Help with Latin translation...
Augustus Fink-Nottle
I say, I know there are a few fish fed johnnies out here who dabble in
Latin. I believe the following lines are in Latin and a translation,
however loose, would just about hit the spot!
1) Sub conservatione formae specificae salva anima.
2) agressi sunt mare tenebrarum quid in eo esset exploraturi.
fogged between the ears,
Gussie
pm
Augustus Fink-Nottle <bhur...@pilot.msu.edu> wrote:
: I say, I know there are a few fish fed johnnies out here who dabble in
: Latin. I believe the following lines are in Latin and a translation,
: however loose, would just about hit the spot!
You might try the fish-fed johnnies at sci.classics, some of them do
this kind of thing for a living. By the way, recently they had a long
discussion going about "rem acu tetigisti", one of Jeeves's gags. It
seems some bounder wrote a novel where he claimed that "tetigistius"
means "needle".
Anyway, here's my attempt at translation:
: 1) Sub conservatione formae specificae salva anima.
The soul is saved when the specific form is conserved.
: 2) agressi sunt mare tenebrarum quid in eo esset exploraturi.
They attacked (or entered) the sea of darkness in order to explore
something there.
Both sentences don't make too much sense in isolation, a bit of context
might be helpful. Where does this come from, Spinoza perhaps?
: fogged between the ears,
: Gussie
Regards, Knatchbull-Huguessen
(unofficial nom-de-plum)
--
Peter Marksteiner e-mail: Peter.Ma...@univie.ac.at
Vienna University Computer Center Tel: (+43 1) 4277 14055
Universitaetsstrasse 7, A-1010 Vienna, Austria FAX: (+43 1) 4277 9140
Tim Palmer
In article <633kik$ovc$1...@msunews.cl.msu.edu>, bhur...@pilot.msu.edu says...
>
>I say, I know there are a few fish fed johnnies out here who dabble in
>Latin. I believe the following lines are in Latin and a translation,
>however loose, would just about hit the spot!
>
I drool when I call to mind the particular body in the greenhouse.
Sir Gregory Parsloe Parsloe Bart, gentleman and scholar
Anne Cotton
I am told by our Classics department (and I mean, what's the use having
one if you can't consult it now and then, right?) that a translation of
the two phrases recently bunged forth here are:
1) Sub conservatione formai specificae salva anima: The soul remains
intact [or unimpaired] as long as its specific form is preserved. (But,
notes our expert, there is NO Latin word "specificus" or "-a"; so what
is meant by this borrowing from a much later language?)
I much prefer the alternative proposed by one hardy translator:
I drool when I call to mind the particular body in the greenhouse.
As for the second phrase, it's easier:
2) Agressi sunt mare tenebrarum quid in eo esset exploraturi: They
approached the sea of darkness in order to explore what was in it.
(While "attacked" is a possible meaning of "agressi", it's not
appropriate in this context, per the local Latin chappie.)
Or, as an alternative, one could essay something along the lines of
"they explored the price of the wild dark female horse" -- ???
Lady Bassett
Augustus Fink-Nottle
pm <p...@katz.cc.univie.ac.at> wrote:
>Both sentences don't make too much sense in isolation, a bit of context
>might be helpful. Where does this come from, Spinoza perhaps?
>Regards, Knatchbull-Huguessen
Actually, it's from Poe. No. Not really Poe himself. The first one is by
a chappie called Raymond Lully (can you imagine the time he must have had
in school with a name like that!) and the other simply attributed to 'the
adventurous Nubian geographer'. Obviously, this Nubian geographer must
have been a dashed adventurous bird; smoking rooms must have buzzed with
his latest escapade, children encouraged to follow in his example and so
on and so forth, for Poe considered it redundant to mention his name.
Though why he would want to go exploring seas of darkness is beyond me.
But to each his own, what? Must have been the hot thing in those days.
Thanks to all who responded. When Poe writes a spiffingly surreal paragraph
and tops it off with a latin phrase, one is simply compelled to decipher it.
One feels, on these occasions, like a bulldog who, at the end of a long run,
has been refused cake.
thanks again for the cake,
Gussie
tariq....@boeing.com
Sweet Caroline wrote:
> Are you sure it's not "veni, vedi, vegi" - "I came, I saw, I had a
> salad" ?
> Or "veni, vedi, velcro" - "I came, I saw, I stuck around" ?
Along the same lines, comedian Buddy Hacket had a bit in one of his
standup routines where the Pope tells Hacket "Abscondo Obeseroi
illegetimo", translated as "Get out of here, you fat bastard".
Merolchazzar, King of Oom
-------------------==== Posted via Deja News ====-----------------------
http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Post to Usenet
Sweet Caroline
Narayanan Anand wrote:
>
> Lady Caroline <cste...@NOSPAMhOtmail.coM> writes:
>
> > It is funny, I mean to say, isn't it, what we pick up in these dashed
> > ancient languages? The extent of my Latin consists of being able to
> > say: "Via ovicipitum dura est"
>
> Surely, milady, you jest: you forget "veni, vici, vidi", if those are
> the bally w. I want.
