[R] If you had to recommend only one...
Mike Schway
I'm not convinced it should be CoM. Sure, it's the first one, but IMHO,
not exactly the best-developed.
I'm guessing one from the following list would have yet another reader
incurably hooked, but I'm trying to pare it down to ONE:
Mort
Wyrd Sisters
Soul Music (my friends are mostly musicians, so this one will hit home)
Thief of Time
Small Gods
What's the consensus here?
TIA,
--Mike Schway
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Mike Schway | [Picture your favorite quote here]
msc...@nas.com |
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Jonathan Ellis
"Mike Schway" <msc...@nas.com> wrote in message
news:mschway-8DE56C...@netnews.attbi.com...
> ...Discworld book to a friend, which one would it be?
>
> I'm not convinced it should be CoM. Sure, it's the first one, but
IMHO,
> not exactly the best-developed.
>
> I'm guessing one from the following list would have yet another
reader
> incurably hooked, but I'm trying to pare it down to ONE:
>
> Mort
> Wyrd Sisters
> Soul Music (my friends are mostly musicians, so this one will hit
home)
> Thief of Time
> Small Gods
>
> What's the consensus here?
Consensus? On AFP?
I'd vote for Hogfather, with Small Gods coming in a close second,
Lords and Ladies third.
Jonathan.
Thomas Zahr
news:b0i9i7$f7$1...@newsg4.svr.pol.co.uk:
I actually quire like NW, and any story with the Lancre witches in
--
Ciao
Thomas =:-)
<out of sig error>
Michael Gilbert
<URL:mailto:msc...@nas.com> wrote:
> ...Discworld book to a friend, which one would it be?
>
> I'm not convinced it should be CoM. Sure, it's the first one, but IMHO,
> not exactly the best-developed.
>
> I'm guessing one from the following list would have yet another reader
> incurably hooked, but I'm trying to pare it down to ONE:
>
> Mort
> Wyrd Sisters
> Soul Music (my friends are mostly musicians, so this one will hit home)
> Thief of Time
> Small Gods
>
> What's the consensus here?
>
Depends on the person to whom you're recommending it. My mother has
currently got Wyrd Sisters in both book and play on loan from me. She's
never even looked at Discworld stuff before, but saw the play. She now
wants to produce a reading of it (Bangor Drama Club, NI, sometime in the
spring I think, I'll keep people posted).
--
Michael Gilbert: in his own write
MALIGNITY
Beth Winter
>
> ...Discworld book to a friend, which one would it be?
>
> I'm not convinced it should be CoM. Sure, it's the first one, but IMHO,
> not exactly the best-developed.
>
> I'm guessing one from the following list would have yet another reader
> incurably hooked, but I'm trying to pare it down to ONE:
I've had good luck with Small Gods, especially with the more religious
people. Soul Music's a good one too, so's Mort. Women tend to go for WS,
but there are exceptions (I for one don't care that much for the entire
Witches series).
--
Beth Winter
The Discworld Compendium <http://www.extenuation.net/disc/>
"To absent friends, lost loves, old gods and the season of mists."
-- Neil Gaiman
Francesco Santini
"Mike Schway" <msc...@nas.com> ha scritto nel messaggio
news:mschway-8DE56C...@netnews.attbi.com...
> ...Discworld book to a friend, which one would it be?
>
> I'm not convinced it should be CoM. Sure, it's the first one, but IMHO,
> not exactly the best-developed.
>
> I'm guessing one from the following list would have yet another reader
> incurably hooked, but I'm trying to pare it down to ONE:
>
> Mort
> Wyrd Sisters
> Soul Music (my friends are mostly musicians, so this one will hit home)
> Thief of Time
> Small Gods
>
> What's the consensus here?
TCoM is one of my favourites and IMHO it is the best way to approach to the
series.
But, if you want to recommend a stand-alone book, I'd settle for Small Gods,
or Pyramids, which is a great book, with many references to the Discworld
universe.
TTFN,
Francesco
WB-LM
> ...Discworld book to a friend, which one would it be?
>
For me it would be Mort. It was the first one that I ever read, and
consequently the one that *hooked* me! ;o)
Caroline xxx
Menshevik
me (it comes with the drawback of being the first of two parts,
by the way).
I then got HOOKED after a friend gave me "Guards! Guards!"
And I gave "Wyrd Sisters" to others to give them a taste
of Pratchett, and that worked very well, thangyew!
Tilman
"Who wants to read something about this subject will find it in a book, the
title of which I've forgotten. But it's the 42nd chapter."
Professor Johann Georg August Galletti (1750-1828)
Aquarion
I'd say bot HF and L&L require a bit of backstory. Mort or Eric would be
my favourites to start with, Possibly Guards Guards. Soul Music is also
a good choice, since it explains Susan's heritage...
--
Aquarion, http://www.aquarionics.com, aqua...@suespammers.org
Tempo difícil esse em que estamos, em que é mais fácil quebrar um átomo do
que um preconceito.
-- Albert Einstein
Ashwan
>
> I'm not convinced it should be CoM. Sure, it's the first one, but
IMHO,
> not exactly the best-developed.
>
> I'm guessing one from the following list would have yet another
reader
> incurably hooked, but I'm trying to pare it down to ONE:
>
> Mort
> Wyrd Sisters
> Soul Music (my friends are mostly musicians, so this one will hit
home)
> Thief of Time
> Small Gods
>
Hi
I'm a newbie here, and I've been lurking for a couple of weeks, but I
just couldn't resist an answer to this one....
Small Gods was the second DW book I read (after Pyramids) and I think
the one that got me hooked... So I'd say that's top of my list. Mort
was the 1st DW book I owned and I still like to reread it now and
then. But besides the ones on your list, I'd say G!G! is a good choice
to start with. Or among the wizards books, I liked TLC and Equal
Rites.
Well, my two pennies...
Ashwan
--
The suespammers.org mail server is located in California;
do not send unsolicited bulk e-mail or unsolicited commercial e-mail
to my suespammers.org address
The Uitlander
continue to marvel at the idea that death has a horse called Binky. BTW
I didn't do any revision for those 5 days, but did also manage to read
TCOM & TLF, and so the world changed.....
Menshevik wrote:
> The first one I read was TCOM, which did not really convince
> me (it comes with the drawback of being the first of two parts,
> by the way).
> I then got HOOKED after a friend gave me "Guards! Guards!"
> And I gave "Wyrd Sisters" to others to give them a taste
> of Pratchett, and that worked very well, thangyew!
--
**************************
The Uitlander
"A little learning is a dangerous thing.
Just imagine what damage you might do with a lot of it."
Peter Morris
>
> I'm not convinced it should be CoM. Sure, it's the first one, but IMHO,
> not exactly the best-developed.
>
> I'm guessing one from the following list would have yet another reader
> incurably hooked, but I'm trying to pare it down to ONE:
>
> Mort
> Wyrd Sisters
> Soul Music (my friends are mostly musicians, so this one will hit home)
> Thief of Time
> Small Gods
>
> What's the consensus here?
When I recommended the books to my mother, the fist one I showed her
was Pyramids. She didn't like the look of it at first, so showed ger the
scene with the Sphynx's riddle. After that she was hooked.
Other good starting points would be Moving Pictures, Guards Guards
or Sourcery.
Definitrely not SM, you need to have read Mort first. TOT is nowhere
near as good as his earlier stuff, IMO. SG & WS are good starting points
too.
But on the whole, I'd say Pyramids.
Sanity
Mike Schway <msc...@nas.com> wrote:
> ...Discworld book to a friend, which one would it be?
[...]
The Star Trek books. Possibly Lord of the Rings.
> What's the consensus here?
Concensus schmonschmensus.
TTFN,
Michel AKA Sanity
--
"Sanity shall make ye -ing fret" Doing Affordable things to AFP:
www.affordable-prawns.co.uk www.affordable-hedgehogs.co.uk
AFP Chess Tournament: http://www.affordable-hedgehogs.co.uk/chess/
Gunna
>
> I'm not convinced it should be CoM. Sure, it's the first one, but IMHO,
> not exactly the best-developed.
>
> I'm guessing one from the following list would have yet another reader
> incurably hooked, but I'm trying to pare it down to ONE:
>
> Mort
> Wyrd Sisters
> Soul Music (my friends are mostly musicians, so this one will hit home)
> Thief of Time
> Small Gods
>
In order my preferences would have to be...
Moving Pictures }tied for equal first place
Small Gods }
Pyramids
Guards! Guards!
Wyrd Sisters
..... etc. etc.
