Lancre?
Peter Bleackley
In the Language lab, clive sandrey writes:
|> Hi.
|>
|> I am new to this newsgroup, infact to any newsgroup, but not to Terry
|> Pratchett.
|>
|> I just wondered exactly how Lancre is pronounced. Is is Lankray, Lanker,
|> or Lancre (french-like)?
|>
|> Unimportant? Maybe, but its been bugging me!
|>
Lancre being a very down-to-earth place, with nothing 'forn' about it at
all, I'd go for the pronunciation most natural to English, i.e. Lanker.
--
~PETE "QUANTUM" BLEACKLEY~
Daleks! Repent of your evil ways, and live in peace as plumbers!
X-Ray Astronomy Group University of Leicester
p...@star.le.ac.uk ~ Website coming soon
clive sandrey
Hold on, this newsgroup goes to fast for me:
all the messages I want to read keep dissappearing. How do I find them?
Anyway, someone replied to my Lancre message, and I hadn't thought of
saying Lancre with an s. Lanser seems to make sense to me.
Cheers
Ulrich Schreitmueller
On Mon, 27 Jan 1997, clive sandrey wrote:
> I just wondered exactly how Lancre is pronounced. Is is Lankray, Lanker,
> or Lancre (french-like)?
>
> Unimportant? Maybe, but its been bugging me!
In the audio tape version of Wyrd Sisters, Tony Robinson pronounces it
french-like - "Lauhnkr'".
But then I had my problems with his pronounciation of Hwel, so it doesn't
have to be accurate.
Cheers, Ulrich
(.sig under construction)
clive sandrey
Hi.
I am new to this newsgroup, infact to any newsgroup, but not to Terry
Pratchett.
I just wondered exactly how Lancre is pronounced. Is is Lankray, Lanker,
or Lancre (french-like)?
Unimportant? Maybe, but its been bugging me!
Cheers
Kedamono
In article <32EC9D...@netgates.co.uk>, clive sandrey
<c.sa...@netgates.co.uk> wrote:
> I just wondered exactly how Lancre is pronounced. Is is Lankray, Lanker,
> or Lancre (french-like)?
>
> Unimportant? Maybe, but its been bugging me!
>
Not unimportant at all. Especially if you plan to rhyme the word. I've
always pronounced it "Lanser", using that sometimes curious reversed "re"
to be "er"
I think Pterry may be quiet on this subject, he sorta let's us work this
stuff out for ourselves.
--
The Kedamono Dragon | The "Anthill Inside" Page is at:
Keda...@concentric.net | http://www.concentric.net/~kedamono
Keda...@aol.com |
---------------------------------------------------------------------
Take a look at the Alternate History Travel Guides! | Ook!
http://users.aol.com/kedamono/sliders/alterguides.html | Gleep!
---------------------------------------------------------------------
All shall quail before me! For I am the Mentos! The Freshmaker!
Derek Lavin
In message <5cikl3$k...@falcon.le.ac.uk>
p...@ltsun6.star.le.ac.uk (Peter Bleackley) writes:
> Lancre being a very down-to-earth place, with nothing 'forn' about it at
> all, I'd go for the pronunciation most natural to English, i.e. Lanker.
I've always pronounced in "CROI-dun".
Glenn Brady
On 27 Jan 1997 13:35:14 GMT, keda...@concentric.net (Kedamono) wrote:
> In article <32EC9D...@netgates.co.uk>, clive sandrey
> <c.sa...@netgates.co.uk> wrote:
>
> > I just wondered exactly how Lancre is pronounced. Is is Lankray, Lanker,
> > or Lancre (french-like)?
> Not unimportant at all. Especially if you plan to rhyme the word. I've
> always pronounced it "Lanser", using that sometimes curious reversed "re"
> to be "er"
Lanker, as in Lankershire, IMHO.
"They were discussing strategy when Rincewind arrived. The concensus seemed to be that if really large numbers of men were sent to storm the mountain, then enough might survive the rocks to take the citadel. This is essentially the basis of all military thinking." Eric - Terry Pratchett
Kedamono
In article <32ed6d2f...@news.pipeline.com.au>,
gro...@pipeline.com.au wrote:
> On 27 Jan 1997 13:35:14 GMT, keda...@concentric.net (Kedamono) wrote:
> > Not unimportant at all. Especially if you plan to rhyme the word. I've
> > always pronounced it "Lanser", using that sometimes curious reversed "re"
> > to be "er"
>
> Lanker, as in Lankershire, IMHO.
>
Lancre has this very french look to it, so I've been pronouncing it
Lanser. Lanker sounds like "canker" as in cankersore. While Lancre may be
a bit out of the way, it surely isn't a canker.
Tony Finch
clive sandrey <c.sa...@netgates.co.uk> wrote:
>
>Anyway, someone replied to my Lancre message, and I hadn't thought of
>saying Lancre with an s. Lanser seems to make sense to me.
What, so it rhymes with words like "acre" and "massacre" and
"mediocre"?
FTony.
--
(S(SKK)(SKK))(S(SKK)(SKK))
Paul Mabbs
On Tue, 28 Jan 1997, Glenn Brady wrote:
> On 27 Jan 1997 13:35:14 GMT, keda...@concentric.net (Kedamono) wrote:
> > > I just wondered exactly how Lancre is pronounced. Is is Lankray, Lanker,
> > > or Lancre (french-like)?
> > I've always pronounced it "Lanser", using that sometimes curious
> > reversed "re" to be "er"
> Lanker, as in Lankershire, IMHO.
Personally, I've always pronounced it to rhyme with Ocre. Most people I
talk to know where I mean too...
<followed by this: all on one line>
> "They were discussing strategy when Rincewind arrived. The concensus
seemed to be that if really large numbers of men were sent to storm the
mountain, then enough might survive the rocks to take the citadel. This
is essentially the basis of all military thinking." Eric -
Terry Pratchett
>
Is my newsreader dying (again) or have you got one hell of a long line
length set...?
--
Paul.
/--------------------------------------+-----------------------------------\
/ Sometimes insanity is the only sane | pj...@leicester.ac.uk \
\ way to cope with an insane world. | pager: 01523 180232 /
\--------------------------------------+-----------------------------------/
Victoria Martin
On 28 Jan 1997, Kedamono wrote:
> >
>
> Lancre has this very french look to it, so I've been pronouncing it
> Lanser. Lanker sounds like "canker" as in cankersore. While Lancre may be
> a bit out of the way, it surely isn't a canker.
I know next to nothing about French, but this doesn't sound right to me.
If it were spelt Lancer then it might be pronounced "lanser" in French
(as it would in English) but not spelt Lancre - isn't there a French
word "fiacre", which is pronounced sort of like "fiaker" but with more
of an r-quality on the vowel? Anyway, byy analogy with "acre" I've been
pronouncing it "lanker".
Victoria
MJ DIMMICK
Glenn Brady (gro...@pipeline.com.au) wrote:
: On 27 Jan 1997 13:35:14 GMT, keda...@concentric.net (Kedamono) wrote:
: > In article <32EC9D...@netgates.co.uk>, clive sandrey
: > <c.sa...@netgates.co.uk> wrote:
: >
: > > I just wondered exactly how Lancre is pronounced. Is is Lankray, Lanker,
: > > or Lancre (french-like)?
: > Not unimportant at all. Especially if you plan to rhyme the word. I've
: > always pronounced it "Lanser", using that sometimes curious reversed "re"
: > to be "er"
:
: Lanker, as in Lankershire, IMHO.
Although in Discworld II game, Granny Weatherwax pronounces it in what
might be considered the French manner i.e. 'Longkre' (I'm a bit poor
at these pronunciation spellings). However, I'm not sure what sort of
authority that is, given that they feature a character titled 'Henry
Coffin'...
--
Michael Dimmick | dimm...@aston.ac.uk | http://www.aston.ac.uk/~dimmicmj
"Outside on the battlements, the guard changed. In fact he changed
into his gardening apron and went off to hoe the beans..."
I really must get out more...
Dave O'Brien
While strolling along the information footpath on Mon, 27 Jan
1997 12:19:48 +0000, I noticed clive sandrey
<c.sa...@netgates.co.uk> say:
>I just wondered exactly how Lancre is pronounced. Is is Lankray, Lanker,
>or Lancre (french-like)?
In the DWII game it's pronounced in the French style. I
personally prefer to pronounce it in the Northern style: Lanker
--
Dave O'Brien, ("Hee Bert, er zit 'n banaan in je oor.")
Provisional Michelena Riosa Testosterone Brigade
Undercover field agent in Charge of the Irish Answer
and of being very far away (but not small)
Dave O'Brien
While strolling along the information footpath on Mon, 27 Jan
<c.sa...@netgates.co.uk> say:
>Hold on, this newsgroup goes to fast for me:
>
>all the messages I want to read keep dissappearing. How do I find them?
Stop using Netscape. Try Free Agent instead
(http://www.forteinc.com)
Terry Pratchett
In article <kedamono-270...@cnc096072.concentric.net>,
Kedamono <keda...@concentric.net> writes
>In article <32ed6d2f...@news.pipeline.com.au>,
>gro...@pipeline.com.au wrote:
>
>> On 27 Jan 1997 13:35:14 GMT, keda...@concentric.net (Kedamono) wrote:
>> > Not unimportant at all. Especially if you plan to rhyme the word. I've
>> > always pronounced it "Lanser", using that sometimes curious reversed "re"
>> > to be "er"
>>
>> Lanker, as in Lankershire, IMHO.
Correct
>
--
Terry Pratchett
Glenn Brady
On 28 Jan 1997 05:04:57 GMT, keda...@concentric.net (Kedamono) wrote:
> >
> > Lanker, as in Lankershire, IMHO.
> >
>
> Lancre has this very french look to it, so I've been pronouncing it
> Lanser. Lanker sounds like "canker" as in cankersore. While Lancre may be
> a bit out of the way, it surely isn't a canker.
Somewhere in Lords and Ladies (I think it is) the locals are described as
Lancreastrians, so I tend to pronounce it with a north-of-England accent.
Have I got the Geography right?
"There were one thousand, two hundred and eighty-three religious books in
there now, each one - according to itself - the only book any man need ever
read. It was sort of nice to see them all together. As Didactolys used to
say, you had to laugh." *Small Gods, by Terry Pratchett*
Martyn Clapham
In article <kedamono-270...@cnc096072.concentric.net>,
Kedamono <keda...@concentric.net> writes
>In article <32ed6d2f...@news.pipeline.com.au>,
>gro...@pipeline.com.au wrote:
>
>> On 27 Jan 1997 13:35:14 GMT, keda...@concentric.net (Kedamono) wrote:
>> > Not unimportant at all. Especially if you plan to rhyme the word. I've
>> > always pronounced it "Lanser", using that sometimes curious reversed "re"
>> > to be "er"
>>
>>
>
>Lancre has this very french look to it, so I've been pronouncing it
>Lanser. Lanker sounds like "canker" as in cankersore. While Lancre may be
>a bit out of the way, it surely isn't a canker.
