sight... is this technically illegal? And I'm not being facetious, I
>actually don't know.
Technically, since you're not the author, yes. But realistically?
>I do know that my newreader has a "forward post" feature, and that I
>forward good makeup posts to my colleague all the time. Is this
>illegal as well? What if she forwards it to someone else?
It's a difference of degree and it revolves around privacy. Reposting or
forwarding something someone writes and sends to a public form is markedly
different than publishing something private that you did not write.
>I do know one thing -- that it is a clear and blatant violation of
>Netiquette, and just about every NG FAQ around, to post private emails
>and real names in a worldwide, public forum.
I agree, having been the victim of your fellow mailing list member Marlene
Eskin doing just that to me.
meoughmix
and just *love* it. Not that that has anything to do with anything :)
In article <8oe2ju$eqt$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>,
lap...@my-deja.com wrote:
> Hi all,
> In the recent post about fragrances and which ones get you the most
> comments, Terra Nova "Rain" was mentioned a lot. I once smelled
> another Terra Nova fragrence, it wasn't rain, but it smelled
> wonderful. where do you find this line? TIA.
> Linda
>
> Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
> Before you buy.
>
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
MakeupGrrl
>I agree, having been the victim of your fellow mailing list member Marlene
>Eskin doing just that to me.
Forgive me if I'm being simplistic here, but what has that to do with
JoAnn doing the same thing? Is it okay just because someone else does
it first? What did I ever do to have my name publicly posted, or the
others on that list? Do you see where I'm going with this?
MG
Ruddell
fig...@aol.comnospam says...
> And does this include Fig? She openly sells on a.f., yet no one makes an issue
> of it. Now, why is Jo Ann's 'selling' so distasteful to this small group of
> vocals, yet Fig's 'selling' is tolerated by them? What *is* that, Kim?
Actually, not just fig & Jo Ann...there's been others as well. Yet
neither seem to be promoting their products (other than using their
site's url for a sig) but answering questions about products. I've
noticed this for a long time and agree with you Linda that Jo Ann seems
to be a target.
What about all the ebay posts, they don't seem to stir up any problems.
Yeah, some are private sales but some definitely are not...remember the
Boycott Chanel thread?
> >So thanks, JA-hope you are happy now. I hope you sell so
> >much crap that you can use those pension checks you get for kindling
> >this winter.
>
> This comment doesn't deserve a response.
It's becoming very clear what's happening here lately, and I suppose that
Kim's intentions are sincere in supporting one side, yet I don't know if
those type of tactics are really worth the effort. As mentioned, we've
made small orders from both and also from a few others just to check the
quality of the service. The competition is so tough out there that I'm
actually amazed that something like this would happen.
Very easy to tarnish one's image and I certainty hope that Kim is posting
independently for fig's sake...
Marlene Eskin
“victim”. You like
to play *the game* too much, the old curmudgeon game.
Now take your home page:
<http://hometown.aol.com/jjjjjulie/myhomepage/index.html>.
I’ve been told it’s a prime example of cyberstalking.
But I’m not complaining, since you’re helping to increase the traffic to my
site.
However, I DO wish you’d work on that page a little - kind of sloppy being so
out of date.
Nonetheless, I owe you a thank you. So, thank you, Jjjjjulie, for all your
good work and the visitors you send me.
--
Marlene Eskin
http://www.CosmeticIndustry.com
Jjjjjulie wrote:
> <snip> I agree, having been the victim of your fellow mailing list member
> Marlene
> Eskin doing just that to me.<snip>
>
Jjjjjulie
>From: janet...@my-deja.com (MakeupGrrl)
>Message-ID: <39adaf58....@news.mindspring.com>
>Forgive me if I'm being simplistic here, but what has that to do with
>JoAnn doing the same thing? Is it okay just because someone else does
>it first? What did I ever do to have my name publicly posted, or the
>others on that list? Do you see where I'm going with this?
What is has to do is that Marlene was one of the first people to jump on JoAnn.
Don't misunderstand me--what JoAnn did was wrong, but Marlene, having done the
same thing, and never even apologizing for it, was living in a glass house when
she posted her scolding.
And it's not OK whether it's done first, second or one millionith, and no one
on that list deserved to have their names revealed in this fashion, and I do
see exactly where you are going with this and I am indeed sorry that the
privacy of a number of people was invaded in this manner.