Mind you I am kinda biased with P, GG and MP as these were my fist books in
that order and I am also a movie freak as well as an athiest with over six
years of religious study of various cultures and religions behind me. So
both MP and SG really hit home as best books as well as good starters...
Gunna.
Sherilyn
> ...Discworld book to a friend, which one would it be?
>
> I'm not convinced it should be CoM. Sure, it's the first one, but IMHO,
> not exactly the best-developed.
>
> I'm guessing one from the following list would have yet another reader
> incurably hooked, but I'm trying to pare it down to ONE:
>
> Mort
> Wyrd Sisters
> Soul Music (my friends are mostly musicians, so this one will hit home)
> Thief of Time
> Small Gods
>
> What's the consensus here?
Wyrd Sisters is a pretty good choice, Mort is good, too. I'd steer
clear of recommending any of the rest, but mainly because I didn't
enjoy them much myself. Night Watch and The Truth are very good
examples of recent Pratchett that I'd unhesitatingly recommend as good
reads, not just because they're introductions to the Discworld.
--
Sherilyn
Andrew Irish
I started with Carpe Jugulum, then onto The Fifth Elephant. The books
are mainly independent, but reading the earlier ones then going back to
the newer ones can reveal so much more...
IMO, it doesn't matter where you start. Choose a book that suits your
current interests, then expand from there. If you like fairy
tales/alternative stories, read the witches. If you like standard
fantasy, read the Rincewind/wizards books. If you like detective
stories, read the Watch books. Then there are the Susan/Death books and
the stand-alones - Pyramids, Small Gods, The Amazing Maurice etc.
I like all of them, but not everyone does.
--
Andrew
Tomas Paulsberg
"Gunna" <Symm...@IMSICKOFSPAM.catchnet.com.au> wrote in message
news:b0jmji$ghv$1...@library.lspace.org...
I'd say one of the Watch books, or at least one that takes place in Ankh
Morpork. I read Carpe Jugulum for my first Discworld book, and now that I've
read them all, I realize that is not (IMO) one of the best. Atfer I had read
it the first time however, I was utterly hooked on discworld, and the books
just kept getting better and better.
Tomas
Mike Stevens
> Mike Schway wrote:
>>
>> ...Discworld book to a friend, which one would it be?
>>
>> I'm not convinced it should be CoM. Sure, it's the first one, but
>> IMHO, not exactly the best-developed.
>>
>> I'm guessing one from the following list would have yet another
>> reader incurably hooked, but I'm trying to pare it down to ONE:
>
> I've had good luck with Small Gods, especially with the more religious
> people. Soul Music's a good one too, so's Mort. Women tend to go for
> WS, but there are exceptions (I for one don't care that much for the
> entire Witches series).
I think you need to match the choice of book to the known interests of
the person you're introducing it to. SM wouldn't have worked for me,
because I miss most of the musical references [1]. But WS and L&L both
grabbed my attention at once because of the Shakespearian tie-ins. My
wife responded best to ER because it ties in with her interests.
[1] I still have to read it with the Annotated Pratchett File at my
elbow.
--
Mike Stevens, narrowboat Felis Catus II
Web site www.mike-stevens.co.uk
No man is an island. So is Man.
Suzi
alt.fan.pratchett, Mike Schway <msc...@nas.com> wibbled...
> ...Discworld book to a friend, which one would it be?
>
> I'm not convinced it should be CoM. Sure, it's the first one, but IMHO,
> not exactly the best-developed.
>
> I'm guessing one from the following list would have yet another reader
> incurably hooked, but I'm trying to pare it down to ONE:
>
> Mort
> Wyrd Sisters
> Soul Music (my friends are mostly musicians, so this one will hit home)
> Thief of Time
> Small Gods
>
> What's the consensus here?
It depends on the person you're trying to hook - what are their
interests? For example, if they're into rock music you could try "Soul
Music", if they're into theatre you could try "Maskerade", and if they
are interested in Egyptian stuff then you could try Pyramids.
Suzi
Menshevik
>interests? For example, if they're into rock music you could try "Soul
>Music", if they're into theatre you could try "Maskerade", and if they
>are interested in Egyptian stuff then you could try Pyramids.
If they're into theatre, "Wyrd Sisters" might be better (now if
they are opera or musical nuts it might be a different story ;-)
WS would also mean not having to worry as much about the
references to the previous (Witches and Watch) books.
Eric Jarvis
> Mike Schway wrote:
> >
> > ...Discworld book to a friend, which one would it be?
> >
> > I'm not convinced it should be CoM. Sure, it's the first one, but IMHO,
> > not exactly the best-developed.
> >
> > I'm guessing one from the following list would have yet another reader
> > incurably hooked, but I'm trying to pare it down to ONE:
>
> I've had good luck with Small Gods, especially with the more religious
> people. Soul Music's a good one too, so's Mort. Women tend to go for WS,
> but there are exceptions (I for one don't care that much for the entire
> Witches series).
>
yep...it's Small Gods that got my brother into reading
Pterry...though I followed it up rapidly by giving him a
copy of Good Omens too...he's working for the Church in
Sweden
--
eric - afprelationships in headers
www.ericjarvis.co.uk
"live fast, die only if strictly necessary"
Robin
Probably SM considering they're musicians, but you might also consider
Guards! Guards! as the excellent first Watch storey.
"Mike Schway" <msc...@nas.com> wrote in message
news:mschway-8DE56C...@netnews.attbi.com...
Daibhid Chiennedelh
>From: Darin Johnson da...@usa.net
>Date: 21/01/03 21:28 GMT Standard Time
>Message-id: <cu1znpu...@nokia.com>>I spent much of HF wondering what the heck the Soul Cake Duck was
>supposed to represent. I hadn't realized there really was such a
>thing as Soul Cake (and still don't know what it is, only that it's
>mentioned in song).
A Soul Cake is a cake made on All Souls Day (Nov 2nd) left for wandering
spirits or collected by kids in an early form of guising (trick-or-treating).
More info (and recipe) here:
The Soul Cake Days are therefore DW's Hallowe'en period, but with a bit of
Easter to confuse everyone.
>I also found L&L confusing at times, and also very Yukian. (ok, I'll
>admit I never understood A Midsummer's Night Dream very well either)
>The horned man is a bit baffling, even after a few readings. Is he
>also an elf, or is he a god, and how he fits in the plot.
He's the King of Elves, and the only person who can really stop the Queen. He's
*also*
a god, of sorts, being the DW equivilent of Cernunnos the Stag Lord, who I
*think* was Master of the Wild Hunt.
HTH. HAND.
--
Dave
Now Official Absentee of EU Skiffeysoc for three years
http://www.eusa.ed.ac.uk/societies/sesoc
"When Mister Safety Catch Is Not On, Mister Crossbow Is Not Your Friend."
-Advanced weapon training, Detritus style; Terry Pratchett, Night Watch
Chris
Having just introduced my grey haired old mum to the Discworld (70+ and now
addicted)
I started her off on the city watch trilogy I had gathering dust, (Guards
Guards, Men at arms & Feet of clay)
following up with the Fifth elephant,
I think getting used to a set of characters and following their development
makes the books more compelling,
I've now passed on the death trilogy and the gods trilogy, from there she
can fill in the holes!
Does this make me sound like some kind of pusher?
Chris G
"Robin" <weftwyn...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message
news:b0kcte$gk1$1...@helle.btinternet.com...
---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
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Michael Gilbert
As it says in the book, Opera != Theatre (Or should it be =!... can't
get hold of this at all, used to write it as = with / through it,
although that is hard on a keyboard). Some of the superstitions are the
same (mirrors, flowers, whistling), but thesps are more likely to enjoy
WS or LoL.
Mike Schway
it as a poll, but I'm going to let it go a couple of days more and post
some results.
I haven't yet compiled anything, but it seems to be a close contest
between SG and G!G!, the edge going to the Vimes story.
Torak
> ...Discworld book to a friend, which one would it be?
>
> Wyrd Sisters
> Soul Music (my friends are mostly musicians, so this one will hit home)
> Thief of Time
> Small Gods
Well, Mamma couldn't get past the first few pages (they bored her...) until
I made her read Interesting Times...
Mike Sphar
write the following? Read the book:
>As it says in the book, Opera != Theatre (Or should it be =!... can't
>get hold of this at all, used to write it as = with / through it,
>although that is hard on a keyboard). Some of the superstitions are the
>same (mirrors, flowers, whistling), but thesps are more likely to enjoy
>WS or LoL.
Are musicals considered opera or theater? I think those in the opera world
would say that "Cats" or "Cabaret" are definitely not opera. And I suspect
"thespians" might say it's not theater.