Are you sure it's not "veni, vedi, vegi" - "I came, I saw, I had a
salad" ?
Or "veni, vedi, velcro" - "I came, I saw, I stuck around" ?
(Your phrase was very helpful in jogging the m.)
Ta,
Lady Caroline
--
| q qq-- | |
| qqq q | This sentence has cabbage six words. |
| qqq | |
|_______http://www.voicenet.com/~steinfor/carohome.htm__________|
Augustus Fink-Nottle
Narayanan Anand <nara...@norbo.cs.wisc.edu> wrote:
>Surely, milady, you jest: you forget "veni, vici, vidi", if those are
>the bally w. I want.
Hmmm... veni, vidi, vici.
I believe it means - 'I came. I saw. I staggered for a moment, then,
composing myself with great swiftness, called for Jeeves and left the
matter entirely in his hands.
pip-pip,
Gussie
tariq....@boeing.com
Anne Cotton wrote:
> Lady Bassett (who had four years of this bloody language in
> high school, and THAT was enough for a lifetime)
In that case you would probably endorse the following sentiments
penned by a bored student of the bygone tongue:
Latin is a language as dead as dead can be
It killed the ancient Romans, and now its killing me.
Narayanan Anand
Lady Caroline <cste...@NOSPAMhOtmail.coM> writes:
> It is funny, I mean to say, isn't it, what we pick up in these dashed
> ancient languages? The extent of my Latin consists of being able to
> say: "Via ovicipitum dura est"
Surely, milady, you jest: you forget "veni, vici, vidi", if those are
the bally w. I want.
Anne Cotton
Lady Caroline questioned my "agricola" series. No, it's not a verb
at all; it's the first declension of nouns. "The farmer; of the
farmer; to the farmer..." etc.
Which reminds me of the story of Winston Churchill, when set to memorize
the first declension. He got to the vocative case, and asked what it
meant; the master replied, "O table." Churchill was puzzled still, so
the master explained, "You would use it in speaking to a table."
Churchill (very young) replied, "But sir, I never do!"
Lady Bassett
Jean Tillson
Gussie wrote:
>Hmmm... veni, vidi, vici.
>I believe it means - 'I came. I saw. I staggered for a moment, then,
>composing myself with great swiftness, called for Jeeves and left the
>matter entirely in his hands.
Good one, Gussie, but here's the real poser: How do you
pronounce it? I have a real, old-fashioned classics
professor this semester and we were discssing Suetonius'
biography of Julius Caesar the other day and she pronounced
the phrase thusly:
way-nee, wee-dee, wee-key
I mean to say, what? I wouldn't dare to question her on it,
either; the old girl reads the ancients in their original
form be it Latin, Greek or what have you, so there. So what
is the deal with the letter "v" in Latin - sometimes it's
a hard "v" and sometimes it's a "w"?
Pax Vobiscum (pax wobiscum?),
Pighooey
JMGarciaJr
Of particular delight to those of us of Imperial extraction (Iberic divisin,
with a dash of Italic, for spice) is the passage a certain commander of an
expeditionary force made.
Seems this stout fellow was to quell a rebellion somewhere in the subcontinent,
and was dispatched duly. Turns out, the garrison of suncontinental rebels was
far larger and more well-armed than previously anticipated. So off this bird
goes, with his handful of Sandhurst's finest to quell said rebellion in a town
called "Sindh", not knowing he was in for a far greater scrape than expected.
Headquarters in London (or Bombay, one forgets these things) waited anxiously,
fearing the very worst. A few tense days later they receive a telegram from
this very soldier with only one word on it. "Peccavi".
A Young Man In Spats
c/o The Drones Club
16 Dover Street
London, W1
sha...@nospam.com
In article <wdgaffr...@norbo.i-have-a-misconfigured-system-so-shoot-me>,
Narayanan Anand <nara...@norbo.cs.wisc.edu> wrote:
>Lady Caroline <cste...@NOSPAMhOtmail.coM> writes:
>
>> say: "Via ovicipitum dura est"
>
>Surely, milady, you jest: you forget "veni, vici, vidi", if those are
>the bally w. I want.
And one must not forget "Semper ubi sub ubi."
Pongo.
Augustus Fink-Nottle
Pighooey, in reference to veni, vidi, vici wrote :
>but here's the real poser: How do you
>pronounce it? I have a real, old-fashioned classics
>professor this semester and we were discssing Suetonius'
>biography of Julius Caesar the other day and she pronounced
>the phrase thusly:
>
>way-nee, wee-dee, wee-key
I also believe that the _ci_ in vici should be pronounced as 'chi'
(as in Chi-Chi's, the restaurant chain. International phonetic symbol
is t-integral.sign-i). You would pronounce an *original* _chi_ as 'ki'
as long the _chi_ is not followed by a vowel. (ie. chinino -> ki'nino).
But the original word is vici, not vichi, so wee-key, I propose, is
entirely improper.
