Why Timothy Dalton left James Bond - THE TRUTH!!!
Jenny
series, I shall repeat again how it all happened - the
thruth! and not the fictionalized bashing that has become
so pre-dominant on this newsgroup.
Dalton was first approached to play Bond in 1971, but since
he was only 25 at the time (born in 1946, despite the Bond
web page's claim that he was born in 1944), he turned downt
he part feeling that he was too young to step into Sean
Connery's shoes.
Wehn Roger Moore threatened to quit the series in the early
1980's, Timothy was again approached, but he was committed
with other projects and had to turn it down.
As a side note, in the 1979 episode "Fallen Angel" from
Charlie's Angels, in which Tim guest-starred, there are at
least two reference to him being like James Bond.
In 1986, the popular choice to replace Roger Moore was
Pierce Brosnan. Pierce had gained popularity through the
Bond-grooming role of Remington Steele by the series of the
same name. Unfortunately, high ratings and viewer protests
at the end of the 4th season prompted NBC to tack on a
mini-fifth year season to "wrap up the series," thus
forcing Pierce to stay locked into his 7-year contract with
NBC. Dalton was approached again, and this time he said
YES.
Tim Dalton shot BRENDA STARR and THE LIVING DAYLIGHTS
literally back to back in 1986/87. After those films he
went on to make the lovely film, HAWKS, and then it was
back to his second outing as Bond in LICENCE TO KILL
(originally titled LICENCE REVOKED).
Lititagation over the rights to the series entangled MGM
and EON productions into a legal battle for several years
while the huge studio also battled bankruptcy. While some
reports state that MGM wanted to replace Dalton due to low
box-office receipts for LICENCE TO KILL, EON was determined
to keep him for the 17th Bond film. Dalton's actual
contract to contune the series had expired in 1990, but he
continued discussions, development, and negotiations with
EON, taking serious interest in the developments of the
scripts. But the litigationw ar raged on. As the dust
settled, it had been several years since LICENCE TO KILL,
and Dalton had allready carried the Bond mantle for 8
years.
During the time of litigation, however, Dalton went on to
make THE KING'S WHORE, THE ROCKETEER, LIE DOWN WITH LIONS,
NAKED IN NEW YORK, FRAMED, IN THE COMPANY OF WOLVES
(Documentary), and was in the middle of shooting SCARLETT
down in Charleston S.C. when he decided it was time to move
on.
In a press release from Variety on 4/11/94:
By Dan Cox
"Hollywood (Variety) - Timothy Dalton brandished his own
license to kill Monday, severing his eight-year connection
with the James Bond action movie series.
"The British actor, who starred in 'The Living Daylights"
and License to Kill' said in a statement that he's ready
for new challenges and no longer wants to play the secret
agent known for high-tech gadgets, fast cars and faster
women.
"In separate releases, UA president John Calley and
Danjaq Inc. producers Albert R. (Cubby) Broccoli and
stepson Michael G. Wilson repleid that they regret the
decision but will respect it.
"The 17th Bond film, scripted by Michael france, is
slated for a summer 1995 release and has an initial $40
million budget. Dalton's statement said, 'Even though the
(producers) have always made it clear to me that they want
me to resume my role in their next James Bond feature, I
have now made this difficult decision.' Dalton also added,
'The Broccolis have been very goot to me as producers.
They have been more special as friends,' he said.
"The Danjaq release said, 'We have never thought of
anyone but Timothy Dalton as the star of the 17th James
Bond film. We understand his reasons and will honor his
decision.'"
Dalton has since gone on toother projects. Whether you
like the direction his Bond took or not, you should be
aware that the direction was agreed upon not only by
Dalton--to bring a grittier, more realistic edge to
Bond--by EON and all of those involved.
It is interesting and says a lot of Dalton's character and
person that he has never slammed or bashed any of his Bond
predessessors. It's just not his style. Timothy Dalton is
a true gentleman actor, trained on the stage. He is highly
underrated and undeserving of the lies told about him and
his time as Bond. He was NEVER kicked out of the part.
