Pronunciation
Sweet Caroline
What ho, all!
The sun having descended over the yardarm in Bora Bora and reascended
and whatnot, I have been able to consult the old sourceb. on that little
pronunciation matter. The tome is entitled "The Mother Tongue: English
and How it Got that Way" by Bill Bryson. And, on page 197, shortly after
the paragraph in which the following is pronounced:
"Often, presumably for reasons of private amusement, the British
pronounce their names in ways that bear almost no resemblance to their
spelling....P.G. Wodehouse becomes 'woodhouse', the poet William Cowper
becomes 'cooper.' Caius College, Cambridge, is 'keys,' while Magdalen
College, Oxford, and Magdalene College, Cambridge, are both pronounced
'mawdlin.'"
the old bean gives the following examples for names with five
pronunciations (there are three, one more in number and two more in
actuality than my fish-deprived brain was able to recall yesterday):
"The surname generally said to have the most pronunciations is
Featherstonehaugh, which can be pronounced in any of five ways:
'feather-stun-haw,' 'feerston-shaw,' 'feston-haw,' 'feeson-hay,' or (for
those in a hurry) 'fan-shaw.' But in fact there are two other names with
five pronunciations: Coughtry, which can be 'kotry' [with a long o],
'kawtry,' 'kowtry,' 'kootry,' and 'kofftry,' and Wriotheseley, which can
be 'rottsly,' 'rittsly,' 'rizzli,' 'rithly,' or 'wriotheslee.'"
He then goes on to tell of "an entire pronunciation unit, a small group
of dedicated orthoepists (professional pronouncers)" employed by the BBC
to deal with just such situations, so the news reporters don't have to
suffer the embarrassment of announcing that Lord "Feather-stun-haw" was
beaned by a bread roll when it was really Lord "Fan-shaw," or suchlike.
One learns something new every day, doesn't one?
Lady Caroline
Yardley-in-the-Sticks
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Sweet Caroline
I.J. Cockburn wrote:
>
> >The tome is entitled "The Mother Tongue: English
> >and How it Got that Way" by Bill Bryson.
>
> that it is full of interesting stuff like this, including a
> section on the amount of words Shakespeare invented whenever
> the fancy took him, a practice that is hilariously drawn
> attention to in Plum's "Over Seventy" in the chapter on
> critics.
> Pip-pip
> Ian
Ian,
What section of the book does that little matter lurk in? I don't
remember it, and I'll have to take a look.
By way of pronunciation, the "Names" chapter also mentions a lovely long
name, but doesn't tell how to say it!! Will some kind chap or Aunt toss
in their interpretation of: MacGillesheathenaich ?
Ta,
I.J. Cockburn
In article <34575A...@NOSPAMhOtmail.coM>,
Sweet Caroline <cste...@NOSPAMhOtmail.coM> wrote:
>>
>
>What section of the book does that little matter lurk in? I
don't
>remember it, and I'll have to take a look.
If memory serves it was in the chapter on "Where words come
from".
>By way of pronunciation, the "Names" chapter also mentions a
lovely long
>name, but doesn't tell how to say it!! Will some kind chap
or Aunt toss
>in their interpretation of: MacGillesheathenaich ?
>
>Ta,
>Lady Caroline
>Yardley-in-the-Sticks
Couldn't say, but i could guess "McGithick" "McGilthyneck",
"McGeck" "Mick" or simply "You there" or "The chappie with
the name".
Jeeves would know.
best of luck,
Ian
Joann Zimmerman
In article <34575A...@NOSPAMhOtmail.coM>, cste...@NOSPAMhotmail.com wrote:
> By way of pronunciation, the "Names" chapter also mentions a lovely long
> name, but doesn't tell how to say it!! Will some kind chap or Aunt toss
> in their interpretation of: MacGillesheathenaich ?
Based on previous form (Fotheringhay = Fungy) the logical choice would be
"Mac," but I suspect that something more sinister is actually occurring.
How about "MacIlhenny"? (I just realized that, at least on *my* screen,
the font of choice seems to deliver capital "i"s and lower-case "L"s as
identical twins, so adjust your interpretations accordingly: MaciLhenny.
Honoria Glossop, Totleigh-in-the-Stacks
--
"Fiction is all about reliving things. It is our second chance."
--Don DeLillo
Joann Zimmerman jz...@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu
Sweet Caroline
I.J. Cockburn wrote:
>
> In article <34575A...@NOSPAMhOtmail.coM>,
> Sweet Caroline <cste...@NOSPAMhOtmail.coM> wrote:
> or Aunt toss
> >in their interpretation of: MacGillesheathenaich ?
