Sunshine song question
Cerul...@hotmail.com
(I posted before, but I don't think it went through.)
I've noticed a lot of people get "Sunshine on My Shoulders" mixed up
with "You are my Sunshine," a much older song. In fact, a friend did
this tonight when we were talking on the phone. She thinks it's
because John Denver's song (co-written with someone else, I think) is
inspired by the earlier one. Does anyone know how JD's song came to be
written? Does anyone else get confused, or am I sampling the wrong
people?
Another thing about this song: my husband says there is a movie
from the early 1970s about a hippie couple who have a daughter named
Sunshine, in which the woman dies of cancer. He says that "Sunshine
on My Shoulders" is on the soundtrack. If this is so, I haven't
heard anyone mention it, and I suspect he may have it mixed up with
the aforementioned other sunshine song. Does anyone know which
movie this is and which song is on the soundtrack?
This is my first posting. For me, John Denver's songs strike a chord
that no other singer's songs do. It's an ineffable quality -- it's
partly nostalgia and remembrance, since the songs bring back feelings
of early childhood when I first heard them, it's partly the wistfulness
of the songs, it's the way the experiences in the songs relate to me --
well, you all know what I mean :-) I don't know if I would use the
word "fan," because to me that denotes more of a sense of worship than I
feel about a fellow human being with normal human problems, but a
totally extraordinary talent.
My (elementary-school-aged) children love his songs too. My son's
favorites are "Country Roads" and "Leaving on a Jet Plane" and my
daughter's favorite is "For Bobbie." Which raises another point -- does
anyone feel uncomfortable about the songs which refer to being "high"
(e.g. Sunshine and RMH, to name two), particularly in relation to
children learning them or singing them? I'm opposed to drug use (for me
a personal decision), but I understand what the songs mean that have
this wording, and I think the wording can have a more universal
significance than use of chemicals.
I enjoy reading this newsgroup!
Lois
-------------------==== Posted via Deja News ====-----------------------
http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Post to Usenet
MtnMomx3
Wow Lois! Now you are picking the depts of my memory. I remember John singing
"You are my sunshine" (or was it "Moonlight Bay"?) with Doris Day on an early
special of his. Also I remember the movie "Sunshine".
It was a very sad movie. I believe there was a short lived television show
based on that movie. But I don't remember if "Sunshine on My Shoulder" was
actually sung in the movie. I would guess so, because they sang a lot of John
Denver's stuff.
Sunshine on my Shoulder is written by John Denver, Dick Kniss, and Mike Taylor.
Dyannah123
Hi Lois,
You write:>Subject: Sunshine song question
>From: Cerul...@hotmail.com
>Date: Mon, Feb 9, 1998 06:51 EST
>Message-id: <887025031...@dejanews.com>
I have never heard anyone getting John's song, "Sunshine on my Shoulders"
confused with "You are my Sunshine", but I suppose anyone not familiar with
John Denver or his music could make this mistake, even though they do not sound
alike at all. As far as the movie in the 70's, yes, your husband is right. I
think the man who starred in it is Cliff De Young, and it did have John's song,
"Sunshine" in it. In fact, in his later song, "Back Home Again", he makes
reference to that movie in the lyrics "Sunshine made her cry".....I guess the
story goes that Annie was talking to her mother the morning after the movie was
on and her mother said that it made her cry. I have young children also, and I
have never been uncomfortable with them listening to any of John's lyrics. I
think you can assume that most times when John was speaking of getting "high",
it was more of a feeling of exhilaration than any thing drug-induced, although
I do know that he did smoke marijuana and do a few other things at one time or
another. He was a human being, after all, and had his shortcomings as do the
rest of us. I think John was mainly "high" on life, and his songs reflect that
over and over again. My children love his music, even my 17 y/o, who I took to
one of his concerts a year ago. She really enjoyed it.My 8 y/o also knows the
words to most of his songs, as that is mostly all that I play. John Denver has
always been a big part of my life, and always will be. Hope I have helped
answer your questions.
Dyannah
Dr Pepper
> http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Post to Usenet
Hi Lois....I have elementary school-aged kids too (2nd and 3rd grade),
and they love to sing about getting "high", but the only "high" they
know is the high from the feelings they get when they are in the
mountains or experiencing something beautiful or wonderful for the first
time. I don't have any issues with what the songs connote for
individuals. John has always said he writes the songs about things in
his life but tries to make them relatively "generic" so they can apply
to many individuals in many situations. I can't remember where I saw
it, but I remember John saying that even though "Rcky Mtn High" was
written in reference to that night he was "chemically influenced", there
are many definitions for what a "Rcky Mtn High" is. And believe me I
have definitely experienced it (the oneness with nature), as have
millions of other people, and it was not drug induced. So who cares what
the literal sense of the words say....John always meant them to be
deeper than that!
Thanks for your post....BTW, I remember some kind of made for TV movie
about someone dying of cancer, and the theme song was Sunshine by JD.
Can't remember the title at the moment.... LS
Patty
Hi,
I have never heard of anyone getting John's "Sunshine on My Shoulders",
confused with "You Are My Sunshine".
I do have the "Anthology" songbook, and will quote what John had to say
about writing both "Rocky Mountain High" and "Sunshine On My Shoulders"
"ROCKY MOUNTAIN HIGH, the title song of the album, was written after we
had moved to the Rocky Mountains. We were living there, starting to go
camping, and everything that I had longed for all my life was now here
and around me. I found some new friends and lost a friend--killed on my
motorcycle when he and his wife were visiting us over one weekend.
Within that framework there was also a big controversy in
Colorado--working to get the Winter Olympics of 1972 in Colorado. The
feeling was that what they were going to do, the money that was going to
be spent and the scars that would be made were going to support
something that most probably would never be used again. The combination
of all these things inspired me to write ROCKY MOUNTAIN HIGH."
"SUNSHINE ON MY SHOULDERS, has an interesting background. There was a
movie being made at that time that I was asked to write a song for. It
had to do with two people who were going to die, and they knew they were
going to die, so this is how they spent their last day together. In a
lot of the things they did, they were celebrating; enjoying being with
each other and making love, and going to the beach and laughing and
dancing in the waves. And yet there was this overriding sense of
sadness through it all. The scene SUNSHINE was written for was the
scene where they were laughing and dancing in the water. I wrote the
song in Minnesota at the time I call late winter, early spring. It was
a dreary day, gray and slushy. The snow was melting and it's too cold
to go outside and have fun, and if yo do, you get all sloppy and dirty,
but God, you're ready for spring. You want to get outdoors again and
you're waiting for that sun and looking for it. So, in that very
melancholy frame of mind I wrote SUNSHINE ON MY SHOULDERS."
Well, I have seen the movie "Sunshine" and in fact have a very poor
video copy of it. John was a little mistaken about it, both people do
not have cancer and die, it is only the young woman. There are other
songs of his earlier days that are also used throughout the movie, "My
Sweet Lady", being one. There is also a paperback book of the same name
and story, that can occasionally be found at used bookstores.
Patty
George
I think the children should be tought that when John uses the word "High" in
a song he's not referring to drugs. Maybe it could be explained to them that
high refers to an extremely elated state , and try to relate it to a real
happy experience that they may have had in their life. I would be more
concerned with the line "While all my friends and my old lady sit and pass a
pipe around"
from "Poems, Prayers, and Promises" than the word high. How do you explain
that line to the kids ?