>
I'm surprised The Bellman, ppint or any of the others from round here
haven't had anything to say about it.[1]
MartynC
[1] Given Demons slow news at present, one of them will have posted by
the time this gets around.
--
http://www.mclapham.demon.co.uk Mobile 0860 914817 AFPurity 61%
Member of LUHU and Michelena Riosa Testosterone Brigade
Minion in charge of asset sharing.
Richard Kettlewell
Dave O'Brien <d...@diaspoir.demon.co.uk> wrote:
><c.sa...@netgates.co.uk> wrote:
>>Hold on, this newsgroup goes to fast for me:
>>
>>all the messages I want to read keep dissappearing. How do I find them?
>
>Stop using Netscape. Try Free Agent instead
>(http://www.forteinc.com)
Well, that's the first time I've heard of a newsreader that can
remotely edit expire.ctl...
--
Richard Kettlewell http://www.elmail.co.uk/staff/richard/
May the Carrier be with you.
Sean B Purdy
Recently, the esteemed MJ DIMMICK, dimm...@aston.ac.uk, imparted:
~ :> <c.sa...@netgates.co.uk> wrote:
~ :>> I just wondered exactly how Lancre is pronounced. Is is Lankray, Lanker
~ :>> or Lancre (french-like)?
~ :> always pronounced it "Lanser", using that sometimes curious reversed "re"
~ :> to be "er"
~ :
~ : Lanker, as in Lankershire, IMHO.
~ might be considered the French manner i.e. 'Longkre' (I'm a bit poor
My 2p: Lan-cruh
Sean
--
Sean B Purdy, system administrator se...@fastnet.co.uk
>> really! is this a usenet newsgroup, or a seventh grade locker room? [1]
>The only way I've ever been able to tell is by the smell. [2]
- [1] Matt Soell [2] Alex Chapman
The Bellman of Ankh
Terry Pratchett <tprat...@unseen.demon.co.uk> wrote in article
<o7pnEGAW...@unseen.demon.co.uk>...
> In article <kedamono-270...@cnc096072.concentric.net>,
> Kedamono <keda...@concentric.net> writes
> >In article <32ed6d2f...@news.pipeline.com.au>,
> >gro...@pipeline.com.au wrote:
> >
> >> On 27 Jan 1997 13:35:14 GMT, keda...@concentric.net (Kedamono)
wrote:
> >> > Not unimportant at all. Especially if you plan to rhyme the
word. I've
reversed "re"
> >>
> >> Lanker, as in Lankershire, IMHO.
>
> --
> Terry Pratchett
>
Just in case any of you missed it!
It is pronounced LANKER as in Lancashire - where a serious number of
the witches come from.
I'm catching up on the ng after being away for a week. I can't believe
the number of follow-ups to this one post. Especially since Pterry has
answered with what *he* considers to be the correct pronunciation
(although as I have asked him on at least one occasion - what does he
know).
FWIW, in an earlier post Pterry also said, about the pronunciation of
Hwell:
"I'm pretty sure that 'Howl' would be close to the proper Welsh
pronunciation, although it[sic] my head I always pronounced it
as 'H-well'"
Now all I need is for the man himself to tell me how he thinks "Gytha"
should be pronounced and then I'll go and show his post to the director
of the local production of Wyrd Sisters that almost got it right in
December and will be geting it better in February.
--
The Official Michelena Riosa Testosterone Brigade
Founder Member and President for Life, New Members Welcome
The Bellman of Ankh, j...@burnis01.airtime.co.uk afpurity 58%
David James Spillett
In article <o7pnEGAW...@unseen.demon.co.uk>, Terry Pratchett
<tprat...@unseen.demon.co.uk> writes
>In article <kedamono-270...@cnc096072.concentric.net>,
>Kedamono <keda...@concentric.net> writes
>>In article <32ed6d2f...@news.pipeline.com.au>,
>>gro...@pipeline.com.au wrote:
>>
>>> On 27 Jan 1997 13:35:14 GMT, keda...@concentric.net (Kedamono) wrote:
>>> > Not unimportant at all. Especially if you plan to rhyme the word. I've
>>> > always pronounced it "Lanser", using that sometimes curious reversed "re"
>>> > to be "er"
>>>
>>> Lanker, as in Lankershire, IMHO.
>
>Correct
>>
>
Just for the record, that's how I've always said it. Ditto for evryone
I've talked to 'bout DW.
--
David James Spillett
ad...@djspillett.demon.co.uk
Preserve wildlife:
pickle a squirrel!
Please excuse my tardy reply. My ISP (Demon UK)
have problems resulting in a /5 hour/ news backlog.
They seem to be gradually getting a hold on the problem.
/And not before time./ (was 60 hours for a while...)
Turnpike evaluation. For information, see http://www.turnpike.com/
Martyn Clapham
In article <Zyq$YGAbQ0...@mclapham.demon.co.uk>, Martyn Clapham
<mar...@mclapham.demon.co.uk> writes
>Being a Lancastrian, I've always pronounced it 'Lankrer'.
>
Sorry about following up my own post, but I realised after re-reading
this last night that my phonetic spelling is wrong. I actually pronounce
it 'Lancruh'.
BTW Demon must be back up to speed, and maybe better than ever, as the
original post was avilable at about 19:00 after being posted at about
12:30. I don't think I ever used to see things I posted from work at
noon until the following day even though I check afp again when I get
home.
MartynC
Dave O'Brien (Wearing a duck on his head)
Richard Kettlewell:
>Well, that's the first time I've heard of a newsreader that can
>remotely edit expire.ctl...
*shrug* Difference between on- and off-line newsreaders, I
suppose. Not editing expire.ctl, just dling the stuff to your own
hd and purging it as req'd.
--
Dave O'Brien, ("Hee Ernie, er zit 'n banaan in je oor.")
("Wat zeg je Bert? ik hoor je niet. Er zit 'n banaan in m'n oor.")
pMRTB: Our man in the Far East, The VIP's wife (or brood-husband)
Quaaaaack! (Will you shut up!)
Sean B Purdy
Recently, the esteemed The Bellman of Ankh,
j...@burnis01.airtime.co.uk, imparted:
~ Now all I need is for the man himself to tell me how he thinks "Gytha"
~ should be pronounced and then I'll go and show his post to the director
~ of the local production of Wyrd Sisters that almost got it right in
~ December and will be geting it better in February.
"Githa"? Doesn't rhyme with wither, almost rhymes with differ.
Sean
--
Sean B Purdy, system administrator se...@fastnet.co.uk
Ceci n'est pas un double .sig
Sean B Purdy, system administrator se...@fastnet.co.uk
Ceci n'est pas un double .sig
Terry Pratchett
In article <01bc0f03$26ff10e0$0100007f@default>, The Bellman of Ankh
<j...@burnis01.airtime.co.uk> writes
>Now all I need is for the man himself to tell me how he thinks "Gytha"
>
>
--
Terry Pratchett
Stuart Bainbridge
Martyn Clapham <mar...@mclapham.demon.co.uk> wrote in article
<Zyq$YGAbQ0...@mclapham.demon.co.uk>...
<snip>
> >> On 27 Jan 1997 13:35:14 GMT, keda...@concentric.net (Kedamono) wrote:
> >> > Not unimportant at all. Especially if you plan to rhyme the word.
I've
> >> > always pronounced it "Lanser", using that sometimes curious reversed
"re"
> >> > to be "er"
> >> Lanker, as in Lankershire, IMHO.
> >
> >Lancre has this very french look to it, so I've been pronouncing it
> >Lanser. Lanker sounds like "canker" as in cankersore. While Lancre may
be
> >a bit out of the way, it surely isn't a canker.
> >
> Being a Lancastrian, I've always pronounced it 'Lankrer'.
>
> I'm surprised The Bellman, ppint or any of the others from round here
> haven't had anything to say about it.[1]
>
> MartynC
I'd have to agree with you, Martyn.
Do you not think that Lancre has a feel of Lancashire, i.e. the Pendle
Witches?
--
>>One Nation>>One People>>One Tribe>>One House>>
Stuart Bainbridge
Glenn Brady
> >>> Lanker, as in Lankershire, IMHO.
> >
> >Correct
> >>
> >
> Ah, but does his opinion count? ;-)
Absolutely. Up to 20 at the very least.
Joann L Dominik
Sean B Purdy (se...@neptune.fast.net.uk) wrote:
: Recently, the esteemed The Bellman of Ankh,
: j...@burnis01.airtime.co.uk, imparted:
: ~ Now all I need is for the man himself to tell me how he thinks "Gytha"
: ~ should be pronounced and then I'll go and show his post to the director
: ~ of the local production of Wyrd Sisters that almost got it right in
: ~ December and will be geting it better in February.
: "Githa"? Doesn't rhyme with wither, almost rhymes with differ.
No it doesn't. And it can't sound like "Geeth-ur," either. (And no, it
doesn't rhyme with "either"....)
Since I hear I'm called a merkin again elsewhere (haven't seen it yet
myself, but believe me, I shall enjoy it...), I'm going to demand this in
public. What *is* it with the English tendency to tell people there's an R
in a word when it's *prefectly* obvious that "Gytha" has no R in it??
Gytha cannot have a pronunciation that's spelled out with Rs in it. No. I
refuse to admit this makes sense.
The *only* reason you guys put that R in, esp. in cases like "Geeth-ur",
is to define what type of vowel sound you mean. Admit it. I had a damned
idiot tell me to pronounce the name "Blanche" as "blarrrrnch." So I did.
With all of my merkin Rs that I had to spare. He couldn't see my point.
All right, so a proper English pronunciation (not a "British accent," and
not even an English accent, as I've been told that there is a way to speak
English with no accent, and have finally conceded on that...) is very
light on the Rs, and in most cases doesn't pronounce them. But then why do
you go and use them when spelling out a phonetic pronunciation of a word
that *has* no R in it?? Why do you bother? Do you *know* you're doing
this?
Irrelevent? Probably. It's just that I've asked this of so many damned
English types, and not one of them admits this. I *know* some of you know
you've dropped the Rs in some words. So why do you use them in spelling
this stuff?
I'll be checking into the wibble ward shortly, don't worry.
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
The Very Intelligent Pig http://www.cloudnet.com/~jldomini
"I was a mixture of alarmed, flattered, and raspberry with a
hint of cinnamon-- it's a new recipe I'm trying." --B
Roger Barnett
In article: <5cu97n$v...@pleides.cloudnet.com> jldo...@antares.cloudnet.com (Joann L
Dominik) writes:
>
>[snip]
> All right, so a proper English pronunciation is very light on the Rs,
> go and use them when spelling out a phonetic pronunciation of a
> word that *has* no R in it?? Why do you bother? Do you *know*
> you're doing this?
