Daddy, what does 'yiff' mean?
G. Raymond Eddy
Scenario: Your innocent, impressionable little cubs are perusing your
furry literature and your newsgroup posts, then they come to you and ask
you "Daddy, what does 'yiff' mean"
Now, seeing that /yiff/ is very much a sexual kind of term, would you be
able to talk about it to your young? Would you be too embarrassed?
--
___________ G. Raymond Eddy gre...@bright.net
(_ _ _ 748 N. Lisbon St.
(__ __)__)(_/ Carrollton, OH 44615-1126
___________/ http://www.bright.net/~greddy/index.htm
Captain Packrat
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
On 31 Jul 1997 18:35:33 GMT, "G. Raymond Eddy" <gre...@bright.net>
wrote:
> Scenario: Your innocent, impressionable little cubs
>are perusing your furry literature and your newsgroup posts,
>then they come to you and ask you "Daddy, what does 'yiff' mean"
The word yiff originally meant the sound made by an excited fox.
There's your answer.
(What are they doing going through your literature and newsgroup
posts in the first place?)
> Now, seeing that /yiff/ is very much a sexual kind of
>term, would you be able to talk about it to your young?
>Would you be too embarrassed?
Depends on how old they are. They've got to learn about sex
someday. Best to explain it to them yourself, rather than
for them to pick it up from the schoolyard.
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Captain Packrat (Captain on FurryMUCK and FurToonia)
Fur Central ---> http://www.sandiego.sisna.com/captpakrat/
Plush Central ---> http://www.sandiego.sisna.com/captpakrat/plush/
Furry Code 1.2 (available from Fur Central)
FRM4 A++>+++ C>+ D++ H+++ M+++ P++++ R+ T++++ W Z+>+++
Sm+ RLTI a cn++ d- e+ f++++ h+ iwf+++ sm#
If you're furry and you know it, Hug the Mouse!
O. .O
==V==
Mel. White
Captain Packrat (captp...@isat.com) wrote:
: -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
: On 31 Jul 1997 18:35:33 GMT, "G. Raymond Eddy" <gre...@bright.net>
: wrote:
: > Scenario: Your innocent, impressionable little cubs
: >are perusing your furry literature and your newsgroup posts,
: >then they come to you and ask you "Daddy, what does 'yiff' mean"
: (What are they doing going through your literature and newsgroup
: posts in the first place?)
--------(snip)--------------
(g) Right on!!!!
Speaking as a parent (of teenagers... ghods... one's voting age and the
other will be voting age next year), and a long time netizen, I really do
wonder about parents who let kids on the Nets unsupervised. Mine grew up
with the undestanding that they'd get net accounts (and modems) when they
turned 18, and not a minute before (I've held to that).
As for sexuality, as a feminist, I made books and literature available to
the kids and discussed it as openly as I could (okay... sometimes it's
REAL embarrassing, but I was honest and said it was fun, too-- but only
after talking about the ethics of the situation and the dangers (pregnancy)).
When they entered junior high, one of their friends found a sexuality test
(this was a 'how much do you really know about sex (designed to wake up kids
to some of the realities) test') and everyone had fun taking it. The whole
pack flunked -- except my kids, who answered every question correctly.
As to their futures as adult, sexual creatures, only the gods know. I've done
what I could to be (in my eyes) a responsible and reasonable parent, and at
this point, as legal adults, the rest of their experience is up to them.
--
m...@netcom.com
========================================================================
Fed up with Spammers? *** Here's some useful resources:
http://www.fraud.org/ http://www.abuse.net/ http://www.cauce.org
http://www.fmp.com/spam_patrol/ http://www.clark.net/pub/rolf/mmf/
Report Make Money Fast schemes to net-...@nocs.insp.irs.gov
Will Sanborn
m...@netcom.com (Mel. White) writes:
>Captain Packrat (captp...@isat.com) wrote:
>: -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
>: On 31 Jul 1997 18:35:33 GMT, "G. Raymond Eddy" <gre...@bright.net>
>: wrote:
>: > Scenario: Your innocent, impressionable little cubs
>: >are perusing your furry literature and your newsgroup posts,
>: >then they come to you and ask you "Daddy, what does 'yiff' mean"
>: (What are they doing going through your literature and newsgroup
>: posts in the first place?)
