Blog/rant/lament
Dover Beach
upset and I'm just going to blog about it for a second. I'll try not to
do this too much. I like to use AFCA to escape my problems, not
intensify them.
So Saturday my mom was back in the ER. Long boring story short: she has
a spinal compression fracture and probably a blood clot in her lung.
Her oxygenation is bad; that's why the doc (whom I actually know and
trust) thinks blood clot. Can't see any blood clots in her legs using
sonogram and doc doesn't want to inject dye and do whatever the other
scan is because the dye is murder on elderly kidneys. Even if they
found a clot the deal is she'd just have to be put on warfarin, which is
a bad idea for people who fall down a lot. I said, "so the choice is
between ischemic stroke and hemorrhagic stroke, right?" and Doc. Heidi
said, "you got it".
There's nothing really to do about the terribly painful spinal
compression fracture. They can inflate the spine and inject cement but
that doesn't always work, it's a majorish procedure, and can cause other
problems. Doc Heidi wants to go easy on the narcotics. Meanwhile the
social workers and I have to dig up a nursing home because she can't go
back to assisted living.
But! Here's what I'm actually upset about. I sent a longer email to my
sister last night outlining all of this, and here's the response, in its
entirety, that I got back this morning:
"Thanks for the update. Let me know if I need to do anything.
<Boyfriend> wants to buy the airline tickets for Christmas (I realize
this is not the top of your priorities right now). We will probably fly
in and out on the same day. Some possible choices are Dec. 24, Dec 25 or
Dec. 16. Of course it's cheaper the 16th. What do you think?"
OKAY. Am I alone in thinking this doesn't really constitute an adequate
response? I'm on the verge of just writing this woman off. Have you
ever written a sibling off? I can't quite bring myself to do it but I'm
thisclose. It goes without saying, I suppose, that she only comes out
here twice a year, never calls, never writes, never emails.
--
Dover
ra...@westnet.poe.com
<snip>
> "Thanks for the update. Let me know if I need to do anything.
> <Boyfriend> wants to buy the airline tickets for Christmas (I realize
> this is not the top of your priorities right now). We will probably fly
> in and out on the same day. Some possible choices are Dec. 24, Dec 25 or
> Dec. 16. Of course it's cheaper the 16th. What do you think?"
> OKAY. Am I alone in thinking this doesn't really constitute an adequate
> response? I'm on the verge of just writing this woman off. Have you
> ever written a sibling off? I can't quite bring myself to do it but I'm
> thisclose. It goes without saying, I suppose, that she only comes out
> here twice a year, never calls, never writes, never emails.
Two of my sibs are dead and buried. I was never especially close to them,
but didn't take too many pains to distance myself.
Learn to accept: so they're distant and not what you'd call adequately
involved in things you find important. OK. Deal with it, becuase no
matter what you do, they'll still be your sibling.
Twice a year visits are more than Richard or Robert give me nowadays,
(halloween is over, so can the zombie jokes) tho they're in my thoughts a
bit more than that.
John
--
Remove the dead poet to e-mail, tho CC'd posts are unwelcome.
Mean People Suck - It takes two deviations to get cool.
Ask me about joining the NRA.
Anny Middon
news:Xns98735ADC2DB3mo...@130.133.1.4...
> In general I try to be entertaining in here (shut UP), but I'm very
> upset and I'm just going to blog about it for a second. I'll try not to
> do this too much. I like to use AFCA to escape my problems, not
> intensify them.
>
> So Saturday my mom was back in the ER. Long boring story short: she has
> a spinal compression fracture and probably a blood clot in her lung.
> Her oxygenation is bad; that's why the doc (whom I actually know and
> trust) thinks blood clot. Can't see any blood clots in her legs using
> sonogram and doc doesn't want to inject dye and do whatever the other
> scan is because the dye is murder on elderly kidneys. Even if they
> found a clot the deal is she'd just have to be put on warfarin, which is
> a bad idea for people who fall down a lot. I said, "so the choice is
> between ischemic stroke and hemorrhagic stroke, right?" and Doc. Heidi
> said, "you got it".
That really sucks, Dover. I'm very sorry your mom isn't doing any better.
IANAD but I think there is a chance that the clots will break up naturally.
Although I suppose it's likely that whatever caused the clot to form will
cause future clots, it's not a given; if she can get through this she may be
okay for quite a while. At least that's something to hope for.
> There's nothing really to do about the terribly painful spinal
> compression fracture. They can inflate the spine and inject cement but
> that doesn't always work, it's a majorish procedure, and can cause other
> problems. Doc Heidi wants to go easy on the narcotics. Meanwhile the
> social workers and I have to dig up a nursing home because she can't go
> back to assisted living.
My thoughts and good wishes are with you and your mom.
>
> But! Here's what I'm actually upset about. I sent a longer email to my
> sister last night outlining all of this, and here's the response, in its
> entirety, that I got back this morning:
>
>
> "Thanks for the update. Let me know if I need to do anything.
> <Boyfriend> wants to buy the airline tickets for Christmas (I realize
> this is not the top of your priorities right now). We will probably fly
> in and out on the same day. Some possible choices are Dec. 24, Dec 25 or
> Dec. 16. Of course it's cheaper the 16th. What do you think?"
>
>
> OKAY. Am I alone in thinking this doesn't really constitute an adequate
> response? I'm on the verge of just writing this woman off. Have you
> ever written a sibling off? I can't quite bring myself to do it but I'm
> thisclose. It goes without saying, I suppose, that she only comes out
> here twice a year, never calls, never writes, never emails.
>
I don't know enough about your sister and your relationship and history with
her to speak to whether or not you should cut off ties with her.
I have nown however several people whose reaction to bad news was basically
to ignore it and hope it goes away. These folks tend to be pretty immature
and they never stand up and take action when you need them to. If later you
complain that they should have done such-and-such, their reaction is always
to say, "How was I supposed to know that you needed me to do that? You were
the one who was there. If you needed that, you should have told me so."
