Illinois Enema Bandit
Stefan
Hi there,
does anybody know whether the Illinois Enema Bandit is actually based
on a real person? I think Frank's made the whole thing up as it's far
to weird to be true, but a friend of mine reckons he's heard of the
I.E.B. before hearing the FZ song.
--
Stefan
--
"Stupidity has a certain charm - ignorance does not."
(Frank Zappa)
www.netforward.com/deathsdoor/?stefanend
FHemmer209
The Illinois Enema Bandit was based on a real event. I am one of the
"older" FZ fans and I remember reading the story in the paper before He
wrote the song. I assume the partial newspaper clip copied in the Live in
New York album jacket is a copy of the actual story. Even Zappa couldn't
have come with that!
Fred Hemmer
Biffyshrew
Stef...@DeathsDoor.com (Stefan) wrote:
>does anybody know whether the Illinois Enema Bandit is actually based
>on a real person? I think Frank's made the whole thing up as it's far
>to weird to be true, but a friend of mine reckons he's heard of the
>I.E.B. before hearing the FZ song.
It is true. One of the shittier things FZ ever did (at least in public)
was to compound the humiliation Kenyon's real-life victims experienced by
performing this song making a joke out of their sexual assault.
Your pal,
Biffy the Elephant Shrew @}-`--}----
Information on THE BRANDNEWBUG CONCERTOS (voted the 606th best album of all time!) at http://users.aol.com/biffyshrew/biffy.html
...Afghanistan bananastand!
johan wikberg
<Stef...@DeathsDoor.com> writes:
> does anybody know whether the Illinois Enema Bandit is
> actually based on a real person? I think Frank's made the
> whole thing up as it's far to weird to be true, but a friend
> of mine reckons he's heard of the I.E.B. before hearing
> the FZ song.
Now, Frank has already told you it was true, and you didn't believe him. Will
you believe us if we tell you? He was for real, damnit!
Johan
johan_...@ssco.se
D. Hudson
Stefan wrote:
>
> Hi there,
>
> does anybody know whether the Illinois Enema Bandit is actually based
> on a real person? I think Frank's made the whole thing up as it's far
> to weird to be true, but a friend of mine reckons he's heard of the
> I.E.B. before hearing the FZ song.
>
> Stefan
> --
> "Stupidity has a certain charm - ignorance does not."
> (Frank Zappa)
> www.netforward.com/deathsdoor/?stefanend
According to the Fortean Times, the IEB did indeed exist. A 30 yr old
named Michael Kenyon was arrested for forcibly administering enemas to at
least 2 dozen females between 1965 and 1975. He was sentenced to six
years in jail.
DH
Michael Forrest Zink
> According to the Fortean Times, the IEB did indeed exist. A 30 yr old
> named Michael Kenyon was arrested for forcibly administering enemas to at
> least 2 dozen females between 1965 and 1975. He was sentenced to six
> years in jail.
Accorsing to an interview with someone (I forget who -- I'm pretty sure
it wasn't FZ though) that was published in Ben Watson's "NDOPP," Richard
Nixon was on Kenyon's list.
-MZ-
Richard C Williams
It's all true!! Really!! At the time it happened, Bob Dylans' Ballad of
Hurricane Carter was popular on the radio, and Frank figured if Dylan
could write a song about an accused murderer, then he would write one
about an accused Enema Bandit.
PiedmontT
I once heard about a Zappa fan who ran into Michael Kenyon around 1982.
Mr. Kenyon was terrified aboput being recognized.
S. Hecht
Peter de B. Harrington
Stefan wrote:
>
> Hi there,
>
> does anybody know whether the Illinois Enema Bandit is actually based
> on a real person? I think Frank's made the whole thing up as it's far
> to weird to be true, but a friend of mine reckons he's heard of the
> I.E.B. before hearing the FZ song.
>
> --
> Stefan
> --
> "Stupidity has a certain charm - ignorance does not."
> (Frank Zappa)
> www.netforward.com/deathsdoor/?stefanend
Before moving to Illinois, Michael Kenyon was the Ohio State
Enema Bandit. MK's (not the fast fingered guitarist)
modus operandi was to enter the homes
of college students through the backdoors that were left unlocked.
On too few occasions, FZ included this in his preamble
which would have provided some public service.
Even today, many college students are victims of crime,
because they continue to hide their doorkeys under the welcome mat
(if they don't have a rear door) or leave the rear door unlocked. The
rationale for this behavior is
[1] I don't want to carry my housekeys with me, because the pants
I am wearing are too tight for them to fit comfortably in the
pockets (mostly women).
[2] I lost my copy of the keys a month ago, and no one else has
found them for me (mostly men).
[3] I have a buddy that is coming over later, who is going to do
me a big favor (the lucky ones).