I don't know whether this is a complete explanation, but it is
certainly true that there appear to be quite a lot of people over
here who just can't help speaking through their Rs.
--
Roger Barnett
Colm Buckley
> == jldo...@antares.cloudnet.com (Joann L Dominik)
> What *is* it with the English tendency to tell people there's an R
> in a word when it's *prefectly* obvious that "Gytha" has no R in it??
As you so correctly point out, this is because in large parts of the U.K.,
most notably in south-eastern England, "r" has become a non-voiced
consonant when following a vowel[1]. It's strange, but (as this thread
makes clear), it has actually reached the point that people can actually
use it when attempting to "phonetically" spell a word, *intending* the
"r" to be silent. This causes considerable confusion to those of us who
don't elide the "r"; it isn't done in Ireland either.
> [...] I've been told that there is a way to speak English with no accent
And *I've* been told that this "neutral" accent is closest to an Irish
accent, with some modifications to the tone. Did anyone who spoke to me
at any afpmeet have any trouble understanding me? :)
Colm
--
Colm Buckley B.F. | EMail : Colm.B...@tcd.ie or co...@lspace.org
Computer Science | WWW : http://isg.cs.tcd.ie/cbuckley/
Trinity College | Phone : +353 87 469146 (087-469146 within Ireland)
Dublin 2, Ireland | "Microsoft : Where do you want to crash today?"
[1] It seems that the letter "t" is also going down this road. Whatever
will English English sound like in 100 years' time? No consonants at
all?
Simon Brown
Colm Buckley spake thusly:
> > == jldo...@antares.cloudnet.com (Joann L Dominik)
>
> > What *is* it with the English tendency to tell people there's an R
> > in a word when it's *prefectly* obvious that "Gytha" has no R in it??
>
> As you so correctly point out, this is because in large parts of the U.K.,
> most notably in south-eastern England, "r" has become a non-voiced
> consonant when following a vowel[1]. It's strange, but (as this thread
> makes clear), it has actually reached the point that people can actually
> use it when attempting to "phonetically" spell a word, *intending* the
> "r" to be silent. This causes considerable confusion to those of us who
> don't elide the "r"; it isn't done in Ireland either.
Just to be awkward, I don't think *I* tend to do that when doing phonetic
spellings, but they do tell me I'm a bit "different", so...
Plus I could of course be completely wrong.
> > [...] I've been told that there is a way to speak English with no accent
>
> And *I've* been told that this "neutral" accent is closest to an Irish
> accent, with some modifications to the tone. Did anyone who spoke to me
> at any afpmeet have any trouble understanding me? :)
I certainly had no trouble understanding your *accent*. As for
understanding you, well, that may take a bit more time :)
> [1] It seems that the letter "t" is also going down this road. Whatever
> will English English sound like in 100 years' time? No consonants at
> all?
For myself, I expect to be rather silent around that time. Either that or
dribbling profusely.
--
Simon Brown BF <si...@amdev.demon.co.uk> / Freelance cynic and beard-wearer
[INFP] http://www.amdev.demon.co.uk/ / Mankind's last best hope for pizza.
Sullen anglepoise lamps spotted in Power Cable, Nebraska. "You'll go blind,
you know." said a local barman.
Tony Finch
jldo...@antares.cloudnet.com (Joann L Dominik) writes:
>
> All right, so a proper English pronunciation is very light on the Rs,
> and in most cases doesn't pronounce them. But then why do you
> go and use them when spelling out a phonetic pronunciation of a
> word that *has* no R in it?? Why do you bother? Do you *know*
> you're doing this?
I shall invoke the "intrusive R" to explain this. If I were to say
"Gytha arrived" it would come out something like "githererrived", with
the Rs pronounced. The intrusive R is seen as a bit sloppy, and RP
tends to discourage it; in my speech it's there but only a little.
FTony.
--
shift = \h.\k. h (\v.\c. c (k v)) (\z.z)
perv = \x. null x (if (\k. k x) (shift (\f.\k. hd x (\h. tl x
(\t. perv t (\t. f t (\t. cons h t k)))))))
perverse = \x. perv x (\z.z)
Joann L Dominik
Colm Buckley (co...@lspace.org) wrote:
: > == jldo...@antares.cloudnet.com (Joann L Dominik)
: > What *is* it with the English tendency to tell people there's an R
: > in a word when it's *prefectly* obvious that "Gytha" has no R in it??
: As you so correctly point out, this is because in large parts of the U.K.,
: most notably in south-eastern England, "r" has become a non-voiced
: consonant when following a vowel[1]. It's strange, but (as this thread
: makes clear), it has actually reached the point that people can actually
: use it when attempting to "phonetically" spell a word, *intending* the
: "r" to be silent. This causes considerable confusion to those of us who
: don't elide the "r"; it isn't done in Ireland either.
I noticed that. It's one of the reasons you're so much easier to
understand. :} Ok, ok, easier for *me* to understand, from a standing
start and all that...
I'm still trying to figure out if the English are actually aware of this
tendency and deny it, or if they really *do* believe they're saying a
letter they're actually not saying. I've yet to see one of them admit it,
in all honesty. Even when confronted on the subject.
: > [...] I've been told that there is a way to speak English with no accent
: And *I've* been told that this "neutral" accent is closest to an Irish
: accent, with some modifications to the tone. Did anyone who spoke to me
: at any afpmeet have any trouble understanding me? :)
Ha. None, as I said... I'm also going to point out that when hearing
someone who speaks the Received Pronunciation, they use more Rs than the
usual everyday English types I've talked to. Which is another reason I
don't understand this tendency to use Rs in phonetic spelling...
: [1] It seems that the letter "t" is also going down this road. Whatever
: will English English sound like in 100 years' time? No consonants at
: all?
Hm. Good point. Although if it makes you feel any better, Americans are at
least keeping up with this trend a *little* bit better.
Dick Eney
> and in most cases doesn't pronounce them. But then why do you
> go and use them when spelling out a phonetic pronunciation of a
> word that *has* no R in it?? Why do you bother? Do you *know*
> you're doing this?
Ahem. Having grown up in New England, where Rs are not pronounced in most
positions within the words (at least other people say we don't pronounce
them :) ), I feel qualified to comment on this. Y'see, we do pronounce
the R, except that our particular dialect pronunciation of R is "ah". The
(un)pronounced R usually affects the vowel sounds near it, too. Since we
have learned that an R is present mostly by the way the vowel near it
sound, we assume that whenever a vowel has that sound, there is an R in
the word. There's also a complicating factor with the schwa sounds, but
that gets very complex. Thus, "Harvard" sounds to others like "Hahvahd"
yet "Florida" comes out as "Florider".
When someone who knows that what sounds like "Hahvahd" is spelled
"Harvard" then wants to spell "Bah" (e.g.), if their spelling is weak the
word might come out "Bar". Or, to use a pterry reference, when Johnny
wants to write "shan't" he knows it rhymes with "bar" (pronounced "bah"),
so he assumes that it has an R and writes it "sharnt".
IMO. That's the only explanation I can come up with, anyway.
=Tamar (sharing account dick...@access.digex.net)
Joann L Dominik
Tony Finch (fa...@lspace.org) wrote:
: jldo...@antares.cloudnet.com (Joann L Dominik) writes:
: >
: > All right, so a proper English pronunciation is very light on the Rs,
: > go and use them when spelling out a phonetic pronunciation of a
: > word that *has* no R in it?? Why do you bother? Do you *know*
: > you're doing this?
: I shall invoke the "intrusive R" to explain this. If I were to say
: "Gytha arrived" it would come out something like "githererrived", with
: the Rs pronounced. The intrusive R is seen as a bit sloppy, and RP
: tends to discourage it; in my speech it's there but only a little.
(And apologies to Roger Barnett, who had to go and make that arse
comment... You're a very silly man, um, sir. I'm dangerously close to
punning now, so I'll have to stop...)
Right. I have noticed the "intrusive R" phenomenon (& on & on) (what a
distraction), but once again, not all of the English I asked about it
would admit it existed. I had someone say "China is." He separated the
words with a glottal stop, then. But when I explained what I meant, he
answered and used the phrase as "Chineris." And then proceeded to repeat
to me what I'd just said, as if he'd just discovered it. Very
frustrating...
So you stick an R in to separate two vowels. This doesn't explain why you
leave it out at other times, and *don't* be giving me any "R conservation"
hoopie. Or I'll maliciously make up another euphemism at you... You know,
I had to explain the Edward Woodward joke at least 3 times now. it's
amazing how confusing one consonant can be..
Victoria Martin
On 3 Feb 1997, Joann L Dominik wrote:
>
> Right. I have noticed the "intrusive R" phenomenon (& on & on) (what a
> distraction), but once again, not all of the English I asked about it
> would admit it existed.
That's because most of the time they don't notice they do it.
> So you stick an R in to separate two vowels. This doesn't explain why you
> leave it out at other times, and *don't* be giving me any "R conservation"
> hoopie.
American English (like Irish English) is a so-called rhotic language,
which means speakers pronounce R when it occurs after a vowel (caR, caRt
etc.) Rhotic languages do not allow the linking R (in ChinaRis) because
speakers perceive the R as a proper consonant and say "hey, why are you
sticking in that extra R". British English is non-rhotic (R is only
pronounced when it occurs before a vowel). This means that speakers don't
"notice" the linking R, for them it's just a by-product of the attempt to
get your mouth and tongue into position ready for the second vowel. They
don't hear it as a consonant as such. So voila! Brits accuse Amis of
sticking in gratuitous Rs all over the place, and Amis accuse Brits of
doing it. And they're both right. Or both wrong, depending on whether
you're the optimistic or the pessimistic type.
Victoria
Smeg
In article <01bc0f03$26ff10e0$0100007f@default>, The Bellman of Ankh
<j...@burnis01.airtime.co.uk> writes
>
>Hwell:
>
> "I'm pretty sure that 'Howl' would be close to the proper Welsh
> pronunciation, although it[sic] my head I always pronounced it
> as 'H-well'"
>
(ie. LL) is pronounced with a sort of choking noise. Kindof like a dry
gargle at the back of the throat... I takes years to get it just right,
and when you do you can't get the damn thing out of your head, even
after I havn't spoken a word of welsh for years. To hear the correct
sounding word, find your local Welsh person (there should be one, we're
everywhere :) ) and get them to make silly noises at you :)
Ah well one of those things :)
paul
Aleternative Computer Terminology.
Incompatibility: any situation involving humans and computers.
Bits: the things scattered on the floor after you throw your computer down the
stairs.
Windows: Point, press and panic.
Motherboard: The main circuit board respnsible for checking that all the other
circuit boards are eating properly and wearing clean underwear.