All this overall brouhaha does is reinforce my belief that there should be
absolutely no selling in the newsgroup for these very reasons and that I
personally will not purchase one thing from anyone who hawks anything here.
Ruddell
jjjj...@aol.com says...
> What is has to do is that Marlene was one of the first people to jump on JoAnn.
> Don't misunderstand me--what JoAnn did was wrong,
Sort of. But if Jo Ann had mentioned that she had evidence to support
such a mailing list, someone would have challenged her anyway to prove
it. So, needless to say I figure she attempted to save some bandwidth,
but of course that never works around here ;-)
> but Marlene, having done the
> same thing, and never even apologizing for it, was living in a glass house when
> she posted her scolding.
You notice it all don't you...
> And it's not OK whether it's done first, second or one millionith, and no one
> on that list deserved to have their names revealed in this fashion, and I do
> see exactly where you are going with this and I am indeed sorry that the
> privacy of a number of people was invaded in this manner.
It would have come out in the wash anyway as once something starts, it
just snowballs (hmmm, winter's coming)...
> All this overall brouhaha does is reinforce my belief that there should be
> absolutely no selling in the newsgroup for these very reasons and that I
> personally will not purchase one thing from anyone who hawks anything here.
That's your choice of course, yet I don't think much selling by
business's is done here to begin with. Actually, I think that af is
fortunate to have some legitimate professionals hanging round to answer
questions with knowledge to back it up...
One of the nice things about this place is the wide variety of opinions
that are offered voluntarily...
Dennis
Susanne
Susanne
EXC JO ANN wrote in message
<20000830173731...@ng-cn1.aol.com>...
Kim
>No, it's not Kim, and you know that as well as I do. Jo Ann came in posting
>on-topic, informative posts. It was the *reaction* of a small handful of very
>vocal individuals, including you, who 'weakened' the group. The only thing it's
>accomplished is to add stress to an otherwise nice, peaceful place to relax.
for herself from day one. And if you call her lame-ass "me-too" posts
on-topic and informative you are as senile as she is. Has she ever
started a thread that didn't somehow relate to something she was
hocking? I doubt it.
>>troll's wet dream where blatent advertising is not only tolerated but
>>encouraged.
>
>of it. Now, why is Jo Ann's 'selling' so distasteful to this small group of
>vocals, yet Fig's 'selling' is tolerated by them? What *is* that, Kim?
of us Linda, but there was a time when ANY soliciting was seriously
frowned upon and this newsgroup was actively policed from within. For
some unknown reason, certain prominent members of alt.fashion(not you
of course) at the time seemed to turn the other cheek to JA's blatant
selling. Some of the old-guard got sick of what af had turned into
and left-the same people who at one time would have been all over
anyone who tried to solicit stuff here. Now that the part of the FAQ
that deals with soliciting is history, I say let anyone from Mary Kay
to Beauticontrol to Amway try and drum up new business here. Its open
season. Fig's site has a much more appealing offering than the dusty
old merchandize found at her competitors to me. And when I read the
copy at fig's site I know it's not taken verbatim from some sales
brochure, complete with bad grammar and typos-or plagiarized.
And ask yourself this Linda-why is JA so threatened by fig? If I were
JA I would be doing all I could do to help my downline sell more
product since I would share in the profit-but not JoAnne! She takes
cheap shots at fig in her pathetic passive-aggressive style. It's
obvious JA is very jealous of fig and that is a shame.
Getting back to the point of this thread, JoAnne has shown her true
self at last; a paranoid delusional with an ego the size of Texas who
can't stand not to be the belle of the ball. She has maliciously
posted a private email with a CC list that includes posters real
names. That is beyond classless-it is heinous. But you'll notice
that her last name is no longer on her web site like it once was.
Gee, what's up with that? Is she scared that she might be endangering
herself? What a hypocrite.
So figarat, unless you are getting your White Shot at cost, I'd jump
off that sinking ship pronto!
Kim
Ripley7173
>On 30 Aug 2000 22:16:53 GMT, fig...@aol.comnospam (Linda) wrote:
>>No, it's not Kim, and you know that as well as I do. Jo Ann came in posting
>>on-topic, informative posts. It was the *reaction* of a small handful of
>very
>>vocal individuals, including you, who 'weakened' the group. The only thing
>it's
>>accomplished is to add stress to an otherwise nice, peaceful place to relax.
