A question for the guys: handicap urinals
Blornx
>> (Ladies: you didn't know what we suffer to take a leak?)
>Yeah, but we can do it from a speeding car.
Could you, would you, on a train?
Would you, could you, in the rain?
--
Blornx The Z from my address remove.
Matt Miller
says...
>They're pretty much omnipresent now in public rest rooms. For those
>females reading this thread, a "handicap urinal" is a normal urinal
>(usually) set about a foot lower than normal ones.
>
>I have never in my life seen one used. Has anyone here seen a
>handicapped guy actually use one? It's got to be incredibly difficult,
>if you consider the position of someone in a wheelchair, and then the
>position they would have to get themselves into to be able to actually
>make use of it.
>
>I have some experience in this matter, having spent a short time in a
>wheel chair in college after injuring myself in a tremendously stupid
>manner.
>
>I thanked heaven every time that I used the rest room in a public place
>(college bars at that point) that there were laws mandating handicap
>accessibility of bathrooms. I always used the handicapped stall, since
>I couldn't figure out how in the world to pee into a handicap urinal
>without pretty much having to actually stand up, which was impossible.
>
>In my eyes, handicap accessible stalls = good thing, handicap urinals =
>stupid thing.
>
>Am I right about this?
I have no idea. I've made use of them when they were the last one
left and when following the "Don't take a urinal next to someone else if
you can help it" rule.
I remember a restroom with ridiculously high urinals (I would have
had to aim upwards to make it) and one normal one.
--
Matt Miller | http://pw2.netcom.com/~matmillr | a.a# 357
EAC Spokesmodel
"Under the rocks and stones
there is water underground."
-The Talking Heads
Bob Ward
wrote:
>They're pretty much omnipresent now in public rest rooms. For those
>females reading this thread, a "handicap urinal" is a normal urinal
>(usually) set about a foot lower than normal ones.
>
>I have never in my life seen one used. Has anyone here seen a
>handicapped guy actually use one? It's got to be incredibly difficult,
>if you consider the position of someone in a wheelchair, and then the
>position they would have to get themselves into to be able to actually
>make use of it.
>
>I have some experience in this matter, having spent a short time in a
>wheel chair in college after injuring myself in a tremendously stupid
>manner.
>
>I thanked heaven every time that I used the rest room in a public place
>(college bars at that point) that there were laws mandating handicap
>accessibility of bathrooms. I always used the handicapped stall, since
>I couldn't figure out how in the world to pee into a handicap urinal
>without pretty much having to actually stand up, which was impossible.
>
>In my eyes, handicap accessible stalls = good thing, handicap urinals =
>stupid thing.
>
>Am I right about this?
>
>-Richard
>
>
Not everyone who is handicapped is in a wheelchair. I've seen people
on crutches who seemed to be doing just fine at the lower urinal,
although I assumed that they were actually intended for use by small
boys.
JWISNIA
>(Ladies: you didn't know what we suffer to take a leak?)
>
Well any who have used a feminine urinal like they used to have on army bases
and in prisons would be "in the know".
Are those things still around anywhere ladies? Seems to me thy'd be more
hygenic (sp?), wouldn't they?
Jeff Wisnia W1BSV
Winchester, MA.
"Common sense isn't very common..."
Gina Marie Wade
wrote:
>
>
>Joe Mac wrote:
>
>> I've always considered them there for either short guys or little boys.
>
>Nope. I took an architecture class in college that had a unit on the
>requirements for handicap accessibility. The low urinals are mandated by
>local building codes as well as federal law. You'll even occasionally see
>where they had to rip a normal height one off the wall and had to reinstall
>it lower to meet the building code.
>
>They're for handicapped guys, but I still don't think they've ever been used
>for that. The bit about them being useful "for kids" is purely ancillary.
>
>-Richard
>
Frankly, I am amazed that you guys think that handicapped
automatically means wheelchair. Being a dwarf or a midget is a
handicap, too, and is covered under ADA.
So, yeah, the urinals may very well be for handicapped guys - but for
short ones.
Gina Marie
GrapeApe
from the 'standard' urinal, others come out further from the wall further, and
at a height where one could almost wheel a wheelchair over it, although I have
never seen this done.
What I find a bit suprising is the relative lack of access aids in most
wheelchairs. Even with arms on either side, there is still a wheel for one to
rise over to slide off of the chair, some using chairs are too weak to exit to
a toilet of any sort this way. I would figure there would be more 'flaps' built
into the seat of the wheel chairs to allow access to a chamber pot, or a
toilet. Such accessories are not easy to find.