Ofcourse I am using Italian rules of pronounciation, but then I believe
Italian and Latin pronounciations are mostly the same, aren't they?
pip-pip,
Gussie
Kristine Fowler
Augustus Fink-Nottle (bhur...@pilot.msu.edu) wrote, in response to
Lady Bassett:
: >What ARE they teaching them in school these days?
: I assure you, we can hic, haec, and hoc for that matter, with the best
: of them.
Well, that rather depends on where they went to school. Gussie and I are
fairly close to the same vintage, and I can by no means hic, haec, or hoc
with any facility. I will join anyone decrying the pervasive lack of this
traditional curriculum. The only game in the town in which I grew up was
a public high school (please note this is "public" in the American sense
of being tax-supported and having to serve the whole population, so you
can imagine what that leads to) offered only modern languages. To add
insult to injury, the public university in the town didn't even offer
Latin. Two of my friends and I decided to remedy this situation by
circulating a petition which we submitted to the university, so the
resident polyglot professor agreed to offer one semester of Latin in the
evenings. So yes, I actually paid for this privilege, but unfortunately
the demand in general was not enough to continue the course. When trying
to round up support amongst my high school friends, I was likely to get
the response, "But I'm not planning to travel to Latland." And that was
from the more intelligent of them.
Then I went to a lovely private university, where they taught not only
Latin but Greek, and people majored in them voluntarily. Of course, I
didn't, but just knowing I could soothed my little soul.
Aurelia Cammarleigh
c/o fow...@math.umn.edu
Augustus Fink-Nottle
In article <63b1ri$fig$1...@vixen.cso.uiuc.edu>,
fow...@alexia.lis.uiuc.edu (Kristine Fowler) wrote:
>Augustus Fink-Nottle (bhur...@pilot.msu.edu) wrote, in response to
>Lady Bassett:
>: >What ARE they teaching them in school these days?
>: I assure you, we can hic, haec, and hoc for that matter, with the best
>: of them.
>
>Well, that rather depends on where they went to school. Gussie and I are
>fairly close to the same vintage, and I can by no means hic, haec, or hoc
>with any facility.
My dear Aurelia, I was referring to the hic'ing, haec'ing and hoc'ing
that one suffers from after ones orange juice has been laced with the
strong and bitter. These things are known to happen quite frequently
when one is in school. But, as you said, we can't hic, haec or hoc with
any facility. Indeed, ones facilities are far beyond ones reach by the
time the hic'ing commences. But that is not to say that we don't do it
with the best of them, what?
Gussie (Eh? Latin? What's that?)
JMGarciaJr
Neil noted:
<<It (Latin pronounciation) depends on where you learn your Latin, or at least
it used to.>>
All else being equal (ceteris paribus), I'd go with the Italianate
pronounciations. After all, they happen to own Rome, and I'd feel a perfect
ass telling them they are doing it wrong.
JMGarciaJr
Lady Bassett exasperatedly inquired:
<<What ARE they teaching them in school these days?>>
Your Ladyship makes the rather dangerous assumption "they" are actually being
taught something.
JMGarciaJr
The lovely and gracious Aurelia despondently noted:
<< Gussie and I are fairly close to the same vintage, and I can by no means
hic, haec, or hoc with any facility.>>
Pray, what vintage might that be? I'm a mere lad of barely 33 summers, and I
recall the diligence with which the Jesuits instilled The Mother of Languages
into our impressionable skulls. Comes in handy whene'er I'm monitoring the
strength of a sermon handicap candidate based on his concelebratory
performance at St. Peter's.
Kristine Fowler
Pongo wrote:
: And one must not forget "Semper ubi sub ubi."
Unfortunately, one has. If there's a good joke here, pray let us in on it.
Aurelia Cammarleigh
c/o fow...@math.umn.edu
Kristine Fowler
A Young Man In Spats (jmgar...@aol.com) wrote:
: The lovely and gracious Aurelia despondently noted:
: << Gussie and I are fairly close to the same vintage, and I can by no means
: hic, haec, or hoc with any facility.>>
: Pray, what vintage might that be? I'm a mere lad of barely 33 summers, and I
: recall the diligence with which the Jesuits instilled The Mother of Languages
: into our impressionable skulls.
Well, you've got a couple years on me (and I've got a few more on Gussie),
but those years appear to be a crucial dividing line. Before the
deprecated public high school, I went to the new style of Catholic school,
which not only had no Jesuits in evidence, but where the nuns didn't even
carry assault rulers. Without these strategic advantages, no doubt they
gave up as hopeless trying to make the little, er, scholars learn Latin.
Aurelia Cammarleigh
c/o fow...@math.umn.edu
Anne Cotton
Nope -- sorry. Latin and Italian are NOT the same -- if one means Latin
of the Caesars. Medieval Latin, now, that's another matter -- by then,
the Church was definitely using modified pronunciations very like medieval
Italian.
But the "w" sound for the initial v is APPARENTLY correct if one is
quoting Caesar (the Gaius Julius of that line). There is some discussion
about even that. And the third word would, according to teachers of
Ancient Latin, have been "VEEky." By the middle ages, of course,
"VEEtchy" would be the correct version; and the initial consonant would
be most definitely the "v" sound we all (except the Germans) know and
love.