It's kind of nice that he changed it to "sit and watch the sun go down"
later on.
As far as the movie Sunshine, I saw it in the mid 70's. I think it was a
movie of the week
or something like that. I don't remember hearing Johns recordings ,but I do
remember
the couple in the movie singing at least 2 of his songs.
In the opening credits , they said something like " featuring the songs of
John Denver"
If I remember correctly the wife had cancer in one leg and chose not to have
it amputated. She was pregnant and would tape special messages for her baby.
kind of like that movie w/ Michael Keaton.
now I'm thinking the baby may have been during the course of the movie.
It's been over 20 years.
I do remember a scene. The wife is throwing up in the bathroom and the
husband is in the other room singing and playing the guitar. She says "how
can you sing while I'm throwing up ?" . He says "how can you throw up while
I'm singing ?"
kinda funny what we remember sometimes isn't it ?
I think the baby's name was Sunshine.
talk to you soon
take care
George
Betsey
Cerul...@hotmail.com wrote:
>
> (I posted before, but I don't think it went through.)
>
> I've noticed a lot of people get "Sunshine on My Shoulders" mixed up
> with "You are my Sunshine," a much older song. In fact, a friend did
> this tonight when we were talking on the phone. She thinks it's
> because John Denver's song (co-written with someone else, I think) is
> inspired by the earlier one. Does anyone know how JD's song came to be
> written? Does anyone else get confused, or am I sampling the wrong
> people?
Lois, Since other people have responded to your other questions I'll
confine myself to where the song came from. From what I have heard he
wrote it when he was living here in Minnesota after he and Annie were
married. Anyone who has lived through a MN winter knows how much you
crave sunshine. The days are short and we go for weeks w/o seeing the
sun. At a concert he said he wrote it toward spring when our cars are
covered with gunk from the melt and it's still cold and cloudy but there
are small sighs that spring is on the way. Hope this helps. Betsey
GBruck
Hi George,
You know, though I was a teenager and 20 year-old in the late 60s and early 70s,
I did not live in a part of the country or run with a crowd that was into that
kind of stuff. Things have always come to the Michigan outback about ten years
later than anywhere else! For years after I heard that line about passing the
pipe around in "P,P,P", I thought it referred to an Indian peace pipe. I'm not
saying that was what JD meant, just that I thought it fit perfectly with the
rest of the words and still do!
Linda B
George wrote:
> Cerul...@hotmail.com wrote:
>
> > (I posted before, but I don't think it went through.)
> >
> > I've noticed a lot of people get "Sunshine on My Shoulders" mixed up
> > with "You are my Sunshine," a much older song. In fact, a friend did
> > this tonight when we were talking on the phone. She thinks it's
> > because John Denver's song (co-written with someone else, I think) is
> > inspired by the earlier one. Does anyone know how JD's song came to be
> > written? Does anyone else get confused, or am I sampling the wrong
> > people?
> >
--
It is one of the most beautiful compensations of this life
that no man can sincerely try to help another
without helping himself.
--- Emerson ---
FoxfirePat
> For years after I heard that line about passing the
>pipe around in "P,P,P", I thought it referred to an Indian peace pipe.
You know, Linda, I always thought that, too.
Pat/CO
"May you know the warmth of love
and wrap it all around you"
lst...@webtv.net
I remember the movie SUNSHINE had a sequel called SUNSHINE CHRISTMAS.
I believe the guy nicknamed his daughter that because of the song.
I don't remember the tv show but there well might have been one.
Larry t
CKenney194
You wrote:
For years after I heard that line about passing the
saying that was what JD meant, just that I thought it fit perfectly with the
rest of the words and still do!
That was the way I heard John answer that question many times!
Peace,
Carole
Cerul...@hotmail.com
Thanks everyone for all your great answers about "Sunshine"! And thanks
for the answers about the drug question too.
I discovered that on another thread, a poster posted the Readers' Digest
interview, which has much of the answer to my sunshine question.
[from the Readers' Digest interview]
{“Sunshine on My Shoulders” has curious history, doesn’t it?} Yes. I
wrote that song in 1972 with Mike Taylor and Dick Kniss, and it first
appeared on my “Poem, Prayers & Promises” LP (1972). I also used it as
the B side of my “I’d Rather Be a Cowboy” single (1973). Then actor
Cliff DeYoung, who sang some of my songs in the 1973 TV movie
“Sunshine”, put out a single of “My Sweet Lady” with “Sunshine on My
Shoulders” on the flip side. When RCA announced plans to issue my
“Greatest Hits” album, I re-recorded some material, including this song.
The result was my first chart-topper. Some of my songs, like “I’m Sorry”
and “Sunshine on My Shoulders,” are melancholy songs on melancholy
subjects. But they make you feel like “Yeah, I’ve been there before”—in
a positive way. “Sunshine” is not a country song. On one level, it’s
about the virtues of love. On another, more deeply felt level, it
reaches for something that the whole world can embrace. (No. 1 pop, No.
42 country, 1974)
Pamela Beasley
FoxfirePat wrote:
>
> > For years after I heard that line about passing the
> >pipe around in "P,P,P", I thought it referred to an Indian peace pipe.
>
>
> Pat/CO
>
way.
Pam
cbergen
I mean no disrespect, but I can't take this anymore. Passing the pipe
around refers to smoking grass. Do you know of anyone who passes an
Indian Peace Pipe around with friends? Besides that, the Indians weren't
smoking tobacco in their pipes either. Check history.
This nonsense about Rocky Mountain's high being a natural "elated"
state is just that. Pure nonsense. The man admitted in his autobiography
that he was on a drug induced high when he describes the experience when
watching the meteor showers in his song. (Which is fine by me, none of
my business.) He also stated that high COULD also mean "naturally high".
To sanctify his memory is an injustice to the human being known as John
Denver. Sugar coating the meanings of his songs (when he wrote them) is
dishonest at best. The man was human, he was honest, and he was a damn
good song writer and entertainer. He wasn't a "saint" and I believe he
would be appalled to be put on this impossible pedastal. To deny the
facts as HE wrote them, is akin to denying that Thomas Jefferson, one of
the great men of our nation, owned a slew of slaves.
I'll take John Denver as he was. Rocky Mountain "high", passing around a
pipe, and all the good as well as the marginal.
After I wrote this, I realized I really should have written this to the
man that suggested we all tell our kids that John Denver meant "high" to
be a "natural high". YEA! Let's all lie to our kids! NOT.
FoxfirePat wrote:
> > For years after I heard that line about passing the
> >pipe around in "P,P,P", I thought it referred to an Indian peace
> pipe.
>
> You know, Linda, I always thought that, too.
>
> Pat/CO
>
cbergen
And what did the Indians smoke in their pipes? Tobacco? Nooooooo.
Lettuce leaves? Noooooooo. Guess again.
CKenney194 wrote:
> You wrote:
> For years after I heard that line about passing the
> pipe around in "P,P,P", I thought it referred to an Indian peace
BaxTerr
Hi Lois,
I see your questions have been answered, but I wanted to add that I enjoyed
reading your post. You said this so beautifully:
>For me, John Denver's songs strike a chord
>that no other singer's songs do. It's an ineffable quality -- it's
>partly nostalgia and remembrance, since the songs bring back feelings
>of early childhood when I first heard them, it's partly the wistfulness
>of the songs, it's the way the experiences in the songs relate to me --
>well, you all know what I mean :-)
And I also liked what you said about the word "fan":
> I don't know if I would use the
>word "fan," because to me that denotes more of a sense of worship than I
>feel about a fellow human being with normal human problems, but a
>totally extraordinary talent.
