Ce'Nedra's Immortality(Mortality???)
Bruce Murphy
this because of the scene in Torak's resting place, when Belgarath
fought with whoever killed Durnik.
If you will remember, Belgarath split open the ground and they
both fell in. When Belgarath explained what he had done later in the
conversation, it turned out he had buried the other guy alive and made
sure that the other guy would never die. This suggested that he had in
effect buried him for all time.
Bruce Murphy
--
*************************************.************************************
* mur...@zeus.franklin.edu |...................................*
* Bruce Murphy |...................................*
Duncan MacRae
>
>I'd imagine that sooner or later, Garion and Ce'Nedra are going to abdicate
>and wander around the world for fun as wolves.
>
Considering Ce'Nedra's temperment, I really doubt she would take to
roaming about and eating raw rabbits. Also, although I agree that Garion
could alter Ce'Nedra's form, I doubt she would let him. Remember, she would
not even let him change the color of her hair.
--
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\ Duncan MacRae -- University of Chicago -- dc...@quads.uchicago.edu \
\ Intelligence is not all that important in the exercise of power, \
\ and is often, in point of fact, useless. -- Henry Kissinger \
Aaron Wong
I don't think Garion would have any problem making Ce'Nedra immortal as well.
I'd imagine that sooner or later, Garion and Ce'Nedra are going to abdicate
and wander around the world for fun as wolves.
NGOK
Kintair of Hawkehaven MKA Bill Hately
>In article <1992Jun2.2...@wuecl.wustl.edu> an...@cec1.wustl.edu
(Aaron Wong) writes:
>>
>>I'd imagine that sooner or later, Garion and Ce'Nedra are going to abdicate
>>and wander around the world for fun as wolves.
secure that his son will lead properly he will abdicate. (Don't ya just love
talking about Fantasy characters in present tense)
>>
> Considering Ce'Nedra's temperment, I really doubt she would take to
> roaming about and eating raw rabbits. Also, although I agree that Garion
>could alter Ce'Nedra's form, I doubt she would let him. Remember, she would
>not even let him change the color of her hair.
>
Besides, don't you think Ce'Nedra would love being a flaming-Red furred Wolf
Kintair of Hawkehaven | Bill Hately | Talk (403) 381-1741
Shire of Windwyrm | Lethbridge AB | proct_...@hg.uleth.ca
Crown Principality of Avacal | Canada | Smile Dammit
An Tir (I knew I spelled it wrong)
Life is a Sexually Transmitted Terminal Condition
Evan Day -PANDION SOFTWARE
following this group I feel obligated to put in my $.02
If Garion is going to live forever and there is some way to make Ce'Nedra
immortal as well, why the hell, back in the beginning of the Malloreon, was
there a big deal over an heir to the throne? If Garion isn't going to die
then there is really no need for him to have a kid who may not end up having
sorcery and die before his own father.
Just a thought...
Evan
--
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Terry Yeung
In a previous article, mur...@zeus.franklin.edu (Bruce Murphy) says:
> If you will remember, Belgarath split open the ground and they
>both fell in. When Belgarath explained what he had done later in the
>conversation, it turned out he had buried the other guy alive and made
>sure that the other guy would never die. This suggested that he had in
>effect buried him for all time.
>
>
>Bruce Murphy
I think you are mistaken in this case. The person that
Belgarath buried was Zedar. Zedar was a sorcerer and therefore could
live as long as he wanted to. That is why they book made it sound as
if he was going to be buried there alive for all time. But then he
could just give up his will to live and die like any of the other
sorcerers who have died.
--
--
Terry Yeung \ Internet: ter...@ocf.berkeley.edu
External Affairs Chair Cal-Animage UCB\ Or: ar...@cleveland.freenet.edu
Anime Expo '92 Registration Supervisor \ FidoNet: Terry Yeung @ 1:125/28
Matt Kimmel
>If Garion is going to live forever and there is some way to make Ce'Nedra
>immortal as well, why the hell, back in the beginning of the Malloreon, was
>there a big deal over an heir to the throne? If Garion isn't going to die
>then there is really no need for him to have a kid who may not end up having
>sorcery and die before his own father.
Well, don't forget--Garion could be killed (admittedly, his murderer
would have to be pretty powerful), or die of other unnatural causes.
While we're on the subject of immortality, there's something that I've
been wondering about: it's been a while since I read the Malloreon, but
I seem to remember Belgarath saying that his task 'was over'. Does that
mean he's going to kick the bucket soon? Or will he just live on
indefinitely anyway?