>
>I see your selective memory is at it again, Linda. JA was shilling
>for herself from day one. And if you call her lame-ass "me-too" posts
>on-topic and informative you are as senile as she is. Has she ever
>started a thread that didn't somehow relate to something she was
>hocking? I doubt it.
Wow! Joann sells hats, walking shoes & clothes AND little black dresses!? I
MUST get back to her site ASAP! And I thought I was just going to get away with
buying some Terra Nova stuff from her this month... :(
Dove Studio, stop in and take a look!
http://users.lanminds.com/%7Ejandove/index.html
EXC JO ANN
>Date: 8/30/00 11:31 PM Eastern Daylight Time
>Message-id: <39add34b$0$30...@motown.iinet.net.au>
>
>"Sakura" means "cherry blossom" in English.
>
>Susanne
EXC JO ANN
>"Sakura" means "cherry blossom" in English.
>
>Susanne
Thanks Susanne!
EXC JO ANN
>that her last name is no longer on her web site like it once was.
>Gee, what's up with that? Is she scared that she might be endangerin
Last and full name - Jo Ann Tackovich.
Need to see Figaro's invoices for White Shot? $175 per bottle. No discounts
here - why should you discount a top of the line
product. Quality and service always
prevail. Ask all the others that purchase
White Shot $175.
EXC JO ANN
>Wow! Joann sells hats, walking shoes & clothes AND little black dresses!? I
>MUST get back to her site ASAP! And I thought I was just going to get away
>with
>buying some Terra Nova stuff from her this month... :(
>
I guess I don't understand this Ripley but
it really is neither here nor there! But since I am senile, according to the
local
authorities, I guess I wouldn't understand.
Oh, and they are called LBDs. :(
Blkmagikwn
troll's wet dream where blatent advertising is not only tolerated but
much crap that you can use those pension checks you get for kindling
this winter.
>>
What bilious drivel! Your therapist must be making a load of dough from such a
headcase.
Stellaglo
>All this overall brouhaha does is reinforce my belief that there should be
>absolutely no selling in the newsgroup for these very reasons
you see, this is the main issue with excjoann...she alone was allowed to
relentlessly hawk her wares on alt fashion, having teflonized herself to the
point where it appeared to be innocent, accidental, whatever. but now that she
has made it into a common practice, we at alt fashion have no choice but to
embrace the new way; by allowing excjoann to stridently sell her products, we
have implicitly given permission to everyone else to do the very same thing.
and no other e-tailer should be chastised for what excjoann does each and every
day.
NB: no, she has never apologized for breaking the rules and posting my name
publicly without permission.
DNYCE15
>Fig's site has a much more appealing offering
<snipped>
Here we go again....Promote Fig, put down Jo Ann --- her Pola competitor. THIS
is the problem people have. Putting down one vendor to promote another.
Furthermore, if you enjoy Fig and her biz , why waste time bashing Jo Ann and
her business?
>She has maliciously
>posted a private email with a CC list that includes posters real
>names.
And you sent my name to some person I did not know. That person, in turn sent
me several threatening and harassing emails. Glass houses, Kim....glass houses.
>But you'll notice
>that her last name is no longer on her web site like it once was.
Geez, are you stalking the poor woman??? You preach on and on about how you
dislike her, yet you're keeping tabs on her and her website? Either you're an
obsessed stalker, or you're working for someone. Maybe it's both? Either way,
it's very strange behavior.....
>Gee, what's up with that? Is she scared that she might be endangering
>herself? What a hypocrite.
Heck! The way you're monitoring her website, who can blame her!
>So figarat, unless you are getting your White Shot at cost, I'd jump
>off that sinking ship pronto!
>
>Kim
Hmm...the way you're acting, some might think you're getting some things at
cost, too.....
~D.
"I am the author of the only dictionary that defines me...".