So maybe the thing for you to do is to figure out exactly what you want your
sister to do. Maybe that's to come and spend several days with your mom.
(If you haven't made it absolutely clear that if she doesn't spend time with
her mom now she may not get another chance, you may need to spell it out for
her.) Maybe you need her to help with the nursing home selection. Whatever
it is, she's asked you to tell her if she needs to do anything. So tell
her.
Anny
Veronique
Dover Beach wrote:
[mom's health and fears about]
Dover, I'm so sorry to hear about your mom.
> But! Here's what I'm actually upset about. I sent a longer email to my
> sister last night outlining all of this, and here's the response, in its
> entirety, that I got back this morning:
>
>
> "Thanks for the update. Let me know if I need to do anything.
> <Boyfriend> wants to buy the airline tickets for Christmas (I realize
> this is not the top of your priorities right now). We will probably fly
> in and out on the same day. Some possible choices are Dec. 24, Dec 25 or
> Dec. 16. Of course it's cheaper the 16th. What do you think?"
>
>
> OKAY. Am I alone in thinking this doesn't really constitute an adequate
> response? I'm on the verge of just writing this woman off. Have you
> ever written a sibling off? I can't quite bring myself to do it but I'm
> thisclose. It goes without saying, I suppose, that she only comes out
> here twice a year, never calls, never writes, never emails.
Welcome to the Sorority of Bizarre Sisters.
You've alluded to the uselessness of this particular sister...what was
her relationship with your mom? Is she completely self-centered with
everything? Can you write back (or call) and tell her you need her
moral support, someone to bounce ideas off of, financial help?
I'd be as furious as you are. My own sisterly issues tend to be the
opposite-- my sister blowing everything up into psychodrama for the joy
of embelleshment. But having your sister hang you out to dry
emotionally...wow.
V.
--
Veronique Chez Sheep
Bill Turlock
I concur, Annie, you've said everything that I would want to, but
better. Except maybe that Dover already knows how sis is going to
behave, and the stress is magnifying her reaction to the
behavior-as-usual. I know it would me. I don't think you "write a
sibling off" (although never having one...) based on this one
interaction. It is what it is...
Dover, you have my utmost sympathy, the situation really sucks,
and I hope for a positive resolution for you all.
Bill
Les Albert
wrote:
>In general I try to be entertaining in here (shut UP), but I'm very
>upset and I'm just going to blog about it for a second. I'll try not to
>do this too much. I like to use AFCA to escape my problems, not
>intensify them.
>So Saturday my mom was back in the ER. Long boring story short:
[snipped]
>Meanwhile the
>social workers and I have to dig up a nursing home because she can't go
>back to assisted living.
>But! Here's what I'm actually upset about. I sent a longer email to my
>sister last night outlining all of this, and here's the response, in its
>entirety, that I got back this morning:
>"Thanks for the update. Let me know if I need to do anything.
><Boyfriend> wants to buy the airline tickets for Christmas (I realize
>this is not the top of your priorities right now). We will probably fly
>in and out on the same day. Some possible choices are Dec. 24, Dec 25 or
>Dec. 16. Of course it's cheaper the 16th. What do you think?"
>OKAY. Am I alone in thinking this doesn't really constitute an adequate
>response? I'm on the verge of just writing this woman off. Have you
>ever written a sibling off? I can't quite bring myself to do it but I'm
>thisclose. It goes without saying, I suppose, that she only comes out
>here twice a year, never calls, never writes, never emails.
What is it that you think she should have said? You told her about
the problems,and the discussions with the doctor. You told her that
you and the social worker are looking for an assisted living facility.
I get the impression that you have the problems well in hand, and she
probably got the same impression. You didn't ask for her help, and
she couldn't offer any if she lives far from you. She may not call or
write, but if she visits twice a year that's more than many siblings
do. What is it that you want from her? And what else has she done
before this that makes you so ready to write her off?
Les
Kim
<snip>
Sorry about your mom - I hope it all works out for you both. My thoughts are
with you.
>
> But! Here's what I'm actually upset about. I sent a longer email to
> my sister last night outlining all of this, and here's the response,
> in its entirety, that I got back this morning:
>
>
> "Thanks for the update. Let me know if I need to do anything.
> <Boyfriend> wants to buy the airline tickets for Christmas (I realize
> this is not the top of your priorities right now). We will probably
> fly in and out on the same day. Some possible choices are Dec. 24,
> Dec 25 or Dec. 16. Of course it's cheaper the 16th. What do you
> think?"
>
>
> OKAY. Am I alone in thinking this doesn't really constitute an
> adequate response?
It's probably the best she knew how to do - but I agree it seems a little
self centered. I think she should have even included a line saying "I know
we planned on coming out sometime over the holidays, if you need me to come
out sooner than that - even if it's just for hand holding - please let me
know."
> I'm on the verge of just writing this woman off.
> Have you ever written a sibling off?
I have 7 siblings, which includes three sisters - and they run the gamut
from overly dramatic diva doomsdayers (my sister the beauty shop owner, who
will talk to my mother and if my mother says "I think I lost a $10 bill
somewhere yesterday" - my sister will then call me saying "Mom is broke and
needs someone to financially support her for the rest of her life") to my
sister in Vermont who lives off the State and is *totally* self centered (If
I ask her if she's talked to Mom recently she'll likely say "Mom who?") to
my totally normal sister (except for baby naming purposes - "Precious") who
actually lives with my mother and pretty much takes care of everything my
mother needs.
I've written off my one brother the heroin addict a few times - but then he
always comes back saying "I'm better" and I give him another chance. He
never actually *is* better, but I keep giving him chances. It's tough to
give up on a brother or sister - there's always the chance that they will
see the error of their ways. But I would think that your sister would at
least, by now, realize that if she can't be with you physically to help out,
she could at least offer some support emotionally.