By the way, the elementary children aren't the only ones that are learning from
you- I looked up "ineffable", GREAT CHOICE to use to discribe John's music!
(also looked up Cerulean, nice screen name, but why are you at hotmail.com?
I'm curious because I just delete unopened email from that address since it's
always "Adult content".)
Terri
GBruck
I think that if you will actually read what was written, you will see that,
for the most part, we were referring to our naivete in thinking he was
referring to a peace pipe. We have since learned that he took some drugs
and smoked some marijuana - he became open and honest about that. I also
didn't know for a very long time that the Indians didn't smoke tobacco in
their pipes, whether you care to believe that or not.
You bet he was honest, once he got past a very natural reticence to publicly
admit to such things, and I admire him for his honesty always. As for
"Rocky Mt. High" being a drug-induced song...well, I have never taken drugs
in my life, but I have many times felt a wonderful natural high, which is
just what he described.
Another thing that you might remember John said about the "meaning of his
songs" was that he was thrilled to have people derive their own meanings
from them, and they often took on a new meaning for him when he sang them.
Nobody is "sugar-coating" John Denver; in my opinion, the man and his works
stand on their own!
Linda B
cbergen wrote:
> I mean no disrespect, but I can't take this anymore. Passing the pipe
> around refers to smoking grass. Do you know of anyone who passes an
> Indian Peace Pipe around with friends? Besides that, the Indians weren't
> smoking tobacco in their pipes either. Check history.
>
> This nonsense about Rocky Mountain's high being a natural "elated"
> state is just that. Pure nonsense. The man admitted in his autobiography
> that he was on a drug induced high when he describes the experience when
> watching the meteor showers in his song. (Which is fine by me, none of
> my business.) He also stated that high COULD also mean "naturally high".
>
> To sanctify his memory is an injustice to the human being known as John
> Denver. Sugar coating the meanings of his songs (when he wrote them) is
> dishonest at best. The man was human, he was honest, and he was a damn
> good song writer and entertainer. He wasn't a "saint" and I believe he
> would be appalled to be put on this impossible pedastal. To deny the
> facts as HE wrote them, is akin to denying that Thomas Jefferson, one of
> the great men of our nation, owned a slew of slaves.
>
> I'll take John Denver as he was. Rocky Mountain "high", passing around a
> pipe, and all the good as well as the marginal.
>
> After I wrote this, I realized I really should have written this to the
> man that suggested we all tell our kids that John Denver meant "high" to
> be a "natural high". YEA! Let's all lie to our kids! NOT.
>
> FoxfirePat wrote:
>
> > > For years after I heard that line about passing the
> > >pipe around in "P,P,P", I thought it referred to an Indian peace
> > pipe.
> >
> > You know, Linda, I always thought that, too.
> >
> > Pat/CO
> >
> > "May you know the warmth of love
> > and wrap it all around you"
--
etc...
does the song have to have only one meaning?
is not everything open to an individual's interpretation?...
and doesn't this interpretation change as we grow and learn?...
why not let a child explore his or her own understanding of the song,
and all things in life... certainly we can answer question, and guide,
but one perspective does not negate another in an open mind...
are we worried about negative hidden messages corrupting our
children?... I watched cartoons as a child and enjoyed them, not having
the frame of reference to understand some of the references... and I
watch cartoons today and find all the layers of meanings... it doesn't
matter as much to me what the artist meant as much as how I appreciate
the art... isn't that what art is all about?...
so let's say John was high and the words of the song referred to
drugs... in this case, perhaps the hidden message (even hidden to John
at the time her wrote it) was the natural high he did not mean at the
time, but is definitely evident (and not hidden) and real for me in the
words...
here's to more "hidden meanings" like this one :)
etc... (who prefers to {and tries to :} choose the positive perspective,
no matter what the artist or writer meant)
each from their own perspective sees
a different forest among the trees :)
BHoehn123
John's openness.....
I was listening to one of his 70's interviews....and he commented on how he cut
the grass at Starwood in the nude, and the family usually went swiming in the
nude.....he commented on this in the most natural way. I can't help smiling at
this.....my goodness telling the whole world he did this.....I bet there was a
whole lot of different reactions to those comments.....
I know what your doing right now, the wheels are turning in your brain right
now....your saying to yourself right now.....I would sure like a copy of that
tape....right.....
Well.......save my email and check in a couple of weeks....going bananas right
now copying tapes ....
Might be talked into swapping right now for the interview, for a swap of a
concert (I love the concerts)....
Barbara
Dr Pepper
Thank you for stating this.....I agree with you whole-heartedly, but if
"cbergen" believes this about JDs songs, that is fine. This is their
opinion.....and this ng is open to ALL opinions, even if we don't
necessarily agree with them. This person sincerely admires the guy (JD),
and I for one, automatically want to hear (good or bad) what a JD fan
has to say about things. But for myself, I believe that Rocky Mtn High
can mean the high that you get in the mountains when taking in the
views, the smells, the quite, the peacefulness, the oneness and as John
has stated lots of times, his songs have several meanings. The
impression I got was that Rocky Mtn High got it's origin from that one
night JD had a drug experience in the mountains, but since then it has
taken on so many new meanings....I think he mentions it on the Wildlife
Concert Video, that it is a high you get when camping in the mountains
or whatever it means to you as individual...I can't remember which video
because I watch all of them so many times, they are mixed up in my
head....but I know he says it. As far as telling little kids....when
kids are young, they are not always "equipped" to handle drug issues.
(the same goes for murder, rape etc....) I don't think one should lie
to them.....but I think expressing to them what the song means to you as
a parent is not a lie.....and I don't believe in "sugar coating" it
either....just looking for a deeper meaning....LS
Carolyn Bergen
GBruck wrote:
> >>I think that if you will actually read what was written, you will
> see that,
> for the most part, we were referring to our naivete in thinking he was
>
> referring to a peace pipe.<<
If you mean you were thinking that he was referring to a legal
substance, yup, your naivety is showing. :)
> >> We have since learned that he took some drugs
> and smoked some marijuana - he became open and honest about that. I
> also
> didn't know for a very long time that the Indians didn't smoke tobacco
> in
> their pipes, whether you care to believe that or not.<<
I believe that.
> >>You bet he was honest, once he got past a very natural reticence to
> publicly
> admit to such things, and I admire him for his honesty always. As for
>
> "Rocky Mt. High" being a drug-induced song...well, I have never taken
> drugs
> in my life, but I have many times felt a wonderful natural high, which
> is
> just what he described.<<
Which is fabulous!
Now then , my point was missed entirely, I see. Rocky Mountain High was
WRITTEN about his experience that came from watching the meteor showers
on a night when he was taking drugs. You can always listen to the song
and apply the "high" to a natural one. I'm sure that's what it generally
came to mean to a lot of people. I just cringe when people talk about
the song as if John meant it to be that way WHEN he wrote the song. He
didn't.
> >>John Denver; in my opinion, the man and his works
> stand on their own!<<
Absolutely!
Carolyn Bergen
etc... wrote:
> does the song have to have only one meaning?
>
> is not everything open to an individual's interpretation?...
