[I] On my tod(d)?
Mark
Can anyone explain the origin of this phrase? It's common local slang
(at least in Nottingham, UK), to say that you are 'on your sweeney' or
'on your tod(d)' - meaning on your own - and the obvious reference is
Sweeney Todd(sp?), the demon barber. So what's the reference to do with
being alone?
Whilst I'm on a local slang tip, has anyone heard of the word 'cob'
meaning bread roll? Not to mention our speciality, calling people
'duck'?
--
Mark
ppint.
- hi; in afparticle, <fImLMBA6...@msengland.demon.co.uk>,
ma...@msengland.demon.co.uk "Mark" sought enlightenment:
>
>Can anyone explain the origin of this phrase? It's common local slang
>(at least in Nottingham, UK), to say that you are 'on your sweeney' or
>'on your tod(d)' - meaning on your own - and the obvious reference is
>Sweeney Todd(sp?), the demon barber. So what's the reference to do with
>being alone?
- unless there is a rhyming slang reference here, that
"sweeney" may be a red herring, a later "backformation"
under his mistaken influence:
the word "tod" means "fox", particularly dog-fox, and is
of ancient, albeit unknown, origin; also "tod-fox": and
the male fox is well known for wandering around solo,
with mischief in mind...
it was once also a 28 lb measure of wool, from the east
frisian, "todde" = "bundle"]; also used for "bush", and
a pile or bale of leaves.
>
>Whilst I'm on a local slang tip,
- dialect, rather than slang...
>has anyone heard of the word 'cob' meaning bread roll?
- yes; it's common round these parts (lancashire and west-
morland); i don't recall seeing them in york, where the
bap was the commonest bread roll...
>Not to mention our speciality, calling people 'duck'?
>
>(mark)
>
- ? or "ducky", or "dsucks" ?
- i remember both these from the east end (of london)
in the late fifties & the sixties.
- love, ppint.
[to reply, please remove the "v" from the reply-to: line]
--
"The English country gentleman galloping after a fox -
the unspeakable in full pursuit of the uneatable."
_A Woman of No Importance_ - oscar wilde, 1893
Margaret Tarbet
In alt.fan.pratchett
on Sat, 27 Jun 1998 23:48:26 +0100,
Mark <ne...@msengland.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>Can anyone explain the origin of this phrase? It's common local slang
>(at least in Nottingham, UK), to say that you are 'on your sweeney' or
>'on your tod(d)' - meaning on your own - and the obvious reference is
>Sweeney Todd(sp?), the demon barber. So what's the reference to do with
>being alone?
Rhyming slang: Todd Malone
Sweeney being the same thing at one remove
(superencrypted, as it were :-)
---------------------------------------------------------------
Margaret Tarbet / tar...@swaa.com / Cambridge Massachusetts USA
---------------------------------------------------------------
"You can't trust folk songs. They always sneak up on you."
Granny Weatherwax, in _Witches Abroad_
Gid Holyoake
In article <899030...@i-m-t.demon.co.uk>, ppint. generously decided
to share with us:
> - hi; in afparticle, <fImLMBA6...@msengland.demon.co.uk>,
> ma...@msengland.demon.co.uk "Mark" sought enlightenment:
> >
> >Can anyone explain the origin of this phrase? It's common local slang
> >(at least in Nottingham, UK), to say that you are 'on your sweeney' or
> >'on your tod(d)' - meaning on your own - and the obvious reference is
> >Sweeney Todd(sp?), the demon barber. So what's the reference to do with
> >being alone?
>
> - unless there is a rhyming slang reference here, that
> "sweeney" may be a red herring, a later "backformation"
> under his mistaken influence:
Yup.. rhyming slang it is.. from Tod Sloane.. a 19th century jockey..
Tod Sloane = alone.....
Gid
--
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Guardian of the Sacred !!!!!'s , Defender of the Temple of AFPdoration
Click on http://www.netcomuk.co.uk/~gidnsuzi/ for The Irrelevant Page
Shaun Salter
"ppint." wrote in message <899030...@i-m-t.demon.co.uk>...