I also seem to remember in the log cabin days, some crazy guy
entered FZ's house with a gun. So don't let them get you.
Pete
William W. Huntley
fhemm...@aol.com (FHemmer209) wrote:
Fred is correct. I saw him in 75 or 76 at Duke; this had been in the
news. Song was crazy, though low in judgement.....anyone know if it's
recorded anywhere?
Michael Forrest Zink
> : One of the shittier things FZ ever did (at least in public)
> : was to compound the humiliation Kenyon's real-life victims experienced by
> : performing this song making a joke out of their sexual assault.
I really don't think that FZ compounded any humiliation of the victims.
Or at least if he did, it was definitely not the intent. The song is
just about the guy, and what he did, and how fuckin' stupid it sounds.
Remember what FZ once said (I'm paraphrasing since I do not recall word
for word what he said): "It's not so much asking the 'when' or the 'why'
as it is asking 'what the fuck?'" Also remember that the song is nearly
13 minutes long, and lyrics don't take anywhere near half of it up (Maybe
I should go back and listen to it to be sure though.)
-MZ-
Vladimir Sovetov
Biffyshrew (biffy...@aol.com) wrote:
: Stef...@DeathsDoor.com (Stefan) wrote:
: >does anybody know whether the Illinois Enema Bandit is actually based
: >on a real person? I think Frank's made the whole thing up as it's far
: >to weird to be true, but a friend of mine reckons he's heard of the
: >I.E.B. before hearing the FZ song.
: It is true. One of the shittier things FZ ever did (at least in public)
: was to compound the humiliation Kenyon's real-life victims experienced by
: performing this song making a joke out of their sexual assault.
Real story details
http://arf.kpbank.ru/Notes/ziny.html
: Your pal,
: Biffy the Elephant Shrew @}-`--}----
: Information on THE BRANDNEWBUG CONCERTOS (voted the 606th best album of all time!) at http://users.aol.com/biffyshrew/biffy.html
: ..Afghanistan bananastand!
Andy Hollinden
Michael Forrest Zink wrote:
>
> > : One of the shittier things FZ ever did (at least in public)
> > : was to compound the humiliation Kenyon's real-life victims experienced by
> > : performing this song making a joke out of their sexual assault.
>
> Or at least if he did, it was definitely not the intent. The song is
> just about the guy, and what he did, and how fuckin' stupid it sounds.
> Remember what FZ once said (I'm paraphrasing since I do not recall word
> for word what he said): "It's not so much asking the 'when' or the 'why'
> as it is asking 'what the fuck?'" Also remember that the song is nearly
> 13 minutes long, and lyrics don't take anywhere near half of it up (Maybe
> I should go back and listen to it to be sure though.)
>
> -MZ-
>
sexually abused before the age of 18. While it's impossible to know
about the victims of Michael Kenyon, I would bet that many, many
victims of abuse would hear FZ songs like "The Illinois Enema Bandit"
and "Magdalena" not only as offensive but as conduit to deeply
humiliating and painful memories. Obviously, I doubt that was FZ's
intent, but, in these days, to deny the possibility seems oafish.
Andy
Michael Forrest Zink
>>>>Also remember that the song is nearly
> I'm not sure I follow your logic. Is that like saying that getting beaten
> up isn't so bad if there's a long guitar solo in the middle?
The point I was trying to make was that (I don't think I even have to say
this) the focus of the song was the music, as it is in every FZ song --
MUSIC IS THE BEST -- not the "ridiculing" and "humiliating". I still
stand by saying that it's intent was not to R&H (even though, yeah, it
did to a certain extent).
-MZ-
PS Thing-Fish is too weird already. Lets not get into ITS moral value.
Bruce Buckingham
D. Hudson wrote:
>
> Stefan wrote:
> >
> > Hi there,
> >
> > does anybody know whether the Illinois Enema Bandit is actually based
> > on a real person? I think Frank's made the whole thing up as it's far
> > to weird to be true, but a friend of mine reckons he's heard of the
> > I.E.B. before hearing the FZ song.
> >
> > Stefan
> > --
> > "Stupidity has a certain charm - ignorance does not."
> > (Frank Zappa)
> > www.netforward.com/deathsdoor/?stefanend
>
> named Michael Kenyon was arrested for forcibly administering enemas to at
> least 2 dozen females between 1965 and 1975. He was sentenced to six
> years in jail.
>
I live in the towns where it mostly happened (Champaign - Urbana, IL ).
I moved here in 1972, and heard the stories many times. When FZ played
here the first time, he said he probably couldn't leave without
performing the song, but we would have to put up with his singing the
lead vocals, instead of, I think, Ray White. He did just fine. This band
also featured Adrian Belew, who would move here a few years later.