>
> and doesn't this interpretation change as we grow and learn?...
Yes, which is what I stated in my post. I also stated that it can mean a
natural high. However, it wasn't written as such.
>
>
> >>why not let a child explore his or her own understanding of the
> song,
> and all things in life... certainly we can answer question, and guide,
>
> but one perspective does not negate another in an open mind.<<
I agree, but, and this is a big but....if my child asks that when JD
wrote this song, he was referring to illegal substances, I'll tell him
the truth. The worst thing we can do, in my humble opinion, is to lie
and tell children he was referring to a "natural high".
> >>are we worried about negative hidden messages corrupting our
> children?...<<
Nope. Guidance is the key.
> >>I watched cartoons as a child and enjoyed them, not having
> the frame of reference to understand some of the references... and I
> watch cartoons today and find all the layers of meanings... it doesn't
>
> matter as much to me what the artist meant as much as how I appreciate
>
> the art... isn't that what art is all about?...<<
Yes, it is also about what the artist wanted us to see in his art.
> >>so let's say John was high and the words of the song referred to
> drugs... in this case, perhaps the hidden message (even hidden to John
>
> at the time her wrote it) was the natural high he did not mean at the
> time, but is definitely evident (and not hidden) and real for me in
> the
> words...<<
I'm sure John did mix the natural as well as the un-natural high in this
song.
> >>here's to more "hidden meanings" like this one :)
>
> etc... (who prefers to {and tries to :} choose the positive
> perspective,
> no matter what the artist or writer meant)
>
> each from their own perspective sees
>
> a different forest among the trees :)<<
So you are saying it doesn't matter what the artist was trying to get
across at the time?
Reminds me of a three yr old that draws a picture of a tree. The adult
looks at it and says "My, what a lovely house!"
Patty
Carolyn Bergen wrote:
>
>
>
> Yes, it is also about what the artist wanted us to see in his art.
>
>
> across at the time?
>
This discussion has been very interesting to me, and I just wanted to
quote something written by John himself, in the back of the Legacy
Songbook, Epilogue....."In this book, I have tried to tell you a little
bit about where these songs have come from or, in some instances, what I
was thinking about when I wrote them. I realized that these songs not
only speak FOR me, in many cases, they still speak TO me, sometimes with
new and different messages. The point is, I don't want you to think
that what the song is about for me is what the song is about. That's
only what the song is for me, and it could mean something completely
different for you. A good song is a window into the soul of the
listener.
I don't believe that anyone should ever say. 'That is what the song(or
any work of art, for that matter) is about'. The writer or artist can
only say, 'This is what it means to me'. After that, whatever comes up
comes from and belongs to the listener."
So, John wants us to see what we want from his songs, not necessarily
what he wrote. He did't want us to see necessarily what he saw, but what
it means to us, individually. It therefore, doesn't matter what he was
trying to get across at the time!
Peace,
Patty
LOU
RE: Rocky Mountain High, to quote Johns own words from his book, Take Me
Home, on page 112, "Some people had the idea that the song was about
getting stoned in the mountains, and it's true that some of that was
going on, but the song was about how exhilarating it was to be there, to
feel free,to have come to such a place, both personally and
geographically, and it was a reflection on mortality.
Rose1533
In article <19980213141...@ladder02.news.aol.com>, bhoe...@aol.com
(BHoehn123) writes:
Barbara
LOL!!!! I heard that a long time ago, but didn't remember it until now!!!! My
husband has a good friend who is also a JD fan who, if I'm not mistaken, likes
to mow in the all-together too.
Mr Nice
At (presumably) something over 14,000 feet the Rocky Mountains are quite
high.
That's what I always thought that he meant.
What do I know ?
mela...@warwick.net
Thank you, Carolyn, for addressing the errors in thinking about the
"Poems, Prayers, and Promises" verse and the "Rocky Mountain High"
meaning. You took the words right out of my mouth. Of course, even
though John admitted to drug use during his camping trip which inspired
Rocky Mountain High, he did refer to Rocky Mountain High as a naturally
induced sensation many times. To name one of these times, I am quoting
out of his autobiography, page 112, which says: "Some people had the
idea that the song was about getting stoned in the mountains, and it's
to be there, to feel free, to have come to such a place, both personally
and geographically."
Mela
Dr Pepper
I think it is so cool that John mowed his own grass.....naked or not! I
live in a neighborhood (not all that fancy) where everyone has "yard
men", about 5 at one time. I am about the only one that mows their own
yard here (how "uncool"). There I am with my pollen mask and safety
glasses, mowing and raking and sweeping and edging, sweating and
grunting.....John could have easily hired somebody....cool....mows his
own lawn.....that's a first that I've heard of for a millionaire to do!
"It amazes me"....LS
Dulcejazz
>I think it is so cool that John mowed his own grass.....naked or not! I
>live in a neighborhood (not all that fancy) where everyone has "yard
>men", about 5 at one time. I am about the only one that mows their own
>yard here (how "uncool"). There I am with my pollen mask and safety
>glasses, mowing and raking and sweeping and edging, sweating and
>grunting.....John could have easily hired somebody....cool....mows his
>own lawn.....that's a first that I've heard of for a millionaire to do!
>"It amazes me"....LS
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
I remember that article in the TV guide interview back in the early 70's when
John said that he liked to mow his lawn and in the "nude".
I think he really got into mowing the yard because he was so proud to have a
yard of his own. He said since his family moved around so much as he grew up,
he never really had a sense of a place of his own. So when he designed and
built he and Annie's first house, it was a dream come true. To finally own
something...and in such a beautiful place. He evidentally enjoyed it right down
to his bare little toes!!! <G>
I for one can relate...and understood that perfectly.
cbergen
Patty wrote:
> >>This discussion has been very interesting to me, and I just wanted
> to
> quote something written by John himself, in the back of the Legacy
> Songbook, Epilogue....."In this book, I have tried to tell you a
> little
> bit about where these songs have come from or, in some instances, what
> I
> was thinking about when I wrote them. I realized that these songs not
>
> only speak FOR me, in many cases, they still speak TO me, sometimes
> with
> new and different messages. The point is, I don't want you to think
> that what the song is about for me is what the song is about. That's
> only what the song is for me, and it could mean something completely
> different for you. A good song is a window into the soul of the
> listener.<<
Ohhhhh boy. I understand that. All I am saying is what was on JOHN'S
MIND when he wrote the song, not what it means to Patty, Linda, or
anyone else in this ng or in the world at this point in time.
> >>I don't believe that anyone should ever say. 'That is what the
> song(or
> any work of art, for that matter) is about'.<<
But we can say what it was about to John when it was written. People
seem to want to gloss over that because of the "drug thing."
Regards,
Carolyn
>
cbergen
LOU wrote:
> RE: Rocky Mountain High, to quote Johns own words from his book, Take
> Me
> Home, on page 112, "Some people had the idea that the song was about
> getting stoned in the mountains, and it's true that some of that was
> going on, but the song was about how exhilarating it was to be there,
> to
> feel free,to have come to such a place, both personally and
> geographically, and it was a reflection on mortality.
Yep, it was true that people were getting stoned. I think that may have
a bit to do with the exhilaration.