Matthe...@ansuz.sooke.bc.ca
James Gater
In message <5cu97n$v...@pleides.cloudnet.com>
jldo...@antares.cloudnet.com (Joann L Dominik) writes:
> Sean B Purdy (se...@neptune.fast.net.uk) wrote:
> : Recently, the esteemed The Bellman of Ankh,
> : j...@burnis01.airtime.co.uk, imparted:
> No it doesn't. And it can't sound like "Geeth-ur," either. (And no, it
> doesn't rhyme with "either"....)
is that eyetherr or eeetherr?
> The *only* reason you guys put that R in, esp. in cases like "Geeth-ur",
> is to define what type of vowel sound you mean. Admit it. I had a damned
> idiot tell me to pronounce the name "Blanche" as "blarrrrnch." So I did.
> With all of my merkin Rs that I had to spare. He couldn't see my point.
You know, it could be the opposite of silent 'h's [1], as in Blahhhnch.
English has an honourable history of silent letters, and added
letters when it comes to pronunciation. It's cos it's such a
bastard[2] language, like.
[1] i.e. added 'h's
[2] in both senses
--
Sex is not the answer. Sex is the question. "Yes" is the answer.
email:- j.g...@zetnet.co.uk
WWW:- http://www.brunel.ac.uk/~ee95jjg
Joann L Dominik
Dick Eney (dick...@access1.digex.net) wrote:
: jldo...@antares.cloudnet.com (Joann L Dominik) writes:
: >
: >[snip]
: > and in most cases doesn't pronounce them. But then why do you
: > go and use them when spelling out a phonetic pronunciation of a
: > word that *has* no R in it?? Why do you bother? Do you *know*
: > you're doing this?
: When someone who knows that what sounds like "Hahvahd" is spelled
: "Harvard" then wants to spell "Bah" (e.g.), if their spelling is weak the
: word might come out "Bar". Or, to use a pterry reference, when Johnny
: wants to write "shan't" he knows it rhymes with "bar" (pronounced "bah"),
: so he assumes that it has an R and writes it "sharnt".
This is exactly what happens, yes. That's how I see it happening. But the
question is, do all these silly English types know they're doing it? So
far, only FTony has shown any hint of awareness. I'm beginning to feel
hugely superior, since they don't even *know* what they're saying. Not
that I'm trying to prick (don't!) any egos or anything here. And I do know
that some have had to be trained to drop their Rs when they speak.
And for those who've wondered if I know what I'm saying, an "Rs" is an
arse is an ass. Well, sort of. Depending on your accent.
Roger Barnett
In article: <5d6hng$4...@pleides.cloudnet.com> jldo...@antares.cloudnet.com (Joann L
Dominik) writes:
>
> Dick Eney (dick...@access1.digex.net) wrote:
>
> : When someone who knows that what sounds like "Hahvahd" is spelled
> : "Harvard" then wants to spell "Bah" (e.g.), if their spelling is weak the
> : word might come out "Bar". Or, to use a pterry reference, when Johnny
> : wants to write "shan't" he knows it rhymes with "bar" (pronounced "bah"),
> : so he assumes that it has an R and writes it "sharnt".
Someone record some sound files for this, cos I find it very difficult
to "hear" spelled pronunciations. Surely the stress in Harvard is on
the first syllable, so the second gets partly swallowed (so that it
sounds more like the 'ud' in cud). And the 'an' in shan't doesn't rhyme
with bar or bah (except perhaps when stressing the word for effect -
which of course leads to the real difficulty, people pronounce the
same word in different ways in different contexts).
> This is exactly what happens, yes. That's how I see it happening. But the
> question is, do all these silly English types know they're doing it? So
> far, only FTony has shown any hint of awareness. I'm beginning to feel
> hugely superior, since they don't even *know* what they're saying.
Well we do really, but we just like to make you feel superiorly huge.
--
Roger Barnett
Dick Eney
Tamar (dick...@access.digex.net) responds with a OLF instead of her
usual 175 lines:
In article <172629...@natron.demon.co.uk>,
Roger Barnett <Ro...@natron.demon.co.uk> wrote:
> Tamar (dick...@access1.digex.net) wrote:
>
> : When someone who knows that what sounds like "Hahvahd" is spelled
> : "Harvard" then wants to spell "Bah" (e.g.), if their spelling is weak the
> : word might come out "Bar". Or, to use a pterry reference, when Johnny
> : wants to write "shan't" he knows it rhymes with "bar" (pronounced "bah"),
> : so he assumes that it has an R and writes it "sharnt".
>
>Someone record some sound files for this, cos I find it very difficult
>to "hear" spelled pronunciations. Surely the stress in Harvard is on
>the first syllable, so the second gets partly swallowed (so that it
>sounds more like the 'ud' in cud). And the 'an' in shan't doesn't rhyme
>with bar or bah (except perhaps when stressing the word for effect -
It does in Boston, MA, USA, and IIRC in Harvard, MA.
>which of course leads to the real difficulty, people pronounce the
>same word in different ways in different contexts.
=Tamar (sharing account dick...@access.digex.net)
Tony Finch
jldo...@antares.cloudnet.com (Joann L Dominik) wrote:
>
>And for those who've wondered if I know what I'm saying, an "Rs" is an
>arse is an ass. Well, sort of. Depending on your accent.
<old joke>
There has _never_ been a donkey in my trousers.
</old joke>
Joann L Dominik
Tony Finch (fa...@lspace.org) wrote:
: jldo...@antares.cloudnet.com (Joann L Dominik) wrote:
: >
: >And for those who've wondered if I know what I'm saying, an "Rs" is an
: >arse is an ass. Well, sort of. Depending on your accent.
:
: <old joke>
: There has _never_ been a donkey in my trousers.
: </old joke>
It's having my donkey in Darrell's bed that concerns me. I mean, I don't
mind hearing that it's being fondled and all, it's just that it's a
worrying thing to hear when you're about to sit down, and start wondering
if you *can*...
Andrew Mobbs
In article <5d6hng$4...@pleides.cloudnet.com>,
Joann L Dominik <jldo...@antares.cloudnet.com> wrote:
>
>This is exactly what happens, yes. That's how I see it happening. But the
>question is, do all these silly English types know they're doing it? So
>far, only FTony has shown any hint of awareness. I'm beginning to feel
>that I'm trying to prick (don't!) any egos or anything here. And I do know
>that some have had to be trained to drop their Rs when they speak.
>
"I know that I stick gratuitous 'R's in all over the place in my speech."
"Me Too!!"
"Me Too!!!"
"Does Terry Pratchett post here?"
Just to totally change the topic; hot, buttered crumpets and medium roast
Columbian coffee is the breakfast of the gods(tm). Mmmm...
--
Andrew Mobbs - and...@chiark.greenend.org.uk
- http://www.chiark.greenend.org.uk/~andrewm/
B. Chalmers
In article <m+b*b9...@news.chiark.greenend.org.uk>,
Andrew Mobbs <and...@chiark.greenend.org.uk> wrote:
>Just to totally change the topic; hot, buttered crumpets and medium roast
>Columbian coffee is the breakfast of the gods(tm). Mmmm...
"Hello Sainsbury's, this is Zeus here, could you scrap the order for
ambrosia, I really feel like buttered crumpets and Columbian coffee today"
Methinks not...
Ben (escaping Usenet exile)
--
--
Ben Chalmers
No .sig, No Comment.
Richard Kettlewell
Joann L Dominik <jldo...@antares.cloudnet.com> wrote:
>Since I hear I'm called a merkin again elsewhere (haven't seen it yet
>myself, but believe me, I shall enjoy it...), I'm going to demand
>this in public. What *is* it with the English tendency to tell people
>there's an R in a word when it's *prefectly* obvious that "Gytha" has
>no R in it?? Gytha cannot have a pronunciation that's spelled out
>with Rs in it. No. I refuse to admit this makes sense.
[...]
>But then why do you go and use them when spelling out a phonetic
>pronunciation of a word that *has* no R in it?? Why do you bother? Do
>you *know* you're doing this?
Listening to an American singer[1] right now I can hear much stronger
`r's than in my own speech. (But it does have some - I'd be in a
pretty poor state if I couldn't pronounce my own name...)
Why ... well ... just one of those things? To me `er' or `ur' or
whatever represents a sound without much or any an `r' in it just
fine, as that's usually how words with those sequences in get
pronounced by and around me. Now that you've made me think about it
everything sounds sort of mushy...
[1] Alanis Morisette. Highly recommended.
--
Richard Kettlewell http://www.elmail.co.uk/staff/richard/
May the Carrier be with you.
Darrell Ottery
In article <5d84bi$a...@dex.trin.cam.ac.uk>, Tony Finch <fa...@lspace.org>
writes
>jldo...@antares.cloudnet.com (Joann L Dominik) wrote:
>>
>>And for those who've wondered if I know what I'm saying, an "Rs" is an
>>arse is an ass. Well, sort of. Depending on your accent.
>
><old joke>
>
>There has _never_ been a donkey in my trousers.
>
></old joke>
I'm saying nothing...
(All will become apparent at a meet near you soon)
--
Darrell [INTJ] - Dar...@lspace.org - http://www.toreador.demon.co.uk/
Sarcasm helps to keep you from telling people what you really think of them.
Ennien and Robin Ashbrook
Richard Kettlewell (ric...@greenend.org.uk) wrote:
: Listening to an American singer[1] right now I can hear much stronger
: [1] Alanis Morisette. Highly recommended.
Got news for you: She's a Canuck.
-==- Ennien (tweren't her first album either - we've been listening to
her for years)
--
*********************************************************
Robin and Ennien Ashbrook : ashb...@spots.ab.ca
Tha a'chumhachd sgriosail aig a'mhi\osail seo air tho\isich
air ur buadh bhochd a thuigsinn! ...mise cuideachd, gu
fi\or.. -- Malanochs (Mallanox)
*********************************************************
Michelena Riosa
On 4 Feb 1997 05:33:36 GMT, jldo...@antares.cloudnet.com (Joann L
Dominik) wrote:
>
>This is exactly what happens, yes. That's how I see it happening. But the
>question is, do all these silly English types know they're doing it? So
>far, only FTony has shown any hint of awareness. I'm beginning to feel
>hugely superior, since they don't even *know* what they're saying. Not
>that I'm trying to prick (don't!) any egos or anything here. And I do know
>that some have had to be trained to drop their Rs when they speak.
>
>And for those who've wondered if I know what I'm saying, an "Rs" is an
>arse is an ass. Well, sort of. Depending on your accent.
Theee iyrrrrony in dis jowannn, iss thayat the murrrikanns sound like
dey allll tahk like dey hayav eckstrrra arrrrs in deyre wurrrds to
meee.
If I could type in the 56 letter phonetic alphabet, the above would
sound more accurate. I apologise if the attemp was unsussessful.
An interesting story on phonetics I one heard concerned the word for
the Military dun-colour. Originally an arabic word 'Khaaakhi"(the
triple a is trying to denote a very backed vowel) was originally heard
by the british army who spelled it "Kharki"(cah-key). Is was
transferred to the American military vocally who interpreted the
spelling according to what they heart the Brits saying and it was
written "khaki"(caa-key). The Canadian armed forces got it through
writing from the British and spelled it Kharki and pronounced it
"car-key" until we became useful to the states when the spelling and
pronunciation switched.