Lady Bassett
Baselight
>Well, you've got a couple years on me (and I've got a few more on Gussie),
>but those years appear to be a crucial dividing line. Before the
>deprecated public high school, I went to the new style of Catholic school,
>which not only had no Jesuits in evidence, but where the nuns didn't even
>carry assault rulers. Without these strategic advantages, no doubt they
>gave up as hopeless trying to make the little, er, scholars learn Latin.
>
>Aurelia Cammarleigh
>c/o fow...@math.umn.edu
I also having 33 years, and not having been brought up by the Jesuits, and
having attended the American public school system, did not become acquainted
with idiom of Latin. Wasn't it Dan Quayle in his collosal gaffe that said of a
trip to Latin America that he "did not speak Latin"?
Adolphus Stiffham
Stow-on-the-Wold
Baselight
>Surely, milady, you jest: you forget "veni, vici, vidi", if those are
>the bally w. I want.
>
>http://www.cae.wisc.edu/~anand
And aren't we overlooking that great phrase from Metro-Goldwyn Mayer "Ars
gratia artis" (Art for the sake of art, which I have been told is improper
usage of Latin) or some derivation therein. Sorry, my memory is not serving me
this morning. Probably something in the fish soup at the Drones last night.
(Or perhaps in one of the seventeen cocktails.)
Adolphus Stiffham
Stow-on-the-Wold
Baselight
>let alone the absolutely sine qua non: "amo, amas, amat, amamus, amatis,
>amant."
How about this one: "Quod erat demonstrandum"? Hey, isn't this fun?
Adolphus Stiffham
Stow-on-the-Wold
Jean Tillson
>And one must not forget "Semper ubi sub ubi."
Always wear under wear!
(Good one, Pongo!)
Yours ever,
Pighooey
Anne Cotton
Oh, no. I missed this one from Pongo; and I have an awful suspicion.
If memory has not completely deserted me (but occasionally she does go
for a very long stroll), "semper ubi sub ubi" translates -- if that is
the word I want -- as "always where under where." Try slurring the
English pronunciation just a bit, and you get a neat nugget of the kind
of advice mothers generally give (is anyone but me old enough to recall
the maternal injunction always to have clean and undarned knickers on,
in case one were to be hit by a truck?)
Lady Bassett
M. Kelley
What HO!
Just in case anyone is dying to get in touch with Miss Postlethwaite or
Mr. Mulliner in the Bar Parlour, here's some contact info for our new
Washington State (Seattle Based) chapter:
And for anyone out there lurking within reach of Seattle on Saturday
evening, November 15th, we'll be having our first ever official
meeting--complete with Wodehouse Playhouse videos--at 7pm. Please drop the
pres. or sec. a line if you're at all interested in attending!
The Angler's Rest (WA State, Seattle)
President and Founding Member:
Susan L. Collicott (Aunt Susan)
ca...@serv.net
Secretary and Founding Member:
Merideth L. Kelley (Lady Terry Cobbold)
mlke...@u.washington.edu
6706 20th Ave NW
Seattle, WA 98117
(206)781-5272
Ronnie Fish
Of course there is also
Sic Transit Gloria Mundi..whoever Gloria was I hope the trip didn't upset
her too much..or how about Alea Jacta Est (The DIe is Cast) for those Asterix
fans among you
Ronnie
--
Paranoid? Why do you ask?
Sweet Caroline
Sweet Caroline wrote:
>
> Ronnie Fish wrote:
> >
> > Of course there is also
> > Sic Transit Gloria Mundi..whoever Gloria was I hope the trip didn't upset
> > her too much..
>
I'm sorry, that should be "Gloria was ill on Monday, so we took her to
the doctor's."
Ranjit Narayanan
Charles Napier being the bloke in question, the headquarters incidentally
were actually in Calcutta. The story is a celebrated one, figuring in most
histories of the Raj, but is apparently apocryphal. Napier's actual
telegram from Sind (a province, not a town) was apparently terse, soldierly
and in English. But a wonderful anecdote nonetheless
JMGarciaJr wrote in message
<19971030141...@ladder02.news.aol.com>...
M. Kelley
On 31 Oct 1997, Tim Palmer wrote:
> In article <345629...@NOSPAMhOtmail.coM>, cste...@NOSPAMhOtmail.coM
> says...
>
> >One of these days I'll learn the Latin phrase for Purple Furry Wombat,
> >then watch out!
> >
> >Lady Caroline
>
> Would that be Vombatus porphyrotrichus, M'lady?
>
> Sir Gregory Parsloe Parsloe, Bart
(Draped over my desk, LOL)
Welcome back, Sir Parsley!
The Celtic vastness appears to be doing you no end of good. Have you
rehydrated (or re-ethanoldrated) yet? May I stand you a (virtual) pint?
BTW, could you elaborate as to which part of the Celtic vastness you
inhabit? I know two emigrees from the C. v.--both from The Valleys.
