Quenya - Finnish wordlist (part 1)

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Ahma

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Jun 12, 2000, 3:00:00 AM6/12/00
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Here it is, then, as I promised, the great list of Quenya words that
are also Finnish words (or closely resemble them)

I made this list based on the Quenya Lexicon Index <
http://www.uib.no/People/hnohf/qlindex2.htm > and later I added a few
words from Quenya Corpus Wordlist at Ardalambion
< http://www.uib.no/People/hnohf/qlist.htm > (you can look for some
of the Quenya translations there). Because of the original source,
the list contains a lot of words from primitive forms of Quenya that
either were changed or abandoned before the "final" mature Quenya.
I've usually used the form that more closely resembles a Finnish
word.

When there are differences of a few letters between the Finnish and
Quenya word, I've used square brackets and written the Finnish
word(s) after the original one. Some such words are pronounced
identically but their difference is in spelling. I've mostly ignored
the meanings of the words (since these weren't apparent from the
original source), but when I added words from the Quenya Corpus
Wordlist, I noticed some uncanny similarities, and decided to add
them in this wordlist.

If a word is a name in Finnish, that is denoted by "(n)" after the
word. If the word is only used in some Finnish dialect, there is a
"(d)" marking after it.


QUENYA-FINNISH WORDLIST
***********************

Ahosta
Ai
Aika
Aimo (n)
Aina
[Aira = airo, kaira (Aira is also a name)]
[Aistale - kaistale]
Ala
Alas
[Alka - alku]
Alma (n)
(Amis = ammattikorkeakoulu)
[Amunta - ammunta]
[Ankar - ankara]
[Arma - armas, armo]
Anna
[Anta - antaa]
Anto
Anu (n)
[Aurinka - aurinko]
Auta
[Ava - avaa]

[Calma - kalma]
[Carmë - karmea]
[Certa - kerta]

En
[Elen - ellen, elelen]
Ere (n)
[Eru - ero]
Et
[Etta - että]

[Haca - haka]
Hara
Halla
[Harma - harmaa]
Helin (n g.)
[Helin - hellin]
Helka (n)
Hepin
[Heru=lord herra=lord]
Hilu
[Horma - horsma, horna]
Hui
[Huiva - huivi]
[Hulin - hulina]
[hunto - kunto]


[Ilke - ilkeä]
Ilma
Imi
[Ímen - imen, immen]
[Iska - iskä]
Itse

Kaima
[Kainusta - Kainuusta]
Kaita
Kakin
Kala
Kalke
Kalle (n)
[Kalleva - kalteva]
Kalma
Kalmo
Kalpa
[Kalpe - kalpea]
Kalu
Kama
[Kamba - kampa]
Kamu
[Kankale - kankaalle]
Kangin
Kantele
Karin (n genetive)
[Karka - karkaa]
[Karkasse - karkas se]
[Karpan - kärpän]
[kasien - käsien]
[Kasta - kastaa, kaste]
[kastea - kostea]
Kate
Kauka
Kauko
[Kaure - kaura]
Kelta
[Kelu - keli]
Kemi
Kilin
[Kilinkele - kilinkello]
Kilkin
Kiltin
Kinkata
[Kirkis - kirkas]
Koi
[Koirea - korea]
[Koire - koira]
Koisiva
[koiva - koivu, kuiva]
[Kôlema - kuolema]
Kolme
Kolosta
[Kômea - komea]
Korin
Korina
[Korto - korte]
Kosima
Kosta
Kulu
Kuluin
Kuluina
Kulusta
Kuluva
Kumin
[Kumpo - kumpu]
Kuru
[Kûva - kuva]

[Lahta - lahti]
Laite
Laita
[Laito - laiton]
Lama
Lanta
Lapa
Lasse (n)
Lassi (n)
Latta
[Latwa - latva]
[Laule - laulu]
[Laulema - laulelma]
[Laume - lauma]
Lava
[Laute - laude]
[Lehe]
[Leminkainen - Lemminkäinen]
[Lempea - lempeä]
[Lenk - lenkki]
[Lepsa - lepsu]
Lese
[Leuke, leuca - leuka]
Lie
[Lint - lintu]
Liri
[Listea]
-lle
[Loime - loimi]
Loimea
Loista
[Loico - loikoa]
[Lokse - luokse]
Lopeta
[Losse - lossi]
[Lotisse - lotisee]
Luin
Luina
[Lûme - lume, lumi]
[Lûmen - lumen]
[Lunda - lunta]