Bruce
--
http://www.soltec.net/~moebius/
--- "The Modern Day Zappa Refuses to Decompose" ---
Biffyshrew
Michael Forrest Zink <dpg...@alpha1.csd.uwm.edu> wrote:
(quoting me)
>> : One of the shittier things FZ ever did (at least in public)
>> : was to compound the humiliation Kenyon's real-life victims
experienced by
>> : performing this song making a joke out of their sexual assault.
>
>I really don't think that FZ compounded any humiliation of the victims.
>Or at least if he did, it was definitely not the intent. The song is
>just about the guy, and what he did, and how fuckin' stupid it sounds.
I don't agree. First he describes the assault in a comical way, which
trivializes the trauma that these women went through, and essentially
holds them up to ridicule. Then the big punch line is that the victims
really like it (and even fall in love with the bandit) because "it must be
just what they all needs." Now that *is* a funny line, but the problem I
have with it is that it sounds just like those deplorable old saws about
women secretly wanting to be raped. ("Why is there no such thing as rape?
Because a woman with her skirt up can run faster than a man with his
pants down.") And this isn't just a fantasy like the kinky stuff in
Thing-Fish (does anyone get too upset about the fact that a [crabgrass]
baby gets fucked?), or generalized sexism like FZ's notorious "women's
movement" comment; this is about real people. (Jim and Tammy are real
people, too--of a sort, anyway--and for that matter so is Michael Kenyon,
but celebrities and evil-doers are fair game. The enema bandit's
real-life victims didn't do anything to put themsleves in the public eye,
and they certainly don't deserve to be made a laughing stock.)
>Also remember that the song is nearly
>13 minutes lough.)
I'm not sure I follow your logic. Is that like saying that getting beaten
up isn't so bad if there's a long guitar solo in the middle?
Your pal,
Biffy the Elephant Shrew @}-`--}----
Information on THE BRANDNEWBUG CONCERTOS (voted the 606th best album of all time!) at http://users.aol.com/biffyshrew/biffy.html
...Afghanistan bananastand!
jonno
So, does this mean that songs like e.g Punky's Whips, Jewish Princess,
Penis Dimension ..., that are in one way way or another, offensive to
some (not all, some) people, should be considered 'wrong' or 'examples
of bad taste and total lack of social feeling' ?
Why not put a label on records containing these outrages...
--
(-OO-) There is this theory of the Mobius,
__ a twist in the fabric of space where time becomes a loop
Lt. Worf, star trek.
Daniel Norris
On Tue, 28 Jan 1997, jonno wrote:
> So, does this mean that songs like e.g Punky's Whips, Jewish Princess,
> Penis Dimension ..., that are in one way way or another, offensive to
> some (not all, some) people, should be considered 'wrong' or 'examples
> of bad taste and total lack of social feeling' ?
>
> Why not put a label on records containing these outrages...
>
Oh, gimmie a break. Nobody said to put a label on anything. Nobody
suggested that Frank didn't have a *right* to put Illinois Enema Bandit on
record, its just that some of feel that it was a tasteless and cruel thing
to do. Like Biffy said, a difference between the songs you list above and
the Bandit song is that the above songs are more broad-based satirical
things, whereas IEB is very specific, since it actually names the real
guy, and jokes about his REAL victems, which is completely unkind and not
funny.
I might roll my eyes a bit at Jewish Princess, because some of my
best friends are Jewish girls, but I can see that he's basically joking
around, since the Jewish Princess he wants is basically a theoretical
person he hasn't met. In the same way, the "He's So Gay" person is just a
list of silly stereotyes that are hard to take seriously unless you're
really uptight. The IEB is really an example of a guy with the ability to
get whatever he wants to say put out on record, using that power to be
mean to some people that had to go through hell anyway.
In other words, Zappa was being a jerk when he wrote that song.
Sometimes he *was* a jerk. So what? he was still cool ther rest of the
time, and I'd stilll like to come, maybe, in his bus.
Suzy
Michael Forrest Zink
> If someone has one of those neat on line dictionaries, perhaps they
> could post the definition of SATIRE. It seems some of us have forgotten
> it.
> Frank wrote the song based on news reports of the incidents, and as a
> sort of antidote to Bob Dylans Ballad of Huricane Carter. As a satirist,
> FZ had no obligation to respect any one individuals' "feelings", indeed
> he'd be compromising his vision if he did.
Well said. Well fucking said. Wish I had said that.
-MZ-
Richard C Williams
Daniel Norris
On 28 Jan 1997, Biffyshrew wrote:
> Michael Forrest Zink <dpg...@alpha1.csd.uwm.edu> wrote:
>
> (quoting me)
> >> : One of the shittier things FZ ever did (at least in public)
> >> : was to compound the humiliation Kenyon's real-life victims
> experienced by
> >> : performing this song making a joke out of their sexual assault.