EXC JO ANN
>and just *love* it. Not that that has anything to do with anything :)
>
>In article
Rain has notes of Green Clover - Lily of the
Valley and Sheer Musk - the musk smell
more prevailing than the floral. Cloud Nine
would be more floral.
rud...@unibase.com
> you see, this is the main issue with excjoann...she alone was allowed to
> relentlessly hawk her wares on alt fashion,
I really wouldn't call using a url in a sig hawking. And she's
definately not alone in this practice which most of use consider more of
a service than anything. Ask a question and get a pro to answer.
> having teflonized herself to the
> point where it appeared to be innocent, accidental, whatever. but now that she
> has made it into a common practice, we at alt fashion have no choice but to
> embrace the new way;
You can filter anyone you don't want, so you do have a choice...
<snip>
> NB: no, she has never apologized for breaking the rules and posting my name
> publicly without permission.
I found that one rather interesting as I'm sure many others did. Like
I'd mentioned earlier, had she made comment about the mailing list she'd
have been challenged to prove it anyway.
Dennis
Calvin7183
>here - why should you discount a top of the line
>product. Quality and service always
>prevail. Ask all the others that purchase
>White Shot $175.
OR only $148.75 at Who's The Fairest.
Danielle
Dennis-
that very well may have been the case, but that doesn't mean it was
right to post it publicly. the "proof" could have been sent in private.
or at the very least, the distribution list could have been edited or
even removed before it was posted.
--
Danielle
--
Mary Joseph McCarthy
Using your math, as best I can figure it, the savings would purchase one
Kiss Me Mascara at Who's The Fairest. Not a bad deal.
Mary Joseph McCarthy,
"Growing older is a serious business, but I really can smile and have a more
expansively optimistic attitude when I recognize a real bargain in this
topsy-turvy world." Ibid.
Mary Joseph McCarthy
EXC JO ANN wrote:
>
<Snipped>.........
> Last and full name - Jo Ann Tackovich.
>
Okay, so you post your complete name.
And, you've also seen fit to sweep back in to alt.fashion, doing your impression
of a Loretta Young sweeping entrance, and posted about fragrance notes and the
meaning of Sakura.
That makes no difference.
What makes a difference is that you still have made no effort to apologize to me
for posting a private e-mail. But even that's no surprise. I would have been
shocked had you done so.
More importantly, you have offered no apology to the other people whose names
you posted in violation of all Netiquette rules.
I am calling your ethics into question, particularly since you have repeatedly
trumpeted how ethical and upstanding you are and that your business could not be
challenged. Wrong. Again, consider yourself challenged. You owe each of the
individuals a private apology and this newsgroup a public admission that you
made a big mistake.
It will be interesting to see what, if anything, occurs.
Mary Joseph McCarthy,
"Growing older is a serious business, but it can be done with class or not.
After all it is a topsy-turvy world." Ibid.
Ripley7173
>you posted in violation of all Netiquette rules.
Screw "netiquette rules". Seriously, if ANYONE here EVER E-mailed me with
some crap that they were too chinkenshit to post, I'd post in a heartbeat. You
send ME a letter, that makes it MINE. I'll post it, burn it or wipe my ass with
it. It was sent to ME. I don't see what CC lists have to do with anything
either. I'm on cc lists for all kinds of stuff! That hardly means I put myself
on them! Why doesn't anyone just mind their own goddamn business and have fun
anymore?
Ruddell
says...
> that very well may have been the case, but that doesn't mean it was
> right to post it publicly. the "proof" could have been sent in private.
> or at the very least, the distribution list could have been edited or
> even removed before it was posted.
Technically you're correct. Yet morally I think Jo Ann's been taking a
bit too much flack here for really providing a service more than
anything. Some of the names in the list have been pretty negative towards
her, and I think her point was made...
I'm rather amazed at some of the comments that have been directed towards
her before, and now after this post.
fig
>I don't see what CC lists have to do with anything
> either. I'm on cc lists for all kinds of stuff! That hardly means I put myself
> on them!
I agree with this. What I don't care for is being accused of being "anti
Pola" by my upline in that organization. This is hardly excusable or
professional behavior...particularly in a public setting with the entire
world as an audience.
Further, the posting of individuals' names is unforgivable. People use
screen names for various reasons. I use one, not because I'm too
cowardly to stand behind my words, because of a past
stalking/harassment experience that occurred before I had even heard of
the internet. If you or anyone close to you has ever lived through one
of these experiences, you know how terrifying and uprooting they can be.
