helping minors
D. Reed
It makes me nervous when talking to High School age transgender people.
Should we chat with, advise or sell transgender information and products to
anyone under the age of eighteen? Should we direct them to the proper
sources so that we ourselves do not get into any trouble? Or would that get
us into trouble also?
--
Desiree Dawn http://www.angelfire.com/mo2/dawnproducts
Kathryn Hammond
age of 21. While I surely sympathize with those who are younger than this
it's not worth it to take a chance on losing your business entirely. There
are tons of kids out there with legitimate problems related to gender. But
you never know when some local District Attorney, Vice Squad, or muckraking
local media types might try to set a trap for you by sending in a minor just
to see what will happen. Let's face it, even talking with them could get
you into serious trouble. We always tell them the same thing. "Sorry, we
can't help you right now. We would love to talk to you in a few years when
you are an adult. We suggest you contact your school counseler if that
person might be sympathetic, or search out a local support group for
transgendered teens."
Kathryn Hammond
The Dressing Room
http://www.mslisasdressingroom.com
"D. Reed" <d...@ipa.net> wrote in message
news:JEH_6.14363$n6.13...@nntp3.onemain.com...
Diane Arons
wrote:
>Screw the cops honey, so long as you aren't selling porn or having sex with
>your customers, you ain't breaking no laws. Is it illegal to sell pantyhose
>to minor? C'mon, think about it... exactly what are you doing wrong???
Once again - advice guaranteed to screw up your life (almost) as much
as the Blakesters.
Keep in mind Laura is someone with a criminal record already and gets
visits from the police from time to time.
For someone with a bit more to lose I would advice extreme caution at
even the slightest hint of impropriety around a minor.
It's a fact that the public often sadly confuses transgendered people
with pedophiles :( - and the last thing anyone needs is to have such
a charge directed against them.
The best thing to do is not to give them pantyhose and start them on
their was, as teh Blakester apparently suggests, but rather to refer
them to regognized gay and lesbian organizations for young adults
which are already set up to help them and/or refer them further.
Bad Blakester - no pizza!
Diane Arons
Diane Arons
<salong...@home.net> wrote:
>We make it a policy in our shop to not do any business with those under the
>age of 21. While I surely sympathize with those who are younger than this
>it's not worth it to take a chance on losing your business entirely. There
>are tons of kids out there with legitimate problems related to gender. But
>you never know when some local District Attorney, Vice Squad, or muckraking
>local media types might try to set a trap for you by sending in a minor just
>to see what will happen. Let's face it, even talking with them could get
>you into serious trouble. We always tell them the same thing. "Sorry, we
>can't help you right now. We would love to talk to you in a few years when
>you are an adult. We suggest you contact your school counseler if that
>person might be sympathetic, or search out a local support group for
>transgendered teens."
Sensible advice!
Diane Arons
Jenice Bay
"D. Reed" wrote:
> It makes me nervous when talking to High School age transgender people.
> Should we chat with, advise or sell transgender information and products to
> anyone under the age of eighteen? Should we direct them to the proper
> sources so that we ourselves do not get into any trouble? Or would that get
> us into trouble also?
Don't send porno or adult related materials to them. Support is fine...just
never get sexual and things will be fine.
Jenice
AndiCLR
>them to regognized gay and lesbian organizations for young adults
>which are already set up to help them and/or refer them further.
Not that the gay/lesbian orgs are the place to dump TG's either.
Jenice Bay
Diane Arons wrote:
One phone call to the Los Angeles Sheriffs office or LAPD would set you straight
on this one. Support is fine...100% legal as long as the laws of the state are
followed. I already have placed a call to Sgt. Natalie Stone of the San Diego CA.
Police department for clarification.
Sure there are screwy prosecutors in canada and the U.S....
But laws are laws...
Furnishing materials and offering support or sales of non obscene items is legal.
If you remember folks, this same tactic on the gays in the 60's...the supreme
court has plenty of free speech decisions out there for the searching.