Carolyn
cbergen
ASLTsmile wrote:
>>Actually, if I remember correctly, he didn't say he was in a
drug-induced state
> while watching the meteor shower. He was talking about the line "And
> they say
> that he got crazy once and tried to touch the sky". This was due to
> an acid
> trip and motorcycle ride with a friend named Crow.<<
No, he really did say that pot smoking was going on that night. The acid
trip is a different story.
>
>
> You're right about the fact that it really is none of our business.
> Also,
> about the fact that being put up on a pedistal is very difficult to
> live up to.
> Let's face it, a lot of us did put him up there, too. I'm glad to
> know he was
> human with faults and all. It makes everything wonderful he did that
> much more
> so, because it means we, with all our faults, can do the same.
>
AMEN to that!
> Carolyn
Pamela Beasley
cbergen wrote:
>
> I mean no disrespect, but I can't take this anymore. Passing the pipe
> around refers to smoking grass. Do you know of anyone who passes an
> Indian Peace Pipe around with friends? Besides that, the Indians weren't
> smoking tobacco in their pipes either. Check history.
True, but when we were kids in school no teacher ever told us that.
Even though I know the truth now, the original childhood impressions
remain. As far as I knew their pipes held "plain ole tabacy".
> To sanctify his memory is an injustice to the human being known as John
> Denver. Sugar coating the meanings of his songs (when he wrote them) is
> dishonest at best. The man was human, he was honest, and he was a damn
> good song writer and entertainer.
You forget that everyone is free to find their own meaning in the
songs. We all approach them from our own individual frame of reference.
To condemn another for a different interpretation of a song is very
short-sighted. The Honest truth about the meanings of John's songs is
that he wanted all of us to find our own meanings in them.
He wasn't a "saint" and I believe he
> would be appalled to be put on this impossible pedastal.
Of course, he didn't want to be "put on a pedastal". That is one of the
reasons he wrote the book.
> After I wrote this, I realized I really should have written this to the
> man that suggested we all tell our kids that John Denver meant "high" to
> be a "natural high". YEA! Let's all lie to our kids! NOT.
What you tell a child depends on his age and level of understanding.
You don't lie but you, as an adult, decide how much information a child
needs at a given age.
Pamela Beasley
All eight of his little toes!! The fact that he lost 2 toes to a lawn
mover as a teenager makes this such an amazing story. We always knew he
was one to take chances. If I had lost toes to a lawn mower, I would be
reluctant to get near one again--esp. with my toes bare!!
Pamela Beasley
ASLTsmile wrote:
>
> >> This nonsense about Rocky Mountain's high being a natural "elated"
> >> state is just that. Pure nonsense. The man admitted in his autobiography
> >> that he was on a drug induced high when he describes the experience when
> >> watching the meteor showers in his song. (Which is fine by me, none of
> >> my business.) He also stated that high COULD also mean "naturally high".
>
> while watching the meteor shower. He was talking about the line "And they say
> that he got crazy once and tried to touch the sky". This was due to an acid
> trip and motorcycle ride with a friend named Crow.
>
> about the fact that being put up on a pedistal is very difficult to live up to.
> Let's face it, a lot of us did put him up there, too. I'm glad to know he was
> human with faults and all. It makes everything wonderful he did that much more
> so, because it means we, with all our faults, can do the same.
>
> Tricia
Beautifully said, Tricia!!
Pamela Beasley
Carolyn Bergen wrote:
> Now then , my point was missed entirely, I see. Rocky Mountain High was
> WRITTEN about his experience that came from watching the meteor showers
> on a night when he was taking drugs. You can always listen to the song
> and apply the "high" to a natural one. I'm sure that's what it generally
> came to mean to a lot of people. I just cringe when people talk about
> the song as if John meant it to be that way WHEN he wrote the song. He
> didn't.
If you go back and read what John wrote about that camping trip, (as I
just did) he never mentioned drugs in connection with the camping trip.
In the paragraphs after the discussion of the camping trip, he begins to
talk about getting high with several Aspen friends during that summer.
John said that during that time of his life drugs were around, but for
him the most personal meaning of Rocky Mt. High was about the natural
high he got by being in the mountains.
Pamela Beasley
> live in a neighborhood (not all that fancy) where everyone has "yard
> men", about 5 at one time. I am about the only one that mows their own
> yard here (how "uncool"). There I am with my pollen mask and safety
> glasses, mowing and raking and sweeping and edging, sweating and
> grunting.....John could have easily hired somebody....cool....mows his
> own lawn.....that's a first that I've heard of for a millionaire to do!
> "It amazes me"....LS
John also insisted on toting his own bags. He always did his share of
loading bags. He really did remember and believe his Dad's words about
not being better than anyone else.
Pamela Beasley
Carolyn Bergen wrote:
>
> etc... wrote:
>
> > does the song have to have only one meaning?
> >
> > is not everything open to an individual's interpretation?...
> >
> > and doesn't this interpretation change as we grow and learn?...
>
> Yes, which is what I stated in my post. I also stated that it can mean a
> natural high. However, it wasn't written as such.
Why do you keep insisting that John wasn't referring to a natural high
in the song? John has said many times that he was. The overriding
urgency to write the song came because of where he was at the time.
> So you are saying it doesn't matter what the artist was trying to get
> across at the time?
> Reminds me of a three yr old that draws a picture of a tree. The adult
> looks at it and says "My, what a lovely house!"
You are stuck on the drug aspect of the word "high". At the time, John
would not have wanted it known that he was doing drugs of any kind. So
I can't figure that John's primary message in the song was concerned
with "getting high." What John wanted people to know was how wonderful
it was to be in the mountains. But, then as now, there are those who
can't get past the so-called drugged high aspect.
Pamela Beasley
Patty wrote:
>
> Carolyn Bergen wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> > Yes, it is also about what the artist wanted us to see in his art.
> >
> >
> > across at the time?
> >
>
> quote something written by John himself, in the back of the Legacy
> Songbook, Epilogue....."In this book, I have tried to tell you a little
> bit about where these songs have come from or, in some instances, what I
> was thinking about when I wrote them. I realized that these songs not
> only speak FOR me, in many cases, they still speak TO me, sometimes with
> new and different messages. The point is, I don't want you to think
> that what the song is about for me is what the song is about. That's
> only what the song is for me, and it could mean something completely
> different for you. A good song is a window into the soul of the
> listener.
> only say, 'This is what it means to me'. After that, whatever comes up
> comes from and belongs to the listener."
>
> So, John wants us to see what we want from his songs, not necessarily
> what he wrote. He did't want us to see necessarily what he saw, but what
> trying to get across at the time!
>
> Peace,
> Patty
Yeah, Patty. I remember reading this, but I forgot where!
ASLTsmile
mjbn
I noticed that in Johns later recordings - and at the last concert I saw
him at in June 97, in at least the last verse he changed the words to "sit
and watch the sun go down". Gave me the impression that he too may have
had a concern about the message here.
Dulcejazz
As I read this continuing debate, I keep thinking...does it all really
matter? I think Trcia had a good piece to say, but in the end I have one
question...to all concerned if he was "high" from whatever reason.....
Have you been to the mountains? On a clear night, on a clear day, or even
in the rain or fog...what a magnificient experiance! The smells (refreshing,
cool, clean,sweet air) the sights, (somrtimes you can see forever past other
peaks and rolling valleys) the sounds (of crickets, chatterring animals,
calling birds and the cool breeze blowing or even a strong powerful wind).
It makes me high! How does it effect you?
I live on the beaches of Florida, but when I go to the mountains I feel like
I'm going home !