Pip pip, Bottoms up!
Lady Terry
Sweet Caroline
Buffy Struggles wrote:
>
> Not to mention, Cogito ergo sum. Which I believe can be extended to Cogito
> cogito, ergo cogito sum. Which would be quite appropriate for my existence
> in the ether...
Shouldn't we extend that to Cogito cogito, ergo cogito sum...cogito.
I think I think, therefore I think I am...I think.
Lady Caroline
Yardley-in-the-Sticks
Sweet Caroline
Ronnie Fish wrote:
>
> Of course there is also
> Sic Transit Gloria Mundi..whoever Gloria was I hope the trip didn't upset
> fans among you
Translates as "Gloria Monday was ill, so we took her to the doctor's"?
<G>
Let the tossing of breadrolls begin.
Lady Caroline
Lindsay Fairhurst
On 31 Oct 1997, Buffy Struggles wrote:
> sha...@noSpam.com spake thusly:
> : And one must not forget "Semper ubi sub ubi."
> :
> : Pongo.
>
> Not to mention, Cogito ergo sum. Which I believe can be extended to Cogito
> cogito, ergo cogito sum. Which would be quite appropriate for my existence
> in the ether...
>
> Buffy.
>
Or for Dr. Seuss fans:
Cogito ergo sam.
Sam I am (I think).
Lindsay
Buffy Struggles
DronesClub
>Lady Bassett writes:
>Which reminds me of the story of Winston Churchill, when set to memorize
>the first declension. He got to the vocative case, and asked what it
>meant; the master replied, "O table." Churchill was puzzled still, so
>the master explained, "You would use it in speaking to a table."
>Churchill (very young) replied, "But sir, I never do!"
It is always nice to see Wodehouse & Winston together. Lady Bassett has
stumbled on to (onto?) my favorite topics. Now, if she can only manage to
blend Gilbert & Sullivan into the mix, it would be a "joy, a rapture
unforeseen. The clouded skies are now serene," etc etc etc.
However, if I may cut to the res: In the above anecdote, if I recall, Winston
was soundly thrashed for his impertinence by a cane which biteth like a
serpent and stingeth like an adder. One thinks he may have served a spell at
Malvern Hose, Bramley-on-Sea, the preparatory school conducted by that prince
of stinkers, the Rev. Aubrey Upjohn, MA.
I mean to say, dash it, and all that kind of rot.
the Duke of Dunstable
da...@no.spam.leeds.ac.uk
> Along the same lines, comedian Buddy Hacket had a bit in one of his
> standup routines where the Pope tells Hacket "Abscondo Obeseroi
> illegetimo", translated as "Get out of here, you fat bastard".
a.f.w occasionally ask for other authors and works that they might
like to read. A recent programme on Sunday afternoon television did a
survey on favourite books for children reminding me that one of mine
was "Moonfleet" by Meade Faulkner. In it there is quoted a curse, said
to be many times more powerful in Latin than when Englished, which
went, E&OE:
Abite me ad ignem infernam qui paratus est
per diablo et omnes opera.
Always useful to keep to hand; I am sure that I need not
construe.
Moonfleet is a real place and its geography is very well described
in Leslie Thomas's book "Secret England". (An author of considerable
talent, but one unlikely to be in the purview of a.f.w.).
Ben.
da...@no.spam.leeds.ac.uk
> 2) Agressi sunt mare tenebrarum quid in eo esset exploraturi: T
[ snip ]
Or, as an alternative, one could essay something along the lines of
"they explored the price of the wild dark female horse" -- ???
"They are looking for a wild dark filly at a fair price"
Ben.
Richard Herring
In article <3459e...@nap.mtholyoke.edu>, Anne Cotton
<aco...@mtholyoke.edu> wrote
>But the "w" sound for the initial v is APPARENTLY correct if one is
>quoting Caesar (the Gaius Julius of that line). There is some discussion
>about even that.
Well, IANAP[*] but I believe strictly it's neither, as it's a voiced
bilabial fricative, whereas the /v/ (and maybe /w/) sounds in English
are usually labiodental fricatives.
Translation: if you say "v" you would in English, you'll probably find
that the lower lip is somewhere behind the top teeth. Push it forward as
if whistling, and you'll get something closer to the Ciceronian Latin
sound. Or indeed the noise made by Sam [WV]eller in the Pickwick Papers.
Amazing what one learns from editing the Saturday Review.
[*] I am not a phonologist, nor a phoneticist.
--
Reggie "Kipper" Herring <ric...@clupeid.demon.co.uk>
sha...@nospam.com
In article <19971030141...@ladder02.news.aol.com>,> goes, ... to quell said rebellion in a town called "Sindh" ...
>Headquarters in London (or Bombay, one forgets these things) waited anxiously,
> fearing the very worst. A few tense days later they receive a telegram from
> this very soldier with only one word on it. "Peccavi".
*Groan*! Multilingual puns are the worst!
(Sind, or Sindh, is a region, not a town; now part of Pakistan.)