> >
> >I really don't think that FZ compounded any humiliation of the victims.
> >Or at least if he did, it was definitely not the intent. The song is
> >just about the guy, and what he did, and how fuckin' stupid it sounds.
>
> I don't agree. First he describes the assault in a comical way, which
> trivializes the trauma that these women went through, and essentially
> holds them up to ridicule. Then the big punch line is that the victims
> really like it (and even fall in love with the bandit) because "it must be
(snip)
> but celebrities and evil-doers are fair game. The enema bandit's
> real-life victims didn't do anything to put themsleves in the public eye,
> and they certainly don't deserve to be made a laughing stock.)
>
> >Also remember that the song is nearly
> >13 minutes lough.)
>
> I'm not sure I follow your logic. Is that like saying that getting beaten
> up isn't so bad if there's a long guitar solo in the middle?
>
I agree with Biffy here. I mean let's face it. Frank Zappa could be a
real asshole in some ways. The Enema Bandit song would be much funnier if
it wasn't based on a real event. And yes, there's a good vocal
performance on the recording, and yes, that's a great guitar solo. But
the song is one of the very few that I actually sort of wish Frank had
never done. Well written post, Biff.
Suzy
johan wikberg
jonno <jo...@vortex.biol.ruu.nl> writes:
> So, does this mean that songs like e.g Punky's Whips, Jewish
> Princess, Penis Dimension ..., that are in one way way or
> another, offensive to some (not all, some) people, should
> be considered 'wrong' or 'examples of bad taste and total
> lack of social feeling' ?
Who is "Punky's Whips" offensive to? Terry Bozzio, Punky Meadows or Steven
Tyler?
Johan
johan_...@ssco.se
Biffyshrew
I *know* what satire is, thank you very much. I also know what
insensitivity is, and it makes for bad art. Always.
Social commentary without a conscience is worthless, even if your defense
of this song simply because it *is* satire implies that satire is
automatically above criticism. Do you believe that there is no such thing
as poor satire? Is satire that can't hit a deserving target (like the
Enema Bandit) without simultaneously spattering underserving targets (like
the Bandit's victims) good satire? Or is it, to use Zappa's own simile
from another context, "the equivalent of treating dandruff by
decapitation"?
And face it: lyrically, "The Illinois Enema Bandit" is less true satire at
heart than it is an extended poo-poo joke. If you want to hear some
*real* satire, I recommend an album you might have heard of called
Broadway The Hard Way.
D.G. Porter
Richard C Williams wrote:
>
> If someone has one of those neat on line dictionaries, perhaps they
> could post the definition of SATIRE. It seems some of us have forgotten
> it.
> Frank wrote the song based on news reports of the incidents, and as a
> sort of antidote to Bob Dylans Ballad of Huricane Carter. As a satirist,
> FZ had no obligation to respect any one individuals' "feelings", indeed
> he'd be compromising his vision if he did.
Fuck. As if Zappa never did anythig satirically. I remember some
butthole in Rolling Stone whining that "Wino Man" was so terible when
evryone should take the "sympathetic" view of Jethro Tul's "Aqualung"
and get with being "PC."
I heard some years ago that a guy was waiting in the unemployment
office, and he heard the name "Michael Kenyon" called out, and it was
the guy sitting next to him, and he asked the guy if he'd ever heard of
someone named Frank Zappa, and the guy bolted from his seat right out of
the building.
DGP (aka Peter James kenyon [no relation I think]}
Biffyshrew
Sorry for reposting this, but it never showed up on my server, and I
assume that means a lot of other people also never got to see it, and I
feel it's an important message.
Richard C Williams <punk...@ziplink.net> wrote:
>If someone has one of those neat on line dictionaries, perhaps they
>could post the definition of SATIRE. It seems some of us have forgotten
>it.
> Frank wrote the song based on news reports of the incidents, and
as a
>sort of antidote to Bob Dylans Ballad of Huricane Carter. As a satirist,
>FZ had no obligation to respect any one individuals' "feelings", indeed
>he'd be compromising his vision if he did.
I *know* what satire is, thank you very much. I also know what
fzdo...@aol.com
In article <19970130135...@ladder01.news.aol.com>,
biffy...@aol.com (Biffyshrew) writes:
>I *know* what satire is, thank you very much. I also know what
>insensitivity is, and it makes for bad art. Always.
>
>Social commentary without a conscience is worthless, even if your defense
>of this song simply because it *is* satire implies that satire is
>automatically above criticism. Do you believe that there is no such
thing
>as poor satire? Is satire that can't hit a deserving target (like the
>Enema Bandit) without simultaneously spattering underserving targets
(like
>the Bandit's victims) good satire? Or is it, to use Zappa's own simile
>from another context, "the equivalent of treating dandruff by
>decapitation"?