> - hi; in afparticle, <fImLMBA6...@msengland.demon.co.uk>,
> ma...@msengland.demon.co.uk "Mark" sought enlightenment:
>>
>>Can anyone explain the origin of this phrase? It's common local slang
>>Whilst I'm on a local slang tip,
"On your tod" is rhyming slang (I'm from Sarf Lundun, so I should know,
innit?)
In full it's, "On your Tod Sloane (own)" .........He was a jockey in the
last century ('Merkin I think) who won most of his many races from the
front.........hence the expression.
>
> - yes; it's common round these parts (Lancashire and west-
> morland); I don't recall seeing them in York, where the
> bap was the commonest bread roll...
They are small, round and get hard enough to pave roads: hence they named
them after cobblestones:
This is not true, but sounds true, hence it is true on a higher level.
The actual explanation is that cob is an archaic ugly-word, meaning
misshapen or out of proportion.
(Checking my facts, I've just discovered that "to Cob" means to thump on the
buttocks........ perhaps it was named after a particularly-well cleavaged
road-labourer while he was laying cobblestones)
Shaun "Not a lot of people know that" Salter
Mark
In article <899030...@i-m-t.demon.co.uk>, ppint. <vafppint@i-m-
t.demon.co.uk> writes
>>has anyone heard of the word 'cob' meaning bread roll?
>
> - yes; it's common round these parts (lancashire and west-
> bap was the commonest bread roll...
Which reminds me of another argument my friends and I had, which
essentially boiled down to whether a cob could only be called a cob if
it was 'crusty', and in this case a soft roll was called a bap.
Coincidentally, during this argument one of my friends mentioned another
particular name for a bread roll used in Yorkshire, though I can't
remember what it was now...
>>Not to mention our speciality, calling people 'duck'?
>>
>>(mark)
>>
> - ? or "ducky", or "dsucks" ?
>
> - i remember both these from the east end (of london)
> in the late fifties & the sixties.
Round our neck of the woods we associate it particularly with a town
called Ilkeston, the accent of it's locals being the butt of several
jokes. For example, an Ilkeston women called her vet from work about her
sick cat. "Is it a tom?" asked the vet. "Of course it is - I wouldn't
bring it with me to work, would I, duck."
> - love, ppint.
> [to reply, please remove the "v" from the reply-to: line]
Thanks for answering.
--
Mark
Mike Putnam
On Sun, 28 Jun 1998 20:47:52 +0100, Mark <ne...@msengland.demon.co.uk>
wrote:
<snip query about Cob as a bready word>
>Which reminds me of another argument my friends and I had, which
>essentially boiled down to whether a cob could only be called a cob if
>it was 'crusty', and in this case a soft roll was called a bap.
I went to Loughborough Uni, near Nottingham, a decade or two (and a
half, maybe) ago and Cob was our word for any round bread roll used in
sandwich mode. Mind you, I don't recall being served any completely
non-crusty ones there, ever. Bap I've always associated with wider
flatter floury cotton-woolly things that your teeth don't even notice
as they pass through. I've never actually seen the point in those.
>
<snip comments about "duck" as a form of address>
>Round our neck of the woods we associate it particularly with a town
>called Ilkeston, the accent of it's locals being the butt of several
>jokes. For example, an Ilkeston women called her vet from work about her
>sick cat. "Is it a tom?" asked the vet. "Of course it is - I wouldn't
>bring it with me to work, would I, duck."
In Loughborough I recall that the term was specifically "M'duck", and
was used regardless of age or sex (i.e. M/M, M/F, F/M, F/F).
--
Mike Putnam, Windsor UK
Brian Howlett
Greetings! In message <899030...@i-m-t.demon.co.uk>
vafp...@i-m-t.demon.co.uk ("ppint.") wrote some or all of the
following:
> - hi; in afparticle, <fImLMBA6...@msengland.demon.co.uk>,
> ma...@msengland.demon.co.uk "Mark" sought enlightenment:
>>
>> Can anyone explain the origin of this phrase? It's common local slang
>> (at least in Nottingham, UK), to say that you are 'on your sweeney'
>> or 'on your tod(d)' - meaning on your own - and the obvious reference
>> is Sweeney Todd(sp?), the demon barber. So what's the reference to do
>> with being alone?