>--------(snip)--------------
>(g) Right on!!!!
>
>Speaking as a parent (of teenagers... ghods... one's voting age and the
>other will be voting age next year), and a long time netizen, I really do
>wonder about parents who let kids on the Nets unsupervised. Mine grew up
>with the undestanding that they'd get net accounts (and modems) when they
>turned 18, and not a minute before (I've held to that).
Way to go Mel, this country needs more parents like you, people who take
an active interest in their kid's safety and don't leave that task up to
society in general. It sounds as if you've done a great job as a parent,
and the way you handled your kids' education about sex was right on the
money.
--
Will A. Sanborn, wa...@shore.net
http://www.shore.net/~was1
(my creative writing: sci-fi, fantasy, furry, romance, speculative fiction)
Betty R.
> : @On 31 Jul 1997 18:35:33 GMT, "G. Raymond Eddy" <gre...@bright.net>
> : @wrote:
> : @Scenario: Your innocent, impressionable little cubs
> : @are perusing your furry literature and your newsgroup posts,
> : @then they come to you and ask you "Daddy, what does 'yiff' mean"
> : Then, Captain Packrat (captp...@isat.com) wrote:
> :
> : (What are they doing going through your literature and newsgroup
> : posts in the first place?)
> And then, in article <melEE7...@netcom.com>, m...@netcom.com (Mel.
> White) wrote:
>
> Speaking as a parent (of teenagers... ghods... one's voting age and the
> other will be voting age next year), and a long time netizen, I really do
> wonder about parents who let kids on the Nets unsupervised. Mine grew up
> with the undestanding that they'd get net accounts (and modems) when
> they turned 18, and not a minute before (I've held to that).
I must agree with the prevailing sentiments here. Children have *no*
business going through the personal contents of your computer. And kids
got no business playing on the internet until they're 18 (and in college
where they can then get net access for free -- yet another incentive for a
higher education).
As for explaining what "yiff" means, just tell your kid that it's
something that little foxes bark when they're happy.
If your kids need something to keep them occupied, might I suggest regular
trips to the local library? And please get some sort of a password
protection program for your PC. Besides do you *really* want your kid
coming up to you and saying, "Daddy, what does 'Erase contents of hard
disk' mean?" ;-)
-- Betty R.
(Remove TOON to reply via email)
Elf Sternberg
In article <jabizriTOON-01...@wt-d4-212.wt.net>
jabiz...@wt.net (Betty R.) writes:
>I must agree with the prevailing sentiments here. Children have *no*
>business going through the personal contents of your computer. And kids
>got no business playing on the internet until they're 18 (and in college
>where they can then get net access for free -- yet another incentive for a
>higher education).
>If your kids need something to keep them occupied, might I suggest regular
>trips to the local library?
I recommend a copy of SurfWatch and a second computer.
Keeping kids away from the Internet until they're eighteen is like
denying them trips to the library, keeping them off the television,
and preventing them from looking at the newspaper. The Internet is
becoming (has become?) a major outlet for news, information, and
public discourse; it may become the backbone of our entire culture
in the next couple of decades.
The library is FULL of stuff I may not want my kids to read.
As an erstwhile librarian, I know that most librarians fight like
Hell to put controversial stuff on shelves, stuff like Mein Kampf,
Mao's Little Red Book, and The Joy of Sex. The idea that 18 is
some magical age where they're suddenly fully ready to emerge into
the world full of the wisdom it takes to survive is utterly stupid.
Start when they're six giving them the morality, the wisdom, and the
knowledge of what it means to be human. That way, when they're 13 and
the hormones hit, they'll have a better chance of surviving puberty.
I would probably explain to my six year old that yiff is what
foxes say when they're excited and happy. I would tell my fourteen
year old that yiff stands for young, intelligent, fuckable, fox, and
to not use those words around Mom.
Elf !!!
--
Elf Sternberg Balkanize Usenet!
e...@halcyon.com www.halcyon.com/elf
Public key available
Antonia T. Tiger
In article <33e223ae...@news.isat.com>
captp...@isat.com "Captain Packrat" writes:
> On 31 Jul 1997 18:35:33 GMT, "G. Raymond Eddy" <gre...@bright.net>
> wrote:
>
> > Now, seeing that /yiff/ is very much a sexual kind of
> >term, would you be able to talk about it to your young?