-Matt
--
Matt Kimmel University of Massachusetts Amherst, MA
Internet: a10...@titan.ucc.umass.edu
Phillip Wade Yarrington
>following this group I feel obligated to put in my $.02
>
>If Garion is going to live forever and there is some way to make Ce'Nedra
>immortal as well, why the hell, back in the beginning of the Malloreon, was
>there a big deal over an heir to the throne? If Garion isn't going to die
>then there is really no need for him to have a kid who may not end up having
>sorcery and die before his own father.
>
>Just a thought...
>
>Evan
>
Would you want to rule a kingdom for several thousands of years?
I think that Garion would eventually retire and settle down with
is wife and other family (except his heir) in the Vale.
-phil
----------------------------------------------------------------
You are in a position to demand nothing sir,
I, on the other hand, am in a position to grant .. nothing.
-Khan Singh
Marc Wandschneider
> Garion or Belgarath should be able to make her immortal. I say
>this because of the scene in Torak's resting place, when Belgarath
>fought with whoever killed Durnik.
> If you will remember, Belgarath split open the ground and they
>both fell in. When Belgarath explained what he had done later in the
>conversation, it turned out he had buried the other guy alive and made
>sure that the other guy would never die. This suggested that he had in
>effect buried him for all time.
One of the things that has always bothered me while reading these books
is the fact that Belgarion is likely to live quite long, whereas we have had NO
suggestions (as far as I have seen) that Ce'Nedra will follow.
While it does appear that the Dryads live for quite a long time, it
hasn't been quite so clear that the members of the Royal family, whom are all
part dryad, will live so long.
As for the point about Zedar, one has to also consider that the Sorcerers really don't appear to have any sort of limit on Age, so Belgarath's Stoning
him as it were really isn't all that remarkable.
It would be neat to see what happens. One would suspect that if he were to continue the series, that he would definitely have to come up with some way around this.
D
D
D
part druid, live so long.
Kevin Happe
>While we're on the subject of immortality, there's something that I've
>been wondering about: it's been a while since I read the Malloreon, but
>I seem to remember Belgarath saying that his task 'was over'. Does that
>mean he's going to kick the bucket soon? Or will he just live on
>indefinitely anyway?
I think since Poledra is around now, he will probalbly spend
at least a couple of centuries getting reaquainted:)
--
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The Wyrm Ouroboros
>In article <1992Jun2.2...@zeus.franklin.edu> mur...@zeus.franklin.edu (Bruce Murphy) writes:
>> Garion or Belgarath should be able to make her immortal. I say
>>this because of the scene in Torak's resting place, when Belgarath
>>fought with whoever killed Durnik.
That was Zedar. Which has been pointed out.
>> If you will remember, Belgarath split open the ground and they
>>both fell in. When Belgarath explained what he had done later in the
>>conversation, it turned out he had buried the other guy alive and made
>>sure that the other guy would never die. This suggested that he had in
>>effect buried him for all time.
>
> One of the things that has always bothered me while reading these books
>is the fact that Belgarion is likely to live quite long, whereas we have had NO
>suggestions (as far as I have seen) that Ce'Nedra will follow.
>
> While it does appear that the Dryads live for quite a long time, it
>hasn't been quite so clear that the members of the Royal family, whom are all
>part dryad, will live so long.
>
> As for the point about Zedar, one has to also consider that the Sorcerers really don't appear to have any sort of limit on Age, so Belgarath's Stoning
>him as it were really isn't all that remarkable.
>
> It would be neat to see what happens. One would suspect that if he were to continue the series, that he would definitely have to come up with some way around this.
Actually, if you think about it.....remember those two acorns, "gifts from the
trees themselves", that intertwined and represented Garion and X'Nedra? If
the one is linked to him, and he's immortal....wouldn't it be? And, since the
two are intertwined, with their sap/lifeblood mixed together, wouldn't that
effectively make the second one also immortal? And if that's the one that our
flamehaired little firepot is going to live as long as.... Hmmm. :) Makes
for some interesting logic.
Oh, and "..until the end of days" seems pretty emphatic. This is .Belgarath.
folks. The Eternal Man. Short of the Gods and the Orb, and perhaps Garion,
his is the premiere will on the planet. I get the feeling that he's forced
Zedar to live forever, and to be entombed forever within the rock. Yeah,
that's horrid. But so was what he did to Durnik.