Personally, I noticed more musical theater references than opera references
in Maskerade, but then I've had more exposure to musicals.
--
Mike Sphar Systems Administrator, Brewer, Patriot
They say 'the early bird gets the worm'. What they often fail to
consider, however, is the early cat.
Michael Gilbert
<URL:mailto:mi...@dogfacedboy.org> wrote:
> Did Ancient Astronauts named Michael Gilbert <mgil...@eclipse.co.uk> once
> write the following? Read the book:
> >As it says in the book, Opera != Theatre (Or should it be =!... can't
> >get hold of this at all, used to write it as = with / through it,
> >although that is hard on a keyboard). Some of the superstitions are the
> >same (mirrors, flowers, whistling), but thesps are more likely to enjoy
> >WS or LoL.
>
> Are musicals considered opera or theater? I think those in the opera world
> would say that "Cats" or "Cabaret" are definitely not opera. And I suspect
> "thespians" might say it's not theater.
>
> Personally, I noticed more musical theater references than opera references
> in Maskerade, but then I've had more exposure to musicals.
>
Musicals are descendants of operetta, and probably are allowed to mutate
into same after a sufficient passage of years. Cabaret and Cats are
musicals, although Cabaret is a stunning interpretation of Christopher
Isherwood's Goodbye to Berlin (etc), and Cats is an obscene travesty of
T S Eliot's most accessible work. West Side Story is being accepted as
opera now, though.
In musicals, the acting matters more than in the classical opera
parodied in Maskerade.
On this side of the pond, amateur companies doing musicals tend to call
themselves "Opera" or "Operatic". On that note...
<plug>[I]
SWMBO is directing Anything Goes for Wellington Operatic this year,
being staged in May at the very nice Wellesley Theatre in the town. This
is the original Wellington, so Kiwis need air tickets to visit.
</plug>
--
Michael Gilbert: in his own write
"If the Xbox console falls and hits someone, especially a small child, it may cause serious injury"
Suresh Ramasubramanian
> If they're into theatre, "Wyrd Sisters" might be better (now if
> they are opera or musical nuts it might be a different story ;-)
> WS would also mean not having to worry as much about the
> references to the previous (Witches and Watch) books.
My wife loved "Equal Rites" - her first Pterry.
srs
Rhiannon S
>between SG and G!G!, the edge going to the Vimes story.
I better hurry up and vote for G!G! then. I think it has the right balance of
jokes and darkness, in fact to be honest, I think this is where the drama began
t get the upper hand in the series. My opinions, yours may vary.
****************************
Rhiannon
http://www.members.aol.com/mddestiny/entrypage.html
ClipclopclipclopBANGBANGclipclopclip
-- Amish driveby shooting
Rhiannon S
>it as a poll, but I'm going to let it go a couple of days more and post
>some results
And on the flipside, which book would you scream put that down to? Which is
the book most likely to put a new reader off Discworld?
For me it is a tie between Moving Pictures and Soul Music. Neither seem to
catch the spirit of discworld, they feel like roundworld issues hastily crammed
into a DW novel and it grates. Especially the animation of SM, it was truly
abominable in capturing the atmosphere (apart from the bigger than cheeses line
of course).
Opinions of others?
Mike Stevens
>> From: Darin Johnson da...@usa.net
>> I also found L&L confusing at times, and also very Yukian. (ok, I'll
>> admit I never understood A Midsummer's Night Dream very well either)
>> The horned man is a bit baffling, even after a few readings. Is he
>> also an elf, or is he a god, and how he fits in the plot.
>
> He's the King of Elves, and the only person who can really stop the
> Queen. He's *also*
> a god, of sorts, being the DW equivilent of Cernunnos the Stag Lord,
> who I *think* was Master of the Wild Hunt.
And those things link him to lots of others. The Midsummer Night's
Dream stuff marks him as Oberon, King of the Fairies, who is another
mythic variant of Alberich the dwarf [1]. And I think the way Pterry
writes him evokes echoes of Wotan/Odin as well [2]. And then there's
all those Sleeping King legends...... And Herne the Hunter [3] - I
was almost surprised that we didn't get a reference to Merry Wives of
Windsor [4].
[1] In the Germanic stuff that Wagner used as a source
[2] At least it does for me.
[3] Who's quite possibly another variant on Cernunnos.
[4] Or did I miss it?
--
Mike Stevens, the Old Farts' old fart
FiX
wine, what would you recommend?
FiX <G,D&R]
Suzi
Gilbert <mgil...@eclipse.co.uk> wibbled...
[Snip]
> Musicals are descendants of operetta, and probably are allowed to mutate
> into same after a sufficient passage of years. Cabaret and Cats are
> musicals, although Cabaret is a stunning interpretation of Christopher
> Isherwood's Goodbye to Berlin (etc), and Cats is an obscene travesty of
> T S Eliot's most accessible work. West Side Story is being accepted as
> opera now, though.
Actually, I'd say that Cats is Operetta (as the distinction is, AFAIA,
that in an Operetta the songs continue the story and the story
would be incomplete without the songs, whereas a musical is "let's break
for a song" and if you stripped the songs out the show would still
make sense).
Suzi
Diane L.
>
> Actually, I'd say that Cats is Operetta (as the distinction is, AFAIA,
> that in an Operetta the songs continue the story and the story
> would be incomplete without the songs, whereas a musical is "let's
> break for a song" and if you stripped the songs out the show would
> still make sense).
Speaking of which, I once saw "Calamity Jane" on Italian TV with all
the songs cut out. It was ... short.
Diane L.
KuroNeko
If i want to introduce Pterry´s Discworld to a person i would make him read
CoM
but if i want a person to read a good book, and i know hes not going to read
the whole DW collection, i would recommend:
-Equal Rites
-Mort
( i havent read all the DW books yet, there are a lot ot titles not avaible
in spanish)
Sabina-
"FiX" <Fi...@club.lemonde.fr> escribió en el mensaje
news:e95c6d4.03012...@posting.google.com...
Thomas Zahr
170573.news.dfncis.de:
... L&L confusion
>
> And those things link him to lots of others. The Midsummer Night's
> Dream stuff marks him as Oberon, King of the Fairies, who is another
> mythic variant of Alberich the dwarf [1]. And I think the way Pterry
> writes him evokes echoes of Wotan/Odin as well [2]. And then there's
> all those Sleeping King legends...... And Herne the Hunter [3] - I
> was almost surprised that we didn't get a reference to Merry Wives of
> Windsor [4].
>
> [1] In the Germanic stuff that Wagner used as a source
> [2] At least it does for me.
> [3] Who's quite possibly another variant on Cernunnos.
> [4] Or did I miss it?
>
>
Where did you get the connection between Alberich and Oberon from? Just
because Germanic Lore does not tend to include elves/fairies, I would not
necessarily see a dwarf = fairy (he does like gold after all)
--
Ciao
Thomas =:-)
<out of sig error>
Michael Gilbert
Menshevik
>because Germanic Lore does not tend to include elves/fairies, I would not
>necessarily see a dwarf = fairy (he does like gold after all)
Ah, but dwarfs are frequently called elfs in Germanic
languages. "Alberich": alb (elf) + rich (wealth, power)
German: Alberich = French/English: Aubrey, from which
you plausibly could derive Auberon > Oberon.
Thomas Zahr
news:20030122173334...@mb-bd.aol.com:
>>Where did you get the connection between Alberich and Oberon from?
>>Just because Germanic Lore does not tend to include elves/fairies, I
>>would not necessarily see a dwarf = fairy (he does like gold after
>>all)
Ok, I take it back, dwarfs are albs (Dunkelalben)
>
> Ah, but dwarfs are frequently called elfs in Germanic
> languages. "Alberich": alb (elf) + rich (wealth, power)
>
> German: Alberich = French/English: Aubrey, from which
> you plausibly could derive Auberon > Oberon.
>
Mike Stevens
Oberon and Alberich (also Auberon, Aubrey and Aiberon) are forms of the
same name, used for broadly similar characters who crop up in a whole
raft of stories from early medieval times onwards. The name probably
derives from "Elferich" meaning "Dwarf-king". He occurs variously as
king of the dwarves or of the fairies, features in the legendary
ancestry of the Merovingian kings, and in one tale is the son of Julius
Caesar and Morgan Le Fay.