Is this even remotely interesting? I thought it was...if anyone knows
the accuracy of this tale I would appreciate knowing.
>
>-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
>The Very Intelligent Pig http://www.cloudnet.com/~jldomini
>"I was a mixture of alarmed, flattered, and raspberry with a
>hint of cinnamon-- it's a new recipe I'm trying." --B
>
mri...@visgen.com
*I*=irrelevant,*R*=relevant,*F*=Fandom,
*C*=Cascade, *M*=Metatopic, *G*=Games,*A*=annotation
[APB]= crosspost to alt.books.pratchett
Darrell Ottery
In article <5d8mqo$bcv$1...@sfere.greenend.org.uk>, Richard Kettlewell
<ric...@greenend.org.uk> writes
>Listening to an American singer[1]
>
For what? The deaf?
She's better than Bjork, but then that's not exactly hard. :) I simply
cannot believe that anyone actually thinks Alanis can sing, or how it is
that so many copies of her albums have been bought. I can only assume
that someone is stockpiling them to use in an act of war at some future
point...
Not a fan, in case you'd not guessed. :)
--
Darrell [INTJ] - Dar...@lspace.org - http://www.toreador.demon.co.uk/
Dave! Put down those Windows discs, Dave. DAVE!
Frugal
B. Chalmers wrote:
>
> In article <m+b*b9...@news.chiark.greenend.org.uk>,
> Andrew Mobbs <and...@chiark.greenend.org.uk> wrote:
>
> >Just to totally change the topic; hot, buttered crumpets and medium roast
> >Columbian coffee is the breakfast of the gods(tm). Mmmm...
>
> "Hello Sainsbury's, this is Zeus here, could you scrap the order for
> ambrosia, I really feel like buttered crumpets and Columbian coffee today"
>
> Methinks not...
Your right, he would be far more likely to use Tescos
--
Frugal@work
.
Michael...@cern.ch
In article <5da37d$4...@lyra.csx.cam.ac.uk>,
bc...@thor.cam.ac.uk (B. Chalmers) wrote:
>
> In article <m+b*b9...@news.chiark.greenend.org.uk>,
> Andrew Mobbs <and...@chiark.greenend.org.uk> wrote:
>
> >Just to totally change the topic; hot, buttered crumpets and medium roast
> >Columbian coffee is the breakfast of the gods(tm). Mmmm...
>
> "Hello Sainsbury's, this is Zeus here, could you scrap the order for
> ambrosia, I really feel like buttered crumpets and Columbian coffee today"
>
> Methinks not...
>
Ambroisia is prety safe at the top of yer average god's shopping list
methinks, but which variety, the curstard or the rice pudding?
Wouldn't mind getting me hands on a hot buttered st^H^H crumpet, mind you.
MH.
-------------------==== Posted via Deja News ====-----------------------
http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Post to Usenet
Warren Jones
Smeg (Pa...@ceejay.demon.co.uk) wrote:
>In article <01bc0f03$26ff10e0$0100007f@default>, The Bellman of Ankh
><j...@burnis01.airtime.co.uk> writes
>>
>>FWIW, in an earlier post Pterry also said, about the pronunciation of
>>Hwell:
>>
>> "I'm pretty sure that 'Howl' would be close to the proper Welsh
>> pronunciation, although it[sic] my head I always pronounced it
>> as 'H-well'"
>>
>This isn't the proper welsh pronounciation either. In welsh a double L
>(ie. LL) is pronounced with a sort of choking noise. Kindof like a dry
>gargle at the back of the throat...
Um, no, that's a CH, and is pronounced like the German (I think). "LL"
is, AFAIK, unique to Welsh, and is pronounced by putting the front half
of your tounge to the roof of your mouth, and blowing around the side of
it. Sounds kind of like a snigger. And anyway, there's only one L in
Hwel.
--
Warren Jones - war...@theshades.demon.co.uk
http://www.theshades.demon.co.uk | Member of LuHu
The Official Michelena Riosa Testosterone Brigade
High Priest of Zen, God of Atheists
Andy Ball
>>Now all I need is for the man himself to tell me how he thinks "Gytha"
>>should be pronounced and then I'll go and show his post to the director
>>of the local production of Wyrd Sisters that almost got it right in
>>December and will be geting it better in February.
>>
>>
>The one Gytha I know pronounced it Geeth-ur
>--
>Terry Pratchett
Ah yes, but it's a fair bet that the Gytha you know comes from round
Wiltshire way (as your good self does, I am led to believe). If that
is the case, and assuming she has the same accent as other people from
round those parts, it is perhaps unsurprising she pronounces Gytha as
"Geeth-ur". Perhaps residents of the Home Counties would pronounce it
"Guy-tha".
Before anyone asks, I hail from Bristol and I sound like Worzel
Gummidge. :)
Joann L Dominik
Darrell Ottery (Dar...@lspace.org) wrote:
: In article <5d8mqo$bcv$1...@sfere.greenend.org.uk>, Richard Kettlewell
: <ric...@greenend.org.uk> writes
: >Listening to an American singer[1]
: >
: >[1] Alanis Morisette. Highly recommended.
She ain't merkin. She's Cananadian.
: For what? The deaf?
:
: She's better than Bjork, but then that's not exactly hard. :) I simply
: cannot believe that anyone actually thinks Alanis can sing, or how it is
: that so many copies of her albums have been bought. I can only assume
: that someone is stockpiling them to use in an act of war at some future
: point...
I haven't heard much Bjork, but I know I really liked one of her songs.
And I *hated* Alanis when she first came out, but with every release I
liked it a little more, until now I've actually considered borrowing the
CD from my sister. There are few songs I've despised as much as that
damnable "One Hand In My Pocket" forkup. I really disliked it. But "Head
Over Heels" is quite good, I think. I was much amused by "Ironic," but
that's from working with the irony-challenged, and wondering how the hell
the song got airplay with people saying "zat like goldy and bronzy?"
: Not a fan, in case you'd not guessed. :)
Neither am I. But I still think she does some capable stuff with her
voice.
: Dave! Put down those Windows discs, Dave. DAVE!
Ahh, but a man with a .sig like this is not to be argued with. Funny how
Bill Gates has inspired several of my favourite .sigs....
Robin Adams
Murky B (mu...@lspace.org) wrote:
: As Joann L Dominik was talking in alt.fan.pratchett, a cockroach
: crawled across the screen...
: > There are few songs I've despised as much as that damnable .....
: So... they 'whose Name May Not Be Mentioned In Civilised Society' have
: not yet crossed the Atlantic?
: You lucky lucky people....
News flash; the SG [1] have only just crossed over this month, and
apparently they are doing very very well. Abandon all hope.
Ralf
[1] No, not Small Gods.
Richard Kettlewell
Ennien and Robin Ashbrook <ashb...@spots.ab.ca> wrote:
>Richard Kettlewell (ric...@greenend.org.uk) wrote:
>>Listening to an American singer[1] right now I can hear much stronger
>>[1] Alanis Morisette. Highly recommended.
>
>Got news for you: She's a Canuck.
Sigh. Someone must have neglected to tell me when they physically
separated Canada from the rest of the American continent.
Derek Lavin
In message <32fccb5d...@news.ftech.net>
mu...@lspace.org (Murky B) writes:
> So... they 'whose Name May Not Be Mentioned In Civilised Society' have
> not yet crossed the Atlantic?
'Fraid so... Last I heard, "WANNABIE" was at the American number 4...
> .... (do you really really really wanna zig a zig ahhh?)
This really annoys me, the lyrics are so bloody puerile... Does
anyone here actually *KNOW* what a zigazig-bloody-ah is? Well, I'll
tell you. It's a cigar. That's it! A bloody cigar. Ooh, the meaning
is so sodding powerful...
Martyn Clapham
In article <32fccb5d...@news.ftech.net>, Murky B <mu...@lspace.org>
writes
>As Joann L Dominik was talking in alt.fan.pratchett, a cockroach
>crawled across the screen...
>> There are few songs I've despised as much as that damnable .....
>
>not yet crossed the Atlantic?
>
>
> .... (do you really really really wanna zig a zig ahhh?)
>
>
>Murky B http://www.ftech.net/~monark/
If you are refering the group who helped launch the mid-week lotter
draw, it appears they are doing quite well in the USA.
Well thats what the record company says anyway.
MartynC
--
http://www.mclapham.demon.co.uk Mobile 0860 914817 AFPurity 61%
Member of LUHU and Michelena Riosa Testosterone Brigade
Minion in charge of asset sharing.
Richard Kettlewell
Joann L Dominik <jldo...@cloudnet.com> wrote:
>Darrell Ottery (Dar...@lspace.org) wrote:
>>Richard Kettlewell <ric...@greenend.org.uk> writes
>>>Listening to an American singer[1]
>>>
>>>[1] Alanis Morisette. Highly recommended.
>
>She ain't merkin. She's Cananadian.
See <5dfqf1$j32$1...@sfere.greenend.org.uk>. Does anyone else want to
tell me this? That's three so far, including email, I'm sure there's
a few more to come.
>Neither am I. But I still think she does some capable stuff with her
>voice.
Seems to work a lot better on CD than the video of a concert I saw
recently.
--
Richard Kettlewell http://www.elmail.co.uk/~richard/
Smeg
In article <MPLANET.32fa1e...@news.demon.co.uk>, Warren Jones
<war...@theshades.demon.co.uk> writes
>Smeg (Pa...@ceejay.demon.co.uk) wrote:
>>This isn't the proper welsh pronounciation either. In welsh a double L
>>(ie. LL) is pronounced with a sort of choking noise. Kindof like a dry
>>gargle at the back of the throat...
>
>Um, no, that's a CH, and is pronounced like the German (I think). "LL"
>is, AFAIK, unique to Welsh, and is pronounced by putting the front half
>of your tounge to the roof of your mouth, and blowing around the side of
>it. Sounds kind of like a snigger. And anyway, there's only one L in
>Hwel.
>
comes you and does it in a handfull of lines, and yes, that is how it's
pronounced :)
paul
Smith couldn't understand all the fuss over computer pornography. "Why," he
exclamed , "surely everybody has seen a computer without it's clothes on by
now?"
Sarah Wittman
I would like to suggest that on 5 Feb 1997 22:30:14 GMT,
ashb...@spots.ab.ca (Ennien and Robin Ashbrook) did write:
>Richard Kettlewell (ric...@greenend.org.uk) wrote:
>: Listening to an American singer[1] right now I can hear much stronger
>: [1] Alanis Morisette. Highly recommended.
>
>Got news for you: She's a Canuck.
>-==- Ennien (tweren't her first album either - we've been listening to
>her for years)
Unfortunatly..
