Coasters song "Charlie Brown"
KGename
What's the deal with the song "Charlie Brown" by The Coasters?
What I mean, is the song supposed to have any connection with Charlie Brown of
the "Peanuts" strip? It seems to me that the song and the strip came out about
the same time- was it just a coincidence that both song and strip used the same
name?
I offer this similarity:
- In the song, Charlie Brown laments "Why is everybody always pickin' on me?"
-In the strip, he often wonders the same thing.
But here's an oddity:
-In the song, Charlie Brown is gambling in the gym, calls the English teacher
"Daddy-O", etc. The epitome of cool.
-In the strip, he could never muster up the nerve to talk sass to a teacher
like that.
My questions:
(1): Did the comic strip have any influence toward the name of the song?
(Maybe the cartoon character's image wasn't yet refined to show Charlie
brown as a humble, meek person. In those early strips- at that time named "Lil'
Folks"- all the kids thought and talked as adults, in the same way as Calvin of
"Calvin and Hobbes".
<or>
(2): Did the song somehow influence Schulz's choice when coming up with the
name of his main character?
(Perhaps the song was written and performed before 1950, the year that
"Peanuts" first appeared, so maybe Schulz came up with the character's name
from some subconscious memory. The Coasters started out in 1949 as The Robins-
it could be that they were already singing the song before the strip's first
appearance.)
It seems to me that Charles Schulz named his main character after himself, but
I couldn't find any proof of that. Al lot of strips featured characters that
were name after the author (and even his family). They include "Dennis the
Menace" and "Family Circus".
It's not that this question is causing me to lose any sleep, but I put a sticky
note on my 'puter reminding me to post this question to afca. I wrote the note
over a year ago...it just melded it's way into the landscaping of everything on
my computer desk, and even if I'm staring right at the note, I don't see it.
Until right now.
73,
Keith
*TASKMASTER EXTRAORDINAIRE*
--Revolutions halted--Tigers tamed--Computers verified--Bars emptied--
--Uprisings quelled--Creationism disproven--Dictators overthrown--
--'Pi' calculated completely--Female minds understood--
Jim Ellwanger
<kge...@aol.com.com.com> wrote:
> My questions:
> (1): Did the comic strip have any influence toward the name of the song?
> (Maybe the cartoon character's image wasn't yet refined to show Charlie
> brown as a humble, meek person. In those early strips- at that time named
> "Lil' Folks"- all the kids thought and talked as adults, in the same
> way as Calvin of "Calvin and Hobbes".
Yes, Charlie Brown was always a "humble, meek person," who was getting
picked on (the punch line of the very first "Peanuts" strip was "How I
hate him," him being Charlie Brown), and he's always been portrayed as
young enough that he would have been way out of place playing dice in
the boys' gym; in fact, he was younger in the early days of the strip
than he later became.
By the way, "Peanuts" was always "Peanuts"; "Li'l Folks" was a
completely different strip that was a collection of single-panel gags
and didn't really have recurring characters, although the name "Charlie
Brown" was used in several of the gags.
> (2): Did the song somehow influence Schulz's choice when coming up with the
> name of his main character?
> (Perhaps the song was written and performed before 1950, the year that
> "Peanuts" first appeared, so maybe Schulz came up with the character's name
> from some subconscious memory. The Coasters started out in 1949 as The Robins-
> it could be that they were already singing the song before the strip's first
> appearance.)
If they were performing the song when they were the Robins, it sure
took them a long time to record it, since "Charlie Brown" didn't hit
the Billboard charts until 1959. And since the name "Charlie Brown"
was used in "Li'l Folks" in 1949, it's doubtful that the name came from
anywhere but...(see below)
> It seems to me that Charles Schulz named his main character after himself, but
> I couldn't find any proof of that. Al lot of strips featured characters that
> were name after the author (and even his family). They include "Dennis the
> Menace" and "Family Circus".
One of his colleagues at the Minneapolis art school where he worked was
named Charles Brown. (The real Charlie Brown's 15 minutes of fame were
when he appeared on a game show in the 1960s, although now I can't
remember if it was "To Tell the Truth" or "I've Got a Secret.")