>
>And face it: lyrically, "The Illinois Enema Bandit" is less true satire
at
>heart than it is an extended poo-poo joke. If you want to hear some
>*real* satire, I recommend an album you might have heard of called
>Broadway The Hard Way.
>
Now see whatchoo done went and did? Ya got Biffy all upset! This is a
first! I sure do think it be time for a new thread!
As you were,
Mark (the) FzDolfan
"...we're never gonna survive, unless we are a little crazy" - Seal
Kurt Nordwell P500
Daniel Norris wrote:
>
a little snip
> funny. I might roll my eyes a bit at Jewish Princess, because some of my
> best friends are Jewish girls, but I can see that he's basically joking
> around, since the Jewish Princess he wants is basically a theoretical
> person he hasn't met.
I spent a year at Columbia University in NY. I have met several people who
meet the description. I think Frank was making a joke about someone he knew
existed in the US.
> In the same way, the "He's So Gay" person is just a
> list of silly stereotyes that are hard to take seriously unless you're
> really uptight.
Once again, I experienced people while growing up in New Orleans that matched this
description. I believe this song was also based on fact not stereotype.
> The IEB is really an example of a guy with the ability to
> get whatever he wants to say put out on record, using that power to be
> mean to some people that had to go through hell anyway.
> In other words, Zappa was being a jerk when he wrote that song.
> Sometimes he *was* a jerk. So what? he was still cool ther rest of the
> time, and I'd stilll like to come, maybe, in his bus.
Amen, I did not initially like the IEB, but I totally changed my opinion after
hearing the 80 band rendition. The ZINY and 84 versions don't do anything for
me. I like the way the initial verse is constructed; "he just be pumpin'
every one of 'em up with a bag full of Illinois Enema Bandit juice" doubled
with bass with a strategically placed scream. I also like the court scene at
the end.
> Suzy
Peace,
Kurt
Jonathan Rozes
In article <5cqosb$1...@camel2.mindspring.com>,
paul...@mindspring.com (Paul Hinrichs) writes:
> did he continue performing Illinois Enema Bandit into the 1980s as
> general consciousness of victims' feelings were raised?
Yes. It was performed quite a bit between '80 and '88.
jonathan
--
+++ Jonathan Rozes, Unix Systems Administrator, Tufts University
++ jro...@tcs.tufts.edu, http://rozes.tcs.tufts.edu/
+ Remember, there's a difference between kneeling down and
bending over --FZ
Rolf Maurer
So then Michael Forrest Zink <dpg...@alpha1.csd.uwm.edu> sez ...
>> : One of the shittier things FZ ever did (at least in public)
>> : was to compound the humiliation Kenyon's real-life victims experienced by
>> : performing this song making a joke out of their sexual assault.
>
>I really don't think that FZ compounded any humiliation of the victims.
>Or at least if he did, it was definitely not the intent. The song is
>just about the guy, and what he did, and how fuckin' stupid it sounds.
>Remember what FZ once said (I'm paraphrasing since I do not recall word
>for word what he said): "It's not so much asking the 'when' or the 'why'
>as it is asking 'what the fuck?'" Also remember that the song is nearly
>13 minutes long, and lyrics don't take anywhere near half of it up (Maybe
>I should go back and listen to it to be sure though.)
Zappa introduces IEB thusly, Vancouver, October 1, 1975:
"The Illinois Enema Bandit is a true story. Some of you might know
about this guy. His REAL name is Michael Kenyon, apparently, because a
person by that name has been arrested and charged with the crime of
capturing college-educated women and giving them, at gunpoint, an
enema, in their residence. Well, it's too bad they caught the
sonofabitch, that's all I've got to say. But anyway ... " at which
point he describes, in lurid detail, a typical assault.
Sounds to me like he definitely thought about the victims, and quite
possibly thought they "needed it". You might call him insensitive. I
call it Frank's Beavis-and-Butthead side (except that he wasn't
fourteen years old when he wrote IEB).
================================================
Rolf Maurer
rma...@pinc.com
================================================
Kurt Nordwell P500
Biffyshrew wrote:
>
> Sorry for reposting this, but it never showed up on my server, and I
> assume that means a lot of other people also never got to see it, and I
> feel it's an important message.
>
> Richard C Williams <punk...@ziplink.net> wrote:
>
> >If someone has one of those neat on line dictionaries, perhaps they
> >could post the definition of SATIRE. It seems some of us have forgotten
> >it.
> > Frank wrote the song based on news reports of the incidents, and
> as a
> >sort of antidote to Bob Dylans Ballad of Huricane Carter. As a satirist,
> >FZ had no obligation to respect any one individuals' "feelings", indeed
> >he'd be compromising his vision if he did.
>
> insensitivity is, and it makes for bad art. Always.