Pongo.
JMGarciaJr
Aurelia Cammarleigh lamented:
<<Before the deprecated public high school, I went to the new style of Catholic
school, which not only had no Jesuits in evidence, but where the nuns didn't
even carry assault rulers. Without these strategic advantages, no doubt they
gave up as hopeless trying to make the little, er, scholars learn Latin. >>
I rather fear the general attitude may have been that Latin
was--gasp!--useless. I am fortunate to be not only the last of the "boomers"
(ugh) but more specifically to have attended a school run by the most
hidebound and reactionary of the various orders available to His Holiness.
A Young Man In Spats
The Breyers Traitor
fmr...@ma.ultranet.com (Jean Tillson), in article <63anit$hcf$1...@decius.ultra.net>, dixit:
>Gussie wrote:
>>Hmmm... veni, vidi, vici.
>>I believe it means - 'I came. I saw. I staggered for a moment, then,
>>composing myself with great swiftness, called for Jeeves and left the
>>matter entirely in his hands.
>Good one, Gussie, but here's the real poser: How do you
>pronounce it? I have a real, old-fashioned classics
>professor this semester and we were discssing Suetonius'
>biography of Julius Caesar the other day and she pronounced
>the phrase thusly:
>way-nee, wee-dee, wee-key
>I mean to say, what? I wouldn't dare to question her on it,
>either; the old girl reads the ancients in their original
>form be it Latin, Greek or what have you, so there. So what
>is the deal with the letter "v" in Latin - sometimes it's
>a hard "v" and sometimes it's a "w"?
Church (Medieval) vs. Ancient. Always gave our choirmaster fits when
we SPQR types would join in, 'v'-ing hither and yon where everyone
else was 'w'-ing away. Some vowel changes as well, but I could never
remember them accurately. (More fits ensued, predictably.)
--
____
Piglet \bi/ http://piglet.org/momentum
pig...@piglet.org \/ Now launching.... Momentum! (for metrical poetry)
Anne Cotton
I canNOT let this thread die without a small anecdote from my "real"
(i.e,, non-Wodehousian) life, wherein I find myself toiling as a college
registrar -- "elite" Eastern women's college at that (name withheld to
protect the innocent). I had a call this summer from both of a pair of
irate parents, inquiring just when they were going to receive their
daughter's "real" diploma (she graduated last May). All they had was
"this thing in French that no one could read." (Our diplomas are of
course printed in Latin. And yes, it was the real diploma that they held
in their hands as they raved at me.)
Lady Bassett
Neil Midkiff
In article <345f2...@nap.mtholyoke.edu> aco...@mtholyoke.edu
(Anne Cotton) writes:
:I canNOT let this thread die without a small anecdote from my "real"
:(i.e,, non-Wodehousian) life, wherein I find myself toiling as a college
:registrar -- "elite" Eastern women's college at that (name withheld to
:protect the innocent).
Well, if you really want to withhold the name, you'll have to have
your account at somewhere besides mtholyoke.edu.
[Amusing story of diploma in Latin followed here.]
My favorite fool-the-parents story involving Latin was told me by a
Princeton graduate - this would have happened in the late 1970s.
It was the custom for one of the seniors who addressed the class at
graduation (I'm not sure whether the valedictorian or salutatorian) to
give the speech in Latin. Apparently the commencement programs handed
out to the parents and public were different from the ones held by the
students. The text of the speech, in Latin only, was printed in the
public programs. The students had the Latin text with an interlinear
English translation and "stage directions" such as [Applause] or
[Laughter], so that the parents could be suitably impressed that their
young ones had received the benefits of a classical education.
-Neil Midkiff
HoodArnold
Lady Caroline wrote:
>The old schoolmasters, on the whole, would never
>teach us amusing but nearly useless phrases such as already discussed.
>(My A.M. didn't even offer Latin; whatever small amount I know has been
>picked up on the 'net and from "Latin for Even More Occasions".
True, true. I didn't get the chance to take any Latin until after college
graduation when my better half was doing his graduate work. A helpful P-Chem
(physical chemistry) professor offered this amusing phrase which he may have
made up himself:
Semper ubi sub ubi
Which, when translated, gives us "Always where under where." (Think about it a
little.) No doubt it is self-evident why he was a p-chem instructor rather
than a classical language prof.
Ta,
Pauline Stoker
Bianchi
I don't get it. LC
DGoldth
Hello, all,
LC penned:
>I don't get it. LC
In response to:
>A few tense days later they receive a telegram from
>>> this very soldier with only one word on it. "Peccavi".
>>
>>*Groan*! Multilingual puns are the worst!
>>
>>(Sind, or Sindh, is a region, not a town; now part of >Pakistan.)
"Peccavi" is Latin for "We have sinned."....
NOW, you can groan with the rest of us...