>I can't quite bring myself to do
> it but I'm thisclose. It goes without saying, I suppose, that she
> only comes out here twice a year, never calls, never writes, never
> emails.
What does she come out for? Just to make a showing over the holidays? If she
never writes or calls or keeps in contact the rest of the year, is this just
a vacation thing for her twice a year or does she actually come out *just*
to see family? How far away is she coming from?
--
Kim
http://thedarwinexception.wordpress.com
*I bet a big perk of owning the Heinz company is being able to use the
phrase "my massive pickle fortune" at parties. (John Gephart IV)*
Mary
Dover Beach wrote:
>
> There's nothing really to do about the terribly painful spinal
> compression fracture. They can inflate the spine and inject cement but
> that doesn't always work, it's a majorish procedure, and can cause other
> problems. Doc Heidi wants to go easy on the narcotics. Meanwhile the
> social workers and I have to dig up a nursing home because she can't go
> back to assisted living.
Oh, no. I'm sorry about your mother, Dover.
> But! Here's what I'm actually upset about. I sent a longer email to my
> sister last night outlining all of this, and here's the response, in its
> entirety, that I got back this morning:
>
>
> "Thanks for the update. Let me know if I need to do anything.
> <Boyfriend> wants to buy the airline tickets for Christmas (I realize
> this is not the top of your priorities right now). We will probably fly
> in and out on the same day. Some possible choices are Dec. 24, Dec 25 or
> Dec. 16. Of course it's cheaper the 16th. What do you think?"
You could just tell her that it's immaterial to you which day she
chooses as you will most likely be busy taking care of Mother either
way.
> OKAY. Am I alone in thinking this doesn't really constitute an adequate
> response? I'm on the verge of just writing this woman off. Have you
> ever written a sibling off? I can't quite bring myself to do it but I'm
> thisclose. It goes without saying, I suppose, that she only comes out
> here twice a year, never calls, never writes, never emails.
Why does she bother? My sister and I aren't close, and she's sort of
distant from my parents too, but she doesn't pretend that it's not so.
Does she think that her relationship with you is normal sisters sort of
stuff?
Weird.
Whatever happens with your sister, I hope it turns out well for you and
your mother.
Mary
xho...@gmail.com
> In general I try to be entertaining in here (shut UP), but I'm very
> upset and I'm just going to blog about it for a second. I'll try not to
> do this too much. I like to use AFCA to escape my problems, not
> intensify them.
>
> So Saturday my mom was back in the ER. Long boring story short:
I'm sorry your mother is doing poorly, Dover.
...
> But! Here's what I'm actually upset about. I sent a longer email to my
> sister last night outlining all of this, and here's the response, in its
> entirety, that I got back this morning:
>
> "Thanks for the update. Let me know if I need to do anything.
> <Boyfriend> wants to buy the airline tickets for Christmas (I realize
> this is not the top of your priorities right now). We will probably fly
> in and out on the same day. Some possible choices are Dec. 24, Dec 25 or
> Dec. 16. Of course it's cheaper the 16th. What do you think?"
>
> OKAY. Am I alone in thinking this doesn't really constitute an adequate
> response?
I don't know. She didn't ask any detailed questions about your mom, but if
you did a thorough job of covering everthing, which I'm sure you did, then
she really wouldn't have any questions to ask. Some people in that
situation would just make up some silly or strained question that they
could ask, just to demonstrate their concern, but I can't really blame
someone for not doing so. She didn't attempt to provide any emotional
support, but e-mail is not the best format for that in the first place, and
I would tend to assume that if someone used that medium for contacting me
that they weren't really looking for emotional support, unless they somehow
made it clear that they were. She did ask if there is anything she needs
to do. Giver her the benefit of the doubt. Tell her she needs to call
you, or to fly out there *now* (or whatever it is you want her to do.)
> I'm on the verge of just writing this woman off. Have you
> ever written a sibling off?
What would writing her off consist of? Would it change the way you
interact with her? I.E. would you stop giving her updates on how your
mother is doing? Or would it only change the expectations you have of her
and your emotional responses to her not living up to those expectations?
If the latter, is that something you can make a conscious decision to do?
Xho
--
-------------------- http://NewsReader.Com/ --------------------
Usenet Newsgroup Service $9.95/Month 30GB
Jeannie
Dover Beach wrote:
> Can't see any blood clots in her legs using
> sonogram and doc doesn't want to inject dye and do whatever the other
> scan is because the dye is murder on elderly kidneys.
So sorry about your mom's troubles, Dover. My two brothers are hours
away so I'm the caretaker (such as I am...Mom is doing great knock on
wood). After Dad died a year and a half ago, they said they'd call and
visit more but...nope.
What shape are her kidneys in? Elderly might not mean "can't stand up
to the dye." It's amazing what good shape some old people's parts are
in. When my mom had her heart valve replacement at 82, they did an
angiogram to make sure everything else was OK, and the surgeon compared
the results favorably with "most people half her age."
Jeannie
Dover Beach
news:454F6C23...@sonnnic.invalid:
Thanks. And Anny's response is very mature and reasonable, probably
more mature and reasonable than I feel like being right now. My husband
stopped me from sending a FOAD reply to my sister so I'm still thinking
about what to do.
--
Dover
Dover Beach
news:1162832557....@e3g2000cwe.googlegroups.com:
>
> Dover Beach wrote:
>
> [mom's health and fears about]
>
> Dover, I'm so sorry to hear about your mom.
>
>
Thank you.
>
> Welcome to the Sorority of Bizarre Sisters.
>
>
> You've alluded to the uselessness of this particular sister...what was
> her relationship with your mom? Is she completely self-centered with
> everything? Can you write back (or call) and tell her you need her
> moral support, someone to bounce ideas off of, financial help?