So is this store regulated as an adult business??? Clothing store??? Or Book
store???
I don't turn away any serious inquiry from minors. I offer support and referrals
and a friendly ear only. I try to direct these kids to clergy, counselors or
trusted personal friends. But I sure as hell never turn one away.
I'm proud of helping others no matter who they are . If you feel threatened by
the local cops ,then maybe you need to reevaluate where you reside or who you
elect to local office.
Besides....most local support groups are loaded with lawyers full of free advice
and a few even have cops and judges in them.
NOTE TO MINORS>>>
IF YOU ARE SEEKING SUPPORT OR REFERRALS TO EDUCATIONAL MATERIALS, OR MEDICAL
NEEDS.......EMAIL ME!!!
Jenice Bay
http://www.geocities.com/jenicebay
(Support always here)
Jenice Bay
Kathryn Hammond wrote:
> We make it a policy in our shop to not do any business with those under the
> age of 21.
Why/ Are you classified as an adult oreinted business by local law?
> While I surely sympathize with those who are younger than this
> it's not worth it to take a chance on losing your business entirely. There
> are tons of kids out there with legitimate problems related to gender. But
> you never know when some local District Attorney, Vice Squad, or muckraking
> local media types might try to set a trap for you by sending in a minor just
> to see what will happen.
What will happen....what goes on inside you business that would be wrong for a
minor to be around?
> Let's face it, even talking with them could get
> you into serious trouble. We always tell them the same thing. "Sorry, we
> can't help you right now. We would love to talk to you in a few years when
> you are an adult.
Oh....after they are all fucked up on drugs and living in the streets
hooking...because the first time the contacted any person they though was going
to be helpful....they got rebuffed.
> We suggest you contact your school counseler if that
> person might be sympathetic, or search out a local support group for
> transgendered teens."
Ok Katheryn...I'm not gonna tell you how to run your business cuz I'm not in
your shoes. I'm sure you have reasons as why you turn these kids away.
Do us all one little favor please....
Make up a little card you can hand these kids before you kick them out of your
store. Have the number of a local support group or closest trans/bi/lez/gay
center on it. That way you can at least give them something to help them on
their way, and the pros can deal with it.
Hell...give them MY email address...it will take care of the referrals.
Thanks!
Jenice Bay
San Diego TransFamily
Diane Arons
>
>Not that the gay/lesbian orgs are the place to dump TG's either.
Actually Andi I have found that local Gay and Lesbian centers usually
do host Tg support meetings and/or can provide referrals to such in
the area.
Diane Arons
Diane Arons
wrote:
>Heaven forbid we should actually chip in and take care of one of our own!
Well if there are any kids out there who want to be "woman-males" when
they grow up - as you advocate....then I guess it would be OK to send
them to you.
Diane Arons
Diane Arons
>
>One phone call to the Los Angeles Sheriffs office or LAPD would set you straight
>on this one.
One charge of child molestation from an angry parent would set *you*
straight...or perhaps not...but it would for most people.
Aren't you the one who told a closeted military TG in the Monterey
area a while back to not worry about going to the gay bar in that
area. That you could fix things up because of your contacts in the
military? <snicker>
Okayyyyyyy...............
Diane Arons
Diane Arons
>Ok Katheryn...I'm not gonna tell you how to run your business cuz I'm not in
>your shoes. I'm sure you have reasons as why you turn these kids away.
>Do us all one little favor please....
US?
Don't speak for me Ms. Weird Science.
I'm sure the woman knows what she is doing and will give your "advice"
all the consideration that it deserves.
Diane Arons
Diane Arons
>NOTE TO MINORS>>>
>IF YOU ARE SEEKING SUPPORT OR REFERRALS TO EDUCATIONAL MATERIALS, OR MEDICAL
>NEEDS.......EMAIL ME!!!
NOTE TO MINORS:
NEVER...but NEVER email an adult who solicits you so readily about
ANYTHING remotely related to sexuality or gender.