I hope all of you take a second look not only at his Bond
films but at his entire career.
For a complete list of his films, please feel free to email
me.
Sincerely,
JGA
DOUGDWISE
Bond, Timothy Dalton. If you read the posts in this newsgroup you can see
that there are a lot of Dalton fans out there and that we get very
defensive when we think that someone doesn't "get" the role as Timothy
Dalton portrayed it. I wrote several letters to Mr. Broccoli (and got a
nice autographed photo) letting him know that I supported the direction
they were taking with Mr. Dalton's Bond, away from the silliness of the
Moore series. I hope that Mr. Dalton is proud of his work in the Bond
films and that he knows that he has a lot of fans out here who are
thankful that he got the role when he did and brought the series back to
where it belonged.
Vtorch
>wow! i thought that there wasn't a single soul out there who
>actually appreciated Dalton's contribution to the Bond thang. it
>just seems that he was caught with the role at a difficult time as
>it was making the transition from the 70's Moore Bond which,
>ludicrous as it may be, made and makes sense even as it has dated
>badly, into a more realistic Bond, which may or may have not been
>done with Brosnan. to me, L.D. and L.t.K. though both quite good
>films, are still better films on paper. both are stronger on plot
>than nearly all the Moore films (possible exception F.Y.E.O.), but
>the case is Dalton is still open to criticism of playing the
>character a little to seriously. even i, an admirer of Dalton's
>work, feel he was just too sensitive or caring. i suspect much of
>the displeasure with his Bond was equal parts frustrated
>testosterone and cognitive dissonance of the highest order that such
>a male fantasy role model as 007 took the time to listen to a female
>let alone compliment her on something other than her (usually,
>patently) obvious physical attributes. i suspect that part of this
>Dalton characterisation has rubbed off on Brosnan's Bond, though if
>you blink you very well may miss this. critically, while Bond is
>quite comfortable with women, he is nevertheless not a man to share
>much of himself beyond his obvious interest horizontal rhumba. this
>is where Dalton strayed. his Bond spent far too much time on being
>monogamous or complenting and lending emotional support to the
>women. like, get real!! i keep thinking, if only he had dropped the
>sensitive new age guy shit and hadn't been so embarrassed about
>dropping the obvious bon(d) mot, then his films would definitelt be
>uo there in the top 10 bondies
Yes, but 1 out of 2 ARE in the top "10 bondies."
-Vtorch
Vtorch
>That's what it said on TV and in the papers but why are you so positive that is the truth? You can't believe everything you read.
> Not even a month before Dalton "resigned" there was a statement from him in the TV Guide. It was to combat the rumors that he was being replaced. He said something like "Of course I'm still James Bond and will be in the next movie". Why would he say this and then quit shortly after?
> Perhaps they just let him leave with some dignity.
>Brian
First of all he had NO contract. And second, why if he had no contract
did he stay that long? He can't quit if he was under contract. He
can't be replaced if he was NOT under contract.
Where's your logic?
student.anu.edu.au
Julianne Weaver
If someone could provide some unimpeachable sources, not "hearsay"
to show that Tim Dalton was pushed out by MGM/UA, I would be willing to
listen. Until that time, I will go with what is in the printed public
record.
And yes, the unimpeachable sources will have to be named. Prove yourself.
J.May, with her nose in a Fleming novel
Jim Paul
> To the newsgroup--
>
> Gee, there's a lot of bad-mouthing going on in this newsgroup.
> Bad-mouthing of the new movie, bad-mouthing of Timothy Dalton,
> bad-mouthing of Brosnan, bad-mouthing of Connery... It makes me ashamed to
> keep checking into this newsgroup.
I feel the same way. Last year when I discovered this n.g. I used to look
forward to reading about the upcoming film (GoldenEye). But most of the
people who used to contribute intelligent, thoughtful posts to this
newsgroup have long since dropped out because of the immature threads here
("rate your favorite Bond films;" "Dalton Sucks;" etc. don't leave a lot
of room for meaningful discussion of the 007 character).