>
> I'd be as furious as you are. My own sisterly issues tend to be the
> opposite-- my sister blowing everything up into psychodrama for the
> joy of embelleshment. But having your sister hang you out to dry
> emotionally...wow.
>
Yeah, it's all cumulative. After I brought Mom out here to stay with
me, I was really cracking under the strain. When my sister would come
out from California for her 3-hour twice-annual visits she would spend
half the time complaining about how she had to get up at 4:00 a.m. to
catch the plane. Yeah, well, whose idea was that? And BTW, our really
difficult mother *lives here in my house* and that's actually more of a
problem than the fact that you had to get up at 4:00.
--
Dover
Dover Beach
news:12kut7m...@corp.supernews.com:
>>I can't quite bring myself to do
>> it but I'm thisclose. It goes without saying, I suppose, that she
>> only comes out here twice a year, never calls, never writes, never
>> emails.
>
> What does she come out for? Just to make a showing over the holidays?
> If she never writes or calls or keeps in contact the rest of the year,
> is this just a vacation thing for her twice a year or does she
> actually come out *just* to see family? How far away is she coming
> from?
>
California. Though she's not a heroin addict she is alcoholic, though
in recovery for several years now. She was fairly abusive to me when
drunk which doesn't add to my patience with her now. She comes out
because she can't really quite just write off Mom either, though she'd
like to. Mom wasn't really the best mother in the whole world, though
who is, really?
--
Dover
Dover Beach
news:1162835638....@m7g2000cwm.googlegroups.com:
>
> Dover Beach wrote:
>
>
> Oh, no. I'm sorry about your mother, Dover.
Thank you.
>
>
> You could just tell her that it's immaterial to you which day she
> chooses as you will most likely be busy taking care of Mother either
> way.
That's lots politer than my first draft. I think I need to do something
along those lines.
>
> Why does she bother? My sister and I aren't close, and she's sort of
> distant from my parents too, but she doesn't pretend that it's not so.
My sister believes herself to be an absolute saint. It's inconsistent
with sainthood to never visit your mother. I think that's why she comes
out.
--
Dover
Dover Beach
>
> I'm sorry your mother is doing poorly, Dover.
Thank you.
>
> What would writing her off consist of? Would it change the way you
> interact with her? I.E. would you stop giving her updates on how your
> mother is doing? Or would it only change the expectations you have of
> her and your emotional responses to her not living up to those
> expectations?
>
> If the latter, is that something you can make a conscious decision to
> do?
>
I dunno. Maybe. Writing her off would probably just mean that I will
finally give up on thinking that when the chips are really down she'll
come through. Also, I would quit giving as much consideration to her
feelings and opinions regarding a couple of family matters where she and
I disagree.
When Mom finally dies I have no idea if I'll ever see my sister again.
I'm finding that hard to face. Somehow I always held on to the idea
that she wasn't absolutely selfish, not down to the DNA level, but I
have to let go of that.
She's an outstanding special ed teacher. She's devoted to her students
and they have benefitted from her work for the 30 years she's been doing
it -- 40 years if you count the volunteer work she started in 6th grade.
She's also devoted to her image of herself as a saint. She spends a
lot of time talking about how wonderful she is. But she doesn't
give a rat's ass about her family.
--
Dover
Dover Beach
news:1162838732.9...@b28g2000cwb.googlegroups.com:
>
>
> So sorry about your mom's troubles, Dover.
Thank you.
> My two brothers are hours
> away so I'm the caretaker (such as I am...Mom is doing great knock on
> wood). After Dad died a year and a half ago, they said they'd call
> and visit more but...nope.
I think that's a common phenomenon.
>
> What shape are her kidneys in? Elderly might not mean "can't stand up
> to the dye." It's amazing what good shape some old people's parts are
> in. When my mom had her heart valve replacement at 82, they did an
> angiogram to make sure everything else was OK, and the surgeon
> compared the results favorably with "most people half her age."
>
I don't know. I assumed her kidneys were fine but I took the doc's word
for it that the dye was a hazard. As I said, I've know this doctor for
several years and have been impressed with her. When you ask nurses
which doctors they recommend they always list this woman. My feeling is
that The Nurses Know.
--
Dover
Dover Beach
news:jhquk21kieb3a6qvc...@4ax.com:
>
>
> What is it that you think she should have said?
Something that indicates that she's aware of what I'm going through.
> You told her about
> the problems,and the discussions with the doctor. You told her that
> you and the social worker are looking for an assisted living facility.
> I get the impression that you have the problems well in hand, and she
> probably got the same impression. You didn't ask for her help, and
> she couldn't offer any if she lives far from you. She may not call or
> write, but if she visits twice a year that's more than many siblings
> do. What is it that you want from her?
I want her to give a damn.
--
Dover
Dana Carpender
Dover Beach wrote:
First of all, Dover, I'm really, really sorry about your mom. As I've
learned from dealing with my mom, there are some situations where the
range is from "sucks" through "sucks worse," to "sucks so bad you're
afraid the universe may implode." I hurt for you. Especially the need
to find a new living situation from your mom; I know she really liked
the assisted living facility.
As for your sister, she sounds incredibly thoughtless and self-centered.
I'd be outraged, in your position.
I can't tell you to write her off or not write her off, but I can tell
you it's not a decision you have to make irrevocably. You can simply
ignore her for the moment, and decide when things are better if you want
her back in your life, or if you're comfortable with the idea of
continuing to ignore her.
((((((((((((Dover)))))))))))))
I hope things are easier soon.
Dana
>
¡Que Barbara!
That sentence brought tears to my eyes. I don't have anything
productive to add, just wanted to say I am so sorry to hear what you
are going through, and that it sucks that your sister is not there for
you. I would vote for getting her in and out as soon as possible,
preferably on the 16th. And, if I were in your I shoes, I would cease
contacting her except in very severe circumstances, but I would reply
if she called or contacted me. Or can you pass her off to your
husband? "Dover is too upset/busy taking of mom to talk right now, but
she wanted me to tell you . . ."