> >Would you be too embarrassed?
>
> Depends on how old they are. They've got to learn about sex
> someday. Best to explain it to them yourself, rather than
> for them to pick it up from the schoolyard.
This problem came up in a recent conversation with a friend on
FurryMUCK. She lives in Georgia and is rather nervous about what the
reaction of her neighbours might be if her kids seem to know too much
about sex...
(Here in the UK, there may be some lower age limits which affect
perceptions -- I'd say they were at the age where they needed to know)
A solution to one problem did emerge -- although personally I think that
a 30mm Inert Practice round from a GAU-8 might be a little bit too big
to be fun. But it seems that it might be OK to be a gun freak, rather
than have sex toys in the house.
And when I went past the place I'd seen some of that stuff on sale to
collectors and enthusiasts, it was closed. Maybe it isn't a good idea
to be a gun freak in the UK.
--
Antonia T. Tiger
Bluefists
> I recommend a copy of SurfWatch and a second computer.
> Keeping kids away from the Internet until they're eighteen is like
> denying them trips to the library, keeping them off the television,
> and preventing them from looking at the newspaper. The Internet is
> becoming (has become?) a major outlet for news, information, and
> public discourse; it may become the backbone of our entire culture
> in the next couple of decades.
That is a definte truism... I myself have a different view on the thing
than most of you me being the actual child... and without the internet I
would have keeled over or something... the Netwatch I personally am glad my
parents cant use a computer cause I myself have been learning a lot of
things parents dont want me too... but without it I woulda wandered
aimlessly cause certain things it just aint easy to tell your parents (like
that your gay and stuff.) I know Im a special case here... but the internet
is a good place to learn... heck Ive learned more biology (Im going to try
a major in Biological studies when I graduate H.S.) online than in all my
BIO classes!
So I wouldnt deny total privelige... try the programs.. I bet they do help,
but also... beleive me when I say if they want things bad enough they'll
get it I know first-hand
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
----------
/\___/\ Bluefists
/ 0 0 \ http://www.geocities.com/Paris/4308
\_\ /_/ "May the force be yer umbrella"
\ / cl...@eaglequest.com
O
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------
Indirian
e...@halcyon.com (Elf Sternberg) wrote:
>In article <jabizriTOON-01...@wt-d4-212.wt.net>
> jabiz...@wt.net (Betty R.) writes:
>
>>I must agree with the prevailing sentiments here. Children have *no*
>>business going through the personal contents of your computer. And kids
>>got no business playing on the internet until they're 18 (and in college
>>where they can then get net access for free -- yet another incentive for a
>>higher education).
> I recommend a copy of SurfWatch and a second computer.
>Keeping kids away from the Internet until they're eighteen is like
>denying them trips to the library, keeping them off the television,
>and preventing them from looking at the newspaper. The Internet is
>becoming (has become?) a major outlet for news, information, and
>public discourse; it may become the backbone of our entire culture
>in the next couple of decades.
>
> The library is FULL of stuff I may not want my kids to read.
>As an erstwhile librarian, I know that most librarians fight like
>Hell to put controversial stuff on shelves, stuff like Mein Kampf,
>Mao's Little Red Book, and The Joy of Sex. The idea that 18 is
>some magical age where they're suddenly fully ready to emerge into
>the world full of the wisdom it takes to survive is utterly stupid.
>Start when they're six giving them the morality, the wisdom, and the
>knowledge of what it means to be human. That way, when they're 13 and
>the hormones hit, they'll have a better chance of surviving puberty.
>
I have to say, I'm with Elf on this one. Start teaching them young
when they *aren't* distracted by their hormones. The Powers know that
I had to figure it out myself, and I could have used some help. But I
was too embarassed to ask for it, and my parents were too embarassed
to volunteer. One of the problems with americal culture is the notion
that sex is somehow 'dirty' and 'obscene' and 'bad' and knowing about
it is 'harmful' to children. Most children below the age of puberty,
when told about sex have *no idea* what all the hooraw is about, and
wonder why anyone would want to do *that*. They'd much rather go play
in the sand, or watch TV, or play a video game. Violence, on the other
hand, is perfectly acceptable. We see guns and knives and blood on
prime time TV, Open heart surgery on PBS, war footage of people with
large chunks of their body missing on the news, but sex? No way! It's
'unsuitable'. Is it me, or is there something wrong with this picture?