I choose to try to protect myself from this ever happening again. fig
Kim
>Here we go again....Promote Fig, put down Jo Ann --- her Pola competitor. THIS
>is the problem people have. Putting down one vendor to promote another.
you Mokka dear, have never uttered a negative comment about WTF? on
MUA? That's the pot calling the kettle black again.
>>She has maliciously
>>posted a private email with a CC list that includes posters real
>>names.
>And you sent my name to some person I did not know. That person, in turn sent
>me several threatening and harassing emails. Glass houses, Kim....glass houses.
Did you report this person to their ISP? Did you report me to my ISP?
What did their ISP do? What did my ISP do? If you got harassing
email from someone they certainly didn't need my assistance to do
so-don't try sticking that on me. But I can see why you'd defend JA
since you've posted private email to this newsgroup before as well.
Birds of a feather.....
>>But you'll notice
>>that her last name is no longer on her web site like it once was.
>Geez, are you stalking the poor woman??? You preach on and on about how you
>dislike her, yet you're keeping tabs on her and her website? Either you're an
>obsessed stalker, or you're working for someone. Maybe it's both? Either way,
>it's very strange behavior.....
Visiting someone's site once or twice is stalking? I guess I'm
stalking fig and beautyjungle and makeupalley too-heaven's to
mergatroid! Call the police! I've visited JA's jaundiced little
patch of cyberspace to laugh at the typos, the poor grammar, and the
plagiarism-oh, and the really professional looking pics too! I
believe that JA's web master can tell you exactly how many times since
she's been open that I've visited.
>>Gee, what's up with that? Is she scared that she might be endangering
>>herself? What a hypocrite.
>Heck! The way you're monitoring her website, who can blame her!
get whatever she deserves.
>Hmm...the way you're acting, some might think you're getting some things at
>cost, too.....
kind enough to send me an eyeliner instead of a lip liner (don't use
them) when her lip liners were the monthly GWP and I thought that was
a wonderful customer service gesture. I haven't been a fan of JA's
since she arrived here-before fig's arrival.
Kim
Kim
> Screw "netiquette rules". Seriously, if ANYONE here EVER E-mailed me with
>some crap that they were too chinkenshit to post, I'd post in a heartbeat. You
>send ME a letter, that makes it MINE. I'll post it, burn it or wipe my ass with
>it. It was sent to ME.
huh?
> I don't see what CC lists have to do with anything
>either. I'm on cc lists for all kinds of stuff! That hardly means I put myself
>on them! Why doesn't anyone just mind their own goddamn business and have fun
>anymore?
I see you post under some sort of psudonym-why is that? Why not post
under your real name? Have you had your real name show up in a
world-wide forum? And speaking of minding one's own business, you've
put your .02 in to this thread for what purpose? Or is that how "you"
have fun?
Kim
Ruddell
fig wrote:
> Further, the posting of individuals' names is unforgivable.
To be honest, there wasn't any information in that message that nobody
didn't have access to anyway...those names were all common knowledge to
everyone in af as we know them of. All it showed was a group of people
who obviously email each other on a regular basis. I think that was
her point...
> People use
> screen names for various reasons. I use one, not because I'm too
> cowardly to stand behind my words, because of a past
> stalking/harassment experience that occurred before I had even heard of
> the internet.
That's more than understandable...in fact happens far too often. Guess
that might explain the amount of generic accounts that are here. Far
higher percentage than many other ng's I've lurked...
> If you or anyone close to you has ever lived through one
> of these experiences, you know how terrifying and uprooting they can be.
> I choose to try to protect myself from this ever happening again. fig
Well, being fair, the post never gave any info to anyone about you or
any of the others that we already didn't know so like I said before, no
harm was done...you're still fig and WTF...
Dennis
Ripley7173
>>>posted a private email with a CC list that includes posters real
>>>names.
I've been wondering about the bro-ha-ha over this, and then something
occurred to me. Not everyone is on AOL like Joann and I are. FYI, on AOL
people's names come up after their screen names on email about 95% of the time.
(non-AOL screen names that is) I don't know if it's how you register or
something, but I get scree...@wherever.com(Joe Smith) in my e-mails all the
damn time! And I certainly didn't ask for the person's name, nor did I put it
there myself. Instead of being ticked at Joann for simply posting e-mail, I'd
be mad at whoever put my name on that list, sending out my real name for
anybody to see!