Take care of yourself.
Barbara
Dana Carpender
Dover Beach wrote:
My mom was. No, really. She was wonderful. Read us stories, took us
to the library, planned fun daytrips for those occasional mid-week days
off from school, sewed our back to school dresses and Easter dresses
every year, made every holiday special, even minor ones like Valentines
Day and St. Patrick's Day, made sure we had mail *every single day* when
we were away at camp, was my Girl Scout leader and class mother, taught
me basic cooking. Told us repeatedly that each of us was the world's
only supply of something unique, that we wouldn't be here if the world
didn't need that particular combination of qualities, and that we had a
responsibility to present our true account.
I miss her. I miss her a lot. The last time I called her, she wasn't
even sure who I was.
Dana
Lisa Ann
Dover Beach wrote:
> xho...@gmail.com wrote in news:20061106133354.025$k...@newsreader.com:
>
>
> >
> > I'm sorry your mother is doing poorly, Dover.
>
> Thank you.
> finally give up on thinking that when the chips are really down she'll
> come through. Also, I would quit giving as much consideration to her
> feelings and opinions regarding a couple of family matters where she and
> I disagree.
If that's what "writing her off" means to you, then by all means do it.
She's not going to suddenly change into someone you can count on.
I had to come to this conclusion with both my brother and my father.
They will never be the type of people I want them to be, and it seemed
that the only one getting hurt about all this was...me. So this is who
they are, and if I keep them posted about my life, I don't expect
anything in return. When I go at it from this mind-set, I'm never
disappointed.
Like it or not, you're the primary caretaker of your mom now. Do what
has to be done, and let your sister know what has been done. If she
protests or disagrees, say as mildly as possible, "Well, you're out
there and I'm here, the decision had to be made, so I made it."
> When Mom finally dies I have no idea if I'll ever see my sister again.
> I'm finding that hard to face. Somehow I always held on to the idea
> that she wasn't absolutely selfish, not down to the DNA level, but I
> have to let go of that.
That's entirely possible. I seriously doubt I'll ever see my brother
again after my mom dies. If I do, I'm sure there will be another dead
body in the room with us.
Don't forget, there are different ways of writing people off, too. You
don't have to sever all ties, you can just send cards on birthdays and
Christmas. That way the door is always open should she choose to come
through it.
> She's an outstanding special ed teacher. She's devoted to her students
> and they have benefitted from her work for the 30 years she's been doing
> it -- 40 years if you count the volunteer work she started in 6th grade.
> She's also devoted to her image of herself as a saint. She spends a
> lot of time talking about how wonderful she is. But she doesn't
> give a rat's ass about her family.
I'm so sorry you're going through this, Dover. I'll keep you and your
mom in my thoughts & prayers.
In the meantime, figure out if you want your sister to come, and what
day(s) you want her to come...and lean on your other family members as
much as you need to. Or on us.
Hugs,
Lisa Ann
Dover Beach
news:1162846477.2...@k70g2000cwa.googlegroups.com:
>
> Dover Beach wrote:
>>
>> I want her to give a damn.
>
> That sentence brought tears to my eyes.
It helped me to write it and look at it and say well, tough tacos,
honey, she doesn't give a damn, so you need to just move on.
> I don't have anything
> productive to add, just wanted to say I am so sorry to hear what you
> are going through, and that it sucks that your sister is not there for
> you. I would vote for getting her in and out as soon as possible,
> preferably on the 16th.
Yeah, why not? Then my husband and I can have actual Christmas to
ourselves.
Thanks, Barbara.
--
Dover
Dover Beach
news:1p6dnRhE-bmPOdLY...@insightbb.com:
>
>
>
> I miss her. I miss her a lot. The last time I called her, she wasn't
> even sure who I was.
>
All of our parents need to stop aging and getting sick RIGHT NOW. I
mean it, I've had just about enough out of them. Next parent who ages
and gets sick goes right into time-out.
Hugs back to you, Dana, and thanks for your support.
--
Dover
Veronique
Lisa Ann wrote:
> In the meantime, figure out if you want your sister to come, and what
> day(s) you want her to come...and lean on your other family members as
> much as you need to. Or on us.
Yes, us! Lean on us! Because we love you and want you to be happy...or
at least want to make sure you have someone to turn to when it's all
too much.
V. "I could send you some salt, if you like"
--
Veronique Chez Sheep
Dover Beach
news:1162848040....@h48g2000cwc.googlegroups.com:
<snip lots of sensible and sympathetic advice>
>
> Hugs,
>
> Lisa Ann
>
Thanks, Lisa Ann.
--
Dover
Dana Carpender
Veronique wrote:
Take her up on the salt, Dover. It won't fix your mom, or make your
sister a decent person, but it's very nice nonetheless.
The salt of the earth, that Veronique. Or at least the salt of the
newsgroup.
Dana
Greg Johnson
<snip unfortunate circumstances>
I'm very sorry to hear about your mother. I hope things go as 'least
badly' as possible (I can't say well, since that's not an option).
>OKAY. Am I alone in thinking this doesn't really constitute an adequate
>response? I'm on the verge of just writing this woman off. Have you
>ever written a sibling off? I can't quite bring myself to do it but I'm
>thisclose. It goes without saying, I suppose, that she only comes out
>here twice a year, never calls, never writes, never emails.
I wouldn't do anything I'd describe as writing her off, but I'd
seriously think about her history of behaviour. Usually, people don't
change much just because bad things are happening. If she was unreliable
before, that's probably going to continue and you need to take it into
account.
--
Greg Johnson
darkon
I can't rate my mom, but she's always been there when I needed her.