Rich Clancey
+ (JWISNIA) writes:
+ >Well any who have used a feminine urinal like they used to have on army bases
+ >and in prisons would be "in the know".
+ >
It doesn't seem fair that women would get special feminine
urinals and men don't!
--
:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:
rich clancey r...@world.std.com rcla...@massart.edu
On an autumn evening one remembers more of childhood
than at any other time of year.
- Graham Greene -
:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:*:
Jeff Janes
: What I find a bit suprising is the relative lack of access aids in most
: wheelchairs. Even with arms on either side, there is still a wheel for one to
: rise over to slide off of the chair, some using chairs are too weak to exit to
: a toilet of any sort this way.
Modern designs of motorized w/c do not have large back wheels that block
access from the side, and many have electric control of seat height to
ease transfer to toiled and back. Some even have some kind of power-tilt
mechanism.
: I would figure there would be more 'flaps' built
: into the seat of the wheel chairs to allow access to a chamber pot, or a
: toilet. Such accessories are not easy to find.
I assume your flaps would be some kind of trap door that drops out
underneath. It would be very difficult to design such a device that
would both function well as a toilet seat when opened and would close
seemlessly enough to avoid pressure points (and hence, decubitus
ulcers) when closed. It would wreak havoc with the bracing underneath
the w/c. Someone without the dexterity or strengh to transfer to a
toilet would also have difficulty independently operating the flap
mechanism, lowering there britches, positioning the thundermug, doing
there business, and reversing the procedure.
The engineering hurdles are considerable. Considering the expense
of design, the liability, and the limited market, it doesn't surprise
me at all that such things would be rare. There much more profit in
making a general-purpose w/c and a general-purpose commode chair than
trying to make a highly specialized hybrid.
Jeff
--
Jeff Janes
email: ja...@scripps.edu
Amy Elizabeth Gleason
JWISNIA <jwi...@aol.com> wrote:
> I've forgotten the URL, but there's a web site run by a nurse with a
page name
> like "Teaching women to urinate standing up". I've seen it mentioned
on this
> newsgroup, and looked at it. It gives directions to ladies on how to
learn to
> pee standing up in front of a regular toilet, similar to a man.
Maybe I'm just not as skilled as other women in this area, but it
totally did not work for me. I was REALLY glad that I tried this at
home.
Don't try this at home. Don't try this anywhere.
L & k,
Amy
David Lentz
If you really want to master the art, you can you a device, for
which I have misplaced the URL.
David
JWISNIA
>totally did not work for me. I was REALLY glad that I tried this at
>home.
>
>Don't try this at home. Don't try this anywhere.
IIRC the web site I mentioned suggested practicing in the shower...
JWISNIA
>
On second thought Amy, maybe you just need the right "tool" for the job. See:
http://www.murrette.com/index.html
or
http://www.pintsize.com/onthego.html
JWISNIA
>
Just so you'll have more than you really wanted to know, Amy....
Here's the "peeing standig up website"
http://www.restrooms.org/standing.html
JWISNIA
>much detail as possible what those feminine urinals look like, how they are
>designed to be used, and what the short-falls and waterfalls are when they
>are
>used.
>
>Les
>
Well try this web page, Les. But, I believe American Standard stopped making
them 27 years ago....There probably aren't too many of these still in service.
http://www.restrooms.org/sanistand1.html
Paulernstmeyer
>-> handicapped guy actually use one? It's got to be incredibly difficult,
>-> if you consider the position of someone in a wheelchair, and then the
>-> position they would have to get themselves into to be able to actually
>-> make use of it.
>
>I always thought these urinals were for the little tykes so they did not
>have to piss all over the toilet seats.
>
>-> -Richard
>
>Perry
>
>
Yeah those urinals are for the short not the handicapped. If someone in a
wheelchair were using that he would piss all over himself unless he had an
extremely long penis.
Perry Farmer
-> >-> handicapped guy actually use one? It's got to be incredibly diff
-> >-> if you consider the position of someone in a wheelchair, and then
-> >-> position they would have to get themselves into to be able to act
-> >-> make use of it.
-> >
-> >I always thought these urinals were for the little tykes so they did
-> >have to piss all over the toilet seats.
-> >
-> >-> -Richard
-> >
-> >Perry
-> >
-> >
-> Yeah those urinals are for the short not the handicapped. If someone
-> wheelchair were using that he would piss all over himself unless he h
-> extremely long penis.
Unless it was to simply empty a bag or other collection device.
I don't believe you have to offer anything beyond a stall, and then that
is probably not required of all, otherwise you would not see so many
with a single one, too small to be considered big enough for a
wheelchair.