I suspect that, like myself, these folks log on from time to time or are
lurking in the background, hoping for interesting posts from the few
people that contribute to an intelligent discussion (like Mr. Benson).
RAYMBEN
Gee, there's a lot of bad-mouthing going on in this newsgroup.
Bad-mouthing of the new movie, bad-mouthing of Timothy Dalton,
bad-mouthing of Brosnan, bad-mouthing of Connery... It makes me ashamed to
keep checking into this newsgroup.
Timothy Dalton was NOT pushed out the series... it was a mutually
agreed-upon decision. He didn't want to do it after the long delay since
"LtoK"... and MGM/UA preferred a new actor. Danjaq, in the middle, was
very happy with Dalton as Bond. His two films did VERY WELL in the
worldwide market. Danjaq just went with the flow.
IMHO, Dalton made the most believable, most human, and most accurate
portrayal of Fleming's Bond. For the record, I think Pierce Brosnan makes
a damn good Bond, too. So enough already!! Stop the bickering!! If
you're a Bond fan, then be a Bond fan. "GoldenEye" has topped all Bond
box office records, so they must be doing something right. I keep seeing
debates on this newsgroup on the merits of Dalton vs. Brosnan--- hey,
these guys were/are two of the best Bonds. Frankly, I think the
embarrassing period for Bond was the Roger Moore era. But that's me, who
grew up with Connery. I'm sure there are just as many Roger fans out
there as there are Connery fans. More power to 'em. Those were a
different style of Bond film. The series has changed, evolved, devolved,
and moved with the times. We're talking nearly 35 years here.
All this comparing of who's a better Bond is ridiculous. I even think
Lazenby did a swell job, all things considered, and his film is still one
of the best.
Get on the "Bond wagon" folks. "GoldenEye" has proven to the world that
Bond is still viable and still a box office hit. It has insured that Bond
will endure into the 21st century--- AND THAT'S WHAT WE ALL WANT, RIGHT??
So stop with the bickering, stop with the blasting of the new movie, stop
with the blasting of the Dalton films-- if you want to blast something,
blast the movie version of "Casino Royale"-- that deserves it!!
--Raymond Benson
JEFF HAUSE
>
>So stop with the bickering, stop with the blasting of the new movie,
stop
>with the blasting of the Dalton films-- if you want to blast
something,
>blast the movie version of "Casino Royale"-- that deserves it!!
>
Actually, I kind of like it for the camp quality.
WILSUNC
Excellent book, by the way.
wilsunc
WILSUNC
Julianne Weaver
<I enjoy it for its camp quality>
Raymond and Jeff are both correct. Bickering is no fun, but as long as
there is a newsgroup here, I fear bickering will be a part of it.
Newsgroups are formed to voice opinions, and provide fun for all. True,
the bickering does make
for tiresome reading. But, to paraphrase, there is a camp quality to it!
(yes, I know the poster was referring to Casino Royale). My suggestion,
skip over the "bickering" posts and surf on to the more intelligent
postings.
Julianne Weaver
<Brosnan was shafted by MTM productions>
If this is so, then how was it Tim Dalton's fault that Brosnan did not
get the Bond role in 1986? Brosnan was unavailable, so Dalton was signed.
<Dalton walked on his own...(snip)......says a major industry source>
This is precisely what I mean by proving via unimpeachable sources.
Hearsay is not public record. Who IS this "source"?
I am now quoting from the public record, courtesy of one Jenny Arata who
was kind enough to send me a reprint of this article and I want to thank
her.
Variety April 11, 1994 By Dan Cox, byline Hollywood, CA
Timothy Dalton brandished his own license to kill Monday, severing his 8
year connection with the James Bond action movie series. The British
actor, who starred in TLD and LTK said in a statement that he is ready
for new challenges.......
In separate releases, UA president John Calley and Danjaq Inc. producers
Albert R. (Cubby) Broccoli, his daughter Barbara Broccoli and stepson
Michael G. Wilson replied that they regret the decision but will respect
it.