Our kids grow up with glamourized violence, and the idea that sex is
something to be ashamed of. Is it any wonder that so many of us are so
screwed up? Hell, most of us are afraid to admit in public that we're
furries...
All we do when we teach our children that sex is something to be
ashamed of is make sure they try to hide it. Make sure than when they
make mistakes (and they will, since we've denied them any information)
that they won't come to us about it until it's probably too late to do
anything about it. I ask you, is this healthy?
OBFUR:
I'll be teaching my kids (when I have them) not only that sex is a
natural part of being human, but also that it's natural to want to
experiment, and that Furriness is just a different way of expressing
ones sexuality (if indeed one's furriness is expressed sexually). And
that there's nothing wrong with it.
Indirian Liryivahl
Mel. White
Elf Sternberg (e...@halcyon.com) wrote:
: I recommend a copy of SurfWatch and a second computer.
: denying them trips to the library, keeping them off the television,
: and preventing them from looking at the newspaper. The Internet is
: becoming (has become?) a major outlet for news, information, and
: public discourse; it may become the backbone of our entire culture
: in the next couple of decades.
Actually, I think I'd disagree here about the informational value of the
Internet. For example, I am a faithful reader of the news services online
and find them... only a little more satisfying than reading the headlines.
They simply can't go into the depth and detail online that they can in a
regular newspaper and certainly not as detailed as the magazines. There's
a perception of its importance, but often the information is old (compared
to library publications) or badly researched.
Agreed, it is an outlet for public discourse, though (if you look at all the
flamewars even on the help echoes and the frequent visits by spam mailers)
I would argue that the value of this discourse is often small.
I don't see that having the kids miss this experience is parallel to having
them miss a library with greater depth of information, a greater reliance
on accurate information (you know how hard it is to get something published!)
and much less fluff and sniping.
... just my 2 cents.
A Super Genius...
Bluefists (cl...@eaglequest.com) wrote:
: That is a definte truism... I myself have a different view on the thing
: than most of you me being the actual child... and without the internet I
: would have keeled over or something... the Netwatch I personally am glad my
: parents cant use a computer cause I myself have been learning a lot of
: things parents dont want me too... but without it I woulda wandered
: aimlessly cause certain things it just aint easy to tell your parents (like
: that your gay and stuff.) I know Im a special case here... but the internet
: is a good place to learn... heck Ive learned more biology (Im going to try
: a major in Biological studies when I graduate H.S.) online than in all my
: BIO classes!
: So I wouldnt deny total privelige... try the programs.. I bet they do help,
: but also... beleive me when I say if they want things bad enough they'll
: get it I know first-hand
They are obviously not teaching grammar, spelling or punctuation in
school anymore, I take it? Or is this some sort of joke? Yeah, I'll bet
that's what this is.
If I was your parent I'd pull you away from that machine and tell you
to do your homework.
--
What you see here is a fantasy! A computer enhanced halucination!
--
Bluefists
>Michael McGee wrote:
> Mr. Super Genius? Go to hell. Some of the smartest, kindest, and
> bravest people I have ever known have trouble with spelling. That
> doesn't mean they're stupid, that means they've chosen to concentrate in
> different areas. And I'd take a kind, gentle person with bad grammar
> over a mean ol' hooerbag with perfect spelling.
Thanks Mike! :)
But in response to super genius, I'm within the top 99% of students in
the U.S. so :P
I Just dont bother with grammer and such in a letter to a newsgroup
because people usually dont nitpick about such, they are usually beyond
such pettiness.
I can have good grammer... hell Im writing a book that people have
actually liked so far. Without grammer I highly doubt I could do that.
Well I hate arguing and prefer lurking in newsgroups and this is getting
off the furry topic so I think Im leaving now.
"Well, snap me down!"