>
> - unless there is a rhyming slang reference here, that
> "sweeney" may be a red herring, a later "backformation"
> under his mistaken influence:
There is indeed a rhyming slang reference - on my/your own=Todd Sloane,
although I have no source for this other than my dubious memory, and
absolutely no idea who he was...!
[snip]
--
Brian Howlett
---------------------------------------------
If you're not in bed by midnight, go home ;-)
Geoff
Mark wrote in message ...
<snip>
>Whilst I'm on a local slang tip, has anyone heard of the word 'cob'
>meaning bread roll?<snip>
>--
>Mark
"Cob" as in small round bread roll, is derived from "cobble" as in the
stones used to pave streets, which the bread rolls resemble.
Th0r (remove the insanity marks to email)
jes...@innotts.co.uk
On Sat, 27 Jun 1998 23:48:26 +0100, Mark wrote in message
<fImLMBA6...@msengland.demon.co.uk>:
>Can anyone explain the origin of this phrase? It's common local slang
>(at least in Nottingham, UK), to say that you are 'on your sweeney' or
Funny, never heard that one (OK, I've only been here for 22+ years),
which part of the county you in?
>'on your tod(d)' - meaning on your own - and the obvious reference is
>Sweeney Todd(sp?), the demon barber. So what's the reference to do with
>being alone?
Haven't a clue.
8-)
Andy Brown
--
http://www.innotts.co.uk/~jester/ | Unsound Engineer to the MAS
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Maurice Barnes
Mark <ne...@msengland.demon.co.uk> annunciated to the gathered
multitude :
>Round our neck of the woods we associate it particularly with a town
>called Ilkeston, the accent of it's locals being the butt of several
>jokes. For example, an Ilkeston women called her vet from work about her
>sick cat. "Is it a tom?" asked the vet. "Of course it is - I wouldn't
>bring it with me to work, would I, duck."
Alternatively, bloke goes to see the vetenarry about his wife's cat
and the vet asks "Is it a Tom?" and the bloke replies "Nay, a'brought
it wi'me."
Ey up mi' duck! Ye need ta goo street dawn straight, nail dawn and
knock a neel in.
If anyone is remotely interested in the Ilkeston dialect, there's a
book by a bloke called Scoggins which I think is titled "Ey up Mi'
Duck!" which has loads more similarly veined stories and the like as
well as a history of the dialect (I think).
Me? Ilkeston born and bred - no wonder no-one understands a word I
say.
Though technically I now live outside the town boundary and I am thus
classed as being a bit posh.
AFPCode 1.1 AB/NL$-UK d s+:-- a@24 UP++ R++ F++ h P-- OSD--: C+
M- pp L+ c B+ Cn-:+ PT+ Pu@48 5+ !X MT? eV+>V r/p-- y-- end
Maurice Barnes (Mr O.)- bar...@globalnet.co.uk
All Things Discworldly at http://www.lspace.org
jes...@innotts.co.uk
On Sun, 28 Jun 1998 20:08:04 GMT, Mike Putnam wrote in message
<35979ff2...@news.demon.co.uk>:
>On Sun, 28 Jun 1998 20:47:52 +0100, Mark <ne...@msengland.demon.co.uk>
>wrote:
>
><snip query about Cob as a bready word>
>>Which reminds me of another argument my friends and I had, which
>>essentially boiled down to whether a cob could only be called a cob if
>>it was 'crusty', and in this case a soft roll was called a bap.
>I went to Loughborough Uni, near Nottingham, a decade or two (and a
Interesting definition of 'near', seeing as Loogabarooga is in
Leicestershire. It's far enough for there to be different usage.
>half, maybe) ago and Cob was our word for any round bread roll used in
>sandwich mode. Mind you, I don't recall being served any completely
>non-crusty ones there, ever. Bap I've always associated with wider
>flatter floury cotton-woolly things that your teeth don't even notice
>as they pass through. I've never actually seen the point in those.