Dalton's statement said: "Even though the (producers) have always made
it clear to me that they want me to resume my role in their next Bond
feature, I have made this difficult decision. "
The Danjaq release said, "We have never thought of anyone but Timothy as
the star of the 17th James Bond film. We understand his reasons and will
honor his decision."
Also, I would like to mention that Dalton's actual contract to continue
the series expired in 1990, but he continued discussions and negotiations
with Eon taking serious interest in the development of scripts.
Remarkable loyalty in this day and age when a signed contract is your
only assurance of employment.
Amvee
>Gee, there's a lot of bad-mouthing going on in this newsgroup.
>Bad-mouthing of the new movie, bad-mouthing of Timothy Dalton,
>bad-mouthing of Brosnan, bad-mouthing of Connery... It makes me ashamed
to
>keep checking into this newsgroup.
<a lot of good stuff snipped>
>So stop with the bickering, stop with the blasting of the new movie, stop
>with the blasting of the Dalton films-- if you want to blast something,
>blast the movie version of "Casino Royale"-- that deserves it!!
>
>--Raymond Benson
Wonderfully written, Raymond.
My tuppence worth-
I say, if we want to debate, let's debate-intelligently. Debating the
merits of each actor or film is a matter of taste, and a lot of fun. But
please, let's get off the "this one sucks, this one rules" mentality. Each
actor brought something else to the table.
Sean's first four films were classics, and set the standard. Enough said!
Fleming himself was evidently impressed by Connery, since his last couple
of books saw Bond develop a sense of humor similar to the cinema
character.
OHMSS is one of the two or three best in the series. I think Lazenby's
lack of a dominant screen presence is actually a plus for the film. Bond
is, after all, a spy, and not *supposed* to attract attention.
Like him or not, he was terrific in action scenes, and would have grown
into the role.
In the decade after Watergate, nobody trusted government, and we all
desperately needed some light relief. Moore's Bond basically winked at the
camera as if to say "Isn't this all preposterous fun?", and you must admit
for the most part it was. There were low points, such as Moonraker, AVTAK
and most of TMWTGG, but there were also golden moments in TSWLM, FYEO and
Octopussy that showed us hardcore Fleming fans there was still hope, and
Moore demonstrated that he could handle the serious side of Bond when it
was written for him. It seldom was.
Then-the all-too-brief Dalton era. Flame me if you want, but TLD was a
masterpiece, from the precredits to the brilliant reworking of the Fleming
short story, to the beautiful "If There Was A Man" end title song. LTK
wasn't far behind. Some said it was too dark & violent but I *enjoyed*
seeing 007 kicking butt and taking names again. He wasn't this
cold-blooded since Dr. No! Again, good use was made of embellishing a
great Fleming setpiece, this time from LALD. Although I was sorry to see
him go, let's face it-Tim's 50 now, and despite looking great for his age
(see "Lie Down With Lions" and "Scarlett") his time would have been
limited in the role. Perhaps he felt it was better to go to soon than too
late, but I will always be happy for his two films and his terrific
performances that grabbed us by the lapels and pulled us back to the
essence of Fleming's tough, resourceful cold warrior-a man we
progressively lost sight of more and more after OHMSS.
GoldenEye gave the Brosnan era a good start, but wasn't quite the
knock-my-socks-off blockbuster I was expecting. Pierce himself was fine.
He delivers the throwaway wisecrack better than Dalton, and IS a good
actor. He could easily have been credible in LTK or TLD. There were some
great moments in GE. I loved the beach scene, the scenes with M, and the
interplay with Trevelyan. I did not like most of the tank chase; it was
played *too* much for comedy. In fact my wife turned to me when the statue
was on the tank and said, "My God, I think we're in a Moore film." On the
whole, though it was good except for Serra's brutal score. The only cues I
liked were the first part of the precredits, and the eerie scene among the
statues in St. Petersburg. The gunbarrel opening music was a travesty, and
Serra demonstrates conclusively that even if Eon has to pay John Barry
more than they pay Brosnan himself, they should do it and get him back.
One thing we should realize is that if fault is to be found in a par
Mike V.