[Máhan - maha, mahan]
[Maka - makaa]
[Makka - makkara]
Maksa
Maksella
Malka
Mana
Mara (n)
Marilla, Marin, Marina, Marinne (n)
Marto
Masto
[Matu - mato]
Melko
Me [=us in quenya, we in Finnish]
[Minu - minun, minä]
[Metta - Mettä]
[Minya - miniä]
Mitta
[Mulda - multa]
Muru
Mut

Nai
Naira (d)
Nalle
[Napsa - napsaa]
Nasta
Nauta
[Nelma - unelma]
[Nesta - neste]
[Nielikki - Mielikki]
[Nissi = woman - tissi = a breast]
Nolo
Nosta
Nuo
[Nuóra - nuora]
[Nuste - muste]
[Nurru = murmur, grumble - nurina = grumble]

Ohta
Olli (n)
Oksa
Ole
Olet
Oma
[ómainen - omainen]
[Omotunto - omatunto]
[Ompa - onpa]
On
[Ondo - ontto]
[Orya - orja]
Osta
Osto
Otso
Otsola
Otoke

[Paimene - paimen]
Paimenesta
Palava
Palan
Palas (d)
[Palasse - palas se]
[Palasya - palasia]
Palo
[Paluva - palava]
Panin
Panna
Pano
Panta
Pata
[Patinka - patikka]
Pelin
Pelko
Pelle
Pelto
[Perma - permanto]
Pieksin
[Pili - pilli]
[Pilu - pillu]
Piri
Piukka
Poika
[Poime - poimi]
[Polenta - poljento, poljenta]
Potsi
[Pulme - pulma]
[Polu - polku]
[Pulka - pulkka]
Puru
Pusulta

Ranta
[Rauke - raukea]
Rauta
[Raumo - rauma]
[Rimu - riimu]
[Rista - riista]
Rokko
Rotta
[Rúma - ruma]

Saita
[Salme - salmi, salmen]
Salpa
Sampo
Sanka
Santa
Sara
[Sarma - särmä]
[Saune - sauna]
[Selka - selkä]
Sen
[Sestaine - seesteinen]
[Silma - silmä]
Sie (d)
[Sile - sileä]
[Silma - silmä]
[Silmarilli - Silmärilli]
[Silmo - silmu]
[Siloine - siloinen]
Silta
[Simen - siemen]
Sisin
Soile (n)
[Sôma - soma]
[Sôra - sora]
[Sorta - sortaa]
Sorto
Sovasta (d)
Sulka
[Súlimë - sulimme]
[Súma - suma]

[Taime - taimen]
Taina (n)
Tana
Taka
[Talwi - talvi]
[Talta - taltta]
[Tarka - tarkka]
Taru
[Tarwe - tarve]
Tauno (n)
Tavasta
Te [quenya=them - Finnish=you]
[Tehta - tehdä, tehtävä]
[Teltasse - teltassa]
[Téra - terä]
[Tereva - terävä]
Tie
Toi
Tontilla
[Tul = come - Tulla (tule) = come]
Tunto
Tupin
[Turinoite - turinoita]
[Turwa - turva]

Ui
Uin
Ukko
[Ulku - ulko]
[Urna - uurna]

Vai
Vaimo
Vala
Valimo
Vaino
[Vakko - vako]
Valkea
Valon
Valta
Vana
Vara
[Vaska - vaski]
Vása
Vasta
Vastan
Vene
Veri
[Veru - vero]
[Víka - vika]
[Víkana - vikana]
[Vilya - vilja]
Vitsi
Voro

[Yalka - jalka]
[Yó - yö]
[Yulma - julma]


***
That's it for now. As soon as I get some order to my Nearly Quenya-
Finnish wordlist (that would be the part 2), I'll post it too.
Meanwhile I urge all lyrically inclined members of the group to
create Elvish poetry using (only) the words found in this list. Never
mind the meanings or grammar, just be creative :) I promise to give
word for word translations for such poems (which should prove both
silly and entertaining).


--
Ahma
"Taksin katolla vilkkuu
yön ainoa valopilkku."

Tamim

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Jun 12, 2000, 3:00:00 AM6/12/00
to
Ahma wrote:
>
> Here it is, then, as I promised, the great list of Quenya words that
> are also Finnish words (or closely resemble them)
>
>

You should send this also to finet.harrastus.tolkien.
BTW I doubt that tolkien knew what amis means.
Apparently you don't either: not many students in the various
ammattikorkeakoulut
would like to be called amisjätkä or amislainen. I of course can't stand
the whole concept of ammattikorkeakoulu: Amis would indeed be the proper
term for them ;)


Tamim

Ahma

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Jun 12, 2000, 3:00:00 AM6/12/00
to
Ummet lammet laverteli Tamim:

>Apparently you don't either: not many students in the various
>ammattikorkeakoulut
>would like to be called amisjätkä or amislainen. I of course can't
>stand the whole concept of ammattikorkeakoulu: Amis would indeed
>be the proper term for them ;)

Whoops! My bad. I did mean to write ammattioppimiskeskus or whatever
amis´s are called these days, but couldn't figure what the correct
term was and got cofnused. Besides if I had really meant to write
ammattikorkeakoulu instead of ammattikoulu, I would have been
insulting myself too! So, why do you mock my intellect, you insidious
troll you? I'm only part elvish, you know! ;)


--
Ahma


Morgil

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Jun 12, 2000, 3:00:00 AM6/12/00
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Ahma kirjoitti viestissä <8F51E3A71...@195.197.108.44>...