>>
><snip comments about "duck" as a form of address>
>>Round our neck of the woods we associate it particularly with a town
>>called Ilkeston, the accent of it's locals being the butt of several
Ilkeston is technically in Derbyshire (which puts it in a whole other
world, jokes and accent wise 8-)
>>jokes. For example, an Ilkeston women called her vet from work about her
>>sick cat. "Is it a tom?" asked the vet. "Of course it is - I wouldn't
>>bring it with me to work, would I, duck."
Heck, that's the proper Nottnm pronunciation.
>In Loughborough I recall that the term was specifically "M'duck", and
>was used regardless of age or sex (i.e. M/M, M/F, F/M, F/F).
See first comment.
Andy Brown (Who's about half way between Nottingham and Derby, but
/just/ on the right side of the border 8-)
Mark
In article <3597dfbd...@news.innotts.co.uk>, jes...@innotts.co.uk
writes
>Ilkeston is technically in Derbyshire (which puts it in a whole other
>world, jokes and accent wise 8-)
True, I should have said East Midlands, but that would have been too
vague. Oh, and Ilkeston is in a whole other world... sorry, wishful
thinking <g>
>Andy Brown (Who's about half way between Nottingham and Derby, but
>/just/ on the right side of the border 8-)
Well, my reference point is Long Eaton (about half a mile the wrong side
of the border, but with a Nottingham postcode). You ain't far away.
Cheers.
--
Mark
Glyn Bradley
Mark wrote:
Can anyone explain the origin of this phrase? It's common local slang
(at least in Nottingham, UK), to say that you are 'on your sweeney' or
'on your tod(d)' - meaning on your own - and the obvious reference is
Sweeney Todd(sp?), the demon barber. So what's the reference to do with
being alone?
Whilst I'm on a local slang tip, has anyone heard of the word 'cob'
meaning bread roll?
Not heard that use, but in these parts, i.e Cheshire/ Staffordshire/ Derbyshire, people use as in "He's got a cob on". They mean that someone is in a bad mood.
Not to mention our speciality, calling people
'duck'?
Generally northen isn't it. Again, that's used around these parts,
especially in Biddulph, and Stoke.
Actually, I was in Nottingham today, and I heard this old man say "Duck."
Nice place but I wasn't good enough for you university.
--
Hofstadter's Law: It always takes longer than you think it will take,
even if you take into account Hofstadter's Law.
Mark
In article <6n8ucv$bhv$1...@library.lspace.org>, Maurice Barnes
<*bar...@globalnet.co.uk> writes
>Alternatively, bloke goes to see the vetenarry about his wife's cat
>and the vet asks "Is it a Tom?" and the bloke replies "Nay, a'brought
>it wi'me."
>
>Ey up mi' duck! Ye need ta goo street dawn straight, nail dawn and
>knock a neel in.
That's how it goes!
>If anyone is remotely interested in the Ilkeston dialect, there's a
>book by a bloke called Scoggins which I think is titled "Ey up Mi'
>Duck!" which has loads more similarly veined stories and the like as
>well as a history of the dialect (I think).
Any idea where I can order this from? Every source I can think of
checking is coming up with nothing matching.
>Me? Ilkeston born and bred - no wonder no-one understands a word I
>say.
>Though technically I now live outside the town boundary and I am thus
>classed as being a bit posh.
Cheers.
--
Mark
Mark
In article <3599365D...@globalnet.co.uk>, Glyn Bradley
<gbra...@globalnet.co.uk> writes
>According to the COD, it's 20th cent, perhaps from rhyming slang On one's
>Tod Sloan (who was a jockey). I've heard it a bit in the north west. A
>few years ago, everyone seemed to using "Billy-no-friends" for people on
>their own. I can't remeber why.
Around here it's still in use as 'billy-no-mates', but likewise, no
known reason why.
>Not heard that use, but in these parts, i.e Cheshire/ Staffordshire/
>Derbyshire, people use as in "He's got a cob on". They mean that someone
>is in a bad mood.
Also a phrase in use round here, but has two uses. One as you've
mentioned, the other is, well, erm, how can I put it... The Chinese have
one every morning, which is why they are the most democratic country in
the world.