>
Sounds like a huge chunk of hip hop, just a thought.
Peace,
Kurt
Paul Hinrichs
biffy...@aol.com (Biffyshrew) wrote:
>And face it: lyrically, "The Illinois Enema Bandit" is less true satire at
>heart than it is an extended poo-poo joke. If you want to hear some
>*real* satire, I recommend an album you might have heard of called
>Broadway The Hard Way.
I hafta agree that the word "satire" is used too frequently these days
to obscure gross insensitivity, often in accompaniment with
accusations of "politically correct" and any other weapon in -ist
recidivism, and I'm pretty close to your position on this - the
ridicule of victims is not merely "satire" or "politically incorrect",
it is vulgar and potentially damaging to the psyches of the victims,
heaping disdain and scorn atop the powerlessness and humiliation they
faced in the original trauma.
Maybe I'm a bit too forgiving of Frank because of all the joy he has
brought me, but I'm not as sure as you that he did that or intended
that. I'm only about a half-inch away from your position, but it is
clearly on the other side of the fence. Had they been victims of pure
rape I'd agree completely with you. But the peculiar fascination our
culture has with poo-poo jokes and bathroom humor make this a mirror,
a hammer, a hamster, or whatever - we should feel disgusted with
ourselves if we find it humorous, but not with him. He was just taking
a topic that the Weekly World News might exploit (read the grocery
checkout tabloids about JonBenet) and making lyrics to some good
music.
I have said before that this was not that unacceptable in the 1970s.
Much as we like to revere Frank for having an advanced consciousness,
should we really expect him to be so far advanced, by two decades, to
think then as we are more likely to now? And a final edible question,
did he continue performing Illinois Enema Bandit into the 1980s as
general consciousness of victims' feelings were raised?
Maybe he did - I'm sure you know the answer. That would make me closer
to agreement with you. As far as the re-releases go, that's
troublesome too. If he can add new Rhythm tracks to Ruben, he
certainly could have deleted IEB from ZINY as well. Still, that would
constitute a bit of self-censorship, something he never woulda been
inclined to do. I don't know. I'm not very fond of some things in IEB,
but I find it difficult to judge his call on it.
Biffyshrew
fzdo...@aol.com wrote:
>Now see whatchoo done went and did? Ya got Biffy all upset!
This is a petulant frenzy!
I'm petulant!
And I'm having a frenzy!
Robert Cook
On Thu, 30 Jan 1997 12:11:59 -0500, Kurt Nordwell P500
<nord...@nortel.ca> wrote:
>a little snip
>
>
>Once again, I experienced people while growing up in New Orleans that matched this
>description. I believe this song was also based on fact not stereotype.
>
I have always believed people get nicknames for a reason. The same
goes for stereotypes, if they were not universally recognizable,
stereostypes would not exist.
Robert Cook
Illinois Enema Bandit has always been one of my favorite Zappa jams
from the first time I heard. I love the music and the lyrics. Its a
great Zappa song. Others, obviously, do not share that opinion.
Charles Ulrich
In article <32f0ed3...@news.pinc.com>, rma...@pinc.com (Rolf Maurer)
wrote:
> Zappa introduces IEB thusly, Vancouver, October 1, 1975:
[snip]
> Well, it's too bad they caught the
> sonofabitch, that's all I've got to say.
This is unfortunate. I have always been willing to take the last verse as
a satire on last verses of blues (as described in the liner notes of ZINY)
and I have always given great importance to the line:
"Apparently there was no law against that."
I interpreted this to be a sardonic reaction to the fact that Kenyon was
prosecuted for robbery but not for assault. I realize that by so doing,
the prosecutors avoided further embarrassing the victims in court, but at
the same time it seems to send the message that crimes against property
are taken more seriously than crimes against women's bodies.
I will continue to maintain my interpretation, even if FZ's Vancouver
introduction suggests that he may not have intended it.
--Charles
Biffyshrew
cul...@u.washington.edu (Charles Ulrich) wrote:
>I interpreted this to be a sardonic reaction to the fact that Kenyon was
>prosecuted for robbery but not for assault. I realize that by so doing,
>the prosecutors avoided further embarrassing the victims in court, but at
>the same time it seems to send the message that crimes against property
>are taken more seriously than crimes against women's bodies.
I assumed it was really just a convenience: something easier to get a
conviction on, just as Al Capone was put away for income tax
evasion--which is not to say that there's "no law against" robbery,
racketeering and murder. However, an early issue of Mother People
reproduced Michael Kenyon's mug shot and rap sheet (god, I sound like an
episode of Dragnet), and there are three charges listed against him. The
first is burglary ("Burg") and the last armed robbery. But the middle
one, which is too blurred in the photocopy to make out clearly, *may* be
"Mal ass," which I take to mean malicious assault. Rather unfortunate
abbreviation, if so.