Instead contact your local gay and lesbian center (in the phone book
or 411) and tell them about your needs and ask for a referral.
Diane Arons
Kathryn Hammond
this alone is enough to get you busted for allowing minors in your shop.
But I'm afraid that like many people some of the replies to my post miss the
point. You do not have to be arrested or charged with a crime to be hassled
by the cops or local authorities. I live in the real world and know that
the police can really do quite a bit to shut you down without charging you
with bupkis! We do what we do for a living, not a hobby, and pay our bills
with the receipts from our shop. Really, if you were in that position,
would you take chances?? I am a business person, not a martyr.
And yes, most TG boutiques are looked upon by those who don't know any
better as "adult" businesses. We are classified with porn shops and gay
bars in the minds of the powers that be. It's best to keep a low profile
and one way to do that is to bar minors from the premises.
Jenice Bay
Diane Arons wrote:
> On Thu, 28 Jun 2001 13:52:22 -0700, Jenice Bay <jb...@cts.com> wrote:
>
> >
> >One phone call to the Los Angeles Sheriffs office or LAPD would set you straight
> >on this one.
>
> One charge of child molestation from an angry parent would set *you*
> straight...or perhaps not...but it would for most people.
Anyone who has improper contact with minors should be arrested. people make false
child mosestation charges all the time. we have a pretty good law in ca that takes
care of those people.
But hey....you know the law right...it's all on google..<big stuupid smile>
> Aren't you the one who told a closeted military TG in the Monterey
> area a while back to not worry about going to the gay bar in that
> area. That you could fix things up because of your contacts in the
> military? <snicker>
Yes I did...and I stand by that Diane...and I can back it up in real life situations.
Besides....tell us the bar you were warning us about....it it still even in
business??...been there lately??..I have beeen to all the gay bars in Monterey/Santa
Cruz/Salinas/San Jose etc... and the straight ones too...geeze...I lived on Montery
coast for 13 years<another stoopid smile>
You wanna take me to task on it Diane?? I back my shit 100%
You wanna do a face to face and see who I am first , like others have?
You wanna debate law with me??? Bring it on! I can hold my own with you no
problem.
I'm in San Diego...I have no problem meeting people and laying down my background to
you... if you think you need to know it.<wink>
> Okayyyyyyy...............
>
Ball is in your court Daine...run with it...or drop it. I can drive up there if you
wish,<tax deduction...support ya know> or we can meet halfway in Orange County if you
wish. I will buy the food...
Or you can come down here for a little San Diego Rockin Lobsters...I will buy those
too.
But you really don't care anyway do ya Diane???
Nor should I...but the invitation is open...do you dare accept?
Jenice Bay
The internet soccermom
http://www.geocities.com/jenicebay
>
Jenice Bay
Diane Arons wrote:
> On Thu, 28 Jun 2001 14:07:42 -0700, Jenice Bay <jb...@cts.com> wrote:
>
> >Ok Katheryn...I'm not gonna tell you how to run your business cuz I'm not in
> >your shoes. I'm sure you have reasons as why you turn these kids away.
> >Do us all one little favor please....
>
> US?
Yes *US*...if you are not one of *US* then too bad! Sign the damm permission
slip nextime Diane<super cheezzzzzy smile>.
>
> Don't speak for me Ms. Weird Science.
I like that moniker...can I keep it???
>
> I'm sure the woman knows what she is doing and will give your "advice"
> all the consideration that it deserves.
Thanks...that is all I ask...a little support and consideration.
Jenice Bay
(got support?)
http://www.geocities.com/jenicebay
Jenice Bay
Diane Arons wrote:
> On Thu, 28 Jun 2001 13:52:22 -0700, Jenice Bay <jb...@cts.com> wrote:
>
> >NOTE TO MINORS>>>
> >IF YOU ARE SEEKING SUPPORT OR REFERRALS TO EDUCATIONAL MATERIALS, OR MEDICAL
> >NEEDS.......EMAIL ME!!!