An election, of course.
>> Not to mention our speciality, calling people
>> 'duck'?
>
>Generally northen isn't it. Again, that's used around these parts,
>especially in Biddulph, and Stoke.
>Actually, I was in Nottingham today, and I heard this old man say "Duck."
>Nice place but I wasn't good enough for you university.
I wasn't either. I had to travel to Wolves.
Cheers.
--
Mark
Eleanor Williams
> >Generally northen isn't it. Again, that's used around these parts,
> >especially in Biddulph, and Stoke.
Biddulph? You're associated with Biddulph? I HATE that place! I keeping
having to write advertising features about it and no one I speak to can tell
me of *anything* even remotely interesting to do with it. Please, if you know
anything exciting, let me know!
Anejo
--
The OFFICIAL tagline of France '98!
http://www.geocities.com/SouthBeach/Breakers/8392
reply to: kharanth at geocities.com
Maurice Barnes
jes...@innotts.co.uk annunciated to the gathered multitude :
>Ilkeston is technically in Derbyshire (which puts it in a whole other
>world, jokes and accent wise 8-)
Strong in'th arm... etc.etc. However Ilkeston is closer to Nottingham
than Derby geographically.
Supermouse
In article <fImLMBA6...@msengland.demon.co.uk>, Mark
<ne...@msengland.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>Whilst I'm on a local slang tip, has anyone heard of the word 'cob'
>meaning bread roll?
Hi! I'm also in Nottingham. I think 'cob' has the same root derivation
as 'cobblestone' and relates to a roughly-rounded shape.
Probably.
> Not to mention our speciality, calling people
>'duck'?
Don't forget 'mardy' (going into a sulk), 'meemo' (icecream) and
'chuckie eggs' (chicken eggs, though 'chuckie' isn't used for chicken).
Still, Nottinghamshire is dialect-poor compared with Yorkshire and
Glasgow.
Cordially,
--
Supermouse
Wee sleekit cowerin' timerous beastie - with attitude.
Glyn Bradley
Supermouse wrote:
> In article <fImLMBA6...@msengland.demon.co.uk>, Mark
> <ne...@msengland.demon.co.uk> wrote:
> > Not to mention our speciality, calling people
> >'duck'?
>
> Don't forget 'mardy' (going into a sulk), 'meemo' (icecream) and
> 'chuckie eggs' (chicken eggs, though 'chuckie' isn't used for chicken).
We tend to say "mard" as in "Yer mard as muck". However, everyone else in
my part of Cheshire has never heard this use. They go around saying "He's
in a mard" as in mood. About half of them know what Lozocking means. I
think that's a northern word. Honestly you [Shadwell mode on] "southern
pansies" [Shadwell mode off] know nowt about owt.
My mad aunt in Staffordshire says chuckyeggs. She's one of them luke,
buke, cuke, tooook people. She also pronounces poorly as "pooly."
If anyone knows about accents I've posted a question somewhere about
hallo/hello somewhere.
jes...@innotts.co.uk
On Tue, 30 Jun 1998 20:02:54 +0100, Glyn Bradley wrote in message
<3599365D...@globalnet.co.uk>:
<hack>
>Actually, I was in Nottingham today, and I heard this old man say "Duck."
>Nice place but I wasn't good enough for you university.
Sorry to hear that. Have you tried the poly?
Andy Brown (Trolling for recent Trent Uni students 8-)
--
http://www.innotts.co.uk/~jester/ | Unsound Engineer to the MAS
AFP Code V1.1 AC$/Mu/E$ d--x@ s-:@ a UP R>+ F h> P-- OSD:>- ?C M-
DinkiPixie
Various interesting words have been introduced to which I add just this:
My mum (from Bradford) said that when she was a girl old people used
'doy' as an affectionate word for a child, but she hasn't heard it
since.