Perry
GrapeApe
>-> wheelchair were using that he would piss all over himself unless he h
>-> extremely long penis.
There ARE handicap urinals that are more than the standard urinal merely
mounted lower. They come out further from the wall almost like a regular
toilet, and you could probably straddle them while on a wheel chair.
Joe Shimkus
paulern...@cs.com (Paulernstmeyer) wrote:
> >-> I have never in my life seen one used. Has anyone here seen a
> >-> handicapped guy actually use one? It's got to be incredibly
> >difficult,
> >-> if you consider the position of someone in a wheelchair, and then the
> >-> position they would have to get themselves into to be able to
> >actually
> >-> make use of it.
> >
> >I always thought these urinals were for the little tykes so they did not
> >have to piss all over the toilet seats.
> >
> >-> -Richard
> >
> >Perry
> >
> >
> Yeah those urinals are for the short not the handicapped. If someone in
> a
> wheelchair were using that he would piss all over himself unless he had
> an
> extremely long penis.
>
Perhaps that's his handicap? :-)
- Joe
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Jeff Janes
: Yeah those urinals are for the short not the handicapped. If someone in a
: wheelchair were using that he would piss all over himself unless he had an
Handicapped does not equal wheel-chair. Some people are short because they
are young, some because their bones fused early, some because their legs were
blued off at the knee.
: extremely long penis.
Or an average sized catheter.
Barry Nos Sher
Considering the expense
>of design, the liability, and the limited market, it doesn't surprise
>me at all that such things would be rare. There much more profit in
>making a general-purpose w/c and a general-purpose commode chair than
>trying to make a highly specialized hybrid.
>
Besides, there's the issue of who pays for what. If we had
more-specialized wheelchairs, the government would end up paying for a
lot of them. The private sector would save money on specialized
plumbing. Under the present arrangement, the government pays less for
the wheelchairs and the landlords and builders pay more for the
porcelain.
Barry Nos Sher
wrote:
The low urinals are mandated by
>local building codes as well as federal law.
Some citations would be really helpful here.
Barry Nos Sher
>FWIW, I seem to recall reading somewhere that the pay toilet stall pretty much
>disappeared in the US thanks to ERA, since it was argued that, if used in both
>men's and lady's rooms, it put an unequal financial burden on the distaff side,
>and if used only in the men's room, an unfair burden on the guys! That seems
>to make sense, 'cause the only "pay terlets" I've seen in quite a while have
>been at self serve gas stations, and in downtown San Francisco, and other big
>cities where you have to pay to get inside the room, regardless of what you're
>going to do there.
>
My recollection is that they were a victim of early feminism, but
pre-ERA. Between that and ADA, it seems that we now have fewer and
dirtier facilities.
GrapeApe
>>local building codes as well as federal law.
>
>Some citations would be really helpful here.
They would differ according to locality for building codes. What sort of
citation are you looking for? Do you somehow doubt there is federal legislation
for handicap access? Or are you looking for some other sort of information?
Greg Goss
> I remember a restroom with ridiculously high urinals (I would have
>had to aim upwards to make it) and one normal one.
Are you sure that the floor wasn't slowly sagging?
Greg Goss
> Do very tall gentlemen experience difficulty with the "normal"
>height urinals?
You pee downwards. Search Deja for past AFCA discussions of the
patented bug to place in urinals to encourage guys to aim.
If you pee downwards ALONG the porcelain, then you prevent splashing.
(as I see the matter - 77 inches tall)
> Wouldn't it make sense to have a distribution of urinal
>heights to match the distribution of, you know, users?
Alan Hamilton
From poking around the http://www.americanstandard-us.com/ site, it
looks like handicapped facilities are specified by ANSI A117.1.
"When installed so top of rim is 432mm (17") from finished floor MEETS
THE AMERICAN DISABILITIES ACT GUIDELINES AND ANSI A117.1 ACCESSIBLE
AND USEABLE BUILDINGS AND FACILITIES - CHECK LOCAL CODES."
However, I'm not curious enough to pay $41 for a copy. There's also
an "Understanding ANSI A117.1" video for $107 more.
--
/
/ * / Alan Hamilton
* * al...@primenet.com
Sean Houtman
>They would differ according to locality for building codes. What sort of
>citation are you looking for? Do you somehow doubt there is federal
>legislation
>for handicap access? Or are you looking for some other sort of information?
Well, I once drove 67 mph in a 55 mph zone and got a citation, but that may not
be the type of citation he wants, since it cost me 20 bucks. On the other hand,
Chevrolet makes (or made) a car called Citation. Maybe he wants a car.
Sean
Call Bob Barker