"worry is a dividend paid to disaster before it is due"
am...@aol.com
Robert T. Zielinski
(Jim Paul) writes:
<<"I feel the same way. Last year when I discovered this n.g. I used to
look forward to reading about the upcoming film (GoldenEye). But most
of the people who used to contribute intelligent, thoughtful posts to
this newsgroup have long since dropped out because of the immature
threads here ("rate your favorite Bond films;" "Dalton Sucks;" etc.
don't leave a lot of room for meaningful discussion of the 007
character). I suspect that, like myself, these folks log on from time
to time or are lurking in the background, hoping for interesting posts
from the few people that contribute to an intelligent discussion (like
Mr. Benson).">>
Spot on, Jim.
Hear Hear!
Tom Zielinski
Lake in the Hills, Il USA
("Life is Funny, But I'm Not Laughing".)
The Rink
>>to show that Tim Dalton was pushed out by MGM/UA, I would be willing to
>>listen. Until that time, I will go with what is in the printed public
>>record.
>>And yes, the unimpeachable sources will have to be named. Prove yourself.
>
>http://www.bizmag.com/ts11d.htm
Uh, I hate to tell you this, but it's an utter lie. Next time, pick a source
that isn't so blatantly trying to hype GE in the typical EON fashion of
bashing the previous Bond. LTK was a financial disappointment, yes, but it's
not universally acclaimed by Bond fans as a disappointment -- but while that
point might be argued, the fact that TLD was NOT a disappointment is
essentially irrefutable. While it made as much money as AVTAK, it is
universally acclaimed as FAR superior to it, and many rank it at the top of
the series. Besides, if Dalton was going to be shown the door, it would have
been closer to 1990 than 1994.
--
_ _ _ _
(_) | | ____ | | | |
_ __ _ _ __ | | __/ __ \ _ _ _ __ | |__ ___ __| |_ _ Sam Stoddard
| '__| | '_ \| |/ / / _` | | | | '_ \| '_ \ / _ \/ _` | | | | Univ. of NH
| | | | | | | < | (_| | |_| | | | | | | || __/ (_| | |_| |
|_| |_|_| |_|_|\_\ \__,_|\__,_|_| |_|_| |_(_)___|\__,_|\__,_| -John 3:16-
\____/
Julianne Weaver
Hello! How was your Super Sunday? I want to thank you for sending me
your article. I saved it and as your can tell quoted from it extensively
in my reply
to the WWWgal in afjb. I gave you your writing credit as promised!
Do you know this Jeffery Wells from the article that she posted? I was
so incensed by the fact that she posted "unnamed sources" after being
challenged to prove with unimpeachable sources. I do realize that there
is a grand tradition in this country of 1st amendment rights. But we are
debating
an employment change NOT Watergate! <VVVBG> Besides, I think Dalton, Eon,
Danjaq are telling the truth, and the PPPP press person just fed the
rumour mill. Now, that is MY humble opinion.
Thanks again for sending me that article! It was quite timely! One
day I'll post ALL of Tim's credits. And fantastic how you burrowed out
the last two. I doubt even Dalton remembers making them. You suppose?
Take good care, Julianne
Z. A. Surve'
>From: kl...@mcs.com (Kimberly Last)
>Subject: Re: Why Timothy Dalton left James Bond - THE TRUTH!!!
>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 1996 21:07:29 CDT
>In article <4e8aft$2r...@useneta1.news.prodigy.com> JJL...@prodigy.com
>(Julianne Weaver) writes:
>> If someone could provide some unimpeachable sources, not "hearsay"
>>to show that Tim Dalton was pushed out by MGM/UA, I would be willing to
>>listen. Until that time, I will go with what is in the printed public
>>record.
>>And yes, the unimpeachable sources will have to be named. Prove yourself.
>From "That's Showbiz", by Jeffrey Wells
>http://www.bizmag.com/ts11d.htm
> And then Dalton -- whom die-hard
> Bond fans had griped about for
> years -- was shown the door.