Thanks for letting me share my view on this "Rocky Mtn High"
I think the guitar Intro. and power that John delivered the words with caught
that exhilaration that I feel in the mountains! A demonstration of his talent
to take his experiance express it to us in a way that all people can relate to
in thier own way, due to their experiances. Like a lot of you- I understood
completely.
Martha
Sami421
For years I had John up on that pedestal. For this reason I was afraid to read
his autobiography. I didn't want the image tarnished of him since so much of
the negativeness of the book was talked about. But now I've listened to the
CD's and am in the middle of the book. All this has made him shine even more
for me. The pedsetal isn't tall enough anymore.
MMJD
Kathy
Carolyn Bergen
Pamela Beasley wrote:
> >>You forget that everyone is free to find their own meaning in the
> songs. We all approach them from our own individual frame of
> reference.
> To condemn another for a different interpretation of a song is very
> short-sighted. The Honest truth about the meanings of John's songs
> is
> that he wanted all of us to find our own meanings in them.<<
I'm not condemning anyone, and I haven't forgot that everyone is free to
find their own meaning in the songs. (Hence the emphasis on "WHEN he
wrote the song." I reiterated that a zillion times. Now it's a zillion
and one.
> >>Of course, he didn't want to be "put on a pedastal". That is one of
> the
> reasons he wrote the book.<<
And yet many people still put him on that pedastal.
>
>
> >>What you tell a child depends on his age and level of understanding.
>
> You don't lie but you, as an adult, decide how much information a
> child
> needs at a given age.<<
So what DO you tell a child who asks what he meant when he wrote the
song then?
Carolyn
Carolyn Bergen
Pamela Beasley wrote:
> >>If you go back and read what John wrote about that camping trip, (as
> I
> just did) he never mentioned drugs in connection with the camping
> trip.
> In the paragraphs after the discussion of the camping trip, he begins
> to
> talk about getting high with several Aspen friends during that summer.
>
> John said that during that time of his life drugs were around, but for
>
> him the most personal meaning of Rocky Mt. High was about the natural
> high he got by being in the mountains.<<
Perhaps it is you who should go back and read it. I quote from John's
book:
Pg 111
"And they say that he got crazy once and he tried to touch the sun" from
"Rocky Mountain High" came out of this. (In reference to acid trip that
summer)
Pg 112
"Some people had the idea that the song was about getting stoned in the
mountains. and IT'S TRUE THAT WAS GOING ON (emphasis mine), but the song
was how exhilarating it was to be there, to feel free, to have come to
such a place, both personally and geographically..."
Carolyn
Carolyn Bergen
Yeah, I guess its for all those people who get upset about references to
smoking pot as they sip their "drug in a bottle". (alcoholic beverages).
:)
Carolyn Bergen
Pamela Beasley wrote:
>
>
> Carolyn wrote> Yes, which is what I stated in my post. I also stated
> that it can mean a
> > natural high. However, it wasn't written as such.
>
> >>Why do you keep insisting that John wasn't referring to a natural
> high
> in the song? John has said many times that he was. The overriding
> urgency to write the song came because of where he was at the time.<<
Where John was at the time was in Colorado, and he was partaking of pot
and acid. That's reality.
> >>You are stuck on the drug aspect of the word "high". At the time,
> John
> would not have wanted it known that he was doing drugs of any kind.
> So
> I can't figure that John's primary message in the song was concerned
> with "getting high." What John wanted people to know was how
> wonderful
> it was to be in the mountains. But, then as now, there are those who
> can't get past the so-called drugged high aspect.<<
And there will always be people who find drug use so hard to accept that
they wish it to didn't exist. I for one, could give a rat's patoot about
John experimenting with drugs. It is those who find it hard to accept
that have a cow about it.
Carolyn
EdOlczyk
Carolyn, yes the pipe John refers to in PP&P is a hash pipe, it was mentioned
in vaguery by (forgot who) at the Aspen Memorial. I think it was unfortunate
that he used that in the original song, and thank God he changed it in
subsequent recordings and when he did it in concert. To me, it taints the
beauty and meanings of the song.
I don't think he'd be apalled at being put on a pedestal, but rather he might
have been somewhat embarrassed because he wasn't about being "kudized". After
having watched Portrait", it was more than apparent in his on camera delivery
that that was so...just simple and honest. The fact that he did so many things
on a charitable basis in Aspen that no one knew about until they were published
in the Aspen Times recently, indicates to me that he talked the talk and walked
the walk...and thensome.
Sanctification is the farthest thing that John Denver fans bestow onto him.
Simply put, we loved the man. Being drunk while driving, or doing a little mary
jane is not what we remember him by. Obviously you never met him in person. He
was every bit the complex man that Annie spoke about with Bryant Gumbel. A
genuinely likable outgoing human being on stage, and a diametrically opposite,
somewhat "shy" man one on one. Someone who you just wouldn't be able to figure
out based on only one introduction, someone who despite having long ago
achieved legendary status, who as incredible as it may sound, felt just as shy
in your presence as you did in his. To have known him in person, just he and
myself for mere minutes, and to have felt the warmth emanating from his soul
through his smile and gentle handshake is what makes me cry a river of tears to
this day, to continue until the day I die.
He was not a saint, but then neither are you and me, and assuredly he was a
heck of a lot closer than either one of us are or will ever be. I've never had
the chance to be with a less fortunate kid, nor go to the poorest of countries
in Africa to spread cheer with my music.
Back in 1977, he gave a concert in Los Angeles, and as told by a letter to the
editor shortly after his death, a lady describes how she and her teenage
daughter had tickets to this much anticipated show, but her daughter was
stricken very ill, hospitalized, and couldn't make it. The hospital called the
venue, John received word about the misfortunes of this young girl and her
mother, and the next day called her on the phone at her hospital bed, spoke to
her for a few minutes and then proceeded to sing and play a few songs for her.
She was absolutely awestruck. It was great sadness that I read at the end of
the letter that this young girl passed on shortly after from this illness, but
John's tenderness and caring shone through like a bright star (and the bright
Star that he was) and made her short life absolutely complete in the words of
her mother.
His song Rocky Mountain High IS NOT, I REPEAT, IS NOT about smoking marijuana,
dropping acid, shooting heroine, snorting coke, bongs, ya da ya da ya da (he
climbed cathedral mountains...he walks in quiet solitude...the serenity of a
clear blue mountain lake). He did experiment with marijuana in the 60s as did
everyone else. He did a lot less than most others. He wrote RMH during the
annual Perseid meteor showers as he describes in his video "A Portrait" and the
high he's talking about are the naturally occuring endorphines that are
produced in the brain and which are responsible for the feelings of euphoria
that we experience.
Too many times, the word "high" is solely used to describe the use of drugs to
induce euphoria. I haven't heard his autobiography yet to validate what you've
stated about his being high on weed when he wrote it, but whether or not he
was, the high that he's talking about is natural, and being an amateur
astronomer I can tell you the high I got as a kid looking through a telescope
for the first time at age 13, coincidentally when RMH first came out, and
seeing the craters on the moon AND the awesome sight of the rings of
Saturn...now THAT was a high!