And anyone who remembers her from before cetainly can't take her
seriously at _all_
Think Tiffanie or Debbi Gibson.. She even had the puffy crimped
hair..
Two summers ago when "You Outta Know" hit the charts, there was a pool
where I worked to guess in which timeslot it would be played on the
radio.. Gotta love the Canadian content rules.
Sarah
"There is no end to the writing of books.
And too much study will wear you down."
Stu
>In article: <5d6hng$4...@pleides.cloudnet.com> jldo...@antares.cloudnet.com
>(Joann L
>Dominik) writes:
>>
>>
>> : When someone who knows that what sounds like "Hahvahd" is spelled
>> : "Harvard" then wants to spell "Bah" (e.g.), if their spelling is weak the
>> : word might come out "Bar". Or, to use a pterry reference, when Johnny
>> : wants to write "shan't" he knows it rhymes with "bar" (pronounced "bah"),
>> : so he assumes that it has an R and writes it "sharnt".
>
>
>Someone record some sound files for this, cos I find it very difficult
>to "hear" spelled pronunciations. Surely the stress in Harvard is on
>the first syllable, so the second gets partly swallowed (so that it
>sounds more like the 'ud' in cud). And the 'an' in shan't doesn't rhyme
>with bar or bah (except perhaps when stressing the word for effect -
I'd say it's less in different contexts, than in different areas. The
old North and South thing again. Down South, it's "Barth", up north it's
"Bath" {short a}. Can't *begin* to tell you how much flak I cop for
this, being a Southener at a Northern University *g* Although I don't
honestly recall anyone pronouncing shan't as anything but "Sharn't"...
Stu
--
Stu
Stu
In article <1KvwDAAa...@toreador.demon.co.uk>, Darrell Ottery
<Dar...@lspace.org> writes
>In article <5d8mqo$bcv$1...@sfere.greenend.org.uk>, Richard Kettlewell
><ric...@greenend.org.uk> writes
>>
>
>
>She's better than Bjork, but then that's not exactly hard. :) I simply
>cannot believe that anyone actually thinks Alanis can sing, or how it is
>that so many copies of her albums have been bought. I can only assume
>that someone is stockpiling them to use in an act of war at some future
>point...
>
ARG! Isn't there some rule against mentioning Bjork on this newsgroup by
now? every time she comes up, there's a mass argument started! Why I
remmeber a poll being taken as to whether she was any good or
not..although not the results. I think "Cute but Crap" sums it up though
:) *ducks out of the way of people who insist on pronouncing her name
Byuuuuuurk, when it's quite obvioulsy B-jork*
Stu
--
Stu
Dick Eney
In article <nf3u5KAOLI$yE...@stuward.demon.co.uk>,
Stu <S...@stuward.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>Roger Barnett <Ro...@natron.demon.co.uk> writes
>>jldo...@antares.cloudnet.com (Joann L Dominik) writes:
>>>
>>> Tamar (dick...@access1.digex.net) wrote:
>>> : When someone who knows that what sounds like "Hahvahd" is spelled
>>> : "Harvard" then wants to spell "Bah" (e.g.), if their spelling is weak the
>>> : word might come out "Bar". Or, to use a pterry reference, when Johnny
>>> : wants to write "shan't" he knows it rhymes with "bar" (pronounced "bah"),
>>> : so he assumes that it has an R and writes it "sharnt".
>>
>>which of course leads to the real difficulty, people pronounce the
>>same word in different ways in different contexts).
>
>I'd say it's less in different contexts, than in different areas. The
>old North and South thing again. Down South, it's "Barth", up north it's
>"Bath" {short a}. Can't *begin* to tell you how much flak I cop for
>this, being a Southener at a Northern University *g* Although I don't
>honestly recall anyone pronouncing shan't as anything but "Sharn't"...
Assuming you're doing the usual Appalachian thing and using a schwa for
the "r" (New England and the South Appalachians both do this; the accent
/differences/ are in other areas) - "ba(h)th" is the older, upperclass,
most northern pronunciation in New England, which hung on in upperclass
Boston. I say "bath" (short a) myself, but my father, who came from way
up north a long time ago, said "ba(h)th". Since Americans rarely if ever
say "shan't" in a normal conversation, it tends to receive the 1930s -
Hollywood - British / Boston, MA pronunciation, which of course is
"sha(h)n't".
OTOH if you're actually _pronouncing_ the "r" in "Barth", well... snh snh
snh...
And even hnufhnufhnufblort
:)
=Tamar (sharing account dick...@access.digex.net)
PS When my mother was living in North Carolina in the 1940s, she said she
only had to change three words for people to think she had "lost her
accent": Hair, Car, and (I think) Dog.
Michelena Riosa
On 7 Feb 1997 17:57:53 GMT, Richard Kettlewell
<ric...@greenend.org.uk> wrote:
>Ennien and Robin Ashbrook <ashb...@spots.ab.ca> wrote:
>>Richard Kettlewell (ric...@greenend.org.uk) wrote:
>
>>
>
>separated Canada from the rest of the American continent.
It happened when the U.S. seemed to take over all rights to the term
"American".....Not naming any names...mind you, except for LBJ, JFK,
FDR etc etc.
Note to the neat:...K.D.Lang is Canananadian too!
Michelena
mri...@visgen.com
"The Unofficial ASCII-Rose Cluler"
-'-,-,-'-@ -,-,-'-,-@ -'-,-'-,-@
-,-,-'-,-@ -'-,-'-,-@ -'-,-,-'-@ -,-,-'-,-@
Margaret Tarbet
>Note to the neat:...K.D.Lang is Canananadian too!
So's Ferron.
Richard Kettlewell
Stu <S...@stuward.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>Darrell Ottery <Dar...@lspace.org> writes
>>Richard Kettlewell <ric...@greenend.org.uk> writes
>>>[1] Alanis Morisette. Highly recommended.
>>
>>For what? The deaf?
[..]
>
>ARG! Isn't there some rule against mentioning Bjork on this newsgroup by
>now? every time she comes up, there's a mass argument started! Why I
>remmeber a poll being taken as to whether she was any good or
>not..although not the results. I think "Cute but Crap" sums it up though
>:) *ducks out of the way of people who insist on pronouncing her name
>Byuuuuuurk, when it's quite obvioulsy B-jork*
Oyoyoy. This is an Alanis Morisette argument, the Bjork argument is
two threads down on the left. I still like her[1], even if you lot
have absolutely no taste whatsoever.
[1] Alanis, I make no comment on Bjork at this point.
Mr B F Bjornsson
In article <jP$v9MAvOI$yE...@stuward.demon.co.uk>,
Stu <S...@stuward.demon.co.uk> writes:
>In article <1KvwDAAa...@toreador.demon.co.uk>, Darrell Ottery
><Dar...@lspace.org> writes
>>In article <5d8mqo$bcv$1...@sfere.greenend.org.uk>, Richard Kettlewell
>><ric...@greenend.org.uk> writes
>>>
>>
>>For what? The deaf?
>>
>>cannot believe that anyone actually thinks Alanis can sing, or how it is
>>that so many copies of her albums have been bought. I can only assume
>>that someone is stockpiling them to use in an act of war at some future
>>point...
>>
>>Not a fan, in case you'd not guessed. :)
>
>
>now? every time she comes up, there's a mass argument started! Why I
>remmeber a poll being taken as to whether she was any good or
>not..although not the results. I think "Cute but Crap" sums it up though
>:) *ducks out of the way of people who insist on pronouncing her name
>Byuuuuuurk, when it's quite obvioulsy B-jork*
No need to duck, both are wrong anyway. :-)
Bjorn
(or Byurn, or Byudddn, or whatever)
P.S. oh, and the new By^Hjork video by John Kricfalusi is quite
good
Gordon W. Rycroft
Stu wrote:
> Down South, it's "Barth", up north it's "Bath" {short a}.
No, no, no... Down south it's Baath. Like the sound that sheep make...
Gordon
elan (Arve Loken)
[Gordon W. Rycroft]
> Stu wrote:
> > Down South, it's "Barth", up north it's "Bath" {short a}.
> No, no, no... Down south it's Baath. Like the sound that sheep make...
Really? Vibrato and all? :)
--
Arve Løken you ask me do I love you... to reply
a.k.a. élan does the pope live in the woods? remove 'a'
el...@jagweb.com quod erat demonstrandum, baby from end
el...@nonsmokers.org (ooh, you speak French) of address
MJ DIMMICK
Murky B communicated by means of words in alt.fan.pratchett...
> As Joann L Dominik was talking in alt.fan.pratchett, a cockroach
> crawled across the screen...
> > There are few songs I've despised as much as that damnable .....
>
> So... they 'whose Name May Not Be Mentioned In Civilised Society' have
> not yet crossed the Atlantic?
>
> You lucky lucky people....
>
> .... (do you really really really wanna zig a zig ahhh?)
>
> .... (set your spirit free) <bletch>
>
> Murky B
Nah, I doubt the dreaded Sp*ce G*rls (asterisks inserted for
respectability) will make it across the Great Divide for the same
reasons that Oasis didn't/couldn't/won't. There's something
quintessentially British about both... and only the British could buy
such crap.
Sorry, I guess my taste just doesn't run to this sort of thing.
TTFN
--
Michael Dimmick | dimm...@aston.ac.uk | http://www.aston.ac.uk/~dimmicmj
"Outside on the battlements, the guard changed. In fact he changed
into his gardening apron and went off to hoe the beans..."
-- Terry Pratchett, `Lords & Ladies'
I really, really must get out more...
Jeff Lipton
dimm...@aston.ac.uk (MJ DIMMICK) wrote:
>Nah, I doubt the dreaded Sp*ce G*rls (asterisks inserted for
>respectability) will make it across the Great Divide for the same
>reasons that Oasis didn't/couldn't/won't. There's something
>quintessentially British about both... and only the British could buy
>such crap.
1) Never underestimate the Merkan market for crap.
2) Oasis did rather well over here before internal rot set in
3) As mentioned by another poster, Oregano Lasses are selling pretty
good.
Jeff
=============================
http://www.markomarketing.com/jlipton/
Gideon Hallett
On Mon, 10 Feb 1997 22:36:56 +0100, el...@jagweb.coma (elan (Arve Loken))
spoke in tongues:
>[Gordon W. Rycroft]
>> Stu wrote:
>> > Down South, it's "Barth", up north it's "Bath" {short a}.
>> No, no, no... Down south it's Baath. Like the sound that sheep make...
>
>Really? Vibrato and all? :)
No, that's if you're Welsh. Coming from Bath (as I do), I can say that
the lower-rent area (Twerton) calls it "Barth" or "Barf" and the nobby
areas (Beechen Cliff, Weston) call it "Baath" or "Buarth" (the u is
almost silent)
Gideon.
--
Gideon_...@3mail.3com.com | "Oh no!". "What's up, John
love?" "Newer and bluer Meanies have been sighted in the
vicinity of this theatre - there's only one way to go out!"