>Here it is, then, as I promised, the great list of Quenya words that
>are also Finnish words (or closely resemble them)

Great list indeed! But in some points there seems to be other
choises, maybe more suitable.

>[Iska - iskä] or isku

>[Laute - laude] or lauta

>[Loime - loimi] or loimu

>[Nissi = woman - tissi = a breast] ( Shame on you! :) ) why not Nisse or
Nissi-nen.

>[Perma - permanto] or perna

>[Rista - riista] or risti
>
>[Taime - taimen] or taimi

>[Vakko - vako] or vakka

Morgil

Ahma

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Jun 13, 2000, 3:00:00 AM6/13/00
to
Ummet lammet laverteli Morgil:

>Great list indeed! But in some points there seems to be other
>choises, maybe more suitable.

I don't know if they're more suitable, but certainly as suitable as
mine. I'll be adding these to the list if you don't mind.

<snippedy>

>>[Nissi = woman - tissi = a breast]

>( Shame on you! :) ) why not
>Nisse or Nissi-nen.

Shame on me? For what? I was just pointing out that there is both
similarity in words and meanings, bridging the gap between Quenya and
Fennya :) And pardon my ignorance, but I didn't know "nisse" is a
Finnish word, but I did find out there is a Finnish word "niisi",
although I have no idea what it means.


Thanks for the additions :)

--
Ahma

Tamim

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Jun 13, 2000, 3:00:00 AM6/13/00
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Ahma <ekro...@fastermail.com> wrote:
> Ummet lammet laverteli Morgil:

>>Great list indeed! But in some points there seems to be other
>>choises, maybe more suitable.

> I don't know if they're more suitable, but certainly as suitable as
> mine. I'll be adding these to the list if you don't mind.

> <snippedy>

>>>[Nissi = woman - tissi = a breast]

>>( Shame on you! :) ) why not
>>Nisse or Nissi-nen.

> Shame on me? For what? I was just pointing out that there is both
> similarity in words and meanings, bridging the gap between Quenya and
> Fennya :) And pardon my ignorance, but I didn't know "nisse" is a
> Finnish word, but I did find out there is a Finnish word "niisi",
> although I have no idea what it means.


> Thanks for the additions :)

> --
> Ahma

Nisse is a name.


Ahma

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Jun 13, 2000, 3:00:00 AM6/13/00
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Ummet lammet laverteli Tamim:

>
>Nisse is a name.

Yes, but is it really a Finnish name? It sounds awfully Swedish to me.

--
Ahma

Tamim

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Jun 13, 2000, 3:00:00 AM6/13/00
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True, I know one Nisse, and his real name is Nils-Erik

Morgil

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Jun 13, 2000, 3:00:00 AM6/13/00
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Tamim kirjoitti viestissä <8i5457$6us$1...@oravannahka.helsinki.fi>...

>Nisse is a name.
>
"Nisse-polkka" a funny Christmas-song.
"Nisse Naskali" a nice little children´s book.

Morgil

Juho P. Pahajoki

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Jun 18, 2000, 3:00:00 AM6/18/00
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Se oli Ahma joka näin lausui, noin nimesi:
>When there are differences of a few letters between the Finnish and
>Quenya word, I've used square brackets and written the Finnish
>word(s) after the original one.

Interesting list certainly, but I'm not quite sure what it proves,
except that Finnish and Quenya have somewhat same looking (& sounding)
words.

Of course the fact that Quenya hasn't got any ä, ö or y (is the
term front vowels in English?) makes the same sounding words, be they
direct loans or otherwise - a bit different from their supposed Finnish
counterparts.

>original source), but when I added words from the Quenya Corpus
>Wordlist, I noticed some uncanny similarities, and decided to add
>them in this wordlist.

Yes, when I was reading through the etymologies I noticed some, were
exactly the same words or roughly the same.

>[Yó - yö]

This ain't even close, compare yoo (or joo) and yö. Joo OTOH is quite
normal Finnish word.

>That's it for now. As soon as I get some order to my Nearly Quenya-
>Finnish wordlist (that would be the part 2), I'll post it too.