Your pal,
Biffy the Elephant Shrew @}-`--}----
Information on THE BRANDNEWBUG CONCERTOS (voted the 606th best album of all time!) at http://users.aol.com/biffyshrew/biffy.html
Think global, act loco.
Martin Gregorie
biffy...@aol.com (Biffyshrew) wrote:
>cul...@u.washington.edu (Charles Ulrich) wrote:
>
>>I interpreted this to be a sardonic reaction to the fact that Kenyon was
>>prosecuted for robbery but not for assault. I realize that by so doing,
>>the prosecutors avoided further embarrassing the victims in court, but at
>>the same time it seems to send the message that crimes against property
>>are taken more seriously than crimes against women's bodies.
>
... snipped Biffy's pertinant comments ....
I always assumed that the prosecution for robbery but not for assault
was what attracted Frank's attention in the first place. This would
mean that the purpose behind the song was an attack on the legal
eagles who'd persued the robbery charge and ignored the enema action.
Seen in that light the song isn't satirising the victims or even
Michael Kenyon, but is rubbing the lawyers noses in the stupidity of
the way they conducted the case and drawing the politicos attention to
some really dumb law-making.
Martin
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Martin Gregorie |Logica UK Ltd
Greg...@logica.com |All opinions expressed are solely those
+44 (0171) 637 9111 |of the author and not of Logica
----------------------------------------------------------------------
jonno
Martin Gregorie wrote:
snip
> Seen in that light the song isn't satirising the victims or even
> Michael Kenyon, but is rubbing the lawyers noses in the stupidity of
> the way they conducted the case and drawing the politicos attention to
> some really dumb law-making.
--
Seen in the light of what Paul Hinrichs has taught us all
(look for his post under: 'Re: Jumbo worse than Illinois'),
the correct way to put this would be:
the song is RIDICULING the victims (or is it?) and
the song is a SATIRE on the lawyers and how they conducted the case and
on the dumb law making.
Did I get it right Paul ?
--
What was that? This is not a chawade,
(-OO-) We need totaw concentwation, now again...
__ and this time, wiv FEEEEWING...
(A fistfull of Yen, Kentucky fried movie)
Paul Hinrichs
jonno <jo...@vortex.biol.ruu.nl> wrote:
>seen in the light of what Paul Hinrichs has taught us all
>(look for his post under: 'Re: Jumbo worse than Illinois'),
>the correct way to put this would be:
>the song is RIDICULING the victims (or is it?) and
>the song is a SATIRE on the lawyers and how they conducted the case and
>on the dumb law making.
>Did I get it right Paul ?
Damn near perfect, jonno - step to the head of the class <g>. In my
mind, "satire" requires a bit of exaggeration. I'm not sure that's in
IEB, it pretty reports the facts, bizarre as they are. There are
little tidbits in there - "I heard it on the news" - that poke some
fun of general conditions, our apparent hunger for perverse stories
and the willingness of the fourth estate to feed it above and beyond
their charter to report important events, but that doesn't really
develop either.
There is another word, other than ridicule, whose meaning is
frequently confused with "satire" and that is "lampoon". A lampoon is
vicious and often malicious, but done so humorously. Whether or not
you find it humorous or just malicious usually depends on whether or
not you share the malice of the lampooner. Like when Larry Flynt did
the now famous cartoon strip of Jerry Falwell's "first time", with his
mother, in an outhouse, that was a lampoon, not a satire. In a satire,
we all are lambasted for a common weakness, yet simultanously smug and
above it all. Only self-righteous people are genuinely offended by it
(and make themselves even more ridiculous in the process) because it
exposes weaknessness they don't want to own up to.
I don't think this is nearly as vague as the US Supreme Court Justice
who said he didn't know how to define obscenity but he knew it when he
saw it, and there is some flexibility to account for personal tastes,
but satire is close to fiction, even though we can draw parallels to
real events - and it's more about mores than individuals.
Tomorrow: The word "farce".
danki...@aol.com
In article <32f8824b.11502503@news>, greg...@see.sig.for.address (Martin
Gregorie) writes:
>This would
>mean that the purpose behind the song was an attack on the legal
>eagles who'd persued the robbery charge and ignored the enema action
I have no comment except to say that I will be using the phrase *enema
action* as often as possible from now on.
===============================================
/\_/\ Dan The Kitti man - http://members.aol.com/dankitti99
( . . )
=;= "Take a trip on a rocket ship, baby, the sea is the sky" -ta
===============================================
David Wilcher
>I have no comment except to say that I will be using the phrase *enema
>action* as often as possible from now on.
When I arrive in a new city, I always ask the cab driver (they ALWAYS know)
"Where can a guy get a little *enema action*?"