--
Jim Ellwanger <trai...@mindspring.com>
<http://trainman1.home.mindspring.com/> will never give up.
"Everything looks beautiful when you're young and pretty."
rob...@bestweb.net
long ago conflated them in my head, and they've never separated. Plus a
real one I knew; we used to play the record when he came over.
Similarly my wolf over there (I see he got online again recently) is also
Wolfie Cohen the restaurateur, and the cab driver Wolfie who phones in to
David Brudnoy, and has appeared in several animated cartoons (including a
Simpson), etc. But he's clearly distinct from a friend's Pomeranian dog.
Robert
RM Mentock
>
> Doesn't matter how different and unconnected the two Charlie Browns were, I
> long ago conflated them in my head, and they've never separated.
Motto!
--
RM Mentock
Ikeya-Zhang is coming
GrapeApe
"Alley Oop"?
Have there been any other it songs from the funny papers?
rob...@bestweb.net
There's (at least) one about Dick Tracy. I have a Little Golden Records 78
of Jack Mercer singing "I'm Popeye the Sailor Man". There's Barney Google
and his googly eyes that even peer out without credit or authorization from
http://www.google.com .
Come to think of it, who lasts long in the funny papers and DOESN'T get a
hit song?
Here's a tougher one: Think of hit songs that've been turned into comic
strips. I can't think of any right now.
Robert
Rick B.
The Royal Guardsmen's "Snoopy Vs. The Red Baron" and its sequels. And
that old song about Little Orphan Annie ("Who's that little
chatterbox?...")
Scott P
wrote:
Wasn't that the theme song from the old Little Orphan Annie radio
show?
Scott
Andrew Gore
>Hi gang~~
> What's the deal with the song "Charlie Brown" by The Coasters?
>
> What I mean, is the song supposed to have any connection with Charlie Brown of
>the "Peanuts" strip? It seems to me that the song and the strip came out about
>the same time- was it just a coincidence that both song and strip used the same
>name?
>I offer this similarity:
> - In the song, Charlie Brown laments "Why is everybody always pickin' on me?"
> -In the strip, he often wonders the same thing.
>
>But here's an oddity:
> -In the song, Charlie Brown is gambling in the gym, calls the English teacher
> "Daddy-O", etc. The epitome of cool.
> -In the strip, he could never muster up the nerve to talk sass to a teacher
>like that.
I wondered about that myself, years ago. But I came to a
conclusion that I still believe. They are talking about a high-school
buddy that they are comparing to the cartoon character. It's like in
high school, imagine if you're walking with a friend, and he's
pointing out people to you. "See that guy, he's captain of the
football team, we call him Superman, cuz he's so great at sports. And
that gal over there, we call her Betty, like that gal in "Archie", ya
know? And that guy, we call him Charlie Brown."
"Of all the Charlie Browns in the world... you're the Charlie
Brown-iest!" - Lucy Van Pelt
The AFCA Kid
>I wondered about that myself, years ago. But I came to a
>conclusion that I still believe.
oh, no, look out.
>They are talking about a high-school
>buddy
Maybe.
> that they are comparing to the cartoon character.
Despite being absolutely nothing like the cartoon character, sure.
> It's like in
>high school, imagine if you're walking with a friend, and he's
>pointing out people to you. "See that guy, he's captain of the
>football team, we call him Superman, cuz he's so great at sports. And
>that gal over there, we call her Betty, like that gal in "Archie", ya
>know? And that guy, we call him Charlie Brown."
well, maybe, if he were sort of a nebbish. On the other hand, since I cannot
picture the Charlie Brown I know from comics shooting dice or walking cool and
slow or setting off incendiaries in the auditorium, you have to think it's
mostly just a name that rhymes with "clown." Maybe Leiber or Stoller heard the
name "Charlie Brown" in the comics first, but even then, if so, the name is all
they based their song on.
bottom line: don't hurt your head looking for a connection, when there isn't
one.