Peace,
John
MBlimes
>Too many times, the word "high" is solely used to describe the use of drugs
>to
>induce euphoria. I haven't heard his autobiography yet to validate what
>you've
>stated about his being high on weed when he wrote it, but whether or not he
>was, the high that he's talking about is natural, and being an amateur
>astronomer I can tell you the high I got as a kid looking through a telescope
>for the first time at age 13, coincidentally when RMH first came out, and
>seeing the craters on the moon AND the awesome sight of the rings of
>Saturn...now THAT was a high!
>
>Peace,
>
>John
>
>
Hi all, I was going to stay out of this one. (Imagine that!!) But John spoke so
eloquently that I just had to add my amen to it! I did my share of drugs in my
younger days and I have to tell you that I have gotten much higher standing and
looking out over the Grand Canyon, and looking from a mountaintop down into the
valley below. What does it matter? Tell your kids that what he meant when he
wrote that song, was whatever it means to you. And I don't think that JD ever
changed the lyrics permanently. Whenever I saw him in concert the first verse
was always Pass the pipe around. and the second verse was always Watch tot sun
go down. He changed it originally because when he was on the Muppets and sang
that song, they wouldn't let him say Pass the pipe.
Marilyn
Hoolie001
This has been a nice interesting exchange about all aspects of John's use of
the term "high" (RMH, Sunshine, Poems Prayers Promises). It does seem that at
least for some people who posted it became a bit of an argument, though. I
hate to see JD fans attack each other in the exchange of ideas. Peace.
cbergen
EdOlczyk wrote:
> >>Carolyn, yes the pipe John refers to in PP&P is a hash pipe, it was
> mentioned
> in vaguery by (forgot who) at the Aspen Memorial. I think it was
> unfortunate
> that he used that in the original song, and thank God he changed it in
>
> subsequent recordings and when he did it in concert. To me, it taints
> the
> beauty and meanings of the song.<<
But to me, it doesn't matter in the least. Maybe that's part of the
point I am trying to get across.
> >>I don't think he'd be apalled at being put on a pedestal, but rather
> he might
> have been somewhat embarrassed because he wasn't about being
> "kudized". <<
Sounds right.
> >>After having watched Portrait", it was more than apparent in his on
> camera delivery that that was so...just simple and honest. The fact
> that he did so many things on a charitable basis in Aspen that no one
> knew about until they were published in the Aspen Times recently,
> indicates to me that he talked the talk and walked the walk...and
> thensome.<<
I agree.
> >>Sanctification is the farthest thing that John Denver fans bestow
> onto him.<<
Here's where we disagree. I think a lot of JD fans would love to make
him St. John.
> >>Simply put, we loved the man. Being drunk while driving, or doing a
> little mary jane is not what we remember him by.<<
Which, IMO, should not be the way to remember anybody.
> >>Obviously you never met him in person.<<
No, I was never that lucky.
> >>He was not a saint, but then neither are you and me, and assuredly
> he was a
> heck of a lot closer than either one of us are or will ever be.<<
Well I know I'm not up for sainthood, but since I don't know you, maybe
you're in the running. :)We can't nor should not judge anyone or compare
anyone's good deeds.
> >>I've never had the chance to be with a less fortunate kid, nor go to
> the poorest of countries in Africa to spread cheer with my music.<<
Maybe because you aren't a millionaire with talent? What I am saying
here is that with the means, you have the way. I'm sure many more people
would be going to third world countries to help the poorest of poor, if
they had the means.
> >>Back in 1977, he gave a concert in Los Angeles, and as told by a
> letter to the
> editor shortly after his death, a lady describes how she and her
> teenage
> daughter had tickets to this much anticipated show, but her daughter
> was
> stricken very ill, hospitalized, and couldn't make it...<<
> The story is a beautiful one and shows the man was a good man.
>
> >>His song Rocky Mountain High IS NOT, I REPEAT, IS NOT about smoking
> marijuana,<<
bulldinky.
> >>dropping acid, shooting heroine, snorting coke, bongs,<<
no, he didn't mention heroine, coke, or bongs in his autobiography.
> >>he climbed cathedral mountains...he walks in quiet solitude...the
> serenity of a
> clear blue mountain lake).<<
Yeah, I did my fair share of pot way back when too. I could still get
"naturally high" when hiking in the forest. I also got an un-natural
high at times in the same forest.
> >>He did experiment with marijuana in the 60s as did
> everyone else. He did a lot less than most others. He wrote RMH during
> the
> annual Perseid meteor showers as he describes in his video "A
> Portrait" and the high he's talking about are the naturally occuring
> endorphines that are
> produced in the brain and which are responsible for the feelings of
> euphoria
> that we experience.<<
Have you read his autobiography?
> >>Too many times, the word "high" is solely used to describe the use
> of drugs to induce euphoria. I haven't heard his autobiography yet to
> validate what you've stated about his being high on weed when he wrote
> it, but whether or not he was, the high that he's talking about is
> natural, and being an amateur
> astronomer I can tell you the high I got as a kid looking through a
> telescope
> for the first time at age 13, coincidentally when RMH first came out,
> and
> seeing the craters on the moon AND the awesome sight of the rings of
> Saturn...now THAT was a high!<<
Well, I wouldn't go into work today and tell your boss that you're
"high" today. :)I agree with you on the rings of Saturn. It is awesome
to look into a telescope and see those magnificent rings.
Let me close by reiterating that I am a JD fan. I used to smoke pot. I
still feel that JD was referring to pot smoking in RMH, as it is obvious
he was speaking of a hash pipe in PP&P. It doesn't bother me in the
least. He was a talented musician and a wonderful person. (Not a Mother
Theresa, but a good man.)
Carolyn
cbergen
Bill Planer wrote:
> Carolyn>Maybe because you aren't a millionaire with talent? What I am
> saying
> >here is that with the means, you have the way. I'm sure many more
> people
> >would be going to third world countries to help the poorest of poor,
> if
> >they had the means.
>
> Bill>>No, I don't think so. Most people have their hands full with
> their family.
> I think a Bible quote is appropriate here: Luke 12:48 - Every one to
> whom
> much is given, of him will much be required.<<
Am I speaking in a foreign tongue? Isn't that what I said? :)
>
>
> >>I think John understood and responded to this.<<
As do I. And if John was a vacuum cleaner salesman I doubt he would have
the opportunity to visit third world countries and help other people as
he did.
Carolyn
Maria J Casolaro
Thank you John, for your eloquence and your truth...Peace..Maria
Pamela Beasley
Carolyn,
The passage you quote "......BUT the was how exhilarating it was to be
there....." just proves what I have been saying. John's exhilaration
with being in the mountains was the over-riding thought on John's mind
when writing the song---NOT BEING HIGH ON DRUG!
Pamela Beasley
Carolyn Bergen wrote:
>
> Pamela Beasley wrote:
>
> >
> >
I don't have a problem about accepting that he did experiment with
drugs. I have a problem with you not being able to see beyond his use
of drugs. You seem to be the one who needs to "get over" John's use of
drugs.
" ....but the song was about how exhilaraing it was to be there, to feel
free, to have come to such a place, both personally and
geographically."--John Denver, in his own words.
Pamela Beasley
cbergen wrote:
>
> Patty wrote:
>
> > >>This discussion has been very interesting to me, and I just wanted
> > to
> > quote something written by John himself, in the back of the Legacy
> > little
> > bit about where these songs have come from or, in some instances, what
> > I
> > was thinking about when I wrote them. I realized that these songs not
> >
> > only speak FOR me, in many cases, they still speak TO me, sometimes
> > with
> > new and different messages. The point is, I don't want you to think
> > that what the song is about for me is what the song is about. That's
> > only what the song is for me, and it could mean something completely
> > different for you. A good song is a window into the soul of the
> > listener.<<
>
> MIND when he wrote the song, not what it means to Patty, Linda, or
> anyone else in this ng or in the world at this point in time.