>
> NOTE TO MINORS:
>
> NEVER...but NEVER email an adult who solicits you so readily about
> ANYTHING remotely related to sexuality or gender.
Another note to minors..
Don't watch TV...Don't look at magazines...don't read the internet...don't look
at billboards...don't ask questions. And for god sake....quit touching yourself!
Bullocks!
Jenice Bay
(got support...email me!)
http://www.geocities.com/jenicebay
> Instead contact your local gay and lesbian center (in the phone book
> or 411) and tell them about your needs and ask for a referral.
>
You can do that too....whatever works for you.
Jenice Bay
(got support...email me!)
http://www.geocities.com/jenicebay
Jenice Bay
Kathryn Hammond wrote:
> Like most TG boutiques we do carry a few magazies that are adult in nature,
> this alone is enough to get you busted for allowing minors in your shop.
If you have a No Minor rule than fine...I understand that...I also understand a
dedicated section for adults only.
> But I'm afraid that like many people some of the replies to my post miss the
> point. You do not have to be arrested or charged with a crime to be hassled
> by the cops or local authorities.
So what goes on in your shop that the cops would have any kind of issue with.
They gave you a business permit right? Are you regulated as an Adult business?
> I live in the real world and know that
> the police can really do quite a bit to shut you down without charging you
> with bupkis! We do what we do for a living, not a hobby, and pay our bills
> with the receipts from our shop. Really, if you were in that position,
> would you take chances??
I sure as hell would stick up for my right to the first amendement...and my
right not to be harassed buy the police.
> I am a business person, not a martyr.
> And yes, most TG boutiques are looked upon by those who don't know any
> better as "adult" businesses.
> We are classified with porn shops and gay
> bars in the minds of the powers that be. It's best to keep a low profile
> and one way to do that is to bar minors from the premises.
Well then it's all pretty moot then in your case...
If you don't allow minors in by regulation or personal choice than fine...that
is the rule.
But if you let minors in your shop..and refuse to speak about tg issues in
anyway..I have a problem with that ,as I find it a copout.
Jenice Bay
(support for all)
http://www.geocities.com/jenicebay
.
Kathryn Hammond
Church. But if there were a 7-11, in the township in which I live they are
not allowed to sell Playboy or Penthouse so your question is meaningless.
As for your other statement, I can only feel sorry for you. Trying to pick
a fight by calling someone a coward is not very ladylike. But then again I
guess you aren't a lady are you.
Due to the fact that I contributed to this thread I broke my long standing
rule of never reading anything posted by the person known as "Laura Blake".
My mistake. And one I won't make again.
"Laura Blake" <ldb...@region.net> wrote in message
news:3hcnjt8045f9ibskm...@news.region.net...
> In message: <_QN_6.137605$DG1.22...@news1.rdc1.mi.home.com>
> Posted: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 22:03:38 GMT
>
> Kathryn Hammond wrote:
>
> >Like most TG boutiques we do carry a few magazies that are adult in
nature,
> >this alone is enough to get you busted for allowing minors in your shop.
>
> Does the 7-11 across the road sell Playboy or Penthouse?
> Do they get busted for allowing minors in their store?
>
>
> >I am a business person, not a martyr.
>
> Pardon the bluntness... but you strike me more like a coward than either
of
> those.
>
>
> -----
> Laura Blake
Glenn Olson
<salong...@home.net> wrote:
>There is no 7-11 across the street from my shop, in fact there is a Baptist
>Church. But if there were a 7-11, in the township in which I live they are
>not allowed to sell Playboy or Penthouse so your question is meaningless.
Where are you? In Alberta, almost every convenience and bookstore
carries adult magazines; the only restriction is that they be out of
easy access to minors.
It's a common tendency to forget that not everyone deals with the same
regulations, though.
