Monty Python #1: edit

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gd

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Jan 1, 1999, 3:00:00 AM1/1/99
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Tonight WNED-TV ran the first of a 7 hour Python marathon.

In the first episode, the whole section about the Amazing Cargol and Janet
commenting about the Mouse problem was cut.

I have NEVER seen this section on US television. Has anyone else?

My contention is that it has always been edited out of any version of the
show broadcast in the U.S. since the very earliest showings in 1975.

What other material is missing from the U.S. distributed shows.

The ones we're seeing are the "Donevan Devillier...etc" from APS
distribution on PBS.

Thanks

Greg
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Sheila Giangreco

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Jan 1, 1999, 3:00:00 AM1/1/99
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No, the scene about the Amazing Cargol and Janet in "The Mouse Problem" was
cut from that show. I always thought that it was in the original script, but
they cut it even before the show was broadcast in the UK in 1969, but maybe
I'm wrong. It could be that it was only edited out in the U.S. In any case,
I've read the sketch in the book "All the Words", and it looks funny. I wish
I could've seen it. But even back in the 70's, I've never seen that. And
according to KHJ's book "The First 200 years..." he mentions that scene being
cut from the final show.

gd

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Jan 1, 1999, 3:00:00 AM1/1/99
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Sheila Giangreco (i...@flash.net) wrote:
: No, the scene about the Amazing Cargol and Janet in "The Mouse Problem" was

: cut from that show. I always thought that it was in the original script, but
: they cut it even before the show was broadcast in the UK in 1969, but maybe
: I'm wrong.

Yes Sheila, you are luckily incorrect, because I actually have a copy of
this very section, recorded in the early 1980's from a broadcast
on Canada's Global Television. They were using the original tapes sent
over to the CBC in 1970 when we first saw the show here, nationally, in
Canada.

When Python was run on the CBC (Canadian Broadcasting Corporation) it
would run in a half-hour slot at 10pm. Although there seemed to be no
sponsor for this show, the CBC did put in numerous program promos, so the
shows were definitely edited with perhaps up to 5 minutes of the show
being cut out.

In 1980, Global television started running the nightly. I remember having
the video on (I thought I'd got full versions from the US on video, so I
was pretty smug) and doing some work and just listening. Suddenly, I heard
this whole section that was totally unfamiliar. Chapman played Cargol.

Luckily I got the whole thing on tape...and even luckier still that
Global, who ALSO interupted the show for numerous commercials, didn't cut
it out.

My theory as to why this portion was removed is that it features a person
who is clinically endorsing three taboos:

beastiality

arson

murder

Watching US television from Buffalo, as we do here in Toronto, we
certainly know that fires were epidemic in Buffalo during the 60's and
70's. Often the local evening news would have nothing but reports on three
alarm blazes!

I'm going to check the copies I've recorded from Canada's BRAVO! station
to see if Cargol exists in these versions.

I"m also interested if the pre-recorded tapes or laserdiscs of episode #1
have the Cargol bit in it.

Bye for now

Greg

Sheila Giangreco

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Jan 1, 1999, 3:00:00 AM1/1/99
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Thanks, Greg, for letting me know! I had no idea that the sketch was ever broadcast
at all. That's interesting how Canada got it but the U.S. didn't. The "Flying
Circus" shows were first shown here in 1974, and I started watching them right away,
but I didn't start taping them until around 1978/79 when I got my first VCR. The
sketch wasn't shown when I taped it, and if memory serves me right, it wasn't shown
in '74 either. Now I'm ALSO wondering if anything else was cut from ours here in
the states.

gd

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Jan 2, 1999, 3:00:00 AM1/2/99
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Sheila Giangreco (i...@flash.net) wrote:
: Thanks, Greg, for letting me know! I had no idea that the sketch was ever broadcast

: at all. That's interesting how Canada got it but the U.S. didn't.


It's a rather amusing story. Before I tell you about it, let me say that
Dean Martin did run some bits from Monty Pythong (How Not to be Seen,
for one) on a summer show he had in the early '70's. I recognised it
only from having seen it in full here in Canada. Dean gave no credit to
anyone when showing it.