My family isn't very expressive for the most part, but there are
other ways. About the time I was getting divorced, I was visiting
my parents, and stopped by a department store and bought a cheap
pottery lamp to go beside my bed. When I got to my parents' house
I opened the box and discovered the lamp was cracked. I was close
to tears over that stupid lamp, not really because of the lamp
itself, of course, it was just one more thing on top of the
divorce. Mom didn't say anything, but a few minutes later she left
and came back after a while with an uncracked lamp just like the
one I'd bought. She kept the cracked one.
For the past year or two my dad keeps giving me things whenever I
visit. Just little things: a hand plane, wood he's never going to
use, drill bits, and so on. I know why, but I don't like it. At
one point he said to me, "David, don't you realize I'm an old
man?" I said, "Yeah, I do, but I try not to think about it."
They're both getting more and more physical problems. When you all
talk about parents failing, I feel lucky that mine are still self-
sufficient, but hate that they're becoming so feeble compared to
how I remember them. It'll be a different world without them.
Dover Beach
news:0gevk2tuu0b8ooqkt...@4ax.com:
> On 6 Nov 2006 15:55:59 GMT, Dover Beach <moon.b...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> <snip unfortunate circumstances>
>
> I'm very sorry to hear about your mother. I hope things go as 'least
> badly' as possible (I can't say well, since that's not an option).
>
Thank you.
>
> I wouldn't do anything I'd describe as writing her off, but I'd
> seriously think about her history of behaviour. Usually, people don't
> change much just because bad things are happening. If she was
> unreliable before, that's probably going to continue and you need to
> take it into account.
True enough, I think.
Boron Elgar
wrote:
>So Saturday my mom was back in the ER. Long boring story short: she has
>a spinal compression fracture and probably a blood clot in her lung.
>Her oxygenation is bad; that's why the doc (whom I actually know and
>trust) thinks blood clot.
Oh,dear...I am so very sorry.
Did she fall again since the UTI? Did she fall in the hospital?
>There's nothing really to do about the terribly painful spinal
>compression fracture. They can inflate the spine and inject cement but
>that doesn't always work, it's a majorish procedure, and can cause other
>problems. Doc Heidi wants to go easy on the narcotics. Meanwhile the
>social workers and I have to dig up a nursing home because she can't go
>back to assisted living.
Not an easy task, especially one that needs to be done in a hurry. Why
can't she go back to assisted living? The falls? Is she incapacitated
now because of the spine or is it that she needs close watching
because of the likelihood of clots?
I ask because when my ex MIL fractured her pelvis a couple of years
ago, she spent time in a facility, which was a cross between a
hospital and a nursing home, but we avoided the nursing home.
The docs want to go easy on the narcotics because they don't want more
falls and disorientation, but please be careful that your mother is
not in a lot of pain. It can take intensive attention to manage and
get the right levels.
Once she goes into a nursing home, will Dr Heidi still be able to
attend her? My pop had to give up all his doctors at that point, as
the nursing home had their own on-call staff and most docs won't make
nursing home calls, anyway.
>
>But! Here's what I'm actually upset about. I sent a longer email to my
>sister last night outlining all of this, and here's the response, in its
>entirety, that I got back this morning:
>
>
>"Thanks for the update. Let me know if I need to do anything.
><Boyfriend> wants to buy the airline tickets for Christmas (I realize
>this is not the top of your priorities right now). We will probably fly
>in and out on the same day. Some possible choices are Dec. 24, Dec 25 or
>Dec. 16. Of course it's cheaper the 16th. What do you think?"
>
>
>OKAY. Am I alone in thinking this doesn't really constitute an adequate
>response? I'm on the verge of just writing this woman off. Have you
>ever written a sibling off? I can't quite bring myself to do it but I'm
>thisclose. It goes without saying, I suppose, that she only comes out
>here twice a year, never calls, never writes, never emails.
You are in a serious situation with your mother right now....you have
your hands full with that responsibility and that alone. It appears
that your sister avoids such things by just ignoring them altogether.
You seek from her what she will never give you and what she may be
incapable of giving to you, no matter how wonderful she is to others.
She may have family issues that have complicated her own situation and
the only way she can stay sober is to wall them off - permanently. It
is sad for you, it is heartbreaking for you, that your own flesh and
blood is not there to love and support or at least comfort and
commiserate with you and your mother right now, but judging from the
other things you wrote, she isn't going to do it at any point in the
future, either.. Admitting that is not easy, but it may be a way to
cope and not set yourself up for disappointment when she repeats this
disconnect.
There is nothing to be gained by telling her off, other than you
getting satisfaction from it (and that is not always a bad thing,
don't get me wrong), but I do not think there is anything to be
gained. You can try to get through to her at Christmas and see if you
can get her more involved, but realize that she may not because she
just cannot. Just as you jump in and take the family responsibility as
that is your nature, so this may be hers that she cannot do it.
The flaw is not in you, but in her and you cannot change her. If you
want to maintain a relationship, one-sided as it is (and again, if
that gives you any comfort, then by god, take it) go ahead and try.
Maybe she will come around one day, but be prepared that she may not
and that your actions may prove futile. This isn't the sort of
abusive relationship that warrants "writing her off," I don't think,
but I don't think it will ever be a close one.
Were the two of you ever close?
Boron
Peter Boulding
<Xns98735ADC2DB3mo...@130.133.1.4>:
Sorry to hear about your mom. What you're describing is outside my
experience, so I'm afraid I've nothing to add...
>"Thanks for the update. Let me know if I need to do anything.
><Boyfriend> wants to buy the airline tickets for Christmas (I realize
>this is not the top of your priorities right now). We will probably fly
>in and out on the same day. Some possible choices are Dec. 24, Dec 25 or
>Dec. 16. Of course it's cheaper the 16th. What do you think?"
From what you say your sister's got big troubles of her own, is immersed in
work (which may be either her salvation or much of her problem or both), and
the above would appear from what you've said to be par for the course. I get
the feeling that while you obviously needed more - like maybe at least some
real concern or sympathy, if not any actual help or advice - the above reply
was not unexpected; it just confirmed rather emphatically what you already
knew.