>
> "McGeck" "Mick" or simply "You there" or "The chappie with
> the name".
> Jeeves would know.
Why, thank you so much. My best interpretation so far is "McGillynick",
but I prefer your "the chappie with the name." Now I'll be prepared if I
ever run up against a bearer of said above name! Provides some strong
incentive for quickly coming to a first-name basis, what?
Am I correct in assuming yours is pronounced "coburn"?
Lady Caroline
Ian Michaud
Derek Keevil wrote:
>
> What ho! Derek here, occassional lurker of the a.f.w.
> I was wondering how one would go about spelling the english name
> pronounced "Chumly." It's something along the lines of Chorlmunderly,
> but I can't remember for the life of me. Thanks!
>
> - DerekHere is the way W.S. Gilbert spelled the name when he gave it to one of
the minor characters in The Yeomen of the Guard: Cholmondeley. How the
British upper classes managed to turn that into Chumley is a mystery but
I suspect centuries of in-breeding may have something to do with it.
Teuf-teuf,
The Mixer
Mixer, The
Marsh wrote:
>
> Ian Michaud (The Mixer) wrote:
> >Here is the way W.S. Gilbert spelled the name (Chumley) when he gave it
> > the minor characters in The Yeomen of the Guard: Cholmondeley. How the
> > British upper classes managed to turn that into Chumley is a mystery but
> > I suspect centuries of in-breeding may have something to do with it.
> >
> > Teuf-teuf,
> >
> > The Mixer
>
> spelt R-U-T-H-V-E-N RUTHVEN. And it's pronounced 'Rivven'. And it's not
> only a whim of M. Grimes the name does actually exist and is pronounced
> that way!!
> Another Fan
Actually Ruthven is another name used by Gilbert & Sullivan. In
Ruddigore Sir Ruthven Murgatroyd is forced by a witch's curse to become a
"bad bart". As everyone is this newsgroup knows, Plum was a great fan
of the Savoy Operas and sprinkled Gilbertian allusions and quotes
throughout his oeuvre. He went on to cheerfully borrow the expression
"bad bart" in several of his stories.
As an off-the-topic aside, Plum's Duke of Dunstable would appear to be
the eldest son of Gilbert's Duke of Dunstable who became betrothed to
Lady Jane (surname unknown) at the end of Patience in 1881. But
when we contrast the amiable nature of Gilbert's Duke with the behaviour
of Plum's Alaric one can't help but wonder if Lady Jane had a little
fling with Reginald Bunthorne somewhere along the way.
Stirring the pot again, tinkerty-tonk from The Mixer
Marsh
Ian Michaud wrote:
>
> Derek Keevil wrote:
> >
> > What ho! Derek here, occassional lurker of the a.f.w.
> > I was wondering how one would go about spelling the english name
> > pronounced "Chumly." It's something along the lines of Chorlmunderly,
> > but I can't remember for the life of me. Thanks!
> >
Richard Herring
In article <345C1F...@bc.sympatico.ca>, "Mixer, The"
<ian_m...@bc.sympatico.ca> wrote
>>
>> Here's another one: In the books of Martha Grimes you will find a butler
>> spelt R-U-T-H-V-E-N RUTHVEN. And it's pronounced 'Rivven'. And it's not
>> only a whim of M. Grimes the name does actually exist and is pronounced
>> that way!!
>> Another Fan
>
>Ruddigore Sir Ruthven Murgatroyd is forced by a witch's curse to become a
>"bad bart".
(But not as bad as all thart.)
--
Reggie "Kipper" Herring <ric...@clupeid.demon.co.uk>
I.J. Cockburn
In article <3458B8...@NOSPAMhOtmail.coM>,
Sweet Caroline <cste...@NOSPAMhOtmail.coM> wrote:
>
>Why, thank you so much. My best interpretation so far is
"McGillynick",
>but I prefer your "the chappie with the name." Now I'll be
prepared if I
>ever run up against a bearer of said above name! Provides
some strong
>incentive for quickly coming to a first-name basis, what?
>
>Am I correct in assuming yours is pronounced "coburn"?
>
>Lady Caroline
Absolutely correct. "Coburn" is the prunounciation, as in
"Lord Cockburn". I tenaciously cling to my real name, partly
because the last time I tried impersonating someone I
realised to my horror I'd selected someone who didn't exist,
a bally hybrid, and the game was jolly well up before you
could say Jack Robinson (pronounced Rawson). Since that
embarrassing situation, i have been licking my wounds and
shall not attempt another subterfuge until Uncle Fred is at
hand to organize it.
Best regards, Ian