When did John tell you about what was on his mind? Were you a person
confident?
nyteowl
Listen to John's comments on the feeling called "Rocky Mountain High"
on the Wildlife Concert Video. I tried to write it all down but couldn't
do it fast enough. If you have the video, go back to that part and watch
him and listen to it again.
He seems to be talking about a feeling that everyone can search for
and find in their own way. My personal Rocky Mountain High has always
been connected to the Ocean and the changes found there that can also
relate to life.
nyteowl
Bill Planer
>> >>I've never had the chance to be with a less fortunate kid, nor go to
>> the poorest of countries in Africa to spread cheer with my music.<<
>Maybe because you aren't a millionaire with talent? What I am saying
>here is that with the means, you have the way. I'm sure many more people
>would be going to third world countries to help the poorest of poor, if
>they had the means.
No, I don't think so. Most people have their hands full with their family.
I think a Bible quote is appropriate here: Luke 12:48 - Every one to whom
much is given, of him will much be required.
I think John understood and responded to this.
Peace,
Bill
George Schumer
Actually, you're thinking of Poems, Prayers and Promises, not Sunshine.
Clearly, the message to "pass the pipe around" was a reference to
marijuana smoking, and is not appropriate either in the conservative 80's
and 90's, or for children at any time.
Still, it was appropriate back in the 60's and 70's, when many of us
former (and present??) pot smokers wondered if what we were doing was
wrong. John's song helped us understand that it was a wonderful ritual.
Now we may wonder whether it was, but at the time it was helpful in
avoiding guilt.
George "St. George" Schumer
Carolyn Bergen
Pamela Beasley wrote:
> Carolyn Bergen wrote:
> >
> > Pamela Beasley wrote:
>
> Carolyn> "Some people had the idea that the song was about getting
> stoned in the
> > mountains. and IT'S TRUE THAT WAS GOING ON (emphasis mine), but the
> song
> > was how exhilarating it was to be there, to feel free, to have come
> to
> > such a place, both personally and geographically..."
> >
> > Carolyn
>
> Pamela>>Carolyn,
> The passage you quote "......BUT the was how exhilarating it
> was to be
> there....." just proves what I have been saying. John's exhilaration
>
> with being in the mountains was the over-riding thought on John's mind
>
> when writing the song---NOT BEING HIGH ON DRUG!<<
Pam, have you ever taken drugs? Certain types of drugs cause euphoria.
Drugs can also certainly enhance euphoria.
The man was experiencing both a natural and artificial high during this
experience. SO WHAT? It's not a big deal. He wasn't harming anyone.
GBruck
Agreed, it's not a big deal. Could we please drop it? It's sure getting
boring (just my humble opinion, of course).
Linda B
Carolyn Bergen wrote:
--
When you get into a tight place and it seems you can't go on,
hold on,
for that's just the place and the time that the tide will turn.
--- Harriet Beecher Stowe
Sami421
Okay, enough of the "Sunshine song question"!! We all know that John used
drugs on occassion. What difference does it make NOW? All you have to do is
experience what is the Rocky Mountains to know what kind of high he meant. To
make it even better have some of John's music playing.
Kathy
Bill Planer
I guess what I was disagreeing with was the statement
> I'm sure many more people would be going to third world countries to help
the poorest of poor, if they had the means.
You have to have the means, but you also have to have the desire and the
ability to relate to people. I don't think that very many celebrities have
either. I know that I could not do that.
Peace,
Bill
sli...@airmail.net
In article <6c4mlu$f...@bgtnsc02.worldnet.att.net>, Carolyn Bergen
<car...@onawhim.com> wrote:
>
>And there will always be people who find drug use so hard to accept that
>they wish it to didn't exist. I for one, could give a rat's patoot about
>John experimenting with drugs. It is those who find it hard to accept
>that have a cow about it.
>
>Carolyn
For someone who "could give a rat's patoot", you seem to be unable to let
this one go. Who cares WHAT kind of high it was 26 years ago? It's a
great song. Enough said.
Carolyn Bergen
sli...@airmail.net wrote:
> >>For someone who "could give a rat's patoot", you seem to be unable
> to let
> this one go. Who cares WHAT kind of high it was 26 years ago? It's a
> great song. Enough said.<<
It's called DISCUSSION. Does that bother you? If it does, too bad.
If you actually READ my messages you will find that I am a JD fan, I
love the song RMH, among others.
Hint: Signing your messages also makes them more credible.
Carolyn Bergen
Ludo van Rongen
Sami421 wrote:
Hi ,
Rocky Mountain High was a favorite song of mine in the seventies, when I was a
member
of the mormon church / latter days saints. Members from that church are not
allowed to use drugs, alcohol, tea and coffee. I loved to sing the song and it
never bothered me what he could have meant with being high. To me it was the
spiritual meaning of how the beauty of nature can make you feel high. I'm not a
member of that church anymore, and I don't
mind if John ever experienced drugs to make him feel this way, I can immagine the
very
soul of John would be able to feel high just because of nature alone. You can see
on John's
face he was not a regular user from druggs, you can see the difference with
members from
the Rolling Stones. And if John happened to be a bit curious in the past to find
out about
drugs , well , he's been wise enough not to constantly go on using it.I never had
the urge
to find out what drugs is, but I had no trouble singing this song ever, the song
expresses my feelings I have when I walk along the seashore and watch the clouds
in the sky,... we don't have mountains in Holland, unfortunaty !!! Bye, I love
this ng and all of your remarks,
Adriana de Jong.
sli...@airmail.net
In article <6chh05$q...@bgtnsc02.worldnet.att.net>, Carolyn Bergen
<car...@onawhim.com> wrote:
I'm not bothered at all by MEANINGFUL discussion.
I didn't say you weren't a fan.
Hint: Look at the top of your newsreader under "from" if you need a
name. I "could give a rat's patoot" whether you think I'm credible or
not.
sli...@airmail.net
>sli...@airmail.net wrote:
>
>> >>For someone who "could give a rat's patoot", you seem to be unable
>> to let
>> this one go. Who cares WHAT kind of high it was 26 years ago? It's a
>> great song. Enough said.<<
>
>It's called DISCUSSION. Does that bother you? If it does, too bad.
>If you actually READ my messages you will find that I am a JD fan, I
>love the song RMH, among others.
>
>Hint: Signing your messages also makes them more credible.
>
>Carolyn Bergen
I'm not bothered at all by MEANINGFUL discussion.
I didn't say you weren't a fan.
Hint: Look at the top of your newsreader under "from" if you want a
name. But just for you......
Sandy Linder
wind.song
My, my!
What kind of nonsense is this about RMH? Its about watching the meteor
shower that occurs every August on one of the highest mountains in the
state of CO!!
NUFF SAID!!
MJ
Carolyn Bergen
Carolyn Bergen
sli...@airmail.net wrote:
> >>But just for you......
>
> Sandy Linder<<
What a guy/gal!
Have a nice life.
EdOlczyk
Thanks for your kind comment Maria, I appreciate it.
Peace,
John