DonnaG
DGo...@aol.com
TimeLady
HoodArnold wrote:
>
> True, true. I didn't get the chance to take any Latin until after college
> graduation when my better half was doing his graduate work. A helpful P-Chem
> (physical chemistry) professor offered this amusing phrase which he may have
> made up himself:
>
> Semper ubi sub ubi
>
> Which, when translated, gives us "Always where under where." (Think about it a
> little.) No doubt it is self-evident why he was a p-chem instructor rather
> than a classical language prof.
An amusing phrase indeed, which I have duly passed on. Unfortunately, my
chem teacher never taught us anything amusing beyond "If it's green,
it's biology; If it stinks, it's chemistry; If it doesn't work, it's
physics." Useful bit of knowledge, that, if not terribly Latin...
Lady Caroline
Yardley-in-the-Sticks
--
| q qq-- | Cross every i and dot every t. |
| qqq q | We're nothing if not thorough. |
| qqq | |
|_______http://www.voicenet.com/~steinfor/carohome.htm__________|
Green Swizzle
TimeLady <cste...@NOSPAMhOtmail.coM> writes:
>An amusing phrase indeed, which I have duly passed on. Unfortunately, my
>chem teacher never taught us anything amusing beyond "If it's green,
>it's biology; If it stinks, it's chemistry; If it doesn't work, it's
>physics." Useful bit of knowledge, that, if not terribly Latin...
Reminds me of a modestly-amusing joke, stop me if I've told this to you before.
Three engineers are in a car which, unaccounably stalls and won't restart.
The mechanical engineer says, "Could be that the driveshaft has seized.
Better get towed to a garage where we could replace it."
The electrical engineer says, "Could be the ignition system. Why don't we pop
open the hood, check the timing and replace the spark plugs."
The computer systems engineer says, "Hey, I have an idea. Why don't we all
just get out, shut the doors, open them again, climb back in and maybe it'll
start this time."
Okay, so this joke is not a zany laugh-riot, but depending on what your
computer has done to you today, it can seem a little funny, if it weren't
so close to the truth....
Green Swizzle
Rev. F. Heppenstall
In article <346099...@NOSPAMhOtmail.coM>, TimeLady
<cste...@NOSPAMhOtmail.coM> preaches
>An amusing phrase indeed, which I have duly passed on. Unfortunately, my
>chem teacher never taught us anything amusing beyond "If it's green,
>it's biology; If it stinks, it's chemistry; If it doesn't work, it's
>physics." Useful bit of knowledge, that, if not terribly Latin...
And if it works to within 10% of specification, it's engineering.
--
Reverend Francis Heppenstall, The Rectory, Twing, Glos.
(c/o Keith Willoughby)
TimeLady
Green Swizzle wrote:
>
> Reminds me of a modestly-amusing joke, stop me if I've told this to you before.
>
> Three engineers are in a car which, unaccounably stalls and won't restart.
> The mechanical engineer says, "Could be that the driveshaft has seized.
> Better get towed to a garage where we could replace it."
> The electrical engineer says, "Could be the ignition system. Why don't we pop
> open the hood, check the timing and replace the spark plugs."
> The computer systems engineer says, "Hey, I have an idea. Why don't we all
> just get out, shut the doors, open them again, climb back in and maybe it'll
> start this time."
>
> Okay, so this joke is not a zany laugh-riot, but depending on what your
> computer has done to you today, it can seem a little funny, if it weren't
> so close to the truth....
Tickled the funny bone properly, G.S., that is to say, I liked it.
Considering that I live in the same house as one electrial / mechanical
engineer and one computer engineer (well, ok, he's a programmer, but
close enough), and several computers... I believe the facts have spoken.
Annette Brougham
--
| q qq-- | Cross every i and dot every t. |
| qqq q | We're nothing if not thorough. |
| qqq | |
|______<http://www.voicenet.com/~steinfor/carohome.htm>_________|
Richard Herring
In article <G1qWCHAx...@cowtown.demon.co.uk>, "Rev. F. Heppenstall"
<heppe...@cowtown.demon.co.uk> wrote
>
>And if it works to within 10% of specification, it's engineering.
>
*decibels* [1] and spot on if within 3.
[1] for the non-RE reader, this means between -90% and +900%.
TimeLady
Edwin Meier wrote:
>
> Green Swizzle (john...@xpam.Carleton.CA) wrote:
>
> : Three engineers are in a car which, unaccounably stalls and won't restart.
> : The mechanical engineer says, "Could be that the driveshaft has seized.
> : Better get towed to a garage where we could replace it."
> : The electrical engineer says, "Could be the ignition system. Why don't we pop
> : open the hood, check the timing and replace the spark plugs."
> : The computer systems engineer says, "Hey, I have an idea. Why don't we all
> : just get out, shut the doors, open them again, climb back in and maybe it'll
> : start this time."
I mean to say, G.S., I ran said joke by the elec/mech. engineer and
comp. programmer in my household last night. Of the comp. prog., to
borrow a phrase from Plum, "He spoke with a certain what-is-it in his
voice, and I could tell that, if not actually disgruntled, he was far
from being gruntled." (Then again, he is my brother, so perhaps that may
explain it.) But the elec/mech e. laughed heartily at both this and the
10%-of-specification wittiness. My thanks.