The Wyrm Ouroboros
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Mathex@PernMUSH Belgarath@TheBelgariad Shadowkiss@TwoMoons
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Whaddaya mean, I haven't found the Orb yet??"
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
T.F. Eccles
>In article <1992Jun2.2...@zeus.franklin.edu> mur...@zeus.franklin.edu (Bruce Murphy) writes:
>> Garion or Belgarath should be able to make her immortal. I say
>>this because of the scene in Torak's resting place, when Belgarath
>>fought with whoever killed Durnik.
>> If you will remember, Belgarath split open the ground and they
>>both fell in. When Belgarath explained what he had done later in the
>>conversation, it turned out he had buried the other guy alive and made
>>sure that the other guy would never die. This suggested that he had in
>>effect buried him for all time.
> One of the things that has always bothered me while reading these books
>is the fact that Belgarion is likely to live quite long, whereas we have had NO
>suggestions (as far as I have seen) that Ce'Nedra will follow.
> While it does appear that the Dryads live for quite a long time, it
>hasn't been quite so clear that the members of the Royal family, whom are all
>part dryad, will live so long.
Garion mentioned this in Seeress of Kell, when talking with Silk about
the no of daughterts he was likely to have. He mentioned that Xbel was 300 years
old, and still of childbearinbg age, then Ce'Nedra would be the same.
A more interesting point, I think would be - when/is Garion going to
abdicate for his son - or rule for a very long timew.
> As for the point about Zedar, one has to also consider that the Sorcerers really don't appear to have any sort of limit on Age, so Belgarath's Stoning
>him as it were really isn't all that remarkable.
Yep, that was what I t hoguht.
Eccles
D. J. Trindle
>
>[...]
>I get the feeling that [Belgarath] forced
>Zedar to live forever, and to be entombed forever within the rock. Yeah,
>that's horrid. But so was what he did to Durnik.
>
>The Wyrm Ouroboros
This is a point which has always baffled me. Zedar didn't do
anything extraordinary to Durnik: he KILLED him. God forbid, eh? After
all, Belgarath & Co. hacked, stabbed, and burned their way through legions
of redshirts, as well as several major characters, to get to that point in
the series, right?
I suppose it's the killing off of a major character who's on the
side of the good guys that's _verboten_. But it still seems to me that
Zedar's punishment was a bit out of proportion: he kills Durnik--
temporarily, as it turns out--and gets buried alive until the end of the
world. I mean, isn't that a bit of an overreaction?
-D.J.T.
Gilles Montsion
to Torak.........
W. Stirling
>
> This is a point which has always baffled me. Zedar didn't do
>anything extraordinary to Durnik: he KILLED him. God forbid, eh? After
>all, Belgarath & Co. hacked, stabbed, and burned their way through legions
>of redshirts, as well as several major characters, to get to that point in
>the series, right?
>
> I suppose it's the killing off of a major character who's on the
>side of the good guys that's _verboten_. But it still seems to me that
>Zedar's punishment was a bit out of proportion: he kills Durnik--
>temporarily, as it turns out--and gets buried alive until the end of the
>world. I mean, isn't that a bit of an overreaction?
I think it was the proverbial "straw that broke the camel's back".
Zedar had done some pretty nasty things, but it's hard to
kill/maim/imprison forever a man in such a wretched state as Zedar was
at the tomb... Until he went and killed someone.
I think that Durnik was not only "special" from the reader's point as
a main character, but he was also special for Polgara and Belgarath,
and in this fashion they stopped acting like superior beings and for
once showed that they were capable of losing control of their
emotions. Had Zedar killed, say, an Arendish serf at the tomb
instead of Durnik, Belgarath's reacting *might* not have been as
severe. Who knows?
"And tomorrow never comes..." - The Durutti Column
Parik Rao
> This is a point which has always baffled me. Zedar didn't do
>anything extraordinary to Durnik: he KILLED him. God forbid, eh? After
>all, Belgarath & Co. hacked, stabbed, and burned their way through legions
>of redshirts, as well as several major characters, to get to that point in
>the series, right?
> I suppose it's the killing off of a major character who's on the
>side of the good guys that's _verboten_. But it still seems to me that
>Zedar's punishment was a bit out of proportion: he kills Durnik--
>temporarily, as it turns out--and gets buried alive until the end of the
>world. I mean, isn't that a bit of an overreaction?
Well, I suppose the justification is more than just the killing of Durnik.
Zedar betrayed Belgarath (went over to Torak), stole the orb (although we
find out later its really the prophecy/Eriond), and who knows what else
when he was a disciple of Aldur (he might have flirted with Poledra... :).