"What's that?" "Singing!" "One!" "Two!" "Three!" "Four!"
Dave O'Brien
Jeff Lipton:
>3) ...Oregano Lasses...
W|N>K! LOL!
--
Dave O'Brien
"If I was any wiser I'd be a leopardskin bikini."
MJ DIMMICK
<keep getting this bloody 'Posting Failed'!>
elan (Arve Loken) communicated by means of words in alt.fan.pratchett...
> [Gordon W. Rycroft]
> > Stu wrote:
> > > Down South, it's "Barth", up north it's "Bath" {short a}.
> > No, no, no... Down south it's Baath. Like the sound that sheep make...
>
> Really? Vibrato and all? :)
>
Imagine you're at the dentist: say 'aaahhhh'! Baaahhhhth.
Whereas Northeners (north of about Watford is the usual 'definition')
use a short a (as in axe/ax; gods, it's that Merkin spelling again) so
therefore ba'th.
Smeg
In article <5dobc4$l...@vixc.voyager.net>, Jeff Lipton
<jhli...@voyager.net> writes
>
>1) Never underestimate the Merkan market for crap.
>2) Oasis did rather well over here before internal rot set in
>3) As mentioned by another poster, Oregano Lasses are selling pretty
>good.
>
>
>Jeff
>
>=============================
>http://www.markomarketing.com/jlipton/
>
Lets start a "What have the merkins given the UK" Thread :)
They have given us:
McDonalds.
[Insert Your Two P Here]
paul
When talking to an idiot, make sure he's not doing the same.
Sarah Wittman
I would like to suggest that on 11 Feb 1997 17:02:22 GMT,
p...@ltsun6.star.le.ac.uk (Peter Bleackley) did write:
>In the record shop, (Sarah Wittman) writes:
someone else wrote this..
>|> >: [1] Alanis Morisette. Highly recommended.
I wrote this part..
>|> Two summers ago when "You Outta Know" hit the charts, there was a pool
>|> where I worked to guess in which timeslot it would be played on the
>|> radio.. Gotta love the Canadian content rules.
>
>What I'd like to hear on the radio- "You Oughtta Know" back-to-back
>with "Head Over Feet". The contrast would be amazing.
Well I haven't heard it on the radio, but my little sister managed to
repeat the cd 25 times on shuffle before I snapped. The contrast was
striking, but I still can't accept Alanis angst-ridden.. it's just
wrong..
Sarah
"I am slowly going crazy, 1,2,3,4,5,6 switch.
Crazy going slowly am I, 6,5,4,3,2,1 switch."
Curiosity
Gideon_...@3mail.3Com.com (Gideon Hallett) writes:
>On Mon, 10 Feb 1997 22:36:56 +0100, el...@jagweb.coma (elan (Arve Loken))
>spoke in tongues:
>
>>> Stu wrote:
>>> > Down South, it's "Barth", up north it's "Bath" {short a}.
>>> No, no, no... Down south it's Baath. Like the sound that sheep make...
>>
>>Really? Vibrato and all? :)
>
>the lower-rent area (Twerton) calls it "Barth" or "Barf" and the nobby
>areas (Beechen Cliff, Weston) call it "Baath" or "Buarth" (the u is
>almost silent)
> Gideon.
Hmm. Having lived a few (18) years of my life in Brum I call it Bath
to rhyme with the first part of _Math_ematics. Some people say my accent
is loosing it's Brumminess. Bryan disagrees - in fact he makes a
point of slipping in and out of a bad brummy accent [1][2] when he
sees me.
Hopefully I'll _never_ call it Barth, no matter how long I live here ;P
Cheers, Curiosity.
==
[1] Not that I mind at all ....
[2] Does he do this to anyone else, I imagine a few of you have met
him and you can't all have perfect BBC English accents ?
--
Curiosity (ccs...@bath.ac.uk) of Bath Information & Data Services (BIDS)
Phone: +44 1225 826826 ex 4658 * http://www.bath.ac.uk/~ccsjwg/home.html
Tim Gerrish
ccs...@bath.ac.uk (Curiosity) wrote:
>Gideon_...@3mail.3Com.com (Gideon Hallett) writes:
>>On Mon, 10 Feb 1997 22:36:56 +0100, el...@jagweb.coma (elan (Arve Loken))
>>spoke in tongues:
>>
>>>[Gordon W. Rycroft]
>>>> Stu wrote:
>>>> > Down South, it's "Barth", up north it's "Bath" {short a}.
>>>> No, no, no... Down south it's Baath. Like the sound that sheep make...
>>>
>>>Really? Vibrato and all? :)
>>
>>No, that's if you're Welsh. Coming from Bath (as I do), I can say that
>>the lower-rent area (Twerton) calls it "Barth" or "Barf" and the nobby
>>areas (Beechen Cliff, Weston) call it "Baath" or "Buarth" (the u is
>>almost silent)
>> Gideon.
>Hmm. Having lived a few (18) years of my life in Brum I call it Bath
>to rhyme with the first part of _Math_ematics. Some people say my accent
>is loosing it's Brumminess. Bryan disagrees - in fact he makes a
>point of slipping in and out of a bad brummy accent [1][2] when he
>sees me.
>Hopefully I'll _never_ call it Barth, no matter how long I live here ;P
Well I were born there and I've always pronounced it 'barth'. It's served
me man and boy for these ..erm...many years now and I ain't going to change
now.
Tim
(:l)
Gideon Hallett
On Thu, 13 Feb 1997 17:20:55 +0000, Smeg <Pa...@ceejay.demon.co.uk> spoke
in tongues:
>In article <5dobc4$l...@vixc.voyager.net>, Jeff Lipton
><jhli...@voyager.net> writes
>>
>>1) Never underestimate the Merkan market for crap.
>>2) Oasis did rather well over here before internal rot set in
>>3) As mentioned by another poster, Oregano Lasses are selling pretty
>>good.
>>
>Lets start a "What have the merkins given the UK" Thread :)
>
>They have given us:
>
>McDonalds.
>[Insert Your Two P Here]
Could we give it back?
In that case, is it a gift?
Sarah Dalrymple
I forgot who wrote what, but respect to them:
> Down South, it's "Barth", up north it's "Bath" {short a}.
"Bath" is what you have, and"Barth" is what you do.
I remember when a southern mate of mine came up to newcastle and spent
10 minutes trying to explain to the geordie bus driver where "The City
baarths" were.
Saz
Douglas Houghton
> >They have given us:
> >
> >McDonalds.
> >[Insert Your Two P Here]
>
> Could we give it back?
>
> In that case, is it a gift?
>
Actually, "McDonald's", I wonder what country THEY emigrated from.
Seems to me it might just be a case of the crapburger coming home to roost.
As far as Burger King goes, it is owned by some British conglomerate that also
owns Pillsbury, so it's just not our fault anymore.
At least in America, Mcdonald's is relatively cheap, as it should be. Last
time I was in Europe(a very long time ago, indeed), a Mcdonald's meal cost
just as much as a meal at a real restaurant here.
Paul Mabbs
On Tue, 18 Feb 1997, Gideon Hallett wrote:
> On Thu, 13 Feb 1997 17:20:55 +0000, Smeg <Pa...@ceejay.demon.co.uk> spoke
> in tongues:
>
> >Lets start a "What have the merkins given the UK" Thread :)
> >
> >They have given us:
> >
> >McDonalds.
> >[Insert Your Two P Here]
>
> Could we give it back?
"Well that depends. Have you kept your reciept? You didn't? <sucking of
breath> Well... I shouldn't really, because I need something for the
books... Well I can't sell it to someone else now can I, you've had it
for XX years. I'll tell you what - as long as you don't tell the boss,
I'll let you have this Burger King range, and I'll even throw in Wendy's
to make up the difference. Ok? Ok. If you could just go round to the girl
on the end there, she'll sort out the paper work for you..."
Me, work in retail? Nooo... :)
--
Paul.
/--------------------------------------+-----------------------------------\
/ Sometimes insanity is the only sane | pj...@leicester.ac.uk \
\ way to cope with an insane world. | pager: 01523 180232 /
\--------------------------------------+-----------------------------------/
Sarah Bonnett
an...@vivitar.demon.co.uk (Andy Ball) wrote:
>>>Now all I need is for the man himself to tell me how he thinks "Gytha"
>>>should be pronounced and then I'll go and show his post to the director
>>>of the local production of Wyrd Sisters that almost got it right in
>>>December and will be geting it better in February.
>>>
>>>
>>The one Gytha I know pronounced it Geeth-ur
>>--
>>Terry Pratchett
>Ah yes, but it's a fair bet that the Gytha you know comes from round
>Wiltshire way (as your good self does, I am led to believe). If that
>is the case, and assuming she has the same accent as other people from
>round those parts, it is perhaps unsurprising she pronounces Gytha as
>"Geeth-ur". Perhaps residents of the Home Counties would pronounce it
>"Guy-tha".
>Before anyone asks, I hail from Bristol and I sound like Worzel
>Gummidge. :)
Erk!
And I thought it was pronounced "Jithur" (soft J)
Oh poo.
Dick Eney
In article <3309f9b8...@news.demon.co.uk>,
The verb is "bathe" where I come from (long a, bay-the). But that seems
to have been forgotten by everyone else, just as they have forgotten the
distinction between "loath" and "loathe," and "breath" and "breathe".
Soapbox? What soapbox? The thing I'm standing on? Gosh, I thought I was
taller today...
=Tamar (sharing account dick...@access.digex.net)
Gideon Hallett
On 21 Feb 1997 17:38:47 -0500, dick...@access2.digex.net (Dick Eney)
spoke in tongues:
>In article <3309f9b8...@news.demon.co.uk>,
>Sarah Dalrymple <s...@jdal.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>>I forgot who wrote what, but respect to them:
>>
>>> Down South, it's "Barth", up north it's "Bath" {short a}.
>>
>>"Bath" is what you have, and"Barth" is what you do.
>>I remember when a southern mate of mine came up to newcastle and spent
>>10 minutes trying to explain to the geordie bus driver where "The City
>>baarths" were.
>
>The verb is "bathe" where I come from (long a, bay-the). But that seems
>to have been forgotten by everyone else, just as they have forgotten the
>distinction between "loath" and "loathe," and "breath" and "breathe".
IIRC, the thread was originally about how to pronounce Bath (the place)
- certain natives of that city (myself included) were having a debate
about Baarth or Baff with some of a northerly persuasion. Quite where
bathing came in, I have no idea.
FWIW, I think that the boundaries are pretty fuzzy on the bath/bathe
debate. I use either, depending on mood.
Richard Kettlewell
On alt.fan.pratchett, Douglas Houghton <d...@mvp.net> wrote:
>Actually, "McDonald's", I wonder what country THEY emigrated from.
That's a remarkably good question, actually.