Bluefists
http://www.geocities.com/Paris/4308/index.html
blue...@hotmail.com
--
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
/\___/\ Bluefists
/ 0 0 \ http://www.geocities.com/Paris/4308
\_\ /_/ "May the force be yer umbrella"
\ / blue...@hotmail.com
O
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Richard de Wylfin
In article <5s2797$4e7$1...@chaos.ao.net>, coy...@leopard.velox.com (A Super
Genius...) wrote:
^^^
> to do your homework.
Shouldn't that be "if I *were* your parent?" It's a contrary-to-fact
if-then clause. ;>
Richard de Wylfin (newgrouper of alt.possessive.its.has.no.apostrophe)
Yealurowluro
On <Aug 04 20:41>, ada...@io.com (Per Aspera, Ad Astra) wrote;
PA>"G. Raymond Eddy" <gre...@bright.net> wrote:
> Scenario: Your innocent, impressionable little cubs are perusing your
>furry literature and your newsgroup posts, then they come to you and ask
>you "Daddy, what does 'yiff' mean"
> Now, seeing that /yiff/ is very much a sexual kind of term, would you be
>able to talk about it to your young? Would you be too embarrassed?
PA>My kids already asked (not because they were looking at stuff
PA>they shouldn't, though). I already told them.
Same here. I figure the time to tell your kids about things they really
need to know about is before they get old enough to figure you don't know
anything and quit listening. :-> It pays to be straightforward - years
ago when Vicky (6 or so at the time) wanted to know why the art show folks
wouldn't let her go into one corner of a ConFurence art show, I simply
informed her that it was mostly pictures of beings mating, at which point
she lost interest.
[mail sent to the above address generally lands splat in the bit bucket.
If you want to send me messages, use kay dot shapero at salata dot com,
making the obvious transformations.]
Per Aspera, Ad Astra
"G. Raymond Eddy" <gre...@bright.net> wrote:
> Scenario: Your innocent, impressionable little cubs are perusing your
>furry literature and your newsgroup posts, then they come to you and ask
>you "Daddy, what does 'yiff' mean"
> Now, seeing that /yiff/ is very much a sexual kind of term, would you be
>able to talk about it to your young? Would you be too embarrassed?
My kids already asked (not because they were looking at stuff they
shouldn't, though). I already told them.
Per Aspera, Ad Astra * mailto:ada...@io.com * http://www.io.com/~adastra
"Darling, I'm not accustomed to being used that roughly." --Dusty Rancourt
dreiss
> Actually, I think I'd disagree here about the informational value of
> the Internet.
Hmmm...You know, if I look through my bookmarks, I can find
searchable databases for medline (allowing me to search and read through
the abstracts for studies published in over a thousand medical journals
in many different languages), online encyclopedias and dictionaries,
university sponsored pages that have libraries of ancient texts scanned
and translated., a searchable database of all bills that have been put
to the 105th congress, the Federalist Papers as well as other
historically important documents having to do with the framing of the
constitution, FTP sites that have information about military history,
A world atlas, several government pages of statistics and polls, etc.
And, of course, several damned good art tutorials.
If you know what you are doing...If you actually *look*, there
is a tremendous amount of useful information out there. Positively
mind boggling, really.
The truth is that I have more information available at a mouse-
click then I would if I made a trip to the local library.
*snip*
> I don't see that having the kids miss this experience is parallel to
> having them miss a library with greater depth of information, a
> greater reliance on accurate information (you know how hard it is to
> get something published!) and much less fluff and sniping.
First, I'm still going to disagree with the 'greater depth of
information' comment. I can find *more* info on the internet then I
can at most libraries.
Second, the reliance on accurate information...One thing that
can and should be taught is how to *check* information gathered, no
matter what the source. Find secondary resources, check the cited
resources, etc. That is a *tremendously* useful skill that use of
the internet as a research tool promotes.
Third: Much less fluff and sniping. Well, yeah. Can't argue
with you there. On the other hand... There's also much *more* support,
social structure and social experience available via the Internet.
I'm going to have to agree with a previous poster and say that
keeping a child from learning how to use the internet would be a severe
diservice. The web, newsgroups, gopher and FTP are going to be *hugely*
important to every-day life, studies and job skills.