Unless there's some kind of unexpected change of circumstances, it sounds
like it's unlikely that things will ever change much on this front. Still,
you never know, and what - apart from venting your immediate feelings -
would a FOAD reply achieve? If you think the time has come to write her off
emotionally, just do it; if you think about it, such a decision is none of
her business.
Regardless, nothing useful is going to be achieved via e-mail, nor, I
suspect, by phone. So you might as well e-mail just to tell her which is the
least inconvenient time to visit. I would suggest telling her not to come
because you've got too much else to cope with, but when your mom is
seriously ill you don't really have a choice; you don't want to end up a
permanent target of a sister's guilt trip.
--
Regards
Peter Boulding
p...@UNSPAMpboulding.co.uk (to e-mail, remove "UNSPAM")
Fractal music & images: http://www.pboulding.co.uk/
Dover Beach
news:nigvk2p4vq1s44969...@4ax.com:
> On 6 Nov 2006 15:55:59 GMT, Dover Beach <moon.b...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>>So Saturday my mom was back in the ER. Long boring story short: she
>>has a spinal compression fracture and probably a blood clot in her
>>lung. Her oxygenation is bad; that's why the doc (whom I actually know
>>and trust) thinks blood clot.
>
> Oh,dear...I am so very sorry.
Thank you.
>
> Did she fall again since the UTI? Did she fall in the hospital?
She fell Saturday morning back at the assisted living place. It's not
entirely their fault; she should've called for help but she has been
resistant to doing so. I get the impression that she's finally convinced
she needs to request help.
>
>
> Not an easy task, especially one that needs to be done in a hurry. Why
> can't she go back to assisted living? The falls? Is she incapacitated
> now because of the spine or is it that she needs close watching
> because of the likelihood of clots?
>
> I ask because when my ex MIL fractured her pelvis a couple of years
> ago, she spent time in a facility, which was a cross between a
> hospital and a nursing home, but we avoided the nursing home.
>
> The docs want to go easy on the narcotics because they don't want more
> falls and disorientation, but please be careful that your mother is
> not in a lot of pain. It can take intensive attention to manage and
> get the right levels.
The Fentanyl patch seems to be working well; her pain is diminished but
she's not groggy. This is the best possible outcome. The hospital
really wants her to go to a nursing home for a few weeks to push the PT
and OT. I think they're not pleased that the AL place let her fall, but
as I said, it's not entirely their fault. She has to understand her
limitations.
>
> Once she goes into a nursing home, will Dr Heidi still be able to
> attend her? My pop had to give up all his doctors at that point, as
> the nursing home had their own on-call staff and most docs won't make
> nursing home calls, anyway.
No, Heidi's a hospitalist and I think the nursing home has its own staff,
which is too bad, but I'll hope for the best.
I think you're right all the way. I'm sure she does need to avoid my
mother for her own emotional preservation. I just feel like screaming at
her sometimes that I'd like to avoid Mom too, but we can't just leave her
in the street. My sister was born in 1954 and I was born in 1960, and
both my sister and my late father assure me that Mom was *really* crazy
in the 1950s, as opposed to just pretty crazy subsequently. So it's
entirely possible that my sister got a worse ride than I did.
>
> Were the two of you ever close?
>
Up and down over the years, but mostly down for the last 20.
Anyway, thank you so much for your kindness and thoughtful words.
--
Dover
bill van
Dover Beach <moon.b...@gmail.com> wrote:
Sounds very much like you need to stop counting on her, i.e. write her
off emotionally, as some have put it. That way you won't be disappointed
next time, and if she does decide to come through, you can be pleasantly
surprised and perhaps readjust your view.
I wouldn't pick a fight with her. Nothing but heartbreak there. Inform
her when there's a major development, answer if she contacts you, be
polite but aloof.
My father went through a long decline before he died last winter and I
live in a different city, so two of my siblings (and other relatives)
bore most of the burden. But we stayed in touch with e-mail and phone
calls and I visited once a year on average, for at least a week. I made
special trips two or three times when he appeared to be failing.
If your sister won't do that or something equivalent by way of support,
don't invest any more emotion in her.
Are there just the two of you by the way, or are there other siblings in
the picture?
bill
Dover Beach
news:96jvk2hujqriqgq2b...@4ax.com:
> On 6 Nov 2006 15:55:59 GMT, Dover Beach <moon.b...@gmail.com>
> wrote in <Xns98735ADC2DB3mo...@130.133.1.4>:
>
> Regardless, nothing useful is going to be achieved via e-mail, nor, I
> suspect, by phone. So you might as well e-mail just to tell her which
> is the least inconvenient time to visit. I would suggest telling her
> not to come because you've got too much else to cope with, but when
> your mom is seriously ill you don't really have a choice; you don't
> want to end up a permanent target of a sister's guilt trip.
>
Yep. Thanks for the wise words.
--
Dover
Dover Beach
news:billvan-0D2B95...@news.telus.net:
>
> Sounds very much like you need to stop counting on her, i.e. write her
> off emotionally, as some have put it. That way you won't be
> disappointed next time, and if she does decide to come through, you
> can be pleasantly surprised and perhaps readjust your view.
Yes. I'm not holding my breath though.
>
> Are there just the two of you by the way, or are there other siblings
> in the picture?
>
Just the two.
--
Dover
xho...@gmail.com
> Dana Carpender <dcar...@kivanospam.net> wrote in
> news:1p6dnRhE-bmPOdLY...@insightbb.com:
>
> >
> >
> >
> > I miss her. I miss her a lot. The last time I called her, she wasn't
> > even sure who I was.
> >
>
> All of our parents need to stop aging and getting sick RIGHT NOW.
Having a parent suddently stop aging and getting sick is no great shakes,
either. But I think it can sometimes be easier than the slower alternative
route. But I feel guilty for thinking that.