One writer says "King Oberon, the noble elven king, actually started out
as a dwarf of all things! In German mythology, Alberich was the King of
the dwarves. Alberich in French is softened to the name Oberon, where it
was used in the play, Huon of Bordeaux. In the French play there are
many similarities to several of the German mythologies concerning the
dwarven king. This was translated into english in 1540, and presumably
where Shakespeare got the name from. "
Here's a lovely bit of confusion that I found on
http://www.dragoncourt.org/ringasset/ch7_02.asp . I don't claim any
accuracy for it!
"Shakespeare's Oberon was Aubrey de Vere. Thus Aubrey and Alberich were
Dragon Ring Lords as was Robert the third earl, who was Robin Hood.
Robin's father was Oberon, Oberon's father and mother were Caesar and
Morgan La Fey. In real life Robert's Father was Aubrey, who's father and
grand father were Alberic. This is how Alberich became Auberon who
became Oberon, father of Robin or Puck. Alberic de Vere's ancestors
included Melusine's great great grandmother; Morgan La Fey and Julius
Caesar's family!"
And from the same source : "Oberon as the god of love directly
corresponds with Odin as a god of love, and both connect with Herne and
the parasexuality of the Wild hunt."
--
Mike Stevens, narrowboat Felis Catus II
Dante
news:MPG.1898f0ed2...@nntp.netcomuk.co.uk:
> Actually, I'd say that Cats is Operetta (as the distinction is, AFAIA,
> that in an Operetta the songs continue the story and the story
> would be incomplete without the songs, whereas a musical is "let's break
> for a song" and if you stripped the songs out the show would still
> make sense).
>
> Suzi
I always thought the difference was that in musicals, you could hear the
words. And sometimes understand them, too.
Does that mean that Buffy: the musical is actually Buffy: the operetta?
caz
Speaker-to-Customers
> Suzi wrote :
>
>> Actually, I'd say that Cats is Operetta (as the distinction is,
>> AFAIA, that in an Operetta the songs continue the story and the story
>> would be incomplete without the songs, whereas a musical is "let's
>> break for a song" and if you stripped the songs out the show would
>> still make sense).
>>
>> Suzi
>
> I always thought the difference was that in musicals, you could hear
> the words. And sometimes understand them, too.
>
> Does that mean that Buffy: the musical is actually Buffy: the
> operetta?
Indeed, according to Suzi's definition, "Once More With Feeling" is
certainly an operetta.
You could strip the spoken words out and it would *almost* make sense, but
the reverse certainly does not apply.
Paul Speaker-to-Customers
--
"Bother!" said Pooh. "She's been doing well with fiends from Hell but
lately we can tell, she's just going through the motions; faking it somehow.
She's not even half the girl she - ow!"
Mike Sphar
the following? Read the book:
>the book most likely to put a new reader off Discworld?
For me, deciding on my least favorite Discworld book is fairly akin to
deciding in my least favorite orgasm. Some of them are better than others,
but they're all pretty damn good.
Jen Birren
> Actually, I'd say that Cats is Operetta (as the distinction is, AFAIA,
> that in an Operetta the songs continue the story and the story
> would be incomplete without the songs, whereas a musical is "let's break
> for a song" and if you stripped the songs out the show would still
> make sense).
Whereas an opera makes no sense *with* the songs. Ok, got it ... ;)
Jen
--
Il paggio!
Mia figlia!
Mia madre!
Madama!
Steve James
> Did Ancient Astronauts named mdde...@aol.comlemon (Rhiannon S) once write
> the following? Read the book:
> >And on the flipside, which book would you scream put that down to? Which is
> >the book most likely to put a new reader off Discworld?
> For me, deciding on my least favorite Discworld book is fairly akin to
> deciding in my least favorite orgasm. Some of them are better than others,
> but they're all pretty damn good.
>
Or they on video?!
Steve (Steeljam) *BF DAcFD (UU) *
Resident Opsimath in Redivivus Studies
Bluebottle
As was a showing of "The Sound of Music" in South Korea - the
cinema manager discovered that the running time was too long and
cut all the songs.
Julie
Graycat
<mike...@which.net> wrote:
>Thomas Zahr <thoma...@freenet.de> wrote:
>> "Mike Stevens" <mike...@which.net> wrote in news:b0mbgs$pv0aq$1@ID-
>> 170573.news.dfncis.de:
>>
>> ... L&L confusion
>>>
>>> And those things link him to lots of others. The Midsummer Night's
>>> Dream stuff marks him as Oberon, King of the Fairies, who is another
>>> mythic variant of Alberich the dwarf [1]. And I think the way Pterry
>>> writes him evokes echoes of Wotan/Odin as well [2]. And then there's
>>> all those Sleeping King legends...... And Herne the Hunter [3] - I
>>> was almost surprised that we didn't get a reference to Merry Wives of
>>> Windsor [4].
where is he called Wotan? And I can't say I saw that connection, but
maybe I was just blinded by the ovious Cernunnos/Herne references.
>>> [1] In the Germanic stuff that Wagner used as a source
>>> [2] At least it does for me.
>>> [3] Who's quite possibly another variant on Cernunnos.
>>> [4] Or did I miss it?
>Here's a lovely bit of confusion that I found on
>http://www.dragoncourt.org/ringasset/ch7_02.asp . I don't claim any
>accuracy for it!
Good, it all looks very suspect to me...
>"Shakespeare's Oberon was Aubrey de Vere. Thus Aubrey and Alberich were
>Dragon Ring Lords as was Robert the third earl, who was Robin Hood.
>Robin's father was Oberon, Oberon's father and mother were Caesar and
>Morgan La Fey. In real life Robert's Father was Aubrey, who's father and
>grand father were Alberic. This is how Alberich became Auberon who
>became Oberon, father of Robin or Puck. Alberic de Vere's ancestors
>included Melusine's great great grandmother; Morgan La Fey and Julius
>Caesar's family!"
Sounds like a whole bunch of modern, myth-addict muddle...
>And from the same source : "Oberon as the god of love directly
>corresponds with Odin as a god of love, and both connect with Herne and
>the parasexuality of the Wild hunt."
Is Odin a god of love?
Elin
The Tale of Westala and Villtin
http://www.student.lu.se/~his02ero/index.html
Graycat
wrote:
>Hey :) im new to this group
hi and welcome.
I have a distinct feeling I've done this before....am I retrieving old
messages? Anyhow, please don't top post, it buggers upp the text when
people reply, makes it hard to read.
Dante
news:b0nki9$rbljb$1...@ID-138064.news.dfncis.de:
> Dante wrote:
>> Suzi wrote :
>>
>>> Actually, I'd say that Cats is Operetta (as the distinction is,
>>> AFAIA, that in an Operetta the songs continue the story and the
>>> story would be incomplete without the songs, whereas a musical is
>>> "let's break for a song" and if you stripped the songs out the show
>>> would still make sense).
>>>
>>> Suzi
>>
>> I always thought the difference was that in musicals, you could hear
>> the words. And sometimes understand them, too.
>>
>> Does that mean that Buffy: the musical is actually Buffy: the
>> operetta?
>
> Indeed, according to Suzi's definition, "Once More With Feeling" is
> certainly an operetta.
>
> You could strip the spoken words out and it would *almost* make sense,
> but the reverse certainly does not apply.
Yup. Joss Whedon wrote it that way on purpose, because most TV shows that
do musical eps just play the scene, and then have everyone burst into a
song which describes the scene that just happened. Which is silly.
caz
Mike Stevens
> On Wed, 22 Jan 2003 23:18:21 -0000, "Mike Stevens"
> <mike...@which.net> wrote:
>
>> Thomas Zahr <thoma...@freenet.de> wrote:
>>> "Mike Stevens" <mike...@which.net> wrote in news:b0mbgs$pv0aq$1@ID-
>>> 170573.news.dfncis.de:
>>>
>>> ... L&L confusion
>>>>
>>>> And those things link him to lots of others. The Midsummer Night's
>>>> Dream stuff marks him as Oberon, King of the Fairies, who is
>>>> another mythic variant of Alberich the dwarf [1]. And I think the
>>>> way Pterry writes him evokes echoes of Wotan/Odin as well [2].
>>>> And then there's all those Sleeping King legends...... And Herne
>>>> the Hunter [3] - I was almost surprised that we didn't get a
>>>> reference to Merry Wives of Windsor [4].
>
> where is he called Wotan? And I can't say I saw that connection, but
> maybe I was just blinded by the ovious Cernunnos/Herne references.
I didn't suggest he was called Wotan, but that I detected a resonance.
That probably comes from the (very obvious as you say) link to Herne the
Hunter. Odin/Wotan was associated with the Wild Hunt very early in
north-European legendry, and this link seems to have passed at some time
to Herne.