-- Jareth
Dr. Skorzy MacFarlaighn
Michael McGee wrote:
> Mr. Super Genius? Go to hell. Some of the smartest, kindest, and
> bravest people I have ever known have trouble with spelling. That
> doesn't mean they're stupid, that means they've chosen to concentrate in
> different areas. And I'd take a kind, gentle person with bad grammar
> over a mean ol' hooerbag with perfect spelling.
Yeah! Lots of other qualities in people that I appreciate before their
mastery of the English language! My Advisor is a scientific genius, but
he's a lying, slimy, anti-social, back-stabbing f**ker that I wouldn't
trust to feed a goldfish.
> And if I recall... Albert Einstein had trouble reading too, did he not?
Yes he did. The man was almost a savant. He was a genius at
mathematics and cognitive thought, but could read at the 10th grade
level...
-Skorzy
--
J. Scott Rogers (Dr. Skorzy MacFarlaighn / rat-Biorg physician)
UMASS Medical Center
Program in Molecular Medicine ** sko...@ma.ultranet.com **
Worcester, Massachusetts ** jeff....@ummed.edu **
--
"The Biorg Universe" (Anthropomorphic Fiction)
http://www.tiac.net/users/bfoxxe/tbu-contents.shtml
"The Home for Tenured Graduate Students" (Exercise in self-indulgence)
http://www.ummed.edu/pub/j/jrogers/
-- "Confusion will be my epitaph."
-- Robert Fripp, King Crimson
A Super Genius...
Michael McGee (readsi...@bottomofpage.com) wrote:
: Mr. Super Genius? Go to hell. Some of the smartest, kindest, and
: bravest people I have ever known have trouble with spelling. That
: doesn't mean they're stupid, that means they've chosen to concentrate in
: different areas. And I'd take a kind, gentle person with bad grammar
: over a mean ol' hooerbag with perfect spelling.
Geez, settle down, Beavis. I have enough bleeding hearts in my life.
But, this is the Internet. I'd expect as much, call me cynical.
Besides, where were you when I was five years old? I thought so.
Ucalegon
Oo, me too! I wanna be flamed too!
So I'll just say that if someone sends out a badly written or
badly spelled posting, I generally figure that tey is a selfish
twit who won't give a little of ter own time to make ter writing
more easily readable to the hundreds or thousands of people
to whom it is addressed; or tey is too ignorant or careless to
be worth reading. Occasionally I may be wrong, but life is
so short and the Internet so full of crap that I have to filter, and
I doubt that I lose much, if anything, by ignoring such posts.
Acag, Treesong (ucal...@aol.com)
X...@webtv.net
Whe you were 5 years old I was probably going through navigator school
at Mather AFB (1980?) What's your point?
http://www.huzzah.org/
http://www.reenactor.net/
http://www.smartlink.net/~custer/
A Super Genius...
Ucalegon (ucal...@aol.com) wrote:
: Oo, me too! I wanna be flamed too!
: Acag, Treesong (ucal...@aol.com)
Impressive! Most impressive.
*UMPH!* Perhaps you are not as strong as the emperor thought! *ARGH!*
This is why 'yiff' hasn't been adopted into current curriculum. Er,
or something. Yeah, don't mind me. :P :)
And my point was that he oughtta take better care to make his messages
more legible if he really cares about 'em. Yeah but furries are are a
kind and open lot, eh? Yup. :)
Tigerden System Admin
X...@webtv.net wrote:
> Whe you were 5 years old I was probably going through navigator school
> at Mather AFB (1980?) What's your point?
Oooo... Day Cel... Nite Cel... T-43s... AFM 51-40... Yer dredging up
memories here. :)
=^_^= Tigerwolf
chance
On 10 Aug 1997 14:53:09 GMT, ucal...@aol.com (Ucalegon) wrote:
[]Oo, me too! I wanna be flamed too!
[]
[]So I'll just say that if someone sends out a badly written or
[]badly spelled posting, I generally figure that tey is a selfish
[]twit who won't give a little of ter own time to make ter writing
[]more easily readable to the hundreds or thousands of people
[]to whom it is addressed; or tey is too ignorant or careless to
[]be worth reading. Occasionally I may be wrong, but life is
[]so short and the Internet so full of crap that I have to filter, and
[]I doubt that I lose much, if anything, by ignoring such posts.