I think it would have been better, story-wise, if Durnik were not revived.
Thats one thing that pissed me off about the last book in Malloreon,
Toth died to make way for Zakath (as the seeress's companion). Granted,
the technical reason is that Durnik died thru "sorcery" and Toth got a
sword stuck in him (in a very dumb attack). But still, I would guess that
the orb/gods would easily be able to fix up Toth. But nope, he's baggage
so off he goes! As if Zedar's sorcery didn't do some sort of permanent
damage to Durnik. And how did he get his newfound magical ability?
Garion could start a new trade, "Sorcerors'R'Us". He'll kill you,
revive you, and you'll become a sorceror (plus live forever!) for only
100 gold pieces.
I suppose its Eddings style, but not enough protagonists died in the book.
We see the rewards everyone gets, but very little of the hardships.
i.e., one memorable scene is at the end of one of the shannara's (wishsong?)
when everyone (-2) dies in a race to get to the well...
--
parik rao pr...@bluemoon.ucsb.edu
W. Stirling
>Garion could start a new trade, "Sorcerors'R'Us". He'll kill you,
>revive you, and you'll become a sorceror (plus live forever!) for only
>100 gold pieces.
>
Yeah, and all he'll need to do it is the presence of Aldur, UL or
someone similar to okay the deal... Unless he wants pretty dangerous
enemies :-)
Seriously, though, I agree with you. I was relieved at the end of the
Elenium when a certain character was NOT raised from the dead (a
friend of mine who was reading "Sapphire Rose" at the same time I was
had a small wager that this certain indvidual would be brought back to
life... I, for one, was happy (for once) to see a real Eddings
character from book one of a series DIE and STAY DEAD (not that I had
anything against the character, just the silly "and they all lived
happily ever after..." that seemed to pervade throughout his first two
series'.)
I'm not into gore and tragedy, I just enjoy reading more when I can
identify with a character who is depending solely on himself/herself.
Sticking deaths christianed by prophecy in the final pages of each of
the books has always been one of the (extremley few, mind you!) cheap
aspects of the way Eddings handled the series'. The surprise death in
the Sapphire Rose was a deviation from style that made the series more
enjoyable.
Kintair of Hawkehaven MKA Bill Hately
(even if at that point in time it was by getting her mad at him) I think as far
as Belgarath was concerned - at that point - it was how Durniks death would
affect Pol as much as anything else (and possibly a little revenge for
leaving their master)
Gail Miyamoto
>>> If you will remember, Belgarath split open the ground and they
>>>both fell in. When Belgarath explained what he had done later in the
>>>conversation, it turned out he had buried the other guy alive and made
>>>sure that the other guy would never die. This suggested that he had in
>>>effect buried him for all time.
Actually, the reason given for Zedar's being stuck down there for all
time was, according to Belgarath, "Sorcery is thought, and no man can
exactly duplicate the thought of another." The fact that he will be
alive for all time has to do with Zedar's being a sorcerer, I think.
Probably, Zedar could escape only one way - by willing himself to
nonexistance (If I remember correctly, this is what a couple of
Belgarath's brothers did several thousand years before the story).
I did have one question about Belgarion's life expectancy, though.
In the last book of the Malloreon, the spirit of the prophecy said
something about how Eriond's religion would spread to take over the
whole world. It said to Belgarion that he would "probably" live long
enough to see it spread through the world. Does this suggest that
maybe he won't live that long?
- Gail
ca...@carina.unm.edu
act that Belgarath did what he did to Zedar. The had a long standing
hatred for each other. You don't Zedar would of done anything less
to Belgarath if he had been able?
As far as Belgarath 'forcing' Zedar to live for ever. Why should Zedar
be any different from the rest of the wizards' life span's?
Cary
Ilana Jayne Rosenshein
>
>
> I suppose it's the killing off of a major character who's on the
>side of the good guys that's _verboten_. But it still seems to me that
>Zedar's punishment was a bit out of proportion: he kills Durnik--
>temporarily, as it turns out--and gets buried alive until the end of the
>world. I mean, isn't that a bit of an overreaction?
>
> -D.J.T.
I don't think so, no. After all, it wasn't just a reaction to Zedar's
killing Durnik. It was also a reaction to Zedar's betrayal of their
trust. Once upon a time Zedar *was* Belzedar, and like a brother to
Belgarath. If you look at Belgarath's treatment of Zedar from that
angle, I would say Zedar got off lightly.