>> Here's a lovely bit of confusion that I found on
>> http://www.dragoncourt.org/ringasset/ch7_02.asp . I don't claim any
>> accuracy for it!
>
> Good, it all looks very suspect to me...
I *did* describe it as "a bit of confusion". The Shakespeare connection
is via Edward de Vere, Earl of Oxford, who was one of Shakespeare's
patrons and, according to some polemicists, the real author of the play
attributed to Shakes. I've been trying to look up his family tree
through Google. There was an Aubrey de Vere, Earl of Oxford in the early
13th Century, and an earlier Alberic de Vere who came to England with
William the Conqueror, and several descendants of the same name. There
were also several descendant called Robert, one of whom is reported by
Stukeley (an almost certainly fictional account) to have been the
custodian of "William of Otho" (aka William Fitzooth), whom Stukeley
said was the original of Robin Hood, but who probably never existed in
real life.
>> "Shakespeare's Oberon was Aubrey de Vere. Thus Aubrey and Alberich
>> were Dragon Ring Lords as was Robert the third earl, who was Robin
>> Hood. Robin's father was Oberon, Oberon's father and mother were
>> Caesar and Morgan La Fey. In real life Robert's Father was Aubrey,
>> who's father and grand father were Alberic. This is how Alberich
>> became Auberon who became Oberon, father of Robin or Puck. Alberic
>> de Vere's ancestors included Melusine's great great grandmother;
>> Morgan La Fey and Julius Caesar's family!"
>
> Sounds like a whole bunch of modern, myth-addict muddle...
Not that modern. Stukeley died in 1765. I find it fascinating how
legendary characters, including some of the really ancient mythical
ones, get tied in with real people by later chroniclers.
>
>> And from the same source : "Oberon as the god of love directly
>> corresponds with Odin as a god of love, and both connect with Herne
>> and the parasexuality of the Wild hunt."
>
> Is Odin a god of love?
If I knew what the author meant by "the parasexuality of the Wild hunt",
I might be able to venture an answer!
--
Mike Stevens, the Old Farts' old fart
Richard Eney
Torak <a.w.m...@durham.ac.uk> wrote:
>
>Well, Mamma couldn't get past the first few pages (they bored her...) until
>I made her read Interesting Times...
Speaking of IT, I recently found out that a saveloy is not just a sausage;
it was specifically a sausage stuffed with brains. That explains Teach's
name (Ronald Saveloy) to me; he's stuffed with brains.
=Tamar
Sherilyn
Well, nowadays in England at least it isn't a brain sausage, but the
name is derived from cerebellum, the latin word for the brain.
--
Sherilyn
Beth Winter
>
> Dante wrote:
> > Suzi wrote :
> >
> >> Actually, I'd say that Cats is Operetta (as the distinction is,
> >> AFAIA, that in an Operetta the songs continue the story and the story
> >> would be incomplete without the songs, whereas a musical is "let's
> >> break for a song" and if you stripped the songs out the show would
> >> still make sense).
> >>
> >> Suzi
> >
> > I always thought the difference was that in musicals, you could hear
> > the words. And sometimes understand them, too.
> >
> > Does that mean that Buffy: the musical is actually Buffy: the
> > operetta?
>
> Indeed, according to Suzi's definition, "Once More With Feeling" is
> certainly an operetta.
>
> You could strip the spoken words out and it would *almost* make sense, but
> the reverse certainly does not apply.
Actually it does make sense. I haven't seen the episode, but a friend
gave me a copy of the CD - and I didn't need to search for a summary at
all.
--
Beth Winter
The Discworld Compendium <http://www.extenuation.net/disc/>
"To absent friends, lost loves, old gods and the season of mists."
-- Neil Gaiman
Graycat
<mike...@which.net> wrote:
>> where is he called Wotan? And I can't say I saw that connection, but
>> maybe I was just blinded by the ovious Cernunnos/Herne references.
>
>I didn't suggest he was called Wotan, but that I detected a resonance.
Sorry for being unclear, I meant where geographically, on the earth,
is Wotan the used form of Odin.
>> Sounds like a whole bunch of modern, myth-addict muddle...
>
>Not that modern. Stukeley died in 1765. I find it fascinating how
>legendary characters, including some of the really ancient mythical
>ones, get tied in with real people by later chroniclers.
Oh well, people will be people...
Thomas Zahr
@news.student.lu.se:
> On Thu, 23 Jan 2003 23:38:56 -0000, "Mike Stevens"
> <mike...@which.net> wrote:
>
>
>>> where is he called Wotan? And I can't say I saw that connection, but
>>> maybe I was just blinded by the ovious Cernunnos/Herne references.
>>
>>I didn't suggest he was called Wotan, but that I detected a resonance.
>
> Sorry for being unclear, I meant where geographically, on the earth,
> is Wotan the used form of Odin.
>
Germany
...
Graycat
Mike Stevens
news:3e31cdd8...@news.student.lu.se...
> On Thu, 23 Jan 2003 23:38:56 -0000, "Mike Stevens"
> <mike...@which.net> wrote:
>
>
> >> where is he called Wotan? And I can't say I saw that connection,
but
> >
> >I didn't suggest he was called Wotan, but that I detected a
resonance.
>
> Sorry for being unclear, I meant where geographically, on the earth,
> is Wotan the used form of Odin.
Hazy memory, so please somebody put me right if necessary. I think Odin
is the North Germanic form (i.e. mainly Scandinavian) and Woden and
Wotan the West Germanic (i.e. Germany, the Low Countries, Saxon) forms.
Wotan is the form of the name used by Wagner in the Ring cycle of
operas.
--
Mike Stevens, the Old Farts' old fart.
Suresh Ramasubramanian
> Did Ancient Astronauts named mdde...@aol.comlemon (Rhiannon S) once write
> the following? Read the book:
>>And on the flipside, which book would you scream put that down to? Which is
>>the book most likely to put a new reader off Discworld?
>
> For me, deciding on my least favorite Discworld book is fairly akin to
> deciding in my least favorite orgasm. Some of them are better than others,
> but they're all pretty damn good.
For me at least, "The Dark Side of the Sun" would qualify for this. But then,
I don't like sci-fi all that much so that I can appreciate its parodies.
srs
François-Xavier de Montgolfier
/me looks at his English-French dictionary, and find that Saveloy is
Cervelas. Which is quite funny, because if an English-speaking person
tried writing Cervelas, he _could_ spell it this way ;-)
Oh, and in French, cervelas is a dead givaway: you _know_ that there
is some brain (cervelle) in it.
/me realizes that the French afpers _should_ organize a "let's gross
out furriners" meet, full of oysters, cervelas, pâté de tête, munster,
andouillette, frog legs, foie gras, salade de gésiers, snails, quite a
few fromages that you've got to smell to believe in...
Sylvain & David, care to give it a try?
FiX <VEG>
--
what's the difference between a laser and #afp ....a laser's coherent
-- Hippo on #afp, as he suddenly realises the devastating truth
Orjan Westin
>
> /me realizes that the French afpers _should_ organize a "let's gross
> out furriners" meet, full of oysters, cervelas, pâté de tête, munster,
> andouillette, frog legs, foie gras, salade de gésiers, snails, quite a
> few fromages that you've got to smell to believe in...
Ingvar? Do you think we would have many problems out-grossing them? Their
food, at least, is fresh, apart from the cheese and wine. Whereas our way
with fish...
<vveg>
Orjan
Torak
Ah, but we only have fish.
And rotmos, I suppose.
Not to mention isterband.
OK, maybe we can do it.
Jen Birren
> /me realizes that the French afpers _should_ organize a "let's gross
> out furriners" meet, full of oysters, cervelas, pâté de tête, munster,
> andouillette, frog legs, foie gras, salade de gésiers, snails, quite a
> few fromages that you've got to smell to believe in...
Ooh, can I come? (Providing I don't have to eat the cheeses. I'll do the
"grossed out furriner" thing on them, and then sneakily eat everything
else. Except I don't know what gesiers are... oh well, it can't be worse
than natto.)
The yuckians could bring some delicious traditional delicacies like
jellied eels and cow-heel pie along in return :)
Jen
Sanity
Francois-Xavier de Montgolfier <Fi...@club.lemonde.fr> wrote:
> /me realizes that the French afpers _should_ organize a "let's
> gross out furriners" meet, full of oysters, cervelas, pate de tete,
> munster, andouillette, frog legs, foie gras, salade de gesiers,
> snails, quite a few fromages that you've got to smell to believe
> in...