Canada got the first few episodes after we'd seen
a few teaser ads, the one I remember the most being the "milkman" sketch.

The show debuted and there was no promotion of it existing at all. Because
of our US branch plant economy of the time, the advertisers really shunned
anything but US shows to place advertising on. Thus Python NEVER ran a
paying ad from a sponsor.

The CBC saw no worth in the show financially, so plotted to have it
removed by saying that the ratings were so low as to be unreportable! They
also did nothing to promote it.

Quietly they had it taken off before the full run of the first season.

Then the impossible happened:

Full scale demonstrations outside CBC headquarters broke out in Montreal
(150 protesters) and Toronto (30 -40) and perhaps in Vancouver.

This compelled the CBC to show the rest of the episodes and to purchase
the rest of them up to and including the third season which were run here
in the summer of 1973.

In June 1973, the Pythons toured Canada and I was there the moment the ST.
Lawrence Centre opened it's box office (I was the only one there eager to
buy tickets immediately)and able to pick whatever seats I wanted in the
whole theatre for me and the friends for whom I was purchasing tickets for
(I was 17 years old at the time). Proudly I returned victorious with eight
front row centre seats. I was so thrilled.

We saw the show and I was in heaven and outside the theatre we saw
Michael, Terry and Terry and Carol running out (unnoticed by everyone but
us) to get a bite to eat. We pursued them and got to chat briefly
although they were just trying to get some food before the next
performance. They were not in a car...but ON FOOT in a strange town
searching for a restaurant!!

If this isn't evidence of 25 years ago being a simpler time, I don't know
what is.


Greg Duffell

: gd wrote:

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Louie Cole

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Jan 6, 1999, 3:00:00 AM1/6/99
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The UK had the Amazing Cargol and Janet commenting on The Mouse Problem
in series 1. Don't know why though. The game show sketch from series 2
has been missing for a while on repeat showings ...

Louie

gregory duffell

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Jan 6, 1999, 3:00:00 AM1/6/99
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Louie Cole (li...@leeds.ac.uk) wrote:
: The UK had the Amazing Cargol and Janet commenting on The Mouse Problem

: in series 1. Don't know why though. The game show sketch from series 2
: has been missing for a while on repeat showings ...

: Louie

The reason for editing is almost purely a U.S. concern. As I said before
cases of murder and arson are, and were, numerous compared to Britain.
As this show, as silly as it is, had someone advocating murder and arson,
as well as beastiality, the heavily litigious U.S. system would have any
broadcaster get nervous. It wouldn't be unusual to have someone charged
with either crime say they'd just seen an authority figure on television
advocating illegal activity and blame the public television service.

Greg D.
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AmbushBug4

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Jan 26, 1999, 3:00:00 AM1/26/99
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>
>The reason for editing is almost purely a U.S. concern.

Greg ----

A very nice and scholarly fellow called Morg...@aol.com has catalogued
many little bits that were reedited or cut altogether from the American
versions, and even at least one case where the American version had a bit put
back in. He never got his notes together, though, which is a shame, and worked
largely off of audiotape while you clearly have video, at least of episode one.
You two should really get together. I myself am far too busy cataloguing lost
scenes from the movies (and yes, when you watch most of them, and few ever get
to, you get the general idea they oughtn't have been cut) to do much on the
series, and anyway I don't have "Cargol and Janet" on video, nor "The Wacky
Queen."

For the record, Kim Howard Johnson's book comments on the American versions
(and contains a few small errors here and there), while the script books come
from British archive versions, I think. Judging from available evidence.

Much work was expended by Ron Devilier and Paramount to assure that the
American releases of the MPFC shows would be complete and unedited from the
British originals, but sometimes a few things just slipped through the cracks,
and will continue to do so as long as they're not recognized .......

Bug
| | Garrett Gilchrist AKA Ambus...@aol.com
| | anthropomorphic tiger & fozzie bear journalist
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