--
"I have been paid a lot for my work, but never everything." -Chris Adams
Opus the Penguin
> Come to think of it, who lasts long in the funny papers and
> DOESN'T get a hit song?
Billy and the Boingers had to record all their own songs. None of them
were hits.
--
Opus the Penguin
Margaret Kane Schoen
> On 2002-04-07 grap...@aol.comjunk(GrapeApe) said:
>
> >How closely did the release of the song "Charlie Brown" coincide
> >with the song "Alley Oop"?
>
> >Have there been any other it songs from the funny papers?
>
> There's (at least) one about Dick Tracy. I have a Little Golden Records 78
> of Jack Mercer singing "I'm Popeye the Sailor Man". There's Barney Google
> and his googly eyes that even peer out without credit or authorization from
> http://www.google.com .
Well, you could arguably count Madonna's "Breathless" album for Dick
Tracy. Also, did Superman ever appear in the comics, or just as comic
books? Cause there's a bunch about him (which we've been over before)
"Jimmy Olsen's Blues" by the Spin Doctors and "Superman" by 5 for
Fighting off the top of my head.
There was a novelty song "The Dugan Kid Who Lives in Hogan's Alley"
about the Yellow Kid.
There was a Doonesbury musical.
http://www.doonesbury.ucomics.com/strip/retro/timeline/1980.htm Also a
Lil' Abner msucial. And someone's mentioned "Annie." But I think older
strips are more likely to have songs.
> Come to think of it, who lasts long in the funny papers and DOESN'T get a
> hit song?
Kathy? Marmaduke? Garfield? The Family Circus? Mary Worth?
Oriole Adams
Hitchhiker"....although the lyrics don't really seem to pertain to the cartoon
sailor.
~
Ah! must Thou char the wood
ere Thou canst limn with it?
rob...@bestweb.net
>did Superman ever appear in the comics
At least in the strip, "The World's Greatest Heroes" (title approx.).
Rick B.
>
> [D]id Superman ever appear in the comics, or just as comic
> books?
My Big Book O' TV Shows mentions in the listing for the George Reeves
series that there was a Superman newspaper strip from 1939 to 1967.
Margaret Kane
news:3CB2471C...@sprynet.com...
Oooh, now what big book o' tv shows is this? Mine only has prime time shows.
Margaret
GrapeApe
>> series that there was a Superman newspaper strip from 1939 to 1967.
>
>Oooh, now what big book o' tv shows is this? Mine only has prime time shows.
Most shows we see in syndication in the morning or afternoon were at one time,
prime time programming. Believe it or Not.
Michael
But not cartoons. I think "old" cartoons were always morning shows.
Never prime time.
--
Michael
I have three e-mail addresses :
mitc...@image-link.com mitc...@att.net mitc...@attbi.com
If one doesn't work, well...
Kim
"Michael" <mitc...@image-link.com> wrote in message
news:3CB314CA...@image-link.com...
> GrapeApe wrote:
> >
> > >> My Big Book O' TV Shows mentions in the listing for the George Reeves
> > >> series that there was a Superman newspaper strip from 1939 to 1967.
> > >
> > >Oooh, now what big book o' tv shows is this? Mine only has prime time
shows.
> >
> > Most shows we see in syndication in the morning or afternoon were at
one time,
> > prime time programming. Believe it or Not.
>
> But not cartoons. I think "old" cartoons were always morning shows.
> Never prime time.
Wasn't "The Flintstones" prime time? I thought I remembered watching it at
night.
Kim
*I don't care what anybody says, "Planet of the Apes" is unrealistic. Any
scientist will tell you that on a planet full of monkeys, someone's throwing
some feces.(Dave James)*
Patrick M Geahan
> But not cartoons. I think "old" cartoons were always morning shows.
> Never prime time.
At least one notable exception was "The Flinstones", which was prime-time.