D|N>K
TTFN,
Michel AKA Sanity
--
"Sanity shall make ye -ing fret" Doing Affordable things to AFP:
www.affordable-prawns.co.uk www.affordable-hedgehogs.co.uk
AFP Chess Tournament: http://www.affordable-hedgehogs.co.uk/chess/
Graycat
wrote:
Don't forget pölsa, bloodpudding and gustavskorv. [1]
Elin
[1] I don't find it gross, but loads of these anglo-saxons have
strange ideas about eating horse...
Orjan Westin
> Orjan Westin wrote:
>>
>> Ingvar? Do you think we would have many problems out-grossing them?
>> Their food, at least, is fresh, apart from the cheese and wine.
>> Whereas our way with fish...
>
> Ah, but we only have fish.
Well, lutfisk and surströmming aren't bad choices for grossness.
Then, if they're still hungry, we have grisfötter, lappskojs, pölsa, palt,
rullsylta, rörost...
All of them quite delicious, of course, if prepared the right way. As for
smoked elk tongue... mmm.
Orjan
Torak
> >> François-Xavier de Montgolfier wrote:
> >>>
> >>> /me realizes that the French afpers _should_ organize a "let's gross
> >>> out furriners" meet, full of oysters, cervelas, pâté de tête, munster,
> >>> andouillette, frog legs, foie gras, salade de gésiers, snails, quite a
> >>> few fromages that you've got to smell to believe in...
> >>
> >> Ingvar? Do you think we would have many problems out-grossing them?
> >> Their food, at least, is fresh, apart from the cheese and wine.
Whereas
> >> our way with fish...
> >
> >Ah, but we only have fish.
> >
> >And rotmos, I suppose.
> >
> >Not to mention isterband.
> >
> >OK, maybe we can do it.
> >
>
> Don't forget pölsa, bloodpudding and gustavskorv. [1]
Urgh, yes.
But Blodpudding is actually quite nice with lingonsylt.
Oooh!
Raggmunk med lingonsylt with a side order of bacon!
::droool::
David Jensen
"Torak" <a.w.m...@durham.ac.uk> wrote in
<b19i6e$bp0$1...@sirius.dur.ac.uk>:
>"Graycat" <gra...@passagen.se> wrote in message
>news:3e382d97...@news.student.lu.se...
>> On Wed, 29 Jan 2003 00:34:35 +0100, "Torak" <a.w.m...@durham.ac.uk>
>> >Orjan Westin wrote:
>> >> François-Xavier de Montgolfier wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>> /me realizes that the French afpers _should_ organize a "let's gross
>> >>> out furriners" meet, full of oysters, cervelas, pâté de tęte, munster,
>> >>> andouillette, frog legs, foie gras, salade de gésiers, snails, quite a
>> >>> few fromages that you've got to smell to believe in...
>> >>
>> >> Ingvar? Do you think we would have many problems out-grossing them?
>> >> Their food, at least, is fresh, apart from the cheese and wine.
>Whereas
>> >> our way with fish...
>> >
>> >Ah, but we only have fish.
>> >
>> >And rotmos, I suppose.
>> >
>> >Not to mention isterband.
>> >
>> >OK, maybe we can do it.
>> >
>>
>> Don't forget pölsa, bloodpudding and gustavskorv. [1]
>
>Urgh, yes.
>
>But Blodpudding is actually quite nice with lingonsylt.
I take it that this is lingonberry sauce?
>Oooh!
>
>Raggmunk med lingonsylt with a side order of bacon!
??
>::droool::
Trina
<da...@dajensen-family.com> had said:
>I take it that this is lingonberry sauce?
/me reads the "on" as "am" and becomes incoherent with juvenile
giggling.
--
*hugs*
Trina
Torak
> "Torak" <a.w.m...@durham.ac.uk> wrote in
>>>> Orjan Westin wrote:
>>>>> François-Xavier de Montgolfier wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> /me realizes that the French afpers _should_ organize a "let's gross
>>>>>> out furriners" meet, full of oysters, cervelas, pâté de tęte,
>>>>>> munster, andouillette, frog legs, foie gras, salade de gésiers,
>>>>>> snails, quite a few fromages that you've got to smell to believe
>>>>>> in...
>>>>>
>>>>> Ingvar? Do you think we would have many problems out-grossing them?
>>>>> Their food, at least, is fresh, apart from the cheese and wine.
>> Whereas
>>>>> our way with fish...
>>>>
>>>> Ah, but we only have fish.
>>>>
>>>> And rotmos, I suppose.
>>>>
>>>> Not to mention isterband.
>>>>
>>>> OK, maybe we can do it.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Don't forget pölsa, bloodpudding and gustavskorv. [1]
>>
>> Urgh, yes.
>>
>> But Blodpudding is actually quite nice with lingonsylt.
>
> I take it that this is lingonberry sauce?
Yup.
>> Oooh!
>>
>> Raggmunk med lingonsylt with a side order of bacon!
>
> ??
It's a sort of potato-based pancake.
FiX
My poor, deluded swedish friend...you should by now have realised that
trying to gross French people with food isn't going to work ;-P
I'm of course strong, and will therefore resist pointing out that,
appart from our cheese (and, believe me, some of our cheese manage to
nearly gross _me_ out <G>), we have tripes à la mode de Caen, lamb
brains, tablier de sapeur (untranslatable, but when you go to Lyon,
ask for some) and assorted delicacies.
They actually are delicious, once you realise that Man is an
opportunist: an animal that, given the chance, will eat any and every
thing. So just because it looks like somebody's been brained, then the
brain has been delicately cut in little cubes, each of one being
aterwards sauted and cooked in sauce isn't a reason to enjoy eating
the current course.
FiX, will try harder to gross out people next time <VVEG>
David Roy
news:61gb3vk11f0a3hk4d...@4ax.com:
> On 24 Jan 2003 01:49:11 GMT, dic...@radix.net (Richard Eney) wrote:
>
>>In article <b0kota$ct3$1...@sirius.dur.ac.uk>,
>>Torak <a.w.m...@durham.ac.uk> wrote:
>>>
>>>Well, Mamma couldn't get past the first few pages (they bored her...)
>>>until I made her read Interesting Times...
>>
>>Speaking of IT, I recently found out that a saveloy is not just a
>>sausage; it was specifically a sausage stuffed with brains. That
>>explains Teach's name (Ronald Saveloy) to me; he's stuffed with
>>brains.
>
> /me looks at his English-French dictionary, and find that Saveloy is
> Cervelas. Which is quite funny, because if an English-speaking person
> tried writing Cervelas, he _could_ spell it this way ;-)
> Oh, and in French, cervelas is a dead givaway: you _know_ that there
> is some brain (cervelle) in it.
>
> /me realizes that the French afpers _should_ organize a "let's gross
> out furriners" meet, full of oysters, cervelas, pâté de tête, munster,
> andouillette, frog legs, foie gras, salade de gésiers, snails, quite a
> few fromages that you've got to smell to believe in...
>
> Sylvain & David, care to give it a try?
>
> FiX <VEG>
>
>
We have to bring the Belgians in too... Anyone that can come up
with a cheese called "vieux puant" has to be part of that meal :-) On the
other hand, I'd also love to know how a country that is quite so willing to
cook anything that comes to hand looks askance at haggis.
David
David Roy
news:3e382d97...@news.student.lu.se:
Horse? Round here, that's just a cheap substitute for beef... If
we're going to go with slightly more unusual meats, emu is dull, but
kangaroo and goat have a bit more taste. And that's without all of the
traditional European game meats - wild boar is wonderful[1].
David
[1] Stop that *now* - I do *not* look like Obelix...
David Roy
news:b19i6e$bp0$1...@sirius.dur.ac.uk:
Never understood the problem with black pudding / boudin noir.
Great stuff - especially with mashed potatos and apples...
David
Ingvar Mattsson
Oh, an in-depth discussion of the preparation and history of gravlax,
some samples of surströmming and lutfisk[1]. Possibly combined with
some other stuff probably inventable at the spot.
//Ingvar
[1] Ideally *badly* prepared lutfisk, so it's mostly just blubbery
white jellylike stuff smelling of fish.
--
(defun m (a b) (cond ((or a b) (cons (car a) (m b (cdr a)))) (t ())))
Graycat
wrote:
>
>But Blodpudding is actually quite nice with lingonsylt.
yes, lots of it.
>Oooh!
>
>Raggmunk med lingonsylt with a side order of bacon!
>
>::droool::
Mmm, but better with the kind of potatisplättar we got at school. And
bacon.