Ilana
Gregory Barron
I thought Zedar was entombed not just for Durnik but for betraying Aldur,
stealing the orb and leading the world to the brink of destruction!
Am I the only one who sees this? :)
Greg
/////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
Ex Minister of Propaganda for the QMS Emperor. sigs are overated. 1st yrs suck:)
/////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
Andrew Langton
>t-m...@microsoft.com (Marc Wandschneider) writes:
>
>>In article <1992Jun2.2...@zeus.franklin.edu> mur...@zeus.franklin.edu (Bruce Murphy) writes:
>> While it does appear that the Dryads live for quite a long time, it
>>hasn't been quite so clear that the members of the Royal family, whom are all
>>part dryad, will live so long.
>
>Garion mentioned this in Seeress of Kell, when talking with Silk about
>the no of daughterts he was likely to have. He mentioned that Xbel was 300 years
>old, and still of childbearinbg age, then Ce'Nedra would be the same.
I think it would be harder for a Dryad (or half-Dryad) to become pregnant.
Just look at how long it took Ce'Nedra, and what they had to go through to
get their son.
>A more interesting point, I think would be - when/is Garion going to
>abdicate for his son - or rule for a very long timew.
Probably abdicate, I think. He isn't really very fond of ruling anyway, so
will give it up when he thinks his son's old enough.
>> As for the point about Zedar, one has to also consider that the Sorcerers really don't appear to have any sort of limit on Age, so Belgarath's Stoning
>>him as it were really isn't all that remarkable.
>Yep, that was what I t hoguht.
They must have some limit on age, otherwise they'd be everywhere. Say
perhaps 10, - 20,000 years? Or perhaps their life is only a couple of
thousand years if they aren't disciples of a God???
One new point - I really loved the Belgariad and Mallorean, but one thing
that began to get at me after a while was the stupidity of the characters.
They never could see the most obvious solutions to simple problems. The
eElenium also suffered from this. Anyone else notice this or am I just
picky?
Andrew
--
"I severed my leg to win a | "The Scottish Drinking Song" :
One legged race | - Doug Anthony All Stars
And when I won I stitched it |------------------------------------------
Right back into place.." | alan...@laurel.ocs.mq.edu.au
Johne Tsau
I have to agree, that Zedar's punishment was extreme. Yes, Zedar was evil.
Yes, Zedar killed Durnik. Yes, Zedar stole the Orb. But lets look at
the facts...
Zedar originally left the Brotherhood of Sorcerers to try to get the Orb
back away from Torak. It was Torak who overcame Zedar's will and bent
him to his own will. After that, Zedar was a servant of Torak, but it
seemed to me he did them all with regret.
Polgara herself said that she might be bent to Toraks will should he win, but
a part of her would probably be screaming til the end of days.
And lets not forget... Polgara might have considered this a cop-out... but
was he not destined to do it??
--
Johne... (The Margrave)
"If you know anyone hiring engineers in the Spring of 1992,
slip my name in..."
UNIX Address : ts...@cae.wisc.edu (fingerable)
Novell Address : j...@caestaff.engr.wisc.edu
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Work Phone : (608) 262-5349
T.F. Eccles
>In <1992Jun10.1...@muddcs.claremont.edu> dtri...@jarthur.claremont.edu (D. J. Trindle) writes:
>I think it would have been better, story-wise, if Durnik were not revived.
How about this for a reason - reviving Durnik gives justification for
the return of the Marags. Remember the scene - it gave Eddings a way
to dramtically give Belgarath a way (recursion anyone?) to announce that
the Marags weren't all dead - esp to Mara.
Interesting way of leading to a sequel?
Eccles
Ron Bruce
I think that the punishment fit the crime. You think that what Belgarath
did was an overreaction, but I don't think so. *I* think that Belgarath
knew how his daughter felt about Durnik, that is why he pressed her to say
why Durnik was special. Polgara wouldn't admit it to herself.
With this in mind, I think that Belgarath was ultimately willing to make
Durnik a part of the family, sooner or later, at any cost so that Polgara
was happy. When Durnik was killed, Belgarath reacted as a Father-In-Law
would (and should), because Zedar robbed his daughter of one of the few
things that she loved. And something that was dear to him, too.
So, to sum it up, I think that Belgarath's punishment fit what Zedar did.
This is all IMHO, of course.