--
-------Patrick M Geahan---...@chartermi.net---ICQ:3784715------
Quote of the Week:"In heaven, the cooks are French, the mechanics are
German, and the police are British. In hell, the cooks are British,
the mechanics are French, and the police are German." - Anonymous
N Jill Marsh
<mitc...@image-link.com>wrote:
>But not cartoons. I think "old" cartoons were always morning shows.
>Never prime time.
Flintstones.
nj"not to mention the cinematic productions"m
"I'm sick and tired of walkin' around like this
With my heart outside my skin
Scared to death we'll never touch again"
Pierre Jelenc
>
> (Perhaps the song was written and performed before 1950, the year that
> "Peanuts" first appeared,
Leiber and Stoller met in the summer of 1950. Their first (minor) hit was
"Hard Times", recorded by ... Charles Brown in 1952.
Pierre
--
Pierre Jelenc | H o m e O f f i c e R e c o r d s
| * The Dan Emery Mystery Band * Pawnshop *
T h e G i g o m e t e r | * The Cucumbers * RAW Kinder *
www.thegigometer.com | www.homeofficerecords.com
GrapeApe
>> >> series that there was a Superman newspaper strip from 1939 to 1967.
>> >
>> >Oooh, now what big book o' tv shows is this? Mine only has prime time
>shows.
>>
>> Most shows we see in syndication in the morning or afternoon were at
>one time,
>> prime time programming. Believe it or Not.
>
>But not cartoons. I think "old" cartoons were always morning shows.
>Never prime time.
George Reeves was flesh and blood. I don't believe that program was created
for Saturday morning consumption. Something makes me want to think it may have
been on early saturday night, or perhaps floating around the same time slot as
Ed Sullivan on Sunday. Saturday Morning was for old republic serials, Pinky
Lee and Beany and Cecil. Wrestling filled the afternoons. Batman was
primetime, two days a week. All the sitcoms you see on Nick at Night yet have
had generations more mileage in other time slots as syndicated programming,
were primetime. The Flintstones were primetime.
Most cartoons or game shows or daytime 'talk' shows, were created for the
daytime market initially, or were syndicated from their inception.
Jim Ellwanger
<mitc...@image-link.com> wrote:
> GrapeApe wrote:
> >
> > >> My Big Book O' TV Shows mentions in the listing for the George Reeves
> > >> series that there was a Superman newspaper strip from 1939 to 1967.
> > >
> > >Oooh, now what big book o' tv shows is this? Mine only has prime time
> > >shows.
> >
> > Most shows we see in syndication in the morning or afternoon were
> > at one time, prime time programming. Believe it or Not.
>
> But not cartoons. I think "old" cartoons were always morning shows.
> Never prime time.
Since everyone else has brought up "The Flintstones," I will add "The
Jetsons" (ABC, Sunday, 7:30, 1962-63); "The Bullwinkle Show" (NBC,
Sunday, 7:00, 1961-62); "Top Cat" (ABC, Wednesday, 8:30, 1961-62); and
an obscure entry that Cartoon Network occasionally inflicts on the
public, "Where's Huddles" (CBS, Wednesday, 7:30, summer 1970).
At any rate, even though the George Reeves live-action "Adventures of
Superman" series was syndicated, it aired in most markets, at least
initially, in prime-time. Throughout the '50s, the networks didn't
carry programming in every possible prime-time slot; it wasn't until
the 1962-63 season that all three were broadcasting the full schedule
of 7:30-11:00 seven days a week.
KGename
>
>KGename <kge...@aol.com.com.com> writes:
>>
>> (Perhaps the song was written and performed before 1950, >>the year
that
>> "Peanuts" first appeared,
>
>Leiber and Stoller met in the summer of 1950. Their first (minor) hit was
>"Hard Times", recorded by ... Charles Brown in 1952.
Ah ha! Looks like you've got the answer. The "Charlie Brown" in the song is
this "Charles Brown" fellow.
Somewhere on the web I saw that Leiber and Stoller met in 1949, but I cannot
cite. I did find a page that says that they met in 1950:
http://www.jsonline.com/letsgo/daily/1018stoller.stm
At any rate, I thank you for answering my original question, which was:
"Was Charlie Brown from "Peanuts" named after Charlie Brown from the song, or
vice versa?