What do you mean Nearly Quenya-Finnish? That it will judge the words
by their meanings? I'd be interested - I thought of making one myself,
but if you're already done the work then I guess I don't have to.

>Meanwhile I urge all lyrically inclined members of the group to
>create Elvish poetry using (only) the words found in this list. Never
>mind the meanings or grammar, just be creative :) I promise to give
>word for word translations for such poems (which should prove both
>silly and entertaining).

--
"In my experience, this is the ultimate problem with Open Source
development: not enough formal engaged testing. Developers want to write
code, they don't want to solve all the niggling little problems that users
come up with." -- Andrew Shuman

Ahma

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Jun 18, 2000, 3:00:00 AM6/18/00
to
Ummet lammet laverteli Juho P. Pahajoki:

>Interesting list certainly, but I'm not quite sure what it proves,
>except that Finnish and Quenya have somewhat same looking (&
>sounding) words.

I'm not sure it should prove anything. I did it out of curiosity and
for fun. And because I wanted make elvish-sounding poems for certain
purposes (but I guess that would fall under "for fun").


>What do you mean Nearly Quenya-Finnish? That it will judge the
>words by their meanings? I'd be interested - I thought of making
>one myself, but if you're already done the work then I guess I
>don't have to.

No, I'm afraid it's not. Sorry to disappoint you. On second thought,
let's forget the second part. It's a silly list anyway.


--
Ahma

Öjevind Lång

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Jun 18, 2000, 3:00:00 AM6/18/00
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Juho P. Pahajoki hath written:

[snip]

>Of course the fact that Quenya hasn't got any ä, ö or y (is the
>term front vowels in English?) makes the same sounding words, be they
>direct loans or otherwise - a bit different from their supposed Finnish
>counterparts.

Quenya had the ä, surely? As in Eärendil and Eärnur, for example.

Öjevind

Who was that trouserless Orc?

Mika-Petri Lauronen

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Jun 19, 2000, 3:00:00 AM6/19/00
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On Sun, 18 Jun 2000 21:23:24 +0200, "Öjevind Lång"
<ojevin...@swipnet.se> wrote:

>Juho P. Pahajoki hath written:
>
>[snip]
>
>>Of course the fact that Quenya hasn't got any ä, ö or y (is the
>>term front vowels in English?) makes the same sounding words, be they
>>direct loans or otherwise - a bit different from their supposed Finnish
>>counterparts.
>
>Quenya had the ä, surely? As in Eärendil and Eärnur, for example.
>

No, in Quenya the umlaut means that the vowel belongs to a different
syllable than the previous syllable, so. Eärendil is spelled E-arendil
and Eärnur is spelled E-arnur.

In Finnish, however, 'ä' and 'ö' are frontal wovels that sound
different from 'a' and 'o'. You probably know that, I suppose?

To those who don't:
'ä' sounds like 'a' in 'man'
'ö' sounds like 'er' in 'never'

Mixu Lauronen
A Finn and proud of it


"To see a World in a Grain of Sand / And a Heaven in a Wild Flower,
Hold Infinity in the palm of your hand / And Eternity in an hour"
-- William Blake --

Juho P. Pahajoki

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Jun 19, 2000, 3:00:00 AM6/19/00
to
Se oli Öjevind Lång joka näin lausui, noin nimesi:
>Juho P. Pahajoki hath written:
>>Of course the fact that Quenya hasn't got any ä, ö or y (is the
>>term front vowels in English?) makes the same sounding words, be they
>>direct loans or otherwise - a bit different from their supposed Finnish
>>counterparts.
>
>Quenya had the ä, surely? As in Eärendil and Eärnur, for example.

*Hrmm*, no, it didn't actually. Somebody hasn't been reading the
Appendix E well.

I've only got my Finnish version, so I'll translate (poorly):
In Quenya /ui, oi/ and /iu, eu, au/ are diphthongs (i.e they are
voiced(?) in the same syllable). All the other pairs of vowels belong
to different syllables. This is often marked with diaresis ëa, ëo, oë.
/A with diaresis/ must not be mixed up with the Finnish sound ä, which
does not occur in the elven languages.

Hmm, but this does mention the "Finnish sound ä", which makes me
wonder if the english appendix is different, and perhaps doesn't
mention it. In any case, no, Quenya doesn't have ä, it is a with
diaresis.

--
"Pyytäkää, niin teille annetaan. Etsikää, niin te löydätte. Kolkuttakaa,
niin teille avataan. Sillä jokainen pyytävä saa ja jokainen etsijä
löytää, ja jokaiselle, joka kolkuttaa, avataan."
-- Jeesus, "Evankeljumi Matteuksen mukaan"

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