> (``Dalton walked on his own
> accord ... (but) only so he could
> say it was his idea,'' says a major
> agency source.) ^^^^^^^^^^^^
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Pardon my nitpicking, but is this this also not 'hearsay', this 'major
agency source'?
" The bitch is now dead."
Panos Sambrakos
T. Zielinski says...
>> I suspect that, like myself, these folks log on from time
>to time or are lurking in the background, hoping for interesting posts
>from the few people that contribute to an intelligent discussion (like
>Mr. Benson).">>
>
>
>Spot on, Jim.
>Hear Hear!
I'm just waiting for the dust to settle...
--
........................................................................
: Panos Sambrakos :: :
: bol...@prometheus.hol.gr :: 'The Internet is not enough' :
: IFF Athens Bureau :: :
:................................::....................................:
Paul Baack
Jenny
Perfectly said! Touche!
R. C. Mac McGrath
>To the newsgroup--
>Gee, there's a lot of bad-mouthing going on in this newsgroup.
>Bad-mouthing of the new movie, bad-mouthing of Timothy Dalton,
>bad-mouthing of Brosnan, bad-mouthing of Connery... It makes me ashamed to
>keep checking into this newsgroup.
...[LOT SNIPPED]...
>Get on the "Bond wagon" folks. "GoldenEye" has proven to the world that
>Bond is still viable and still a box office hit. It has insured that Bond
>will endure into the 21st century--- AND THAT'S WHAT WE ALL WANT, RIGHT??
Amen!
I had become so disgusted with all the bashing in this NG that I
didn't bother checking in for weeks after the GE premiere. Recently, I
drop by again and same story... the bashing goes on.
Too many people just don't seem to pay attention to the name of this
NG: alt.FAN.james-bond (emphasis added); they should. Better yet -
they should form NG's that address their *specific* interests (eg -
alt.fan.timothy-dalton).
That would leave more bandwidth for the *fans* who want to discuss the
James Bond character of the books, films, and genre.
Or maybe we (myself certainly included) should just get better at
ignoring the whiners.
--Mac
Julianne Weaver
Welcome home!
Julianne Weaver
private posting ment only for one persons eyes, that I mistakenly posted
in the group. I made a huge error and jhumbly ask for your forgiveness.
Mz. Last included.
J.May, with her nose in a bible doing pennance ;-)
Julianne Weaver
While I do differ with her opinions on certain things, the previous
letter was written as private email and by a most grevious error, printed
in this newsgroup. I will take 1,000 lashes with a wet noodle for my
error.
J.May, with her nose in a Fleming novel
Ray Dempsey
Sambrakos) writes:
|> In article <4edk16$j...@reader2.ix.netcom.com>, rt...@ix.netcom.co, Robert
|> |> T. Zielinski says...
|> >> I suspect that, like myself, these folks log on from time
|> >to time or are lurking in the background, hoping for interesting posts
|> >from the few people that contribute to an intelligent discussion (like
|> >Mr. Benson).">>
|> >
|> >
|> >Spot on, Jim.
|> >Hear Hear!
|>
|> I'm just waiting for the dust to settle...
PANOS -- Back again! Armed and dangerous I trust. :-)
--
Ray Dempsey
"The proprieties will be observed at all times."
MizBliss
(top)
-Mizbliss
jno...@violet.ccit.arizona.edu
>Panos:
> Welcome home!
>
>
> J.May, with her nose in a Fleming novel
>
------- James M. Norman -------- E-mail: jno...@ccit.arizona.edu ----------
GRADUATED, EMPLOYED AND MOVING TO A REAL PROVIDER SOON!
For more information about THE ROCKY HORROR PICTURE SHOW check out my site at:
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----------------------------------------------------------------------------
kelly smith
now."
You're welcome.
Kelly
kelly smith
now."
Kelly
Jim T
Brian White
I had heard that Dalton's contract had been up after LTK, but that he had
left himself open so that if they wanted him for the next movie, he would
do it. He was just very dedicated to the series and didn't want it to
die off if they couldn't get someone to replace him, he would keep doing
the part.
--
Brian White
whit...@uidaho.edu