Ron
--
R. Bruce bru...@jacobs.cs.orst.edu
IMHO An opinion is like a certain part | Do Not Taunt Happy-Fun-Ball |
of the anatomy: everyone has one. |______________________________|
Matt Houlahan
I've always had one problem with the entombed ni rock thing. Why didn't
Zedar just do something else to get himself out? If he couldn't do exactly what
Belgarath did, then why didn't he translocate himself or something similar?
I think that Garion will live as long as Ce'Nedra does. Since she is part
Dryad, that could be a few centuries or so. That seems about lng enough for
Eriond to grow a following. One more thing: I don't think that Belgarath's
brothers willed theselves into nonexistence. It says (if I remember correctly)
that they just stopped caring or just gave up. That implies that they did not
actively destroy themselves.
One question for all of you: several times in the Belgariad and Mallorean,
it is mentioned that if the quest to defeat Torak or Zandramas suceeds, then
they will all live to see something wonderful happen. But at the end of the
Mallorean, all that they will see will be the florishing of a new religion.
What is the "wonderful thing"? The birth of a new god? the death of
Zandramas/Torak? What?
-=Matt=-
Bonnie Jean Wallace
[Lots o' stuff deleted]
>
> One question for all of you: several times in the Belgariad and Mallorean,
>it is mentioned that if the quest to defeat Torak or Zandramas suceeds, then
>they will all live to see something wonderful happen. But at the end of the
>Mallorean, all that they will see will be the florishing of a new religion.
>What is the "wonderful thing"? The birth of a new god? the death of
>Zandramas/Torak? What?
> -=Matt=-
My guess would be the end of the senseless ritual sacrifice and pain
of the Angarak religion (which did not end with Torak's death) and
the general improvement in overall quality of life for the entire
eastern half (or so) of their world. A god of hate replaced with
a god of love.
-Bonnie
bon...@cco.caltech.edu
T.F. Eccles
>In article <ins450m....@aurora.cc.monash.edu.au> ins...@aurora.cc.monash.edu.au (T.F. Eccles) writes:
>>t-m...@microsoft.com (Marc Wandschneider) writes:
>>
>>>In article <1992Jun2.2...@zeus.franklin.edu> mur...@zeus.franklin.edu (Bruce Murphy) writes:
>>> While it does appear that the Dryads live for quite a long time, it
>>>hasn't been quite so clear that the members of the Royal family, whom are all
>>>part dryad, will live so long.
>>
>>Garion mentioned this in Seeress of Kell, when talking with Silk about
>>the no of daughterts he was likely to have. He mentioned that Xbel was 300 years
>>old, and still of childbearinbg age, then Ce'Nedra would be the same.
>I think it would be harder for a Dryad (or half-Dryad) to become pregnant.
>Just look at how long it took Ce'Nedra, and what they had to go through to
>get their son.
A dryad becomes pregnant if the appropriate ....um... acts are commited
:) at the right time - ie in late winter ealry spring, when her tree is
fertile. I think the main reason fro Ce'Nedra s long delay has been solved -
the tree now has soil from the wood of the dryads as well as water - maybe
a special enzyme in the soil to trigger the dryads tree's fertility?
>>A more interesting point, I think would be - when/is Garion going to
>>abdicate for his son - or rule for a very long timew.
>Probably abdicate, I think. He isn't really very fond of ruling anyway, so
>will give it up when he thinks his son's old enough.
I'll go with that.
>>> As for the point about Zedar, one has to also consider that the Sorcerers really don't appear to have any sort of limit on Age, so Belgarath's Stoning
>>>him as it were really isn't all that remarkable.
>>Yep, that was what I t hoguht.
>They must have some limit on age, otherwise they'd be everywhere. Say
>perhaps 10, - 20,000 years? Or perhaps their life is only a couple of
>thousand years if they aren't disciples of a God???
Well, there aren't that many of them to begin with.....
Nope Senji's 4,800 years old, and he's not a disciple.
Most of the Grolims are no good at sorcery - besides they die
if you stab them enough.......
>One new point - I really loved the Belgariad and Mallorean, but one thing
>that began to get at me after a while was the stupidity of the characters.
>They never could see the most obvious solutions to simple problems. The
>eElenium also suffered from this. Anyone else notice this or am I just
>picky?
How many fantasy novels have you read......?
I've tended to notice that peopl who have read alot can
pick what's happening or going to happen.
How about 'The Place that Is NO More' - I thought it
was going to be Vo Wacune - it would make a change from having it in Mallorea
Eccles
Aaron Wigley
mind, that Garion asked Belgarath once about his age. Belgarath's reply
was something along the lines of "We live as long as we have to".