--
"I want to be pretty *and* kick butt"
- 19 y/o girl's reaction to Laura Croft
Cher
carry many specialty items and have lots of friends in the area (most customers
eventually become friends because of the support we offer and the fact that we
keep our prices very low compared to the other CD places).
Quite awhile ago, I remember a teenager --probably about 17 00 came to our shop
and eyed some of the lingerie for a bit and then bolted suddenly. My partner
suspected he pocketed something but after checking the rack, found out nothing
was missing. I suspected he got scared after he finally got up the courage to
come in.
Eventually, he IM'd me on the computer saying he was the boy he came and went
and explained that he really was interested in the lingerie but was scared. I
told him it was ok......that he could come back when he felt comfortable.
He did return and chose a white lace garterbelt. He only had about $10, so I
through some pretty lacetop stockings for free.
He was really very happy. I remember he emailed me with thanks for helping and
then confessed he started having dreams about Me. Honestly, I was flattered
:o)
I ended up seeing him recently working in a hardware store but made sure I
didn't acknowlege him unless he wanted to say Hi first.
I never ever thought I did anything wrong. Never thought it would be illegal in
anyway (was I wrong, hmmmm?). We don't carry anything pornographic so we don't
really need an "over 18" policy. We're trying to fight the stigma of CD'ing
being wrong or perverse, so I guess I never considered the age.
Sure, we've had cops "undercover" visit, but that's to be sure there isn't any
lingerie modeling/prostitution going on. Once they knew we were straight up,
they didn't bother us.
I figure hey.....I was a part of a (hopefully fond) memory for this guy and
showed him acceptance at a tender age....isn't that sort of an honor?
Teddy Girl Lingerie, Inc.
-- Self Promotion BS (sorry)
http://www.TeddyGirl.com
http://www.TGplayroom.com
Jenice Bay
sister to sister stuff that helps the person get a little closer to self
acceptance. You broke no laws....crossed no 'lines'. You provided a needed public
service full of compassion.
YOU ROCK!
Jenice
Cher
>
Well, down here in Florida they have "Lingerie Modeling" along with "Spa
Attendants" and "Aromatherapy Attendants"......all really a cover for
prostitution. They don't sell any lingerie :o) they sell a "service. I had no
idea since I came from New York -- up there we just call them straight out
hookers :o) We always have guys coming in looking for "Modeling".....you can
spot them as soon as they come in from the desperate perverse look in their
eye.
As far as handouts for kids, well....that was the first and last little guy I
ever saw.
We've had teenage girls come in....but rarely a guy. I think they are way too
nervous at that age and convinced they are doing something wrong.
We do have plenty of grown ups who are seeking advice, so hand outs might be
good for them. I'll email you about it. Thanks Laura.
Cher
Thanks, Jenice. You should see Me on a dance floor :o)
-Cher
Jenice Bay
people say I dance like a white chick....I got no ass!
Jenice
Laura Blake wrote:
> In message: <20010701144338...@ng-fc1.aol.com>
> Posted: 01 Jul 2001 18:43:38 GMT
>
> Cher wrote:
>
> >>YOU ROCK!
> >
> >Thanks, Jenice. You should see Me on a dance floor :o)
>
> YIKES... a brave transie with moves?
> Sounds like a night out to me! <G>
>
> -----
> Laura Blake
Trainman
DiDi
Cher <tedd...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20010701143902...@ng-fc1.aol.com...
Cher
>YIKES... a brave transie with moves?
>Sounds like a night out to me! <G>
>
OOOps, I forgot to make the distinction that I'm a GG.......but all my dance
partners are of the T variety....and many can out-dance (some in 5" heels, no
less).
And anytime you're interested in a night out in the Clearwater, FL
area.....just let Me know, we've got lots of fun people 'round these parts!!
wargoat
-suddenly re-lurking-
Justine
"Jenice Bay" <jb...@cts.com> wrote in message
news:3B3BB3F9...@cts.com...
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