--
David Wilcher > Sysop > The Juke Joint BBS > 513-687-2423
wil...@ibm.net
Without music to decorate it, time is just a bunch of boring production
deadlines or dates by which bills must be paid. - Frank Zappa
Paul Hinrichs
Hanzo
In article <19970206135...@ladder01.news.aol.com>
danki...@aol.com writes:
> In article <32f8824b.11502503@news>, greg...@see.sig.for.address (Martin
> Gregorie) writes:
>
> >This would
> >mean that the purpose behind the song was an attack on the legal
> >eagles who'd persued the robbery charge and ignored the enema action
>
> I have no comment except to say that I will be using the phrase *enema
> action* as often as possible from now on.
>
>
>
> ===============================================
> /\_/\ Dan The Kitti man - http://members.aol.com/dankitti99
> ( . . )
> =;= "Take a trip on a rocket ship, baby, the sea is the sky" -ta
> ===============================================
>
>
I agree, that must be what you need. Flush all those surplus words out.
hanzo
danki...@aol.com
The song Illinois Enema Bandit is EXTREMELY OFFENSIVE...........
to the state of Illinois, and anyone who has ever given or recieved an enema.
Anyone who has ever lived in, or for any reason, has been to Illinois *and* has given and/or recieved an enema will be offended.
Any type of bandit will be offended. :O
The song is too shocking for words.
===============================================
/\_/\ Dan the Kitti Man - http://members.aol.com/dankitti99
elliot.spe...@gmail.com
> Hi there,
>
> does anybody know whether the Illinois Enema Bandit is actually based
> on a real person? I think Frank's made the whole thing up as it's far
> to weird to be true, but a friend of mine reckons he's heard of the
> I.E.B. before hearing the FZ song.
>
> --
> Stefan
> --
> "Stupidity has a certain charm - ignorance does not."
> (Frank Zappa)
> www.netforward.com/deathsdoor/?stefanend
My dad went to school with him
The old geezer
>
> My dad went to school with him.....
With Frank?
TOG
jimb...@gmail.com
The old geezer
Martin Gregorie
onto a hard drive for easier access. My old Sony CD player plays half a
track and then starts skipping and the so the only player I have that
works reliably is a USB CD drive thats currently connected to the laptop
I'm writing this on. I've detoured through jazz and blues. Now on FZ
sidemen (just ripped and listened to Johnny 'Guitar' Watson) to be
followed by FZ and then back to a drawer-full of classical stuff. Then
only vinyl to digitize.
Besides, now summer is almost here, music etc. is about to take a backseat
to soaring. The glider is ready and so am I.
--
Martin | martin at
Gregorie | gregorie dot org
The old geezer
Martin Gregorie
> Martin: they still do sell cd players! I have a Sony CE-375 which is
> going on about 11 years old now.
>
money because they're built like brick outhouses and over here are still
valued by hifi buffs. I think the read head (LED and photocell) may be
failing.
> Since I have around 1,000 cds I will most likely purchase another one.
> My home is all wired for sound hooked up to my “entertainment center”. I
> started buying 45 rpms & 331/3 vinyl back in 1964. Then in 1981 I put
> them all on cassette tapes. Then switched everything over to cds in
> 2000 & sold/ gave away all my vinyl. That’s it! I ain’t going on any
> further. Yeah, I have music on my old computer but that’ll be dying
> soon.
>
house. Sound is based round a Quad 33/303 I've had since 1979, with an FM3
FM tuner and a Logitech Touch that controls the music server on one of my
computers and converts streamed music into audio input for the Quad 303
You don't need much computer to do this: a GBP 35 RaspberryPi can easily
act as the music server, though I'm using a 20 year old whitebox PC
because I have it and its working well.
> It was all the 4 lads from Liverpool’s fault!!
>
Peter,Paul and Mary, then Bob Dylan and jazz. My boost into (prog) rock
came from hearing the whole of ELP's "Pictures At An Exhibition" played
on the radio one Saturday afternoon. I only got into FZ when some chums
played me JG vol 1, so quite late, soon after I got back from a rather
long drive round parts of Asia - I missed most of the Punk era because of
that.
The old geezer
federico....@gmail.com
enough. I never even would have though of doing so unless I was trying to understand what was said on a episode of AEW (wrestling show btw). Yeah I know a weird way to come here. With that being said, this has to be one of the best examples of white privilege. Six years!? Only 6 years of jail after doing all of that horrible and disgusting things to women? Either that and/or poor police and legal & judicial procedures. Victims afraid to come forward? WTF!?
The old geezer
Les Cargill
> WTF r u talking about????
>
Fulla The Illinois Enema Bandit Juice
He just be pumpin' every one of 'em up with all the bag
Fulla The Illinois Enema Bandit Juice"
( washes hands)
--
Les Cargill