Xho
--
-------------------- http://NewsReader.Com/ --------------------
Usenet Newsgroup Service $9.95/Month 30GB
Dover Beach
> Dover Beach <moon.b...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Dana Carpender <dcar...@kivanospam.net> wrote in
>> news:1p6dnRhE-bmPOdLY...@insightbb.com:
>>
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > I miss her. I miss her a lot. The last time I called her, she
>> > wasn't even sure who I was.
>> >
>>
>> All of our parents need to stop aging and getting sick RIGHT NOW.
>
> Having a parent suddently stop aging and getting sick is no great
> shakes, either. But I think it can sometimes be easier than the
> slower alternative route. But I feel guilty for thinking that.
>
I'm sorry about your father, Xho. But even Dr. Heidi was telling me
that it's not heartless to hope that they go quickly. The options are
going quickly or slowly. The option of "not going" hasn't been worked
out yet.
--
Dover
darkon
> My father went through a long decline before he died last winter
> and I live in a different city, so two of my siblings (and other
> relatives) bore most of the burden. But we stayed in touch with
> e-mail and phone calls and I visited once a year on average, for
> at least a week. I made special trips two or three times when he
> appeared to be failing.
Something seems to have become garbled on its way from your head to
the keyboard. How did you visit once a year for at least a week?
Should that be once a week for at least a year?
Veronique
Sounds like Bill visited yearly, for the duration of a week for each
visit. Sort of what I do with my parents.
V.
--
Veronique Chez Sheep
darkon
OK, that makes sense. I read it several times without being sure
what Bill meant. I couldn't see how yearly visits were fitting into
the span of a week.
Must. Have. Coffee.
Jeannie
xho...@gmail.com wrote:
>
> Having a parent suddently stop aging and getting sick is no great shakes,
> either. But I think it can sometimes be easier than the slower alternative
> route. But I feel guilty for thinking that.
Don't. My dad had Alzheimer's and an ostomy and bad knees, and my mom
worked herself exhausted taking care of him. In April '05 we were in
the middle of shopping for an assisted living place for him (or maybe
for both of them) when I brought them milk after work and found Mom
barely conscious in the back yard next to Dad in his lawn chair, who
unruffledly told me she was taking a nap.
She went in for the heart valve replacement, I got 24/7 caregivers for
him, but he was so disoriented by her absence that he went downhill
really quickly and died the next month. Mom and I felt really guilty
and kept trying to think of what we could/should have done for him, but
in the end she made us both feel better when she realized that no
matter what we did, we wouldn't have been able to fix his brain.
It sounds terrible to say this, but Mom finally has her own life now.
Dad and us kids were always her life, and I really thought she would
just fade away after he died, but she is trucking along just fine. She
misses him terribly, of course, but I know she doesn't miss the
sleepless nights and the worry, and she's really thriving on being able
to sleep when she pleases (usually her preferred hours of 3a-11a), eat
what and when she wants, and be social again.
Jeannie
P.S. Mom and I keep in touch with my two brothers via email and an
ongoing 4-person Scrabble game from
http://www.thepixiepit.co.uk/scrabble/ . I wish they'd call and visit
her more, but the "notes" you can include with your Scrabble turn are
better than nothing!
Bob Ward
wrote:
What else would you call it if you spent the third week of August each
year visiting relatives?
darkon
bill van
darkon <darko...@gmail.com> wrote:
Just got here. Yes, I visited once a year, on average, and usually
stayed for about a week, sometimes longer.
bill
Greg Goss
>"Kim" <72FLHtak...@twcny.rr.com> wrote in
>news:12kut7m...@corp.supernews.com:
>
>
>
>>>I can't quite bring myself to do
>>> it but I'm thisclose. It goes without saying, I suppose, that she
>>> only comes out here twice a year, never calls, never writes, never
>>> emails.
>>
>> What does she come out for? Just to make a showing over the holidays?
>> If she never writes or calls or keeps in contact the rest of the year,
>> is this just a vacation thing for her twice a year or does she
>> actually come out *just* to see family? How far away is she coming
>> from?
>>
>
>California. Though she's not a heroin addict she is alcoholic, though
>in recovery for several years now. She was fairly abusive to me when
>drunk which doesn't add to my patience with her now. She comes out
>because she can't really quite just write off Mom either, though she'd
>like to. Mom wasn't really the best mother in the whole world, though
>who is, really?
Um, Mine?
My mother was just about perfect as parents go, and my father was
pretty good. (Other than that voting for Vanderzalm thing.)
But your question asks who is the BEST mother in the whole world. In
my opinion, Ruth Goss held that position till Y2K then surrendered the
title. I don't know the name of the current holder.
--
Tomorrow is today already.
Greg Goss, 1989-01-27
Greg Goss
>It sounds terrible to say this, but Mom finally has her own life now.
It's hard to believe that my mother lasted most of a decade after Dad
died. In my mind there's a year or two between the two events.
Greg Goss
Definately a coffee requirement. I can't see how it could be parsed
into what you saw.
Jeannie
Greg Goss wrote:
> Dover Beach <moon.b...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >Mom wasn't really the best mother in the whole world, though
> >who is, really?
>
> Um, Mine?
>
> My mother was just about perfect as parents go, and my father was
> pretty good. (Other than that voting for Vanderzalm thing.)
>
> But your question asks who is the BEST mother in the whole world. In
> my opinion, Ruth Goss held that position till Y2K then surrendered the
> title. I don't know the name of the current holder.
Martha Rowena Bell. (mine!)
Jeannie
wow, that was an easy one
darkon
for (at_least_a_week) {
visit_once_a_year();
}
I use Perl more than any other language, and it allows you to write
simple loops like this:
visit_once_a_year() for (at_least_a_week);
Read (past tense) like that, what Bill said looked like a bug.
xho...@gmail.com
Oddly enough, I also use Perl more than any other language (including
English, probably) and I also parsed it that way at first.