[]
[]Acag, Treesong (ucal...@aol.com)
Dunno about a flame, but I'd get those "h" and "i" keys checked if I
were you....
chance (who loves a good Troll as much as the next guy...)
Ucalegon
I've been using the gender-neutral pronoun tey/ter/tem for a
couple of decades now. I forget where I picked it up, though I
know it was discussed in an article in the first issue of *Ms.*
It was originally a consciousness-raising device but now it's
just habit....
Acag, Treesong
Acag, Treesong (ucal...@aol.com)
Betty R.
In article <19970813013...@ladder01.news.aol.com>,
ucal...@aol.com (Ucalegon) wrote:
> I've been using the gender-neutral pronoun tey/ter/tem for a
> couple of decades now. I forget where I picked it up, though I
> know it was discussed in an article in the first issue of *Ms.*
> It was originally a consciousness-raising device but now it's
> just habit....
Aren't the pronouns "they/their/them" *already* gender-neutral?
Obviously that "Ms." article didn't sink into the broad public consciousness
since "tey/ter/tem" are not part of the English lexicon. When most people
see "words" like that, they have a tendency to think that the writer
either
can't spell or have a malfunctioning keyboard. I know that when I come
across writing like that, I promptly cease reading.
-- Betty R.
(who also read "Ms." but who took it with a grain of salt)
--> Remove TOON to reply via email
Ron Orr...& Tirran
Dennis Lee Bieber <wulf...@netcom.com> wrote:
> On 13 Aug 1997 17:24:20 GMT, jabiz...@wt.net (Betty R.) declaimed the
> following in alt.fan.furry:
>
> > Aren't the pronouns "they/their/them" *already* gender-neutral?
> >
> The problem is that /those/ are /also/ plural pronouns in the
> category of "we/ours/us" and not third person cognates of "I/mine/me".
>
> I tend to mix using as a gender-neutral the word "one/one's/???"
"One" and "one's" do work, but I think they add a certain
coldness to the message. One imagines British aristos looking down their
noses at one and saying, "One simply doesn't speak that way, does one?"
Ron
whose kids, BTW, don't know what 'yiff' means but will probably ask any
day now...
Tobias Koehler
On Thu, 14 Aug 1997 04:18:14 GMT, Dennis Lee Bieber
(wulf...@netcom.com) wrote in alt.fan.furry:
> On 13 Aug 1997 17:24:20 GMT, jabiz...@wt.net (Betty R.) declaimed the
> following in alt.fan.furry:
> > Aren't the pronouns "they/their/them" *already* gender-neutral?
> The problem is that /those/ are /also/ plural pronouns in the
> category of "we/ours/us" and not third person cognates of "I/mine/me".
There is hy/hys/hym (he-fluff), shy/hyr/hyr (she-fluff),
han/per/per, yt/yts/yt, sie/hir/hir .... use what you like :)
Of course you can just use `it' if you like to be genderneutral.
unci
--
tobias benjamin koehler t...@rcs.urz.tu-dresden.de
______<_ ______________ ______________ ______________
/'...<+>`\|H ========== H||H ========== H||H ========== H|
______`o-o--o-o'`-oo--------oo-'`-oo--------oo-'`-oo--------oo-'
Skytech
Ron Orr...& Tirran wrote:
>
> "One" and "one's" do work, but I think they add a certain
> coldness to the message. One imagines British aristos looking down their
> noses at one and saying, "One simply doesn't speak that way, does one?"
>
One thing I've always felt about political correctness and gender
neutrality *is* the coldness they instill.
--
La kasigada vulpo
Skytech
Betty R.
> Ron Orr...& Tirran wrote:
> >
> > "One" and "one's" do work, but I think they add a certain coldness
> > to the message. One imagines British aristos looking down their
> > noses at one and saying, "One simply doesn't speak that way, does one?"
Better to be cold and distant, than nonsensical and poorly-written --
where the reader can not clearly make out what the writer is trying to say
because they stubbornly insist on using absurb, made-up words.
(Unless you're James Joyce, that is.)
> One thing I've always felt about political correctness and gender
> neutrality *is* the coldness they instill.
I agree! And their sense of humor could be better, too.
-- Betty R.
(who likes "funny animals")