Answer: Neither.
73,
Keith "trivially sated" G
The AFCA Kid
>
>In article <3CB314CA...@image-link.com>, Michael
><mitc...@image-link.com> wrote:
>
>> GrapeApe wrote:
>> >
>> > >> My Big Book O' TV Shows mentions in the listing for the George Reeves
>> > >> series that there was a Superman newspaper strip from 1939 to 1967.
>> > >
>> > >Oooh, now what big book o' tv shows is this? Mine only has prime time
>> > >shows.
>> >
>> > Most shows we see in syndication in the morning or afternoon were
>> > at one time, prime time programming. Believe it or Not.
>>
>> But not cartoons. I think "old" cartoons were always morning shows.
>> Never prime time.
>
>Since everyone else has brought up "The Flintstones," I will add "The
>Jetsons" (ABC, Sunday, 7:30, 1962-63); "The Bullwinkle Show" (NBC,
>Sunday, 7:00, 1961-62); "Top Cat" (ABC, Wednesday, 8:30, 1961-62); and
>an obscure entry that Cartoon Network occasionally inflicts on the
>public, "Where's Huddles" (CBS, Wednesday, 7:30, summer 1970).
Jonny Quest aired in primetime for at least one season, as did Bugs Bunny, and
Calvin and the Colonel.
Estron
> > I think "old" cartoons were always morning shows.
> > Never prime time.
with this one-word reply:
> Flintstones.
The first "Jonny Quest" also started out in Friday evening prime time.
--
All opinions expressed are exactly that.
Pax vobiscum.
est...@tfs.net
Kansas City, Missouri
Estron
> Maybe Leiber or Stoller heard the name "Charlie Brown" in the comics
> first, but even then, if so, the name is all they based their song on.
They seem to have had a pattern of doing that. IIRC, they never came
to Kansas City. Their song "Goin' To Kansas City" doesn't contain any
references to anything here (Vine doesn't even go through to 12th
St.).
The AFCA Kid
>Previously in alt.fan.cecil-adams, The AFCA Kid wrote:
>
>> Maybe Leiber or Stoller heard the name "Charlie Brown" in the comics
>> first, but even then, if so, the name is all they based their song on.
>
>They seem to have had a pattern of doing that. IIRC, they never came
>to Kansas City.
Yeah, well...they sure rock, though.
>Their song "Goin' To Kansas City" doesn't contain any
>references to anything here
On the other hand, if I were going to go get my baby, that's where she would
be found, quite in accordance with the lyrics Paul McCartney sings on "Beatles
for Sale."
Bob Moissonnier
> Pierre wrote:
> >
> >KGename <kge...@aol.com.com.com> writes:
> >>
> >> (Perhaps the song was written and performed before 1950, >>the year
> that
> >> "Peanuts" first appeared,
> >
> >Leiber and Stoller met in the summer of 1950. Their first (minor) hit was
> >"Hard Times", recorded by ... Charles Brown in 1952.
> ----
> Ah ha! Looks like you've got the answer. The "Charlie Brown" in the song is
> this "Charles Brown" fellow.
I suppose it's possible, but I really doubt it, maestro.
Rick B.
>
> Since everyone else has brought up "The Flintstones," I will add "The
> Jetsons" (ABC, Sunday, 7:30, 1962-63); "The Bullwinkle Show" (NBC,
> Sunday, 7:00, 1961-62); "Top Cat" (ABC, Wednesday, 8:30, 1961-62); and
> an obscure entry that Cartoon Network occasionally inflicts on the
> public, "Where's Huddles" (CBS, Wednesday, 7:30, summer 1970).