Stellaglo
posting e-mail, I'd
>be mad at whoever put my name on that list, sending out my real name for
>anybody to see!
sugarbean, that's sort of like saying "instead of being mad at the person who
shot me, i'd be mad at the person who told her where to find a bullet."
"we really have to be careful who we sell this stuff to!!" my daughter, mocking
fred segal's sales policies.
Linda
> Screw "netiquette rules". Seriously, if ANYONE here EVER E-mailed me with
>some crap that they were too chinkenshit to post, I'd post in a heartbeat.
But you see, this is the MO - sending little nastygrams behind the scenes to
people, feeling 'protected' by netiquette. These are people who don't want to
take responsibility for their actions. Why would you send something that you
wouldn't want posted? Embarrassed? Realize how pathetic it makes you look
when it's there for all to see? If something isn't fit to post, then don't
send it to a relative stranger. And these people don't 'get it' that they're
sending people's full names around to other people via email. When I got sick
of MJM's little nasties (some containing the standard cc list), I told her I'd
post any that come my way, and I will. Actually, I'd feel free to post any of
the little nasty emails I might get, without a single consideration for
'netiquette'. Hey, the person who has sent it to me won't have been thinking
'etiquette' when they wrote/sent it, so why should I give them that
consideration?
Linda
Linda
>I've visited JA's jaundiced little
>patch of cyberspace to laugh at the typos, the poor grammar, and the
>plagiarism-oh, and the really professional looking pics too!
Kim, do you understand that when you include these adolescent little slams that
it discredits everything else that you write? Do you have any insight in to
how this is perceived by the reader?
Linda
DNYCE15
>>I've visited JA's jaundiced little
>>patch of cyberspace to laugh at the typos, the poor grammar, and the
>>plagiarism-oh, and the really professional looking pics too!
Linda writes:
>Kim, do you understand that when you include these adolescent little slams
>that
>it discredits everything else that you write? Do you have any insight in to
>how this is perceived by the reader?
>Linda
Linda,
Gosh! The way Kim is responding is Jo Ann's site, the reader probably thinks
she's working for someone.....
fig
> To be honest, there wasn't any information in that message that nobody
> didn't have access to anyway...those names were all common knowledge to
> everyone in af as we know them of.
No, Dennis, their *real* names were posted.
> All it showed was a group of people
> who obviously email each other on a regular basis. I think that was
> her point...
I know this was her point, but who cares? I'm on a bunch of cc lists
with all sorts of people. (Further, we all know that this type of thing
can be forged very easily.) What does this prove?
> Well, being fair, the post never gave any info to anyone about you or
> any of the others that we already didn't know so like I said before, no
> harm was done...you're still fig and WTF...
True but calling someone you profit from (and some of her customers)
"anti Pola" is ludicrous no matter whose name is on the email. Also,
everyone one on that cc list has been pretty clear about their feelings
vis a vis Jo Ann. Re-read Candy Cane's post for an accurate history, Dennis.
Other than these complaints, I don't care about the posting of that
email or the cc list. Jo Ann's recently shown herself at being quite
adept at posting her own private emails (witness her recent digs at an
af poster in the OoO Total Effects thread) so why not post those of
others? fig
DNYCE15
>some crap that they were too chinkenshit to post, I'd post in a heartbeat.
Ditto!
> I don't see what CC lists have to do with anything
>either. I'm on cc lists for all kinds of stuff! That hardly means I put
>myself
>on them!
I see your point, but in this case, the people on that CC list that was sent to
Jo Ann are on that list because they want to be.
Ripley7173
>Date: 9/1/00 7:10 AM Central Daylight Time
>Message-id: <20000901081001...@ng-mf1.aol.com>
>
>ripley naively states......> Instead of being ticked at Joann for simply
>posting e-mail, I'd
>>be mad at whoever put my name on that list, sending out my real name for
>>anybody to see!
>
>sugarbean, that's sort of like saying "instead of being mad at the person who
>shot me, i'd be mad at the person who told her where to find a bullet."
>
Nope. It's being mad at the person who gave somebody the bullet and said
"shoot her or I'll shoot you". Let's face it, who here does NOT function with
some measure of self-preservation?