,-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- The Wigs of Oz =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-.
| Aaron Wigley 2nd Year BCSE, Monash University Clayton |
| Email: ins...@aurora.cc.monash.edu.au or |
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Kintair of Hawkehaven MKA Bill Hately
did something or other at the high places of Korim which are no more. (My
sister missed that too)
Me once again
T.F. Eccles
>Correct me if I'm wrong, but I seem to recall from my exam befuddled
>mind, that Garion asked Belgarath once about his age. Belgarath's reply
>was something along the lines of "We live as long as we have to".
Yeah, although it might have been Polgara, saying we live
so long because we have things to do that take that long......
>| Aaron Wigley 2nd Year BCSE, Monash University Clayton |
^^^^^^^^^^^^
Ugh
:)
Eccles
T.F. Eccles
>In article <ins450m....@aurora.cc.monash.edu.au>,
>ins...@aurora.cc.monash.edu.au (T.F. Eccles) writes:
>>alan...@laurel.ocs.mq.edu.au (Andrew Langton) writes:
>>
>>>In article <ins450m....@aurora.cc.monash.edu.au> ins...@aurora.cc.monash.edu.au (T.F. Eccles) writes:
>>>>t-m...@microsoft.com (Marc Wandschneider) writes:
>>>>
>>>>>In article <1992Jun2.2...@zeus.franklin.edu>
>>>>>mur...@zeus.franklin.edu (Bruce Murphy) writes:
>>>One new point - I really loved the Belgariad and Mallorean, but one thing
>>>that began to get at me after a while was the stupidity of the characters.
>>>They never could see the most obvious solutions to simple problems. The
>>>eElenium also suffered from this. Anyone else notice this or am I just
>>>picky?
>>How many fantasy novels have you read......?
>>I've tended to notice that peopl who have read alot can
>>pick what's happening or going to happen.
>>How about 'The Place that Is NO More' - I thought it
>>was going to be Vo Wacune - it would make a change from having it in Mallorea
>>
>>Eccles
>Nah, that was actually "given away" in one of the Prologs - Torak went up and
>did something or other at the high places of Korim which are no more. (My
>sister missed that too)
>Me once again
Are you sure?
I don't read the prologs, becasue they give too much away. Well, I read
them afterwards, not before.
Eccles
kenneth deegan
>Correct me if I'm wrong, but I seem to recall from my exam befuddled
>mind, that Garion asked Belgarath once about his age. Belgarath's reply
>was something along the lines of "We live as long as we have to".
>
eventually abdicate in favour of his son. I see him and Ce'Nedra
becoming being very busy with all of the girls anyways (do know
how much traveling will be involved with finding suitable husbands
for all of them??). As for the life span, I figure that Ce'Nedra could
live for 400-500 years. After she dies I see Garion ceasing his own life
because life without her would have no meaning. This is why Eddings
had to bring Poledra back. If he did not Belgarath would have killed
himself at the end of the Mallorean to be with her (what with him
having lived as long as he had to), This would have contradicted Eddings
seeming like for happy endings.
Jonathan Forbes
I noticed that as well, but I was very lucky when I started reading Pawn of
Prophecy; a friend had told me to read it, and when I started, I wasn't too
enthusiastic, so although I read the prologue, it didn't really "sink in" very
deeply (but enough for me to have a general gist of what was going on).
I think I got the maximum enjoyment out of the book, because I didn't realise
who Belgarath and Polgara were, since I didn't pick up on the wolfishness and the
white lock in the prologue, but when I actually found out, all the stuff from the
prologue came back, and I said "of course...". But such a surprise was very
enjoyable.
--
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Jonathan Forbes | Communications Research Centre
Waterloo Electrical Engineering | Ottawa, Ontario, Canada, Earth
Email: jona...@sparky.dgbt.doc.ca | Planet 779169751568816422619-3
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Jonathan Forbes
About happy endings; in Seeress of Kell, once the actual "deed" was done, I looked
at how much book there was left to read. It turned out to be a whole bunch of
mushy mushy stuff, which is all right I suppose, but there was an awful lot of
it with no real plot at the end.
On a totally unrelated note about Garion Ce'Nedra, I was rather miffed at the
whole scene early in the series, about them having children. I wish they had
just done it the "normal" way. I kept thinking, "Geez, Garion...".
gmc...@bnr.ca
|> How about 'The Place that Is NO More' - I thought it
|> was going to be Vo Wacune - it would make a change from having it in Mallorea
|>
|> Eccles
Along the same lines, I was sure that the Arends living in Perivor were going
to be Wacites. Especially since Polgara repeatedly mentioned how much she
missed them.