Not to mention "The Alvin Show" (those damn chipmunks; CBS, Wednesday
7:30, 1961-62); "Matty's Funday Funnies" (eventually retitled "Beany and
Cecil"[1] after those characters became the main attractions; ABC,
Friday 7:30 1960-61, Saturday 7:00 1961-62); "Calvin and the Colonel"
(Freeman Gosden and Charles Correll thinly disguse their "Amos 'n' Andy"
characters as critters; ABC, Tuesday 8:30 fall 1961, Saturday 7:30
Jan-Sep 1962), and "Wait Till Your Father Gets Home" (mild All in the
Family ripo^H^H^H^H^imitation, with Tom Bosley voicing the dad and Jack
Burns as an obnoxious neighbor; syndicated, intended for a 7:30 slot,
1972-74).
Rick B.
[1]No, not *him*. This Cecil was a seasick sea serpent.
Joseph Nebus
>Since everyone else has brought up "The Flintstones," I will add "The
>Jetsons" (ABC, Sunday, 7:30, 1962-63); "The Bullwinkle Show" (NBC,
>Sunday, 7:00, 1961-62); "Top Cat" (ABC, Wednesday, 8:30, 1961-62); and
>an obscure entry that Cartoon Network occasionally inflicts on the
>public, "Where's Huddles" (CBS, Wednesday, 7:30, summer 1970).
Didn't "Gerald Mcboing Boing," a UPA series based loosely on the
famous short, with a lot of new material added in, get into prime time
programming as well (only to be cancelled when... well, everybody agreed
the shows were quite nice and pleasant and healthy for children to watch;
the children just didn't want to watch).
Of course, I still think the best would be the ABC Saturday
morning cartoon preview show, Friday night at 8 p.m. That wasn't a weekly
show, but what would they have lost by making it one?
(I still can't get people to believe there were two cartoon
spinoffs of "Happy Days," but one of my friends is traumatized by the one
where they were travelling through time, so I guess that balances in some
strange way. I also take great pride that I can find jaw-droppingly bad
pop culture without making any of it up, even though some friends think I
do.)
Joseph Nebus
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
GrapeApe
> Didn't "Gerald Mcboing Boing," a UPA series based loosely on the
>famous short, with a lot of new material added in, get into prime time
>programming as well (only to be cancelled when... well, everybody agreed
>the shows were quite nice and pleasant and healthy for children to watch;
>the children just didn't want to watch).
I remember reading about such a series as famously shortlived. IMDB would have
the scoop perhaps.
It may not have had legs as a series, or lended itself to as clever or funny
enough stories on an extended repeatable basis.
I'm astounded that apparently the talking baby sitcom on CBS was annointed as a
hit so quickly. (that is, outside the typical hype that calls a show 'a hi!"t
before it has even aired once)
Bob Moissonnier
I think the creator/writer was predisposed to be a critical fave,
being a well-respected TV writer who did a lot of good stuff on The
Simpsons. I could be thinking of a different show, though.
Pope Bob
" ... blast their oily hides!"
Alan Hamilton
wrote:
>Not to mention "The Alvin Show" (those damn chipmunks; CBS, Wednesday
>7:30, 1961-62);
So did Simon and Theodore have terrible agents or what? Later
incarnations go by "The Chipmunks".
--
/
/ * / Alan Hamilton
* * al...@arizonaroads.com
GrapeApe
>>7:30, 1961-62);
>
>So did Simon and Theodore have terrible agents or what? Later
>incarnations go by "The Chipmunks".
Bogdosian wasn't even thinking of Simon and Theodore until he realized Alvin
needed harmonies while he was playing with a tape recorder.
Anyone here actually slowed down a Chipmunks record?
Jerry Randal Bauer
news:20020414155513...@mb-ch.aol.com:
I have.
I have at least one Chipmunks 33rpm LP in the archives, and a 1/4" reel-to-
reel with 3.5ips and 7ips speeds. So, naturally...
It was a long time ago, though.
Rick Howard
GrapeApe wrote
> Anyone here actually slowed down a Chipmunks record?
Yeah. Weird. They were saying "I buried Paul."
Alan Hamilton
Go to http://www.toontracker.com/demented/demented.htm and listen to
"The Chipmunk Hoax Exposed". This is a really neat site, but it's a
pain to navigate.