Elin
Emma Stoneman
Schway <msc...@nas.com> writes
>This has proven to be a fascinating thread. I know I didn't advertise
>it as a poll, but I'm going to let it go a couple of days more and post
>some results.
>
>I haven't yet compiled anything, but it seems to be a close contest
>between SG and G!G!, the edge going to the Vimes story.
>
OK, this is almost the same question, so I'll post here instead of
starting a new thread... I have a £10 book token which is going to get
spent on DW books, along with <however much> to make it up to two books'
worth. The problem is, which books to get? It's not a case of getting me
to like the books, cos I would be here if I didn't, but there's 7 I
don't have and I can't choose! The 7 missing ones are
Sourcery
Eric
Guards! Guards!
Lords & Ladies
Interesting Times
Maskerade
The Last Continent (though that may be with my brother, it's not in this
house though so doesn't count)
Any help is welcome, I'm too indecisive for this! :) Thanks.
--
* Emma Stoneman *
ejsto...@dsl.pipex.com
Mike Schway
Emma Stoneman <ejsto...@dsl.pipex.com> wrote:
> >
> OK, this is almost the same question, so I'll post here instead of
> starting a new thread... I have a £10 book token which is going to get
> spent on DW books, along with <however much> to make it up to two books'
> worth. The problem is, which books to get? It's not a case of getting me
> to like the books, cos I would be here if I didn't, but there's 7 I
> don't have and I can't choose! The 7 missing ones are
> Sourcery
> Eric
> Guards! Guards!
> Lords & Ladies
> Interesting Times
> Maskerade
> The Last Continent (though that may be with my brother, it's not in this
> house though so doesn't count)
> Any help is welcome, I'm too indecisive for this! :) Thanks.
Just my 2c (on this side of the Atlantic), if you're already a fan but
haven't read them all, then G!G! and L&L both go a long way towards
explaining a lot of what you've already read.
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Mike Schway | [Picture your favorite quote here]
msc...@nas.com |
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Clotilde
It would be between Guards! Guards! (because it gives you a base to understanding
all the subsequent Vimes books) and Lords & Ladies (because it is a witch
book with elves).
Emma Stoneman
Schway <msc...@nas.com> writes
>In article <e9Z68RDA...@dsl.pipex.com>,
> Emma Stoneman <ejsto...@dsl.pipex.com> wrote:
>
>> >
>> OK, this is almost the same question, so I'll post here instead of
>> starting a new thread... I have a £10 book token which is going to get
>> spent on DW books, along with <however much> to make it up to two books'
>> worth. The problem is, which books to get? It's not a case of getting me
>> to like the books, cos I would be here if I didn't, but there's 7 I
>> don't have and I can't choose! The 7 missing ones are
>> Sourcery
>> Eric
>> Guards! Guards!
>> Lords & Ladies
>> Interesting Times
>> Maskerade
>> The Last Continent (though that may be with my brother, it's not in this
>> house though so doesn't count)
>> Any help is welcome, I'm too indecisive for this! :) Thanks.
>
>Just my 2c (on this side of the Atlantic), if you're already a fan but
>haven't read them all, then G!G! and L&L both go a long way towards
>explaining a lot of what you've already read.
See, that's the thing, I *have* read all of them (at some point, though
not necessarily recently!), and I intend to buy all of them at some
point... I just don't know which ones I want to own first!
Eric Jarvis
then it doesn't matter and you may as well just grab two
at random...I find tossing a coin or rolling dice is
invaluable for these decisions
--
eric - afprelationships in headers
www.ericjarvis.co.uk
"I am a man of many parts,
unfortunately most are no longer in stock"
Torak
>> andouillette, frog legs, foie gras, salade de gésiers, snails, quite a
>> few fromages that you've got to smell to believe in...
>
> with a cheese called "vieux puant" has to be part of that meal :-) On
> the other hand, I'd also love to know how a country that is quite so
> willing to cook anything that comes to hand looks askance at haggis.
But they have chips.
CHIPS!
Mmmmm.... chips....
Torak
> gra...@passagen.se (Graycat) wrote in
>>>> François-Xavier de Montgolfier wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> /me realizes that the French afpers _should_ organize a "let's
>>>>> gross out furriners" meet, full of oysters, cervelas, pâté de tête,
>>>>> munster, andouillette, frog legs, foie gras, salade de gésiers,
>>>>> snails, quite a few fromages that you've got to smell to believe
>>>>> in...
>>>>
>>>> Ingvar? Do you think we would have many problems out-grossing them?
>>>> Their food, at least, is fresh, apart from the cheese and wine.
>>>> Whereas our way with fish...
>>>
>>> Ah, but we only have fish.
>>>
>>> And rotmos, I suppose.
>>>
>>> Not to mention isterband.
>>>
>>> OK, maybe we can do it.
>>>
>>
>> Don't forget pölsa, bloodpudding and gustavskorv. [1]
>>
>> Elin
>>
>> [1] I don't find it gross, but loads of these anglo-saxons have
>> strange ideas about eating horse...
>
> Horse? Round here, that's just a cheap substitute for beef... If
> we're going to go with slightly more unusual meats, emu is dull, but
> kangaroo and goat have a bit more taste. And that's without all of the
> traditional European game meats - wild boar is wonderful[1].
Kangaroo is delicious, and ostrich is... is... yes. Drool.
Alligator is nice, duck is marvellous, boar is nice, rabbit is nice, and so
on.
Apparently fugu is nice too, but should be prepared following the recipe in
Nanny Ogg's book rather than any other for health reasons.
Torak
>
> yes, lots of it.
>
>> Oooh!
>>
>> Raggmunk med lingonsylt with a side order of bacon!
>>
>>>> droool::
>
> Mmm, but better with the kind of potatisplättar we got at school. And
> bacon.
And maybe a mug of nyponsoppa.
And princesstårta, which I am rather good at making. I put frozen
raspberries in the bottom layer, so they're just thawed by the time I serve
it - it gives it a wonderful tangy taste so it's not all sugary. And lots of
vanilla in the cream, of course. Normally I make a marzipan rose to go on
the top and all.
And semlor!
Dammsugare!
DelicatobollarDelicatobollarDelicatobollarDelicatobollarDelicatobollarDelica
tobollarDelicatobollar.............
Torak
> OK, this is almost the same question, so I'll post here instead of
> starting a new thread... I have a £10 book token which is going to get
> spent on DW books, along with <however much> to make it up to two books'
> worth. The problem is, which books to get? It's not a case of getting me
> to like the books, cos I would be here if I didn't, but there's 7 I
> don't have and I can't choose! The 7 missing ones are
> Sourcery
> Eric
> Guards! Guards!
> Lords & Ladies
> Interesting Times
> Maskerade
> The Last Continent (though that may be with my brother, it's not in this
> house though so doesn't count)
> Any help is welcome, I'm too indecisive for this! :) Thanks.
G!G! and IT. Without a doubt.
Or possibly Maskerade.
Emma Stoneman
<use...@ericjarvis.co.uk> writes
Torak
Use two D8 and reroll eights.
melinda
> But dice only have six sides :P
Two die?
--
Melinda
<http://cust.idl.com.au/athol>
Eric Jarvis
> Emma Stoneman <ejsto...@dsl.pipex.com> wrote:
> > But dice only have six sides :P
>
> Two die?
>
one die...roll three times for each of the seven and
choose the two with the highest totals
I do this sort of thing a lot...I decided many years ago
that if I really couldn't decide between several things
rationally then I either needed more information or the
choice may as well be random...saves a lot of headaches
and as yet hasn't caused me to do anything I
regretted...all the really bad decisions are the things
that seemed obvious at the time
--
eric - afprelationships in headers
www.ericjarvis.co.uk
"live fast, die only if strictly necessary"
Emma Stoneman
<use...@ericjarvis.co.uk> writes
>melinda wrote:
>> Emma Stoneman <ejsto...@dsl.pipex.com> wrote:
>> > But dice only have six sides :P
>>
>> Two die?
>>
>
>one die...roll three times for each of the seven and
>choose the two with the highest totals
>
>I do this sort of thing a lot...I decided many years ago
>that if I really couldn't decide between several things
>rationally then I either needed more information or the
>choice may as well be random...saves a lot of headaches
>and as yet hasn't caused me to do anything I
>regretted...all the really bad decisions are the things
>that seemed obvious at the time
>
though, may as well choose randomly since I'll enjoy reading any of them
anyway :)
David Chapman
I'd rather two sleep.
--
Dark don't lie, dreams come true
Could be a few will see you through
X Kyle M Thompson
> The Department of Pre-Crime reports that melinda will say:
>> Emma Stoneman <ejsto...@dsl.pipex.com> wrote:
>>> But dice only have six sides :P
>> Two die?