--
Angela MacKellar
Ailbhe Leamy
DinkiPixie <dink...@spamnet.co.uk> wrote in article
<6nfqlo$1ap$1...@roch.zetnet.co.uk>...
wondering about decreasing vocabularies. . .
in the 40s and 50s chilldren in cork were
quite capable of running in to their parents
whining 'she pushed me in the mire'; mire
is now a word used rarely, mud being preferred,
or muck. any other examples?
ailbhe
Sadie Slater
><35979ff2...@news.demon.co.uk>:
>
>>On Sun, 28 Jun 1998 20:47:52 +0100, Mark <ne...@msengland.demon.co.uk>
>>wrote:
>>
>><snip query about Cob as a bready word>
>>>Which reminds me of another argument my friends and I had, which
>>>essentially boiled down to whether a cob could only be called a cob if
>>>it was 'crusty', and in this case a soft roll was called a bap.
>>I went to Loughborough Uni, near Nottingham, a decade or two (and a
>>sandwich mode. Mind you, I don't recall being served any completely
>>non-crusty ones there, ever. Bap I've always associated with wider
>>flatter floury cotton-woolly things that your teeth don't even notice
>>as they pass through. I've never actually seen the point in those.
Here in Coventry, _any_ bread roll type thing is known as a batch. If
it's filled it's eg a sausage batch (aka sausage-inna-bun). If not, it's
still a batch.
Even if you have proper sarnies made with real bread ie the sliced
stuff, people will still turn round at lunchtime and ask what you've got
in your batches today.
--
TTFN, Sadie
sa...@topicaltim.demon.co.uk
"If the good Lord had intended us to walk, he would have given us
sneakers." -Douglas Adams
Leighton Pritchard
Glyn Bradley wrote:
>
> Supermouse wrote:
>
> > In article <fImLMBA6...@msengland.demon.co.uk>, Mark
> > <ne...@msengland.demon.co.uk> wrote:
> > > Not to mention our speciality, calling people
> > >'duck'?
> >
> > Don't forget 'mardy' (going into a sulk), 'meemo' (icecream) and
> > 'chuckie eggs' (chicken eggs, though 'chuckie' isn't used for chicken).
>
> We tend to say "mard" as in "Yer mard as muck". However, everyone else in
> my part of Cheshire has never heard this use. They go around saying "He's
> in a mard" as in mood.
Round our (pronounced 'are') way - Salford to Wigan, we used 'mard-arse'
(sulky person) and 'mardy' (same thing) too. 'Chuckyegg' is one my mum
('me Mam') uses, though I still think it's babby-talk :)
When I was at primary school - up to 1985, we still inflected you to
'thee' and 'thy' (as well as the possessive 'thine').
> About half of them know what Lozocking means.
They beat me then. What is it? 'Wazzock' I know, but 'lozocking'?
> My mad aunt in Staffordshire says chuckyeggs. She's one of them luke,
> buke, cuke, tooook people. She also pronounces poorly as "pooly."
I'm a 'luke', 'buke', 'cook' person myself. I'm continually having the
pish ripped out of me up here in Glasgow for not having lost the accent
after six years. They're a cheeky bunch, especially as they can't even
get the order of breakfast-dinner-tea right, and confuse 'pants' for
underwear :)
--
Discard inhibitions to reply
--
Leighton:
I don't speak for the university. It doesn't speak for me. Unless I'm
particularly incoherent.
Glyn Bradley
Leighton Pritchard wrote:
> Glyn Bradley wrote:
> >
> > We tend to say "mard" as in "Yer mard as muck". However, everyone else in
> > my part of Cheshire has never heard this use. They go around saying "He's
> > in a mard" as in mood.
>
> Round our (pronounced 'are') way - Salford to Wigan, we used 'mard-arse'
> (sulky person) and 'mardy' (same thing) too. 'Chuckyegg' is one my mum
> ('me Mam') uses, though I still think it's babby-talk :)
>
> When I was at primary school - up to 1985, we still inflected you to
> 'thee' and 'thy' (as well as the possessive 'thine').
>
I remember my grandad using "may and thay" in place of me and you.
> > About half of them know what Lozocking means.
>
> They beat me then. What is it? 'Wazzock' I know, but 'lozocking'?
>
To Lozock: to lay around in bed, or slouch about, when you're supposed to be up
doing something else (at least in thier opinion). As in "Stop lozocking about
in bed all day..."