Also to Young Edwin for the following version, with which I will regale
them next.
> There's an engineer, an electrician and an computer programmer in a
> car and as the car is headed downhill the brakes fail. After
> a hair-raising ride running over bushes and turning the car sideways
> they finally bring it to a stop.
> The engineer says ... The electrician says... And the computer
> programmer says, "First, we need to try it again."
Ta,
Annette Brougham
(formerly Lady Caroline)
Keith Ingram
> Donna G said:
>
> "Peccavi" is Latin for "We have sinned."....
>
> NOW, you can groan with the rest of us...
Thanks to Donna and the cove with the nerve (which I lacked) to admit
ignorance before all.
Judelon Ingram
Bill Cleere
Richard Herring wrote:
>
> In article <346A64...@best.com>, Bill Cleere <rcl...@best.com>
> wrote
> >Now, my Latin's awfully poor, and I certainly wouldn't want to
> >give any impression otherwise. I happen to remember "peccavi"
> >particularly well because of a story I heard frightfully many
> >years ago:
>
> I think you should have thrown in a "stop me if you've heard one"
> somewhere in the above - since this entire thread started with precisely
> that story.
I should indeed think that, had the beginning of the thread
still been on my server when I happened upon it, I should
no doubt have done that. Sorry to have been a bore.
-- Claude N. Eustace
Augustus Fink-Nottle
>Richard Herring wrote:
>I should indeed think that, had the beginning of the thread
>still been on my server when I happened upon it, I should
>no doubt have done that. Sorry to have been a bore.
> -- Claude N. Eustace
Don't lose sleep over it, old boy. The person who ought to lose sleep
is the next chump to come along with the same story. Just as during
repeat performances of Sonny Boy, we merely look at each other, trading
vexed glances and perhaps a murmur when the performance is repeated twice.
It's only during the third performance that the tomatoes get airborne.
I wonder if this isn't one of Jeeves schemes...
chin chin,
Gussie
Jean Tillson
Green Swizzle wrote:
>By the way, that "always wear under wear" wheeze came in handy in a staff
>meeting the other day - someone was trying to impress the group with having
>once studied Latin, and I was able to spoil her little joke in a bored tone,
>as if translating off-colour Latin puns was a trivial matter, almost beneath
>my contempt.
Hee hee! And they say Latin has no usefulness in today's
society. Bravo, Green Swizzle. I, too, put the recent
discussion of Latin to good use by pasting all of the messages
into a quasi-coherent whole and presenting it to my classics
Prof (she of the "weni widi wici" pronunciation) who got a
good chuckle out of it all (bless her heart).
Yours ever,
Pighooey
TimeLady
Jean Tillson wrote:
>
> Green Swizzle wrote:
>
> >By the way, that "always wear under wear" wheeze came in handy in a staff
> >meeting the other day - someone was trying to impress the group with having
> >once studied Latin, and I was able to spoil her little joke in a bored tone,
> >as if translating off-colour Latin puns was a trivial matter, almost beneath
> >my contempt.
Lovely!
> Hee hee! And they say Latin has no usefulness in today's
> society. Bravo, Green Swizzle. I, too, put the recent
> discussion of Latin to good use by pasting all of the messages
> into a quasi-coherent whole and presenting it to my classics
> Prof (she of the "weni widi wici" pronunciation) who got a
> good chuckle out of it all (bless her heart).
>
> Yours ever,
> Pighooey
I say, Pighooey, that sounds topping, and I'd be most interested in a
copy of that if you happen to have it available. You can send it to
cste...@hotmail.com, or if a sufficient number of the denizens of
a.f.w are interested, you could post it.
Thanks ever so much,
Annette Brougham
Jim Skrydlak
Green Swizzle Wooster wrote:
> I don't know, I had entirely forgotten how the thread started, and thought the
> "peccavi" story dashed interesting. This suggests that the whole thread could
> work its way around again, and everything would seem new. There is a certain
> comfort in the majestic symmetry of it all. But, incidentially, I don't see
> how the story proves that the correct phrase is "I have sinned", the
> commander's message could have just as easily read "We have Sindh."
The story doesn't prove it. The rules of Latin verb conjugation,
though,
are that the first person plural ends in "mus" for an active verb.
Ern
HoodArnold
Claunde N. Eustace wrote:
>I should indeed think that, had the beginning of the thread
>still been on my server when I happened upon it, I should
>no doubt have done that. Sorry to have been a bore.
Not at all, old thing. I bunged in the "semper ubi sub ubi" wheeze one night,
thinking no one had ever heard of it, and imagine my chagrin when the next
seven messages were all about it. Tried desperately to unsend, but it was
impossible.
Ta,
Pauline Stoker
E. Gospodinoff
I say, this reminds me of a dashed amusing telegram story. Stop
me if you've heard it...
Resplendent,
E. Gospodinoff
(scu...@dreamscape.com)
Bill Cleere
"Peccavi..." "Peccavi..."
No, doesn't seem to ring a bell, old thing.
-- Claude N. Eustace