> I'd rather two sleep.
I have a penchant for dreams.
--
"Cavemen! Jesus Christ! Stone age, clubs, battle axe,
long beard, bows and arrows, hatchets, that's all"
Larry Green on cavemen in "Voices from the Duplex Planet"
pia
>
> And semlor!
<misty-eyed> those are one of the things I greatly miss from Sweden.
And it used to amuse me that foodstuff which is traditionally meant
for fattening oneself up for Lent was available in shops from
Christmas to Midsummer.
> Dammsugare!
>
> Delicatobollar
Never cared for thems. I generally seem to lack the sweet-tooth. Mere
presence of glucose is not enough to send me into throes of ecstasy.
pia
François-Xavier de Montgolfier
<ing...@cathouse.bofh.se> wrote:
>"Orjan Westin" <nos...@cunobaros.demon.co.uk> writes:
>
>> François-Xavier de Montgolfier wrote:
>> >
>> > /me realizes that the French afpers _should_ organize a "let's gross
>> > out furriners" meet, full of oysters, cervelas, pâté de tête, munster,
>> > andouillette, frog legs, foie gras, salade de gésiers, snails, quite a
>> > few fromages that you've got to smell to believe in...
>>
>> Ingvar? Do you think we would have many problems out-grossing them?
/me looks at the naive upstart barbarian with amused incredibility:
how can furriners even dream of outgrossing us with food? Yes, I know,
these are vicking furriners, who think they are fearless and laugh in
the face of death. I've got only one thing to say: the last Norvegian
friend who took the train with me while I was bringing back Mont d'or
from Besançon swore he would never ever travel with me again ;-P
>>Their
>> food, at least, is fresh, apart from the cheese and wine. Whereas our way
>> with fish...
/me hadn't seen the remark about our food being fresh. And /me now has
to replace his laptop's keyboard: do you realise how _costly_ these
are? ;-P
One of the (sadly outdated) way of preparing game meat was to have the
meat wait for 3 weeks to a month, when the meat would become
"faisandée" (bits of the meat would start separeting from the whole
body on their own, for instance). You could then cook the meat. I said
earlier that this was sadly outdated, because I could on some
occasions taste game that had been faisandé, and that was _good_!
There is actually quite a few recipes that don't work with fresh meat,
and these recipes mostly cannot be recreated today, as the meat should
not be put in a freezer for the right bacteria to start developping.
And, of course, I'm not going to try explaining how gross cheese is
made, it's far better leaving your imagination do the work by
themselves ;-P
>Oh, an in-depth discussion of the preparation and history of gravlax,
/me _love_ gravlax and, yes, know how it's made ;-)
>some samples of surströmming and lutfisk[1]. Possibly combined with
>some other stuff probably inventable at the spot.
Unfortunately, I don't think I know the last 2 dishes. But, frankly,
thinking that a well-educated French would be grossed out by food is
rather cute ;-)
BTW, this does not mean that I would _like_ any offered food, just
that I will taste it before deciding...
FiX
--
what's the difference between a laser and #afp ....a laser's coherent
-- Hippo on #afp, as he suddenly realises the devastating truth
François-Xavier de Montgolfier
wrote:
>
>Emma Stoneman <ejsto...@dsl.pipex.com> wrote:
[Emma will be able to buy 2 books out of the following 7]
>>Sourcery
>>Eric
>>Guards! Guards!
>>Lords & Ladies
>>Interesting Times
>>Maskerade
>>The Last Continent (though that may be with my brother, it's not in this
>>house though so doesn't count)
>>Any help is welcome, I'm too indecisive for this! :) Thanks.
>>--
>> * Emma Stoneman *
>>ejsto...@dsl.pipex.com
>>
>
>It would be between Guards! Guards! (because it gives you a base to understanding
>all the subsequent Vimes books) and Lords & Ladies (because it is a witch
>book with elves).
In any case, don't buy Eric unless it's the illustrated version, since
it's a very thin book without the pictures. It must be half the lenght
of any "standard" DW book.
Looking at the books you haven't got yet, I think you're not a great
Rincewind fan. Sourcery, Eric, IT and TLC (sorry, getting lazy) are
Rincewind books, and should be read in that order (though you still
shouldn't buy Eric, you should get it from your library).
You should buy G!G, because it's the first Watch book, and gives some
background that is useful in reading the nex watch books.
L&L and M!M (Masquerade) are witches books, but L&L occurs before M!M,
and thus should be read first. However, L&L is _much_ darker than M!M,
so if you're looking for light reading, go for M!M... OTOH, seeing
untolkienesque elves these days should be rather interesting <G>
As everybody on this thread, I thus seem to recommend you buying G!G
and L&L.
François-Xavier de Montgolfier
> We have to bring the Belgians in too... Anyone that can come up
>with a cheese called "vieux puant" has to be part of that meal :-)
Agreed
>On the
>other hand, I'd also love to know how a country that is quite so willing to
>cook anything that comes to hand looks askance at haggis.
Are you refering to France? I never noticed that we looked askance at
haggis. Though I want French people to look askance at haggis, it
means there'll be more for me ;-P
FiX <yes, I've actually tried haggis and loved it>
--
If you can't take fucking responsibility for fucking supervising your
children on the fucking internet. I suggest you stop fucking.
---Kayla's "raising children in the electronic age for Dummies"
François-Xavier de Montgolfier
wrote:
>"François-Xavier de Montgolfier" wrote:
>
>> /me realizes that the French afpers _should_ organize a "let's gross
>> out furriners" meet, full of oysters, cervelas, pâté de tęte, munster,
>> andouillette, frog legs, foie gras, salade de gésiers, snails, quite a
>> few fromages that you've got to smell to believe in...
>
>Ooh, can I come?
Of course
>(Providing I don't have to eat the cheeses. I'll do the
>"grossed out furriner" thing on them,
Err, no, you don't seem to understand: you'll do the grossed out
furriner thing on them, and _then_ eat them ;-P
>and then sneakily eat everything else.
/me starts having seconds thought at this stage
Err, please note that I do intend to eat, too!
>Except I don't know what gesiers are... oh well, it can't be worse
>than natto.)
Sonce I don't know what natto is... After looking in myFrench-English
dictionary, gesier's gizzard in English. Not that the word is an
obvious rip-off of the French one, of course <G>
>The yuckians could bring some delicious traditional delicacies like
>jellied eels and cow-heel pie along in return :)
Never tasted jellied eels. Will have to...
Orjan Westin
> On 30 Jan 2003 17:38:39 +0000, Ingvar Mattsson
> <ing...@cathouse.bofh.se> wrote:
>
>> "Orjan Westin" <nos...@cunobaros.demon.co.uk> writes:
>>
>>> Their
>>> food, at least, is fresh, apart from the cheese and wine. Whereas
>>> our way with fish...
>
> meat wait for 3 weeks to a month, when the meat would become
> "faisandée" (bits of the meat would start separeting from the whole
> body on their own, for instance). You could then cook the meat. I said
> earlier that this was sadly outdated, because I could on some
> occasions taste game that had been faisandé, and that was _good_!
Well, perhaps the southrons who've no respect for their history find it
outdated, but I personally know at least four hunters who let the meat hang
for 2-4 weeks. Obviously, you can't have small game hang as long as roe
deer or moose, and the only bird i know is regularly hung to mature is
"tjäder" - Tetrao urogallus.
> There is actually quite a few recipes that don't work with fresh meat,
> and these recipes mostly cannot be recreated today, as the meat should
> not be put in a freezer for the right bacteria to start developping.
So, basically, you don't do gross food anymore, what with it being outdated
and all?
>> some samples of surströmming and lutfisk[1].
Surströmming:
http://www.svensson.com/norge/sur1.htm
http://www.escapeartist.com/efam32/swedish.html
http://www.bahnhof.se/%7Echimbis/tocb/recipes/fish/f22.htm
Lutfisk:
http://www.recipesource.com/ethnic/europe/swedish/lutfisk1.html
http://www.surfminnesota.net/lutfisk.html
Orjan
Graycat
wrote:
>And maybe a mug of nyponsoppa.
oh yes <goes off to make some>
>And semlor!
Fat tuesday isn't till mars 4th this year. I may have to cheat by a
few weeks...sigh
>DelicatobollarDelicatobollarDelicatobollarDelicatobollarDelicatobollarDelica
>tobollarDelicatobollar.............
Ah yes, 5SEK at the school cafteria...to keep me awake through bio...