There is, near Cambridge, a McDonald's near a main road which
resembles a flying saucer. Fair enough, we though, just someone being
weird. But then a bit later on we spotted an implausibly
aerodynamic-looking Little Chef. Which got us wondering...
Anyway a bit later on we called in at a service station - another
Little Chef - to break up the journey and have something to eat.
Eddie ordered something - I don't remember what - but was shortly told
that there wasn't any of that, would he like something else? As he'd
just been driving his brain relaxing quite a bit and took a while to
come back online to make a decision.
We started eating, but by now it was all becoming clear. They'd made
Eddie use his brain twice for a _reason_: they're borrowing spare
processing time in our brains for their own nefarious purposes. That
earlier Little Chef was aerodynamic for a good reason, and the McD
shaped like a flying saucer - or rather, vica versa - was no
coincidence either.
Merely looking around provided further evidence. The Little Chef we
were in included a Burger King; and of course Burger King are
currently selling `Independence Day' burgers. Talk about hiding in
plain sight!
Notice also that one often sees Forte hotels in the same place as
Little Chef - how better to get hold of some spare brain capacity to
use than to sell people somewhere to sleep for the night?
We continued on our journey northwards, paying particular attention to
service stations. Many looked deeply suspicious... Being a long
journey we also played the traditional game of Stobart (discussed
previously on AFP; for some more information about this, see
<URL:http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/doug_chinnery>). But
even this brought peculiarities to our attention.
Firstly, we spotted a _nest_ of them, about 10 in all (which meant
Sion won hands down for that journey, but that's not important).
Secondly, we observed that you _never_ saw them parked in a service
station - they were always driving or parked in a lay-by. How
curious.
Clearly, we decided, the Stobart lorries were the neutral brokers
employed by the McDonald's and Little Chef aliens to ferry information
and resources around the country. The game of Stobart spotting
presumably evolved when someone else discovered this; they were able
to make people notice them but presumably eliminated before they could
tell us the terrible truth. They avoid parking actually at service
stations so as not to give the game away.
You probably think this is entirely a fantasy of my own invention.
But there's more. Consider David Damerell's research into whether
McDonald's employees have free will (the conclusion was that they
don't); or his discovery of the explanation behind the alien-burger, a
colloquial name for a particularly tall McDonald's burger which,
supposing you are foolish enough to believe the adverts, could only be
eaten by someone with mouth parts resembling those aliens from the film
of the same name - they have a large outer mouth with which they can
hold the burger and a small inner one with which to bite bits off.
(This also explains why McDonald's food has no nutritional content to
a human - it was originally invented for the purposes of feeding
another species entirely.)
Back to the service stations. One was particularly unsubtle: you
could see the brain-scanning devices, cunningly disguised as lights
(but _not switched on_, which gave it away) hanging from the ceiling.
There wasn't one over every seat, so clearly the installation wasn't
finished.
In another - one the way back to Cambridge - we noticed another
curious thing. The chairs had space for legs to go _backwards_ from
the occupant - they weren't designed for humans, but for creatures
with four legs. Hexapodia as the key insight indeed! That was a
Little Chef, we have no information on how many legs the aliens
controlling McDonald's may have.
At another, we noticed that the tables had a sort of metal fencing
between them - clearly someone trying to get us used to sitting behind
bars. The fake greenery and the out-of-place looking mock-
old-fashioned street lights (obvious brain-scanners in disguise) added
to the effect; this one was a "Road Chef", clearly a third group of
aliens hoping not only borrow our spare brain power but also to put us
all in zoos.
None of this really answers the question Douglas poses. But it's all
interesting stuff, nonetheless.
This conspiracy was discovered by Richard Kettlewell, Sion Arrowsmith,
Eddie Welbourne and Matthew Reid, during the course of a trip to
Edinburgh.
--
Richard Kettlewell http://www.elmail.co.uk/~richard/
[wubba wubba wubba wubba wubba wubba wubba wubba] It was a creepy and
surreal morning when they implanted the biochips in the mind of
Mohinder Singh. [wubba wubba wubba wubba wubba wubba wubba wubba]
LeeAnn Rucker
In article <5et1hr$ffb$1...@sfere.greenend.org.uk>, Richard Kettlewell
<ric...@greenend.org.uk> wrote:
>That's a remarkably good question, actually.
>
>There is, near Cambridge, a McDonald's near a main road which
>resembles a flying saucer. Fair enough, we though, just someone being
>weird. But then a bit later on we spotted an implausibly
>aerodynamic-looking Little Chef. Which got us wondering...
Even weirder inside[1]. You go down a chute into a room with no windows.
Spooky. I ate in my car.
[1] No I don't normally eat at McDonalds at home[2], but I spent most of
Worldcon appreciating the qualities of a Scottish breakfast[3] whilst
recovering from a bout of food poisoning[4]
[2] The US, if you couldn't tell
[3] Much like dwarf bread - take one look at it and decide you aren't that
hungry after all.
[4] Which I'd got in the US just before I left, worse luck
Derek Lavin
In message <3309f9b8...@news.demon.co.uk>
s...@jdal.demon.co.uk (Sarah Dalrymple) writes:
> "Bath" is what you have, and"Barth" is what you do.
Nonononono! Bath is what you have, *BATHE* is what you do...
The Galactic Overlord
Richard Kettlewell has discovered our plot to take over the
world.
Damn! Foiled again.
--
* <-- Canberra
Tony Finch
Douglas Houghton <d...@mvp.net> wrote:
>
>Actually, "McDonald's", I wonder what country THEY emigrated from.
>As far as Burger King goes, it is owned by some British conglomerate that also
>owns Pillsbury, so it's just not our fault anymore.
?!
>At least in America, Mcdonald's is relatively cheap, as it should be. Last
>time I was in Europe(a very long time ago, indeed), a Mcdonald's meal cost
>just as much as a meal at a real restaurant here.
And Burger Thing is even more pricey. I wonder if it's amything to to
with VAT (aka sales tax), which is charged for restaurant meals and
sweets but not other food.
FTony (who thinks VAT is pernicious).
--
346 ...
Frugal
Tony Finch wrote:
> Douglas Houghton <d...@mvp.net> wrote:
> >At least in America, Mcdonald's is relatively cheap, as it should be. Last
> >time I was in Europe(a very long time ago, indeed), a Mcdonald's meal cost
> >just as much as a meal at a real restaurant here.
>
> And Burger Thing is even more pricey. I wonder if it's amything to to
> with VAT (aka sales tax), which is charged for restaurant meals and
> sweets but not other food.
Vat is charged on anything not considered to be an essential
item (like heating for instance).
--
Frugal the Curious
fru...@fysh.org
Vagueness
In article <5f41v0$7...@lyra.csx.cam.ac.uk>,
Tony Finch <fa...@lspace.org> wrote:
>And Burger Thing is even more pricey. I wonder if it's amything to to
>with VAT (aka sales tax), which is charged for restaurant meals and
>sweets but not other food.
>
>FTony (who thinks VAT is pernicious).
I forget completely who it was, but someone once said that we took the fast
food idea, removed all the bits that made it worthwhile and I've just
remembered I think the quote is from Good Omens and I've completely misquoted
the entire thing, so I'm going to stop now.
I can't even spell pernicious.
Is that irony?
Paranoia is like believing in God, you've got nothing to lose
And you might just be right
-Vagueness-
Michael Dimmick
Tony Finch communicated by means of words in alt.fan.pratchett...
> Douglas Houghton <d...@mvp.net> wrote:
>
>
> >At least in America, Mcdonald's is relatively cheap, as it should be. Last
> >time I was in Europe(a very long time ago, indeed), a Mcdonald's meal cost
> >just as much as a meal at a real restaurant here.
>
> And Burger Thing is even more pricey. I wonder if it's amything to to
> with VAT (aka sales tax), which is charged for restaurant meals and
> sweets but not other food.
>
IIRC, food is a necessity, but sweets are a luxury. VAT is payable on
luxury items. Books are not subject to VAT, nor are newspapers, nor
magazines. VAT is applied to adults clothes but not childrens.
It's all very confusing...
There's also the distinction between not-applicable and zero-rated.
If an item is zero rated, the manufacturer can nevertheless claim back
VAT on the goods required to make it; if non-applicable, they can't.
Rogue
This may be one of those popular myths everyone hears about, but I was told
ages ago that when asked in McDonalds or BurgerThing if you are sitting
down or eating out, always tell them eating out, that way they pay more
tax.
In article <5fekt2$gpg$1...@whatsit.aston.ac.uk>, dimm...@aston.ac.uk
(Michael Dimmick) wrote:
> Tony Finch communicated by means of words in alt.fan.pratchett...
> > Douglas Houghton <d...@mvp.net> wrote:
> >
> >
> > >At least in America, Mcdonald's is relatively cheap, as it should be. Last
> > >time I was in Europe(a very long time ago, indeed), a Mcdonald's meal cost
> > >just as much as a meal at a real restaurant here.
> >
> > And Burger Thing is even more pricey. I wonder if it's amything to to
> > with VAT (aka sales tax), which is charged for restaurant meals and
> > sweets but not other food.
> >
>
> IIRC, food is a necessity, but sweets are a luxury. VAT is payable on
> luxury items. Books are not subject to VAT, nor are newspapers, nor
> magazines. VAT is applied to adults clothes but not childrens.
>
> It's all very confusing...
[snip]
::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
These are my own opinions and not my employers
::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
Frugal
Michael Dimmick wrote:
> Tony Finch communicated by means of words in alt.fan.pratchett...
> > with VAT (aka sales tax), which is charged for restaurant meals and
> > sweets but not other food.
> >
> IIRC, food is a necessity, but sweets are a luxury. VAT is payable on
> luxury items. Books are not subject to VAT, nor are newspapers, nor
> magazines. VAT is applied to adults clothes but not childrens.
My favourite is that if you have a milkshake to take out, you don't
pay VAT, but you do if you eat it in ;O)
> There's also the distinction between not-applicable and zero-rated.
> If an item is zero rated, the manufacturer can nevertheless claim back
> VAT on the goods required to make it; if non-applicable, they can't.
I had always wondered what the difference was.
RobC
Rogue (Di...@party.hats) wrote:
: This may be one of those popular myths everyone hears about, but I was told
: ages ago that when asked in McDonalds or BurgerThing if you are sitting
: down or eating out, always tell them eating out, that way they pay more
: tax.
I've never been asked if I'm eating in or taking away.
Anyway, why would you want them to pay more taxes? They'll just end up
raising their prices to compensate.
--
Rob Cooper
No pixels were harmed during the making of this article.
Tony Finch
Di...@party.hats (Rogue) wrote:
>This may be one of those popular myths everyone hears about, but I was told
>ages ago that when asked in McDonalds or BurgerThing if you are sitting
>down or eating out, always tell them eating out, that way they pay more
>tax.
You have to pay VAT for restaurant meals but not take away meals, so
you have this the wrong way round.
FTony.
--
346 ...