Just my gut feeling leading me astray......
Calvin
Ross T. Bunker
>
> This is a point which has always baffled me. Zedar didn't do
>anything extraordinary to Durnik: he KILLED him. God forbid, eh? After
>all, Belgarath & Co. hacked, stabbed, and burned their way through legions
>of redshirts, as well as several major characters, to get to that point in
>the series, right?
>
>
> -D.J.T.
I think another important thing is HOW Zedar killed him. From the
description I believe Zedar just basically willed him dead. Durnik, being
an ordinary man at this time could have no defense against such an attack.
You never saw Belgarath or Polgara or Garion going around WILLING people
dead. They always used swords or something else physical to defend
themselves. This may seem irrelevant (dead is dead), but I think that for
these all powerful sorcerors it is an important point.
Recall that Belgarath said something like "you've never killed anyone
before Pol..." when she wanted to kill Zedar. I think this is what he meant.
My 2 cents.
:)ross
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Kintair of Hawkehaven MKA Bill Hately
>In article <1992Jun10.1...@muddcs.claremont.edu>
dtri...@jarthur.claremont.edu (D. J. Trindle) writes:
>>
>[stuff deleted]
>> This is a point which has always baffled me. Zedar didn't do
>>anything extraordinary to Durnik: he KILLED him. God forbid, eh? After
>>all, Belgarath & Co. hacked, stabbed, and burned their way through legions
>>of redshirts, as well as several major characters, to get to that point in
>>the series, right?
>>
>[stuff deleted]
>before Pol..." when she wanted to kill Zedar. I think this is what he meant.
>
>My 2 cents.
Don't forget the little incident where Pol snapped the Grolims mind and he
Jumped off Cthol Mishrak. (Personally I'd say she did a fair job of killing
him (even if it wasn't first hand) - Belgarath made a mis-statement there.)
Oh yeah, for those of you interesteded in where DE first said where the Place
which is no more is here goes:
"... The peoples who were mine called themselves Angaraks. I was well pleased
with them and I led them to the High places of Korim which are no more..."
(Prolog from Enchanters Endgame "Exerpts from the Book of Torak") I think all
our Sorcerers were a little slow on the uptake to miss that one.
Bill
T.F. Eccles
>In article <43...@daily-planet.concordia.ca>, k_de...@bessel.concordia.ca (kenneth deegan) writes:
>|> In article <1992Jun16.1...@monu6.cc.monash.edu.au> ins...@aurora.cc.monash.edu.au (Aaron Wigley) writes:
>About happy endings; in Seeress of Kell, once the actual "deed" was done, I looked
>at how much book there was left to read. It turned out to be a whole bunch of
>mushy mushy stuff, which is all right I suppose, but there was an awful lot of
>it with no real plot at the end.
Tieing up ends only. Moderately interesting, but no surprises.
>On a totally unrelated note about Garion Ce'Nedra, I was rather miffed at the
>whole scene early in the series, about them having children. I wish they had
>just done it the "normal" way. I kept thinking, "Geez, Garion...".
>--From what I've read - they tried - many times :)
But Ce'Nedra was a Dryad, and it don't no work, Jim.
Eccles aka Hates VI
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HOANG NGO
>About happy endings; in Seeress of Kell, once the actual "deed" was done, I looked
>at how much book there was left to read. It turned out to be a whole bunch of
>mushy mushy stuff, which is all right I suppose, but there was an awful lot of
>it with no real plot at the end.
I think you are wrong there for when the last page of the Seeress
of Kell came about, Belgarth says ( don't quote me ) that Polgara had
looked after so many children, not her own, she had to have children of her
own to really know the feelings of motherhood. In the grolim side of the
prophecy, she was to be a bride of Torak and as such would not know the
joys of motherhood. Didn't it seem strange to you that after the final
confrontation, that both a dryad who had sereve difficulties getting
pregnant the first time around and a soccerous who had none would suddenly
get pregnant ?
Can others please give me their thoughts on the ramifications of
the final meeting on Korim.
/\ / / /\ / ________/\ 'What is life, but,
/ \ / / / \ / / / \ an excuse for death,
/ \ / / / \ / \ / /----\ What is death, but,
/ \/ / / \/ \_/ / \ an escape from life.'
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